Point of order: Tarmogoyf's maximum base stats are now 9/10. There are now nine card types: artifact, battle, creature, enchantment, instant, land, planeswalker, sorcery, and tribal.
Note for time travelers, as of MH3, instances of tribal across the game have been errata'd to kindred. All tribal/kindred cards are the same type. Just a change to the wording, no change to the way it works. It is still a card type, not a super type.
I thought of ‘goyf, but since it isn’t a 0/1 I didn’t count it. I guess it technically is a 0/1, but since the stat block is */1+* I don’t consider it a 0/1.
My only thing is Tarmogoyf isn't a 0/1 the same way the others are. Every other card on the list, even if they aren't always staying there, have a written PT of 0/1. Tarmogoyf isn't a 0/1 by that metric. I may be wrong but don't these normally go off written power and toughness?
@@rogerstewart5525 "Yes, this card’s base power/toughness is -1/-1. If it has five +1/+1 counters on it, it’s a 4/4 creature." I love that this quote is an _official_ ruling. I have never seen an official ruling sound so exasperated.
I can definitely think of *one* statline that's worse than a 0/1. A 0/0. But I can't think of anything better than "TOP 10 VINTAGE CARDS (MINUS POWER 9)"!
7:20 why doesn’t Signal Pest simply have Flying? That would be identical to what its second effect accomplishes, with the only difference being that it would be open to Flying-specific support and hate.
Signal Pest can't be used to block flying creatures, which is a large part of why it is worded like that. It does dodge a few pieces of flying removal that way as well, which that block had some ok flying specific removal.
From the Commander side of things, I'd also like to give a shoutout to the mvp Rograkh, Son of Rohgahh. Whether he's just an on-demand free body for sacrifice into bigger plays, there to give you access to red spells or swinging for damage, he's an absolutely fantastic card, though I don't have any tournament results to back it up with. I just love pairing him with Ardenn, Intrepid Archaeologist and watching this weenie 0/1 win with commander damage.
I saw Signal Pest come on screen and wondered why Wizards gave it that second ability instead of just Flying. I had thought maybe it was a weird old design policy, and clearly its Oracle text would have been updated to just give it Flying. But no. I would say that it avoids targeted Flying-removal, but most of those can also target Artifacts. I guess it has a niche that it keeps “flying” when equipped with a Colossus Hammer?
Hahaha I've been away from magic for awhile but occasionally come back to watch videos on it. I only pay attention to the lore and still enjoy looking up spoilers. When I saw the number 1 card and seen the price NOT be insane (not even over $15!) was more of a shocker than the actual number 1 card for me.
You made a minor error. You said that Goyf can now be an 8/9 with Battles but actually it's now a 9/10. Also other than the Goyf which I didn't think you'd count, i got most of the list right. Just in the wrong order...
Do you sappose they may produce a third Exhalted? Their both green mana, but Exhalted belonged to Bant and thier colors are W-B-G. So, will we get one with a blue mana cost? Maybe?
Small nitpick that will save you a lot of grief in the long run: the shorthand for Blue in mana symbols is "U," "B" indicates a Black mana symbol. It's been this way longer than a sizable portion of the player base has been alive, and is why "WUBRG" is the shorthand for a 5 color casting cost, or mana production (like on Ramos...).
I liked Clever Luminacer from Strixhaven. I built my first modern deck based on her. The magecraft mechanic is very simular to prowess and you can make a decent cheap modern deck based on these two ablities.
From the rulings in Gatherer: "The ability that defines Tarmogoyf's power and toughness works in all zones, not just the battlefield. If Tarmogoyf is in your graveyard, it will count itself." So it's technically a card with variable power and toughness. Not a 0/1 that gets +1/+1 bonuses.
@@tomatus270389 Isnt that the same for all creatures. All creatures power and toughness may be affected by board state. But Goyf's base power and toughness in a neutral state is 0/1. Which is how we define base. At the end of the day, it has stars printed but it could also be 0/1.
i really like that the list is how good cards have been historically, rather than this moment in time! 5:47 you mean veil of summer? bruh that #1 is such a bait
I would be interested to see a top 10 with top 10 non-land cards. The power 9 would maybe be high but is it actually higher than something legal in modern or legacy?
Probably; despite being limited in which formats you can play in; in the one officially sanctioned format you can play with them; they always show up in up in 8 out of the top 8 slots.
in some of nizzahon's other lists you can see the power 9's stats and they do all have incredibly high scores due to appearing in almost every single vintage deck that has ever top 8'd a tournament
The Exhalted get the points ahead of the Birds becouse the Bird is becouse, OUTSIDE of producing mana, it's just a flying Chump Blocker; but the Exhalteds do that, and help with your offensive power.
Do Enchantress Decks see so little play that Argothian Enchantress didn't make the list? To be fair it's only legal in the eternal formats but I would've liked to know how many points she has
Argothian Enchantress does see play, but being that Legacy has so few events in combination with Enchantress being a very meta-dependent deck, it wouldn’t have a very high score. And if you think about its Standard environment… it would have been competing against Cradle and Academy decks.
If you look for 0/1 on Oracle, Tarmogoyf comes up. It is a 0/1 with empty graveyards. It isn't that big of a stretch, not any more than something like Voracious Hydra.
Dear Nizzahon. I like to watch this series and thank you for that. Although I do not know how much work exactly you have to invest for one of the lists and where you get the data from I think you manage to provide interesting lists. but as far as i can tell from your education, i think you are aware that your lists are not truly bests of lists of best cards in magic. you kind of legitimze the ratings by the seemingly hard facts of a system based on points accumulated in competitve play. do you think i am the only one interested how you think about setting your parameters disregarding possible time in competitive play, meta at time, legalities in formats and therefore possibilities to get points and most importantly bannings and other factors? i sure would like to hear your thoughts and why you chose the name of your vids this way and how to came to settle on your system of points. all the best
I can't believe Birds wasn't #1 by like 200 points. It was THE mana-dork unless you were playing elf-tribal. Noble Hierarch makes a little sense as a successor but you have to play it Turn 1, your opponent doesn't have a 1-drop, and you don't have a 2 or 3-drop on Turn 2. Seems narrow.
@@crawdaddy1234 Would a green ramp deck have a 3-drop that would attack solo on Turn 4? Exalted needs either a quick body or a big body. My attempts at green ramp had quick, mid-range combo pieces, and the big stompies, so I wouldn't want the mid-range pieces to attack solo into anything but an empty board.
@@woodysmith2681 How would your 3-drop not attack alone on turn 3? Unless you played a creature with haste, you only have the 3-drop to attack with. And moreover, what would a Birds of Paradise be doing better? It can chump block a flier? Very few decks are actually five colors, so the benefit of Birds is pretty minimal. And remember that Exalted triggers stack. If you have two Hierarchs, the attacker gets +2/+2. Also, it works while it’s tapped, so it provides double utility in the same turn.
@@crawdaddy1234 Haven't built a ramp in years, so stacking the triggers makes sense. My line of reasoning (dated as it is) was that you can use (Ig)Noble Hierarch in limited ways on three-color decks, as opposed to Birds, where the choice could matter.
@@woodysmith2681 If you haven’t built a deck like that in a long time, your comment about color fixing makes a lot of sense. However, color fixing is incredibly easy nowadays. We have the Trioms dual/shock lands, Horizon lands (e.g., Fiery Islet or Horizon Canopy), fetch lands, Pathways, fast lands(e.g., Darkslick Shores), etc. Decks need oomph more than they need fixing, and Hierarch gives that.
Tarmogoyf seems an odd addition to this list as he never hits the battlefield as a O/1, then again that is the mark of many 0/1s they get pumped up the second they hit the battlefield or else are easily pumped by other factors. The rest tap for mana.
SPOILERS:
As has been pointed out, Tarmogoyf's max size is 9/10. Apparently I can't count.
It's OK you just forgot about tribal being a card type like most players do
Tribal is such nonsense "type" 😭
Point of order: Tarmogoyf's maximum base stats are now 9/10. There are now nine card types: artifact, battle, creature, enchantment, instant, land, planeswalker, sorcery, and tribal.
Note for time travelers, as of MH3, instances of tribal across the game have been errata'd to kindred. All tribal/kindred cards are the same type. Just a change to the wording, no change to the way it works. It is still a card type, not a super type.
I really appreciate that when you mention a combo, you show it on the screen.
Cool
Not gonna lie: I totally whiffed.
I thought for sure it was going to be Birds, I ABSOLUTELY forgot about Tarmogoyf.
I thought about him but was like "Nah, dat boy is */*+1, those not zeroes."
yeah me too. maybe it is because it's not a 0/1.
I forgot Goyf too, but even after seeing it, I'm surprised it beat out BoP.
I thought of ‘goyf, but since it isn’t a 0/1 I didn’t count it. I guess it technically is a 0/1, but since the stat block is */1+* I don’t consider it a 0/1.
You were right
I must say that I had actually forgot some of those cards were actually 0/1, since I only ever focused on their abilities.
My only thing is Tarmogoyf isn't a 0/1 the same way the others are. Every other card on the list, even if they aren't always staying there, have a written PT of 0/1. Tarmogoyf isn't a 0/1 by that metric. I may be wrong but don't these normally go off written power and toughness?
Just wanted to bring up; it was Veil of Summer in standard with Voracious Hydra, not Veil of Autumn
Its autumn's veil iirc
Nizzahon: "0/1 is the worst statline."
0/0's: "Am I a joke to you?"
And don't forget spinal parasite.
@@rogerstewart5525 Oh wow, that’s one goofy card
@@rogerstewart5525 "Yes, this card’s base power/toughness is -1/-1. If it has five +1/+1 counters on it, it’s a 4/4 creature."
I love that this quote is an _official_ ruling. I have never seen an official ruling sound so exasperated.
I can definitely think of *one* statline that's worse than a 0/1. A 0/0. But I can't think of anything better than "TOP 10 VINTAGE CARDS (MINUS POWER 9)"!
There's one even worse than that: -1/-1. Looking at you, Spinal Parasite.
Force of Savagery (8/0) has a pretty bad statline
@@crovax1375 It has an awesome statline for my Kresh commander deck!
#8 I was unaware that Akoum Hellhound was basically a reprint of another card.
7:20 why doesn’t Signal Pest simply have Flying? That would be identical to what its second effect accomplishes, with the only difference being that it would be open to Flying-specific support and hate.
Signal Pest can't be used to block flying creatures, which is a large part of why it is worded like that. It does dodge a few pieces of flying removal that way as well, which that block had some ok flying specific removal.
@@Seveah I see. Thank you.
From the Commander side of things, I'd also like to give a shoutout to the mvp Rograkh, Son of Rohgahh. Whether he's just an on-demand free body for sacrifice into bigger plays, there to give you access to red spells or swinging for damage, he's an absolutely fantastic card, though I don't have any tournament results to back it up with. I just love pairing him with Ardenn, Intrepid Archaeologist and watching this weenie 0/1 win with commander damage.
Tarmogoyf waits patiently for new card types to be created. Perhaps one day it will have the potential to be a 20/21 with a stocked graveyard!
And it will be achievable with 8 actual cards total in gaveyards, starting with an artifact creature land.
Taking bets on how long before One With Nothing becomes a viable combat trick with Goyf...
I saw Signal Pest come on screen and wondered why Wizards gave it that second ability instead of just Flying. I had thought maybe it was a weird old design policy, and clearly its Oracle text would have been updated to just give it Flying. But no.
I would say that it avoids targeted Flying-removal, but most of those can also target Artifacts. I guess it has a niche that it keeps “flying” when equipped with a Colossus Hammer?
No idea on the why, but the most relevant part about wording it this way is that it can't block flyers.
It can't block flyers. It's not a huge deal, but it would be a useful chump block at times, and makes it just a little weaker.
I was sat going to myself "what could possibly be better than birds of paradise?"
Turns out, I have a bad memory.
I like the quantifiable stats. I wish Commander has similar stats. Of course there’s EDHREC but you don’t know if the deck is any good 😂
Hahaha I've been away from magic for awhile but occasionally come back to watch videos on it. I only pay attention to the lore and still enjoy looking up spoilers. When I saw the number 1 card and seen the price NOT be insane (not even over $15!) was more of a shocker than the actual number 1 card for me.
Hey, Nizza! I have an idea for a Top 10.
Cards that clone or replicate themselves, such as Scute Swarm or Replicating Ring
Cronozooa !!
I think he did a video on clone cards actually
You made a minor error. You said that Goyf can now be an 8/9 with Battles but actually it's now a 9/10.
Also other than the Goyf which I didn't think you'd count, i got most of the list right. Just in the wrong order...
ah rip didn't see your comment before posting, in mine I listed all 9, I assume he forgot tribal is a supertype for some reason
I had a fun janky deck on arena with voracious hydra and yarok, the desecrated. It was fun to double the counters and fight at the same time.
And never forget the shear power that Steppe Lynx provides for the "Angry Kitties" deck.
Do you sappose they may produce a third Exhalted? Their both green mana, but Exhalted belonged to Bant and thier colors are W-B-G. So, will we get one with a blue mana cost?
Maybe?
Small nitpick that will save you a lot of grief in the long run: the shorthand for Blue in mana symbols is "U," "B" indicates a Black mana symbol.
It's been this way longer than a sizable portion of the player base has been alive, and is why "WUBRG" is the shorthand for a 5 color casting cost, or mana production (like on Ramos...).
@@andrewamann2821 SMALL NITPICK.
I'm surprised you included tarmogoyf. I wouldn't call it a 0/1, i would call it a */*+1
top 10 suggestion. creatures with pseudo-flying or gliding, like the Signal pest.
What about a top 10 -x/-x cards? Just would have to have that line somewhere on the card
I love Xantid swarm, had it in an insect tribal deck I built
I liked Clever Luminacer from Strixhaven. I built my first modern deck based on her. The magecraft mechanic is very simular to prowess and you can make a decent cheap modern deck based on these two ablities.
I thought for sure Birds would beat Goyf to number 1 because it's been here since Alpha. It's crazy it's managed top it.
I don't think Tarmogoyf it's technically a 0/1. But close enough, I think it's still OK to include it in the list.
From the rulings in Gatherer: "The ability that defines Tarmogoyf's power and toughness works in all zones, not just the battlefield. If Tarmogoyf is in your graveyard, it will count itself."
So it's technically a card with variable power and toughness. Not a 0/1 that gets +1/+1 bonuses.
@@tomatus270389 Yeah Goyf just isn't a 0/1 by definition
@@tomatus270389 Isnt that the same for all creatures. All creatures power and toughness may be affected by board state. But Goyf's base power and toughness in a neutral state is 0/1. Which is how we define base. At the end of the day, it has stars printed but it could also be 0/1.
i really like that the list is how good cards have been historically, rather than this moment in time!
5:47 you mean veil of summer?
bruh that #1 is such a bait
What about the 8/0 from Future Sight?
An 8/0 isn’t a 0/1 ^^‘
I remember when Tarmogoyf was first shown a lot of players weren't sure it was any good...
Tarmogoyph can get to 9/10 now thx to Battles, not 8/9, they don't print new Tribal cards but they still exist as a card type.
The errata hasn't been updated yet. No mention of battles.
@@TheLuminousCleric Reminder text isn't rules text. Battles are a card type, and so grow the goyf.
In my opinion 1/0 is far worse Base statline because anything would die in an Instant
Steppe Lynx is the same card as Akoum Hellhound, so I would have included the Hellhound in that slot alongside Lynx even if it didn't get any points.
Wow. Would have sworn that argothian enchantress would appear. Did you miss it nizza? Or it actually wasn't that important?
It has fewer than 10 points
But wait, Tarmogoyf isn’t a 0/1, it’s a 3/4!
Sorry, a 4/5.
Sorry, a 5/6.
Does battle count towards Tarmogoyf now?
I would be interested to see a top 10 with top 10 non-land cards. The power 9 would maybe be high but is it actually higher than something legal in modern or legacy?
Probably; despite being limited in which formats you can play in; in the one officially sanctioned format you can play with them; they always show up in up in 8 out of the top 8 slots.
in some of nizzahon's other lists you can see the power 9's stats and they do all have incredibly high scores due to appearing in almost every single vintage deck that has ever top 8'd a tournament
Came for the bird and stayed for the bird
The Exhalted get the points ahead of the Birds becouse the Bird is becouse, OUTSIDE of producing mana, it's just a flying Chump Blocker; but the Exhalteds do that, and help with your offensive power.
Surprised argothian enchantress was not on the list
Gonna refer the HELL out this video... when I get friends....
You could say the 11th card on the list fought Voracious Hydra... and lost^^
Birds can unfortunately chump block Teeka's Dragon
I would totally watch a video all about birds.
Which card would get the 10 spot if Noble Hierarch and Ignoble Hierarch were combined into one?
I'd say that Force of Savagery has the worst stat line!
Goyf can be a 9/10. Creature, Land, Instant, Sorcery, Artifact, Planeswalker, Enchantment, Battle and Tribal.
You've done top 10 token generators, but how about top 10 token types? Like 1/1 white soldier, 2/2 black zombie, manifest, etc
Morph/manifest aren't token types...
I think goyf can hit 9/10 now? Creature, Land, instant, sorcery, planeswalker, battle, tribal, artifact, enchantment. Yea 9/10
Does Tribal count?
Isn't it a super type, like Legendary?
It is literally in its reminder text.
Do Enchantress Decks see so little play that Argothian Enchantress didn't make the list? To be fair it's only legal in the eternal formats but I would've liked to know how many points she has
She has 7 points.
Argothian Enchantress does see play, but being that Legacy has so few events in combination with Enchantress being a very meta-dependent deck, it wouldn’t have a very high score.
And if you think about its Standard environment… it would have been competing against Cradle and Academy decks.
Can’t believe Signal Pest didn’t get any points for four years.
For some reason, Nizza always calls Veil of Summer, "Veil of Autumn." He must be getting it mixed up with Autumns Veil.
I would love a deck history of decks birds of paradise have top 8ed in
You are wrong about tarmogoyf: it can be 9/10 now (you probably forgot that Tribal is also a card type)
Tarmogoyf, the best 0/1, 1/2, 2/3, 3/4, 4/5, 5/6, 6/7, 7/8, 8/9, 9/10 in the game.
I can't wrap my head around the fact that Tarmogoyf is a vanilla creature! With all the power creep it's definitely NOT the best creature in Magic!
I don’t agree that Goyf is a 0/1, nice list otherwise!
Can we get a Hammer time history video plz?
No Lonis, Cryiptozoologist? come on, I know the 1/2 is a lot but the ability of stealing your opponent's permanents is just too good
Will o Wisp slight here. Only 21 points to get it on the list.
Ignoble is great. I use them in modern jund
I can't believe Noble Hierarch is only 12 bucks.
Wow, slap me silly, even more shocked Tarm is worth a buck more. HFS.
DO BEST 0/0s! Those do happen to exist, i just dk how many would make a list
I don't think it's fair to include Tarmogoyf as it's not a 0/1. It's a */1+*
If you look for 0/1 on Oracle, Tarmogoyf comes up. It is a 0/1 with empty graveyards. It isn't that big of a stretch, not any more than something like Voracious Hydra.
‘Goyf can get to a 9/10. You forgot Tribal (Bitterblossom).
I didn't forget it, I just can't count.
@@NizzahonMagic 😂
I appreciate the self-deprecating humor.
Oh boy it's 1 am
Uhm Affinity decks still definitely exist in modern, they just run the 8-cast and saga style lists now.
Tarmo doesn't say 0/1 on it though.
steppe lynx is amazing
Now let’s look that the best 0/0 cards
Dear Nizzahon. I like to watch this series and thank you for that. Although I do not know how much work exactly you have to invest for one of the lists and where you get the data from I think you manage to provide interesting lists.
but as far as i can tell from your education, i think you are aware that your lists are not truly bests of lists of best cards in magic. you kind of legitimze the ratings by the seemingly hard facts of a system based on points accumulated in competitve play.
do you think i am the only one interested how you think about setting your parameters disregarding possible time in competitive play, meta at time, legalities in formats and therefore possibilities to get points and most importantly bannings and other factors? i sure would like to hear your thoughts and why you chose the name of your vids this way and how to came to settle on your system of points. all the best
Tarmogoyf in list is math mistake. * not equal 0.
He isn't banned in every format, just Modern...as the video says.
0/1: 🥰
1/0: 💀
I can't believe Birds wasn't #1 by like 200 points. It was THE mana-dork unless you were playing elf-tribal. Noble Hierarch makes a little sense as a successor but you have to play it Turn 1, your opponent doesn't have a 1-drop, and you don't have a 2 or 3-drop on Turn 2. Seems narrow.
But you forget that it has the potential to do something relevant if you top deck it on turn 4. It can allow an attack that wasn’t possible before.
@@crawdaddy1234 Would a green ramp deck have a 3-drop that would attack solo on Turn 4? Exalted needs either a quick body or a big body. My attempts at green ramp had quick, mid-range combo pieces, and the big stompies, so I wouldn't want the mid-range pieces to attack solo into anything but an empty board.
@@woodysmith2681 How would your 3-drop not attack alone on turn 3? Unless you played a creature with haste, you only have the 3-drop to attack with. And moreover, what would a Birds of Paradise be doing better? It can chump block a flier? Very few decks are actually five colors, so the benefit of Birds is pretty minimal.
And remember that Exalted triggers stack. If you have two Hierarchs, the attacker gets +2/+2.
Also, it works while it’s tapped, so it provides double utility in the same turn.
@@crawdaddy1234 Haven't built a ramp in years, so stacking the triggers makes sense. My line of reasoning (dated as it is) was that you can use (Ig)Noble Hierarch in limited ways on three-color decks, as opposed to Birds, where the choice could matter.
@@woodysmith2681 If you haven’t built a deck like that in a long time, your comment about color fixing makes a lot of sense. However, color fixing is incredibly easy nowadays. We have the Trioms dual/shock lands, Horizon lands (e.g., Fiery Islet or Horizon Canopy), fetch lands, Pathways, fast lands(e.g., Darkslick Shores), etc. Decks need oomph more than they need fixing, and Hierarch gives that.
I think you meant BEST stat line
What is the WORST 0/1?
My pick: Camel
i don't think tarmogoyf belongs on this list
Tarmogoyf seems an odd addition to this list as he never hits the battlefield as a O/1, then again that is the mark of many 0/1s they get pumped up the second they hit the battlefield or else are easily pumped by other factors. The rest tap for mana.
Worst Stat line? I think 0/1 is better than 8/0
what are you doing steppe lynx? uwu
Finally!
#TeamRograkh
Now do 0/0 creatures
9/10
cool
Goya doesn’t count.
I'm glad you can appreciate the flavor behind Xantid Swarm. I know you're not a fan of bees/hornets.
I would not count Tharmogoyf as 0/1. Seems like a strange decision.
Oracle counted it when I searched for 0/1s, and it is what it is with empty graveyards.