@John, for redundant tooling there’s a great way to rely on the secondary tool cutting to size. This is something we do regularly, I’m in large scale manufacturing. Disclaimer: This does require having all tooling pre set, best case using a pre setter external to the machine or the setter inside the lathe. This should be common knowledge though. When setting up a part and the machine is warm, throw in a fresh insert on the tool you want redundant tooling for. Run the program to turn the feature and measure that feature with something reliable. If you need to make an adjustment to get it to size make that adjustment in your tool path inside the NC code. We have found if you set up tools when they are fresh using this concept and then swapping to a redundant with a known tool length that parts hold tolerance when swapping tools. This works because you’re technically re-setting back to what the tool pressure/tool geometry effects when a fresh insert is loaded. We are basically cheating the code to give you a turned part to size when a new similar tool is called up. Some say that’s not proper programming etiquette but that’s the reality of mass production and this is how we have found to get redundant tools to repeat in size. This does require a stable machine with rigid work holding and tooling but I think you have that covered in your application.
meijertech Tool life management is essentially a macro that’s built into the control. You could definitely write your own macro and set a tool life limit after x runs that swaps to the next station when you encounter x. Not having tool management means you will need to reference the new position offset that is specific to that tool. Hypothetically tool 1 and 2 are like tools and 2 is the redundant to 1. When 1 hits the end of tool life you set at x then you want to call up tool 2 as your new tool 1 using the offsets specific to tool 2. Without having tool management you’ll have to call up the tool number as a variable let’s say B. At the beginning or end of your program you’ll have some statement that looks similar to B= 1 + y where y initially equals 0. Y will be another statement as your count loop for tool life initially equal to 0 and will equal 1 when tool life is met. This will require changing variables when you’re finished with all redundants and id recommend writing a diagram and work instruction as not to forget the logic and make it simple for operators.
Hi John, I work at a shop in the Netherlands and we also have a GT13. Really lovely machine. I now have Iscar OD modular tools because I found out it was easier and faster to change tips. We also have 2 Nakamura AS200-L. They are good machines too so I really liked your vision on bothe the Tornos and on the Nakamura. Always nice to hear what someone else thinks about the exact same machine and what they make on it. Greetzz from the other side of the water 👍
Also a tip to the guy who made this, check out wiper inserts or a large nose radius and cleaning up the radius with a smaller radius tool or undercutting. Swiss has enough rigidity to make the additional tool pressure negligible as long as your setup is correct.
What’s the price range on a GT13? Depends on the options, of course, but are we talking $100k or $300k? I know you want to make your parts in-house, but have you done a video on the business / financial side of justifying the purchase?
i Wonder if the part counter was at max part count made , this is why it was running in single part mode, i know our citizen does this when it gets to max parts made
Or maybe the Fanuc Control was set to Setting mode instead of Machining mode. That can happen on our newer machines, they only produce one part in that case.
Hold on... You said this completely backwards. The main side always makes a part. The sub does not. Also this is not a problem that has anything to do with swiss machining. It has to do with sub-spindle machining of any sort.
Hey John, are you aware of the incredibly stupid knife laws that classify flipper knives a prohibited weapon in Canada? According to the government website its considered an automatic. I found out cuz i recently had a knife confiscated at the border.
@@12345NoNamesLeft Automatic knife - An automatic knife is one that houses a blade that will open automatically by applying hand pressure to a button, spring, lever, or other device, in or attached to the handle of the knife, including knives that have a button, spring, lever, or other device, located in the spine of the handle and attached to the inner part of the blade. That's what it says on the website. Doesn't say its prohibited to import it just says classifies any flipper an auto and therefore making it illegal to own in Canada
@@simonn611 So basically although Johns's knive arn't automatic and require the person to actaully flip it (manually) they lump them in as automatic...That sucks. At least its not as bad as over here - cant even make any knifes like John does, nor sell them - people have gotten around it tho - bascially you "buy" the handle then "buy" the blade as an optional extra (and so cannot be sold fully aseembled only in parts).
@John, for redundant tooling there’s a great way to rely on the secondary tool cutting to size. This is something we do regularly, I’m in large scale manufacturing.
Disclaimer: This does require having all tooling pre set, best case using a pre setter external to the machine or the setter inside the lathe. This should be common knowledge though.
When setting up a part and the machine is warm, throw in a fresh insert on the tool you want redundant tooling for. Run the program to turn the feature and measure that feature with something reliable. If you need to make an adjustment to get it to size make that adjustment in your tool path inside the NC code. We have found if you set up tools when they are fresh using this concept and then swapping to a redundant with a known tool length that parts hold tolerance when swapping tools. This works because you’re technically re-setting back to what the tool pressure/tool geometry effects when a fresh insert is loaded. We are basically cheating the code to give you a turned part to size when a new similar tool is called up. Some say that’s not proper programming etiquette but that’s the reality of mass production and this is how we have found to get redundant tools to repeat in size. This does require a stable machine with rigid work holding and tooling but I think you have that covered in your application.
Do you need to have Tool Life Management option to make redunndant tooling to work or could you make it with a macro?
meijertech
Tool life management is essentially a macro that’s built into the control. You could definitely write your own macro and set a tool life limit after x runs that swaps to the next station when you encounter x. Not having tool management means you will need to reference the new position offset that is specific to that tool. Hypothetically tool 1 and 2 are like tools and 2 is the redundant to 1. When 1 hits the end of tool life you set at x then you want to call up tool 2 as your new tool 1 using the offsets specific to tool 2. Without having tool management you’ll have to call up the tool number as a variable let’s say B. At the beginning or end of your program you’ll have some statement that looks similar to B= 1 + y where y initially equals 0. Y will be another statement as your count loop for tool life initially equal to 0 and will equal 1 when tool life is met. This will require changing variables when you’re finished with all redundants and id recommend writing a diagram and work instruction as not to forget the logic and make it simple for operators.
Hi John, I work at a shop in the Netherlands and we also have a GT13. Really lovely machine.
I now have Iscar OD modular tools because I found out it was easier and faster to change tips.
We also have 2 Nakamura AS200-L.
They are good machines too so I really liked your vision on bothe the Tornos and on the Nakamura.
Always nice to hear what someone else thinks about the exact same machine and what they make on it.
Greetzz from the other side of the water 👍
Was hoping for some under water pictures from the cooling tank
while John is snorkeling through. 🤣
I love how the marketing/sales guys have to refer to the spec sheet, the potential buyer knows his stuff though!
Also a tip to the guy who made this, check out wiper inserts or a large nose radius and cleaning up the radius with a smaller radius tool or undercutting. Swiss has enough rigidity to make the additional tool pressure negligible as long as your setup is correct.
7:55 "1mm bar stock" :-D dude that's a thin wire
sledgeoc we run down to .010 wire.... .03937 wire is just slightly under average for swiss machines.
What’s the price range on a GT13? Depends on the options, of course, but are we talking $100k or $300k?
I know you want to make your parts in-house, but have you done a video on the business / financial side of justifying the purchase?
Around 150k USD
CAN you tel me What is the price ? tornos GT13 thanks
Mr. Grimsmo Are you going to work on aircraft parts or robotics parts in the feuter you have great machinery.😏👍🏻
They can barely satiate the demand for their knives. They are probably going to focus on that.
Enjoyed John!
ATB, Robin
Love the information but all I could concentrate on was the SMW T shirt. I got to get me one.
Nice T shirt John, where did you get it lol.
i Wonder if the part counter was at max part count made , this is why it was running in single part mode, i know our citizen does this when it gets to max parts made
Or maybe the Fanuc Control was set to Setting mode instead of Machining mode. That can happen on our newer machines, they only produce one part in that case.
hey that was very informative, good watch
How does the high pressure oil go with small through coolant drills?
Hi, do you know that this machine is all but Swiss :)
Why not cold heading for his parts?
Because he needs to hold 0.0005 tol. And you can't head them then machine them, because you'd have to load each one individually.
Hold on... You said this completely backwards. The main side always makes a part. The sub does not.
Also this is not a problem that has anything to do with swiss machining. It has to do with sub-spindle machining of any sort.
anyone know who makes the safety glasses john has on?
KMS Tools
VERl koD
Rask Rask Rask
Hope they pay you for your time .
Hey John, are you aware of the incredibly stupid knife laws that classify flipper knives a prohibited weapon in Canada? According to the government website its considered an automatic. I found out cuz i recently had a knife confiscated at the border.
He is making them in Canada...
Not permitted to import, but you can buy them made in Canada.
Unless they can flip it open with centrifugal force- then it's prohibited.
@@12345NoNamesLeft Automatic knife - An automatic knife is one that houses a blade that will open automatically by applying hand pressure to a button, spring, lever, or other device, in or attached to the handle of the knife, including knives that have a button, spring, lever, or other device, located in the spine of the handle and attached to the inner part of the blade.
That's what it says on the website. Doesn't say its prohibited to import it just says classifies any flipper an auto and therefore making it illegal to own in Canada
@@simonn611 So basically although Johns's knive arn't automatic and require the person to actaully flip it (manually) they lump them in as automatic...That sucks. At least its not as bad as over here - cant even make any knifes like John does, nor sell them - people have gotten around it tho - bascially you "buy" the handle then "buy" the blade as an optional extra (and so cannot be sold fully aseembled only in parts).
@@Nostradamus1981 i think another way of getting around it is to tighten the pivot so much that it can't open. Then once it arrives you loosen it up