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Ok but what movement are the military trying to mimic with the trap bar? Cause it looks an awful lot like what a combat medic would have to do to pick up a stretcher, or what an infantryman would do to pick up two ammo boxes, or a million other completely functional things for the job. In some ways, probably more applicable than the barbell deadlift
In every way it is more applicable than a barbell deadlift, when I was in most combat corps/MOS were doing hex bar, farmers walks and suitcase carries, for high reps than 5x5. SS and GOMAD are great for a skinny teenager who hasn't trained in his life. It's not the best option for athletes or those in a physical role, like a soldier. Ripp needs to stay in his lane.
I was looking for this comment because that's exactly what popped into my head. I've been out for a number of years but the transferability of the hex bar's grip and weight dustribution was immediately apparent
I'm squatting nearly 800lbs atm and sometimes trap bar deadlifts are needed just to give my low back a break. Great way to get some stimulus in without feeling demolished.
Also depends on foot type ,I have extremely high arch feet ( dancers feet ) and I have trouble balancing free deadlifts with bars ..the trap bar is excellent i actually bought one and gave it to the gym so everyone can use it most don’t have them . Of course it’s easier to lift heavy weights on the trap bar but it works and you still develop strength. It’s definitely safer don’t know who would argue that ? Lol
💯 I did a 500lb trap bar lift and got like 8 reps because didn't have to pull has low felt like a rack pull but really worked my hamstrings and glutes pretty good!
I like what Wendler said, if you’re lifting 900lbs on the trap bar, you’re strong. Doesn’t matter the specific bar so much as lifting safely through a decent range of motion while becoming increasingly stronger
Literally, what it is. If you move it one more time that last year, you're stronger. If it got bigger than last year, you're stronger. If you do it in a shorter period of time than last year, 🥳 congratulations 🥳, you're stronger. If can't be flexible to apply principles of your own chosen hobby elsewhere, what are you even doing? And this isn't like if I work hard at boxing practice then I can study longer, lol, it's steel vs gravity. Some people are kind of absurd but you got it, so there's still hope out there.
We use the hex bar in the army because: 1. It’s easier to train 2. It’s closer to what we do in the army Carrying Ammo cans, litters, 3k generators(which I have to do in my MOS semi-frequently); really any equipment with handles are CLOSER to a hex bar deadlift than a conventional deadlift
3. For the squat component, it doesn't require a separate piece of equipment, i.e., a squat rack, or a spotter. If you have a fail because of bad form or injury, it's safer-- your just drop it. One can also train the back squat with it, isolating the posterior chain. 4. It's one helluva, safe, way to Farmer's Walk.
@@dddutuber1 I think it’s really interesting you bring up the “squat component” because I have seen many soldiers who don’t workout regularly themselves perform a squatting motion during the ACFT rather than the hinge motion characteristic of a deadlift. I think the army should have just implemented dumbell squats instead of the Hex bar because it matches the motions of daily activities and also tests core stability better, which is arguably more important than raw strength for the average soldier, but I guess cost of equipment was a consideration
@@JooceGooce Fair enough. I uilize both techniques separately, but often together; i.e., pulling from the floor with what amounts to an a**-to-ankles full squat, then pulling upright with the hinge movement. Maybe I've developed an ugly variant, but it works for me because it hits both the quads and the posterior chain.
@@dddutuber1 Oh! I didn’t mean to criticize! I was just pointing out my observations and your comment helped me make sense of what was going on. I think you’ve actually contextualized what I've been seeing even more, and now I don't think I really have to “correct” the form when grading anymore because its just individual body mechanics, as long as it works and there’s no risk of injury, all is well
Guys nearly 70 years of age and can likely still lift more than 99.99% of the gym population... If all of the skinny fucks who train 6 days a week with their bro splits actually listened to him they'd be way, way ahead in terms of progress than listening to horseshit the juiced up influencers on the internet tell them.
Mark rippetoe is only useful for teaching absolute novices how to lift and run novice linear progression. Literally everything else out of his mouth- including “gain 10 lbs by next week and your press will go up” is asinine nonsense.
Little do these stupid SS fan boys know, Chase just ran his NLP, that's how he got the 405lbs strict press. Rip never taught him through all Intermediate and Advanced stages. But since Rip is his coach, he couldn't progress further because, well, Rip can't teach anything except NLP
ABSURD! Trap bar deadlift helped me deadlift 800 lbs conventional and sumo. Also, helps increase athleticism by doing jump squats and heavy Bulgarian Split Squats. I highly recommend doing trap bar deadlifts because it takes a lot of load off the spine and develops powerful leg drive.
I would argue that trap bar lifting is actually much more akin to what soldiers might do in the field. Grabbing gear with both hands at the side and moving it around.
@@mrhyde2250 Farmers walks are the safest way to do it. Realistically the weights are never even (especially when carrying a weapon in one hand), rarely stable and you're often wearing as much kit as you're carrying. I did a lot of suitcase carries, which are basically an uneven farmers walk.
Normally I ignore that old man's bloviating, but this specific instance was beyond over the top. I would argue the trap bar is better suited for people who want to deadlift and don't need to do a conventional (or sumo) pull for competition reasons. It's a great tool, I really appreciated it when I had some hamstring issues. EDIT: I just got to the part where he claimed you can pull more on a barbell than a trap bar. God I wish that was the case, I'd be in the 600s with a barbell. This man is a caricature, an animal extinct in its own time.
Rip is really speaking to me here. I am totally on board with this! From now on I am only benching in the smith machine so I limit the degrees of freedom!
My low back is still fucked to this day from straight bar deadlifts. The pain is gone, but if I straight bar deadlift it comes right back. I swore off deadlifts years ago and if I deadlift, it’s with a trap bar.
100% this. I can't even do conventional deadlift anymore, it messes up my back. I can do sumo and trap bar safely - hell I've done 600lb on the trap bar (top handles) pretty easily before, and weight is weight man.
@@dancook5057 It's more hips. If you have deep hip sockets, getting down low enough can cause the back to round as the hips hit their limit early. For instance, I could deadlift 600lb from 16 inches, when I couldn't pull 400lb off the floor because of the rounding of my back at the bottom - while also being able to sumo just fine with a normal bar as I could get lower with a strait back.
@ragnakak and manage your training deliberately. Rack pulls, and hastings, are measurable in their differences from a full deadlift. Trap bars are different, but how much and exactly how? That said, the trap bar does seem like a way to practice for farmer carries, at first. But it seems expensive for just that.
Hey mate, just wanted to say thanks for your videos on Anterior Pelvic Tilt. They really helped me out of a persistent injury - I’m very grateful 🙏 Hope all’s well with you and your family (certainly looking good on your videos!) 👊
A lot of those insane “OHP” records seem to be more of a standing incline lift lol… but you’re right, the amount of core strength to stabilize oneself has to be impressive. I would collapse like a folding chair and never walk again if I did that.
I can't even bench 315, overhead pressing anything near 400 with any form is impressive, regardless of leg drive hip drive or two spotters lifting half of it for you.
Standing 405 incline bench press is pretty easy. I can do that for sure. It's just my cOrE is too weak to not let me snap apart... Other than that I sure can do this
Actually the OHP in the Olympics was removed because of those insane inclines that they wound up using. Strong as fuck cores to be sure but true OHpresses,,, not so much.
Every now and again, I will get sloppy with my deadlifts and tweak my back because I didn't brace properly. I will use the trap bar in that instance as part of getting back into the saddle. If I remember my history, that is exactly what the trap bar was designed for: to train around a back injury.
Yep. "Starting Strength" is an essential text. But Mark is old school... and, as such, he tends to take a dim view of new ideas. And, to be fair, most new gym toys are gimmicky nonsense. The trap bar is the rare exception - something relatively new that's actually useful.
Most of his stuff is just common sense and has been for decades. It's very easy to be 90% right about anything you say about weightlifting, it's not exactly quantum physics.
Only people who don't agree with his training philisophy are people who never read neither of books, and think they know everything about Starting Strength from 10-minute video "What is Starting Strength". those are the people who say about "t-rex physique" and "good morning squats"
@@stephentg1it’s not that new. Was designed by al Gerard in the mid 80’s. Certain lifters on ‘ironmind’ and ‘cyber pump’ (remember them??!?) heavily promoted these alongside the use of fractional plates in the early 2000s.
I'm a guy that's built to pull. Long ass arms, short torso. Long femurs. The trap bar is a godsend for getting me in a more "squat" movement pattern. Especially when my hips are killing me.
One of the first accessories I added when I started lifting was a trap bar. This was about 7 years ago. I had a lumbar fusion and found this tool to be an amazing way to overload in a very athletic way. The neutral grip allows me to brace tightly without putting too much stress on my lower back. Great for quads, grip, rowing, carries…
the best excersise is the one you get excited to do and give it your all and every one is diffrent and aslong as you are doing somthing its beter than nothing
Exactly. Essentially none of us are going to be competing seriously and with any chance of success. Let's just have fun and be healthy. If that means pursuing a yuuge trap bar deadlift or growing a cake that turns heads of other straight men, great!
Anyone talking in absolutes about an exercise is a clown. There's a lot of good to be heard from Rippetoe. I have a hard copy of starting strength still, but anyone beyond a novice will also start to pick up a lot of nonsense.
Teaching a proper deadlift to new Soldiers is difficult. Teaching the trap bar deadlift to new Soldiers is much easier. However ive gotten alot of Soldiers out of initial training who needed a considerable amount of retraining to improve their deadlift. We're talking about kids who for the most part are only going to deadlift during the ACFT.
As a Physical Therapist, I firmly believe the trap bar has it’s place. From a rehabilitative standpoint, it takes stress off the lower back when dealing with patients with low back pain as the center of gravity is in your favor. Thus, you’re able to lift more weight more safely. This example is a modification based on a special case. Not one size fits all!!!
I like it from a tactical perspective; most jobs; fire, military, cops, etc…require lifting from awkward positions and especially suboptimal ones in a state of fatigue or potential exhaustion. I used to say the say thing when I was a big climber/boulderer. When you make it to the top of a climb, and have to mantle up into a bastardized tricep press, normal balanced tricep dips aren’t necessarily the end all be all as they never train the movement in a sub-par awkward position. There’s something to be said for awkward, or “potentially dangerous” movements, as I’d rather much comfortable through terrible joint angles and have some built up strength, then get stuck 20 ft off the ground trying to press from a suboptimal position but having zero strength in it as I hyper fixated all of my gym time on balanced and safe lifts 24/7. Off topic, but it comes to mind as a general thought in relation to the barbell only crowd, or rip, sometimes people need to train in different manners to appease their goals. I’ve never needed to pick up things solely grinding up my shins in a job capacity. Working for the forest service on a hotshot crew, I had to awkwardly lift limbs, tree stumps, etc…w/ a 45 lb pack on, zercher carry random things….again, just another example of a profession littered with suboptimal positions and awkward spots. My two cents again
This. Rippetoe essentially only sees everything in terms of if it's useful in a powerlifting competition but at the same time makes nonsense comparisons to the real world where in reality you do need to do a lot of odd lifts of awkward objects. Zerchers have been way more functional to me than a back squat ever has been as how often do you carry things on your back vs having to pick up objects from the ground (likely with no handholds either) and carry them somewhere else?
Yah but if you’re doing a sandbag lifts or swinging a hammer you’re dealing with literally hundreds of pounds less that you could squat or deadlift, and you can’t just dirty bulk to get the numbers or your fitness up, so it’s harder to simplify on paper.
@@mitchgowing2336 it’s not, but he’s saying that it’s down to deviate from the basic powerlifting movements because they don’t actually comprehensively replicate “real world” movements/challenges as well they’re advertised to.
Trap bar RDLs are great and I vastly prefer them to DB RDLs. Horizontal back, stand on plates or a box so you can dangle the plates down to a deficit -- it's awesome. They for sure have a place in training regimes alongside barbell RDLs.
Starting Strength, to me, always sounded like the kettlebell and macebell gurus whose personality is connected to the tool they push. "this one tool will cure your cancer, and everything else it just a lie". The undergound, caveman, warrior - call it what you like - craze that happened to the fitness industry in the early 2000's was a weird time, but at least is cultivated the notion of just using whatever is around. In the immortal words of Ross Enamait, "accomplish what you can, with what you have, where you are, when you can".
That also drove me away from it early on, it felt like a less-culty Crossfit then I did some research and found that Rip used to be involved with Crossfit over twenty years ago which is maybe why there's some similarities in attitude and marketing.
25:27 Can you elaborate on how you fixed this? This is my exact problem. I'm 5'10 with a -2 ape index and a long torso. I can pull 495 but trying to pull 405 for more than 1 and I turn into Quasimoto.
Last I checked the performance charts for the ACFT, the top score for the deadlift was 320 pound for three reps. So worrying about 500 pound deadlifts for untrained soldiers isn’t really an issue. And 320 was the perfect score. Passing is much lower.
Conventional hurt my back Trap Bar doesn't. Me use Trap Bar until back hurts no more. Me returning to Conventional after 9 months. Me still stronk, Mark still dumb.
I and heard about Rip because I heard that he wrote a book that seemed to be well regarded (Starting Strength). It was during the pandemic, I had bought a barbell and squat rack so the idea of doing everything with a barbell and compound movements seemed elegant and well suited to my situation. Other things appealed to me, I love the overhead press and prefer it big time over the bench press so I thought I like this guy's philosophy. Before buying a barbell and rack I bought some kettlebells and I liked that but I missed barbell movements enough that I spent lots of cash on a barbell and rack. When I heard Rip's opinions on kettlebells (they're the dumbest thing in the world, he really thinks they're just so stupid) I thought, well he's a grumpy old man with weird strong opinions, I can tell the difference between his weird strong opinions and his useful knowledge plus I can evaluate the arguments he gives for his various. But over time watching his stuff, I started thinking no I can't trust this guy.
Great vid. One thing that I don't believe was touched on is the added variety of non barbel movements and their effects on having a PMA. Sure the stimulus change can create growth, but sometimes you just need a slightly different movement/apparatus to get you into the gym or get you fired up for the day. If I have been grinding out low bar squats for an 8 week block, switching to SSB makes the workout fresh and fun. Just my 2c. On the barbel vs trap bar discussion. If I am not mistaken, the mil-spec trap bar has fixed sleeves. Which makes them much more durable and require less maintenance than a barbel or any item with spinning sleeves. That was likely a consideration for the trap bar as well.
Bromley, brother, you sharing your Deca experience was brave and saved my life at the most and my heath and fitness at the least. 20 years of thorasic pain and at the worst not wanting to live because I felt so worthless as a man and father and husband with a broken, weak body. I am also on you Mastif AI plan so this is coming from true to my heart meaning well. For me, watching biching about people biching is not the most fun, man. Your content gets really good and technical at the end (Always at the end. :/ ) Where you are talking about the analysis of the what it is that the person said that is wrong or doesnt apply. It's encouraging to me and remindsds me to hustle, keep trying hard to do hard things. But picking apart the fallacious arguments and why this guy isnt Archimedes, I dont care about that. Will any true bromley people back me up or am I all alone? i love all your stuff and shell out a few sheckles for your opinion via your AI. WHAT is wrong with the advice and why is so much more important to me than WHO is wrong.
I wonder how many of Mark's ancestors ever had to pick up buckets of water, or tool boxes, or handled tools in general like shovels&picks, or baskets of things because again it's more natural to pick up something at your side than it is to pick up something in front of you which is why anybody that has ever used a trap bar before will tell you it's more comfortable it feels more natural and it's less taxing on the spine but it is a variation so somebody like him should not at all ever say that it shouldn't be called a deadlift because picking up a kettlebell in front of you or even to the side of you is still a deadlift if the weight is not moving 🤦
actually think he has a point when it comes to new lifters. learn how to do a standard deadlift and get decently strong at it before using variations. don’t always have access to a trap bar and there’s value in strictly reinforcing the movement pattern. ultimately you do you though… whatever keeps you motivated to keep picking up heavy stuff
Rippetoe always came off to me as the kind of guy who would have been screaming about the invention of the shoe... "You all those newfangled shoes are just making you weak and if you get hurt on your bare feet then you just don't know how to run... "🤦♂️
I injured myself following mark rippetoes "cues" and descriptions in Starting Strength while deadlifting, which didn't actually make any sense for my particular weird body proportions. I probably should have been doing trap bar deadlifts. Thanks for the lifelong injury, Mark!
Okay but what about the trap bar overhead press with shit hanging off one side while standing on one foot that I learned from Joel Seedman? Is that okay?
i was trapbar deadlifting in the 700s while barbelling 605. i didnt have much faith in rip but he should lose all credibility after saying you can lift more on a barbell.
Mark has a point about the instability along the axis of rotation of the bar. There are no raised handles on the ACFT trap bar, so it lacks a moment arm that would add a lot of stability to the lift. It’s much easier to come close to your actual strength potential with a trap bar with elevated handles-unless you practice lifting with the Army style trap bar often. Also, I can see how soldiers might injure themselves trying to rotate the bar back into a good position. The event requires touch and goes which makes it harder to rotate the bar into a better position once started.
If i dropped the barbell deadlift in favour of the trap bar, would i need to add in something else for hamstrings? Trap bar deadlift favours the quads unless im mistaken.
Trapbar Deadlifts are ALL I DO and my overall strength and back development is IMPRESSIVE. I prefer it because I didn't have good grip strength, which has now improved, and it is overall a more manageable way to pull more weight. I noticed how it translates to regular deadlifts but my grip still needs work. I am not using straps because that won't help my grip in the long run.
Man, don't keep the giant muscles of your legs and back small because your hands can't hold on to a thin metal bar. Even people with strong hands strap up because the skin can't handle volume. Do holds and wrist curls... but when you're doing legs do legs!
I notice when teaching some of my more out of shape friends to lift they feel safer pushing themselves on the trap bar then they do with the squat. Requires less mobility to get started. I think I wasted their time trying to teach them a perfect squat when they don't have the mobility and having one lift they can do heavy with confidence would be better for them. Everybody seems to just grab the thing and lift it off the ground with somewhat reasonable form without being told anything. And I can do crazy deficeit deadlifts with it too which is fun.
I remember when this video came out... I got the sense that the Army reached out to Rip among other professionals for input for the ACFT, and he was butt hurt because they didn't pick Starting Strength as the training protocol.
I’ve had four spine surgeries. Trap bar deadlifts are a staple for me. Barbell deads are too much of a risk. I can stay in a safer position with the trap bar
Same here, HS weight training was pretty basic even compared to SS. We had one hour and like 6 stations, alternating upper/lower every day. Upper was bench, military press, incline press, neck machine bs, dips, and lat pull. Lower was leg ext/curl, trap DL, squat, power clean, and leg press machine. Also we only did 3x3 for time constraint reasons. Even with this haphazard approach we still got strong as hell. They never taught us how to barbell DL so we only knew trap bar. Years later when I got into SS/SL/etc I didn't much care for barbell DL and eventually bought my own trap bar from amazon that cost less than my last barbell. It's simply more enjoyable for me, and alone is worth any shortcomings.
Yo Bromley I’ve been getting shoulder pain while benching recently. I also do body weight push-ups on my rest days and my shoulders hurt on those too, but after a set or two, they start to feel better. However, the relief is only temporary and I’m worried that the push-ups could still be contributing to overuse injuries in my shoulders over the long term. Should I drop the push-ups or am I just being a puss
I like Rip as far as his modification of Bill Starr's 5X5 program, his book Starting Strength is very interesting and informative. But I also know he is a businessman and as such he is selling a product and that product is Starting Strength, a barbell program and only a barbell program. There are Starting Strength gyms that run Rip's program and there is probably money involved. Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 program is an excellent program for the people who begin with Starting Strength and plateau.
at 44 I bench 170 kg (374lb) squats and deadlifts were way less around 100 kg (220) Over the decades having occasional back spasms and weak core weight gain and weight loss etc, I was very sketchy about dead lifts with any serious weight, but a year of hex bar or trap bar and a very similar lever action lift machine enabled me to lift 250 kg (551lb) recently out of interest I asked to just have a quick go with a deadlift set up for 160kg (352lbs) I lifted it no problem and stood and chatted while holding it so..i would say it has some good carry over to say the least, for clarity I also did normal back extensions and reverse back extensions and various depth of mobilty and core stuff which i think safe guarded me
Did Rippetoe used to be this angry all the time? I used to follow him a lot like 10 years ago, but he just seems to flip his lid at the smallest things.
I've wondered about this. I do barbell deadlifts on Tuesdays and since we have a trap bar i do that on Fridays. It's just variation to me, but I've always wondered if there are opinions about this.
Deadlifts are primary, Mark would say do power cleans and barbell rows as you sub maximal replacements as you progress, then as you get stronger add in halting deadlifts and rack pulls in place of deadlifts. I think his opinion is a little too strong here, but really why do trap bar with all the other options?
The real problem with weight training is everyone’s structure is different, so it’s pretty tough to say that one way is the only way. The bent over position in the deadlift makes lifting a lot harder than going straight up a down. I found that I could do a triple on the trap bar with no back strain, and it directly translated to a single on the deadlift. It was a fantastic training tool for me. At 175 I was a 500lb deadlifter.
Now that I am older I use the hex/trap bar instead of back squats because the force does not impact my back and discs in my back like the back squat does. There is a much greater force of compression on the vertebral discs from the back squat.
Rip has a very particular view of what is right. He has points, but there are many effective methods to getting big and strong. If he had all these amazing students I might believe he had all the answers.
I injured myself on deadlift because my body proportions are weird for the movement and require me to either squat the bar at the beginning (which is ironically a reason he says the trap bar is bad), or shift the bar forward a bit so it's not in the middle of my foot at the beginning of the movement, but more over my toes. I chose to shift it over my toes more to put more weight on my back and eventually got very seriously injured. Now I'm using the trap bar to rehab and I should have been using it all along. My weird proportions don't matter with trap bar, I can make it work for me.
> run squat program > constantly crushing my discs in my back > use belt squat > get weird rash on my hips because the belt is apparently never washed (noted) > what do I do now? ah lmao let's do trap bar, squat style movement pattern but I pull up weight from the floor so it would feel good on my back > actually saves me from getting injured or dropping from the program. Thank you, Trap Bar!
Used to have this mental with trap bars vs Barbell. Thinking trap bars weren’t good. Same thing with smith machine. Did my research and worked with some coaches and added these items my rotation of training. Especially the trap bar for the army fitness test
Trap bar is amazing! So many benefits! I found doing a mixture of low and high trap bar deads. Increased my squat and standard deadlift numbers massively. I go weeks doing just trap bar then ill revert to standard dead for a couple of weeks before attempting a 1rm....it works for me
I use both conventional and trap bar deadlifts and find they complement each other. I have not had any problems with this "sagittal" plane instability, though I do see the point with regards to hand placement (I'm just more careful to keep a centered grip on the trap bar handles). I've had much more problems using the hook grip on the conventional deadlift with one side (bicep and lats) getting more strain than the other (something which I could potentially solve by using straps). I'll keep using the trap bar as usual.
I've been using my trap bar because my deadlift is past the max of my barbell and its been great on my lower back. I do deficits DL with my barbell still though but will probably continue on my trap bar even after my power bar comes in.
I broke my lower back in a work injury back in the 80's I spent some time in the hospital unable to move, it took months and months to recover to about 75%, dead lifting for me was over, my therapist had a trap bar and I used it, I tried deadlifting over the next 20 years, it would cause so much pain I could not work the next day or two, the trap bar worked for me, my strength came back slowly, then I went to the Smith machine started to deadlift, that got my strength up enough till I could free weight deadlift again (very lightly) but it took years for this to happen, it wasn't till I saw how Eddie Hall and Thor deadlifted, the way they rolled the weight and set themselves etc.. made all the difference, if not for the trap bar and Smith Machine I might still be where I was, I can only do 150lbs but I'm 60 I still work out 3-4 times a week, so this guy can go jump off a bridge
I use a hex bar because I train for athleticism and overall strength. If I wanted to compete in some competition, I would use a barbell. He has his opinion as does everyone. I have personally had fantastic results from hex bar, landmine, and a few kettlebell lifts.
Good luck with the app brother, wish it were just slightly cheaper, maybe even 3 months at 14.99 and then 24.99 after or something. That would really let me dig deep and see if the app is right for me. Also, great video! Mark Rip is a very interesting guy and everyone that is part of starting strength operates like a cult. Its really weird.
I started trap deadlifting after a severe back injury that had me unable to stand for 5 days and not able to stand up straight for a few months.. i still use it for variety.. its also useful ro get the body used to holding heavier weight than a regular deadlift
One can stand on a platform to lower the trap bar (or barbell) handles to get a lift lower from the ground, nore similar to truly picking sonething up off the ground and work the lower back.
one thing i like about the hexbar deadlift (which is really more a squat in my opinion) is that at the peak i can retract my shoulders more to help fight rounding of the shoulders
I’m a pretty novice lifter and I don’t know a whole lot about lifting. But I will say, I’ve been injured doing a straight bar deadlift and I’ve never been injured doing trap bar deadlift. I still do both though, because I feel they both have a place in my workout routine. Trap bar feels really natural, ergonomically speaking, for me. And I think we pick things up in that fashion very often.
So I just started doing the hex Bar today. I noticed I could do more of a squat. Then I noticed I could do it as a hip hinge. Turns out it can be either and depends on execution, not the bar
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traphouse...also unsafe
Ok but what movement are the military trying to mimic with the trap bar? Cause it looks an awful lot like what a combat medic would have to do to pick up a stretcher, or what an infantryman would do to pick up two ammo boxes, or a million other completely functional things for the job. In some ways, probably more applicable than the barbell deadlift
That combat medic is in danger! Too much freedom in the sagittal plane!
In every way it is more applicable than a barbell deadlift, when I was in most combat corps/MOS were doing hex bar, farmers walks and suitcase carries, for high reps than 5x5. SS and GOMAD are great for a skinny teenager who hasn't trained in his life. It's not the best option for athletes or those in a physical role, like a soldier. Ripp needs to stay in his lane.
@@PingTPunk-rq9usrofl. Truly the most grave risk.
I was looking for this comment because that's exactly what popped into my head. I've been out for a number of years but the transferability of the hex bar's grip and weight dustribution was immediately apparent
@@happymradrianasking mark rippetoe to stay in his lane is like telling a junky to quit cold turkey. The boomer final boss can’t help himself
I'm squatting nearly 800lbs atm and sometimes trap bar deadlifts are needed just to give my low back a break. Great way to get some stimulus in without feeling demolished.
Also depends on foot type ,I have extremely high arch feet ( dancers feet ) and I have trouble balancing free deadlifts with bars ..the trap bar is excellent i actually bought one and gave it to the gym so everyone can use it most don’t have them . Of course it’s easier to lift heavy weights on the trap bar but it works and you still develop strength. It’s definitely safer don’t know who would argue that ? Lol
Right on, man. I’ve also done the same when I slightly strained my lower back a few months ago.
Couldnt say it better!
@@UncleTermitedon’t know if I have the same thing you have but my feet are short as fuck. They don’t provide that stability
💯 I did a 500lb trap bar lift and got like 8 reps because didn't have to pull has low felt like a rack pull but really worked my hamstrings and glutes pretty good!
Guy that has a barbell course says other thing is worse than a barbell. I never would have guessed
Though he has dumbbells and machines in his own gym. But yeah, I guess Rip hates everything that is not a barbell....
His solution to everything is do more barbells.😂😂😂😂😂
I like what Wendler said, if you’re lifting 900lbs on the trap bar, you’re strong. Doesn’t matter the specific bar so much as lifting safely through a decent range of motion while becoming increasingly stronger
Literally, what it is. If you move it one more time that last year, you're stronger. If it got bigger than last year, you're stronger. If you do it in a shorter period of time than last year, 🥳 congratulations 🥳, you're stronger. If can't be flexible to apply principles of your own chosen hobby elsewhere, what are you even doing? And this isn't like if I work hard at boxing practice then I can study longer, lol, it's steel vs gravity. Some people are kind of absurd but you got it, so there's still hope out there.
exactly. Just angles, movement.
Range of motion unimportant. If your body’s under load then it’s under load.
@@mark4levThe way I goon, I’m always under load.
We use the hex bar in the army because:
1. It’s easier to train
2. It’s closer to what we do in the army
Carrying Ammo cans, litters, 3k generators(which I have to do in my MOS semi-frequently); really any equipment with handles are CLOSER to a hex bar deadlift than a conventional deadlift
3. For the squat component, it doesn't require a separate piece of equipment, i.e., a squat rack, or a spotter. If you have a fail because of bad form or injury, it's safer-- your just drop it. One can also train the back squat with it, isolating the posterior chain.
4. It's one helluva, safe, way to Farmer's Walk.
@@dddutuber1 I think it’s really interesting you bring up the “squat component” because I have seen many soldiers who don’t workout regularly themselves perform a squatting motion during the ACFT rather than the hinge motion characteristic of a deadlift. I think the army should have just implemented dumbell squats instead of the Hex bar because it matches the motions of daily activities and also tests core stability better, which is arguably more important than raw strength for the average soldier, but I guess cost of equipment was a consideration
@@JooceGooce Fair enough. I uilize both techniques separately, but often together; i.e., pulling from the floor with what amounts to an a**-to-ankles full squat, then pulling upright with the hinge movement. Maybe I've developed an ugly variant, but it works for me because it hits both the quads and the posterior chain.
@@dddutuber1 Oh! I didn’t mean to criticize! I was just pointing out my observations and your comment helped me make sense of what was going on. I think you’ve actually contextualized what I've been seeing even more, and now I don't think I really have to “correct” the form when grading anymore because its just individual body mechanics, as long as it works and there’s no risk of injury, all is well
@@JooceGooce No worries. I took it as the objective observation it appeared to be. It was good to rethink my mechanics. 🖖
Rip is like the annoying older guy at the gym who is simply there to tell everyone what they're doing wrong
And has made no progress himself since he peaked decades ago.
@zerrodefex tbf he's an old man
Guys nearly 70 years of age and can likely still lift more than 99.99% of the gym population... If all of the skinny fucks who train 6 days a week with their bro splits actually listened to him they'd be way, way ahead in terms of progress than listening to horseshit the juiced up influencers on the internet tell them.
@@zerrodefex And his goals and values are different from yours
Bro scientist dismantles milk connoisseur
😂😂😂
I need a new label for 'bro scientist'. The spirit is right, but I take issue with the word 'scientist' being placed next to my name
@@AlexanderBromley brofessor might be better
@@AlexanderBromley What about "brofessional"? I mean, a professional is, by definition, someone who does things and knows what they're doing.
@@AlexanderBromleyI recommend the honorary term of “brofessional meathead “ as replacement
Mark rippetoe is only useful for teaching absolute novices how to lift and run novice linear progression. Literally everything else out of his mouth- including “gain 10 lbs by next week and your press will go up” is asinine nonsense.
Not even that. He's responsible for many novice tyrannosaur physiques.
Little do these stupid SS fan boys know, Chase just ran his NLP, that's how he got the 405lbs strict press. Rip never taught him through all Intermediate and Advanced stages. But since Rip is his coach, he couldn't progress further because, well, Rip can't teach anything except NLP
What's a tyrannosaur physique? Big legs and torso and tiny arms?
@@JustSomeGuy69420kirk Douglas without the big squat
After three months I learned that there wasn't much more to learn from him.
ABSURD! Trap bar deadlift helped me deadlift 800 lbs conventional and sumo. Also, helps increase athleticism by doing jump squats and heavy Bulgarian Split Squats. I highly recommend doing trap bar deadlifts because it takes a lot of load off the spine and develops powerful leg drive.
'Already we are down the sewer tunnel of pedantic bullshit' - ROTFL - I need to use that in a sentence now.
And he said it so casually😂😂😂
This sort of opinion and it's lunacy could drive one to....GO MAD.... I'll see myself out now
I’m chortling ova here
@@legrandfromage9682 _Sensible chuckle_
*ba-dumm tshh*
😂
Bristol in the house.
I would argue that trap bar lifting is actually much more akin to what soldiers might do in the field. Grabbing gear with both hands at the side and moving it around.
Farmer's walks?
@@kricku I’d say they are cousins in a sense. And you can do farmer’s walks with the trap bar.
@@mrhyde2250 Farmers walks are the safest way to do it. Realistically the weights are never even (especially when carrying a weapon in one hand), rarely stable and you're often wearing as much kit as you're carrying. I did a lot of suitcase carries, which are basically an uneven farmers walk.
A trap bar farmers carry almost entirely replicates a 2 man litter carry.
Normally I ignore that old man's bloviating, but this specific instance was beyond over the top. I would argue the trap bar is better suited for people who want to deadlift and don't need to do a conventional (or sumo) pull for competition reasons. It's a great tool, I really appreciated it when I had some hamstring issues.
EDIT: I just got to the part where he claimed you can pull more on a barbell than a trap bar. God I wish that was the case, I'd be in the 600s with a barbell. This man is a caricature, an animal extinct in its own time.
Rip is really speaking to me here. I am totally on board with this! From now on I am only benching in the smith machine so I limit the degrees of freedom!
I have the WR for my weight class in the incline smith machine bench press!
Sadly, Rip has positioned himself as the grumpy old man of lifting who's so knowledgeable, he only knows how to use one tool to get stronger.
I have NEVER hurt my back on a trap bar. I have hurt my back with a straight bar MULTIPLE times.
My low back is still fucked to this day from straight bar deadlifts. The pain is gone, but if I straight bar deadlift it comes right back. I swore off deadlifts years ago and if I deadlift, it’s with a trap bar.
100% this. I can't even do conventional deadlift anymore, it messes up my back. I can do sumo and trap bar safely - hell I've done 600lb on the trap bar (top handles) pretty easily before, and weight is weight man.
So maybe we look at back positioning and not blaming the implement?
@@dancook5057 It's more hips. If you have deep hip sockets, getting down low enough can cause the back to round as the hips hit their limit early. For instance, I could deadlift 600lb from 16 inches, when I couldn't pull 400lb off the floor because of the rounding of my back at the bottom - while also being able to sumo just fine with a normal bar as I could get lower with a strait back.
@@dancook5057 maybe we use the device SPECIFICALLY designed to be better on the back.
If you took a drink everytime Rip say "sagittal plane" you'd have been alchol poisoned 20 minutes in.😅
That sounds like a challenge to me.
I'd say quicker than 20
Trap bar is a good way to get some more deadlift volume in, while being sustainable
Just another tool in the box.
Or you could just do rack pulls
@ragnakak and manage your training deliberately. Rack pulls, and hastings, are measurable in their differences from a full deadlift. Trap bars are different, but how much and exactly how?
That said, the trap bar does seem like a way to practice for farmer carries, at first. But it seems expensive for just that.
@@ragnakak rack pulls have their place but how on earth do you think that you can just do rack pulls instead of trap bar lifts or deadlifts?
@@barrydworak or, you know, practice deadlifts without strain on the lower back? Pretty good for that. Its a good bar.
Hey mate, just wanted to say thanks for your videos on Anterior Pelvic Tilt. They really helped me out of a persistent injury - I’m very grateful 🙏
Hope all’s well with you and your family (certainly looking good on your videos!) 👊
A lot of those insane “OHP” records seem to be more of a standing incline lift lol… but you’re right, the amount of core strength to stabilize oneself has to be impressive. I would collapse like a folding chair and never walk again if I did that.
I can't even bench 315, overhead pressing anything near 400 with any form is impressive, regardless of leg drive hip drive or two spotters lifting half of it for you.
Standing 405 incline bench press is pretty easy. I can do that for sure. It's just my cOrE is too weak to not let me snap apart... Other than that I sure can do this
Actually the OHP in the Olympics was removed because of those insane inclines that they wound up using. Strong as fuck cores to be sure but true OHpresses,,, not so much.
@@aaa-tm9dccap
@@aaa-tm9dcPls take Rippetoes weiner out of your mouth
Every now and again, I will get sloppy with my deadlifts and tweak my back because I didn't brace properly. I will use the trap bar in that instance as part of getting back into the saddle. If I remember my history, that is exactly what the trap bar was designed for: to train around a back injury.
I actually agree with a lot of Rip's overall training philosophy. But he gets silly with certain things, trap-bar included.
I actually do as well. Basically a fan of his impact on training culture.
Yep. "Starting Strength" is an essential text. But Mark is old school... and, as such, he tends to take a dim view of new ideas. And, to be fair, most new gym toys are gimmicky nonsense. The trap bar is the rare exception - something relatively new that's actually useful.
Most of his stuff is just common sense and has been for decades. It's very easy to be 90% right about anything you say about weightlifting, it's not exactly quantum physics.
Only people who don't agree with his training philisophy are people who never read neither of books, and think they know everything about Starting Strength from 10-minute video "What is Starting Strength".
those are the people who say about "t-rex physique" and "good morning squats"
@@stephentg1it’s not that new. Was designed by al Gerard in the mid 80’s. Certain lifters on ‘ironmind’ and ‘cyber pump’ (remember them??!?) heavily promoted these alongside the use of fractional plates in the early 2000s.
The aging pink milkman continues to fear monger
And his hairline continues to evaporate
I'm a guy that's built to pull. Long ass arms, short torso. Long femurs. The trap bar is a godsend for getting me in a more "squat" movement pattern. Especially when my hips are killing me.
Ah yes, Mark Ripped-A-Hole-in-my-favorite-pair-of-pants-doing-GOMAD-for-a-3pl8-Squat-toe.
damnit i did that too
One of the first accessories I added when I started lifting was a trap bar. This was about 7 years ago. I had a lumbar fusion and found this tool to be an amazing way to overload in a very athletic way. The neutral grip allows me to brace tightly without putting too much stress on my lower back. Great for quads, grip, rowing, carries…
the best excersise is the one you get excited to do and give it your all and every one is diffrent and aslong as you are doing somthing its beter than nothing
Exactly. Essentially none of us are going to be competing seriously and with any chance of success. Let's just have fun and be healthy. If that means pursuing a yuuge trap bar deadlift or growing a cake that turns heads of other straight men, great!
Anyone talking in absolutes about an exercise is a clown. There's a lot of good to be heard from Rippetoe. I have a hard copy of starting strength still, but anyone beyond a novice will also start to pick up a lot of nonsense.
only a sith deals in absolutes
@@luke-kun9030I will do what I must
Teaching a proper deadlift to new Soldiers is difficult. Teaching the trap bar deadlift to new Soldiers is much easier.
However ive gotten alot of Soldiers out of initial training who needed a considerable amount of retraining to improve their deadlift.
We're talking about kids who for the most part are only going to deadlift during the ACFT.
Mark is a cult of personality, and boy is he entertaining to listen to!
As a Physical Therapist, I firmly believe the trap bar has it’s place. From a rehabilitative standpoint, it takes stress off the lower back when dealing with patients with low back pain as the center of gravity is in your favor. Thus, you’re able to lift more weight more safely. This example is a modification based on a special case. Not one size fits all!!!
I like it from a tactical perspective; most jobs; fire, military, cops, etc…require lifting from awkward positions and especially suboptimal ones in a state of fatigue or potential exhaustion. I used to say the say thing when I was a big climber/boulderer. When you make it to the top of a climb, and have to mantle up into a bastardized tricep press, normal balanced tricep dips aren’t necessarily the end all be all as they never train the movement in a sub-par awkward position. There’s something to be said for awkward, or “potentially dangerous” movements, as I’d rather much comfortable through terrible joint angles and have some built up strength, then get stuck 20 ft off the ground trying to press from a suboptimal position but having zero strength in it as I hyper fixated all of my gym time on balanced and safe lifts 24/7.
Off topic, but it comes to mind as a general thought in relation to the barbell only crowd, or rip, sometimes people need to train in different manners to appease their goals. I’ve never needed to pick up things solely grinding up my shins in a job capacity. Working for the forest service on a hotshot crew, I had to awkwardly lift limbs, tree stumps, etc…w/ a 45 lb pack on, zercher carry random things….again, just another example of a profession littered with suboptimal positions and awkward spots.
My two cents again
This. Rippetoe essentially only sees everything in terms of if it's useful in a powerlifting competition but at the same time makes nonsense comparisons to the real world where in reality you do need to do a lot of odd lifts of awkward objects. Zerchers have been way more functional to me than a back squat ever has been as how often do you carry things on your back vs having to pick up objects from the ground (likely with no handholds either) and carry them somewhere else?
Yah but if you’re doing a sandbag lifts or swinging a hammer you’re dealing with literally hundreds of pounds less that you could squat or deadlift, and you can’t just dirty bulk to get the numbers or your fitness up, so it’s harder to simplify on paper.
How is trap bar more awkward than barbell
@@mitchgowing2336 it’s not, but he’s saying that it’s down to deviate from the basic powerlifting movements because they don’t actually comprehensively replicate “real world” movements/challenges as well they’re advertised to.
Trap bar, smith machine, etc are all just tools in the toolbox. It's stupid to say that any of the tools are bad.
Trap bar RDLs are great and I vastly prefer them to DB RDLs. Horizontal back, stand on plates or a box so you can dangle the plates down to a deficit -- it's awesome. They for sure have a place in training regimes alongside barbell RDLs.
I like when Uncle Rip hits the sauce extra hard during the holidays....
Starting Strength, to me, always sounded like the kettlebell and macebell gurus whose personality is connected to the tool they push. "this one tool will cure your cancer, and everything else it just a lie". The undergound, caveman, warrior - call it what you like - craze that happened to the fitness industry in the early 2000's was a weird time, but at least is cultivated the notion of just using whatever is around. In the immortal words of Ross Enamait, "accomplish what you can, with what you have, where you are, when you can".
That also drove me away from it early on, it felt like a less-culty Crossfit then I did some research and found that Rip used to be involved with Crossfit over twenty years ago which is maybe why there's some similarities in attitude and marketing.
25:27 Can you elaborate on how you fixed this? This is my exact problem. I'm 5'10 with a -2 ape index and a long torso. I can pull 495 but trying to pull 405 for more than 1 and I turn into Quasimoto.
Last I checked the performance charts for the ACFT, the top score for the deadlift was 320 pound for three reps. So worrying about 500 pound deadlifts for untrained soldiers isn’t really an issue. And 320 was the perfect score. Passing is much lower.
Conventional hurt my back
Trap Bar doesn't. Me use Trap Bar until back hurts no more. Me returning to Conventional after 9 months. Me still stronk, Mark still dumb.
I and heard about Rip because I heard that he wrote a book that seemed to be well regarded (Starting Strength). It was during the pandemic, I had bought a barbell and squat rack so the idea of doing everything with a barbell and compound movements seemed elegant and well suited to my situation. Other things appealed to me, I love the overhead press and prefer it big time over the bench press so I thought I like this guy's philosophy.
Before buying a barbell and rack I bought some kettlebells and I liked that but I missed barbell movements enough that I spent lots of cash on a barbell and rack.
When I heard Rip's opinions on kettlebells (they're the dumbest thing in the world, he really thinks they're just so stupid) I thought, well he's a grumpy old man with weird strong opinions, I can tell the difference between his weird strong opinions and his useful knowledge plus I can evaluate the arguments he gives for his various.
But over time watching his stuff, I started thinking no I can't trust this guy.
Great vid. One thing that I don't believe was touched on is the added variety of non barbel movements and their effects on having a PMA. Sure the stimulus change can create growth, but sometimes you just need a slightly different movement/apparatus to get you into the gym or get you fired up for the day. If I have been grinding out low bar squats for an 8 week block, switching to SSB makes the workout fresh and fun. Just my 2c.
On the barbel vs trap bar discussion. If I am not mistaken, the mil-spec trap bar has fixed sleeves. Which makes them much more durable and require less maintenance than a barbel or any item with spinning sleeves. That was likely a consideration for the trap bar as well.
A trap isnt even unstable. It's a stable equilibrium because you're arms are a pendulum. They'll swing and self correct to be vertical.
RIP is also against reverse hypers.
Gay
Agree with Mark on the instability with trap bar deadlift, have had it rock a bit and it is not good on your back
Literally me yesterday: "I wish more down to earth people would talk about the trap bar"
Bromley: "bro you're not gonna believe this"
Bromley, brother, you sharing your Deca experience was brave and saved my life at the most and my heath and fitness at the least. 20 years of thorasic pain and at the worst not wanting to live because I felt so worthless as a man and father and husband with a broken, weak body. I am also on you Mastif AI plan so this is coming from true to my heart meaning well. For me, watching biching about people biching is not the most fun, man. Your content gets really good and technical at the end (Always at the end. :/ ) Where you are talking about the analysis of the what it is that the person said that is wrong or doesnt apply. It's encouraging to me and remindsds me to hustle, keep trying hard to do hard things. But picking apart the fallacious arguments and why this guy isnt Archimedes, I dont care about that. Will any true bromley people back me up or am I all alone? i love all your stuff and shell out a few sheckles for your opinion via your AI. WHAT is wrong with the advice and why is so much more important to me than WHO is wrong.
I wonder how many of Mark's ancestors ever had to pick up buckets of water, or tool boxes, or handled tools in general like shovels&picks, or baskets of things because again it's more natural to pick up something at your side than it is to pick up something in front of you which is why anybody that has ever used a trap bar before will tell you it's more comfortable it feels more natural and it's less taxing on the spine but it is a variation so somebody like him should not at all ever say that it shouldn't be called a deadlift because picking up a kettlebell in front of you or even to the side of you is still a deadlift if the weight is not moving 🤦
Watching Bromley lose his shit about Rippetoe's predictable convictions is like watching him lose his shit about the weather.
actually think he has a point when it comes to new lifters. learn how to do a standard deadlift and get decently strong at it before using variations. don’t always have access to a trap bar and there’s value in strictly reinforcing the movement pattern. ultimately you do you though… whatever keeps you motivated to keep picking up heavy stuff
Rippetoe always came off to me as the kind of guy who would have been screaming about the invention of the shoe...
"You all those newfangled shoes are just making you weak and if you get hurt on your bare feet then you just don't know how to run... "🤦♂️
Low hanging fruit, but I'm still baffled by the olympic level of unlikability. It's genuinely impressive.
Mark Rippltoe: THE TRAP BAR IS TRAAAASSSHHHH
Tom Lazorik would like to have a word with this man 😂😂😂
Happy to see Tom getting a shoutout on a Bromley vid.
Tom was just commenting on the new GVS video, he'll probably be along shortly.
Paul Kelso is preparing a thorough trap bar workout for Rip, in the afterlife.
I injured myself following mark rippetoes "cues" and descriptions in Starting Strength while deadlifting, which didn't actually make any sense for my particular weird body proportions.
I probably should have been doing trap bar deadlifts. Thanks for the lifelong injury, Mark!
Okay but what about the trap bar overhead press with shit hanging off one side while standing on one foot that I learned from Joel Seedman? Is that okay?
i was trapbar deadlifting in the 700s while barbelling 605. i didnt have much faith in rip but he should lose all credibility after saying you can lift more on a barbell.
Mark has a point about the instability along the axis of rotation of the bar. There are no raised handles on the ACFT trap bar, so it lacks a moment arm that would add a lot of stability to the lift. It’s much easier to come close to your actual strength potential with a trap bar with elevated handles-unless you practice lifting with the Army style trap bar often. Also, I can see how soldiers might injure themselves trying to rotate the bar back into a good position. The event requires touch and goes which makes it harder to rotate the bar into a better position once started.
I saw Mike Israetel give you props in a podcast recently. That would be s good interview guest.
If i dropped the barbell deadlift in favour of the trap bar, would i need to add in something else for hamstrings?
Trap bar deadlift favours the quads unless im mistaken.
No. I dont even understand how you can ask that question. Its the same movement.
@Axteffekt it isn't. Otherwise both wouldn't need to exist.
Trapbar Deadlifts are ALL I DO and my overall strength and back development is IMPRESSIVE. I prefer it because I didn't have good grip strength, which has now improved, and it is overall a more manageable way to pull more weight. I noticed how it translates to regular deadlifts but my grip still needs work. I am not using straps because that won't help my grip in the long run.
Man, don't keep the giant muscles of your legs and back small because your hands can't hold on to a thin metal bar. Even people with strong hands strap up because the skin can't handle volume. Do holds and wrist curls... but when you're doing legs do legs!
I really don't care if Rip is right or wrong, this clip is hilarious. Maybe his best meme outside of Hyip Drahve.
Hyip Drahve into a Cyentral Shaft
I notice when teaching some of my more out of shape friends to lift they feel safer pushing themselves on the trap bar then they do with the squat. Requires less mobility to get started. I think I wasted their time trying to teach them a perfect squat when they don't have the mobility and having one lift they can do heavy with confidence would be better for them. Everybody seems to just grab the thing and lift it off the ground with somewhat reasonable form without being told anything. And I can do crazy deficeit deadlifts with it too which is fun.
I remember when this video came out... I got the sense that the Army reached out to Rip among other professionals for input for the ACFT, and he was butt hurt because they didn't pick Starting Strength as the training protocol.
I’ve had four spine surgeries. Trap bar deadlifts are a staple for me. Barbell deads are too much of a risk. I can stay in a safer position with the trap bar
We learned how to deadlift with this bar in hs football & loved it. I was already scrapping my shins from skateboarding. A win win for me.
Same here, HS weight training was pretty basic even compared to SS. We had one hour and like 6 stations, alternating upper/lower every day. Upper was bench, military press, incline press, neck machine bs, dips, and lat pull. Lower was leg ext/curl, trap DL, squat, power clean, and leg press machine. Also we only did 3x3 for time constraint reasons. Even with this haphazard approach we still got strong as hell. They never taught us how to barbell DL so we only knew trap bar. Years later when I got into SS/SL/etc I didn't much care for barbell DL and eventually bought my own trap bar from amazon that cost less than my last barbell. It's simply more enjoyable for me, and alone is worth any shortcomings.
Yo Bromley I’ve been getting shoulder pain while benching recently. I also do body weight push-ups on my rest days and my shoulders hurt on those too, but after a set or two, they start to feel better. However, the relief is only temporary and I’m worried that the push-ups could still be contributing to overuse injuries in my shoulders over the long term. Should I drop the push-ups or am I just being a puss
Love that you are digging this one up. Nearly every influencer was reacting to this when Telander was going at Rip a couple years ago.
I remember when a trap bar came from the future to murder me. I was saved by a barbell sent back to protect me from the villainous trap bar.
I like Rip as far as his modification of Bill Starr's 5X5 program, his book Starting Strength is very interesting and informative. But I also know he is a businessman and as such he is selling a product and that product is Starting Strength, a barbell program and only a barbell program. There are Starting Strength gyms that run Rip's program and there is probably money involved. Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 program is an excellent program for the people who begin with Starting Strength and plateau.
at 44 I bench 170 kg (374lb) squats and deadlifts were way less around 100 kg (220)
Over the decades having occasional back spasms and weak core weight gain and weight loss etc, I was very sketchy about dead lifts with any serious weight, but a year of hex bar or trap bar and a very similar lever action lift machine enabled me to lift 250 kg (551lb) recently out of interest I asked to just have a quick go with a deadlift set up for 160kg (352lbs) I lifted it no problem and stood and chatted while holding it so..i would say it has some good carry over to say the least, for clarity I also did normal back extensions and reverse back extensions and various depth of mobilty and core stuff which i think safe guarded me
Did Rippetoe used to be this angry all the time? I used to follow him a lot like 10 years ago, but he just seems to flip his lid at the smallest things.
Common symptom of dementia
I've wondered about this. I do barbell deadlifts on Tuesdays and since we have a trap bar i do that on Fridays. It's just variation to me, but I've always wondered if there are opinions about this.
Deadlifts are primary, Mark would say do power cleans and barbell rows as you sub maximal replacements as you progress, then as you get stronger add in halting deadlifts and rack pulls in place of deadlifts. I think his opinion is a little too strong here, but really why do trap bar with all the other options?
The real problem with weight training is everyone’s structure is different, so it’s pretty tough to say that one way is the only way. The bent over position in the deadlift makes lifting a lot harder than going straight up a down. I found that I could do a triple on the trap bar with no back strain, and it directly translated to a single on the deadlift. It was a fantastic training tool for me. At 175 I was a 500lb deadlifter.
Now that I am older I use the hex/trap bar instead of back squats because the force does not impact my back and discs in my back like the back squat does. There is a much greater force of compression on the vertebral discs from the back squat.
“To call it a deadlift, you have to use a barbell”, so a dumbbell deadlift isn’t a deadlift? Ok Rip. The trap bar was invented by a Powerlifter.
Rip has a very particular view of what is right. He has points, but there are many effective methods to getting big and strong.
If he had all these amazing students I might believe he had all the answers.
I used trapbar DLs after a back issue. I still use it to do farmers carry. Also static holds at 90kg for time. Trap bars are awesome.
I injured myself on deadlift because my body proportions are weird for the movement and require me to either squat the bar at the beginning (which is ironically a reason he says the trap bar is bad), or shift the bar forward a bit so it's not in the middle of my foot at the beginning of the movement, but more over my toes. I chose to shift it over my toes more to put more weight on my back and eventually got very seriously injured.
Now I'm using the trap bar to rehab and I should have been using it all along. My weird proportions don't matter with trap bar, I can make it work for me.
The discussion at the end of this video is priceless.
> run squat program > constantly crushing my discs in my back > use belt squat > get weird rash on my hips because the belt is apparently never washed (noted) > what do I do now? ah lmao let's do trap bar, squat style movement pattern but I pull up weight from the floor so it would feel good on my back > actually saves me from getting injured or dropping from the program. Thank you, Trap Bar!
Used to have this mental with trap bars vs Barbell. Thinking trap bars weren’t good. Same thing with smith machine. Did my research and worked with some coaches and added these items my rotation of training. Especially the trap bar for the army fitness test
Is the bar secured during a barbell row?
Rippetoe is a Narrow Minded, Legend in His Own Mind. A quality trap bar is a great training tool.
Trap bar is amazing! So many benefits! I found doing a mixture of low and high trap bar deads. Increased my squat and standard deadlift numbers massively. I go weeks doing just trap bar then ill revert to standard dead for a couple of weeks before attempting a 1rm....it works for me
I use both conventional and trap bar deadlifts and find they complement each other. I have not had any problems with this "sagittal" plane instability, though I do see the point with regards to hand placement (I'm just more careful to keep a centered grip on the trap bar handles). I've had much more problems using the hook grip on the conventional deadlift with one side (bicep and lats) getting more strain than the other (something which I could potentially solve by using straps). I'll keep using the trap bar as usual.
I've been using my trap bar because my deadlift is past the max of my barbell and its been great on my lower back. I do deficits DL with my barbell still though but will probably continue on my trap bar even after my power bar comes in.
who was the old guy at the beginning of the video???
I broke my lower back in a work injury back in the 80's I spent some time in the hospital unable to move, it took months and months to recover to about 75%, dead lifting for me was over, my therapist had a trap bar and I used it, I tried deadlifting over the next 20 years, it would cause so much pain I could not work the next day or two, the trap bar worked for me, my strength came back slowly, then I went to the Smith machine started to deadlift, that got my strength up enough till I could free weight deadlift again (very lightly) but it took years for this to happen, it wasn't till I saw how Eddie Hall and Thor deadlifted, the way they rolled the weight and set themselves etc.. made all the difference, if not for the trap bar and Smith Machine I might still be where I was, I can only do 150lbs but I'm 60 I still work out 3-4 times a week, so this guy can go jump off a bridge
I use a hex bar because I train for athleticism and overall strength. If I wanted to compete in some competition, I would use a barbell. He has his opinion as does everyone. I have personally had fantastic results from hex bar, landmine, and a few kettlebell lifts.
Good luck with the app brother, wish it were just slightly cheaper, maybe even 3 months at 14.99 and then 24.99 after or something. That would really let me dig deep and see if the app is right for me.
Also, great video! Mark Rip is a very interesting guy and everyone that is part of starting strength operates like a cult. Its really weird.
I started trap deadlifting after a severe back injury that had me unable to stand for 5 days and not able to stand up straight for a few months.. i still use it for variety.. its also useful ro get the body used to holding heavier weight than a regular deadlift
Whats anchoring every lift is the straight line of gravity to the core of earth.
One can stand on a platform to lower the trap bar (or barbell) handles to get a lift lower from the ground, nore similar to truly picking sonething up off the ground and work the lower back.
Been taking a break from conventional deadlift and doing 2in deficit trap bar deadlifts using the low handles. I like it.
one thing i like about the hexbar deadlift (which is really more a squat in my opinion) is that at the peak i can retract my shoulders more to help fight rounding of the shoulders
I’m a pretty novice lifter and I don’t know a whole lot about lifting. But I will say, I’ve been injured doing a straight bar deadlift and I’ve never been injured doing trap bar deadlift. I still do both though, because I feel they both have a place in my workout routine. Trap bar feels really natural, ergonomically speaking, for me. And I think we pick things up in that fashion very often.
It’s a thing you can make heavy and lift. Good enough for me.
So I just started doing the hex Bar today. I noticed I could do more of a squat. Then I noticed I could do it as a hip hinge. Turns out it can be either and depends on execution, not the bar
Does the trap bar help you make your bed?