My husband calls those churches "drive through churches" you go in on Sunday and get some feel goods and get back to your life and never experience conviction of the Spirit or ever meet Jesus. There is no denial of Christ once you meet Him. But in feel good churches you don't really submit your soul to Christ. And when you do you are hungry for Christ and for His word and studying the Word is exciting. My husband and I would stay up every night after going to college courses on divinity and we would revisit the whole day's coursework. I now have trouble with churches that don't offer meat but only milk of the word. I want that deeper learning but most churches don't offer it.
Very well said! Thank you for that. I am very wary of any Christian who is seeking experiences as opposed to studying and knowing the true supernatural word of God. That is enough “supernatural” for me!
@@vincestapleton703 We were encouraged to be all about the Feelings growing up on a church that was progressive when we still thought Liberal was the right word. If a person at your church laughs and asks why you brought your Bible ? Go home! ;) I'm so grateful my young Mom was seeking God so diligently, digging into the Bible, sharing with me as she learned. If not for my Mom, I really don't want to think where I'd be.
I have a lot suspicion for Megachurches or churches who try to sell you with material stuff. I prefer smaller churches with a lot of meat in their message. Churches who are interested in changing lives spiritually through a strong bibically inspirired message. I find these churches are satisfied with being smaller or a moderate membership. It's quality not quanity. The few members who are gifted the most, go out and form their own churches and so on. A good example of this is the Calvary church movement in the 70's. It wasn't always perfect but for the most part it works. This is how it was in the early church. Church leaders need to remember why they are there. Humility is key and remembering these good things come from the grace of God and his will, not us. God is always soviergn. Totally agree.
Many do deny Christ, just to put it out there. The Bible says it. I totally agree that the idea of a "feel good" church is dangerous to the concept of true faith. This is why I also am learning when to step back, when someone keeps rejecting my explaining the Bible, and why certain things they do need edifying, or even just why I won't do those things, and they get upset. I was once a "Christian" that cherry picked and decided I could be Christian and agnostic. Nope. I was not truly a Christian - I had no idea what to TRULY meant to have that relationship with Christ, and to accept salvation meaning it wholly. Not what I think many do when they aren't ready and like the "feel good"- they might "yeah whatever , Jesus save me! Ta da!" But it's not true. We can't KNOW this of course, but judge by the fruits and actions. But I think it's a sad place open to a LOT of deception when trying to dip a toe in. I no longer encourage that, if someone is persistently against Bible study for more than a few talks about Christianity I will question outright why they say they are "Christian", what that means to them, then move on. I pray for them but I think it's a sign they are not ready and I cannot help them be ready, I can only share what they are ready to receive. Christ, Almighty God chooses to give us free will to accept or deny him. So apologetically it makes no sense to me to open someone up to that vulnerability if they are going to cherry pick. Just having been there and talked with others who have...I think people that are sort of in/sort of out are more easily deceived. Just like the guy in the video insinuates that was good for him, but I questioned it when he implied that Christians don't sin. 😢 That's not Biblically accurate. I am praying for my father at this time. He's one who claims Christianity but beyond "believing in Jesus" in his own way....whoever he thinks Jesus is....I don't know how he defines it. He gets very triggered by my asking him to read the Bible. I asked him to stop sharing new age stuff with me. I think he thought it was funny and "this is what you're doing". I had stopped sharing the Bible already. Out of respect. But he keeps pushing videos and such he thinks is good. I take those opportunities to politely share something similar but Biblical with him and to explain why it's different, why I prefer one to the other. ❤ If I can't do that then I leave it entirely to the holy spirit!
@@theLionandtheLamb1 I like Answers in Genesis channel and website for adding some inspiration to my week for Bible study and even historical study of events of the Bible. But I also would join a Messianic Synagogue if I were to try to return to in person service. They seem to be the most Biblically committed. They even have Hebrew and I have been studying on my own before this, to read older TaNak/Old Testament texts myself, and the Hebrew translation of Gospels. Eventually ancient Hebrew would be neat! My husband is studying Greek and I think it would be awesome if we could encourage others to join in Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic. The Synagogue has Hebrew classes but also Spanish translation for their Shabbat service. So they are definitely into that stuff! Seem like my kind of people. Even more crazy to me is how often they are not counted amongst Christian groups, but they are. LOL and gentiles are welcome. I can't help but wonder if that's the deceiver at work, because he knows they are GOOD❤
Something I came to understand is that, when your only goal is to be positive, you must completely remove yourself from the pain of others. This leaves exactly zero room for empathy, sympathy or kindness in the face of another's hardship. In fact, you may even find yourself blaming them for circumstances that are, in fact, outside of their control. This seems to me a special kind of hard heartedness rooted in absolute selfishness.
True. It also makes you unaware of your own pain and challenges. The Bible says in several ways, that we need challenges and pain to make us stronger. Hard work can feel painful/negative. But we are supposed to grow. The verse often taken out of context; "spare the rod, spoil the child". This is not about physical punishment. It's about a parent doing their JOB to parent. To GUIDE. The shepherd's rod used to guide sheep. Not to beat them. It's hard work for the parent to pay attention, be diligent and to lead vs punish when things go wrong. Also to have the child learn and GO where corrected to go, how to go. To expect them to also put work in. Not to simply be carried to where they need to go. I think there is also knowledge around that verse about having children learn practical work and to not be lazy. But it's been a while might be another part of the Bible I'm thinking of. Throughout the Bible, we see people giving up comforts that tempt them, but also celebrating in moderation when God wills it- such as with some of the holy days like Sukkot-- (when Jesus was born BTW according to scholars that make a lot of sense....) , but these celebrations followed harvests in the fields, and looking back on works of patience and endurance as well. Hanukah which is not a holy day(s) but reason to celebrate for sure! Then the holy days that can be celebrated by Christians of our waiting for Christ and working to repent. Repentance should be FACING one's negative doings and thought, to correct. You can't edify yourself let alone others if you can't face negativity. And also this is unhealthy, not kind, and not safe! ❤ Today people are often obsessed with avoiding any pain or conflict for fear of rejection, or that the pain and negativity equates to the extreme of bad is bad. There's no recognition of the path from bad TO good. And that the path to damnation can be filled with good intentions.
Wow this is one of the best interviews on the subject i have ever heard. I am friends with a LOA 'christian' who is into this sort of thing. We both grew up in the 80s in christian families back when churches used to teach the bible. I want to send her this interview but i know she won't listen to it bcuz it will be negative to her and she gets very angry at me when i try to talk to her about ANYTHING that isn't joyful. So there is a solid brick wall now between us. This is one of the most nefarious things and to think it infiltrated itself into the church is just,,, i have no words.
Pray for God to guide you to reach her in his will. I have several friends I am working to find words and how to handle in a way that will not push them further into the abyss. Praying to remember to ask more questions to cause them to think.
Thank you for sharing! I practiced the law of attraction for years and it did work (some wild stories) but at a terrible cost. I became isolated and my mental health plummeted. It’s very very dangerous. Fortunately, I turned to Jesus, now have peace, and my mind is being renewed. 🧡 (Funny thing is I’d make lists of what I desired and I’d receive everything on that list except what I dreamed of the most which was a husband. I never found my husband while practicing the law of attraction yet the moment I came to Christ, I was blessed with an amazing husband.)
I have asked God for signs and many times they happened. Like a sign in blue and next day I found a sapphire ring! Also a sign in yellow to show he forgave me and I saw a cloud of gold finches fly by. But In both circumstances I gave thanks to God and never thought I had any power in convincing God to do my will. I also don't like the practice of Christians saying "I declare" or "I decree!" as an order to God.
Mr. Clash, appreciate your definition of the Law of Attraction. I had wondered what it truly meant. It reminds of persons that have blind optimism or faith in faith rather than faith in Christ. Enjoyed your interview with Melissa and the clarity you provided. Thank You. - Deborah, Orange Co SoCal
I looked into Hindu faith so I could talk to my Indian friend better about Christianity. This Law of Attraction seems to have a lot of Hinduism and Gnosticism in it!
I've known quite a few "law of attraction" followers, and as a result, began to be drawn to it myself. But then I started to notice that any time something didnt go the way they would have liked, they became completely unhinged. I found this very disturbing and quickly realized that this way of living is not based in reality. I thank God for opening my eyes.
I loved this conversation Melissa! Thank you for desiring to reveal the truth in the midst of our evolving-away society; uncovering the lies of the enemy... 2 Timothy 4:3-5 "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry."
Who knew my mother was right all along? Isn't this essentially the meaning of "stiff upper lip?" Put on your lipstick and smile. Everything is just fine (even though everything is falling apart).
Thanks for talking about the distinction (or not distinction) between positive confession in the church and law of attraction. I’d love even more as I see some “borderline” law of attraction talk sometimes.
I feel into the same belief that Shannon D. Did. The secret fooled me so I stared practicing is 8 yrs ago. I thought it was a hidden law. I started meditating and it wasn’t long before the demonic showed up. I repented fast and got away from it fast!!
This was really helpful. My dad was really into this type of belief, before it was called LOA. He himself was negative but wouldn’t tolerate it from anyone else. My brother is very immersed in all this, it is really hard to just have a conversation sometimes🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
I’ve never heard of the law of attraction, and I’m glad I haven’t. I’ve been to church every Sunday of my life, pretty much. I’m a PK, but I was 49 years old before I got saved by Grace, through faith, not of my works. That was in July of 2009. I started studying the Bible, God’s way, rightly dividing the Word of truth. The rest is history!! God bless you in your ministry.
I am so glad you talked about people thinking older is better or more true. I had never heard the idea that any religion was older than Christianity until my old manager said it and treated it like that was a duh everyone knows that kind of thought. At the time I didnt know how to respond because I was stuck on where did you hear that and how could you think that? Some people really act the reformation was the origin of Christianity and ignore where it started. I mean the term Christian goes back to biblical times when the church started when we still had Peter and Paul, etc.
When we get right to it. We have to ask ourselves is what does God want us to do and why. We are supposedly getting ready for another plane of exsitance. How rich we are and material matters are largely irrellivant. What matters is what is our spiritual relationship with God.
Yep Amen! They sure can! And they can turn that one blue feather into two blue feathers into 3 blue feathers, into an entire patch of 4 leaf clovers to distract you and play keep away with you. What am I going to do with a box full of feathers or a jar of cloves lol if I don’t have Jesus?
Funny dichotomy. Jon (rightly, imo) points out the respect people have for "older" things - and yet, it occurs to me how often people use the Bible's age as a criticism against it! 🤷♀️
So true, many say it is old and we need to " evolve" with the times, but yet say this. Also, God was in existence way before anything or any other made up belief systems.
Thank You! I had been wondering about The Law of Success by Napoleon Hill. My Dad had bought it for me before kids, and he doesn't necessarily buy me lots of things, so it's easier to cherish, when he does. (Whoa, we are very similar) I have been asking God to show me specific items that don't serve me, that I can free my home from God distracting things. It was really erie to skim through the chapter list, and see at the very end "the Golden Rule". The entire book seemed like a forgery of the Bible. Leaving out the most important parts!!
Wow this was a great video! Yes yes yes! Thank you for touching on all of this! The church is so deceived right now. We’ve got to be more aware of where these things are originating from!
Excellent guest... been following both Melissa and Jon for quite awhile and glad to see them connect.. appreciate both their ministries very much. Thank you both! GmaJo Keeping it Real (in Faith and Truth) 🙏🏻❤️
The biggest reason I don't agree with this practice is that we would be taking the will of God out of your desires. God will sometimes give us what we want to guide us into something we need to learn. God's will to be done 1st and always.
I have a very large family and only three if us are Christian but just about everyone is into the Law of Attraction. We were planning a sledding gathering and our online family chat was full of admonition to think of snow and manifest it.
Fabulous interview I could listen to this all morning. It is so amazing how much this permeates society and the church. Would love to hear another or more interviews with Jon. Thank you Melissa ♥
This is good information. I'm glad that you covered the fact that the law of attraction doesn't talk about the actual work needed to accomplish or to get the things you are seeking. I liked the part about the law of attraction is really a satanic counterfeit. That rang true to me and made sense. Thank you.
Helana Patrovna Blavatskie. Who founded the Theosophical Society. Seems to be one of.if not the originator of the law of attraction thing. Probably came through a lot of other philosophy as well. But what I am seeing is that the people who practice that. Use it for the exact opposite. When dealing with other people. Your not like me. So you are bad. And they label you as someone to keep away from. Because you are going to cause bad things. No forgiveness. And a lot of them call themselves Christian. Sad
Could you give a list of "Christian" authors or preachers who teach these lies of Law of Attraction. I know a few like Caroline Leaf and TD Jakes and most NAR preachers.
Can you please provide a clip either written or video where Lavey says this about new age. I would love to have this at a tool when I am evangelizing about this topic and was unable to find this exact quote so far. Thank You!
To the friends who like the law of attraction: read Job. Read Daniel. Read about the abuses of Jesus. I think the old name for this (in part) was name and claim it.
Melissa, do you think praying scripture is possibly the same thing, for example praying specific bible verses to gain outcomes we want, like success with a ministry, growth in faith, or salvation of others?
You shouldn't be praying scripture to get a desired outcome, you should be praying scripture to line yourself up with the mind of Christ and God's desires for you
If you think about it, the Book of Psalms has been the major prayer book of the Church for 2000 years (just as it was the prayer book in Judaism in the days of Jesus, and before that). The difference to the Law of Attraction is that Christians don't pray specific Psalms or Bible verses in order to gain anything. We pray those verses and Psalms because they verbalize our thoughts much better than we are able to do by ourselves, because they correct us and line us up with the mind of Christ, and because we "remind" God about His promises. Whether those things we are praying for happen or not, that's up to God.
As someone who considers themselves spiritual and not Christian I appreciate your channel. I kind of wish we could have a discussion because I disagree so much yet I am very thankful for opposing points of view. We're all on our own journey. Much respect to you. This was an interesting discussion, but not very insightful from where I am today. I disagree alot with what you both are saying but also agree on other things. It would be alot to comment on. Just wanna send love and thanks!
Just to let you know - The Catalysm of the Kingdom of Heaven provides a great basic orthodoxy for Christianity. It also addresses the faults of other belief systems especially the tendencies of polytheism which is really what the Law of Attraction falls under. It also has a very orthodox statement of faith.
Panentheism simply means that God is present everywhere in creation. God is also outside of creation, aka transcends creation. In other words, creation is not God. Pan = all, entheos = God within. God is present in everything, because he created everything. But yes, it is definitely twisted by occultists to mean that God being in creation is somehow the same as humans being God. Other than that, great talk, and I agree with everything you're talking about, as an ex "New Ager".
@@angietorok8389 Correct. But you are *physically unable* to be present in your sculptures, because you're not God. You have a *physical body* that limits you in time and space. God has no such limitations because he transcends time and space. Or are you saying that God is limited? It's also kind of weird that you're comparing yourself to God. 😅🙈 You also insinuate that you don't have the Holy Spirit in you, since, you know, God not being present in his creation and all.
As stated in the video, there are practically two wings of panentheism. One wing could be translated as "omnipresence", and as such it is a part of Christian worldview (similar presentation appears in the apologies of Aristides and Athenagoras of Athena in the 2nd century). But the other wing of panentheism basically claims that all existence has "a sort of spark of divinity"... and this idea is typical for Gnosticism and strongly opposed by Christians throughout centuries.
Ironic but not really how during the interview ads interrupted for intuitive power courses by that Helen Haskell promoter guy whose voice I rush to mute and some other master class/“here’s how to interpret the Bible” ad. Tsk tsk. But not surprising.
Hey Melissa, I have a friend who is presently listening to, and following the teachings of Dr. Mark Paul Bishop, who uses/misuses scripture to teach that if you think positively about your health or circumstances, you can change the "physical" by speaking it, and believing it. He believes that you can speak your way to perfect health. Anyway, I have a hard time sharing with her because she will quickly shut me off, put up the defense walls, and tell me that she doesn't want to hear anything negative. She says that she's a Christian, and I don't doubt it, but she's fallen into some really questionable new age teachings (mascarating) as truth, in my opinion. What can I do to help her to see that this is not christianity or biblical, and see the truth? If you know anything about this Dr., can you share your thoughts and opinions? Thank you for your work.
- you mean the Laws of Attraction used by those sons of God that left their first estate - some even practiced in the churches as in so of the Law to that in the Letter
Another Great interview with Saint Jon to help many people understand how sneaky these doctrines are and adding more & more to it and different ways , & off shoots worldwide. Peace & Love to you both & your families. Amen. 😊❤.
Just a note that the book of Deuteronomy is the first book written by Moses to the Israelites in the past. For our learning today as Christians, but not directed towards Christians today.
We DO worship Yahweh described in Deuteronomy ch. 28. The point is that literally no single human being has ever obeyed God and His commandments as they have been intended to be obeyed. The real miracle is that God has allowed people to prosper *in spite of all lawlessness and unfaithfulness.* And as a matter of fact, "being blessed" doesn't exclusively or even primarily mean being productive and prosperous - worldly prosperity was meant to be a sign to other nations. But the real prosperity is to partake in the very life of God and His sufferings.
@@HomoEucharistica Then God truly is a evil narcissist monster and since God does not change then maybe Jesus is not who everyone thinks he is. Worshiping a God that makes mothers eat their children is horrifyingly wicked.
@@peertopeertherapy3720 It's quite the contrary, really. Literally only thing God is doing is to take His blessings away from people (who have already separated themselves from Him and ignored all warnings and calls to come back) and let them to be on their own. That naturally brings only misery and death - what else one could expect when he is casted away from the presence of the source of Life? Those people want a life without God, and a life without God is what they receive... and that's a life without Sun. They could return at any moment and everything could be fixed, restored and even uplifted (that's what God desires), but they systematically refuses to do such thing.
Your definition is incorrect. Please be honest to your viewers and subscribers. You're not really "attracting" anything....it's not like a magnet. The idea is physical reality is more like a mirror, not a magnet. What you put out, is what you get back. It's not about what you think, or say.....it's about how you feel, and behave. If you're feeling, and behaving like a victim, reality will just mirror back to you more ways to feel that way. Since you all worship Jesus, why not behave the way he did, so reality will reflect the love and compassion back to you? After all, he gave his life trying to tell you all this. This is what he meant when he said "I am the way....be the way". I can't think of any other way to be that I would want reflected back to me, could you? Please remember, this is always working, 24/7.....and if you're being dishonest to your viewers, others at some point in your life will be dishonest to you in the same way. It's just a mirror....it's the most fairest way to be, and nobody can escape it.
This guy just spent the entire interview knocking something that clearly is central to his life... as he was trying to knock the law of attraction he only reinforced it as a working and successful model of manifestation for him in his life. It is clear from hearing what is being said (not just hearing what one wants to hear) that his commitment to the process of manifestation brought him the fame he desired, the position he desired, the money he desired and so on (all this things being referred to in the context of subjectivity of course)... also it would seem to me that speaking of the law of manifestation, even if you do not agree or like it contributes to its presence and confirms its truth. Anyway, this guy is in denial of the fact that the law of manifestation is active and creating much of his life experience....
The law of Attraction works but it is a demonic power, it has nothing to do with God. It is openly in rebellion to God. True prayer is asking God for something and wanting to line up your desire with God's desire.
He is where he is because of his work ethic, just as he referred to his millionaire friends, they became wealthy because of the long hours of work, not the law of attraction. Same with Jon, he is becoming well known because of his commitment to spreading the truth, not because the law of attraction.
The loa never ends well. A person may obtain things( mostly because they are putting in the effort of getting the thing). But, when you have not made Jesus your savior and been born again saved, these things you acquire while doing your own thing, tend to not end well. Your life eventually becomes a mess.
If christianity is true there is a spirit that wants to prevent you in anyway possible from finding Jesus so even if he got it from spiritual means that speaks nothing unto whether loa is true or not
My husband calls those churches "drive through churches" you go in on Sunday and get some feel goods and get back to your life and never experience conviction of the Spirit or ever meet Jesus. There is no denial of Christ once you meet Him. But in feel good churches you don't really submit your soul to Christ. And when you do you are hungry for Christ and for His word and studying the Word is exciting. My husband and I would stay up every night after going to college courses on divinity and we would revisit the whole day's coursework. I now have trouble with churches that don't offer meat but only milk of the word. I want that deeper learning but most churches don't offer it.
Very well said!
Thank you for that.
I am very wary of any Christian who is seeking experiences as opposed to studying and knowing the true supernatural word of God.
That is enough “supernatural” for me!
@@vincestapleton703 We were encouraged to be all about the Feelings growing up on a church that was progressive when we still thought Liberal was the right word. If a person at your church laughs and asks why you brought your Bible ? Go home! ;) I'm so grateful my young Mom was seeking God so diligently, digging into the Bible, sharing with me as she learned. If not for my Mom, I really don't want to think where I'd be.
I have a lot suspicion for Megachurches or churches who try to sell you with material stuff. I prefer smaller churches with a lot of meat in their message. Churches who are interested in changing lives spiritually through a strong bibically inspirired message. I find these churches are satisfied with being smaller or a moderate membership. It's quality not quanity. The few members who are gifted the most, go out and form their own churches and so on. A good example of this is the Calvary church movement in the 70's. It wasn't always perfect but for the most part it works. This is how it was in the early church. Church leaders need to remember why they are there. Humility is key and remembering these good things come from the grace of God and his will, not us. God is always soviergn. Totally agree.
Many do deny Christ, just to put it out there. The Bible says it. I totally agree that the idea of a "feel good" church is dangerous to the concept of true faith.
This is why I also am learning when to step back, when someone keeps rejecting my explaining the Bible, and why certain things they do need edifying, or even just why I won't do those things, and they get upset.
I was once a "Christian" that cherry picked and decided I could be Christian and agnostic. Nope. I was not truly a Christian - I had no idea what to TRULY meant to have that relationship with Christ, and to accept salvation meaning it wholly. Not what I think many do when they aren't ready and like the "feel good"- they might "yeah whatever , Jesus save me! Ta da!" But it's not true.
We can't KNOW this of course, but judge by the fruits and actions. But I think it's a sad place open to a LOT of deception when trying to dip a toe in.
I no longer encourage that, if someone is persistently against Bible study for more than a few talks about Christianity I will question outright why they say they are "Christian", what that means to them, then move on. I pray for them but I think it's a sign they are not ready and I cannot help them be ready, I can only share what they are ready to receive.
Christ, Almighty God chooses to give us free will to accept or deny him.
So apologetically it makes no sense to me to open someone up to that vulnerability if they are going to cherry pick. Just having been there and talked with others who have...I think people that are sort of in/sort of out are more easily deceived.
Just like the guy in the video insinuates that was good for him, but I questioned it when he implied that Christians don't sin. 😢 That's not Biblically accurate.
I am praying for my father at this time. He's one who claims Christianity but beyond "believing in Jesus" in his own way....whoever he thinks Jesus is....I don't know how he defines it. He gets very triggered by my asking him to read the Bible.
I asked him to stop sharing new age stuff with me. I think he thought it was funny and "this is what you're doing". I had stopped sharing the Bible already. Out of respect. But he keeps pushing videos and such he thinks is good. I take those opportunities to politely share something similar but Biblical with him and to explain why it's different, why I prefer one to the other. ❤ If I can't do that then I leave it entirely to the holy spirit!
@@theLionandtheLamb1 I like Answers in Genesis channel and website for adding some inspiration to my week for Bible study and even historical study of events of the Bible. But I also would join a Messianic Synagogue if I were to try to return to in person service.
They seem to be the most Biblically committed. They even have Hebrew and I have been studying on my own before this, to read older TaNak/Old Testament texts myself, and the Hebrew translation of Gospels. Eventually ancient Hebrew would be neat! My husband is studying Greek and I think it would be awesome if we could encourage others to join in Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic. The Synagogue has Hebrew classes but also Spanish translation for their Shabbat service. So they are definitely into that stuff! Seem like my kind of people.
Even more crazy to me is how often they are not counted amongst Christian groups, but they are. LOL and gentiles are welcome. I can't help but wonder if that's the deceiver at work, because he knows they are GOOD❤
Something I came to understand is that, when your only goal is to be positive, you must completely remove yourself from the pain of others. This leaves exactly zero room for empathy, sympathy or kindness in the face of another's hardship. In fact, you may even find yourself blaming them for circumstances that are, in fact, outside of their control. This seems to me a special kind of hard heartedness rooted in absolute selfishness.
Bingo! I've always thought that it strips people of their humanity and empathy for others. Dangerous stuff. 🎯
💯
Beautifully said... Or creating your own reality your denying the reality outside of your own little bubble world.
This is a really good point. When you view things in the black and white of positive/negative, it completely skews the human experience
True. It also makes you unaware of your own pain and challenges. The Bible says in several ways, that we need challenges and pain to make us stronger. Hard work can feel painful/negative. But we are supposed to grow. The verse often taken out of context; "spare the rod, spoil the child". This is not about physical punishment. It's about a parent doing their JOB to parent. To GUIDE. The shepherd's rod used to guide sheep. Not to beat them.
It's hard work for the parent to pay attention, be diligent and to lead vs punish when things go wrong. Also to have the child learn and GO where corrected to go, how to go. To expect them to also put work in. Not to simply be carried to where they need to go.
I think there is also knowledge around that verse about having children learn practical work and to not be lazy. But it's been a while might be another part of the Bible I'm thinking of.
Throughout the Bible, we see people giving up comforts that tempt them, but also celebrating in moderation when God wills it- such as with some of the holy days like Sukkot-- (when Jesus was born BTW according to scholars that make a lot of sense....) , but these celebrations followed harvests in the fields, and looking back on works of patience and endurance as well. Hanukah which is not a holy day(s) but reason to celebrate for sure! Then the holy days that can be celebrated by Christians of our waiting for Christ and working to repent. Repentance should be FACING one's negative doings and thought, to correct.
You can't edify yourself let alone others if you can't face negativity. And also this is unhealthy, not kind, and not safe! ❤
Today people are often obsessed with avoiding any pain or conflict for fear of rejection, or that the pain and negativity equates to the extreme of bad is bad. There's no recognition of the path from bad TO good. And that the path to damnation can be filled with good intentions.
Wow this is one of the best interviews on the subject i have ever heard. I am friends with a LOA 'christian' who is into this sort of thing. We both grew up in the 80s in christian families back when churches used to teach the bible. I want to send her this interview but i know she won't listen to it bcuz it will be negative to her and she gets very angry at me when i try to talk to her about ANYTHING that isn't joyful. So there is a solid brick wall now between us. This is one of the most nefarious things and to think it infiltrated itself into the church is just,,, i have no words.
Pray for God to guide you to reach her in his will. I have several friends I am working to find words and how to handle in a way that will not push them further into the abyss. Praying to remember to ask more questions to cause them to think.
Thank you for sharing! I practiced the law of attraction for years and it did work (some wild stories) but at a terrible cost. I became isolated and my mental health plummeted. It’s very very dangerous.
Fortunately, I turned to Jesus, now have peace, and my mind is being renewed. 🧡
(Funny thing is I’d make lists of what I desired and I’d receive everything on that list except what I dreamed of the most which was a husband. I never found my husband while practicing the law of attraction yet the moment I came to Christ, I was blessed with an amazing husband.)
I have asked God for signs and many times they happened. Like a sign in blue and next day I found a sapphire ring! Also a sign in yellow to show he forgave me and I saw a cloud of gold finches fly by. But In both circumstances I gave thanks to God and never thought I had any power in convincing God to do my will. I also don't like the practice of Christians saying "I declare" or "I decree!" as an order to God.
Thanks so much for having me on!!!
Mr. Clash, appreciate your definition of the Law of Attraction. I had wondered what it truly meant. It reminds of persons that have blind optimism or faith in faith rather than faith in Christ. Enjoyed your interview with Melissa and the clarity you provided. Thank You.
- Deborah, Orange Co SoCal
@@deb4578 God bless you! Deborah is my mothers name!
Thank You!
Curious about how each of your sources relate to the Law of Success - Napoleon Hill.
His book did have a chapter on action.
@@cheerfulmouse- Napoleon Hill was one a huge scammer and was arrested multiple times.
@@cheerfulmouseone thing about Napoleon hill is he never even met Andrew Carnegie
I looked into Hindu faith so I could talk to my Indian friend better about Christianity. This Law of Attraction seems to have a lot of Hinduism and Gnosticism in it!
It’s all Eastern Mysticism with the same seducing spirits over it.
I've known quite a few "law of attraction" followers, and as a result, began to be drawn to it myself. But then I started to notice that any time something didnt go the way they would have liked, they became completely unhinged. I found this very disturbing and quickly realized that this way of living is not based in reality. I thank God for opening my eyes.
I loved this conversation Melissa! Thank you for desiring to reveal the truth in the midst of our evolving-away society; uncovering the lies of the enemy... 2 Timothy 4:3-5 "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry."
Who knew my mother was right all along? Isn't this essentially the meaning of "stiff upper lip?" Put on your lipstick and smile. Everything is just fine (even though everything is falling apart).
Thanks for talking about the distinction (or not distinction) between positive confession in the church and law of attraction. I’d love even more as I see some “borderline” law of attraction talk sometimes.
This is concerning to me how it creeps into the church and Christians lives. THanks for sharing this.
I feel into the same belief that Shannon D. Did. The secret fooled me so I stared practicing is 8 yrs ago. I thought it was a hidden law. I started meditating and it wasn’t long before the demonic showed up. I repented fast and got away from it fast!!
This was really helpful. My dad was really into this type of belief, before it was called LOA. He himself was negative but wouldn’t tolerate it from anyone else. My brother is very immersed in all this, it is really hard to just have a conversation sometimes🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
Yes my sister is in this heavy but she doesn’t see it !! Yes hard to conversate with her 😑
Yes my sister is negative Nancy but she would not allow you to speak negative about anything !! Totally feel you !!
I’ve never heard of the law of attraction, and I’m glad I haven’t. I’ve been to church every Sunday of my life, pretty much. I’m a PK, but I was 49 years old before I got saved by Grace, through faith, not of my works. That was in July of 2009. I started studying the Bible, God’s way, rightly dividing the Word of truth. The rest is history!! God bless you in your ministry.
What's a PK? Sorry I'm just interested and abbreviations sometimes trip me up
@@adriennedunne1748 son or daughter of a pastor
@@gniksamkacb thanks for that
People forget that Abraham and his wife Sarah were called out of Paganism.
I didn’t know either so thank you!!
Wow --thanks for that- can you point to where I can find that in scripture?
I am so glad you talked about people thinking older is better or more true. I had never heard the idea that any religion was older than Christianity until my old manager said it and treated it like that was a duh everyone knows that kind of thought. At the time I didnt know how to respond because I was stuck on where did you hear that and how could you think that? Some people really act the reformation was the origin of Christianity and ignore where it started. I mean the term Christian goes back to biblical times when the church started when we still had Peter and Paul, etc.
When we get right to it. We have to ask ourselves is what does God want us to do and why. We are supposedly getting ready for another plane of exsitance. How rich we are and material matters are largely irrellivant. What matters is what is our spiritual relationship with God.
It seems as though the intense focus and drive on attracting your desires is another way to move people toward idolatry.
Yes that vibration and frequency crap is just that CRAP
Just like Pharaoh's magicians, the enemy can cause someone find that blue feather to keep folks distracted from Jesus.
Yep Amen! They sure can! And they can turn that one blue feather into two blue feathers into 3 blue feathers, into an entire patch of 4 leaf clovers to distract you and play keep away with you.
What am I going to do with a box full of feathers or a jar of cloves lol if I don’t have Jesus?
Wow! That was so good! Amazon keeps advertising law of attraction stuff to me and it just seemed off.
Lots of eye opening info! Great video! Thank you!
Funny dichotomy. Jon (rightly, imo) points out the respect people have for "older" things - and yet, it occurs to me how often people use the Bible's age as a criticism against it! 🤷♀️
So true, many say it is old and we need to " evolve" with the times, but yet say this. Also, God was in existence way before anything or any other made up belief systems.
Just got his book a few weeks ago! Love it!
Thank You!
I had been wondering about The Law of Success by Napoleon Hill.
My Dad had bought it for me before kids, and he doesn't necessarily buy me lots of things, so it's easier to cherish, when he does. (Whoa, we are very similar)
I have been asking God to show me specific items that don't serve me, that I can free my home from God distracting things.
It was really erie to skim through the chapter list, and see at the very end "the Golden Rule".
The entire book seemed like a forgery of the Bible.
Leaving out the most important parts!!
Very interesting and informative. Thank you ❤
Wow this was a great video! Yes yes yes! Thank you for touching on all of this! The church is so deceived right now. We’ve got to be more aware of where these things are originating from!
Excellent guest... been following both Melissa and Jon for quite awhile and glad to see them connect.. appreciate both their ministries very much. Thank you both! GmaJo Keeping it Real (in Faith and Truth) 🙏🏻❤️
Thank you for this teaching, helpful.
The biggest reason I don't agree with this practice is that we would be taking the will of God out of your desires. God will sometimes give us what we want to guide us into something we need to learn. God's will to be done 1st and always.
I have a very large family and only three if us are Christian but just about everyone is into the Law of Attraction. We were planning a sledding gathering and our online family chat was full of admonition to think of snow and manifest it.
Solid 9 on the cool surname meter Mr. Clash.
Sounds like an appropriate name for an apologist engaged in 'battle'.
🤣🤣 thank you! God bless!
This was soo good! Thanks both ❤️❤️
Fabulous interview I could listen to this all morning. It is so amazing how much this permeates society and the church. Would love to hear another or more interviews with Jon. Thank you Melissa ♥
Great and useful discussion. Kudos x 2
Great discussion!!
Thank you for your ministry
Thank you Melissa and Jon. ❤ 🇦🇺
Nice discussion!
This is good information. I'm glad that you covered the fact that the law of attraction doesn't talk about the actual work needed to accomplish or to get the things you are seeking. I liked the part about the law of attraction is really a satanic counterfeit. That rang true to me and made sense. Thank you.
Helana Patrovna Blavatskie. Who founded the Theosophical Society. Seems to be one of.if not the originator of the law of attraction thing. Probably came through a lot of other philosophy as well. But what I am seeing is that the people who practice that. Use it for the exact opposite. When dealing with other people. Your not like me. So you are bad. And they label you as someone to keep away from. Because you are going to cause bad things. No forgiveness. And a lot of them call themselves Christian. Sad
Can you pray for a man named Wil?. He isn't a Christian, but I'm praying for him.
Could you give a list of "Christian" authors or preachers who teach these lies of Law of Attraction. I know a few like Caroline Leaf and TD Jakes and most NAR preachers.
This was great!!
Can you please provide a clip either written or video where Lavey says this about new age. I would love to have this at a tool when I am evangelizing about this topic and was unable to find this exact quote so far. Thank You!
To the friends who like the law of attraction: read Job. Read Daniel. Read about the abuses of Jesus. I think the old name for this (in part) was name and claim it.
GREAT VIDEO,...!
Clash is a legend
Loved Jon’s cultish episode! ❤ this is awesome you are interviewing him❤
I listened to jon Clash's book, and i definitely recommend it to anyone who likes Alissa Childers content! Plus you get to support a Christian author!
thank you!
Yes I have a friend who won't let me say anything negative
Melissa, do you think praying scripture is possibly the same thing, for example praying specific bible verses to gain outcomes we want, like success with a ministry, growth in faith, or salvation of others?
You shouldn't be praying scripture to get a desired outcome, you should be praying scripture to line yourself up with the mind of Christ and God's desires for you
I don't see how in anyway it could be "wrong" to pray scripture for someone's salvation.
If you think about it, the Book of Psalms has been the major prayer book of the Church for 2000 years (just as it was the prayer book in Judaism in the days of Jesus, and before that). The difference to the Law of Attraction is that Christians don't pray specific Psalms or Bible verses in order to gain anything. We pray those verses and Psalms because they verbalize our thoughts much better than we are able to do by ourselves, because they correct us and line us up with the mind of Christ, and because we "remind" God about His promises. Whether those things we are praying for happen or not, that's up to God.
I always think, "Anything but God/Jesus," when I hear the latest incoherent, non-scientific and illogical explanations for life and purpose.
Joyce Meyer teaches law of attraction like things.
All the faith preachers do!
As someone who considers themselves spiritual and not Christian I appreciate your channel. I kind of wish we could have a discussion because I disagree so much yet I am very thankful for opposing points of view. We're all on our own journey. Much respect to you. This was an interesting discussion, but not very insightful from where I am today. I disagree alot with what you both are saying but also agree on other things. It would be alot to comment on. Just wanna send love and thanks!
Just to let you know - The Catalysm of the Kingdom of Heaven provides a great basic orthodoxy for Christianity. It also addresses the faults of other belief systems especially the tendencies of polytheism which is really what the Law of Attraction falls under. It also has a very orthodox statement of faith.
We Humans🙈thank you❤
Panentheism simply means that God is present everywhere in creation. God is also outside of creation, aka transcends creation. In other words, creation is not God. Pan = all, entheos = God within. God is present in everything, because he created everything. But yes, it is definitely twisted by occultists to mean that God being in creation is somehow the same as humans being God.
Other than that, great talk, and I agree with everything you're talking about, as an ex "New Ager".
I'm a sculptor. That means I make things...but I am not present in them.
@@angietorok8389 Correct. But you are *physically unable* to be present in your sculptures, because you're not God. You have a *physical body* that limits you in time and space. God has no such limitations because he transcends time and space. Or are you saying that God is limited? It's also kind of weird that you're comparing yourself to God. 😅🙈 You also insinuate that you don't have the Holy Spirit in you, since, you know, God not being present in his creation and all.
God is not the rock he created. It is similar to a work of art being an output of the artist
As stated in the video, there are practically two wings of panentheism. One wing could be translated as "omnipresence", and as such it is a part of Christian worldview (similar presentation appears in the apologies of Aristides and Athenagoras of Athena in the 2nd century). But the other wing of panentheism basically claims that all existence has "a sort of spark of divinity"... and this idea is typical for Gnosticism and strongly opposed by Christians throughout centuries.
The Law Of the Lord is perfect converting the soul ..... more to be the desired are they than Gold .... Proberbs 19
The Spirit and the Bride say, Come Lord Jesus...
Does anybody know what Santa Ria is? My spelling may be off, by the way. Thank you.
Ironic but not really how during the interview ads interrupted for intuitive power courses by that Helen Haskell promoter guy whose voice I rush to mute and some other master class/“here’s how to interpret the Bible” ad. Tsk tsk. But not surprising.
What does the law of attraction have 2 do with the law of GOD
Hey Melissa, I have a friend who is presently listening to, and following the teachings of Dr. Mark Paul Bishop, who uses/misuses scripture to teach that if you think positively about your health or circumstances, you can change the "physical" by speaking it, and believing it. He believes that you can speak your way to perfect health. Anyway, I have a hard time sharing with her because she will quickly shut me off, put up the defense walls, and tell me that she doesn't want to hear anything negative. She says that she's a Christian, and I don't doubt it, but she's fallen into some really questionable new age teachings (mascarating) as truth, in my opinion. What can I do to help her to see that this is not christianity or biblical, and see the truth? If you know anything about this Dr., can you share your thoughts and opinions? Thank you for your work.
Getty yup!! 👍
❤❤❤
What a clever way of blaming the victim. . .
- you mean the Laws of Attraction used by those sons of God that left their first estate - some even practiced in the churches as in so of the Law to that in the Letter
Another Great interview with Saint Jon to help many people understand how sneaky these doctrines are and adding more & more to it and different ways , & off shoots worldwide.
Peace & Love to you both & your families. Amen. 😊❤.
- and do they know for what is as to with so in the very hand of God
I have a question??? Do you worship and pray to the God of your bible as described in Deuteronomy chapter 28?
Just a note that the book of Deuteronomy is the first book written by Moses to the Israelites in the past. For our learning today as Christians, but not directed towards Christians today.
We DO worship Yahweh described in Deuteronomy ch. 28. The point is that literally no single human being has ever obeyed God and His commandments as they have been intended to be obeyed. The real miracle is that God has allowed people to prosper *in spite of all lawlessness and unfaithfulness.* And as a matter of fact, "being blessed" doesn't exclusively or even primarily mean being productive and prosperous - worldly prosperity was meant to be a sign to other nations. But the real prosperity is to partake in the very life of God and His sufferings.
@@HomoEucharistica Then God truly is a evil narcissist monster and since God does not change then maybe Jesus is not who everyone thinks he is. Worshiping a God that makes mothers eat their children is horrifyingly wicked.
@@peertopeertherapy3720 It's quite the contrary, really. Literally only thing God is doing is to take His blessings away from people (who have already separated themselves from Him and ignored all warnings and calls to come back) and let them to be on their own. That naturally brings only misery and death - what else one could expect when he is casted away from the presence of the source of Life? Those people want a life without God, and a life without God is what they receive... and that's a life without Sun. They could return at any moment and everything could be fixed, restored and even uplifted (that's what God desires), but they systematically refuses to do such thing.
I need God, because i need accountability 😭🙏
You don’t ‘do’ the LoA. It’s a Law like the Law of gravity. It just is. Nobody ‘does’ the Law of gravity. Crazy!
Your definition is incorrect. Please be honest to your viewers and subscribers. You're not really "attracting" anything....it's not like a magnet. The idea is physical reality is more like a mirror, not a magnet. What you put out, is what you get back. It's not about what you think, or say.....it's about how you feel, and behave. If you're feeling, and behaving like a victim, reality will just mirror back to you more ways to feel that way. Since you all worship Jesus, why not behave the way he did, so reality will reflect the love and compassion back to you? After all, he gave his life trying to tell you all this. This is what he meant when he said "I am the way....be the way". I can't think of any other way to be that I would want reflected back to me, could you? Please remember, this is always working, 24/7.....and if you're being dishonest to your viewers, others at some point in your life will be dishonest to you in the same way. It's just a mirror....it's the most fairest way to be, and nobody can escape it.
Oh look, the fundamentalist conmen are trying to cash in on Law of Attraction.
This guy just spent the entire interview knocking something that clearly is central to his life... as he was trying to knock the law of attraction he only reinforced it as a working and successful model of manifestation for him in his life. It is clear from hearing what is being said (not just hearing what one wants to hear) that his commitment to the process of manifestation brought him the fame he desired, the position he desired, the money he desired and so on (all this things being referred to in the context of subjectivity of course)... also it would seem to me that speaking of the law of manifestation, even if you do not agree or like it contributes to its presence and confirms its truth. Anyway, this guy is in denial of the fact that the law of manifestation is active and creating much of his life experience....
The law of Attraction works but it is a demonic power, it has nothing to do with God. It is openly in rebellion to God. True prayer is asking God for something and wanting to line up your desire with God's desire.
He is where he is because of his work ethic, just as he referred to his millionaire friends, they became wealthy because of the long hours of work, not the law of attraction.
Same with Jon, he is becoming well known because of his commitment to spreading the truth, not because the law of attraction.
The loa never ends well. A person may obtain things( mostly because they are putting in the effort of getting the thing). But, when you have not made Jesus your savior and been born again saved, these things you acquire while doing your own thing, tend to not end well. Your life eventually becomes a mess.
If christianity is true there is a spirit that wants to prevent you in anyway possible from finding Jesus so even if he got it from spiritual means that speaks nothing unto whether loa is true or not
Of course it works, but it's not of God.