Man, I COULD NOT use logic with my ex. This video makes so much sense to me. It is so difficult to keep your composure when an argument cannot be based on the facts and they twist everything. Before you know it, you are on the defense about something that happened a year ago and not the SIMPLE disagreement or argument! Nothing is constructive or have any sort of compromise! I still miss her, somehow! WTF! hahaha.
Another confusion tactic: they'll go into play-by-play on the argument, trying to distract you and confuse you rather than address the points you are making.
This explains so much why I kept feeling so disoriented when I’d try to have a calm rational discussion with my cheating, lying husband who has high narcissistic traits.
Because I wouldn't raise my voice at my ex when 'arguing' she actually told me to yell at her. Narcissists need to feel they are the victim in everything. I learned that the best thing to do is to to not engage. It starves them of the argument they want. It will piss them off, they'll yell all manner of insults and allegations to try bait you into an argument of any type. The desire to defend ourselves is strong but not responding is the only option and of course putting as much distance between you and them.
How's this for faulty logic. When i was 12 i was removed by child protection because of neglect and lack of protection from family scapegoating. Instead of my family admitting that they were the cause, they say.. "it was for your own good". They will frame everything that they did as 'good'. Its pure insanity.
I am so sorry this happened. Yes I recognise this in my own situation where the father of my children decided it was best he was removed rather than getting well and healed and working with me. It’s similar mindset where they diffuse them being in the wrong by finding a way to say what happened was for your best. It is a choice opposed to an inability. And it’s their broken logic. It’s very very sad and it IS broken. Many don’t like to say broken because it is then harmful but it needs fixing so I would say that is broken. It may not be their fault but responsibility kicks in when we become adults. I have been a co narcissist and that is really hard to admit, it’s horrible. But I don’t want to be and I want to be better and so seek help and ways to try and better improve myself. Far from perfect but taking steps each day. I hope you are finding Tim’s videos helpful.
This is the story of my life...our narcissistic and mentally ill mother, obviously could not handle 3 boys so we ended up in the child protection rackett... we were abused there. But our narc mother had always said we were there because we were bad and deserved it. The truth is that she shifted responsability upon us for her own inability to take care of her children. That woman never took responsability for a single thing in her life, she was a master of blaming others for her problems. She learned that from her alchoolic father.
I know it is a crazy argument and I'm sorry for what happened to you at 12, being removed. I hope you grew up ok and didn't get entangled with the negative family aspects.
That's very sad and they (parents) are responsible but in the case they weren't wanting/able to own their responsibility maybe that was better for you indeed. It's hard but now you get to shape your future instead of them doing it. Now the power is in your hands ❤
Very informative & educational. It clarifies & confirms the fact that i grew up surrounded by narcissists. It's amazing that i still have a few shreds of sanity left.
I was 45 years ruled by a level 10 narcissist (step father). And he used literally all of the points you presented. This affected even people who didn’t know him. It was like a devils circle around him Tim, thx a lot for your work. Best regards from Germany 🙋♂️
I found great strength in the "grey stone" response to narcissistic behavior. It took me forever to recognize my situation, though. Good luck, friends ❤
THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR SHARING THIS YOU ARE ABSOULTLEY RIGHT I WENT THROUGH HORRIFIC EMOTIONAL ABUSE BY A MALIGNANT NARCS FOR YRS I WOULD ALWAYS FIND MYSELF APOLOGIZING TO HIM FOR HIS ABUSE.THIS ALMOST CAUSED MY NERVOUS BREAKDOWN NARCS ABUSE IS BRUTAL
Wow. I'm highly encouraged that there are still thinking professionals out there. Well done you. Free thinkers are so rare amongst the professions nowadays. People are terrified to appear to lack "political correctness". How do we reverse this? Because it feels like it's getting worse and it's incredibly lonely.
@@echofoxtrot2.051 If more people speak openly and honestly about what they think and what their intentions are, I think things get better. It’s starts with the individual and ripples out.
@@milliewoo337 absolutely 💯. Don’t ever give in to what you know to be wrong or harmful. You don’t have to be subsumed by manipulation or corruption. It can be lonely at first, but eventually and inevitably you will find your people of similar mind and shared values. I’m still on the lookout, but I have the faith and humility to know I’m not the only one that wants to be good.
Amazingly helpful stuff which helps so much for me to understand issues which cause conflict and mental pain. This guy surpasses all the others because he speaks and explains things in a simple way that the common man can understand.
Brilliant(!) And absolutely spot on. Not a wasted word., and wish I knew this 4 years ago to know this invaluable information. “Never too late” as is said… But as an empathic person , I still find it difficult to find sympathy..
A lot of information to take in, Tim. While any scenario can be explained away as an argument style, the conflict or strife remains because of common underlying traits - a need to assuage personal insecurity and be right at any cost or, Ignorance of the possibility of differentials or -apathy or avoidance due to fear in the face of adversity and potential failure.
My husband's parents were divorced from the time he was 2. Mom is a covert narcissist. It would be his Dad's weekend, but Mom would say, "If you dont choose to go to church with me on Sunday (even though it's Dad's weekend), you're grounded." He's 34, and we are just now going through the healing process of conplex trauma, enmeshment, because we've just realized within the past 4 months she is a covert narcissist. I unfortunately am having to heal from being traumatized by her for 16 years. He's had a lifetime of trauma that he didnt even realize was trauma that he's healing from. It's very hard, especially when you have such intense pushback with boundaries, etc. from her.
@@Thisismotherhood You and your husband might want to consider going no contact. It’s so much easier and faster, but always ongoing, to heal from toxicity when you’re not exposing yourself to it. Best wishes and congratulations for recognizing the situation and beginning the healing journey.
"They" never actually win. My covert narc sister thought she stoled my mother from me. (You can't lose what you've never had.) I then went NC for the past 8 years. Sis has been at mommies beckon call 24/7. Who won? 😊🎉😂
17:45 Gray rock is more like you look into their eyes and you don't say anything 😶. Just stare at them, knowing that engaging with them is futile, and they'll bug off.
@@alisonfisher1877 not quite the same. The narcissist can tell if you're weak and avoiding confrontation. And the narcissist can bully you in that case. You've to be ferm while maintaining eye contact but not giving narcissistic supply. They'll bug off but be prepared for retaliation. They're nasty.
@@alexandrugheorghe5610 I’m not disagreeing with you, I just mean to say that the supply is the reaction. So being firm is to be stoic, to be unaffected by demonstrating you can hold your ground unwaveringly against whatever crazy tactics the narcissist brings.
My husband gaslights me all the time. He does everything you talk about. He is sober 2 years and not gambling, but he still behaves this way. I stayed with him because I am working on my recovery.
Hard part is when you go to couples or family counseling and the other party is doing this left and right in front of the therapist and the therapist says they're not allowed to take sides or even attempt to figure out who's telling the truth. And they end up believing the person spewing all the fallacies. There needs to be major change in therapy. They're enabling and even aiding abusers.
We live in a culture that says if it feels good it must be right. Proverbs 14:12 warns us that “There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end, it leads to destruction”. God has our best interests at heart according to His word.
This is an excellent presentation. However, It's very triggering, so I'm going to have to take a break and come back to watch the rest a little later this week!
Omg After he would do that , I would then start bringing up all his stuff Which of course was way more nefarious than mine we would end up going to circles for sometimes days. He passed away in June & it's almost like I feel psychologically safer in this world after 38yr of marriage but I do Find myself missing his presence in the house....
My 2 sisters are npd; I have totally no contact with one and very minimal with other, you simply can't be around them, they are evil, very evil, their goal is to turn you into a robot or destroy you, yes destroy you, very bad people, my mother was too!❤❤❤don't argue with them, get away very far!
You’ve only amused my experiences of whom who’ve tried to negate factual evidence. Cherry picking is quite common, along with here say. I don’t have patience with ignorance, and fortunately, those whom chose to debate their beliefs were quickly dismantled. 😂😂😂😂 I laugh hard, because they were the last two long-term, now understanding narcissistic relationships I had. 😅 More amusing, I believe I was too strong for them, as I challenged their beliefs and thought processes. 🤷🏻♀️. Facts are the facts. You can’t negate the facts. 🤷🏻♀️ 😂😂😂
On the 4th year of repeating multiple ways they don't reciprocate at all, and them just gaslighting me saying "i don't like your tone, or I hope you find peace, or this is just the way I am...I'm done. No point was ever addressed, and he's mad because I'm not being heard and just leaves cause I yelled at this point... sheesh...I'm not a tit for tat person, but I had nothing to work with.
I'm still confused. I'm trying to address my issues. I see that how I was raised really distorted me. I am the scapegoat. I also recognize that t have adopted these insidious ways of communicating and relating to others. It hurts me to know that I have treated others the way I was treated. I hope my ex's find heeling for my bad behavior. I never intended to become that person or do those things. Reflecting on it, I believe that I was operating from a subconscious place. I also believe that most people relate to others in a "self-preserving" way. If you aren't intentional about how you are relating, I believe that this is the human default means of having a relationship. It's shallow and doesn't risk much for the other person involved. Did I mention my confused state?
Yes unless you learn what not to do then you will repeat the cycle. I'm determined to not repeat it and make sure I don't do that to my husband or friends
39:19 After I put myself into alcohol treatment at the ripe old age of 26, the focus in our family was how they all were not what I was, which was decreed to be defective. I lost my job because my sister refused to get involved when the counselor deployed emotional blackmail to try to force her attendance at the weekend family group meeting. She also refused to get my paperwork so I could save the job put into jeopardy thru that counselor's abuse. My father told me I should just settle, because I was getting old. There was more implied. Imo those rehab units are traumatizing and dangerous, when they force families to attend. I was a grownup with employment and insurance when I walked into those doors a lamb to slaughter. I had no idea it was jail, until I couldn't save my job by getting the paperwork they needed, and no one would help. This is when I mark the end of my life.
God totally rearranged my life through a series of what appeared to be tragic events in order to reposition my life in a direction that would bring real peace and happiness. This included losing my job when I was less than a year from getting a pension for retirement, starting my own business and then getting robbed multiple times and eventually I was carjacked at gunpoint and ended up in a shootout. All of that to say that on the other side of that it took each event to get me pointing in a different direction and then it led me to the right people at the right time. I had to be completely broken down and stripped of the things that I wanted in order to get what God had for me. The last thing in this series of events was my spiritual mentor died. I had nothing left to hang onto except for God and God showed me that I should have been doing that before. I kind of was but I had to completely let go. Today I am glad for everyone who stabbed me in the back and everything that happened. No way I would be in this good of place if I had my way happen. I read the book of Job a lot. I used to joke about what I was going to do with my she asses after being sifted like wheat.
@@boxelder9167 I was deliberately betrayed, and Job at least had a good life before it was blighted. You believe what serves you. I believe what I have experienced, and that is a lifetime of deliberately dealt evil. Death is not the worst thing that can happen to anyone.
@@kristinmeyer489 - I understand that sentiment all too well. I hope that you can find better than what was taken from you. I found that I couldn’t avoid the first wound (inflicted on me) but I learned to avoid the second wound (the one I inflicted upon myself because of what they did).
It’s not that I don’t understand the unscrupulous tactics… you call faulty logic… especially after dealing with narcs most of my life. It’s that others.. the people I need help from… don’t believe me or what I’m trying to describe has occurred. I call it willful blindness. Only the LORD can straighten it out!!
Oh my mom pulled that stuff on me. A few times when I was responding to something, and she just screamed, I'm sorry, I wasn't the perfect mother and hung up the phone, and I'm sitting there thinking you weren't I mean we can't just pretend that you were a perfect motherwhy you sit there and bash other people and judge other people like you're sitting up. There on your freaking. Whatever it is Eiffel Tower, whatever that's the thing that makes you mad. And then all the lying and omitting of facts already in evidence. One thing I noticed is 1 thing I learned and I never learned it from anybody but hunter Biden and his partner. And that's plausible, deniability, because these people think of in the situation ahead of time, most people don't do that, most people don't do that. Most people don't do that most people don't do that. Most people just heading to a situation assess it make a decision take care of it. Resolved and move on, not these already thought of what you're gonna say. How you're gonna say it. How they're going to avoid it? How they're gonna change it? How they're gonna manipulate it so that it can all end up around the word. Plausible deniability and that's what makes you feel like you're gonna go crazy
Same thing happened with my ex-wife because I had used “I” in a sentence. I learned to talk about myself in the 3rd person while in the military so this husband was having fun referring to himself as this husband. Sigh, this husband was her first but since then she just went through her 5th husband so the irony of that is alarming.
Hmmm. I love your stuff. Logically, understand how the Tu Quoque fallacy is a fallacy... From a common sense perspective, can you help me understand how it's not somewhat helpful? It seems like common sense to take diet / lifestyle advice from a fit person, instead of someone who struggles with being overweight. That doesn't mean that the advice from the overweight person is false, but it makes sense that it's less trustworthy. It makes more sense to trust someone who has experienced the outcome of the advice they are giving. Am I missing something?
In my experience of tackling distortions like this, the hardest part isn’t letting go of these strategies when they don’t serve us. The hardest part is letting go where you feel they work. Doctor’s role is to give advice, healthy scepticism is good. However, if you feel yourself resistive to it, examine the stories you’re telling yourself. Use the same idea on different subjects and see if they’re less triggering. - If he said you needed chemo would you expect him to have beaten cancer? - Are there any ripped & fit people out there who give garbage advice?
If you are a True Christian the Bible is enough research - I mean for going astray from the laws of God,- I’m not talking about nuances or biological or physical scientific facts, and I mean facts.any human can manipulate the research so perhaps we shouldn’t offer explanations that have no real tested and proven, concrete evidence- that’s confusing to anyone who needs truth .
34:38 I disagree. The daughter is not responsible for the death of her cat. It was killed by the actions of the father. Yes admittedly, they could have taken the cat with them. But her hands caused no harm or loss. If one human orders another to shoot someone in the head; Who is accountable for the deliberate loss of life? Yes, it would be through coercion (which in accordance to Common Law, is unlawful) However; The one (who's action) pulling the trigger is ultimately responsible. It is free will. That is the rule according to Natural LAW. Natural LAW is harsh for a reason. The boundaries are clear and precise. It cares not of the 'hows and whys'. It is about taking responsibility for ones actions to evolve in consciousness. Humans are expected to know the difference between right and wrong. We are all born with a conscience ❤ Sadly now, many work from their traumatized and programmed sub-consious. I enjoyed listening to this. Thank you very much 🙏
He's giving an example of a fallacy or a distorsion of reality. By no means he said the gir is at fault or that she caused the cat to be killed by her father because she didn't choose him. The girl could not win and the sole responsability falls into her father. She didn't cause anything. She was blackmailed.
I have a sincere question, it’s not judgmental or meant to be insulting. How is it you perceived him as blaming the daughter and why didn’t it make you take pause and realize that would have been contradictory to Tim’s message? My bf does this same kind of thing often and I would just like to better understand what’s happening? He never questions his own perception.
I find it difficult to understand how someone with this knowledge can still subscribe to a particular religion. You basically disproved all religions in this video... this is quite frustrating I must say XD Do you believe that Christianism is true based on science and facts? Do you think all other religions are false? Maybe you have a video somewhere that explains your reasoning here?
Only you can confirm if you are drawn to what Tim Fletcher teaches or not. As a skeptic I find his information very enlightening ,identifiable and helpful in my trauma healing. There are many brilliant informative teachers out there but it is up to the person /patient/ client to be open to do the hard work to help themselves.
Tim has a unique way of getting to the core of issues in a way that dissolves the confusion and complexity into clarity and simplicity that accurately maps thing out thoroughly.
![[안방1열 풀캠4K] 베이비몬스터 'DRIP' (BABYMONSTER FullCam)│@SBS Inkigayo 241110](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/AQ4RIghEvUs/mqdefault.jpg)
![ปฏิเสธไม่ไหว (Crush on you) - LIPTA feat. No One Else [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/NBw1jF342vw/mqdefault.jpg)
Tim, when you talk it's like having a trusted friend online
Also known as:
• deflect & diminish
• invalidation
• funneling/coercion
• word salad circular arguing
Man, I COULD NOT use logic with my ex. This video makes so much sense to me. It is so difficult to keep your composure when an argument cannot be based on the facts and they twist everything. Before you know it, you are on the defense about something that happened a year ago and not the SIMPLE disagreement or argument! Nothing is constructive or have any sort of compromise! I still miss her, somehow! WTF! hahaha.
Another confusion tactic: they'll go into play-by-play on the argument, trying to distract you and confuse you rather than address the points you are making.
The Rabbit Hole..
This explains so much why I kept feeling so disoriented when I’d try to have a calm rational discussion with my cheating, lying husband who has high narcissistic traits.
Because I wouldn't raise my voice at my ex when 'arguing' she actually told me to yell at her. Narcissists need to feel they are the victim in everything.
I learned that the best thing to do is to to not engage. It starves them of the argument they want. It will piss them off, they'll yell all manner of insults and allegations to try bait you into an argument of any type. The desire to defend ourselves is strong but not responding is the only option and of course putting as much distance between you and them.
@@scarab36319ify yeah, I can’t think of anything that has worked better for me than the gray rock strategy.
How's this for faulty logic. When i was 12 i was removed by child protection because of neglect and lack of protection from family scapegoating. Instead of my family admitting that they were the cause, they say.. "it was for your own good". They will frame everything that they did as 'good'. Its pure insanity.
I am so sorry this happened. Yes I recognise this in my own situation where the father of my children decided it was best he was removed rather than getting well and healed and working with me. It’s similar mindset where they diffuse them being in the wrong by finding a way to say what happened was for your best. It is a choice opposed to an inability. And it’s their broken logic. It’s very very sad and it IS broken. Many don’t like to say broken because it is then harmful but it needs fixing so I would say that is broken. It may not be their fault but responsibility kicks in when we become adults. I have been a co narcissist and that is really hard to admit, it’s horrible. But I don’t want to be and I want to be better and so seek help and ways to try and better improve myself. Far from perfect but taking steps each day. I hope you are finding Tim’s videos helpful.
This is the story of my life...our narcissistic and mentally ill mother, obviously could not handle 3 boys so we ended up in the child protection rackett... we were abused there. But our narc mother had always said we were there because we were bad and deserved it. The truth is that she shifted responsability upon us for her own inability to take care of her children. That woman never took responsability for a single thing in her life, she was a master of blaming others for her problems. She learned that from her alchoolic father.
Exactly!!! So I would do the same toward them. Taking back control and power! I would neglect or "forget" to give money for "their own good".
I know it is a crazy argument and I'm sorry for what happened to you at 12, being removed. I hope you grew up ok and didn't get entangled with the negative family aspects.
That's very sad and they (parents) are responsible but in the case they weren't wanting/able to own their responsibility maybe that was better for you indeed. It's hard but now you get to shape your future instead of them doing it. Now the power is in your hands ❤
Thank you for exposing this evil.
Very informative & educational. It clarifies & confirms the fact that i grew up surrounded by narcissists. It's amazing that i still have a few shreds of sanity left.
I was 45 years ruled by a level 10 narcissist (step father). And he used literally all of the points you presented. This affected even people who didn’t know him. It was like a devils circle around him
Tim, thx a lot for your work. Best regards from Germany 🙋♂️
I find Tim's work exceptionally insightful and well presented.
I found great strength in the "grey stone" response to narcissistic behavior. It took me forever to recognize my situation, though. Good luck, friends ❤
THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR SHARING THIS YOU ARE ABSOULTLEY RIGHT I WENT THROUGH HORRIFIC
EMOTIONAL ABUSE BY A MALIGNANT NARCS FOR YRS I WOULD ALWAYS FIND MYSELF APOLOGIZING TO HIM FOR HIS ABUSE.THIS ALMOST CAUSED MY NERVOUS BREAKDOWN NARCS ABUSE IS BRUTAL
Wow. I'm highly encouraged that there are still thinking professionals out there. Well done you. Free thinkers are so rare amongst the professions nowadays. People are terrified to appear to lack "political correctness". How do we reverse this? Because it feels like it's getting worse and it's incredibly lonely.
@@echofoxtrot2.051 If more people speak openly and honestly about what they think and what their intentions are, I think things get better. It’s starts with the individual and ripples out.
Logic needs to be taught as a defense against deceit and manipulation.
How about self deciet and to combat self-manipulation as well.
@@SmearCampaignsAreEvilrecognizing it and participating in it are two very different things.
@@milliewoo337 absolutely 💯. Don’t ever give in to what you know to be wrong or harmful. You don’t have to be subsumed by manipulation or corruption. It can be lonely at first, but eventually and inevitably you will find your people of similar mind and shared values. I’m still on the lookout, but I have the faith and humility to know I’m not the only one that wants to be good.
OMG I love you! This is our politics today! This!
Their main of way of getting you off the topic, theyll.say something like "Everybody KNOWS you're nuts!!". Gaslighting is really a very CRUEL tactic.
Thanks!
He brought up something that happened 17 years ago. He loved semantics.
Amazingly helpful stuff which helps so much for me to understand issues which cause conflict and mental pain. This guy surpasses all the others because he speaks and explains things in a simple way that the common man can understand.
I am finding this very helpful. Thank you, Mr. Fletcher.
Brilliant(!) And absolutely spot on. Not a wasted word., and wish I knew this 4 years ago to know this invaluable information. “Never too late” as is said… But as an empathic person , I still find it difficult to find sympathy..
A lot of information to take in, Tim. While any scenario can be explained away as an argument style, the conflict or strife remains because of common underlying traits - a need to assuage personal insecurity and be right at any cost or, Ignorance of the possibility of differentials or -apathy or avoidance due to fear in the face of adversity and potential failure.
My husband's parents were divorced from the time he was 2. Mom is a covert narcissist. It would be his Dad's weekend, but Mom would say, "If you dont choose to go to church with me on Sunday (even though it's Dad's weekend), you're grounded." He's 34, and we are just now going through the healing process of conplex trauma, enmeshment, because we've just realized within the past 4 months she is a covert narcissist. I unfortunately am having to heal from being traumatized by her for 16 years. He's had a lifetime of trauma that he didnt even realize was trauma that he's healing from. It's very hard, especially when you have such intense pushback with boundaries, etc. from her.
@@Thisismotherhood You and your husband might want to consider going no contact. It’s so much easier and faster, but always ongoing, to heal from toxicity when you’re not exposing yourself to it. Best wishes and congratulations for recognizing the situation and beginning the healing journey.
"They" never actually win. My covert narc sister thought she stoled my mother from me. (You can't lose what you've never had.) I then went NC for the past 8 years. Sis has been at mommies beckon call 24/7. Who won? 😊🎉😂
😂❤🎉
17:45 Gray rock is more like you look into their eyes and you don't say anything 😶. Just stare at them, knowing that engaging with them is futile, and they'll bug off.
Same thing. It just means not giving any reaction
@@alisonfisher1877 not quite the same. The narcissist can tell if you're weak and avoiding confrontation. And the narcissist can bully you in that case. You've to be ferm while maintaining eye contact but not giving narcissistic supply. They'll bug off but be prepared for retaliation. They're nasty.
@@alexandrugheorghe5610 I’m not disagreeing with you, I just mean to say that the supply is the reaction. So being firm is to be stoic, to be unaffected by demonstrating you can hold your ground unwaveringly against whatever crazy tactics the narcissist brings.
Took me years but I found you. Thank you for the great info!
My husband gaslights me all the time. He does everything you talk about. He is sober 2 years and not gambling, but he still behaves this way. I stayed with him because I am working on my recovery.
Hard part is when you go to couples or family counseling and the other party is doing this left and right in front of the therapist and the therapist says they're not allowed to take sides or even attempt to figure out who's telling the truth. And they end up believing the person spewing all the fallacies. There needs to be major change in therapy. They're enabling and even aiding abusers.
It’s as if you’ve been eavesdropping on our conversations! I eventually just give up…knowing no matte4 what I say will be negated.
Wow !!! Tim you sure have taught me so much. My parents never taught me any of these things.
Sounds like my boss and my parents. Not sure why people do that to those who do nothing to them
Really great info, Tim … thanks for this video.
incredible explanation. Congratulations
We live in a culture that says if it feels good it must be right. Proverbs 14:12 warns us that “There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end, it leads to destruction”. God has our best interests at heart according to His word.
Thank you 🙏🏽
I can't even move my body!.My eyes are crossed How am i supposed to find a safe place to heal? It's so difficult, so little time.
Thank you
I genuinely believe in doing the right thing and I do my best to know what that is at the moment. I don't argue, I state facts. #✌️❤️✨️
This is an excellent presentation. However, It's very triggering, so I'm going to have to take a break and come back to watch the rest a little later this week!
Thank you for this helpful talk.
As an American, the Americans do have lots of problems. Your logic is not wrong.
Rhetoric, logical fallacies, lies... the tricks as old as time.
Omg After he would do that , I would then start bringing up all his stuff Which of course was way more nefarious than mine we would end up going to circles for sometimes days. He passed away in June & it's almost like I feel psychologically safer in this world after 38yr of marriage but I do Find myself missing his presence in the house....
My 2 sisters are npd; I have totally no contact with one and very minimal with other, you simply can't be around them, they are evil, very evil, their goal is to turn you into a robot or destroy you, yes destroy you, very bad people, my mother was too!❤❤❤don't argue with them, get away very far!
Thank you
You’ve only amused my experiences of whom who’ve tried to negate factual evidence. Cherry picking is quite common, along with here say.
I don’t have patience with ignorance, and fortunately, those whom chose to debate their beliefs were quickly dismantled. 😂😂😂😂
I laugh hard, because they were the last two long-term, now understanding narcissistic relationships I had. 😅
More amusing, I believe I was too strong for them, as I challenged their beliefs and thought processes. 🤷🏻♀️. Facts are the facts. You can’t negate the facts. 🤷🏻♀️ 😂😂😂
On the 4th year of repeating multiple ways they don't reciprocate at all, and them just gaslighting me saying "i don't like your tone, or I hope you find peace, or this is just the way I am...I'm done. No point was ever addressed, and he's mad because I'm not being heard and just leaves cause I yelled at this point... sheesh...I'm not a tit for tat person, but I had nothing to work with.
Powerful
I'm still confused. I'm trying to address my issues. I see that how I was raised really distorted me. I am the scapegoat.
I also recognize that t have adopted these insidious ways of communicating and relating to others. It hurts me to know that I have treated others the way I was treated. I hope my ex's find heeling for my bad behavior.
I never intended to become that person or do those things. Reflecting on it, I believe that I was operating from a subconscious place. I also believe that most people relate to others in a "self-preserving" way. If you aren't intentional about how you are relating, I believe that this is the human default means of having a relationship. It's shallow and doesn't risk much for the
other person involved.
Did I mention my confused state?
love him
If a youth is being gaslighted in their developmental years, can that person learn from the parent gaslighting as a coping tool?
Certainly
Yes unless you learn what not to do then you will repeat the cycle. I'm determined to not repeat it and make sure I don't do that to my husband or friends
I would call this lesson: How to deal with a perverse mind and win the battle! 😅
39:19 After I put myself into alcohol treatment at the ripe old age of 26, the focus in our family was how they all were not what I was, which was decreed to be defective. I lost my job because my sister refused to get involved when the counselor deployed emotional blackmail to try to force her attendance at the weekend family group meeting. She also refused to get my paperwork so I could save the job put into jeopardy thru that counselor's abuse. My father told me I should just settle, because I was getting old. There was more implied. Imo those rehab units are traumatizing and dangerous, when they force families to attend. I was a grownup with employment and insurance when I walked into those doors a lamb to slaughter. I had no idea it was jail, until I couldn't save my job by getting the paperwork they needed, and no one would help. This is when I mark the end of my life.
God totally rearranged my life through a series of what appeared to be tragic events in order to reposition my life in a direction that would bring real peace and happiness. This included losing my job when I was less than a year from getting a pension for retirement, starting my own business and then getting robbed multiple times and eventually I was carjacked at gunpoint and ended up in a shootout. All of that to say that on the other side of that it took each event to get me pointing in a different direction and then it led me to the right people at the right time.
I had to be completely broken down and stripped of the things that I wanted in order to get what God had for me. The last thing in this series of events was my spiritual mentor died. I had nothing left to hang onto except for God and God showed me that I should have been doing that before. I kind of was but I had to completely let go. Today I am glad for everyone who stabbed me in the back and everything that happened. No way I would be in this good of place if I had my way happen.
I read the book of Job a lot. I used to joke about what I was going to do with my she asses after being sifted like wheat.
@@boxelder9167 I was deliberately betrayed, and Job at least had a good life before it was blighted. You believe what serves you. I believe what I have experienced, and that is a lifetime of deliberately dealt evil. Death is not the worst thing that can happen to anyone.
@@kristinmeyer489 - I understand that sentiment all too well. I hope that you can find better than what was taken from you. I found that I couldn’t avoid the first wound (inflicted on me) but I learned to avoid the second wound (the one I inflicted upon myself because of what they did).
Narc pop often said, "Now dammit quit confusing me with facts. I know what I think."
It’s not that I don’t understand the unscrupulous tactics… you call faulty logic… especially after dealing with narcs most of my life. It’s that others.. the people I need help from… don’t believe me or what I’m trying to describe has occurred. I call it willful blindness. Only the LORD can straighten it out!!
Find safe people. 😢 Sorry but this is an education in itself
Tim, How do I contact you? I have some questions for you regarding a new treatment option. Thank you in advance. 36:37
Oh my mom pulled that stuff on me. A few times when I was responding to something, and she just screamed, I'm sorry, I wasn't the perfect mother and hung up the phone, and I'm sitting there thinking you weren't I mean we can't just pretend that you were a perfect motherwhy you sit there and bash other people and judge other people like you're sitting up. There on your freaking. Whatever it is Eiffel Tower, whatever that's the thing that makes you mad. And then all the lying and omitting of facts already in evidence.
One thing I noticed is 1 thing I learned and I never learned it from anybody but hunter Biden and his partner. And that's plausible, deniability, because these people think of in the situation ahead of time, most people don't do that, most people don't do that. Most people don't do that most people don't do that. Most people just heading to a situation assess it make a decision take care of it. Resolved and move on, not these already thought of what you're gonna say. How you're gonna say it. How they're going to avoid it? How they're gonna change it? How they're gonna manipulate it so that it can all end up around the word. Plausible deniability and that's what makes you feel like you're gonna go crazy
My husband would attack me because I said "you" in a sentence. Only a moron would say "you ". Could never get beyond that.
Same thing happened with my ex-wife because I had used “I” in a sentence. I learned to talk about myself in the 3rd person while in the military so this husband was having fun referring to himself as this husband. Sigh, this husband was her first but since then she just went through her 5th husband so the irony of that is alarming.
Hmmm. I love your stuff. Logically, understand how the Tu Quoque fallacy is a fallacy... From a common sense perspective, can you help me understand how it's not somewhat helpful? It seems like common sense to take diet / lifestyle advice from a fit person, instead of someone who struggles with being overweight. That doesn't mean that the advice from the overweight person is false, but it makes sense that it's less trustworthy. It makes more sense to trust someone who has experienced the outcome of the advice they are giving. Am I missing something?
In my experience of tackling distortions like this, the hardest part isn’t letting go of these strategies when they don’t serve us.
The hardest part is letting go where you feel they work.
Doctor’s role is to give advice, healthy scepticism is good. However, if you feel yourself resistive to it, examine the stories you’re telling yourself.
Use the same idea on different subjects and see if they’re less triggering.
- If he said you needed chemo would you expect him to have beaten cancer?
- Are there any ripped & fit people out there who give garbage advice?
If you are a True Christian the Bible is enough research - I mean for going astray from the laws of God,- I’m not talking about nuances or biological or physical scientific facts, and I mean facts.any human can manipulate the research so perhaps we shouldn’t offer explanations that have no real tested and proven, concrete evidence- that’s confusing to anyone who needs truth .
I find your comment to be very interesting. If I understand correctly, then I agree with you.
34:38 I disagree.
The daughter is not responsible for the death of her cat.
It was killed by the actions of the father.
Yes admittedly, they could have taken the cat with them.
But her hands caused no harm or loss.
If one human orders another to shoot someone in the head;
Who is accountable for the deliberate loss of life?
Yes, it would be through coercion (which in accordance to Common Law, is unlawful)
However;
The one (who's action) pulling the trigger is ultimately responsible.
It is free will.
That is the rule according to Natural LAW.
Natural LAW is harsh for a reason. The boundaries are clear and precise.
It cares not of the 'hows and whys'.
It is about taking responsibility for ones actions to evolve in consciousness.
Humans are expected to know the difference between right and wrong.
We are all born with a conscience ❤
Sadly now, many work from their traumatized and programmed sub-consious.
I enjoyed listening to this.
Thank you very much 🙏
He's giving an example of a fallacy or a distorsion of reality. By no means he said the gir is at fault or that she caused the cat to be killed by her father because she didn't choose him.
The girl could not win and the sole responsability falls into her father. She didn't cause anything. She was blackmailed.
I have a sincere question, it’s not judgmental or meant to be insulting. How is it you perceived him as blaming the daughter and why didn’t it make you take pause and realize that would have been contradictory to Tim’s message? My bf does this same kind of thing often and I would just like to better understand what’s happening? He never questions his own perception.
This is what oir medoa has been doing for some.uears now
I find it difficult to understand how someone with this knowledge can still subscribe to a particular religion. You basically disproved all religions in this video... this is quite frustrating I must say XD Do you believe that Christianism is true based on science and facts? Do you think all other religions are false? Maybe you have a video somewhere that explains your reasoning here?
Are you a licensed professional? Or is this all just unprofessional informative information?
Entire video just went over your head taco boy
@@sarahw7616 I didn’t even watch the video, was asking ahead of time for disclosure. Not sure why you’re attacking me though
Dr Tim Fletcher is very good and a professional counsellor and highly experienced. Also strong in faith.
Only you can confirm if you are drawn to what Tim Fletcher teaches or not. As a skeptic I find his information very enlightening ,identifiable and helpful in my trauma healing.
There are many brilliant informative teachers out there but it is up to the person /patient/ client to be open to do the hard work to help themselves.
Tim has a unique way of getting to the core of issues in a way that dissolves the confusion and complexity into clarity and simplicity that accurately maps thing out thoroughly.
thank you