Entry into this hobby is so out there, I love what you guys do and appreciate your content...I live vicariously through you guys. On my own with basic cheap telescopes been able to view the standards Jupiter, Saturn, Mars, Venus, Orion Nebula but not so well. I wish I could view like you guys do, especially out in Arizona or Palm Springs where it's really dark and can view so many stars. Thanks again guys for sharing your time with us!❤
I have the Dwarf and have maybe 10 hours of exposure time on most of the November targets within its range. This thing is amazing in a lot of ways. The price quality n ease of use is superb. I think maybe the best bang maybe the zwo but I love my dwarf
I bought the Vespera based on your recommendations and so far its been fantastic. Im going to watch your test vid of all four and I do hope I made the right choice..Thanks my friends for sharing and Merry Christmas to you.🎄🎄👍👍👍👍👍🎄🎄
I think the EVScope is great just because it got Stella so excited on minute 2:37 . I think she didnt get that happy even when you guys got your collaborative APOD. Kudos EVScope!
I feel a little silly spending thousands on numerous individual astrophotography products when I could just buy one item for a fraction of the price. Plus they’re so much easier to use.
This is an excellent way to start astrophotography if you’re just starting to get into it! These telescopes make things so much easier and once you have gotten a feel for astrophotography and enjoy it, you can always buy bigger telescopes and astrophotography gear once you’re ready to get into more advanced astrophotography!
Thank you and good job on the video! At this time there's no broad comparison reviews out there to reference on these devices, so the effort on this is very much appreciated! Is there maybe a way you could provide a comparison of the devices you reviewed in a format that can be easily referenced, side by side, outside of audio?
Very curious for part two, IQ...most important I think. Will the resolution be important, quality of the optical system, focal length.... Very nice to put them side by side
I think there is a mistake in the DwarkLab specs; 675mm@F4.2 is an aperture of 160mm (That's the spec of a giant sports lens !!). Even 48mm@F2.4 means a 20mm aperture, which this clearly isn't. So I think DwarfLab took some "marketing freedom" and used full frame equivalent focal length instead of using proper physical values. Looking at the IMX415 specs, it has roughly a 6.7 times crop factor, so the real focal lenght is probably around 100mm (which makes a lot more sense in that small packaging).
I think you're right, the specs on the website shows as "100mm (48mm wide, 675mm telephoto)" so I was a bit confused by that, I should have just used 100mm
Unistellar a fairer comparison is Equinox 2, lower price point. More around 2000 USDs. Equinox a faster optical setup and naturally less prone to dew formation, being reflector, which you didn’t mention. Software on Unistellar aimed at producing an image on the night and not directly via post processing. The Dew remover on Vespera is around 106 pounds plus postage and is needed in Europe. Dwarf2 is 8mp, but 2x2 binning means more like 2mp. You can use ICE (free Microsoft software) to stitch Equinox images.
So looking forward to pt2. Traveling from UK to Oz in Feb and need something to do some imaging while I'm there . Do I take my 385mm apo n camera and buy a mount out there or just get a smart scope ?
Interesting but you only looked at a key features. Shouldn't you have shown pictures or video clips of what they can render at night ? can you plug a camera and do a long exposure ? does it move automatically to follow the night sky ? Perhaps in another product comparison.
Have to take Dwarf. Definitely the most portable by far, can do a rough eq mode, expanding your usable image field, great interface, top notch customer care and an interactive development team. Frequent updates to the app. Seestar is the only other one in the same price range.
Based on the specs - I selected these as the winners - not that the others will be bad - just think that DwardLab seems to have a slight advantage on the amount of light that hits the sensor. The results should be intresting. Unistellar DwarfLab ZWO Vaonis EVScope Dwarf II Seestar Vespera IMX 347 IMX 415 IMX 462 IMX 462 f4 f2.4 f4.2 f4.9 f4.9 450mm 48mm 675mm 250mm 200mm 7.7 MP 2 MP 8MP 2MP 2MP 8MP Planet Planet Sun Moon Orion
But the Dwarf 2 out of the lot has the most potential, as it can be EQ mounted, so opening it up to give the sensor longer exposure ability and use the wide field camera as maybe a possible guide scope. But yes the aperture handicaps it compared to others
I finally went and put my big 600MM lens on my mount - needed to find the old spare vixen plate for that. Every night since then we have had windows of 1-3 hours of clear nights - firtst starting at 8PM local but then shifting later and later, so we had no clear nights that I could image. Curse of this hobby. Or the werewolf curse - where you get your equipment and the first night you can test is under a bright full moon.
@@mikehardy8247 be my guest - only because it is true! Remember 20 years ago getting a new eyepeice - the day it arrived was a full moon and then clouds for the next few weeks.
Anticipation of “a few days” is killing me! Almost worse than heving to wait until christmas morning….(would love to understand why all of these have such low megapixel numbers. My cell phone 20 years ago had a better sensor…interesting to lesrn about Vespere Pro…)
Thought Ill never get one of these.... Fast forward: used up my trial rental for Unistellar, have my second dwarf (but may need to be returned, inner dust etc in lens.) And now have a Seestar arriving early December [I hope.] Yeah wtf happened to my initial thought 🤣😂
I'm curious if the output of any of them is even remotely comparable to a bespoke setup. The SeeStar seems to have glass specs similar to a RedCat51, but are the images as clean as a RedCat?
Not for long exposure deep sky imaging - all of them have uncooled sensors and are alt-az mounts without field derotation, thus limiting the practical length of exposures. These scopes are all intended primarily for EAA-type imaging, with relatively short exposures and somewhat limited total integration time. Their main attraction is of course simplicity of setup, no polar alignment, guiding, etc. but you do trade off capability for that benefit.
Think the Seestar will end up matching the l Performance of the vespera, as vertically the same specs, and software needs to mature, as Vespera has had a head start. The Dwarf 2 is the only one that you can EQ Mount, so I get no field rotation, so may make use of the wide field camera as a guide scope in a future update if using it as an eq mounted system, plus longer exposure times available. So has a greater potential than the others in this resoect
The Seestar is virtually already obsolete. In a few months, Vespera Pro will be released with a 12,5 mp sensor and images up to 32 mp with live panorama mode.
the images you can get with it have 16 x the resolution of the ones of the Seestar + more sensible sensor + better optics. It s just not the same category, like it goes for car, camera, computers ...@@bobmusil1458
We are not talking about the vespera pro? The standard one, and the Seestar software is not as mature yet, but when it is, will match the standard Vespera for a fraction of the price. Cannot even compare the Vespera pro as that's a whole new system abd even more expensive. At the price you Pau, may as well invest in a decent setup with an EQ mount. It does nor matter how good the Vespera pro is. The alt alz mount handicaps any system and limits exposures to around 10 ro 15 secs max due to field rotation. If it could be EQ mounted would then be a game changer? Why is the D2 the only one that can be EQ mounted? Surly would not be hard to allow these to be eq mounted? All you need is a tilting tripod? Seems Dwarflabs have it figured out and owners eq mount the D2. This leads to the possibility of Dwarf labs giving us far longer exposures if they add an EQ mode
the problem with all of those is the Image size... you can not print this stuff... also zoom in is not good... the performance and software is everywhere great but under 12 MP is just a gimmick for PC screen... waiting for the next round with more pixel...
Great testing! Thank you! But a tough one to do as the software for these scopes is changing rapidly. So whatever function one model lacks is likely to be added with the next update. We’re anxiously awaiting the major upgrade for the Dwarf II scope which corrects its major deficiency, its small object catalog. And the SeeStar is supposed to get a Pro mode with a choice of exposure times. The Dwarf has one significant advantage over the other three in that it can be polar aligned to minimize field rotation in long sets of images. It wasn’t initially designed to work that way but users tried it, and it works. Dwarf had to strengthen the base to allow it to be tipped over but it is an officially supported (literally!) mode now. Clear skies!
My bet is Vaonis is the winner for image quality and long term investment. From price perspective and for beginners getting into astro, I think its a tie between Zwo seestar and Dwarf. Its disappointing that Zwo seestar has smaller FOV so large targets like Andromeda are cut (although it does use the same sensor IMX 462 as vaonis and has an extensive catalog). For me Dwarf has an edge because of the dual camera, adjustable gain, eq setup and horizontal orientation. I'll wait for Vaonis Vespera pro 😅.
For the price, you could buy 3 Seestar and do wider field or multiple targets. Once again the only advantage Vaonis is really offering is auto-setup, everything else is simple software variances which will change as Seestar matures.
Vespara the only reason it will win is only down to software as its been around longer so has matured. Give it 12 months and Seestar will be as good or better than the Vespera, and often seeing new improved features with Seestar. Also mosaic mode is coming to Seestar and even when it came out it has a better app than when Vespera first came out
Your information about focal length is wrong! You compare *actual focal length* (Unistellar 450 mm, Seestar 250mm, Vespera 200mm) to *equivalent focal length* of 675 mm for the Dwarf. The actual focal length of the Dwarf is 100 mm.
One issue in the video: Focal Length of DWARF II is 100mm, not 675mm.
Entry into this hobby is so out there, I love what you guys do and appreciate your content...I live vicariously through you guys. On my own with basic cheap telescopes been able to view the standards Jupiter, Saturn, Mars, Venus, Orion Nebula but not so well. I wish I could view like you guys do, especially out in Arizona or Palm Springs where it's really dark and can view so many stars. Thanks again guys for sharing your time with us!❤
I have the Dwarf and have maybe 10 hours of exposure time on most of the November targets within its range. This thing is amazing in a lot of ways. The price quality n ease of use is superb. I think maybe the best bang maybe the zwo but I love my dwarf
I bought the Vespera based on your recommendations and so far its been fantastic. Im going to watch your test vid of all four and I do hope I made the right choice..Thanks my friends for sharing and Merry Christmas to you.🎄🎄👍👍👍👍👍🎄🎄
This video is very well edited 👍
I think the EVScope is great just because it got Stella so excited on minute 2:37 . I think she didnt get that happy even when you guys got your collaborative APOD. Kudos EVScope!
Another great review, thanks guys 😀
I feel a little silly spending thousands on numerous individual astrophotography products when I could just buy one item for a fraction of the price. Plus they’re so much easier to use.
Don't say that, I just bought a c11 yesterday 😂
Sound like an adv...
This is an excellent way to start astrophotography if you’re just starting to get into it! These telescopes make things so much easier and once you have gotten a feel for astrophotography and enjoy it, you can always buy bigger telescopes and astrophotography gear once you’re ready to get into more advanced astrophotography!
Thank you and good job on the video! At this time there's no broad comparison reviews out there to reference on these devices, so the effort on this is very much appreciated! Is there maybe a way you could provide a comparison of the devices you reviewed in a format that can be easily referenced, side by side, outside of audio?
Very curious for part two, IQ...most important I think. Will the resolution be important, quality of the optical system, focal length....
Very nice to put them side by side
Excelllent video! Congrats and thank you!
I think there is a mistake in the DwarkLab specs; 675mm@F4.2 is an aperture of 160mm (That's the spec of a giant sports lens !!). Even 48mm@F2.4 means a 20mm aperture, which this clearly isn't. So I think DwarfLab took some "marketing freedom" and used full frame equivalent focal length instead of using proper physical values.
Looking at the IMX415 specs, it has roughly a 6.7 times crop factor, so the real focal lenght is probably around 100mm (which makes a lot more sense in that small packaging).
I think you're right, the specs on the website shows as "100mm (48mm wide, 675mm telephoto)" so I was a bit confused by that, I should have just used 100mm
It’s gonna be out of this world…thank you and clear skies
The only video i needed!
All things considered the Seestar can’t be beat! Especially since the app is always improving!
the delivery times though...
@@hmuphilly9129 I got mine from Agena in 6 days.
@@hmuphilly9129 quickly becoming a non-issue. As of Dec 1st the timeframe for delivery is ~week thru most vendors.
@@hmuphilly9129I ordered my S50 from highpoint scientific on Nov 18 and got it on Dec 3, 2023. Not too bad.
So which one would actually track a SpaceX falcon 9 or the Starship durring launch?
Unistellar a fairer comparison is Equinox 2, lower price point. More around 2000 USDs. Equinox a faster optical setup and naturally less prone to dew formation, being reflector, which you didn’t mention. Software on Unistellar aimed at producing an image on the night and not directly via post processing. The Dew remover on Vespera is around 106 pounds plus postage and is needed in Europe. Dwarf2 is 8mp, but 2x2 binning means more like 2mp. You can use ICE (free Microsoft software) to stitch Equinox images.
So looking forward to pt2. Traveling from UK to Oz in Feb and need something to do some imaging while I'm there . Do I take my 385mm apo n camera and buy a mount out there or just get a smart scope ?
Interesting but you only looked at a key features. Shouldn't you have shown pictures or video clips of what they can render at night ? can you plug a camera and do a long exposure ? does it move automatically to follow the night sky ? Perhaps in another product comparison.
Are any of these scopes capable of decent planetary imaging yet?
Astro-BackYard covered SeeStar too. Planetary imagining is totally useless with this scope as planets appear like dots.
Have to take Dwarf. Definitely the most portable by far, can do a rough eq mode, expanding your usable image field, great interface, top notch customer care and an interactive development team. Frequent updates to the app. Seestar is the only other one in the same price range.
What do you guys think of Vespera 2? The specs look impressive on paper. Should i pull the trigger on it or wait for Pro?
Dwarf can be mounted in EQ mode!
Based on the specs - I selected these as the winners - not that the others will be bad - just think that DwardLab seems to have a slight advantage on the amount of light that hits the sensor.
The results should be intresting.
Unistellar DwarfLab ZWO Vaonis
EVScope Dwarf II Seestar Vespera
IMX 347 IMX 415 IMX 462 IMX 462
f4 f2.4 f4.2 f4.9 f4.9
450mm 48mm 675mm 250mm 200mm
7.7 MP 2 MP 8MP 2MP 2MP 8MP
Planet Planet
Sun
Moon
Orion
The Dwarf has the smallest aperture, 24mm, so the least light gathered of the 4.
But the Dwarf 2 out of the lot has the most potential, as it can be EQ mounted, so opening it up to give the sensor longer exposure ability and use the wide field camera as maybe a possible guide scope. But yes the aperture handicaps it compared to others
@@denodanat 25mm vs 50mm it would need twice the exposure time..
@@dennisrogers6786 It has a 25mm objective. You can’t bypass physics. It will take twice the time due to 1/2 light capture.
Zwo seestar best overall fit in budget.
couldnt care less for any of these scopes actually I just love watching your videos no matter the content
Received my Seastar today. Supposed to be cloudy all week.
I finally went and put my big 600MM lens on my mount - needed to find the old spare vixen plate for that.
Every night since then we have had windows of 1-3 hours of clear nights - firtst starting at 8PM local but then shifting later and later, so we had no clear nights that I could image.
Curse of this hobby. Or the werewolf curse - where you get your equipment and the first night you can test is under a bright full moon.
WEREWOLF curse! Can I borrow that?
@@mikehardy8247 be my guest - only because it is true!
Remember 20 years ago getting a new eyepeice - the day it arrived was a full moon and then clouds for the next few weeks.
👏 will the B3 be comparable with Beosound Theater and before more one ?
This is a awesomely good idea,,
Anticipation of “a few days” is killing me! Almost worse than heving to wait until christmas morning….(would love to understand why all of these have such low megapixel numbers. My cell phone 20 years ago had a better sensor…interesting to lesrn about Vespere Pro…)
Seestar does Mosaic now I believe.
Where is Part 2? cannot find it
Where did you shoot this video? Thanks!
Where is part 2 of this series??
You are comparing with a very early version of eVscope. Why?
Thought Ill never get one of these....
Fast forward: used up my trial rental for Unistellar, have my second dwarf (but may need to be returned, inner dust etc in lens.) And now have a Seestar arriving early December [I hope.]
Yeah wtf happened to my initial thought 🤣😂
I'm curious if the output of any of them is even remotely comparable to a bespoke setup. The SeeStar seems to have glass specs similar to a RedCat51, but are the images as clean as a RedCat?
Not for long exposure deep sky imaging - all of them have uncooled sensors and are alt-az mounts without field derotation, thus limiting the practical length of exposures. These scopes are all intended primarily for EAA-type imaging, with relatively short exposures and somewhat limited total integration time. Their main attraction is of course simplicity of setup, no polar alignment, guiding, etc. but you do trade off capability for that benefit.
❤
Think the Seestar will end up matching the l
Performance of the vespera, as vertically the same specs, and software needs to mature, as Vespera has had a head start.
The Dwarf 2 is the only one that you can EQ Mount, so I get no field rotation, so may make use of the wide field camera as a guide scope in a future update if using it as an eq mounted system, plus longer exposure times available. So has a greater potential than the others in this resoect
The Seestar is virtually already obsolete. In a few months, Vespera Pro will be released with a 12,5 mp sensor and images up to 32 mp with live panorama mode.
@@adventurerofthethirdplanet I like the resolution of the Vespera Pro but it’s 4x as expensive as the Seestar.
the images you can get with it have 16 x the resolution of the ones of the Seestar + more sensible sensor + better optics. It s just not the same category, like it goes for car, camera, computers ...@@bobmusil1458
We are not talking about the vespera pro? The standard one, and the Seestar software is not as mature yet, but when it is, will match the standard Vespera for a fraction of the price. Cannot even compare the Vespera pro as that's a whole new system abd even more expensive. At the price you Pau, may as well invest in a decent setup with an EQ mount. It does nor matter how good the Vespera pro is. The alt alz mount handicaps any system and limits exposures to around 10 ro 15 secs max due to field rotation.
If it could be EQ mounted would then be a game changer? Why is the D2 the only one that can be EQ mounted?
Surly would not be hard to allow these to be eq mounted? All you need is a tilting tripod?
Seems Dwarflabs have it figured out and owners eq mount the D2.
This leads to the possibility of Dwarf labs giving us far longer exposures if they add an EQ mode
Reflectorrrrrr
the problem with all of those is the Image size... you can not print this stuff... also zoom in is not good... the performance and software is everywhere great but under 12 MP is just a gimmick for PC screen... waiting for the next round with more pixel...
Great testing! Thank you! But a tough one to do as the software for these scopes is changing rapidly. So whatever function one model lacks is likely to be added with the next update. We’re anxiously awaiting the major upgrade for the Dwarf II scope which corrects its major deficiency, its small object catalog. And the SeeStar is supposed to get a Pro mode with a choice of exposure times. The Dwarf has one significant advantage over the other three in that it can be polar aligned to minimize field rotation in long sets of images. It wasn’t initially designed to work that way but users tried it, and it works. Dwarf had to strengthen the base to allow it to be tipped over but it is an officially supported (literally!) mode now. Clear skies!
My bet is Vaonis is the winner for image quality and long term investment. From price perspective and for beginners getting into astro, I think its a tie between Zwo seestar and Dwarf. Its disappointing that Zwo seestar has smaller FOV so large targets like Andromeda are cut (although it does use the same sensor IMX 462 as vaonis and has an extensive catalog). For me Dwarf has an edge because of the dual camera, adjustable gain, eq setup and horizontal orientation. I'll wait for Vaonis Vespera pro 😅.
For the price, you could buy 3 Seestar and do wider field or multiple targets. Once again the only advantage Vaonis is really offering is auto-setup, everything else is simple software variances which will change as Seestar matures.
Vespara the only reason it will win is only down to software as its been around longer so has matured. Give it 12 months and Seestar will be as good or better than the Vespera, and often seeing new improved features with Seestar. Also mosaic mode is coming to Seestar and even when it came out it has a better app than when Vespera first came out
@@mycarolinaskies not interested in buying more than 1 gadget at this point as I have a dwarf. I Will wait and see how seestar matures though.
Vespara's software is terrible, buggy, lockups, etc
Seestar FOV is not that narrow. You can image the entire Andromeda Galaxy.
where is part 2 ?
It will come out in a few days
Your information about focal length is wrong!
You compare *actual focal length* (Unistellar 450 mm, Seestar 250mm, Vespera 200mm) to *equivalent focal length* of 675 mm for the Dwarf.
The actual focal length of the Dwarf is 100 mm.
Yes, we acknowledged that in a different comment
first!
All I heard from Dalia is...BUTT-TON 🤣
Stop interrupting him!
How can you buy such crap?😂
Wdym?