If you want to keep up to date with me you can follow me on twitter here: twitter.com/ZerkMhunter Also, I was on EmblemCast as a guest recently, you can check that out Here: soundcloud.com/user-131072822/episode-31-emblemcast-strikes-back-with-zerkmonsterhunter and lastly, sorry to all Zelgius fans, Everything I said about him could apply to Nergal as well, so I flipped a coin and landed on Zelgius. he's not bad, I love him, I just wish we saw him become the FE equivalent of Darth Vader in real time. Though, last time someone tried to do a Darth Vader origin story it didn't go so well...
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 I only played this game on Eirikas path and thought Lyon wasn't a particularly special antagonists. You just opened my eyes good sir, im going to play the game again on his side
In heroes, when he says "Well, come then," he is beckoning Ephraim forth. When he says "I am the Demon King," he is lying to Eirika. When he says "My caring heart has died," he is lying to himself.
Here's an interesting theory: The game starts you off with Eirika to encourage the player to do Eirika's route first, then play Ephraim's route. Eirika's route deliberately leaves the player asking "Why can't I save Lyon?" so that Ephraim's route can give you the answer: "Because he doesn't want to be saved". Lyon was faking in both routes, but it's revealed in the one players are more likely to play second to avoid having one route spoil the other. Once we reach the twist, we are meant to see Eirika's route in a whole new light. We realize that the events we saw were filtered through the perspective of a gullible and naive character. Once we see the events as they really are, we understand how completely Eirika was fooled and how we fell for it right along with her. Lyon's story is weaker if Eirika's route is viewed in isolation, but stronger as a whole if viewed in the right order. But then again, it's been a while since I played Sacred Stones, so I could be very wrong.
My one issue with this is that Eirika's path rather objectively paints Lyon's full possession, I really hope however, that this direction you mentioned is implemented into a possible FE8 remake.
@@deathcon6261 I hope that if they remake Sacred Stones they do two simultaneous routes as well. Either split the current cast in half (so more units get play time) or use contrasting game styles. Ephraims route could be more about smaller/harder battles while Erikas levels would have a lot more units on the map. Would be pretty cool.
Maybe not as soon though since this was the latest GBA game. I think they might try to Westernize some of the games we didn't receive (officially) like 4 or 5
Id love to see a no bars pc fan remake, kinda like fallout 4 new vegas but updated the game entirely into the modern sense. Id also love to see the play time go up and to see a much deeper story/dialogue system. Id also like to see the grief after killing lyon really hit you as tge player.
@@ZerkMonsterHunter The most pathetic thing is that Eirika's barely even relevant to her own side plot. Once Innes comes in, you could kick her out of the story entirely with minimal changes to what happens, because Innes is the one doing all the intellectual heavy lifting.
@@SuperZez which makes it even more sad because her story has one of the greatest sub plots SS has - Joshua's. It's short but holy hell did I not see that coming. I fully expected Eirika to be way more involved considering, you know, she similarly lost parents just recently. Nope. Says a couple "I'm sorry"ies and calls it a day.
I love Lyon because of how human and real he is to me. I could understand being envious of the perfect friend, and then devaluing yourself. I could understand being lustful for a girl whose your friend, and then feeling unworthy or ashamed of yourself. I've never experienced all this to his tragic extreme, but I love how he personifies my darkness.
Lyon never realised what his inner strength was. He sought to compensate in areas he never excelled at, when he could have focused on what he was good at : being a great scholar and a compassionate person. Those traits are extremely valuable in a leader. But because he compared himself to Ephraim, and fell prey to jealousy, he failed to see that he didn't need to be like him to be his own person and leader to Grado.
He's not lustful for Eirika, he loves her. Lust and love aren't the same. Obsession and love also aren't the same. Lyon deeply loved both Eirika and Ephraim, it's seen through the whole game with not only how he treats them but also how it affects his life and decisions. Just like he deeply loved his country. Lyon is full of love for so many things, but he doesn't feel strong enough as a person to take care of them nor feels like he "deserves" their love, which is what dooms him. Saying he simply lusted after her was so incorrect and disrespectful to the character. And talking about "your darkness" as if you're the only person to ever go through devaluing yourself when comparing yourself to someone better or because you lust after someone is ridiculous. That's not darkness nor something personal to only you. That's literally what humanity is about. Since the dawn of time. But I'm just gonna assume you were like 14 when you wrote that which is why you had such a "dooming" atmosphere lol
I remember being pretty young playing SS, I rushed through the game caring little for story, but every time Lyon popped up I found myself not being able to advert my eyes and glance over it, while it was probably his theme mesmerizing me, I stopped glancing over game stories once I fully realized that I could find gold such as Lyon.
His theme is actually one of my favorite pieces of gaming music, there are 4 arrangements of it throughout sacred stones and I'd love to hear a remastered medley of them.
There's a username here on TH-cam named OrangaStang (or something like that) and they made a remasterization of the whole Sacred Stones soundtrack. You should definitely check it out :D
I hope Naglfar refine would grant his weapon an effectivity against red units too. Then the eff would be granting +4 atk/def when nearby to infantry sword or lance ally.
Here's my headcannon, (strongly based on what you showed): Lyon tried to do a ritual to ressurect his dead father, he felt he wasn't ready to be king as he suffered from a inferiority complex which is understandable because his only other real friends were Ephraim and Erikia. Lyon always thought that Ephraim's headstrong attitude and extrovert demeanour fits the idea of a prince much better then himself. He strived to be like him but realized that both physically and mentally, he couldn't do it. So in his despiration he saught powers from the dark arts to save his father and as a result, his country; but ultimately he wanted to save himself from being thrust into a position he wasn't ready for. When the demon came to take him over, at the time he didn't resist. His fathers death and the ever looming threat of being crowned king brought much stress to the poor prince. He has been alone with his insecurities for far too long and he simply didn't want to think anymore... ...When he was struck down by Ephraim later in the game, he would utter the words "Where... Where did I go wrong?" He is asking himself when those feelings of insecurities that led him down his path, arised. When he thinks of a prince he thinks of traits like perseverance despite the odds and not secondguessing yourself. These are traits that Ephraim has that he lacked and almost as a direct result his insecurities made him believe that he would never be the king his land truely needed. He believed he would not match up to Ephraim. Lyon believed he would never match up to any of his predecessors and perhaps after realizing the evil deeds he has done, perhaps now he wish he would have never had been born at all. "The weight of the crown....is immense" - Lyon
it really is though, like it specifically happened to me after doctor strange 2 and thor 4 just how good lyon is as a possessed villain, and honestly he might straight up be THE best version of this trope as I can think of very few others that do anything near as good with the concept as lyon
I excpectd the game to have us go to Grado and pick up Lyon as a dark mage, and i was shocked when Lyons nature was revealed. I was saddened by the fact that i would have to kill Lyon
I think Sacred Stones has the best story of any Fire Emblem, and Lyon only confirms my decision. Also, I loooooove the interpretation of Lyon on Fire Emblem Heroes, the sentences and the voice actor fit him sooo much.
Yes, SS is also my favorite game, I love all its characters and some of them are the most interesting on the entire franchise: Lute, Cormag, Lyon, ect. Even the lords (I dont understand the Eirika hate at all) are two of my favorites. I think is a very underrated game.
Blueblade13 Mine as well. Arvis is a close second since he's also as manipulative, yet every bit as tragic as Lyon when you realize the entirety of his tragedy. I hate Heroes for making them nearly identical in stats, though >.< I want to use them both!
Blueblade13 Indeed. He could really use a refinement and a rework on stats to stop him from being essentially a cheap Arvis. And tbh, if his stats were going to be as mediocre as they are now, I would've preferred for him to be in the summoning pool, because then you could at least fix him beyond +3.
I’m quite happy Lyon won the recent Voting Gauntlet in FEH. In FEH you get the sense he knows what had once transpired, and that he shouldn’t have had a second chance to help others or reunite with Eirika and Ephraim after what he was going to do under the demon king’s influence.
Same here. To be honest didn't think he would win but I still chose him. He's probably my favorite character ever, if not, one of my favorites. I kid you not, when I saw that victory screen with mai boi I felt this rush of warm happiness wash over me and I may still be smiling over it
An interesting interpretation I've heard is that Lyon on Ephraim's route is lying that he has more control than he does to intimidate his rival and in Eirika's, lies that he has less control to either get pity points or make himself look less villainous in his beloved's eyes.
I love how his normal quotes in heroes sound realy soft and weak and...you know Lyonish, but his special quotes sound powerful ,dark and evil. It's like he changes personality mid battle wich to be hones he kind of does.
Welp, guess I'll be replaying Sacred Stones again. I really do need to experience Eirika's story. In my, 3 times I think, of playing I've always chosen Ephraim, and while I thought Lyon was a good villain, I didn't quite think he was the best. But with your video, I now kinda have to reconsider. He has so many layers (I want to make a Shrek joke here, but I'm restraining myself), that I never considered. While I have more nostalgia for Black Knight, and I think Arvis makes for a cooler fight, Lyon might just the best story of them all. So in other words, Lyon is an onion. He's purple, has layers, and is easily sliced with a knife.
Well, I'm happy I could make you rethink Lyon. as I said in the video, Eirika's path does come with the issue of goofing Lyon's character, but there's still a lot of good within it.
I'll always hold Black Knight as my top. Though Lyon is definitely good. Black Knight just has so many intricacies and his sorrow brought emotions into me.
Julius is just really generic for a FE villain. Posseessed by ancient evil dragon, callous, but charismatic. It does not help that Genealogy gives him no backstory or depths.
Fortnite is CANCER While I can see a certain point in saying that Julius has a backstory, said "backstory" has far more to do with his relationship to Julia, Seliph, Deidre, Sigurd, and Arvis than it does with Julius himself.
Man, sacred stones is great. Like, it has something for everybody. A great story, great characters, great gameplay, and a great villain. And that’s something I can really appreciate.
A lot of people say that SS was terrible, too easy, cliche plot, and characters were poorly written. But I found no such thing in any of these, permanent character deaths needs to come back with no option so that people take the game more seriously.
Sacred Stones was very easy, but I liked the gameplay because I could choose to max out everyone at Tower of Valni, make a team of sages and paladins or whatever i wanted because of branching promotions, and I could abuse summoners. Also Ross. The only Fire Emblem game I enjoyed equally was Radiant Dawn because the game has so much content it's ridiculous.
@@BlackDragon41sbm The funny thing is, I remember Sacred Stones characters the most out of all of the characters from Fire Emblem games that I've played. Ike is my favorite Lord/Hero, but when it comes to side characters Sacred Stones takes the cake.
Did you know that the don't have the last word in VGs, but the last hour's multiplier, which usually benefits the current losers. So VGs are usually nothing but lies.
@@GaeaRage0798 You know whether we like it or not that sometimes the multiplier can be pretty useful to certain circumstances like these (PS: I don't not want a Tellie character such as Ike to win)
Absolutely phenomenal video. You can tell how much effort went into this 25 minute analysis of a video game character, and you portrayed perfectly what Lyon means to you, your personal connection to him, and how his character arc makes Lyon a very tragic character. Those 25 minutes passed by instantly, but no amount of what you said and discussed in that time was boring or uninteresting. The video wasn't overly long, and you absolutely made the most of out every second. This gave me a new perspective on Lyon and made me appreciate him more than I ever would have been able to; your thoughts, opinions, and perspective on Lyon was flawlessly conveyed. Looking forward to what you'll bring next, Zerk. Great video.
This may be quite late, but your passion for a game I love made me bother to leave my own opinions on this subject, in which I mostly agree with you. I only disagree in that Eirika's path is bad characterization of Lyon. In fact, I think it is exactly how Lyon would act if he was facing Eirika as the leader of the army. Why use straightforward and honest truth when he knows she's incredibly naive? It would be far more useful to manipulate those feelings he knows she has for him and play the victim to the end. I feel that Ephraim's path is intended to be the second one you play, as it would reveal that Lyon is scheming and vile of his own accord. I took those revelations to be telling that all of his Eirika path dialogue is an act, as he loved her, and wanted to be loved by her. What better way to do so than play the damsel in distress, even when he knew his death at her hands was inevitable? Aside from that, wonderful video. Sacred Stones will always be my favorite FE and one of my favorite games ever because of these characters, and I'm glad there are others who are just as passionate. Thank you.
This is so well made! I played Ephraim's route right after Eirika, so I might have skipped some story scenes because I thought it was the same (and bc I was a dumb kid). Lyon isn't a villian who is controlled by a demon king, he IS the one controlling others. He is the Demon King. The special quotes part that you showed gave me absolute chills, especially the response to Ephraim. You did a great job Zerk! You were perfectly able to show just who Lyon is. Keep up the great work! 😁👍
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 haha thanks! But I made my own build anyway. Naglfar Rally Spd/Res Vengeance Close Counter Swordbreaker 3 (for now) Drive Res 2 QR3 Seal Fire Blessing I'm having too much fun deploying him haha.
I never really played classic fire emblem ,but guess who i sided with in the past Gauntlet? Lyon. All it took was one quote. “ Nobody but YOU know what you’ve been through “
Gloomy nerd boy is best boy. He deserved better. Looking up to your best friend, wanting to be just like him. Falling for a girl who is kind to you no matter how low you think of yourself. The crippling fear of being unable to measure up to your father's name and legacy. I know these feelings well. I feel like a lot of us can relate to Lyon in at least one of these aspects, and that's why he's my favourite villain in my favourite FE game. Awesome video, dude. Keep up the great work, and believe in yourself.
The divergence of the story when you choose your paths serves to contextualize Lyon's actions in different ways. To begin, Lyon is very blatantly based on the tale of Icarus, a man who flew too close to the sun. This is interesting, because Ephraim and Eirika hold the Solar and Lunar Braces, which are based on the sun and the moon, which is the sun's shadow. If you choose Eirika's path, and by extension the Lunar Brace, we see that all of Lyon's actions were a farce. He lost to the Demon King before he could even try to save Grado. He chased the moon and became lost in the cosmos. Without the sun to either guide or kill him, he could never come back down to Earth again. That's why he is a mere puppet, at least thematically. If you choose Ephraim's path, and by extension the Solar Brace, Lyon gets the chance to fly too close to the sun. His hubris tricks him into believing that he can be like his metaphorical sun, Ephraim, and beat the Demon King on his own. We see through the story that this is not what happens, and Lyon flying to close to the sun is what brought him (and by law his kingdom) crashing down. While he was able to somewhat control the Demon King, he was so caught up in the fantasy of matching the sun's brilliance to realize that there was no point in even flying to the sun. The only thing that would happen is that he would get burned. Also, the real villain of Sacred Stones is fucking Vigarde for shooting down Lyon's idea of asking Ephraim and Eirika for help with Grado's whole future earthquake thing.
I legit under estimated sacred stones character arcs. "i've always loved you, i've always hated you" how can such a SIMPLE line describe how jealousy twists someone into something vicious and hollow?
As I've told friends, Lyon is the Camus archetype on steroids. I enjoy Eirika's route with Lyon because it makes me feel like "if I'd just been faster, I could have helped him" but there wasn't a way to fix this. I kept rooting for Lyon to break free of control totally, but since it didn't happen, I was sad but had righteous fury to stop the Demon King (although I think ANYONE who's played Eirika's route will say that her giving Lyon the stone was a seriously dumb move) and it felt good to take the demon down and set Lyon free. Ephiram's route was always good because to me, it felt like these routes were happening at the same time, save a few script changes. Imagine this: if Lyon was faking all along, why would he tell Eirika that? He loved her, to the point that the demon king made special mention of that fact in a boss quote. To me, even if Lyon was faking it in both, him using Eirika's naivety and dangling the carrot of rescue makes sense, because he knows she'll succeed where he's failed. To me, he's still the most sob-story of the FE villains but that's a good thing because let's face it, we all can't be insane as Nergal or blinded by rage as Sephiram or just as ass as Shagall or daddy issues like Zephiel. Lyon was a fundamentally broken character, so for his ending to be a sad one just makes it better. After all, the question of "what if" comes up about Lyon and it makes things far more interesting. Lyon would have gotten redemption from Ephiram and Eirika almost immediately because we know where he comes from. Can you really say that if any other main villain in the entirety of FE had survived (aside from Sephiram/Lehran) their final encounter that they'd be as quick to redeem as Lyon would be? He did what he did from a place of fear and lack of confidence, and with Eirika and Ephiram to help him he'd be a great king and prevent the damage that the earthquake he saw in his vision would bring. He was a good person who, thanks to the demon king, lost sight of himself and the right path. He's still one of my top 3 villains because of both Ephiram AND Eirika's paths (even if parts of Eirika's were handled with the care of an angry bull in a china shop)
Eirika's path never ceases to find ways to upset me. In regards to what ifs on whether Lyon would have been a great king, I beleive he still would've lived too much in his father's shadow, I also think he'd probably never have a chance with Eirika either. unfortunately, just given his character I feel, should he have succeeded grado proper, he'd be a very reclusive king.
This was a nice video. Good thing you've been hyping this up for a while. I was never really crazy about Lyon but he was quite a tragic character which was among the most memorable parts of Sacred Stone's story Although I'm a bit confused about Lyon himself actually being responsible for the conflict in the story. I've only played Ephraim's route once which was a bit of a long time ago so a lot of what I remember is a little foggy. But I thought he was fully possessed in both routes. It doesn't really add up that innocent nerdy Lyon is the same as possessed Lyon. I've always assumed that the Demon King was just more cunning and manipulative on Ephraim's route.
glad you enjoyed! and yeah, I played through SS back in april to prepare for this and I can confirm Lyon IS in control of his actions, his emotional state is being manipulated by the demon king, think of it like: "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink"
Godamn...man...i...i'm at a lost for words...but i'm glad to know this video is out, you're doing okay and well analyzed. Just remember do stuff that makes you happy, don't focus on views,and most importantly you have support from your friends and fans.
Honestly, if his father's penultimate dying words weren't basically "LOL! You're going to burden other kingdoms because of our natural emergency? You dumbass!", Lyon probably wouldn't have done all this stupidness and would've just explained to other kingdoms.
Its so damn annoying people hate on sacred stones because its easy, or isnt designed as well as the others, that they over look its greatest strength, how it handles characters, its in my opinion the best one in the series with characters, followed after by blazing sword. Lyon was my first villain in media i grew to respect yet fear as a character, and even hurt for him, and very few stand close to him even after all these years
I think the timing of this is spot on since Lyon won the voting gauntlet, did you plan for this? Also I felt that you might have explained Lyon somewhere along the road. Anyways, nicely done Zerk. I always like the reason why people has a personal bias of a character they like and yours is no exception of Lyon. Though I prefer Eirika's path better because of Joshua and Cormag the way of how Lyon is portrayed in Ephraim's path is a lot better as you have stated. Don't know if you want to change your pic to Lyon now but I think that it could be good. Anyways great video Zerk. Btw who did you ally support Lyon with? I supported him with regular Eirika.
Glad you liked the video, and like I said, there certainly is merit to eirika's path, just not for Lyon. I haven't decided who to ally support mine with, you can see mine in the video, all he has is earth blessing. perhaps if they ever add Selena or Knoll to heroes...
That was spectacular. Definitely goes to show how Lyon isn't just one of the best Fire Emblem villains, but one of the best Nintendo villains as a whole.
I always thought lyon was underrated myself, hes one of the most realistically written characters in the game (despite being possessed by a demon) and yet nothing goes well for him even his death only benefitted the demon king. sacred stones is like the Batman of the franchise in that it has the best villains
To be fair. I completely agree with your synopsis of Lyon. He's the greatest Antagonist in my eyes, with Arvis following second and Grima third (with the added story of Echoes and the realization that he slaughtered all the earth dragons alone). So I have to say that I loved the vid!
Robin - The - Joker I didn't mention it but there are some interesting parallels between Lyon and Arvis. if it's any consolation; arvis is my second favorite villain
Amazing analysis, wow 👌🏻 It’s cool to hear about how certain characters hit emotional chords for different people :) I was a bit bored by Lyon in SS, although I can appreciate how well he was written. Just wasn’t my cup of tea. Especially on Eirika’s route, as I’m really not a fan of crush-on-girl-turns-into-jealousy-feel-bad-for-me plotlines. Ephraim’s route tho I 100% agree with you, Lyon was MUCH better written, although still not my taste in villains. I definitely understand how he could be a great character to relate to. Congrats on completing the video 🤘🏻🤘🏻
thank you! and yeah, I realize his archetype isn't for everyone, but he's just so different from every other FE villain I can't help but be intoxicated with how well he's written.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 For sure! Lyon on Ephraim’s route in particular was much better as you said. But I really didnt like his whole crush on Eirika arc in her path, and cuz of that I’ve had mixed feelings on him as a character. But anyways, amazing analysis! Enjoyed it 👌🏻
It has been quite a while since I played Sacred Stones but I really enjoyed your take, the game pulls Lyons Story off really well. First you think he is possessed by a demon only to find out he isn’t only to wonder in the end on how much it really affected him. Atleast my interpretation always was that while he was in control, it wasn’t nearly as much as he himself likes to think. I like to think that the demons corruption worked more akin to removing his inhibitions, turning his love to Erika into lust, his jealousy for Ephraim into hate - in many ways killing the caring heart, his shy personality, which in another path could have turned into humility and temperance, making him a great ruler in his own way. But he instead tried to rule by magical strength and demonic power - I think this is what his words really mean. Yes, Fomortiis is a demon. But Lyon became the Demon(ic) King.
Tell me, Ephraim: do I look like I’ve grown stronger? The last time we dueled, I was too weak to test you. Why, I was so weak, I even lost to Eirika… …… I’ve sacrificed the lives of many good people. I’ve committed many unforgivable sins. The caring heart I once possessed died long ago… And I’ve grown stronger because of it. I’ve grown strong enough to defeat even you, Ephraim. …No, you haven’t. You’re still no match for me. You were never one for combat. It’s not in you. You should never have chosen this path. …… …… Here I come, Lyon. (Thanks, Serenes Forest! I... wish I had it memorized, but I don’t)
Im late to the party but I liked how Fire Emblem Heroes development some Lyon character by his normal self talk to his possesed version. I thought it was really cool and well executed.
I just wanted to say that everything you say in this video... I talk about it every day. I am probably one of the biggest fans of the sacred stones. I've never played it due to my terrible skill in video games-- I can't even win easy, casual mode in later games-- But I've read the script over and over and over again and almost every single character has carved its own personal space in my heart. Lyon first and foremost. I've annoyed my friends over and over again with half-hour long rants about why he is the best fire emblem villain by far because he isn't the villain at all-- He's your friend, and he's *always loved you*, even if he's always hated you, too. This video is like listening to my own inner thoughts-- And I'm thankful that it is. Fire Emblem 8 is relatively unloved compared to the more recent stories. We can't get any alts other than Ephraim and Eirika, and no one knows any of the characters other than those two. I've been upset due to CYL 3 with no FE8 characters other than Eirika since it was my goal to vote for one every single day to show my adoration for my absolute favorite piece of media. To cure this, I've been looking for likeminded individuals-- People that love the game as much as I do. This video made me feel so much happier and better because it was everything I already knew but needed to hear. Thank you for this video. It was exactly what I needed to see.
A Fallen Heroes 2 would be neat to see. Berkut, Loptous!Julia, a version of Ike driven berserk by Lehran's medallion... I think a Redeemed Villains banner would be just as cool though. They could use FE3/12 Michalis, gen 2 Arvis, Gangrel, and maybe Fernand.
I think that another reason that Eirikas story portrays Lyon as a puppet is because Lyon wanted Eirika to think that. He loved her. With the Demon King, he still did, perhaps even more so. He wanted to still have a chance with Eirika, he couldn't stand her hating him. So he lied. All he wanted was to be with Eirika, and to be like Ephraim. He was consumed by his despair. Your video almost makes me feel wrong to mod the sacred stones to where Lyon isn't the villian. But I think how he was in Sacred Stones really shaped me to WANT to make him a good guy. It's like another of my favorite video game characters; Knight Artorias. He was consumed by the Abyss, but in his cut dialogue and his intro, you see he's still there. Barely. He begs for redemption that cannot come. All he wanted was to save everyone. You feel wrong to kill him, but you have to. That is the hallmark of a truly great villain. You WANT them to be redeemed. You BEG for their rise back to grace. And it makes it all the more heartbreaking when they don't.
I hear a lot of "oh he's faking it in Eirika's campaign" I want to believe it I really do, but I feel it steps a bit too far into speculative territory. Lyon exemplifies the "non-villain" antagonist, a really cool thing I wish was more constant in writing
@@ZerkMonsterHunter It definitely is speculation, I was just theorising based on what we know about Lyon. He's Easily top two favorite Fire Emblem characters for me and I love the guy to death. But that's just my two cents.
Naglfar refine for best villain when IS.... Also when they make a Sacred Stones remake (someday), they had better get Mark Whitten to reprise his role as Lyon since he did such an amazing job in heroes. On top of that, I would love a Lyon alt where he transforms into the Demon King (with ravager as his weapon), but you get hints that he is faking his possession for his 5 star quotes and a huge hint for his level 40 5 star quote.
@@ZerkMonsterHunter Still no refine for the best prince, but he got an alt as a Duo Hero tag teaming with Ephraim. Fingers crossed that he gets a refine soon (So my +10+110 Lyon can be finally complete).
In regard to Lyon being able to temporarily break from the demon kings soul in Eirika's route, I feel like this was only due to Lyon's feelings of love for Eirika, which temporarily took the demon king off guard and broke his hold for a moment (hence him saying it was a mistake to disregard the power of human emotion) Once the DK realized Lyon had these strong emotions he was able to manipulate and abuse them to get not only more of what he wanted out of Lyon, but even make him more powerful. Its implied that Lyon has always had feelings of contempt and frustration with Ephram, from the way Emphram viewed amd treated their friendship, to the way Eirika never gave Lyon the attention he desired because of Ephram always getting in the way. On top of this Lyon has great pride in knowing that the firdt emperor of Grado was the great hero of old, but noe Grado despite having the best military had become one of the most disregarded nations despite their legacy, with Renais being the most loved and heralded nation, again, due in no small part to Ephram. The DK didnt really force Lyon to do things he didnt want to, but rather brought out all of his inner darkness evil and base desires to the surface, all the things Lyon had worked hard to deny and repress within himself. He delved too deep into dark magic to revive his father, he destroyed Renais out of jealousy of it outshining Grado, he hounded Ephram and killed their father to spite the man he viewed as his superior, and when the possibility that Lyon could break free from the DK's influence because of Eirika arose, the DK then not only preyed upon Lyon's love for Eirika, but also baited Lyon with his own carnal desires for her as well that, again, he had hid and repressed from himself for so long. If anything, the fact that Lyon had that one chance to break free, but failed because he couldnt come to terms with his own negative and selfish tendencies, and subsequently lost any hope for being saved because of it only makes him even more tragic.
I know we probably are really far away from a Sacred Stones Remake, but after hearing Mark Whitten’s performance I really cannot wait for him to break my heart by adding “extraemotionalpunch” to Lyon in game
I'm really happy the text scroll for the "where did I go wrong" moment matches so well. I want Whitten and Chun to banter off each other as Ephraim and Lyon so badly you don't understand.
You know The first time I played sacred stones I went Ephraim route for some reason It let me see more of the darker side of the story in all senses While eirika goes through the mountains with light and hope in her heart, Ephraim sees the decay of grado in all senses While the bosses like Pablo were cartoony to a fault,you could feel the sorrow in Selena's eyes after receiving her last order as a moonstone You see how for once is not the invaders who destroyed the evil land Then you reach castle grado Vigarde was dead all along all that Maybe I didn't really notice at that time but it's surprisingly all so fluid Nothing feels like an asspull when thinking from the game world's logic and possibilities Now when reading the interactions between Ephraim and Lyon Just wow Eirika's route just feels like a red hairing now A sheet to cover the depth of the game
Fire emblem : sacred stones is my favorite game but super underrated! Thank you for making a video on Lyon the best character that's been hyped up all through out that game!
with all due respect, for me, Erika's route is the Canon one to me, for the very reasons you dislike it, the fact taht leon's actions were never his own, and that the fight against the Demon King much more justfied, and i HATE ephirim's route for the same reasons you Like it.
so, here's my take, Both paths happen congruently, so the stuff about valter killing glen and caelaach killing Joshua's mother all still happens, it's just that ephraim's path does Lyon so much better, neither path is "canon" per say.
joaocisne556 completely agree I also like Eirika's path much more and thought it was more interesting, tragic, and well written. but besides that (and the mispronounciation of Lyon's name), the essay is well done and some recognition of Lyon's character is super refreshing!
@@ZerkMonsterHunter actually in heroes the two Eirikas say Lyon differently. I thought it was funny when I first heard it. You should go check it out. Its actually hilarious hearing the same voice actor read Lyon completely different.
The opening narration was very VERY promising in this video. I haven't watched the rest. I'm sure you won't shit on eirika or anything like most others d-- Edit 1 - ok, I'm sensing a similar vibe to another youtuber I watch with the way you describe lyon's actions or the game's showing of his character. I'm not going to say who, but you both make me want to do anything you say. Edit 2 - Is it "Lee-on", "Lie-uhn", or "Lee-own"? I'm so confused, and I've always said "Lee-on" Edit 3: Ok, now I understand what you're getting at with Eirika's route being bad. Honestly, I never got this impression. I just was able to understand what kind of situation Eirika and the others are in, and what evil there actually is. Now, I cant pick up small story details in plots, so Eirika's route using Lyon as a possessed puppet was easier for me to understand than what.... Ephraim's Lyon was... trying to throw at me. Oh, and the "sob story" is exactly what we learn in ephraim's route, so I don't see why this specific thing is a problem, aside from Lyon and his father. Edit 4: Ok. What the actual F^CK is the dialogue at 17:51 to 19:12? Seriously. When I first played Ephraim's route, I was SO F^cking confused at what this was, at what he was saying, that I had no clue what to make of it. Was he jealous? Was the demon king in control or not? Was Lyon in control or not? It seemed as if everything he said was to contradict his previous statements and confuse the living hell out of the player (me). I kinda get it now, what he's doing and what he went through as a character, but if its nothing to the dreams of the human heart, then why did he go and do this stuff anyway? Its just SO CONFUSING and I never understood any of it. To this day, I still find it confusing, and it adds upon my hatred for chapter 18. I'm sorry, Zerk. I suppose I'm just not one of the smart people who understand this deep crap.
Heroes is vague with the pronunciation, sword infantry Eirika says "Lee-on" but Mage Eirika and Legendary Ephraim say "Lee-own" and I've always pronounced it "Lion" so, yeah sorry about that. also, glad you liked the opening, not sure how well that was going to be received.
Another thing i found after watching this video is that when lyon said the he seen two paths with the dark stone one where he was consumed by the demon king and other where he controls it. Is parallel with the two paths with the twins. I really love this game and the story got to be pne of the best
Well I haven't played Eirikas path yet but Ephraim's was so good I don't even think I need to, but I will. And because of my playing of his path Lyon is probably my favorite FE villain to date and Ephraim is easily one of my favorite lords. (P. S. Lyon's evil portrait is so well done. It really captures just how evil and twisted he's become in such a short time)
If you are playing Eirika's path, there's not much reason to play past chapter 16. I usually reccomend to first time sacred stones players to copy their save before the route split, play both until beating chapter 15 and then finishing the game with Ephraim.
Zerk, this was amazing! Just like you, Lyon is my favorite video game character of all time. While his impact on me wasn't as personal as yours, his tragic arc felt so real and so fleshed out to me. And you did an excellent job at portraying that! Props to you!
I love lyon and I can't describe how I felt when I discovered in Heroes that it's pronounced leon and not lion. But okay. Great video. And fucking great Monika/Lyn avatar.
i haven't even played Sacred Stones before and im already just. totally in love with Lyon's character. i thought he was neat in Heroes, but Damn. knowing all of this now, and hearing that one line, ("Where did I go wrong...?"), im actually really upset. i came here for cute mages and dragons, not to feel ruined over someone who can't be saved
So... Lyon ended up becoming evil because he hated Ephraim and was obssesed with Eirika; both unconsciously... This means... Lyon was a victim of suggestive brainwashing from Fomortiis to make him liberate his more negative feelings about their beloved ones... and making the whole path of destruction easier without having to do it in his own until the very end.
While I haven’t played SS myself, I’ve grown to really like Lyon from Heroes mostly from two quotes he says while standing around the castle. One where he mentions how he tripped yet it doesn’t bother him and that being alive is wonderful and another where he tells the Summoner that it’s ok to cry because no one knows what they’re going through. At the moment I’m typing this, I don’t feel the greatest but reading those lines made me feel just a tad better.
I recently played FE8 in around november. I played Ephraim's route and I got to the end, I cried so much, for the first time in a game since 2013. Lyon is such a relatable character from my perspective, I was going through a lot but FE8 made me feel good about myself. I loved Lyon as a character, tragic yet kind, like me. I just think Lyon is my favorite character in all of fire emblem, yes he may be cliched but he's tragic and I feel his pain in some ways. And when I watched this video, it made me feel like crying again, I just love the way you described all the stuff that went down with Lyon as a character. This is an amazing video!
No matter what happens I will always enjoy your content and it's always a blessing to see such in depth analysis like these posted. It's not often we get to see analysis like these posted and with full commentary. It makes it easier to put in the background and listen to and not to mention they are a little bit more accessible and out there. Keep up with this content and I look forward to seeing more!
Wow, this gives me a reason to replay Sacred Stones again. I love the way that this video is conveyed, the effort and emotion is really felt, this really just reinforces why Lyon is best boy. This is a entertaining and intriguing video as always king. Also my heart right now, they don't think it be like that sometimes, but it really do man...
I know I'm late to this video, but I recently got into Fire Emblem and I played Sacred Stones because I knew Erikia from heroes. I'm a little confused on Lyon. So he was the host for the Demon King, but everything he did was his own actions. So why didn't he try to stop everything that happened. Did he want Ephraim to kill him? Did the Demon King corrupt his emotions and that's how it was of Lyons will? Sorry but I'm new to this franchise so I'm a bit confused
The Demon King warped his emotions into just making him want to do things. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink, but if you convince it it's thirsty maybe it just might
Tbh I still feel that its a 50/50 since the daemon king did use lyon as stated and the fact the 2 paths sorta conflict with eachother a tad (easy to just label is as eirika's naive perspective tho.) Id argue lyon was controlled like the cordetex fungus but not enough to try and essentially kill ephrims caring kindness for lyon so he can for sure kill him in the final battle. Something I got in how he speaks not just during the volcano level but also during the final battle, he still sees lyon as a friend enough to essentially still speak as some sort of puppet that knows its being puppeteered in mind but can still voice his wish for death. Ironically like a person enslaved to fate, he knows it will come and yet laments it...like konrad curze.
I actually like both routes. In Erika route I don't think he could face her having made the decisions he did. He loves her and would rather her believe him a victim than a villain.
Just attempt to imagine the amazing battle Lyon would have with Nergal if they were to come to a confrontation. One who can bend the elements, the essence of life and even the dragons against One who managed to conceal the most evil being of all time within himself through sheer willpower, can even practice necromancy with minimal help and can also control dragon zombies.
24:01 -- Mine too. It's interesting, because I played Sacred Stones years before I started watching Fairy Tail, and there's a character with a similar moral dilemma that appears in the latter. The comparison between Lyon and Jellal can't "not" be made due to the similar circumstances the find themselves in, and as much as I come to sympathize with Jellal eventually (even though I disliked how his first arc played out), I sincerely believe that the way Lyon was written in Sacred Stones is still one of the best ways to handle a character like this. Come to think of it, doesn't Fire Emblem series and Fairy Tail have a lot in common? > "Titania". > Ancient Dragon > Adopted Daughter of a Dragon > Brainwashed best-friend that becomes the main villain I'll just leave that here.
Might be the first time in a while I didn't find it appropriate to make a joke about Lyn's thighs... I could just tell you to cry into them, but... Yeah, I feel like that would be doing a disservice to all the effort you put into this video. Though I'm not sure I agree that Eirika's route does him a disservice, I do agree that Ephraim's route does far more for him, and it's for all the reasons you explained.
Very well... *Ahehehem!* Next you'll say, "just kidding, btw, I wasn't REALLY crying, I just pretended so that Lyn would let me shove my face in her thighs!"
Honestly, I view Eirika route as Lyon pretending to be possesed, as he wouldn't have the heart to tell Eirika otherwise as he loves her. His ultimate goal is still to save Grado from ruin, just like Ephraim route. He isn't in love with Ephraim and envies him, so that's why he was able to tell him straight on.
I would actually argue Nergal is the most tragic, but you have to really dig to find out he's more than the designated megalomaniacal dark mage. Spoilers. He was separated from his dragon family, and sought power to reunite with them. He turned to the extremes of dark magic and manipulating life energy to get the portal open. Unfortunately the dark magic eroded his mind and he forgot what his goal was, and instead began doing progressively worse things to chase power for its own sake. Eventually he gains the power to summon dragons into the world, and by dumb chance, pulls in his own children who he intends to sacrifice, forgetting that they were his goal all along. As he's dying in the end, he has a moment of clarity and asks himself why he wanted power in the first place. It's honestly quite similar to what happened with Lyon. Furthermore, Nergal's earlier morphs had personality and emotion, while his later ones were nothing but cruel and evil. You can make out his descent into cruelty and madness by Kishuna's memory of being created, vs Nergal discarding him and other morphs for being useless in favor of heartless monsters like Sonia and Ephidel.
nergal falls into the same pitfall as Zelgius does. his backstory is merely told to us in bits and pieces, whereas Lyon is shown to us in essentially real time.
While I LOVE both this video and Lyon, there is one tiny issue I have with Ephriam's route. In the scene where Renais' sacred stone is destroyed, you described it as Lyon casting 'Hold Person' on Ephriam. My issue is that A. this is the only time he does that in the game, B. (though I will admit I feel less strongly on this one) he just lets Ephriam live after that, and C. Erika's version of this scene get so much flak but this version doesn't. I still enjoyed your analysis, but that will always bug me.
ah yes good question, knowing how hold person works, Lyon may have cast it often and everyone always passes their save. and Like I said in the video, this version doesn't get as much flak because it has the whole "oh shit" factor of Ephraim finally being not in control of a situation. that "oh shit" factor is what Eirika's version of this scene lacks.
Honestly, while Lyon was already one of my favorite characters back then, I didn't really take him into account when considering, which route is better. I really liked Eirika's route, because of Cormag and Joshua, but now I'm not so sure.
If you want to keep up to date with me you can follow me on twitter here: twitter.com/ZerkMhunter
Also, I was on EmblemCast as a guest recently, you can check that out Here: soundcloud.com/user-131072822/episode-31-emblemcast-strikes-back-with-zerkmonsterhunter
and lastly, sorry to all Zelgius fans, Everything I said about him could apply to Nergal as well, so I flipped a coin and landed on Zelgius. he's not bad, I love him, I just wish we saw him become the FE equivalent of Darth Vader in real time.
Though, last time someone tried to do a Darth Vader origin story it didn't go so well...
Cool video
Ruby Knights ignore him. he's blowing a throwaway line way out of proportion.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 yeah okay.
Hey what do you think of the new Fire Emblem heroes units that came out today well technically yesterday yesterday.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4
I only played this game on Eirikas path and thought Lyon wasn't a particularly special antagonists. You just opened my eyes good sir, im going to play the game again on his side
maaake a discoooord you loser >:( i need to show you my legendary lyn
In heroes, when he says "Well, come then," he is beckoning Ephraim forth.
When he says "I am the Demon King," he is lying to Eirika.
When he says "My caring heart has died," he is lying to himself.
yep. his lines are all gold, it's so good
I am currently trying not to cry in public at the revelation.
Damn
Did you know the VA for Lyon is the also the VA for Seteth
He didn't lie his past still does hold the power the Demon
Here's an interesting theory:
The game starts you off with Eirika to encourage the player to do Eirika's route first, then play Ephraim's route. Eirika's route deliberately leaves the player asking "Why can't I save Lyon?" so that Ephraim's route can give you the answer: "Because he doesn't want to be saved". Lyon was faking in both routes, but it's revealed in the one players are more likely to play second to avoid having one route spoil the other. Once we reach the twist, we are meant to see Eirika's route in a whole new light.
We realize that the events we saw were filtered through the perspective of a gullible and naive character. Once we see the events as they really are, we understand how completely Eirika was fooled and how we fell for it right along with her. Lyon's story is weaker if Eirika's route is viewed in isolation, but stronger as a whole if viewed in the right order.
But then again, it's been a while since I played Sacred Stones, so I could be very wrong.
My one issue with this is that Eirika's path rather objectively paints Lyon's full possession, I really hope however, that this direction you mentioned is implemented into a possible FE8 remake.
@@ZerkMonsterHunter More likely they will pull a Echoes/Gaiden and have you play both routes.
Assuming the new Fallen Lyon is from Eirika's path then this is 100% the case
I recently beat Sacred Stones, i got to the Ephraim route First
@@deathcon6261 I hope that if they remake Sacred Stones they do two simultaneous routes as well. Either split the current cast in half (so more units get play time) or use contrasting game styles. Ephraims route could be more about smaller/harder battles while Erikas levels would have a lot more units on the map. Would be pretty cool.
I really want a sacred stones remake like shadows of valentia
YES
Maybe not as soon though since this was the latest GBA game. I think they might try to Westernize some of the games we didn't receive (officially) like 4 or 5
Ashton Reynolds the day we do get it thought I'll be beyond myself in excitement
Id love to see a no bars pc fan remake, kinda like fallout 4 new vegas but updated the game entirely into the modern sense. Id also love to see the play time go up and to see a much deeper story/dialogue system. Id also like to see the grief after killing lyon really hit you as tge player.
For real, this needs to happen, but with FE Warriors... pretty much copying the plotline.... it may never happen. Warriors mocks FE Sacred Stones.
Lyon is the best Fire Emblem villain and he’s not even the actual villain
#LyonDidNothingWrong
#BlameTakumi
Maage He is though. Formortiis isn’t even a character, let alone a villain.
Agreed, I love him so
@@jonahj9519 I just like Fomortiis sprite lol, and the fact it's not ANOTHER DRAGON...
How bout the Good Ending where we get an FE8 remake where Ephraim and Eirika’s routes are treated equally in terms of plot
THIS
Perhaps Eirika's story would be about Redemption while Ephiriam would be about Justice
@@ZerkMonsterHunter The most pathetic thing is that Eirika's barely even relevant to her own side plot. Once Innes comes in, you could kick her out of the story entirely with minimal changes to what happens, because Innes is the one doing all the intellectual heavy lifting.
@@SuperZez which makes it even more sad because her story has one of the greatest sub plots SS has - Joshua's. It's short but holy hell did I not see that coming. I fully expected Eirika to be way more involved considering, you know, she similarly lost parents just recently. Nope. Says a couple "I'm sorry"ies and calls it a day.
I love Lyon because of how human and real he is to me. I could understand being envious of the perfect friend, and then devaluing yourself. I could understand being lustful for a girl whose your friend, and then feeling unworthy or ashamed of yourself. I've never experienced all this to his tragic extreme, but I love how he personifies my darkness.
Lyon never realised what his inner strength was. He sought to compensate in areas he never excelled at, when he could have focused on what he was good at : being a great scholar and a compassionate person. Those traits are extremely valuable in a leader. But because he compared himself to Ephraim, and fell prey to jealousy, he failed to see that he didn't need to be like him to be his own person and leader to Grado.
Every guy ever has gone through this it’s not your “darkness” lmao
He's not lustful for Eirika, he loves her. Lust and love aren't the same. Obsession and love also aren't the same.
Lyon deeply loved both Eirika and Ephraim, it's seen through the whole game with not only how he treats them but also how it affects his life and decisions. Just like he deeply loved his country.
Lyon is full of love for so many things, but he doesn't feel strong enough as a person to take care of them nor feels like he "deserves" their love, which is what dooms him.
Saying he simply lusted after her was so incorrect and disrespectful to the character.
And talking about "your darkness" as if you're the only person to ever go through devaluing yourself when comparing yourself to someone better or because you lust after someone is ridiculous. That's not darkness nor something personal to only you. That's literally what humanity is about. Since the dawn of time.
But I'm just gonna assume you were like 14 when you wrote that which is why you had such a "dooming" atmosphere lol
I remember being pretty young playing SS, I rushed through the game caring little for story, but every time Lyon popped up I found myself not being able to advert my eyes and glance over it, while it was probably his theme mesmerizing me, I stopped glancing over game stories once I fully realized that I could find gold such as Lyon.
His theme is actually one of my favorite pieces of gaming music, there are 4 arrangements of it throughout sacred stones and I'd love to hear a remastered medley of them.
There's a username here on TH-cam named OrangaStang (or something like that) and they made a remasterization of the whole Sacred Stones soundtrack. You should definitely check it out :D
YES, IT'S SO FUCKING GOOD
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 Time to listen to it as a lullaby xD
Naglfar refine plz IS. Especially since Lyon won the VG
I hope Naglfar refine would grant his weapon an effectivity against red units too. Then the eff would be granting +4 atk/def when nearby to infantry sword or lance ally.
We need a defense buff on a refinement.
8 months since this comment and still no refine, this is an issue to say the least
@@dershall3678 literally year and still no refine whatsoever
Still waiting 😔
Here's my headcannon, (strongly based on what you showed):
Lyon tried to do a ritual to ressurect his dead father, he felt he wasn't ready to be king as he suffered from a inferiority complex which is understandable because his only other real friends were Ephraim and Erikia. Lyon always thought that Ephraim's headstrong attitude and extrovert demeanour fits the idea of a prince much better then himself. He strived to be like him but realized that both physically and mentally, he couldn't do it. So in his despiration he saught powers from the dark arts to save his father and as a result, his country; but ultimately he wanted to save himself from being thrust into a position he wasn't ready for. When the demon came to take him over, at the time he didn't resist. His fathers death and the ever looming threat of being crowned king brought much stress to the poor prince. He has been alone with his insecurities for far too long and he simply didn't want to think anymore...
...When he was struck down by Ephraim later in the game, he would utter the words "Where... Where did I go wrong?" He is asking himself when those feelings of insecurities that led him down his path, arised. When he thinks of a prince he thinks of traits like perseverance despite the odds and not secondguessing yourself.
These are traits that Ephraim has that he lacked and almost as a direct result his insecurities made him believe that he would never be the king his land truely needed. He believed he would not match up to Ephraim. Lyon believed he would never match up to any of his predecessors and perhaps after realizing the evil deeds he has done, perhaps now he wish he would have never had been born at all.
"The weight of the crown....is immense"
- Lyon
That was a great piece
This is how you make a proper possesed antagonist, take note everyone
it really is though, like it specifically happened to me after doctor strange 2 and thor 4 just how good lyon is as a possessed villain, and honestly he might straight up be THE best version of this trope as I can think of very few others that do anything near as good with the concept as lyon
I excpectd the game to have us go to Grado and pick up Lyon as a dark mage, and i was shocked when Lyons nature was revealed. I was saddened by the fact that i would have to kill Lyon
indeed, Like I said, father and son is ridiculously dense
I like your profile pic. Ares is my main hero
I think Sacred Stones has the best story of any Fire Emblem, and Lyon only confirms my decision.
Also, I loooooove the interpretation of Lyon on Fire Emblem Heroes, the sentences and the voice actor fit him sooo much.
agreed on all accounts
Sacred Stones remains my favorite because of the story and because of Ross being the best character in existence.
Yes, SS is also my favorite game, I love all its characters and some of them are the most interesting on the entire franchise: Lute, Cormag, Lyon, ect. Even the lords (I dont understand the Eirika hate at all) are two of my favorites.
I think is a very underrated game.
NEWS
We have a new alt of Lyon in FEH, and his supports in FORGING BONDS are amazing.
"You believe you are my future, in reality it is the other way around"
And that is why Lyon is my No.1 favorite FE antagonist.
same.
Same
Blueblade13 Mine as well. Arvis is a close second since he's also as manipulative, yet every bit as tragic as Lyon when you realize the entirety of his tragedy. I hate Heroes for making them nearly identical in stats, though >.< I want to use them both!
Arvis is perfectly viable though thanks to Valflame and his skillset. Lyon got absolutely shafted though.
Blueblade13 Indeed. He could really use a refinement and a rework on stats to stop him from being essentially a cheap Arvis. And tbh, if his stats were going to be as mediocre as they are now, I would've preferred for him to be in the summoning pool, because then you could at least fix him beyond +3.
I was waiting for this. You timed it well with Lyon's surprise underdog victory in FEH (Shanna who?).
It made me so happy that he won.
Grade-AMasterpiece if only I had played Sacred Stones before I did VG... of course it was only afterwards. I would have picked him in a heartbeat
Lol Lyon is my favorite character and my name is Shana, lol.
69 likes
Nice
I’m quite happy Lyon won the recent Voting Gauntlet in FEH. In FEH you get the sense he knows what had once transpired, and that he shouldn’t have had a second chance to help others or reunite with Eirika and Ephraim after what he was going to do under the demon king’s influence.
especially from his text quotes on the home screen.
Same here. To be honest didn't think he would win but I still chose him. He's probably my favorite character ever, if not, one of my favorites. I kid you not, when I saw that victory screen with mai boi I felt this rush of warm happiness wash over me and I may still be smiling over it
An interesting interpretation I've heard is that Lyon on Ephraim's route is lying that he has more control than he does to intimidate his rival and in Eirika's, lies that he has less control to either get pity points or make himself look less villainous in his beloved's eyes.
Lyon will always be one of my favorite fire emblem characters
same here
I love how his normal quotes in heroes sound realy soft and weak and...you know Lyonish, but his special quotes sound powerful ,dark and evil. It's like he changes personality mid battle wich to be hones he kind of does.
Rip me, never had that revelation.
#iamthedemonking
Dang u right
X2 in my case because i don't understand the fluent english haha
"Lyon basically casts Hold Person and Ephraim fails his save."
Eyyy I see that D&D reference!
Welp, guess I'll be replaying Sacred Stones again. I really do need to experience Eirika's story. In my, 3 times I think, of playing I've always chosen Ephraim, and while I thought Lyon was a good villain, I didn't quite think he was the best. But with your video, I now kinda have to reconsider. He has so many layers (I want to make a Shrek joke here, but I'm restraining myself), that I never considered. While I have more nostalgia for Black Knight, and I think Arvis makes for a cooler fight, Lyon might just the best story of them all.
So in other words, Lyon is an onion. He's purple, has layers, and is easily sliced with a knife.
Well, I'm happy I could make you rethink Lyon. as I said in the video, Eirika's path does come with the issue of goofing Lyon's character, but there's still a lot of good within it.
I'll always hold Black Knight as my top. Though Lyon is definitely good. Black Knight just has so many intricacies and his sorrow brought emotions into me.
Lyon is julius done right
Julius suffers from every problem Eirika's path Lyon does without the flash backs and better pacing.
Shadow Sceptile Gaming being better than Julius isn't saying much
Julius is just really generic for a FE villain. Posseessed by ancient evil dragon, callous, but charismatic. It does not help that Genealogy gives him no backstory or depths.
Fortnite is CANCER While I can see a certain point in saying that Julius has a backstory, said "backstory" has far more to do with his relationship to Julia, Seliph, Deidre, Sigurd, and Arvis than it does with Julius himself.
I hope if Geneology has a remake, Julius is more fleshed out as a character especially with his relationship with Ishtar similar to Berkut and Rinea
Man, sacred stones is great. Like, it has something for everybody. A great story, great characters, great gameplay, and a great villain. And that’s something I can really appreciate.
There is a reason it is my favorite, even if it is on the easy side.
If ny FE could benefit from a lunatic/mirror mode it's SS
A lot of people say that SS was terrible, too easy, cliche plot, and characters were poorly written. But I found no such thing in any of these, permanent character deaths needs to come back with no option so that people take the game more seriously.
Sacred Stones was very easy, but I liked the gameplay because I could choose to max out everyone at Tower of Valni, make a team of sages and paladins or whatever i wanted because of branching promotions, and I could abuse summoners. Also Ross. The only Fire Emblem game I enjoyed equally was Radiant Dawn because the game has so much content it's ridiculous.
@@BlackDragon41sbm The funny thing is, I remember Sacred Stones characters the most out of all of the characters from Fire Emblem games that I've played. Ike is my favorite Lord/Hero, but when it comes to side characters Sacred Stones takes the cake.
Oh look the guy that kill Ike and Hardin in the VG
yep, he's also an amazing character.
Did you know that the don't have the last word in VGs, but the last hour's multiplier, which usually benefits the current losers. So VGs are usually nothing but lies.
he was true heroe he saved arhcanea.
@@GaeaRage0798 You know whether we like it or not that sometimes the multiplier can be pretty useful to certain circumstances like these (PS: I don't not want a Tellie character such as Ike to win)
Absolutely phenomenal video. You can tell how much effort went into this 25 minute analysis of a video game character, and you portrayed perfectly what Lyon means to you, your personal connection to him, and how his character arc makes Lyon a very tragic character. Those 25 minutes passed by instantly, but no amount of what you said and discussed in that time was boring or uninteresting. The video wasn't overly long, and you absolutely made the most of out every second. This gave me a new perspective on Lyon and made me appreciate him more than I ever would have been able to; your thoughts, opinions, and perspective on Lyon was flawlessly conveyed.
Looking forward to what you'll bring next, Zerk. Great video.
Thank you so much! that really means a lot to me, you have no idea.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 Yeah I really love your comprehensive analysis, can't wait for the next one.
This may be quite late, but your passion for a game I love made me bother to leave my own opinions on this subject, in which I mostly agree with you.
I only disagree in that Eirika's path is bad characterization of Lyon. In fact, I think it is exactly how Lyon would act if he was facing Eirika as the leader of the army. Why use straightforward and honest truth when he knows she's incredibly naive? It would be far more useful to manipulate those feelings he knows she has for him and play the victim to the end. I feel that Ephraim's path is intended to be the second one you play, as it would reveal that Lyon is scheming and vile of his own accord. I took those revelations to be telling that all of his Eirika path dialogue is an act, as he loved her, and wanted to be loved by her. What better way to do so than play the damsel in distress, even when he knew his death at her hands was inevitable?
Aside from that, wonderful video. Sacred Stones will always be my favorite FE and one of my favorite games ever because of these characters, and I'm glad there are others who are just as passionate. Thank you.
Good Lord. I thought Lyon was complex but damn.
I could've honestly made this video over 45 minutes long If I went full pretentious and analyzed some scenes line for line
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 There could’ve been more?! Wow. Oh, I’d want to see that.
45 minutes would be a bitch to edit though.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 Understandable.
Make a part 2 so you have a "45 minutes video" :v
I feel like your relationship with Lyon is quite similar to my relationship with Sokka from avatar the last air bender
This is so well made! I played Ephraim's route right after Eirika, so I might have skipped some story scenes because I thought it was the same (and bc I was a dumb kid). Lyon isn't a villian who is controlled by a demon king, he IS the one controlling others. He is the Demon King. The special quotes part that you showed gave me absolute chills, especially the response to Ephraim.
You did a great job Zerk! You were perfectly able to show just who Lyon is. Keep up the great work! 😁👍
Also thanks to you I shall finally build Lyon in heroes haha.
if you are building Lyon in heroes, I sneaked mine into the quotes section if you want to steal it.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 haha thanks! But I made my own build anyway.
Naglfar
Rally Spd/Res
Vengeance
Close Counter
Swordbreaker 3 (for now)
Drive Res 2
QR3 Seal
Fire Blessing
I'm having too much fun deploying him haha.
go with Iceberg instead of vengeance, much more consistent
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 I will when I get an iceberg fodder haha
I knew i made the right choice in the voting gauntlet
I never really played classic fire emblem ,but guess who i sided with in the past Gauntlet? Lyon.
All it took was one quote.
“ Nobody but YOU know what you’ve been through “
please play sacred stones, you owe it to yourself; it's an amazing game.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 I would if I had a GBA or WiiU to play it on but unfortunately I don’t. :/
well, then... resort to... less than savoury methods.
Gloomy nerd boy is best boy. He deserved better. Looking up to your best friend, wanting to be just like him. Falling for a girl who is kind to you no matter how low you think of yourself. The crippling fear of being unable to measure up to your father's name and legacy. I know these feelings well. I feel like a lot of us can relate to Lyon in at least one of these aspects, and that's why he's my favourite villain in my favourite FE game. Awesome video, dude. Keep up the great work, and believe in yourself.
thank you, glad you enjoyed!
The divergence of the story when you choose your paths serves to contextualize Lyon's actions in different ways. To begin, Lyon is very blatantly based on the tale of Icarus, a man who flew too close to the sun. This is interesting, because Ephraim and Eirika hold the Solar and Lunar Braces, which are based on the sun and the moon, which is the sun's shadow. If you choose Eirika's path, and by extension the Lunar Brace, we see that all of Lyon's actions were a farce. He lost to the Demon King before he could even try to save Grado. He chased the moon and became lost in the cosmos. Without the sun to either guide or kill him, he could never come back down to Earth again. That's why he is a mere puppet, at least thematically.
If you choose Ephraim's path, and by extension the Solar Brace, Lyon gets the chance to fly too close to the sun. His hubris tricks him into believing that he can be like his metaphorical sun, Ephraim, and beat the Demon King on his own. We see through the story that this is not what happens, and Lyon flying to close to the sun is what brought him (and by law his kingdom) crashing down. While he was able to somewhat control the Demon King, he was so caught up in the fantasy of matching the sun's brilliance to realize that there was no point in even flying to the sun. The only thing that would happen is that he would get burned.
Also, the real villain of Sacred Stones is fucking Vigarde for shooting down Lyon's idea of asking Ephraim and Eirika for help with Grado's whole future earthquake thing.
I legit under estimated sacred stones character arcs. "i've always loved you, i've always hated you" how can such a SIMPLE line describe how jealousy twists someone into something vicious and hollow?
It's one of the most brilliant pieces of dialogue in all the Fire Emblem, that whole scene is just phenomenal
As I've told friends, Lyon is the Camus archetype on steroids. I enjoy Eirika's route with Lyon because it makes me feel like "if I'd just been faster, I could have helped him" but there wasn't a way to fix this. I kept rooting for Lyon to break free of control totally, but since it didn't happen, I was sad but had righteous fury to stop the Demon King (although I think ANYONE who's played Eirika's route will say that her giving Lyon the stone was a seriously dumb move) and it felt good to take the demon down and set Lyon free. Ephiram's route was always good because to me, it felt like these routes were happening at the same time, save a few script changes. Imagine this: if Lyon was faking all along, why would he tell Eirika that? He loved her, to the point that the demon king made special mention of that fact in a boss quote. To me, even if Lyon was faking it in both, him using Eirika's naivety and dangling the carrot of rescue makes sense, because he knows she'll succeed where he's failed. To me, he's still the most sob-story of the FE villains but that's a good thing because let's face it, we all can't be insane as Nergal or blinded by rage as Sephiram or just as ass as Shagall or daddy issues like Zephiel. Lyon was a fundamentally broken character, so for his ending to be a sad one just makes it better. After all, the question of "what if" comes up about Lyon and it makes things far more interesting. Lyon would have gotten redemption from Ephiram and Eirika almost immediately because we know where he comes from. Can you really say that if any other main villain in the entirety of FE had survived (aside from Sephiram/Lehran) their final encounter that they'd be as quick to redeem as Lyon would be? He did what he did from a place of fear and lack of confidence, and with Eirika and Ephiram to help him he'd be a great king and prevent the damage that the earthquake he saw in his vision would bring. He was a good person who, thanks to the demon king, lost sight of himself and the right path. He's still one of my top 3 villains because of both Ephiram AND Eirika's paths (even if parts of Eirika's were handled with the care of an angry bull in a china shop)
Eirika's path never ceases to find ways to upset me.
In regards to what ifs on whether Lyon would have been a great king, I beleive he still would've lived too much in his father's shadow, I also think he'd probably never have a chance with Eirika either. unfortunately, just given his character I feel, should he have succeeded grado proper, he'd be a very reclusive king.
Calm thyself friend...all is well...stop this...(on a serious note I enjoyed the difference between Lyon's character on each routes)
This was a nice video. Good thing you've been hyping this up for a while. I was never really crazy about Lyon but he was quite a tragic character which was among the most memorable parts of Sacred Stone's story
Although I'm a bit confused about Lyon himself actually being responsible for the conflict in the story. I've only played Ephraim's route once which was a bit of a long time ago so a lot of what I remember is a little foggy. But I thought he was fully possessed in both routes. It doesn't really add up that innocent nerdy Lyon is the same as possessed Lyon. I've always assumed that the Demon King was just more cunning and manipulative on Ephraim's route.
glad you enjoyed! and yeah, I played through SS back in april to prepare for this and I can confirm Lyon IS in control of his actions, his emotional state is being manipulated by the demon king, think of it like: "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink"
Godamn...man...i...i'm at a lost for words...but i'm glad to know this video is out, you're doing okay and well analyzed. Just remember do stuff that makes you happy, don't focus on views,and most importantly you have support from your friends and fans.
I hope you enjoyed the video, I should be back to my chipper self now that I don't have to worry about it.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 I always do
Honestly, if his father's penultimate dying words weren't basically "LOL! You're going to burden other kingdoms because of our natural emergency? You dumbass!", Lyon probably wouldn't have done all this stupidness and would've just explained to other kingdoms.
Its so damn annoying people hate on sacred stones because its easy, or isnt designed as well as the others, that they over look its greatest strength, how it handles characters, its in my opinion the best one in the series with characters, followed after by blazing sword. Lyon was my first villain in media i grew to respect yet fear as a character, and even hurt for him, and very few stand close to him even after all these years
I think the timing of this is spot on since Lyon won the voting gauntlet, did you plan for this? Also I felt that you might have explained Lyon somewhere along the road. Anyways, nicely done Zerk. I always like the reason why people has a personal bias of a character they like and yours is no exception of Lyon. Though I prefer Eirika's path better because of Joshua and Cormag the way of how Lyon is portrayed in Ephraim's path is a lot better as you have stated. Don't know if you want to change your pic to Lyon now but I think that it could be good. Anyways great video Zerk.
Btw who did you ally support Lyon with? I supported him with regular Eirika.
Glad you liked the video, and like I said, there certainly is merit to eirika's path, just not for Lyon.
I haven't decided who to ally support mine with, you can see mine in the video, all he has is earth blessing. perhaps if they ever add Selena or Knoll to heroes...
I'm playing through Sacred Stones again (because why not?). I loved Lyon's arc.
Its so good.
The ending gave me chills. It's obvious how much care you put in to this video.
why thank you!
Lyon’s win in the voting gauntlet was so deserving. I’m so happy I built up my Lyon in Heroes
Such an odd way to end off the video. The whole mentioning about Lyon being somewhat similar to you. It’s quite intriguing.
for analysis yes, but It's really hard for me to talk about him without getting into my own bias.
That was spectacular. Definitely goes to show how Lyon isn't just one of the best Fire Emblem villains, but one of the best Nintendo villains as a whole.
Indeed he is.
I can whistle lyon's theme without fainting...
I dont know if i should be proud of that
be very proud of that.
I always thought lyon was underrated myself, hes one of the most realistically written characters in the game (despite being possessed by a demon) and yet nothing goes well for him even his death only benefitted the demon king. sacred stones is like the Batman of the franchise in that it has the best villains
SilverBladeHero 15 I'd say it's like batman more in the sense that the villains are more interesting than the main character
To be fair. I completely agree with your synopsis of Lyon. He's the greatest Antagonist in my eyes, with Arvis following second and Grima third (with the added story of Echoes and the realization that he slaughtered all the earth dragons alone). So I have to say that I loved the vid!
glad you liked it!
so you still prefer Lyon over Arvis/Alvis? Damn, mad respect for you. Thanks for making this video
Robin - The - Joker I didn't mention it but there are some interesting parallels between Lyon and Arvis.
if it's any consolation; arvis is my second favorite villain
Amazing analysis, wow 👌🏻 It’s cool to hear about how certain characters hit emotional chords for different people :) I was a bit bored by Lyon in SS, although I can appreciate how well he was written. Just wasn’t my cup of tea. Especially on Eirika’s route, as I’m really not a fan of crush-on-girl-turns-into-jealousy-feel-bad-for-me plotlines. Ephraim’s route tho I 100% agree with you, Lyon was MUCH better written, although still not my taste in villains. I definitely understand how he could be a great character to relate to. Congrats on completing the video 🤘🏻🤘🏻
thank you! and yeah, I realize his archetype isn't for everyone, but he's just so different from every other FE villain I can't help but be intoxicated with how well he's written.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 For sure! Lyon on Ephraim’s route in particular was much better as you said. But I really didnt like his whole crush on Eirika arc in her path, and cuz of that I’ve had mixed feelings on him as a character. But anyways, amazing analysis! Enjoyed it 👌🏻
Out of all FE games, Lyon is my favorite character because of his character and past. I love him. 😭 He's my favorite video game character ever too!
It has been quite a while since I played Sacred Stones but I really enjoyed your take, the game pulls Lyons Story off really well. First you think he is possessed by a demon only to find out he isn’t only to wonder in the end on how much it really affected him. Atleast my interpretation always was that while he was in control, it wasn’t nearly as much as he himself likes to think. I like to think that the demons corruption worked more akin to removing his inhibitions, turning his love to Erika into lust, his jealousy for Ephraim into hate - in many ways killing the caring heart, his shy personality, which in another path could have turned into humility and temperance, making him a great ruler in his own way. But he instead tried to rule by magical strength and demonic power - I think this is what his words really mean. Yes, Fomortiis is a demon. But Lyon became the Demon(ic) King.
Tell me, Ephraim: do I look like I’ve grown stronger? The last time we dueled, I was too weak to test you. Why, I was so weak, I even lost to Eirika…
……
I’ve sacrificed the lives of many good people. I’ve committed many unforgivable sins. The caring heart I once possessed died long ago… And I’ve grown stronger because of it. I’ve grown strong enough to defeat even you, Ephraim.
…No, you haven’t. You’re still no match for me. You were never one for combat. It’s not in you. You should never have chosen this path.
……
…… Here I come, Lyon.
(Thanks, Serenes Forest! I... wish I had it memorized, but I don’t)
Sacred stones was one of my first fe games and still my favorite fe game after playing almost every single one. Lyon holds such a special place to me
Im late to the party but I liked how Fire Emblem Heroes development some Lyon character by his normal self talk to his possesed version. I thought it was really cool and well executed.
I have a video up on the channel exploring Fomortiis as well as that heroes conversation, take a look if You're interested!
I just wanted to say that everything you say in this video... I talk about it every day. I am probably one of the biggest fans of the sacred stones. I've never played it due to my terrible skill in video games-- I can't even win easy, casual mode in later games-- But I've read the script over and over and over again and almost every single character has carved its own personal space in my heart. Lyon first and foremost.
I've annoyed my friends over and over again with half-hour long rants about why he is the best fire emblem villain by far because he isn't the villain at all-- He's your friend, and he's *always loved you*, even if he's always hated you, too.
This video is like listening to my own inner thoughts-- And I'm thankful that it is. Fire Emblem 8 is relatively unloved compared to the more recent stories. We can't get any alts other than Ephraim and Eirika, and no one knows any of the characters other than those two.
I've been upset due to CYL 3 with no FE8 characters other than Eirika since it was my goal to vote for one every single day to show my adoration for my absolute favorite piece of media. To cure this, I've been looking for likeminded individuals-- People that love the game as much as I do. This video made me feel so much happier and better because it was everything I already knew but needed to hear.
Thank you for this video. It was exactly what I needed to see.
glad you enjoyed it. I'm very proud of this video and it's awesome to hear.
I'm hoping for a Fallen Lyon character in FEH really.
I really need Fallen Heroes 2 with Lyon and Berkut!
Berkut needs Kriemhild, and Lyon needs a weapon that doesn't suck!
Give my soft boi a refine
A Fallen Heroes 2 would be neat to see. Berkut, Loptous!Julia, a version of Ike driven berserk by Lehran's medallion...
I think a Redeemed Villains banner would be just as cool though. They could use FE3/12 Michalis, gen 2 Arvis, Gangrel, and maybe Fernand.
I think that another reason that Eirikas story portrays Lyon as a puppet is because Lyon wanted Eirika to think that. He loved her. With the Demon King, he still did, perhaps even more so. He wanted to still have a chance with Eirika, he couldn't stand her hating him. So he lied. All he wanted was to be with Eirika, and to be like Ephraim. He was consumed by his despair.
Your video almost makes me feel wrong to mod the sacred stones to where Lyon isn't the villian. But I think how he was in Sacred Stones really shaped me to WANT to make him a good guy. It's like another of my favorite video game characters; Knight Artorias. He was consumed by the Abyss, but in his cut dialogue and his intro, you see he's still there. Barely. He begs for redemption that cannot come. All he wanted was to save everyone. You feel wrong to kill him, but you have to. That is the hallmark of a truly great villain. You WANT them to be redeemed. You BEG for their rise back to grace. And it makes it all the more heartbreaking when they don't.
I hear a lot of "oh he's faking it in Eirika's campaign" I want to believe it I really do, but I feel it steps a bit too far into speculative territory. Lyon exemplifies the "non-villain" antagonist, a really cool thing I wish was more constant in writing
@@ZerkMonsterHunter It definitely is speculation, I was just theorising based on what we know about Lyon. He's Easily top two favorite Fire Emblem characters for me and I love the guy to death. But that's just my two cents.
3:12 Great screenshot out of context to explain Ephraim's love for Lyon.
Naglfar refine for best villain when IS.... Also when they make a Sacred Stones remake (someday), they had better get Mark Whitten to reprise his role as Lyon since he did such an amazing job in heroes.
On top of that, I would love a Lyon alt where he transforms into the Demon King (with ravager as his weapon), but you get hints that he is faking his possession for his 5 star quotes and a huge hint for his level 40 5 star quote.
fallen Lyon as a dragon(?) unit with the demon king transformation would be super dope.
@@ZerkMonsterHunter Still no refine for the best prince, but he got an alt as a Duo Hero tag teaming with Ephraim. Fingers crossed that he gets a refine soon (So my +10+110 Lyon can be finally complete).
@@ZerkMonsterHunter The Demon King has arrived in Heroes!
In regard to Lyon being able to temporarily break from the demon kings soul in Eirika's route, I feel like this was only due to Lyon's feelings of love for Eirika, which temporarily took the demon king off guard and broke his hold for a moment (hence him saying it was a mistake to disregard the power of human emotion) Once the DK realized Lyon had these strong emotions he was able to manipulate and abuse them to get not only more of what he wanted out of Lyon, but even make him more powerful. Its implied that Lyon has always had feelings of contempt and frustration with Ephram, from the way Emphram viewed amd treated their friendship, to the way Eirika never gave Lyon the attention he desired because of Ephram always getting in the way. On top of this Lyon has great pride in knowing that the firdt emperor of Grado was the great hero of old, but noe Grado despite having the best military had become one of the most disregarded nations despite their legacy, with Renais being the most loved and heralded nation, again, due in no small part to Ephram. The DK didnt really force Lyon to do things he didnt want to, but rather brought out all of his inner darkness evil and base desires to the surface, all the things Lyon had worked hard to deny and repress within himself. He delved too deep into dark magic to revive his father, he destroyed Renais out of jealousy of it outshining Grado, he hounded Ephram and killed their father to spite the man he viewed as his superior, and when the possibility that Lyon could break free from the DK's influence because of Eirika arose, the DK then not only preyed upon Lyon's love for Eirika, but also baited Lyon with his own carnal desires for her as well that, again, he had hid and repressed from himself for so long. If anything, the fact that Lyon had that one chance to break free, but failed because he couldnt come to terms with his own negative and selfish tendencies, and subsequently lost any hope for being saved because of it only makes him even more tragic.
I know we probably are really far away from a Sacred Stones Remake, but after hearing Mark Whitten’s performance I really cannot wait for him to break my heart by adding “extraemotionalpunch” to Lyon in game
I'm really happy the text scroll for the "where did I go wrong" moment matches so well. I want Whitten and Chun to banter off each other as Ephraim and Lyon so badly you don't understand.
ZerkMonsterHunter 4 It’s a dream so real you can almost taste it, but so far away in the horizon that the wait is a nightmare
this, this is my eternal pain
You know
The first time I played sacred stones I went Ephraim route for some reason
It let me see more of the darker side of the story in all senses
While eirika goes through the mountains with light and hope in her heart, Ephraim sees the decay of grado in all senses
While the bosses like Pablo were cartoony to a fault,you could feel the sorrow in Selena's eyes after receiving her last order as a moonstone
You see how for once is not the invaders who destroyed the evil land
Then you reach castle grado
Vigarde was dead all along all that
Maybe I didn't really notice at that time but it's surprisingly all so fluid
Nothing feels like an asspull when thinking from the game world's logic and possibilities
Now when reading the interactions between Ephraim and Lyon
Just wow
Eirika's route just feels like a red hairing now
A sheet to cover the depth of the game
glad you liked it, happy I'm not alone in my thoughts of Ephraim's route being that much better.
Fire emblem : sacred stones is my favorite game but super underrated! Thank you for making a video on Lyon the best character that's been hyped up all through out that game!
with all due respect, for me, Erika's route is the Canon one to me, for the very reasons you dislike it, the fact taht leon's actions were never his own, and that the fight against the Demon King much more justfied, and i HATE ephirim's route for the same reasons you Like it.
so, here's my take, Both paths happen congruently, so the stuff about valter killing glen and caelaach killing Joshua's mother all still happens, it's just that ephraim's path does Lyon so much better, neither path is "canon" per say.
joaocisne556 completely agree I also like Eirika's path much more and thought it was more interesting, tragic, and well written. but besides that (and the mispronounciation of Lyon's name), the essay is well done and some recognition of Lyon's character is super refreshing!
I didn't mispronounce it, they pronounce it as "leon" in heores, though it is inconsistent, sometimes it's "leone"
@@ZerkMonsterHunter actually in heroes the two Eirikas say Lyon differently. I thought it was funny when I first heard it. You should go check it out. Its actually hilarious hearing the same voice actor read Lyon completely different.
I also prefer Eirikas route. Ephraim’s route Lyon is an edgy crybaby with an inferiority complex, while Lyon in Eirika’s route is a tragic saint.
The opening narration was very VERY promising in this video. I haven't watched the rest. I'm sure you won't shit on eirika or anything like most others d--
Edit 1 - ok, I'm sensing a similar vibe to another youtuber I watch with the way you describe lyon's actions or the game's showing of his character. I'm not going to say who, but you both make me want to do anything you say.
Edit 2 - Is it "Lee-on", "Lie-uhn", or "Lee-own"? I'm so confused, and I've always said "Lee-on"
Edit 3: Ok, now I understand what you're getting at with Eirika's route being bad. Honestly, I never got this impression. I just was able to understand what kind of situation Eirika and the others are in, and what evil there actually is. Now, I cant pick up small story details in plots, so Eirika's route using Lyon as a possessed puppet was easier for me to understand than what.... Ephraim's Lyon was... trying to throw at me. Oh, and the "sob story" is exactly what we learn in ephraim's route, so I don't see why this specific thing is a problem, aside from Lyon and his father.
Edit 4: Ok. What the actual F^CK is the dialogue at 17:51 to 19:12? Seriously. When I first played Ephraim's route, I was SO F^cking confused at what this was, at what he was saying, that I had no clue what to make of it. Was he jealous? Was the demon king in control or not? Was Lyon in control or not? It seemed as if everything he said was to contradict his previous statements and confuse the living hell out of the player (me). I kinda get it now, what he's doing and what he went through as a character, but if its nothing to the dreams of the human heart, then why did he go and do this stuff anyway? Its just SO CONFUSING and I never understood any of it. To this day, I still find it confusing, and it adds upon my hatred for chapter 18. I'm sorry, Zerk. I suppose I'm just not one of the smart people who understand this deep crap.
Heroes is vague with the pronunciation, sword infantry Eirika says "Lee-on" but Mage Eirika and Legendary Ephraim say "Lee-own" and I've always pronounced it "Lion" so, yeah sorry about that.
also, glad you liked the opening, not sure how well that was going to be received.
Another thing i found after watching this video is that when lyon said the he seen two paths with the dark stone one where he was consumed by the demon king and other where he controls it. Is parallel with the two paths with the twins. I really love this game and the story got to be pne of the best
Well I haven't played Eirikas path yet but Ephraim's was so good I don't even think I need to, but I will. And because of my playing of his path Lyon is probably my favorite FE villain to date and Ephraim is easily one of my favorite lords. (P. S. Lyon's evil portrait is so well done. It really captures just how evil and twisted he's become in such a short time)
If you are playing Eirika's path, there's not much reason to play past chapter 16. I usually reccomend to first time sacred stones players to copy their save before the route split, play both until beating chapter 15 and then finishing the game with Ephraim.
Zerk, this was amazing! Just like you, Lyon is my favorite video game character of all time. While his impact on me wasn't as personal as yours, his tragic arc felt so real and so fleshed out to me. And you did an excellent job at portraying that! Props to you!
glad you liked it, thank you!
congrats to lyon for winning the voting gaunlet by the way
yep.
I love lyon and I can't describe how I felt when I discovered in Heroes that it's pronounced leon and not lion. But okay. Great video.
And fucking great Monika/Lyn avatar.
i haven't even played Sacred Stones before and im already just. totally in love with Lyon's character. i thought he was neat in Heroes, but Damn. knowing all of this now, and hearing that one line, ("Where did I go wrong...?"), im actually really upset. i came here for cute mages and dragons, not to feel ruined over someone who can't be saved
Lee Rose I do reccomend you give sacred stones a shot if you can track it down or have a Wii U.
glad you liked the video!
So... Lyon ended up becoming evil because he hated Ephraim and was obssesed with Eirika; both unconsciously...
This means... Lyon was a victim of suggestive brainwashing from Fomortiis to make him liberate his more negative feelings about their beloved ones... and making the whole path of destruction easier without having to do it in his own until the very end.
yes, there's certainly argument to be made that Lyon's fall from grace would've happened regardless of whether or not he was possessed.
You KNOW they made a truly badass villian when you curse your own main unit for being a badass an you give the boss a handicap.
While I haven’t played SS myself, I’ve grown to really like Lyon from Heroes mostly from two quotes he says while standing around the castle. One where he mentions how he tripped yet it doesn’t bother him and that being alive is wonderful and another where he tells the Summoner that it’s ok to cry because no one knows what they’re going through. At the moment I’m typing this, I don’t feel the greatest but reading those lines made me feel just a tad better.
please go play it, you owe it to yourself.
I recently played FE8 in around november. I played Ephraim's route and I got to the end, I cried so much, for the first time in a game since 2013. Lyon is such a relatable character from my perspective, I was going through a lot but FE8 made me feel good about myself. I loved Lyon as a character, tragic yet kind, like me.
I just think Lyon is my favorite character in all of fire emblem, yes he may be cliched but he's tragic and I feel his pain in some ways. And when I watched this video, it made me feel like crying again, I just love the way you described all the stuff that went down with Lyon as a character. This is an amazing video!
Thank you, glad you enjoyed the video!
3:18 "It's so thick." 😏
Darth Enigma “Like Lyn’s thighs” - possibly Zerk
No matter what happens I will always enjoy your content and it's always a blessing to see such in depth analysis like these posted. It's not often we get to see analysis like these posted and with full commentary. It makes it easier to put in the background and listen to and not to mention they are a little bit more accessible and out there. Keep up with this content and I look forward to seeing more!
thank you! glad you liked it.
Wow, this gives me a reason to replay Sacred Stones again.
I love the way that this video is conveyed, the effort and emotion is really felt, this really just reinforces why Lyon is best boy. This is a entertaining and intriguing video as always king.
Also my heart right now, they don't think it be like that sometimes, but it really do man...
glad you liked it.
I know I'm late to this video, but I recently got into Fire Emblem and I played Sacred Stones because I knew Erikia from heroes. I'm a little confused on Lyon. So he was the host for the Demon King, but everything he did was his own actions. So why didn't he try to stop everything that happened. Did he want Ephraim to kill him? Did the Demon King corrupt his emotions and that's how it was of Lyons will? Sorry but I'm new to this franchise so I'm a bit confused
The Demon King warped his emotions into just making him want to do things. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink, but if you convince it it's thirsty maybe it just might
Tbh I still feel that its a 50/50 since the daemon king did use lyon as stated and the fact the 2 paths sorta conflict with eachother a tad (easy to just label is as eirika's naive perspective tho.)
Id argue lyon was controlled like the cordetex fungus but not enough to try and essentially kill ephrims caring kindness for lyon so he can for sure kill him in the final battle.
Something I got in how he speaks not just during the volcano level but also during the final battle, he still sees lyon as a friend enough to essentially still speak as some sort of puppet that knows its being puppeteered in mind but can still voice his wish for death.
Ironically like a person enslaved to fate, he knows it will come and yet laments it...like konrad curze.
I think this gets away from what this video is arguing, it's not about which is the correct path or the "Canon" one about which one is better written.
I actually like both routes. In Erika route I don't think he could face her having made the decisions he did. He loves her and would rather her believe him a victim than a villain.
While I love that interpretation, it is ultimately just a headcanon: though a great one I might add.
Saying IS knows lyon's path didnt age well, seeing how FE engage made eirika's path the canon route
i don't think that's how that works. I mean Ike supposed to be representing PoR and he's very clearly RD ike
Lyon won the villian you just can't hate category in Heroes. He rightfully so deserves it.
Lyon made me fall in love with tragic characters in media for better or worse
I saw this video after finishing Sacred Stones. Because the end cutscene is so tragic. Dayum.
glad you liked it.
I love Lyon as a character. He's way more compkex than some of the villains we've gotten lately. Not including Rudolph. He's a decent villain.
Orry Jensen yh well rudolph isnt technically a new villain merely updated but yh i agree
Just attempt to imagine the amazing battle Lyon would have with Nergal if they were to come to a confrontation.
One who can bend the elements, the essence of life and even the dragons
against
One who managed to conceal the most evil being of all time within himself through sheer willpower, can even practice necromancy with minimal help and can also control dragon zombies.
Wow, this was deep. I liked Lyon and could relate to him but damn, if you didn't make me love him even more, good job.
thank you! happy you liked it.
24:01 -- Mine too. It's interesting, because I played Sacred Stones years before I started watching Fairy Tail, and there's a character with a similar moral dilemma that appears in the latter. The comparison between Lyon and Jellal can't "not" be made due to the similar circumstances the find themselves in, and as much as I come to sympathize with Jellal eventually (even though I disliked how his first arc played out), I sincerely believe that the way Lyon was written in Sacred Stones is still one of the best ways to handle a character like this.
Come to think of it, doesn't Fire Emblem series and Fairy Tail have a lot in common?
> "Titania".
> Ancient Dragon
> Adopted Daughter of a Dragon
> Brainwashed best-friend that becomes the main villain
I'll just leave that here.
Might be the first time in a while I didn't find it appropriate to make a joke about Lyn's thighs... I could just tell you to cry into them, but... Yeah, I feel like that would be doing a disservice to all the effort you put into this video. Though I'm not sure I agree that Eirika's route does him a disservice, I do agree that Ephraim's route does far more for him, and it's for all the reasons you explained.
glad you enjoyed, and please be as much of a goof as you like, getting this video out finally is a reward in of itself.
Very well... *Ahehehem!*
Next you'll say, "just kidding, btw, I wasn't REALLY crying, I just pretended so that Lyn would let me shove my face in her thighs!"
WHYvernMaster I only cried so Ltn would let me.... NANI?
Finally got through the second part of Jojo, btw. Thanks for getting me into it, even if all I get out of it is memes XD
Honestly, I view Eirika route as Lyon pretending to be possesed, as he wouldn't have the heart to tell Eirika otherwise as he loves her. His ultimate goal is still to save Grado from ruin, just like Ephraim route. He isn't in love with Ephraim and envies him, so that's why he was able to tell him straight on.
I guess? I enjoy the thought but it clearly wasn't the intent.
I would actually argue Nergal is the most tragic, but you have to really dig to find out he's more than the designated megalomaniacal dark mage.
Spoilers.
He was separated from his dragon family, and sought power to reunite with them. He turned to the extremes of dark magic and manipulating life energy to get the portal open. Unfortunately the dark magic eroded his mind and he forgot what his goal was, and instead began doing progressively worse things to chase power for its own sake. Eventually he gains the power to summon dragons into the world, and by dumb chance, pulls in his own children who he intends to sacrifice, forgetting that they were his goal all along. As he's dying in the end, he has a moment of clarity and asks himself why he wanted power in the first place. It's honestly quite similar to what happened with Lyon.
Furthermore, Nergal's earlier morphs had personality and emotion, while his later ones were nothing but cruel and evil. You can make out his descent into cruelty and madness by Kishuna's memory of being created, vs Nergal discarding him and other morphs for being useless in favor of heartless monsters like Sonia and Ephidel.
nergal falls into the same pitfall as Zelgius does. his backstory is merely told to us in bits and pieces, whereas Lyon is shown to us in essentially real time.
Revisited this video recently. Still gets me misty-eyed. Excellent work, Zerk!
thank you!
While I LOVE both this video and Lyon, there is one tiny issue I have with Ephriam's route. In the scene where Renais' sacred stone is destroyed, you described it as Lyon casting 'Hold Person' on Ephriam. My issue is that A. this is the only time he does that in the game, B. (though I will admit I feel less strongly on this one) he just lets Ephriam live after that, and C. Erika's version of this scene get so much flak but this version doesn't. I still enjoyed your analysis, but that will always bug me.
I think the reason he doesn't kill him is the fact that Lyon wants to prove his strength to Ephraim going by their battle dialogue.
ah yes good question, knowing how hold person works, Lyon may have cast it often and everyone always passes their save.
and Like I said in the video, this version doesn't get as much flak because it has the whole "oh shit" factor of Ephraim finally being not in control of a situation. that "oh shit" factor is what Eirika's version of this scene lacks.
Honestly, while Lyon was already one of my favorite characters back then, I didn't really take him into account when considering, which route is better. I really liked Eirika's route, because of Cormag and Joshua, but now I'm not so sure.
I think Lyon's writing is what elevates Ephraim's route to the best story in FE history imo.
Wow
I really need to play this game now
Edit: After hearing everything you said in the end of the video I had to sub! 😢
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