2023 Subaru Plug-In Hybrid Crosstrek, Who's Buying This?! The Math Doesn't Add Up For Most!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ต.ค. 2022
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Our 2019 Crosstrek PHEV in the base hybrid trim, after factoring in a state rebate and federal tax credit, cost about $3,500 less than the gas-powered model with the comparable "limited" trim. We're getting 68mpg, our real-world EV range averages around 20 miles and it only costs us 52 cents in electricity to fully charge the battery at home. Mileage can be increased by using the "save" mode at highway speeds on trips beyond the 20-mile EV range, and most of our driving beyond the EV range is in the mountains. The extra torque of the electric motor actually makes it better at crawling over steep terrain and in sport mode we can easily pass going uphill in short passing zones on curvy mountain roads. We've never had an issue with the slightly reduced cargo space either. I guess we're among those owners that can take full advantage of all the benefits the PHEV has to offer.
In pure hybrid mode what do you average mpg wise without the EV mode? On a road trip on the highway what type of mpg can you average?
I'm so happy you're talking about the Crostrack again
19:55 this statement perfectly sums up the problem with how you calculated the average fuel cost. There are variables that would drastically reduce the amount of fuel you use, rather than just a general, rudimentary mileage calculation. Most people in urban and suburban areas live less than 10 miles from at least half of the places they visit. Whether it's the grocery store, dropping kids off at school, etc. Most of these places could be travelled to without going over 17 miles, round trip. That's where the cost saving kicks in.
For me personally, I live 2 miles away from my job, half a mile away from the grocery store, and I'm 22 miles away from downtown Oklahoma City. That is a massive amount of fuel savings. I currently drive a WRX that I'm getting close to $10k built up in equity. I'm planning on selling it and buying a plug in hybrid because it will save me more than half of my fuel costs.
Just because something doesn't suit your needs, it does not mean it doesn't suit anybody's needs
Great information from the great guy Mr. Subaru. Thanks Mr. Subaru.
My 21 sport has been treating me very nicely so far :) PYP color of course, because you gotta
Going forward, as a salesmen. An owner of a '21 Sport trek and a '19 Series.Gray STI SEND IT on the sport trek. If you don't need the size of the forester, or the added features of the outback its a no brainer. the 2.5 is incredible, the startex is great for average people actually using their vehicle. Were debating a wilderness in 2 years ish time for similar reasons though needing a bigger overall package. shame it doesnt come in CGK yet
Everyones use case is different, but with us, ALL of our errands/daily driving routes are under 20 miles round trip and we are in the Suburbs not a city center. A PHEV with 20 miles of range would allow 95%+ of our daily driving to be EV only. The Crosstrek PHEV has a bit too short of range though, would prefer something like 30-40 miles of EV only range. Our next car will be a PHEV for sure, especially with the upcoming $7500 rebate (In 2024... 2023 will still be the tax-based credit) and the possibility of qualifying for more rebates from the state.
I thought I heard something about the car, or parts of it, needing to be assembled in the USA, in order to qualify for the upcoming rebates. Did I hear or incorrectly understand that?
@@m3rdpwr yes, it's 2 rebates that's equal 7k, to get one I think 90% of the battery has to be made in USA and to get the other 90% of the raw materials have to be mined in north america.. the details may be a little off but that's the basic framework, good luck finding a car that qualifies for both
@@andrewscott8892 I'm pretty sure you're right, that sounds familiar.
@@m3rdpwr That is correct. I'm sure Subaru will start doing Hybrid drivetrains in the US built cars soon.
@@stevemartegani I heard they have a 1.8 turbo in Japan. I wonder if they're going to bring that to the US, and phase out the 2.5 L NA.
past owner of 2009 Legacy 5 speed, current owner of 2017 crosstrek 5 speed 2021 crosstrek 6 speed. with all these my only changes I wish I could make are a larger gas tank, leather interior option, and the larger 4 cylinder engine (2.5 liter). over all I love my Subarus.
For you, Mr. Subaru, the hybrid isn't an option. It isn't sold in your state. I sell Subarus and think the hybrid is a piece of junk.
Love your videos!
Yes! You are now talking about my current vehicle, the 2023 Crosstrek Limited PHEV. I traded in my Outdoor and picked up my PHEV Trek mid-September. I went with the Lagoon Blue and in Canada it already comes with the moonroof + Harmon Kardon stereo and 8" infotainment upgrade. I went with the roof rails and crossbars, rainguards, already had the kayak and bike racks, bumper guard and weather mat set for the interior.
I live in Montréal and do a 400Km roundtrip every week to Gatineau and back. I never use gas in Montréal or Gatineau regardless of the traffic and the range, that is seemingly very low, gets me where I need to go with nightly charges and regen braking in the traffic, at lights, etc. For my 400 Km roundtrip, the Atkinson's cycle has been getting me an average of 6.9L/100Km (~34 MPG) in Save mode. I get this running my racks, usually against heavy wind and decent hill traversal for this trip. I also travel packed to the gills with tools and luggage. In other words, I am not running in high efficiency gas saving mode, but I am still getting good gas mileage.
When it comes to power, I hear all sorts of fears and complaints due to the on-paper ratings. The take off in EV mode, putting my foot less than half way down, stays in EV and I always have to re-adjust my speed as I get up to speed faster than I expect. I do not have trouble passing at highway speeds and I drive a freaking lot of highway. Honestly, it is really fun to drive IMO.
One important thing that I have to say is that I did not buy this Trek to "save money." This is not realistic considering the 15K more you pay to have the Hybrid. I bought it to not spew Carbon Monoxide everywhere when stuck in traffic and driving around cities and in this respect it is really satisfying to me. I also do not mind the plugging in as we have decent electric infrastructure in Québec and there are always chargers around places that I need to run errands or around parks. I charge my battery typically to 80-90% and almost never to 100% and it still gets me more electric mileage daily than is listed on paper. I typically charge between 1 and 1.5 hours at a level 2 and plug into the house for 3-4 hours.
I can still pack everything that I need into the back, even though you lose some storage space due to the battery. This is coming from a guy who packs tools, computers, clothes for 4-5 days, sometimes bikes, kayak gear and photography gear every week. Same that I was able to fit in my Outdoor. There is less space, but not enough of a loss to keep me from packing what I need without dropping the seats.
I do visit the gas station far less than when I owned my 2021 Crosstrek Outdoor and I spend less at each fillup for sure.
Personally, I love my Trek PHEV. But I know that I am not in the majority hehe.
i read that the battery recharges from the engine especially with highway driving. Have you noticed an appreciable increase in mileage due to this?
@Philip Fabrizio Well, this process that you speak of is called Charge Mode. It has to be manually enabled to use this mode and it uses about a gallon more per hour when it this mode. It is a thermodynamics fail tbh. I use "Save Mode" on the highway, which will switch between EV and boxer engine when applicable and save you mileage while not burning your battery down from consistent highway speeds without regen braking. In the city, I use excusively EV mode and the engine never kicks in unless I burn the battery down to ~10-15% charge. This is rare since I charge every night and the regen potential that I have from the traffic and hills allows me to do all of my "in-city" driving in EV. I love my Crosstrek PHEV and I do a lot of city driving as well as a weekly 500k+ km highway trip every week.
I ordered a loaded '21 Crosstrek Limited in August of last year. Couldn't be more happy with it at this point.
We have a few other vehicles, including a Toyota 4 Runner Limited. Offroading isn't what we got the Subie for, it's more for traveling and just a daily get-around vehicle that'll get mid 30's mpg.
With old man winter in the horizon, we need a updated winter prep video. 2022 edition.
PHEV's and EV's are NOT sold on the premise of saving fuel cost.
While you will save a little, particularly if you are charging at home off peak and primarily just commuting, the primary reasons to purchase these vehicles are to win energy independence from countries like Saudi Arabia and Iran, and to reduce pollutants by burning 80% less gasoline per year
Good breakdown! 😎👍
Another thing to consider is that a lot of states charge you extra to register your PHEV than a normal ICE vehicle.
I heard from a guy in the repo business that banks are repossessing 8,000 vehicles per day, on average. So if you wait, you can get a much better deal. Banks are not able to sell these cars at auction because their asking price is too high. Eventually they will need to reduce used car prices if they want to move this massive glut of used vehicles on bank lots. This will eventually translate to lower prices on dealer lots. Patience is key.
Also, keep in mind people who buy this may live in an apartment and may have nowhere to plug this into charge it during the day or evening. I was reading an article, and they said if you live in Massachusetts or California, you should buy the hybrid model, because of the rebates being offered. That being said, I don't know if I could get myself to buy a hybrid. My current truck is a 2014 ram Laramie crew cab. I only drive it 5,000-6,000 mi a year, and it only has about 44,000 mi on it right now. I've been looking for something smaller to drive for when I have to head into Boston and parking can be a pain. I've been looking at the Subaru's, because being in Massachusetts, I wanted a good winter car when not driving the truck. The Outback has been one of my choices, because I now have a second dog and it might be good for traveling.
I have a 2020 Crosstrek Hybrid with 50,000 miles on it - so far nothing has gone wrong. If you compare to a like-optioned vehicle (not a base model), the savings are easier to find. The Hybrid comes standard with automatic climate, bigger infotainment screen, etc. and can't be optioned down.
Thanks for all the work you put into this video. Also some states give tax incentives for buying an electric car. I don't know how all that works but I think in California it's $7000. Not sure but I heard something like that.
Your math works for a rural driver, however a person in an urban environment would save much more and get more electric driving due to regenerative braking. For example people complain about start-stop, on my 2019 Forester it saves about 0.1 gal/tank of few per tank when I’m at my house in a fairly rural area. In NYC area, where I spend most of my time as I work on Long Island, Start-Stop can save over 2 gal/tank, as traffic can have you sitting stopped for more than 3 hours per tank of gas, letting a car idle all that time is just foolish waste of money.
Bought a 2022 in April and it was cheaper then a used 21!! First time in my life that buying new was cheaper!!
Went through the Costco auto program! Beat deal in town!
The numbers aren't entirely valid. If you are wanting to produce a video about the cost savings of getting the hybrid vs standard gasoline engine it would have been more appropriate to use the Limited VS Hybrid model for comparison. The limited has Harmon/Kardon sound system upgrade available as well as comes with standard leather interior just as the Hybrid does.
No. The biggest problem for me is that it’s neutered for mpg. I want performance with my hybrid. If it had a turbo 2.4 or turbo 2.5 I’d definitely buy one.
Imagine a vehicle with a gas generator and an electric transmission and small storage. That would be fun to drive.
Fantastic job.
@MrSubaru1387 Hi, thank you for the informative video. My partner and I were really interested in trying to get a hybrid Crosstrek, but now I have some concerns.
Out of curiosity is there another hybrid of approximate similar size and price point that you would recommend?
Same thing happened to me. Back in 2016 I was ordering a base model Outback and the dealership had a used 2014 base model Outback with about 20,000 miles on it. They wanted about a $1,000 more for the used one than a new one. I was pressing the sales person why the used one was more than the new one and he didn't have a reasonable answer. He got annoyed with me and finally said, "why don't you just get the new one?" which I did.
I say go for it on the new sport. A fine choice in my opinion. I'm in a '17 hyper blue crosstrek limited. Just put some Falken Wildpeaks on it. It's been a great car.
One thing in favor of the Hybrid reliability-wise is that it's the only Subaru CVT that does not use a chain. Theoretically, out of all the transmissions Subaru makes today (including manuals), the Hybrid CVT should be the most reliable.
excellent point, the hybrid uses the prius prime eCVT transmission and thats certainly going to be reliable. i hope they use the same system in the Crosstrek hybrid (not plug in). I don't mind the plug in but 17 miles EV range isn't much
i meant the upcoming Crosstrek hybrid
First two minutes of this video totally vindicates me buying a new 2023 crosstrek, receiving it in two weeks and of course CGK
I just got a brand new 2023 Subaru Crosstrek here in BC Canada for $35900.00 CAD. I’m very happy with it so far. I’ve put 10000 kms (6213 miles) on it since early August. I’ve already given it it’s first oil change at 7000 kms. (4350 miles)I commute to work quite a few times a month about 250 miles each way over 2 high mountain passes, it’s a great car for that. I’m getting about 36 miles per gallon on average on the commute.
I've "done the math" for pure EVs in my area. This is important for people living in areas like me, in New England where we're supplied with electricity generated with natural gas and with pipelines strangled making natural gas 3 times what it is in the midwest. So today, my electricity is $0.33 per kWh. My electric company, Eversource has announced that rates are going up 60%. I assume this is only on the generation side, so it's going to be $0.45 per kWh. Now, with gas, I constantly get "gas points" from my supermarket so get huge discounts. Last fill up, retail was $3.70 a gallon and my price was $2.00 a gallon. Take all that and a Tesla Model 3 costs 12 cents a mile to run and my 19 Crosstrek Premium manual getting 35 mpg costs me 8 cents a mile. So my $22k Crosstrek will always cost less than a $50k single motor Model 3 with no options. I could do the same calculation with the Crosstrek hybrid but I'd have to also throw in the solenoid controller failure for the CVT. My older 13 Crosstrek limited had the CVT replaced by Subaru under warranty at 53k miles. The controller failed and the $800 part replaced at 150k miles. We're currently approaching 185k miles so I have no complaints as I'm from the 70's and remember that any car that was over 80k miles and not in the junkyard was rare.
$0.45 per kWh? That's nuts! I pay $0.095 Canadian per kWh... so about $0.07 US per kWh 😀 And before I switched to the flat rate, I had a dual rate with an oil/electric furnace. All year long, as long as outside temp was over -12C (10F) I paid only $0.045 Canadian per kWh ($0.034 US), and when under that temp it was a "pricey" $0.28 Canadian per kWh ($0.21 US). Sadly since my oil furnace it too old I only run it in electric mode, so I've switched to the flat electricity pricing.
Thanks for the video take care of yourself. Gas is 4.09 in NW Wisconsin.
$3.30 here in SC
$6.74 per US Gallon (in the UK)! Note that this is 95RON and now 10% Ethanol.
If you want Premium 98RON 5% Ethanol then is about 9-12% more expensive.
6.60 here in California
I'm sticking with my Gen 4 Outbacks. No cracking windshields, no safety-nannies jerking the wheel or clamping on the binders, no sketchy entertainment "might work, honest!" system that needs endless updating, no start-stop. Adding a plug-in hybrid to any Subaru adds more non-value added complication and opportunity for failures (and a very close and intimate relationship with your friendly Subaru service department!). Subaru contracted the same disease of "New! Cutting Edge! High-Tech! Car of the Future Now!" that most other manufacturers suffer from making the "lucky new owners" the Beta testers for all this stuff (and service departments wealthier). I don't dislike the brand but I'll likely never purchase another 2015 or later Subaru vehicle.
I have one and none of those things have occurred.
@@suspicionofdeceit ...yet. There - fixed it for you.
Nice! The Sport is a great choice. I live in Quebec and bought the 2021 Crosstrek Outdoor in October of 2020 and absolutely loved it! It also came with the 2.5L and I can attest to the fun factor and power boost. Dual X-Mode was nice to, living in the center of snowland ;)
Battery on this is quite simply in the wrong place. Because they did the Prius Prime cheap-out, it's five cubic feet off the cargo space and to add insult to injury they blocked off the spare wheel well, just like on the 2016-22 Prius Prime. If they'd put the battery under the back seat where it belongs, and incorporated full-size cargo space and a spare wheel, I'd be a lot more interested.
That wheel design is perfect on the Sport, and the extra power. I'd rather see a turbo diesel model than the hybrid, even with the sky high price of fuel. Gravity is the same for all Crosstreks. It's the mass that differs :)
I was/am interested in this but ideally would rather an Outback EV/PHEV
Same. I'm holding out for an Outback hybrid or PHEV.
Don't forget about financing fees on top of the base prices. A loan on the cost of the vehicle would make these total costs go even higher.
I've got a 2017 subaru legacy 2.5i sport I'm looking to see if it is worth it for me to switch to the 2.4L turbo engine for the extra power?
The list of Accessories available with the US Version is insane we get the basic stuff and that is it :/ but we are getting the new 2023 Outback Touring next Jan/Feb up from the 2022 Outback Sports we currently owe at the moment
It may not be right for much of the country but there are enough consumers in cities that get mixed weather to help this car make sense. I'm a city dweller and most of my destinations are under 17 miles away. When I had a daily commute it was 14 to 17 miles (depending if I avoided tolls). If I could have charged at work this car would have practically functioned as an EV. When not in EV mode city traffic brings out the best of a hybrid. That said, this car makes no sense for me now, without a regular short daily commute.
The hybrid battery life has been fantastic on Toyotas. However, they have not used lithium up until recently since lithium does not hold up well in extreme environments. The one thing that kills batteries faster is lack of use. I have seen hybrid batteries fail just from not being driven, like an 8yr old Prius or Camry with 30-40k miles. Yet 300k+ hybrid batteries are still doing well.
Just had a thought on the new car being cheaper. Would the dealer be incentives to sell the new car lower because it'll get reported to SOA (or subaru in general)? With the used, it wouldn't matter since it's been out of the inventory. I also have no clue how dealers work and stuff though.
Not me my power goes out once month on average. Ice storm took it out for 3 weeks once.. longest outage was 5 weeks. It's 24 to 48 hours after a thunderstorm. it's 30 min one way for me just to get to the post office. Grocery store an hour with clear roads.
The hybrid models have 0 trunk space because the battery is located under the trunk. Was hoping they would fix this with a 2023 model refresh, but COVID caused them to forego the refresh and carry over the 2022 design.
Thanks for the shopping comparison, I like this type of video. Maybe I missed it but did you include the cost of electricity to power those 17 miles per day? That makes the hybrid worse in the comparison. However, the 2.0 liter 6-speed manual gets 29 mpg highway, not 33. That makes the hybrid look better, so probably a wash. Anyway, $41k for a Crosstrek is just nuts. Even $32k for the Sport seems high, especially when an Outback with sunroof and more equipment (not to mention a nicer car) is only about $3k more with similar mpg.
that's the flaw here, you need to do a daily average and credit in the 17miles each day.
I don’t mind the black plastic on the cross trek, sure as hell doesn’t belong on the WRX in my opinion… it’s so sad that Subaru won’t offer a turbo variant for the cross trek, wonder what the EZ36D would’ve been like in this car obviously it’s a pretty heavy engine..
I love Subaru''s and have owned several and still own and cherish my V5 STi Type RA. But the maths when it comes to Subaru (at least here in the UK) hasn't added up for some time. Example, 40k for a Forester!! That puts it in to seriously competitive territory. You can get a brand new BMW 340i xdrive touring for that - I know what I'm getting.
For real.
I have a 2023 Sport in CGK. You built the exact spec I ordered lol except I went with weathertech. Absolutely love everything about it.. almost bout it in white until I saw CGK in person. Why would I spend $2500 more for a 2021 at my local dealer? The 2022 was $3500 more with 10k miles. Also add about $2500-$3000 in taxes and fees on top of that..
I will happily keep my 2.5L
For someone with a short enough commute to be able to run mostly on electric, whats the best strategy for keeping the gas in the gas tank fresh? I would think this might be an issue. Otherwise, i would much prefer the range flexibility of a hybrid vs. Limited range of an all electric. Are there any tax incentives for hybrids? How much might the battery pack cost to replace? Does the gas engine have the same maintenance cost and schedule for the hybrid as a gas only vehicle? There are MANY questions.
I drove a Chevy Volt for ~3 years, which has a 50+ mile EV range before it cuts over to gas. I think I only went through 2 tanks of gas the entire time I owned the car and the short answer is that it wasn't a problem. If I understand it correctly, Chevy engineers pressurized the tank to help the gas life, and the car was smart enough at the 2 year mark to turn the engine on and force me to use the gas in the tank before it went bad. I also didn't see any battery degradation in the time I owned the car, but if I had, we're really just talking about a little less EV range before it turns into a regular hybrid.
I finally got rid of the car because it was small and uncomfortable to drive, but the plug-in hybrid system made it the best car I've owned from a drivetrain perspective.
The major thing I didn't like about the sport trim(outdoor here in Canada) is no LED headlights. Wouldn't be a problem if they were halogen projectors, but they are just reflectors and awful. The same headlights my 2015 impreza touring had. I upgraded the bulbs to high output LEDs and they were still awful. Couldn't see anything for most of the day here in Winter. The LED headlights on a 21 crosstrek limited I test drove were incredible compared. If the Sport just had LED headlights it would be amazing. Maybe on the new 24.
LEDs work just fine until they freeze over with ice and snow then they're worthless, I put additional halogens on my outback because it had LED headlights, driving in Alaska
Yes they are terrible, I have the base and it’s my only real disappointment.
If I were picking between the EV and the Hybrid, I'd probably go with the Hybrid. But I'd probably pick my regular old 6 cylinder over the hybrid.
So, what your views on those subaru hybrids such as forester hybrid?. Which technology is better in terms of fuel consumption?.😊
Does this plug-in hybrid qualify for Federal or State rebates?
Depends on everybody situation cause I have a plug-in hybrid and to drop off kids at school and drive around town I’m able to charge every time a get back home and put 900 miles sometimes 500 miles and only cost around 45 bucks to fill the tank so for me works out! Driving on electric a lot it will use less of the fuel engine so it might last longer and less repairs!
Awsome presentation Mr. subaru. 👍Please give some thought on saving us the trouble, as you already did the whole exercise for us…….comparative grid end specs calculation on power cost , overall g/mi over 8.4 years. You would be greatly appreciated .🌹
A phev only makes sense if most of your driving is in ev mode. I use my volt for driving around town (under 30 miles a day) and the occasional road trip. I use about 18 gallons of gas a year.
I’m at 75,000 miles on my forester spark plugs…. Go ahead, gimme a yellin. I’ll get around to them eventually.
Thanks for all the great Subby content
Best review I’ve seen great job on the comparison… I drive a EV in upstate NY the car is not great on sub zero weather reduced range .. going back to gas or a hybrid… but the cost of plug in .. that is a toyota system maybe not a good option … looking at the cost ! Thanks for doing the math !
All we've wanted since 2013 is a Crosstrek XT!.... So sad they never did this. At least they finally gave it a 2.5
Plus interest rates are high
Lol.... just wait a little while... gonna be TONS of used cars coming out of Florida soon....
The market will be flooded.
ETA: damn.... that hybrid crossy weighs more than my OB
We have a woman in our Subaru legacy group that works at the Subaru plant SIA I’ll have to ask her how Subaru production is going!
Not just saving at the pump... For me it was brakes. 205k miles on my hybrid before selling with original brakes. Don't just pay attention to gas savings. I happen to have solar as well and which 17 miles would fully cover most of commuting miles. (Though I can charge my car for free on the work side of it as well).
Ignore that and just pay attention to brakes. Glad he compared to sport because that's where you really should be comparing.
Just please stop forgetting brakes people. Cost me $1500 to replace my battery and I kept the old one.
I guess it'll take more time for people to actually drive them and see they're not the plague like many people paint them to be.
I've been told that there's not one Subaru dealership in Pennsylvania selling hybrids or EVs due to a state law that requires the dealership to maintain a charging station for every 10 units sold per year, at an initial cost of around $60k per charging station. So, a dealership that sells 50 in a year needs to install 5 of those charging stations (a $300k investment). If they sell 80 the next year, they need to add 3 more charging stations. There is a huge incentive to NOT sell them from an economic standpoint for the dealership, nevermind the MSRP for the buyer.
Hello guys, i got a 2002 Legacy GX 2.5 (left hand side steering wheel). is it possible to swap my old engine with a JDM 2.0 twin turbo engine?
“Life of the vehicle” should be 15-20 years or 2-300000 miles, for cars with a decent power train, and reasonable maintenance.
Now, that would be the case if the natural, un-distorted market demand met car manufacturing. But instead, market demand meets eco-maniacs that force insane environmental requirements on the car companies.
This fiasco results in new cars that are poorly built by design in order to have marginally better gas mileage.
2021 Crosstrek Sport (cool khaki grey) 22,000 mi = $30,246, right now at Williams Subaru.
That is so funny the sport model was the same price as my 13 3.6 R Limited, that was MSRP I walked out of the Subaru dealer the same dang price as the base model 27,5ish 🤘
The 2.5 with the manual would be a good combo
Hey, I recently found your channel. I placed an order for a hybrid Crosstrek a couple months ago, and now your video has me thinking of switching that over to a limited or sport package. I do think that I could work around that. If I take the shuttle bus out to my job site, I ordinarily drive 10-15 miles per day. But I do like to go up to the mountains and I’m fairly outdoorsy…
That literally happened to me with a 2020 Crosstrek premium not even the 2.5L for 32k and If I ordered a brand new Sport one with the 2.5L it was around 31k
Thank you for this great comparison! There are two factors that are important to add to this as well. First, if there are any rebates that may factor into the purchase. I live in Canada, so am not fully qualified to discuss any available American rebates that may be available. The rebate amount may be the difference in COO as demonstrated in the video. Second, is the environmental factor. Yes, hybrids may not be the best CO2 wise, but it is still better than a gas only vehicle. Thanks again for a great video!
We have a $4500 Federal tax credit. Aka worthless in the pricing.
I would like a hybrid, but mostly because you can run the AC on battery when car camping (engine will come on to refill battery every couple bhours or so). Better MPG really just a bonus. But getting anything other than a Toyota hybrid is stupid, and unfortunately they are now priced out of the range I would like to pay.
Does anyone else like to just go to websites and build cars for fun? (Just, don't submit them so that dealerships will contact you!).
It's like playing Gran Turismo or something... minus the driving part.
While watching this video, I decided to go play around on the Subaru website and built out a 2023 Outback Onyx XT. (I have a 2021 Onyx XT btw). I kind of like the front end on the 2023's. The round foglights are something I'd kill for right now, as well as the black trim around the windows. My current Onyx XT had chrome window trim and vertical rectangular fog lights. You can't go aftermarket for the fogs without buying specially made mounting brackets, in which only one or two places sell. Upgrades fog lights will cost me $800 w/o tax, so forget doing that anytime soon. The window trim is a PIA and looks stupid with all the other black trim parts. I ended up just adding vinyl to my window trim (I bought 3M vinyl, used vinyl primer + edge sealer, and did everything myself... carefully. No pre-cut kits!). It looks so much better!
I was also surprised to see that the 2023 Onyx XT doesn't have a sunroof option. Mine has one. I don't use it much due to Texas heat, but winter and Autumn are really nice to have a sunroof here. I'm also surprised to see that there are now two types of Outback Onyx Editions- a Base and an XT. That was just interesting to me!
For what it's worth, I LOVE my '21 Onyx. The window trim was my number one complaint, followed by the fogs (they seemed useless, but that's because I immediately put a yellow film over them after buying my car. I've now removed that, and they are much brighter. I just haven't had a chance to use them in the rain yet... again... Texas). My third complaint would just be the half-screen Android Auto (soon to be fixed!) and that my phone takes like 5 attempts to connect to the car's Android Auto. (And it's a new and modern phone!). Not sure if that's my cable or what.
The Crosstrek PHEV would be perfect for people living in NYC, but Subaru could have made the Forester PHEV with a bit more electric range.
Thorough and pretty fair. But there are more people in your "specific buyer" category than you might think. Still, Subaru is discontinuing development on PHEVs for now for this reason. Not enough people can make the math work. Looking forward to possibly picking up a used one some day, when they've dropped to the sub-20k range. With solar on the roof, and solar at our farm 18 miles away, we could do the trip mostly on free electric, and have a decent longer-trip car as well.
The old Crosstrek hybrid was wonderful... for me. For the customer the special alternator and battery lasts about 100k miles and cost almost 2000 bucks. The lifetime fuel savings was about 10 gallons on all but one I've seen. Electric Subarus are a bad idea. Even with Toyota help the engineers have not proven capable to the task. Here comes the rav 4 I mean soltera.
Did I miss you saying that Subaru Plug-In Hybrid has the whole different Toyota-like eCVT in it? No belt, no chain, just gears and MGs. Gonna save by not having to replace the conventional Subaru's CVT!
hybrid might work small trips in small towns and if own past 8 years.
I have a Crosstrek hybrid plug in. Although the spec say 17 miles full electric, I have been getting 30 or more. One trip to dealer over 25 ,miles one way I had about 40 percent battery left. I finally had a chance to get some info from Subaru hybrid tech. And on line search. The type of driving I predominantly do is town or small city. The nature of stop and go and coasting charges the battery as well has speeds ranging from 25 to top 40.
Highway I use hybrid I have, so far close to 400 miles in five weeks, used 1.4 gallons of gas. Unfortunately cost of electricity in Ma. With national grid is pushing driving electric over cost of gas so I will go hybrid more often. I did not choose Subaru for hybrid but safety features standard w hybrid model.
Symmetrical drive a major plus.
I have 2 questions. I have a 1981 subaru dl hatchback 1.6 engine. I am having trouble getting power to the electric fuel pump. I have hotwired the fuel pump and it works. I have checked everything under the hood but have yet to find what is causing it to not have power. Can you help me with this?
Because of a wreck that was not my fault I need to buy a new car. I am over 65 and need a comfortable car. I am looking at the 2023 Subaru Legacy Limited. Do you have an ideal the best and the worse of the vehicle?
Paul
I'd check the gauge of that hot wire if that's the way you want to go and buff the ground. Buffing and testing the grounds fixed all of my electrical issues in my 84 gl.
@@thesayerofing Thanks for your input. This will help me. Thanks again.
In not sure but should this plug-in hybrid be eligible for federal and state EV credits?
With those credits, the higher cost of the hybrid model will/may be negated.
Idk about you, but a tax credit is meaningless for me.
In late 2021 I bought a 2021 model year crosstrek PHEV and then promptly got the $4500 federal tax credit 2 months later when I filed my taxes. I think the laws were reworked in summer 2022 so the tax credits may have gone away on hybrids made in Japan. That’s a big issue. With inventory low we got what we could find a base model PHEV with no options for msrp. The base PHEV is supposedly similar to a limited trim and it seems nice enough. We use it for commuting to work 9 miles away from the house 5 days a week and occasional road trips. We put 13k miles on it in 11 months and it’s been great so far. My other car is a 2020 outback premium which we use for the family trips.
Got a 2021 Trek Sport .. lifted it 2" .. aluminum skid plate .. BFG KO2's in 225/65 17" .. cross braced the front struts and have a few more goodies on it. I live in the car on the road .. it's my mini RV. Love the car. but would sell it in a heart beat .. why? The electronics suck big time! My old Ford Explorer, that's my other rig, and in 10 years I've never had a close call with it .. the Trek I've had 3 close call's this past year all caused by the freaking electronic nannies. 27K miles $32K firm .. LOL🤠
I was hoping you would shoot for the manual Robert!
it would make sense if you only drove to work that was 8 miles away, then back home lol
The current cost is the main issue because hybrids are a stop gap measure to the future, even current EVs that use Lithium-ion batteries is a dead end road ultimately. Won’t be until battery takes a leap in technology that EVs can truely take over, Sodium-ion batteries look like the future.
I would wait for the all new 2024 at this point.
Better get the strut tower brace as well. There is a video on y tube of someone who installed one on his Crosstrek…
Big improvement in handling!
I have one car thats 55 years old, so...I'll take that in writing Subaru.
Thanks for approaching this in a realistic financial way. We keep our vehicles longer than most, so the battery cost alone makes this a deal breaker.
& with the hybrid you loose your spare tire.
Yup
Yeah, forced to run those expensive run flats.
All those accessories don't even count the labor cost of the dealership. Putting it in You better add about 2k.
i dont like the bells in whistles on the limited, so i got a sport
Another thing to think about is they just use Hybrid as a selling word. Most people don't do the math like you have done to realize it's not a good idea. Also, one other negative I'd say of Hybrids is thermal runaway if ever you were in an accident where that could be an issue.
I would buy one if the price wasn't THAT much of an increase. $3k I would do.
The electric motor would get me to and from work on one charge so would save a lot of gas. Spread that over the length of time I would own it and that would eventually pay for itself.
The plug-in hybrid prices are stupid though. Toyota Rav4 Prime is insanely priced compared to the regular hybrid.
The plug-in hybrid price will eventually normalize, just like the hybrid has so maybe my next car will be plug-in (maybe full electric Subaru that isn't an overpriced Soltera?)
The Soltera battery has a 10 year warranty. I assume the Crosstrek would be the same, so in theory buying the Crosstrek Hybrid today you shouldn't have to worry about it. Unless you are Mr Subaru and drive the car for 20 years like his LL Bean Outback...
You nailed it. The Hybrid I tested in the UK, 2.0 was horrible. Engine cutting in out all the time and although it was unobtrusive it was annoying. It was less economical than my 2.5 my19 Outback. Then factor in added complexity and less space cargo wise… What I’d like to see here in the UK is the 2.5 but we only get the 2.0 Hybrid.
Vary good
Too bad Subaru is stingy on multimedia screen size on the Sport at 6.5in, 7-8in is pretty much standard on most cards. Another nickel and dime from Subaru. Also, no lumbar is what gets me.
Hello, 2001 Subaru Forester sport, idles fine, bogges out when I push accelerator, full throttle is 20mph at most. Have to full throttle to pull up driveway minimal slope.