30:35 I think things went downhill for Mo, when they got caught hacking into Jeff Luhnow's computer. That tells me that even Mo knew that the 2011-2015 success was more in part to Luhnow's draft picks. By 2015, the well was running dry, and it was all on Mozeliak and completely his organization. So, no wonder that the Cards got caught (in Jun 2015), hacking into Luhnow's computer. And if anyone says Mo didn't have knowledge of Chris Correa doing that, has their head in the sand. After 2015, when Mozeliak did get great players, he traded them away (i.e. Zac Gallen, Sandy Alcantara).... And also kept players too long and traded at their lowest value (Tyler O'Neill, Dylan Carlson, etc). Add to that, hiring only rookie "first time" managers because he didn't want anyone to challenge him, then when someone did speak their mind, aka Shildt, they were immediately fired.
The schedule says they are done. This last series is what to expect the rest of the way. The pitchers are old and out of gas, our corner infielders are shot. The outfield makes you want to beat your head against a wall. Burly, MW, only good constants besides some of the bull pen guys.
*Venting/Rant* Since the first series against the Royals in July, we began falling apart. Our bullpen went from 6th best ERA in MLB to 9th (so far). Starting pitching has been seriously struggling, our bats have died, and our defense is additionally slipping further. The Walker move makes zero sense, given he's statistically better against RHP than LHP, and him being a platoon bat is helping no one especially Walker himself. Listening to the broadcast today, about how Jonathan India had been struggling recently and he came in earlier than everyone to practice and work on his swinging, then he ends up with 2 home runs going 3-5, shows such a huge difference between the Cards current mindset and the Reds. As for Chaim Bloom, in the case of Tampa and Boston, he was in charge of managing a team with the ideals of tightening the budget, so think trading off guys before we have to pay them kind of mindset, and that is likely what DeWitt wants in a POBO, think of us as a 500 team while he's in charge and us getting rid of good players and still ending seasons around 500 most years... On the bright side, he may decide to blow up team coaching and it could bring new life to the org. That's enough venting go cards!
Toxicity or lack thereof is not talked about much. It trickles down. Look at the great people that we had left before they even start. Holiday and Yadi. Holiday is raising 2 of the best hitters and works with lots of players was a coach for less than a day. I'm sure he saw the front office and got out of there faster than he could. Same with Yadi. The front office is toxic.
Dewitt and Mo have ruined this organization. Poor scouting, talent evaluation, coaching, trades, free agent singings, Absolutely every aspect of the organization has been circulating down the drain slowly for eight years. Mo inherited a great organization, by stabbing Jockerty in the back,, with at least tacit approval from Dewitt. As all the players we had aged out and the prospects we had were run through, and Mo replaced good baseball minds with yes men. This whole mess lies at the feet of Dewitt and Mo.
100% but firing a coach who made it 17 in a row and to a NLCS that beat the Braves in the divisional who won it all season or two later was the biggest mistake.. hope padres win the pennant
#FACTS Since the playoffs of 2022. Then 2023. and now the colapse in 2024. Mo and Marmol have been such a disaster all this time, that now MLB media, friends, baseball leaders dont even mention anything about "The Cardinal Way" as being a good thing to come to the @Cardinals anymore. The organization has really really gone bad. Top to bottom. Prayer is so needed
After losing 3 straight to the Reds and now the Cardinals have back to back series with the Dodgers and Brewers. This is plain and simple not a good team. We will finish below .500 again this season. Needs to be complete overhaul of leadership from front office to players. If you keep doing what you are doing you will keep getting what you are getting.
17:35 left - maybe Bloom wouldn't want to step into this mess. I think Hence, Matthews & Weatherholt would at least have him excited. Challenged to transition to Cardinals' biggest "Rebuild" type scenario since the '70s or '90s.
I looked at our pitching at the start of the season and I saw a bottom 3rd team. Now that I've got a better look at the other half of our team I like our chances even less. Let's take a really good look at what we have in the minors and move on to next year.
They should be treating Walker like they did with Winn in 2023. How long until they realize they should be playing for the future instead of playing for 2024? Perhaps after the next 6 games.
Honestly would be the best thing for the future. Let Burleson get the bulk of 1b reps, call up Saggese, Let McGreevy and Graceffo get a few starts. Also need to judge guys like nootbar and Gorman to see if they should even be on the team next year.
It's time to clean house from POBO down to the farm system. Then Mr.DeWitt needs to bring in capable proven baseball people from OUTSIDE the Cardinals Organization to oversee a rebuild.
I've been hard on this team all year for a reason. There was no way they were going to win the division (and don't tell me that "The season's not over yet!"). It is over... I said this back in May, before Mother's day. And while it has been exciting to watch the team almost prove me wrong, we are back below 500 ball. AGAIN. This team, as currently constructed, will NOT win a division (let alone a playoff series). Signing pitchers who are all over 34 to be your guys was confusing at best, and here we are. Has Gibby been good? For the most part, yes. Has Gray? Also yes. But even these guys have been bad recently, and Gray hasn't been good for a while. We needed a true number one pitcher, or at least another guy on Gray's level, and everyone that pays close attention to this team knew that. There was no way this rotation was going to be a world series contender. But it's not just the pitching. Ho ho, no... What the actual f**k happened to our bats? I would love to think that replacing our hitting coach would solve this, but I do not believe that it would. It might improve some areas of our offense, but you can't fix some of these guys. I said we should have traded Gorman and Nootbaar at the end of 22. Everyone got all up in arms saying "YoU CaN'T tRaDe tHEsE gUYs!!! ThEIr cEiLiNg iS ToO HiGh fOr ThaT!!!" Really? How long do we have to keep sticking with these guys before people start to wake up?! Prospect (until proven otherwise) are just that: PROSPECTS! And our ownership just can't seem to figure it out anymore... I don't know what we're doing at the AAA level, but something needs to change down there and fast.
You don't think Oli is that dumb but you think Mo is? We've already been told by Mo that he doesn't make lineup decisions. Meanwhile you've got the guy who is younger than his veteran players with no playing experience having to make a decision between playing those veterans or a rookie and he's the guy that has to deal with them. It's Oli. You think Mo decided to activate Walker with the intention for him to warm Carpenter's seat on the bench? I can almost guarantee you Walker will be in the lineup starting Friday because someone from Mo's office is going to call him and ask him what the hell he's doing. Yes Oli should be fired. When a team doesn't perform the manager is accountable. That doesn't mean he's to blame, but you need new leadership, and whatever he's providing isn't working. And hopefully they won't go for another internal "Cardinal Way" inexperienced guy with little to no actual professional playing experience. One problem i have with your takes is that you look at what happened in the last two weeks as being predictive of what's going to happen the next two months (ignoring the 2-3 months before that). Goldschmidt has been "AWESOME", Burleson "IS INCREDIBLE, COULDN'T BE ANY BETTER" (yes his 1.1 WAR is impossible to top, tied for 9th on the team with Siani). Superlatives like "awesome" and "incredible" lose all their meaning. 😆 Trying to trade Gorman or Nootbaar means trading them at their lowest value, which means getting almost nothing in return. The one to trade would be Burleson because (a) his ceiling isn't very high, and (b) he's probably at his peak value. He's a corner outfielder and his bat isn't elite enough to make him untouchable or even very valuable. But what do i know, i was arguing to trade O'Neill at the deadline and after the 2021 season. Anyway, keep it up, I do enjoy the podcast, just wish the Chiefs hat guy would be a little more objective (i.e., less homer) Lol. 😆
Well on the bright side.. if this continues we can get a high draft choice again next season.. I almost to the point of calling for a complete restructuring of the system, but to do that Cardinal fans will have to eat some lean years as they rebuild..
Agreed Oliver Marmol is not the worst manager in history like we act but imo it’s the locker room atmosphere that he fails at the most. Now granted all the reporters who have been in the locker room says it’s such rainbows and daisies but our team looks deflated. He let the team crush the highly paid free agent catcher last year and he publicly calls out players. He just seems in over his head
33 MINS. In - - - -Mo may have done that - developing Wacha, C. Martinez, Flaherty, Sh. Miller, etc, etc. HASN'T BEEN Working for quite a long while now though!!!
For the life of me I cannot understand how anyone would believe that Bloom would be any different than Mo. He literally did exactly this in Boston. He was just slightly worse at it. We need Ng and we need to get out of her way and let her do her thing.
I disagree on the trade for superstars point, they have several big names. If nado and goldy were playing at the level they get paid for, and they had some support around them that could swing the bat and get 4 to 5 runs a game instead of striking out all thebtime, the pitching looks way better. They just are playing bad baseball, and it's pretty much the whole team at the same time.
They just need to retool a bit, not total but close. Wasn't Dewitt one of the better owners at one time? What happened? Albert for manager, Yadi for pitching coach and Holiday hitting coach. The present team just sucks.
I predict a Cardinals record of 79-83. That may be giving them more credit than they disserve. After the season is over the front office better figure it out. I think the organization is going to lose many more fans. This isn't Cardinals baseball, just pitiful.
They need a new owner, a new gm, a new manager, new coaches, and about 75 percent of the 40 man roster needs to go but hey other than that they're in good shape
Biggest mo hater I know... he was the best gm n baseball 1st half of his career in baseball. Since thn, he hasn't adapted, the inconsistencies r crazy, the money he spends is f tier, and the structure since he started it..... just a bunch of garbage plug ins. I really hope Bloom turns into a terminator and cleans house
Josh, you are so delusional. I can’t wait for the season to be over the Cardinals. Don’t make the playoffs. You have to eat your words on every show you ever made.
Pitching finally gave out because it was unreasonable to expect them to keep doing what they were doing. It's impossible. Offense is too inconsistent. Idc if they make it to the playoffs. They will get dominated and out first even in the wildcard. Uncompetirive team. Period. Only people who think that they're a ws team is delusional
I personally don't even want Chaim Bloom to take over, because Mo picked him.
I don't want any connections to Mozeliak having major roles next year.
30:35 I think things went downhill for Mo, when they got caught hacking into Jeff Luhnow's computer.
That tells me that even Mo knew that the 2011-2015 success was more in part to Luhnow's draft picks.
By 2015, the well was running dry, and it was all on Mozeliak and completely his organization.
So, no wonder that the Cards got caught (in Jun 2015), hacking into Luhnow's computer.
And if anyone says Mo didn't have knowledge of Chris Correa doing that, has their head in the sand.
After 2015, when Mozeliak did get great players, he traded them away (i.e. Zac Gallen, Sandy Alcantara)....
And also kept players too long and traded at their lowest value (Tyler O'Neill, Dylan Carlson, etc).
Add to that, hiring only rookie "first time" managers because he didn't want anyone to challenge him,
then when someone did speak their mind, aka Shildt, they were immediately fired.
That's how incompetent Rick McKay works things in the NFL. Best buddies with the owner, too.
I said before spring training started that this team would not play 500 ball they did a little in the off-season off-season to improve this team
The schedule says they are done. This last series is what to expect the rest of the way. The pitchers are old and out of gas, our corner infielders are shot. The outfield makes you want to beat your head against a wall. Burly, MW, only good constants besides some of the bull pen guys.
Contreras is solid
The schedule is immaterial. This team would be done if they were playing high school teams the rest of the season.
@@boschlosser10 Donny, too., but otherwise the above is dead on.
*Venting/Rant* Since the first series against the Royals in July, we began falling apart. Our bullpen went from 6th best ERA in MLB to 9th (so far). Starting pitching has been seriously struggling, our bats have died, and our defense is additionally slipping further. The Walker move makes zero sense, given he's statistically better against RHP than LHP, and him being a platoon bat is helping no one especially Walker himself. Listening to the broadcast today, about how Jonathan India had been struggling recently and he came in earlier than everyone to practice and work on his swinging, then he ends up with 2 home runs going 3-5, shows such a huge difference between the Cards current mindset and the Reds. As for Chaim Bloom, in the case of Tampa and Boston, he was in charge of managing a team with the ideals of tightening the budget, so think trading off guys before we have to pay them kind of mindset, and that is likely what DeWitt wants in a POBO, think of us as a 500 team while he's in charge and us getting rid of good players and still ending seasons around 500 most years... On the bright side, he may decide to blow up team coaching and it could bring new life to the org. That's enough venting go cards!
I remember a manager once said that prospects are nothing but suspects
Toxicity or lack thereof is not talked about much. It trickles down. Look at the great people that we had left before they even start. Holiday and Yadi. Holiday is raising 2 of the best hitters and works with lots of players was a coach for less than a day. I'm sure he saw the front office and got out of there faster than he could. Same with Yadi. The front office is toxic.
Don’t blame me. I warned everyone not to trust this team back in June when they were winning.
Ditto here, even in July, but I didn't see Burleson coming on this strong. At least there's one good player under 28 other than Winn.
11:36 Every pod Andrew has a take I have to point out and say hey good take. 2022 was more of an outlier than 2023
Dewitt and Mo have ruined this organization. Poor scouting, talent evaluation, coaching, trades, free agent singings, Absolutely every aspect of the organization has been circulating down the drain slowly for eight years. Mo inherited a great organization, by stabbing Jockerty in the back,, with at least tacit approval from Dewitt. As all the players we had aged out and the prospects we had were run through, and Mo replaced good baseball minds with yes men. This whole mess lies at the feet of Dewitt and Mo.
100% but firing a coach who made it 17 in a row and to a NLCS that beat the Braves in the divisional who won it all season or two later was the biggest mistake.. hope padres win the pennant
Yep, on both accounts. I'm rooting for the Padres.
Nothing will change until the turnstiles go cold. Mo gotta go. Mo owns this mess
@@marktucker1586 daddy dewitt will never fire his boy mo.😂😂😂😂
#FACTS Since the playoffs of 2022. Then 2023. and now the colapse in 2024. Mo and Marmol have been such a disaster all this time, that now MLB media, friends, baseball leaders dont even mention anything about "The Cardinal Way" as being a good thing to come to the @Cardinals anymore. The organization has really really gone bad. Top to bottom. Prayer is so needed
Where's the spark? Where's the leadership? Where's Yadi???
They won’t win 80 games this season!
I'll take the UNDER on that one.
Is that a Peoria Chiefs hat?
Yes it is!
After losing 3 straight to the Reds and now the Cardinals have back to back series with the Dodgers and Brewers. This is plain and simple not a good team. We will finish below .500 again this season. Needs to be complete overhaul of leadership from front office to players.
If you keep doing what you are doing you will keep getting what you are getting.
So how many players are you going to get rid of off the team five players 10 players
The Reds actually have a better team than the Cardinals they're starting staff is awesome
Josh with the Chiefs hat yessir !!!
17:35 left - maybe Bloom wouldn't want to step into this mess. I think Hence, Matthews & Weatherholt would at least have him excited. Challenged to transition to Cardinals' biggest "Rebuild" type scenario since the '70s or '90s.
I looked at our pitching at the start of the season and I saw a bottom 3rd team. Now that I've got a better look at the other half of our team I like our chances even less. Let's take a really good look at what we have in the minors and move on to next year.
Mo gotta go. Nothing will change until the fan base stays home. The franchise annually draws 3 million for a sub par team.😂 go figure
Well the fan base has been staying home
@@mikekeeler6362 will they surpass 3 million. I believe that's the annual goal?
@@marktucker1586 yeah they announced the paid attendance but I don't think there's 15,000 people in the whole stadium I don't even like watching them
They should be treating Walker like they did with Winn in 2023. How long until they realize they should be playing for the future instead of playing for 2024? Perhaps after the next 6 games.
Honestly would be the best thing for the future. Let Burleson get the bulk of 1b reps, call up Saggese, Let McGreevy and Graceffo get a few starts. Also need to judge guys like nootbar and Gorman to see if they should even be on the team next year.
It's time to clean house from POBO down to the farm system. Then Mr.DeWitt needs to bring in capable proven baseball people from OUTSIDE the Cardinals Organization to oversee a rebuild.
Trade all of the starting 8 players none of them are any good
I've been hard on this team all year for a reason. There was no way they were going to win the division (and don't tell me that "The season's not over yet!"). It is over... I said this back in May, before Mother's day. And while it has been exciting to watch the team almost prove me wrong, we are back below 500 ball. AGAIN. This team, as currently constructed, will NOT win a division (let alone a playoff series). Signing pitchers who are all over 34 to be your guys was confusing at best, and here we are. Has Gibby been good? For the most part, yes. Has Gray? Also yes. But even these guys have been bad recently, and Gray hasn't been good for a while. We needed a true number one pitcher, or at least another guy on Gray's level, and everyone that pays close attention to this team knew that. There was no way this rotation was going to be a world series contender.
But it's not just the pitching. Ho ho, no... What the actual f**k happened to our bats? I would love to think that replacing our hitting coach would solve this, but I do not believe that it would. It might improve some areas of our offense, but you can't fix some of these guys. I said we should have traded Gorman and Nootbaar at the end of 22. Everyone got all up in arms saying "YoU CaN'T tRaDe tHEsE gUYs!!! ThEIr cEiLiNg iS ToO HiGh fOr ThaT!!!" Really? How long do we have to keep sticking with these guys before people start to wake up?! Prospect (until proven otherwise) are just that: PROSPECTS! And our ownership just can't seem to figure it out anymore... I don't know what we're doing at the AAA level, but something needs to change down there and fast.
You don't think Oli is that dumb but you think Mo is? We've already been told by Mo that he doesn't make lineup decisions. Meanwhile you've got the guy who is younger than his veteran players with no playing experience having to make a decision between playing those veterans or a rookie and he's the guy that has to deal with them. It's Oli. You think Mo decided to activate Walker with the intention for him to warm Carpenter's seat on the bench? I can almost guarantee you Walker will be in the lineup starting Friday because someone from Mo's office is going to call him and ask him what the hell he's doing.
Yes Oli should be fired. When a team doesn't perform the manager is accountable. That doesn't mean he's to blame, but you need new leadership, and whatever he's providing isn't working. And hopefully they won't go for another internal "Cardinal Way" inexperienced guy with little to no actual professional playing experience.
One problem i have with your takes is that you look at what happened in the last two weeks as being predictive of what's going to happen the next two months (ignoring the 2-3 months before that). Goldschmidt has been "AWESOME", Burleson "IS INCREDIBLE, COULDN'T BE ANY BETTER" (yes his 1.1 WAR is impossible to top, tied for 9th on the team with Siani). Superlatives like "awesome" and "incredible" lose all their meaning. 😆
Trying to trade Gorman or Nootbaar means trading them at their lowest value, which means getting almost nothing in return. The one to trade would be Burleson because (a) his ceiling isn't very high, and (b) he's probably at his peak value. He's a corner outfielder and his bat isn't elite enough to make him untouchable or even very valuable. But what do i know, i was arguing to trade O'Neill at the deadline and after the 2021 season.
Anyway, keep it up, I do enjoy the podcast, just wish the Chiefs hat guy would be a little more objective (i.e., less homer) Lol. 😆
Marmol has to go
28 Mins. IN - INTEREST for fans yes. Have them come back to the stadium......not until '26 or '27 I would suspect.
Start by fire this incompetent manager. Someone has to be held accountable. It's the only move you can make to see if the team gets jump started.
Well on the bright side.. if this continues we can get a high draft choice again next season.. I almost to the point of calling for a complete restructuring of the system, but to do that Cardinal fans will have to eat some lean years as they rebuild..
Agreed Oliver Marmol is not the worst manager in history like we act but imo it’s the locker room atmosphere that he fails at the most. Now granted all the reporters who have been in the locker room says it’s such rainbows and daisies but our team looks deflated. He let the team crush the highly paid free agent catcher last year and he publicly calls out players. He just seems in over his head
33 MINS. In - - - -Mo may have done that - developing Wacha, C. Martinez, Flaherty, Sh. Miller, etc, etc. HASN'T BEEN Working for quite a long while now though!!!
For sure - the early years were great but he’s grown stale and ineffective
For the life of me I cannot understand how anyone would believe that Bloom would be any different than Mo. He literally did exactly this in Boston. He was just slightly worse at it. We need Ng and we need to get out of her way and let her do her thing.
I disagree on the trade for superstars point, they have several big names. If nado and goldy were playing at the level they get paid for, and they had some support around them that could swing the bat and get 4 to 5 runs a game instead of striking out all thebtime, the pitching looks way better. They just are playing bad baseball, and it's pretty much the whole team at the same time.
Considering they just got swept by the Reds (not saying this will happen btw) I do not see a "guaranteed" win in their next 25 games. 😢
They just need to retool a bit, not total but close. Wasn't Dewitt one of the better owners at one time? What happened?
Albert for manager, Yadi for pitching coach and Holiday hitting coach.
The present team just sucks.
None of those guys want to manage on this team
And I don't blame them @@mikekeeler6362
I predict a Cardinals record of 79-83. That may be giving them more credit than they disserve. After the season is over the front office better figure it out. I think the organization is going to lose many more fans. This isn't Cardinals baseball, just pitiful.
They need a new owner, a new gm, a new manager, new coaches, and about 75 percent of the 40 man roster needs to go but hey other than that they're in good shape
Easy to say hard to do
😂😂😂
Mo is godddddddd
Biggest mo hater I know... he was the best gm n baseball 1st half of his career in baseball. Since thn, he hasn't adapted, the inconsistencies r crazy, the money he spends is f tier, and the structure since he started it..... just a bunch of garbage plug ins. I really hope Bloom turns into a terminator and cleans house
Move the team to Las Vegas
Oscar taverus
Mo is horrible. The players are just getting older and worse. What are there, two kinda good prospects left?
Yup and they’ll give Marmol another 2 year extension!!!! Such a storied franchise going to shit!!! Cheap ass team going in the wrong direction!!!!!
Josh, you are so delusional. I can’t wait for the season to be over the Cardinals. Don’t make the playoffs. You have to eat your words on every show you ever made.
What? We said their season was over?
Dont click on lousy headlines like this.
Pitching finally gave out because it was unreasonable to expect them to keep doing what they were doing. It's impossible. Offense is too inconsistent. Idc if they make it to the playoffs. They will get dominated and out first even in the wildcard. Uncompetirive team. Period. Only people who think that they're a ws team is delusional
Don’t worry we’ll pick up Gibson and Lynn’s option and run 90% of this same team back next year smh
Well they thought they were going to get power stats out of Arenado Nolan Gorman and Jordan Walker
Well they thought they were going to get power stats out of Arenado Nolan Gorman and Jordan Walker
Well they thought they were going to get power stats out of Arenado Nolan Gorman and Jordan Walker
Well they thought they were going to get power stats out of Arenado Nolan Gorman and Jordan Walker