Post Office scandal: Why has justice taken two decades? | The News Agents
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ม.ค. 2024
- The wrongly convicted Post Office victims have waited up to twenty years to have their prosecutions cancelled.
Today, in one swift sentence, the Prime Minister declared them null and void. An initial payout will be made to each of 75 thousand pounds - a drop in the ocean for many of those who've lost livelihoods, homes and jobs. But it is at least a start.
Why did the solutions suddenly come so thick and fast (I think we know).
What does it tell us about the way we consume news, scandal and corporate malpractice?
#postoffice #politicz #uk #news #NewsAgents #EmilyMaitlis #JonSopel #LewisGoodall
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WHY does it obviously come back to the taxpayer? This was not caused by the taxpayers 🤬🤬
About 900 were convicted, but about 3,000 had money extorted from them and suffered greatly.
It's reported that Fujitsu donate over £630000 per annum to the Conservative party.
The contaminated blood products scandal has also been going on since the nineties and survivors are still waiting for justice including compensation.
That was horrible. Was introduced to the scandal by one of the leaders of the movement on a podcast by james English. Horrible really, the NHS would shut down if it was audited. Lost my mum with an incorrect diagnosis for cancer and am going through the same with my health condition.
FUJITSU needs to pay back the money we've given them! I think thats the centre of the story and would keep all of our attention.
Absolutely right. But this govt is silent on this
....and, as Alan Bates sagely points out, this shouldn't be referred to as compensation when it is attempting to return those affected to their original state of affairs, prior to the Post Office's heinous actions.
It is *financial restitution*.
But punitive awards would be compensation, would they not?
@@milesobrien2694Hopefully. They should start with restitution and then add compensation - 20 years worth - for pain and suffering.
@@laurieharper1526 And then put a few of the post office middle and senior management inside for theft and false accounting. A lot of the stuff that they got away with was absolutely outrageous. For instance, it seems very likely that members of their own investigations branch received end of year bonuses out of the proceeds of money "recovered" from their investigations.
We know that in 2020 or thereabouts, after the successful class action, that senior management were awarded bonuses for "getting documents ready for the public hearing on time". But Maitliss and others are right to say that government sat on their hands for 20 years and now Sunak and others want to present themselves as the people putting right a serious wrong - the real heroes. Post Office would be bust long ago but for public ownership and public money.
What an utter disgrace…….🙈🙈🙈………and as usual……just hot air in compensation………PEOPLE HAVE COMMITTED SUICIDE OVER THIS…!!!
Stick with this! It's so important. Those people are at deaths door. Corruption cannot win on this one.
£75,000 hush money 💰. And Sunak is a mate of the Horizon person.in the enquiry.
The victims do not need primary legislation. They need uncontested appeals in a court of law to make sure there are no unintended consequences. They are innocent and don’t need pardons they need judicial exoneration
Why does Sunak invariably give the impression that the latest long-running scandal has only now appeared over the horizon (pun intended). Is he living under a rock or does he take us all for fools?
He was Head Boy at Winchester College.
The home of casual arrogance.
I doubt he knows anything. Never underestimate ignorance.
He takes us for fools! Always stupidly smiling Sunak.
A bit of both?
Have you noticed that we call it the Post Office Scandal, not the Post Office and Fujitsu Scandal? Labeling changes perception.
Is it because of the links between Fujitsu and Sunak's wife's firm Infosys?
Or is it because the Education Secretary,Gillian Keegan's husband Michael,worked for the Post Office and was a Fujitsu boss 2006-16?
I so hope all the connections between tory parasites and the companies behind this shameful scandal are fully dragged out into the open.
Aye, aye.
Also the link between the Tory education minister and her husband"s firm receiving govt contracts!!! Corruption
Haven't we heard all this before. In 2019, the then Prime Minister promised to bring in legislation to ban the practice of fire and rehire following the sacking of 800 seafarers by P&O. After the story had run its course and ceased to be in headlines, the legislation became guidance.
Compensation will only be fully met when financial compensation is paid and every scumbag who was complicit in this miscarriage are behind bars and that will never happen! The rich look after the rich as always!🤬🤬🤬
Please note that the press' focus on Ed Davey is because he's Libdem. All his successors were Tories.
No one will see any of the 75k, all of it will go to pay off existing legal fees
Bet if this hadn't been a General Election year, then the poor sub-postmasters would be left waiting long afterwards, even in the wake of the drama broadcast
Why haven’t the serious fraud squad of the police been notified about this debacle? Surely they should be investigating the “mafia hit men “ of the PO investigators and how they were able to convict the innocent victims without a warrant!!
Because the Post OIffice made a profit from each Sub Postmaster they fleeced
Two Words,, Election Year
It took 20 years because, although the corporate media reported on it, they didn’t do their unanimous, frenzied screeching and puking about it every day at full volume the way they did with other stories which were either far less important or entirely fabricated.
What a joke! The PO has paid out only £9,000 so far in some court cases and £12 million distributed among 555 settled claimants, after court costs, or £21,000. Which is it?? They should charge Fujitsu the initial cost of the software which runs to the billions!
One word - Election
They all meed £1,000,000 plus,
What you didn’t cover - in all these stories - is what motivates people’s behaviour, in corporations like the PO and Fujitsu. Spell it out. Personal greed for unwarranted financial gain so they can enjoy nice lives and high status thank you very much, hiding personal failure, externalising their own guilt. Same motivation over and over again.
Here is the thing- apart from all the other aspects of this affair the role of Lord Neuberger in the Recusal seems to have escaped attention.
I have therefore pasted the following ‘The role of Lord Neuberger in the recusal fiasco (Justice Fraser) should be investigated’ on as many TH-cam articles as I could, about ten, but when I checked to see if there was any response I discovered they had all been taken down including Talktv
This Kafkaesque episode staggers one at every turn, even when Big brother has been outed he seems to be still working away!
I really want to know why Lord Neuberger interfered , if the recusal had succeeded the whole noble attempt at taking on the stinking system would have failed
They are not all going to be paid out you can bet on that
It was known in 2011. A report by consultants Ernst and Young sent to Post Office directors in 2011 warned that Fujitsu staff had "unrestricted access" to sub-postmasters' accounts, that "may lead to the processing of unauthorised or erroneous transactions".
In 2011, external auditors warned (Moya) Greene that they had identified weaknesses in the Horizon system they believed could 'lead to... unauthorised or erroneous transactions'. However, Greene accepted assurances from Post Office bosses that the cases were being handled correctly, as per the Mail Online.
The fujitsu interventions in the live program were not tracked or audited, the fujitsu team of coders were using sub postmaster's IDs to log in and change the transactions and coding on the fly. Please keep up at the back.
Reminds me of the effect the program "Kathy come home" years ago. The general public only become enraged when the terrible situations are fed to them on a plate.
Fujitsu is a private company and they know how to play the game.
I wonder if Lyme Disease will be the next scandal, thousands have it, but no NHS treatment!
It’s responsibility of all us including the press to ensure this case is not forgotten to follow the enquiry and all its recommendations are implemented and then some.
Postmasters names are cleared, they receive financial restitution, the Post Office stop dragging their feet to make payments. It appears the Post Office would prefer to pay their lawyers than Postmasters. The other area is who was responsible for misleading postmasters, lawyers, judges, enquiries, MP’s, Parliament and those individuals who perverted justice are pursued with the same vigour the Postmasters were. These people at the very least include past and present employees at the Post Office, Fujitsu, Lawyers and Civil Servants.
Why is no one mentioning Adam Crozier???? Is it because he is employed by ITV?
It's possibly because he was employed by ITV, but he isn't now. CEOs don't seem to face responsibilities, they just move on to other roles.
*edited for accuracy.
He isn’t employed by ITV
Crozier has been and gone from ITV. He is currently chairman of Whitbread and BT Group.
@nt300uk He was employed by ITV a short time ago. He was also CEO of the Post Office when the scandal occurred.
Don't worry, he's got another job at BT.
@@andrewoliver8930 he left in 2017, which was six years ago. If you’re counting that as a short time then sure.
This is an incredibly scandalous story, I don’t get why people feel the need to make up new facts to make it even more scandalous. Is it just attention seeking?
And yet…The Tories thought it fit to ignore the scandal for years & give out gongs to the PO😮 instead!,
why? Because they are fixated with corporate greed and reward it wherever they can.
Why has justice taken two decades?
Because the media didn't think it was newsworthy enough to keep it in the spotlight.
Oh hang on, that's you isn't it.
Jesus wept. Yeah that's the reason why the biggest miscarriage of justice in the UK happened, two decades ago, because of the News Agents 🙄
This is a systemic failure across the board, media, politics, public, post office, fujitsu.
Unfortunately, the media is owned by millionaires who are on the side of the elites.
Not all the media. Computer Weekly and Private Eye have been following this matter for years and the BBC made a documentary in 2015. MPs have been trying to pursue individual constituents’ cases and there is currently a public inquiry going on. It is the Tory-supporting media that have ignored it until the ITV drama but through to the public.
@@clarecrawford9677 It's the millionaire owned corporate media that have not been bothered. They've got friends at the top.
Keeping every scandal in the news daily is impossible. Docudramas on blood products Hillsborough, PPI during the pandemic, Rwanda deal, money to the French govt, Brexit lies, sewage in our waters, Windrush, Grenfell, Met police……et al. More dramas exposing these please!
No one /nothing covers being falsely locked up/imprisoned.
Believe me.
Why is Fujitsu dominating UK IT Systems? ICL (International Computers Limited) existed as a commercial entity and brand from 1968 to 2002; perhaps the flagship computer manufacturer of the UK until it was finally and completely absorbed into its eventual, Japanese owner Fujitsu.
Bates is right: the6 are entitled to restitution, not merely compensation.
Fujitsu donates hundreds of thousands pounds to the Tories.
Their former director during this scandal was given a government job last year.
They received another 2 billion in new contracts lately and are major Tories donors it's another way of money laundering to fund the next election on the Tories behalf at tax payers expense also you cannot hand back a cube you can refuse one at first but once given the king must take it back so more smoke and lies about this honour returned she still has it
@@monged4life442 He is married to the Education Minister.
I think the auditors should be questioned. They should have known that there was surpluses appearing without consideration. Not a word about the auditors.
Auditors, Ernst and Young flagged the problems in 2011. Fujitsu remotely altering till records.
Royal Mail and the Government decided it was "being handled properly"
Why, now - pre knowledge of guilt, happen.
Go back to the late 90s and see who Fujitsu bribed to win the contract. There's a senile old white guy in the UK right now, that definitely got his palms greased. He might be six feet underground, but he's there somewhere.
i like the herd analogy.. its your job to find away out of this analogy. if only the leaders would listen to the many and not the few
The whole story on the Government, Contractors & Post Office Ltd just feels so incestuous. Terrible smell in Westminster. Our Government is starting to make Mr Bunga Bunga almost look legitimate.
i mean looking at the british history since its inception i think we have always had high corruption we just are clever at how we do it here
Fujitsu sell one thing in Australia - air conditioning units.
The SNP guy was spot on.
I am amazed at the ignorance of journalists about the relations between Fujitsu and the Post Office. Clearly Fujitsu was aware of the problems and would have been trying to find solutions. The Post Office would have to have approved any 16:56 solutions and assessed the damage to their business, if necessary terminating Horizon at great cost. Fujitsu could hardly be expected to make failures public, damaging their customer or to withdraw in breach of contract. Fujitsu should be held accountable for failing to deliver a reliable system but not for the consequential damage caused by the actions of Post Office Ltd against the subpostmasters.
Sunak is ghastly. He took little or no interest before.
Its not really difficult to understand when you get it in your head we live in corrupt society who puts the interest of business above people and has done for generations. Its quite a normal thing once you stop pretending there is fairness for all.
The latter discussion shows ignorance of the panel on how American foreign secretary role works there are multiple very capable subordinates who can step in and do at least as well as the secretary
I am glad you brought up the Voltaire quote. I was getting in a mess when yiu listen to ministers, barristers etc who have been rabbiiting on as if the quote should be in reverse
“Grenfell was made for television” - this guy Lewis Goodall really comes out with some terrible phrases.
My inner cynic is telling me that firstly the general public has finally noticed this because of a docudrama and secondly, it's an election year.
Can't to see election flyers boasting that Sunak "Resolved the Ed Davey post office scandal"
Yes, the journalists EVENTUALLY reported the story 12 years after it happened. I wouldn't be giving yourselves too many high fives for that because you were not on top of this terrible injustice.
The avaricious cowardice shown by all involved is a disgrace, the British people need to stand up to the WEF clowns who are abusing the British people
Settlement/s yes.
BUT NEVER "FINAL".
.
Horizon was known to be faulty before it went live in 1999. Govt authorised Horizon going live with that knowledge.
The PO can calculate direct losses.
PM must tell all the lawyers to stop what they are doing immediately or the will be prosecuted. Everyone who had to pay the post office money must get that back immediately plus interest. All post masters must be declared to be innocent and did not commit any crime. Fujitsu must be suspended from tendering for any UK business. Then the name game for prosecutions can done with immediate effect. Name those to be prosecuted from Fujitsu, the post office and the government.
What the docudrama portrayed was the classic hero and villain story, which has the power to resonate with all of us. Quite a bit of 'waffle' and 'over-analysis' around the reason for it's impact as e.g. being shown at a particular time of year where it would have had the same impact had it been shown in July. It had a lot of impact because of those essential ingredients. Grenfell never had any heroes just plenty of villains and victims. Hillsborough likewise
Ask the right question…. Who has received payments/directorships from the company that’s just waiting quietly for all the nuisance noise to die down. Right now the NHS and schools are also relying on software companies that get billion pound contracts and have 10 employees! It will take 30 years to forever to discover that they have been abusing/hiding corruption behind GDPR laws disasters like this are waiting to happen. If the software tells the doctor not to prescribe medicine or the teacher that it must predict a ridiculous grade it must know better than the human who has gone through 8 or more years of dedicated study and a lifetime of work experience. The world is now run by an army of people with empty titles but no actual qualifications. These empty titles and matching pay rises have given them unlimited power to performance manage hardworking people with years of study and experience out of the jobs if they don’t do what the huge boards of greedy executives and their armies of ‘overseers’ want them to. Who said greed is bad? The greedy are commanding top pay here.
Absolutely!!!
And the matter swept under the carpet?
RS has already said that a sum has been set aside to cover the cough up.
And apparently this payout will be subject to taxation!!!
They can maybe pay the tax in 20 years time?
Unlike Sunak's wife.
Wrong. Compensation is not subject to income tax nor capital gains tax. Stop believing the nonsense on social media and do your own research.
@@kevinsyd2012 Where compensation is for loss of profits, then it and any attendant interest is taxable. London and Thames Haven v Atwool 1967TC
Compensation for personal suffering is not taxable.
No mate it not that they are imbedded with each other, it’s that they don’t come from a diverse enough background. So for stories to catch fire it has to offend your sensibility. It’s called being out of touch.
So the Post Office scandal...So it has to be asked why judges/courts allowed this to happen without checking why this was so endemic( even when judges when sentencing reviewed previous cases) ... it was only when it became public suddenly all including judges try rowing back on what was done...the court systems failed systemically...it’s caused suicide and destroyed lives ... it’s all smoke and mirrors....lady justice is more than blind, she is selectively deaf and mute as well .... then dispenses it’s programmed agenda ...with little if anything to do with being ‘just’...
ATTENBOROUGH AND ADAM BRITTON were in business together.....
but i bet YOU WILL COVER THAT UP.
The whole story is horrific, but I would love to hear the other side. The post office officials who decided that a large percentage of sub postmasters were fiddling the books before The horizon system was introduced. Just to know that point of view.
Hello jonathan as the other side (retired 16 years now) let me make a couple of comments:
- PO management is well ensconced in its bunker and I doubt we will see them, particularly after Steve Bradshaw was vilifyed in the press this morning.
- I've watched most days of the inquiry with growing horror and shame. I am sure that in time a few lower echelon people will "pay the butcher's bill"
- I've thanked my lucky stars a number of times that not one of my cases involved Horizon at all.
- As was mentioned in the inquiry, a number of "career criminals" have been attracted to jobs in the Post Office. Cases I dealt with included a loss of £1M over 3 months.
At the end of the day, however misinformed or misguided we were trying to protect public money
983 out of 10,400 post offices seemingly started fiddling the books just as Horizon came online.
Between 2003 and 2012 the courts were sending thirty subpostmasters to jail every year. And prosecuting 90.
Why the Barristers, the Courts, the Media, the Government, the Post Office not start questioning this earlier?
The enquiry is televised and put out on TH-cam. Unfortunately this has only popped up in many peoples feeds in the last week, but if you go to the enquiry channel all the videos from a long way back are available. I have watched quite a few of them, and I have to say that the Post Office investigators giving evidence are not coming across as decent people - many many questions are responded to with ‘I can’t remember’ and ‘I dont know’, or they refuse to acknowledge glaring inconsistencies in their statements. They are also clearly not particularly well educated so one wonders why they were ever considered capable of doing a job which could have such a devastating outcome on peoples lives. But worst of all, of those I have seen so far, there has very little in the way of humility or apology to their victims. And yes, they were victims - victims of intimidation, bullying, threats, lies and downright disgusting treatment). There is no excuse for that, including the excuse of ‘we were just trying to do our job’. It is perhaps unfortunate for Stephen Bradshaw that he was scheduled to appear on the first day after the broadcast drama, as public interest had hit an all-time high, but given that he in particular personified this bullying, intimidating, lying culture it was at least a chance for the public to see one of those responsible given a little taste of what he had dished out to others.
Because its england thats why. Things take long or dont happen at all.
Grenfell.
Jersey peado case,
covid scandal,
jimmy saville,
hillsborough,
Just wondering why it comes back to the taxpayer Emily ? Didn’t fujitsu trouser this money ?
Can the Sunak not just write a few cheques and write off for tax allowances or claim back on expenses or both?
Where were all the journalists.
This is not new news.
Just too boring for you ?
Just ordinary people with no money or royal blood.
Yeah he was wrong not to tell the President but relax guys other people out there to make decisions
Presenters partisan bias gets in the way of reporting …. Disappointing but not surprising given the individuals
Has she borrowed a childs Laptop to do this show, looks very cheep??