"Adding power might make you faster on the straights but subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere." Ahh, Colin Chapman's Lotus philosophy! Great video Hoki :)
This could be used as a quick reminder. I did not read any comments and also wrote this down in one watching of the vid., so take this with a grain of salt. Summary 12:00 Prioritize: Antiroll Differential Wheel spacers Race/Rally/Drift Tires and braking Shift quick enough Gear rations Weigh reduction Power Long version: 0:00 - 12:00 Conversions: Engine swapp: Stock engine unless pushing into other class, as they have better PI value. Drivetrain: Recommended to leave as is. Execptions online for launch speed Turbo: Generally preffered over superchargers. Good choice if you cannot reach power goals with NA engine. Superchargers: More weight and less peak power, linear power gain and starts lower in the rev range. Aero: Forza parts very useful on high class cars. Generally worth on A+ class cars. Add(for appropriate front/rear) only if you are struggling for front/rear grip. Wheel & Tire mods: Compound: Choosing right compound should be chosen by temp. Drive around and inspect tire telemetry. Blue too cold - downgrade Transperant good Yellow too hot - upgrade Width: Max for driven wheels Rims: Can reduce weight 17"+ recommended Bigger wheels = more weight, more responsive handling, better grip Go for spacers if possible Transmission mods: Clutch: Huge help on manual cluthless and automatic Not worth if you are driving on manual Transmission: Upgrade if stock gear ratios are off or need faster shift time Driveshaft: Go for it, weight reduction Differential: Does not cost any PI, go for it Breaking: Max is not always better. Max braking for A+ Only upgrade if you are not maxing out braking Open up telemetry and check the peak braking power: Under 100% - downgrade Over 100% - good, might benefit from upgrade? Suspentions: Skips street/sport Race Drift Rally according to the mode Antiroll: Max Chassi reinforcement: Most do not need any Extremely useful for older cars that are pushed into a higher class Raw weight reduction: Great if you can affford PI. Choice between POWER/WEIGHT R. = Shave weight instead of adding power. Prioritize losing weight in wheel / driveshaft / flywheel weight over raw weight reduction Power: Intake - lower priority. Increases power/torque sometimes reduced weight Throttle body - lot of power and torque and shave weight. Good way to add power Fuel system - good mod power and torque does not shave weight Exaust - higher priority shaves a lot of weight, adds good power and a lot of torque Cam shaft - highest priority lots of power/torgue and increased redline Valves - lower priority Displacement - a lot of extra power/torque Compression - lower priority Turbo - higher priority great way of adding a ton of power Cooling(intercooler/oilcooling ) - avoid if you can get power else where. On simulation helps to prevent engines from overheating, otherwise justs adds weight Flywheel - good way to add/reduce few PI
A car that is that light with a good amount of power (especially with such a light car) should definitely be able to go over 140. You should check out a video on changing the gearing. You can completely change the top speed or the amount of acceleration that the car has.
0:16 Conversions 2:11 Aero 3:14 Tires and rims 5:54 Drivetrain 7:14 Handling 9:30 Engine 12:00 Overall Priorities Found myself coming back often, so I put down the chapters
That's my philosophy too: prioritise handling. A slow car that can turn at full throttle is faster than a fast car that needs to brake at every single turn. I often win races against more powerful cars because my car can do almost all the race at 100% gas
Help me all my cars ended up being s2 or s2 with shit handling what should I do???? To improve the handling and stop the cars from sliding slightest turn at 200 km or 150 above I lose my control even though I tried to improve my grip
@@lthedoperabbitl9258 for the class just don't put all max parts, i do this especially when i have to build a car for a specific class in a race: if the race allows it i'll max it all out, but if it's an A or B class race i just put racing cams, flywheel and exhaust, then i'll work on handling and transmission. If it's a slow car you don't need high performance tyres and wider wheels, you can also skip the rollcage..just keep in mind that less power needs less "containment". About the handling well that's a lot of trial and error: i had some issues on my S2 nissan R390, it had a little bit of understeer and sometimes it decided to spin its rear in a turn, in freemode i started changing camber, anti-roll bars etc. one point at a time until the car was race ready.
Ah jeez...well thank you! I'm definitely someone who doesn't like the sound of their own voice on recordings (and tbh my mic setup is not great) so to hear that means a lot!
Die hard sim players: “now you don’t want to max out everything and you want to prioritise speed or handling” Ever other FORZA player: “so guys just maxed out my new car to X999 class can’t wait to go so fast”
Online multiplayer: "You mean I can't bring my X class car into any old race? So I have to get cars tuned to S2, and cars for both road and dirt for S1, A and B? Damnit!"
After binge-watching all of your videos since I recently discovered your channel, this was the last guide that I desperately needed! Your content has made me a millions times more interested in this game and it's community, so thank you for making really enjoyable and accessible guides for us!
As far as upgrading process (in terms of what to upgrade first) I pretty much always have the same structure, prioritized after usefulness (filling the PI with the big rocks (important upgrades) and filling it with the sand (nice-to-have stuff) afterwards is much easier than filling in the sand and _then_ trying to get the big rocks in, if you want to go with that image). Interesting to note though: the PI is actually calculated in-game as a floating number (IIRC) - that's why some upgrades don't change PI at first, then suddenly do after you come back to it from upgrading the rest, that's why it's a good idea to leave some tweaking points. *1) Conversions (duh).* Changing this after you upgraded the rest defeats the purpose as you replace your upgrades. *2) Tires.* I usually have a PI goal in mind, and I prioritize this over anything else because my car will literally stand or fall with this. Tire compound first, then tire width, then track width. I leave the rims as a tweaking point for later (since Forza doesn't differentiate between sprung and unsprung weight, it's just more weight shaved off). *3) Aero.* As a rule of thumb, I try to leave the aero stock below S1 class. In A class if a car is particularly unruly, but mostly I get by without; I found it costs quite a bit of PI and the handling hit I take for not taking Aero upgrades is negligable for the most part in A class and below. *4) Transmission.* Unless the gears are completely wonky, final gear tuning is enough. Clutch I only upgrade if I feel the shifting is too slow. Differential costs no PI and adds tuning options, so always take that. Driveline I leave as a tweaking point, since sometimes you can get away with upgrading your driveline without upping your PI and the performance boost isn't high enough to prioritize this over more power IMHO. *5) Platform and handling.* Suspension > ARBs > Brakes > Weight Reduction (depending on the car); Roll Cage only in cars that aren't -race cars OR - built after 1995(ish). Or in some cases, just as a way to optimize the front weight percentage. A good indication when it's a good idea is when it adds more than 2 PI. *6) Engine.* Camshafts > Exhaust > Fuel system > Fly Wheel > anything else that brings me up to the PI I want. BONUS: *7) Transmission.* Going back to check if I can sneak in a driveline upgrade :D
Drift suspension is usually 1lb less than race, sometimes 0, but can be tuned back to race alignment & stiffness. This provides no advantage over race suspension in a race but in freeroam rush it is hugely beneficial to have extra angle to bring yourself out of bad situations.
One thing to keep in mind is that the camshaft upgrade essentially extends your gears without having to purchase the transmission with adjustable final drive. In some cases you can use this to your advantage and not have to buy the trans to get the speed you need.
It might be important to note the camshaft upgrade also changes the torque curve, especially noticeable on the rally engine swaps since they're tuned for specific RPM and have airflow restrictions, it's still usually a good idea to take it, but if you want to keep the mountain of torque low down you have to keep them stock.
Dude, this was so incredibly helpful - thank you. I was finally able to tune/upgrade the 22b which was impossible to use before with my crap upgrading.
Great video as always bud. Saw somebody else mention this below, a video on the different engine swaps might be good. What cars they come from, what type of racing they are suited to and whatever else is relevant lol. Anyhoo keep up the good work! ✌️
@@annahenrietta9517 i will give S2 this. When the drivers are actually good and the cars and tuned correctly it's very intense racing. And diverse. The track focused Mosler, the Wicked Zonda, the fun and welcoming 918 or the absolute powerhouse of the Agera RS. It's fun, but 8 times out of ten children ruin it.
One caveat to weight reduction is that it'll make tunable suspension more necessary (as does the change in weight balance that usually comes with engine swaps). In certain cars where you only want to bring them up by less than a full class, more power and/or stickier tires can be the full upgrade (and sometimes the extra weight from differet/bigger/wider wheels/tures or chassis stiffening) can help keep them in a lower class than they would pop into with the added power might put them just a few points over.
About Radiator and Oil Cooling, you can balance it by prioritizing Air Intake, Exhaust, Valve, and Piston with race option and add Radiator/Oil Cooling on sports/street option because they only add a little weight. I've been experiment with radiator/oil cooling and sometimes it can balance engine response and make other upgrades more effective for adding power.
Great video... slightly disagree with tyre. What i have found is if your car is slipping while cornering, upgrading tyre fixes it. You can corner fast. Temp is not the only deciding factor for tyre.
Not gunna lie its about time someone did a guide on upgrading and not just streaming they're gameplay. Just a suggestion your next video SHOULD be fine tuning. ;)
Tuning is much more important than modifications. After putting in all parts that unlock tuning options (ie sway bar, diff), it just comes down to personal preference on mods.
Just to mansion. In real world you prioritize tire temp whatever tire you've got by adjusting tire pressure so can get you to somewhere in max window grip. not the other way around. Great stuff! "Always sacrifice feeling over grip" Petter Solberg
Great video ,only 1 aspect missing,in all the forza games ive played from forza 2 till now,the weight distibution front to back is made very important . Even drifting cars,front to back dist of 50 % is what I always give priority after weight and tyre. Because the weight distribution has a overal bigger effect on handeling in general. Plus the upgrades that effects this are the ones that most of the times can even downgrade the pi. One of the more advance tuning ways is upgrading for even weight distribution. I know for sure that You know what I mean,i could explain coolers en oiling upgrades with a certain engine and charger can make a almost drifting race car transform into a car as relax handeling and save as a volvo ( just an example ,a volvo is ..well pff In the end the cars that have that great handeling al ready stock always have that ratio of 50 . For a drag rce it doesnt matter and using an engine designed for drag or streetrace when rally or city racing is not the way. But if for example a high performance car is what u using in moderate to high rev range and power band track( like most of the tarmac race in fh4 then going for the weight distribution is the logic thing the v12 engine with awd swap and max turbo plus cooling and oil can make a 45 % to the back sliding nightmare suddenly into a 50 % relax car. Mostly it is the best way of gettimg a front bias car ,like many of the muscle car ,lose that terrible understeer. Im sure that many of you know the frustrating feeling of a high powered ford that goes like a rocket but almost needs to park on every low speed corner,and can be used as a landscaper on those long sweeping speed corners. That Problem Can be solved the way I said. Because almost every other way one loses a lot of the power and acc. This way one can have the raw power of a great muscle car with the cornerimg of a rdical. The radical is the most over looked handeling car in the game ,not that senna or mosler or f1 is the best handeling car ,but the radical is ,it has the cornering feel of a lmpt car in forza motersport ,if it would lack that little bit of max speed it would be the far best car. Hey dont believ me ,just pick goliath and leave it stock ,you wil,not beat the f1 or the maserati because those a faster,but you will have an easer ride for sure...try a hill climb or down on fortune island..
Very good. Forst time I've watched your vids. Obviously you're a Forza expert. Very informative for the beginner to the seasoned vet. (Taught me something!) I'd like to point out, most of this applies to both motorsport as well as horizon. Rally parts being the main exception. I will be referring my Academy members to your channel. Thanks for the high quality, in depth info!
I have a tuned 2002 Turbo that I drive all the time. It is 11,000+ miles on it. I designed it to look like my 1982 320is as much as possible. Anyway; I have tuned it with the drift suspension and it handles pretty well. If I don’t let off soon enough around a corner; I will spin out. I have a second 2002 turbo that has the same tune but on race springs. After doing 50 laps of the Falcon Speedway Loop, the drift suspension did put down a fast time but was trickier to learn on track. My advise is, if you want a challenge and you know how to handle a bit of snap oversteer, absolutely use the drift suspension for course racing. Also that extra steering Angel can be fun to mess around with on the streets.
1 thing to add, superchargers are usually used irl since its technically easier to just slap on a supercharger. But in game, u should just upgrade the main engine since it doesnt add weight
I really only find aero good on S2 cars. S1 and below I just generally stick to the stock design and put the PI into other areas. I've found this game really likes cars with a focus in power.
Kabloosh on my F-Type in A class I had some extreme oversteer issues. Rear wing made it disappear (with a bit of tuning). So largely not helpful, but on some cars it is make or break. :)
@@ALittleBitOfGay I've been able to really tune out over steer with -.2 toe rear and front caster between 6.5 and 7.0 with just about any car. It's usually my default setting. I also build cars with grip levels depending on the class. S1 and S2 generally I mostly max out grip, but A class I am fine with a car between .9-1.1 g's around there and then the rest just goes to boosting power for the car. I tend to avoid aero unless the car comes with it. Even then I often tune my cars with the aero preferring speed over cornering.
Great video mate the only thing that I would argue is the tire telemetry part I would keep the Grippy tyres but raise or lower the tyre pressure accordingly
I just thought I'd mention, you can tune your car and adjust the PSI of your rear and front tyres (tyre pressure). This can affect the heat of your tyres. A good rule of thumb is to adjust your tyre pressure so the tyres are just before yellow on the Telementary HUD when driving, this is usually around 170°F. You should note that tyre pressure is not as much of a serious factor in rally racing than it is in road racing. I recommend you balance out the tyre pressure for the front and rear tyres for rally racing and purchase the widest tyre profiles you can buy, this will keep the car somewhat planted in the dirt and allow you to make rather quick corrections.
Forza doesn't differentiate between sprung and unsprung weight. The only difference maker where weight is concerned (AFAIK) is weight balance (aka "front weight percentage"), driveline, and the fly wheel.
AWD swap is a must have if you play on keyboard, if you put RWD on a car and increase horse power, you end up just spinning tires, also cornering isn´t much fun.
@@AdminAbuse update: RWD is completely viable option on keyboard, just needed to get good, racing and drifting on keyboard through last 2 Horizons and I don´t plan on changing that anytime soon
Aim for 350-500HP for A class, 550-800+ for S1 class. Rally tires can be great on both A and S1(4WD) class cars if you are too lazy to make another car for winter/rally racing. Try out different engines. In some cases you can get the same PI with a lower rev engine, more usable power, and 10% boost to the power, which will get you around 5% higher top speed (ex:NSX-R GT is better with the V6 engine rather than the v-tec one) Other cars will benefit from high revving engines, in my experience, the lower the power.
There’s also some cars that have awkward setups for their upgrades when trying to stay in the pi range. Sometimes the camshaft upgrade isn’t worth it in manual with/without clutch because you can match the max upgrade if you can well past the redline and there’s the potential non peak torque loss. Idk if this has any negative consequences in simulation mode by damaging/overheating the engine though.
Even if you can rev as high, is the motor even making any power at those higher rpm? The dyno graph will usually show where the car makes power up to. So reving much past that will result in a beautiful sounding screaming engine but its not accelerating as fast as if you were in the rpm range where it actually makes power.
@@RealAnthonyJones Some engines like the 6.2 V8 still make power up there. PI calculations are done with automatic upshifts which shift before redline, so that might be a kind of exploit to make your car stronger for a given PI.
wow. I never thought it would be this advanced... "if you cant heat up your tyres to proper trace temps..." i liiiike it! will put my new wheel to good use in forza it would seem Hope driving in GB wont messing me up too bad :P
I still use street and sport suspension if I’m too lazy to adjust spring rate and damping but when using street and sport they are stiffer by a lot compared to stock. Note: if you decide to run street or sport suspension always put race sway bars on and upgrade your tires at least one compound unless your vehicles already on race tires or race slicks. If you don’t upgrade tire compound it’ll feel like you’re driving on ice. And if you don’t upgrade sway bars your car will always lose traction. Also make your sway bars softer seeing how street and sport suspension is stiffer
A bit late to the party, but I haven't seen anyone (including you Hoki :P) talk about centrifugal superchargers. I like to install them to my 2WD cars in addition to camshaft upgrades to reduce their torque-to-power ratio, which IMO gets them to launch and exit corners with a lower chance to break traction. What do you think ?
I guess it is a personal decision on what you like or not. If you play with damage you will earn a little more credits I think. I always play with it off because these driveatars in free roam can be pretty annoying. 😅
Amazing man! Thank you very much for share these informations. I started driving in the class C to learn how to drive correctly because of your video about drive education. Now, I will try to improve the setup of my car in the class C based on this video. Thanks. 👍
@@Uncle_Glock I already drove at the classes A, S1 and S2. I really enjoyed racing at the A class with the old abarth Fiat 500 or with the Lotus eleven 1956 at the A class or S1 class ( I don't remenber now for which class I prepared the Lotus). The problem starts at the S2 class. It's really fast and constantly I feel the sensation of fear to make some mistakes and lose the control of my car while I race. So with the tips from drive education video, I hope to improve my skills on the higher classes training on the lower classes. 👍
something on my mind. I noticed that some racers like ISAD tend to not upgrade the cams on their engine. The most famous being the 6.2 v8 and the 3.2 i6. As far as I can see it, this is due that you can squeeze much more power by revving the engine over the redline. What do you think of this? It’s been on my mind for a long time if I’m honest 😅
I’ve experience what you mentioned. I do the same in my 1945 Jeep. I learned that I lose quite a bit of non peak from adding camshaft upgrades since it stretches the dyno.
Previous games cams were never worth the pi they cost when you could get much more power and torque using a combination of the other upgrades...not sure if that’s still the case w fh4 or not;)
@@sharonneedlesfreedomsnotfr813 what do you mean not worth the pi cost? Like isnt the whole point to max out everything? Like why are yall worried about pi? I just dont understand the pi thing i guess. So pls explain.
I criticize him just as bad as AR12. He doesn’t tune his stuff as deeply as Hoki does. Half of his cars are usually AWD and engine swapped and he calls it a day. I highly recommend just going by Hoki’s guidelines. I’ve tuned my cars much better on the original drivetrain and engine thanks to him. As far as cams go, squeezing every bit of power in said gear is crucial especially if you’re running turbochargers. This also increases your top end especially for those straights.
Hoki hoshi I am so glad that you actually answered my question, to be honest I never was expecting a video in response of my comments because I always feel like my comments go unseen which I can understand you can only read so many comments at a time but anyway I appreciate you answering my questions, thank you for your help!
its not only about swapping to AWD to get better handling, a lot of other things are needed, especially Toe, Camber and general aerodynamics. And for more finesse tuning, rims, tires and car suspension height.
thank you! thanks to your videos, I am starting to understand tuning and cars, so I don´t have to call my brother to tune my new cars... saves time and I am starting to have fun with it.
What about a period/manufacturer correct swap? Say a Ford 427 (7.0 racing engine) into the 68 mustang, something that fits the original character of the car
@@dennisjungbauer4467 Tbh, i rarely swap anything. But if you have some random low PI car you want to use online, you pretty much need engine and awd swaps, especially in S2, and even S1. I still have a couple cars in S1 and S2 that have their original engine and rwd, but most of the time i end up swapping engine and converting to awd for the cars i use in ranked
I always find cam shafts add way too much pi, I max upgrade the brakes as I like to tune the braking balance so the rear tyres are being fully utilised in a braking zone, it does mean if you lock up you are very likely to spinout, but you do stop faster
awesome guides. i m just starting out with tuning and well most if it is probly pretty bad but i dont even care. i dont expect to create the best tunings in the world but as long as they work, im fine with it. i think its a pretty solid trade off for flexibility. because downloading other tunes allways made me feel.. helpless. for example winter season. you wanna edit your tune and slap on winter tires... well you cant do that because its locked and you need to pray for mercy that someone creates a winter tune... i just wanna do stuff myself for whatever car i wanna drive (and those cars are usually off meta cars since i wanna be that weird guy who s using that car noone uses simply because it looks good) lxD
This is the best video. It’s missing the track width parts because of the sample car. Can you explain if I using a FR BMW 2002, should I max the rear width and keep the front width as original ?
I've noticed that power to weight ratio always seems to lean to adding power before raw weight reduction. I didn't do a ton of testing before coming to that conclusion but it seemed fairly consistent through about 20 cars that I tested it on.
Hey Hoki maybe you can help me out. I rly like your tuning guide but i have a question/problem: So far everything works fine but my cars generally seem to lack power. They are quite fine to drive but i cant keep up even with the AI drivers (on third to second highest difficulty, sim steering, manual w/o clutch, controller and Thrustaster T150). Tried to tune the Volvo 850 (as i have that car IRL) grip tune A800. So what parts can i swap in favor of more power? Or is the Volvo just a bad car to tune?
Great video. Sadly for competitive play, Playground has made the game such that you're pretty fucked if you don't use AWD especially in freeroam rush and making it almost impossible to do good launches. You're also fucked in the low speed corners where you need throttle modulation whereas you can pretty much floor every AWD car everywhere.
@@Uncle_Glock Yeah super true! It's all 1500 hp lambos all round. I made my own little track once (Based out of Needle Descent), picked out my favourite cars, turned em back to stock. And drove them up and down, just to notice the nuances. Made the entire game worth it!!
It’s why I stay off usually stay off s1 and up. S1 is where I start seeing awd becoming necessary and beyond. A class any drivetrain can do the job unless some nut job decides to drag race and wall ride his way to first
"Adding power might make you faster on the straights but subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere."
Ahh, Colin Chapman's Lotus philosophy! Great video Hoki :)
I'm glad people are catching that quote :)
Borrowing from the best.
I only know it from the British green missions! I love lotus
@@wolfcaliburRX i hate lotus
simplify and add lightness
This could be used as a quick reminder.
I did not read any comments and also wrote this down in one watching of the vid., so take this with a grain of salt.
Summary 12:00
Prioritize:
Antiroll
Differential
Wheel spacers
Race/Rally/Drift
Tires and braking
Shift quick enough
Gear rations
Weigh reduction
Power
Long version: 0:00 - 12:00
Conversions:
Engine swapp:
Stock engine unless pushing into other class, as they have better PI value.
Drivetrain:
Recommended to leave as is.
Execptions online for launch speed
Turbo:
Generally preffered over superchargers.
Good choice if you cannot reach power goals with NA engine.
Superchargers:
More weight and less peak power, linear power gain and starts lower in the rev range.
Aero:
Forza parts very useful on high class cars.
Generally worth on A+ class cars. Add(for appropriate front/rear) only if you are struggling for front/rear grip.
Wheel & Tire mods:
Compound:
Choosing right compound should be chosen by temp.
Drive around and inspect tire telemetry.
Blue too cold - downgrade
Transperant good
Yellow too hot - upgrade
Width:
Max for driven wheels
Rims:
Can reduce weight
17"+ recommended
Bigger wheels = more weight, more responsive handling, better grip
Go for spacers if possible
Transmission mods:
Clutch:
Huge help on manual cluthless and automatic
Not worth if you are driving on manual
Transmission:
Upgrade if stock gear ratios are off or need faster shift time
Driveshaft:
Go for it, weight reduction
Differential:
Does not cost any PI, go for it
Breaking:
Max is not always better. Max braking for A+
Only upgrade if you are not maxing out braking
Open up telemetry and check the peak braking power:
Under 100% - downgrade
Over 100% - good, might benefit from upgrade?
Suspentions:
Skips street/sport
Race Drift Rally according to the mode
Antiroll:
Max
Chassi reinforcement:
Most do not need any
Extremely useful for older cars that are pushed into a higher class
Raw weight reduction:
Great if you can affford PI.
Choice between POWER/WEIGHT R. = Shave weight instead of adding power.
Prioritize losing weight in wheel / driveshaft / flywheel weight over raw weight reduction
Power:
Intake - lower priority. Increases power/torque sometimes reduced weight
Throttle body - lot of power and torque and shave weight. Good way to add power
Fuel system - good mod power and torque does not shave weight
Exaust - higher priority shaves a lot of weight, adds good power and a lot of torque
Cam shaft - highest priority lots of power/torgue and increased redline
Valves - lower priority
Displacement - a lot of extra power/torque
Compression - lower priority
Turbo - higher priority great way of adding a ton of power
Cooling(intercooler/oilcooling ) - avoid if you can get power else where. On simulation helps to prevent engines from overheating, otherwise justs adds weight
Flywheel - good way to add/reduce few PI
Thanks
thanks
you've got time to spare :D
very useful comment anyway.
Thanks!
hey man awesome job
I always end up in A class with a 2000 pound car that has 320hp and can only go 140, but god do they turn lmao
when you good at vocab in french but shit at grammar so you have to stay in the beginning class
@@chordeaux8203 I have no idea what you're trying to say
A car that is that light with a good amount of power (especially with such a light car) should definitely be able to go over 140. You should check out a video on changing the gearing. You can completely change the top speed or the amount of acceleration that the car has.
@@chordeaux8203 What are you talking about?
@@lmCIoudz it's aero limited not weight limited. Generally more power is better top speed, less weight is better acceleration
0:16 Conversions
2:11 Aero
3:14 Tires and rims
5:54 Drivetrain
7:14 Handling
9:30 Engine
12:00 Overall Priorities
Found myself coming back often, so I put down the chapters
That's my philosophy too: prioritise handling.
A slow car that can turn at full throttle is faster than a fast car that needs to brake at every single turn. I often win races against more powerful cars because my car can do almost all the race at 100% gas
Help me all my cars ended up being s2 or s2 with shit handling what should I do???? To improve the handling and stop the cars from sliding slightest turn at 200 km or 150 above I lose my control even though I tried to improve my grip
@@lthedoperabbitl9258 for the class just don't put all max parts, i do this especially when i have to build a car for a specific class in a race: if the race allows it i'll max it all out, but if it's an A or B class race i just put racing cams, flywheel and exhaust, then i'll work on handling and transmission.
If it's a slow car you don't need high performance tyres and wider wheels, you can also skip the rollcage..just keep in mind that less power needs less "containment".
About the handling well that's a lot of trial and error: i had some issues on my S2 nissan R390, it had a little bit of understeer and sometimes it decided to spin its rear in a turn, in freemode i started changing camber, anti-roll bars etc. one point at a time until the car was race ready.
Hoki, has anyone told you that you have such a calming and beautiful voice. Love this video by the way.
Ah jeez...well thank you! I'm definitely someone who doesn't like the sound of their own voice on recordings (and tbh my mic setup is not great) so to hear that means a lot!
I definitevly aprouve mate !
Esai Soto is your profile pyrocynical?
Tha fuck?
@@rusKA21344 ?
"Adding power makes you faster on the straights, but subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere."
One of my favorite quotes :)
Die hard sim players: “now you don’t want to max out everything and you want to prioritise speed or handling”
Ever other FORZA player: “so guys just maxed out my new car to X999 class can’t wait to go so fast”
i like mine to be a or s1 class :)
Online multiplayer: "You mean I can't bring my X class car into any old race? So I have to get cars tuned to S2, and cars for both road and dirt for S1, A and B? Damnit!"
me when I'm lazy
*Looks at Final Drive.*
Spd. - Accel.
]..........l....|..............[
"Oh YeAh!! Mountain DEW!"
Spd. - Accel.
]|..............|..............[
Ayo your name is like mine in an alternate universe
After binge-watching all of your videos since I recently discovered your channel, this was the last guide that I desperately needed!
Your content has made me a millions times more interested in this game and it's community, so thank you for making really enjoyable and accessible guides for us!
Same
As far as upgrading process (in terms of what to upgrade first) I pretty much always have the same structure, prioritized after usefulness (filling the PI with the big rocks (important upgrades) and filling it with the sand (nice-to-have stuff) afterwards is much easier than filling in the sand and _then_ trying to get the big rocks in, if you want to go with that image). Interesting to note though: the PI is actually calculated in-game as a floating number (IIRC) - that's why some upgrades don't change PI at first, then suddenly do after you come back to it from upgrading the rest, that's why it's a good idea to leave some tweaking points.
*1) Conversions (duh).* Changing this after you upgraded the rest defeats the purpose as you replace your upgrades.
*2) Tires.* I usually have a PI goal in mind, and I prioritize this over anything else because my car will literally stand or fall with this. Tire compound first, then tire width, then track width. I leave the rims as a tweaking point for later (since Forza doesn't differentiate between sprung and unsprung weight, it's just more weight shaved off).
*3) Aero.* As a rule of thumb, I try to leave the aero stock below S1 class. In A class if a car is particularly unruly, but mostly I get by without; I found it costs quite a bit of PI and the handling hit I take for not taking Aero upgrades is negligable for the most part in A class and below.
*4) Transmission.* Unless the gears are completely wonky, final gear tuning is enough. Clutch I only upgrade if I feel the shifting is too slow. Differential costs no PI and adds tuning options, so always take that. Driveline I leave as a tweaking point, since sometimes you can get away with upgrading your driveline without upping your PI and the performance boost isn't high enough to prioritize this over more power IMHO.
*5) Platform and handling.* Suspension > ARBs > Brakes > Weight Reduction (depending on the car); Roll Cage only in cars that aren't -race cars OR - built after 1995(ish). Or in some cases, just as a way to optimize the front weight percentage. A good indication when it's a good idea is when it adds more than 2 PI.
*6) Engine.* Camshafts > Exhaust > Fuel system > Fly Wheel > anything else that brings me up to the PI I want.
BONUS: *7) Transmission.* Going back to check if I can sneak in a driveline upgrade :D
You can't get a driveline and a ricer rim together >(
You somehow managed to cram all that helpful information in to a size big enough for one screenshot, thanks for that
Pguy123?
Sometimes adding a wing can drop pi although the splitter almost always adds it (from my experience)
wide rinoceros
Why does it do that? I’ve always wondered. It can be a full on top speed build and it will make the PI lower for some reason
I’ve found a very enjoyable niche in B class... not too fast but fast enough to still feel like a race and not a parade.
Drift suspension is usually 1lb less than race, sometimes 0, but can be tuned back to race alignment & stiffness. This provides no advantage over race suspension in a race but in freeroam rush it is hugely beneficial to have extra angle to bring yourself out of bad situations.
You have no idea how much you've helped me Hoki. Thank you so much 🙏
One thing to keep in mind is that the camshaft upgrade essentially extends your gears without having to purchase the transmission with adjustable final drive. In some cases you can use this to your advantage and not have to buy the trans to get the speed you need.
It might be important to note the camshaft upgrade also changes the torque curve, especially noticeable on the rally engine swaps since they're tuned for specific RPM and have airflow restrictions, it's still usually a good idea to take it, but if you want to keep the mountain of torque low down you have to keep them stock.
Dude, this was so incredibly helpful - thank you. I was finally able to tune/upgrade the 22b which was impossible to use before with my crap upgrading.
Finally. There hasn't been one of these since DJS did one for horizon 2
Me: slaps all max upgrades on my car and makes them all s2+
Why??
TheForzaGameshow why not?
Not my personal option, but have definitely been there!
Same
@@larrytheshep8479 cos s2 is good
Great video as always bud.
Saw somebody else mention this below, a video on the different engine swaps might be good.
What cars they come from, what type of racing they are suited to and whatever else is relevant lol.
Anyhoo keep up the good work! ✌️
This helps so much I enjoy A and S1 the most.
Ah, a man of culture I see
Same here , can't stand S2 or the stupid custom X class madness. Lower classes are fun but no one seems to play them
@@annahenrietta9517 i will give S2 this. When the drivers are actually good and the cars and tuned correctly it's very intense racing. And diverse. The track focused Mosler, the Wicked Zonda, the fun and welcoming 918 or the absolute powerhouse of the Agera RS. It's fun, but 8 times out of ten children ruin it.
B class is fun as hell too
Same. B Class and lower is a bit too slow for me,and S2 class cars are usually very difficult to handle
Side note : Rally suspension is good for drag dracing as it improved 0-60 time and you can add height in the back of your car
I love this tutorial but I will still keep my Isetta which was tuned to spin like beyblade when you floor the gas.
One caveat to weight reduction is that it'll make tunable suspension more necessary (as does the change in weight balance that usually comes with engine swaps). In certain cars where you only want to bring them up by less than a full class, more power and/or stickier tires can be the full upgrade (and sometimes the extra weight from differet/bigger/wider wheels/tures or chassis stiffening) can help keep them in a lower class than they would pop into with the added power might put them just a few points over.
D class, B class and and A class are the most fun with proper tunes
About Radiator and Oil Cooling, you can balance it by prioritizing Air Intake, Exhaust, Valve, and Piston with race option and add Radiator/Oil Cooling on sports/street option because they only add a little weight.
I've been experiment with radiator/oil cooling and sometimes it can balance engine response and make other upgrades more effective for adding power.
Great video... slightly disagree with tyre. What i have found is if your car is slipping while cornering, upgrading tyre fixes it. You can corner fast. Temp is not the only deciding factor for tyre.
Thank you for making these. Just came here via your tuning guide - these are really helpful videos, very clear and calm, and very much appreciated.
Not gunna lie its about time someone did a guide on upgrading and not just streaming they're gameplay. Just a suggestion your next video SHOULD be fine tuning. ;)
Woah. I didnt know about the tire compound temperature and brakes hitting peak grip, thanks man!
I've been doing it wrong this whole time. Extremely helpful video!
It's only wrong if it doesn't work
Me too. Blowing all my PI on tyres
Tuning is much more important than modifications. After putting in all parts that unlock tuning options (ie sway bar, diff), it just comes down to personal preference on mods.
They need to add a AWD category and FW/RW category. You’re at a huge disadvantage throughout the race
Just to mansion. In real world you prioritize tire temp whatever tire you've got by adjusting tire pressure so can get you to somewhere in max window grip. not the other way around. Great stuff! "Always sacrifice feeling over grip" Petter Solberg
I have tuned a AM Vantage GT12 with AWD and its Beautiful in S1 Street scene / Road racing, and still doesn't try to kill me in Winter.
Wow 😮 maybe I should try that car
Well the main thing i learned today is that your car can overheat on sim damage... and also never knew the exhaust upgrade made your car louder?
Most of the cars I have are either s1 or A class I tend to find those cars the most fun to drive
Great video ,only 1 aspect missing,in all the forza games ive played from forza 2 till now,the weight distibution front to back is made very important .
Even drifting cars,front to back dist of 50 % is what I always give priority after weight and tyre.
Because the weight distribution has a overal bigger effect on handeling in general.
Plus the upgrades that effects this are the ones that most of the times can even downgrade the pi.
One of the more advance tuning ways is upgrading for even weight distribution.
I know for sure that You know what I mean,i could explain coolers en oiling upgrades with a certain engine and charger can make a almost drifting race car transform into a car as relax handeling and save as a volvo ( just an example ,a volvo is ..well pff
In the end the cars that have that great handeling al ready stock always have that ratio of 50 .
For a drag rce it doesnt matter and using an engine designed for drag or streetrace when rally or city racing is not the way.
But if for example a high performance car is what u using in moderate to high rev range and power band track( like most of the tarmac race in fh4 then going for the weight distribution is the logic thing the v12 engine with awd swap and max turbo plus cooling and oil can make a 45 % to the back sliding nightmare suddenly into a 50 % relax car.
Mostly it is the best way of gettimg a front bias car ,like many of the muscle car ,lose that terrible understeer.
Im sure that many of you know the frustrating feeling of a high powered ford that goes like a rocket but almost needs to park on every low speed corner,and can be used as a landscaper on those long sweeping speed corners.
That Problem Can be solved the way I said.
Because almost every other way one loses a lot of the power and acc.
This way one can have the raw power of a great muscle car with the cornerimg of a rdical.
The radical is the most over looked handeling car in the game ,not that senna or mosler or f1 is the best handeling car ,but the radical is ,it has the cornering feel of a lmpt car in forza motersport ,if it would lack that little bit of max speed it would be the far best car.
Hey dont believ me ,just pick goliath and leave it stock ,you wil,not beat the f1 or the maserati because those a faster,but you will have an easer ride for sure...try a hill climb or down on fortune island..
Very good. Forst time I've watched your vids. Obviously you're a Forza expert. Very informative for the beginner to the seasoned vet. (Taught me something!) I'd like to point out, most of this applies to both motorsport as well as horizon. Rally parts being the main exception. I will be referring my Academy members to your channel. Thanks for the high quality, in depth info!
Excellent video! Man I want to drive one of those irl
I have a tuned 2002 Turbo that I drive all the time. It is 11,000+ miles on it. I designed it to look like my 1982 320is as much as possible. Anyway; I have tuned it with the drift suspension and it handles pretty well. If I don’t let off soon enough around a corner; I will spin out. I have a second 2002 turbo that has the same tune but on race springs. After doing 50 laps of the Falcon Speedway Loop, the drift suspension did put down a fast time but was trickier to learn on track. My advise is, if you want a challenge and you know how to handle a bit of snap oversteer, absolutely use the drift suspension for course racing. Also that extra steering Angel can be fun to mess around with on the streets.
1 thing to add, superchargers are usually used irl since its technically easier to just slap on a supercharger. But in game, u should just upgrade the main engine since it doesnt add weight
The LSD goes straight to 75/75. When it's stock it'll have different numbers on the slider for different cars.
I really only find aero good on S2 cars. S1 and below I just generally stick to the stock design and put the PI into other areas. I've found this game really likes cars with a focus in power.
Kabloosh on my F-Type in A class I had some extreme oversteer issues. Rear wing made it disappear (with a bit of tuning). So largely not helpful, but on some cars it is make or break. :)
@@ALittleBitOfGay I've been able to really tune out over steer with -.2 toe rear and front caster between 6.5 and 7.0 with just about any car. It's usually my default setting. I also build cars with grip levels depending on the class. S1 and S2 generally I mostly max out grip, but A class I am fine with a car between .9-1.1 g's around there and then the rest just goes to boosting power for the car.
I tend to avoid aero unless the car comes with it. Even then I often tune my cars with the aero preferring speed over cornering.
The game likes power, but not as much as FH3.
I was desperatley looking for such a video by release of FH4....thankx for doing now!
Great video mate the only thing that I would argue is the tire telemetry part I would keep the Grippy tyres but raise or lower the tyre pressure accordingly
I just thought I'd mention, you can tune your car and adjust the PSI of your rear and front tyres (tyre pressure). This can affect the heat of your tyres. A good rule of thumb is to adjust your tyre pressure so the tyres are just before yellow on the Telementary HUD when driving, this is usually around 170°F. You should note that tyre pressure is not as much of a serious factor in rally racing than it is in road racing. I recommend you balance out the tyre pressure for the front and rear tyres for rally racing and purchase the widest tyre profiles you can buy, this will keep the car somewhat planted in the dirt and allow you to make rather quick corrections.
Forza doesn't differentiate between sprung and unsprung weight. The only difference maker where weight is concerned (AFAIK) is weight balance (aka "front weight percentage"), driveline, and the fly wheel.
does suspention hight shift weight balance in game?
@@slxmega7924 no. not that I can tell from playing the game at least.
@@slxmega7924 Yes, it does.
These videos are really helpful because I don’t know much about upgrading and tuning cars
Thanks a lot
I made an abomination of a awd corvette, still have to adjust some gears till its fully ready lol
Bro me too💀that’s why I’m here
AWD swap is a must have if you play on keyboard, if you put RWD on a car and increase horse power, you end up just spinning tires, also cornering isn´t much fun.
Who the hell plays a racing game on Keyboard?
@@AdminAbuse update: RWD is completely viable option on keyboard, just needed to get good, racing and drifting on keyboard through last 2 Horizons and I don´t plan on changing that anytime soon
The tuto I wanted so bad!!! Thaaaank you!
Hey Hoki! Your videos have helped me so much, and I really enjoy watching them! Keep it up!!! 🔥🔥🔥
Aim for 350-500HP for A class, 550-800+ for S1 class.
Rally tires can be great on both A and S1(4WD) class cars if you are too lazy to make another car for winter/rally racing.
Try out different engines. In some cases you can get the same PI with a lower rev engine, more usable power, and 10% boost to the power, which will get you around 5% higher top speed (ex:NSX-R GT is better with the V6 engine rather than the v-tec one)
Other cars will benefit from high revving engines, in my experience, the lower the power.
YOU ROCKS HokiHoshi. You are the best Forza TH-camr :3
There’s also some cars that have awkward setups for their upgrades when trying to stay in the pi range. Sometimes the camshaft upgrade isn’t worth it in manual with/without clutch because you can match the max upgrade if you can well past the redline and there’s the potential non peak torque loss. Idk if this has any negative consequences in simulation mode by damaging/overheating the engine though.
Even if you can rev as high, is the motor even making any power at those higher rpm? The dyno graph will usually show where the car makes power up to. So reving much past that will result in a beautiful sounding screaming engine but its not accelerating as fast as if you were in the rpm range where it actually makes power.
@@RealAnthonyJones Some engines like the 6.2 V8 still make power up there. PI calculations are done with automatic upshifts which shift before redline, so that might be a kind of exploit to make your car stronger for a given PI.
Ive always prioritize handeling uprgrades then power
Good clear info. Thank you
Thanks man!! You've earned my respect
You have the most useful videos on FH4 !
this is the first forza games i've ever played and i need some edu about cars because forza isnt about whos the fastest
wow. I never thought it would be this advanced... "if you cant heat up your tyres to proper trace temps..." i liiiike it! will put my new wheel to good use in forza it would seem
Hope driving in GB wont messing me up too bad :P
I still use street and sport suspension if I’m too lazy to adjust spring rate and damping but when using street and sport they are stiffer by a lot compared to stock. Note: if you decide to run street or sport suspension always put race sway bars on and upgrade your tires at least one compound unless your vehicles already on race tires or race slicks. If you don’t upgrade tire compound it’ll feel like you’re driving on ice. And if you don’t upgrade sway bars your car will always lose traction. Also make your sway bars softer seeing how street and sport suspension is stiffer
Hi. The brakes also reduce the weight significantly. Moreover, they also affect the initial phase of the turn
Thanks Hoki your a real life saver
A bit late to the party, but I haven't seen anyone (including you Hoki :P) talk about centrifugal superchargers. I like to install them to my 2WD cars in addition to camshaft upgrades to reduce their torque-to-power ratio, which IMO gets them to launch and exit corners with a lower chance to break traction. What do you think ?
That's a solid strategy.
"If you can reach your power goals with the naturally aspirated engine, that's generally better" but turbo sound good :(
But turbo lag is annoying
Wait, so is it wrong if I play Horizon with simulation damage?
I guess it is a personal decision on what you like or not. If you play with damage you will earn a little more credits I think. I always play with it off because these driveatars in free roam can be pretty annoying. 😅
Amazing man! Thank you very much for share these informations.
I started driving in the class C to learn how to drive correctly because of your video about drive education.
Now, I will try to improve the setup of my car in the class C based on this video.
Thanks. 👍
Its really rare to see someone in the forza community to be driving with appreciation for cars. Not just v12 awd max upgrade everything! Repect
I recommend going up to A class.
@@Uncle_Glock I already drove at the classes A, S1 and S2. I really enjoyed racing at the A class with the old abarth Fiat 500 or with the Lotus eleven 1956 at the A class or S1 class ( I don't remenber now for which class I prepared the Lotus).
The problem starts at the S2 class. It's really fast and constantly I feel the sensation of fear to make some mistakes and lose the control of my car while I race. So with the tips from drive education video, I hope to improve my skills on the higher classes training on the lower classes.
👍
Him: this costs a lot of cr
*laughs in 100 mil*
He's talking about class points, i think PI = Performance Index
holy hell I learned a lto from this video. Now time to re tune all of my cars lol
Exactly what I was looking for, thanks
These videos are great ! Thank you
something on my mind. I noticed that some racers like ISAD tend to not upgrade the cams on their engine. The most famous being the 6.2 v8 and the 3.2 i6. As far as I can see it, this is due that you can squeeze much more power by revving the engine over the redline.
What do you think of this? It’s been on my mind for a long time if I’m honest 😅
I’ve experience what you mentioned. I do the same in my 1945 Jeep. I learned that I lose quite a bit of non peak from adding camshaft upgrades since it stretches the dyno.
Previous games cams were never worth the pi they cost when you could get much more power and torque using a combination of the other upgrades...not sure if that’s still the case w fh4 or not;)
@@sharonneedlesfreedomsnotfr813 what do you mean not worth the pi cost? Like isnt the whole point to max out everything? Like why are yall worried about pi? I just dont understand the pi thing i guess. So pls explain.
I criticize him just as bad as AR12. He doesn’t tune his stuff as deeply as Hoki does. Half of his cars are usually AWD and engine swapped and he calls it a day.
I highly recommend just going by Hoki’s guidelines. I’ve tuned my cars much better on the original drivetrain and engine thanks to him. As far as cams go, squeezing every bit of power in said gear is crucial especially if you’re running turbochargers. This also increases your top end especially for those straights.
Camshaft upgrades on some engines like the 6.2 V8 should make your car less OP, since the PI calculations are done in automatic upshifts.
Your tuning quickies have helped me fix my fwd and rwd cars. But can we get an awd guide..
There is not need for AWD quickies, just having AWD fixed any launch/wheelspin problems
Hoki hoshi I am so glad that you actually answered my question, to be honest I never was expecting a video in response of my comments because I always feel like my comments go unseen which I can understand you can only read so many comments at a time but anyway I appreciate you answering my questions, thank you for your help!
Ofcourse! I definitely read all my comments so never think that what you/others are saying is going unheard!
Hoki hoshi thanks to this video I just created a monster b class hemi cuda
The Nissan GTR LM R33 Forza Edition's premade setup comes with AWD and handles much better than if you were to do an AWD swap on a normal GTR LM R33
its not only about swapping to AWD to get better handling, a lot of other things are needed, especially Toe, Camber and general aerodynamics. And for more finesse tuning, rims, tires and car suspension height.
is 50/50 weight distribution matter for Read Mid engine car?
I'm a new player, thanks for this video
No one:
Younger me: max out everything and wonder why it drifts by just looking at it
thank you! thanks to your videos, I am starting to understand tuning and cars, so I don´t have to call my brother to tune my new cars... saves time and I am starting to have fun with it.
Imo if you engine swap a car, you aren't driving that car anymore. Same with drivetrain swapping.
What about a period/manufacturer correct swap? Say a Ford 427 (7.0 racing engine) into the 68 mustang, something that fits the original character of the car
@@Iridiumcosmos yeah exactly i dont agree with the v12 in everything
I'm not here to drive an ugly-ass Audi TT, i'm here to win races
@@Randomii666 Well, some people, including myself, have more of a balance - we want cars we like, too, also trying to keep the character, if feasible.
@@dennisjungbauer4467 Tbh, i rarely swap anything. But if you have some random low PI car you want to use online, you pretty much need engine and awd swaps, especially in S2, and even S1.
I still have a couple cars in S1 and S2 that have their original engine and rwd, but most of the time i end up swapping engine and converting to awd for the cars i use in ranked
Thanks for the info dude
Very helpful and too the point. Subscribed
Some times too much power will make a lot of wheelspin on the tires it will make them a drift
I always find cam shafts add way too much pi, I max upgrade the brakes as I like to tune the braking balance so the rear tyres are being fully utilised in a braking zone, it does mean if you lock up you are very likely to spinout, but you do stop faster
The v12 maxed out naturally aspirated is balanced too. 797hp
Never underestimate a grippy car
I beat plenty in circuits with them
well duh
awesome guides. i m just starting out with tuning and well most if it is probly pretty bad but i dont even care. i dont expect to create the best tunings in the world but as long as they work, im fine with it. i think its a pretty solid trade off for flexibility. because downloading other tunes allways made me feel.. helpless. for example winter season. you wanna edit your tune and slap on winter tires... well you cant do that because its locked and you need to pray for mercy that someone creates a winter tune... i just wanna do stuff myself for whatever car i wanna drive (and those cars are usually off meta cars since i wanna be that weird guy who s using that car noone uses simply because it looks good) lxD
Lotus: less power, mo lightness!
Insane video, keep up
Rally springs are the best
Thanks Rob! Your explanation is very helpful as always! :)
This is the best video.
It’s missing the track width parts because of the sample car.
Can you explain if I using a FR BMW 2002, should I max the rear width and keep the front width as original ?
I've noticed that power to weight ratio always seems to lean to adding power before raw weight reduction. I didn't do a ton of testing before coming to that conclusion but it seemed fairly consistent through about 20 cars that I tested it on.
Hey Hoki maybe you can help me out. I rly like your tuning guide but i have a question/problem: So far everything works fine but my cars generally seem to lack power. They are quite fine to drive but i cant keep up even with the AI drivers (on third to second highest difficulty, sim steering, manual w/o clutch, controller and Thrustaster T150). Tried to tune the Volvo 850 (as i have that car IRL) grip tune A800. So what parts can i swap in favor of more power? Or is the Volvo just a bad car to tune?
Great video. Sadly for competitive play, Playground has made the game such that you're pretty fucked if you don't use AWD especially in freeroam rush and making it almost impossible to do good launches.
You're also fucked in the low speed corners where you need throttle modulation whereas you can pretty much floor every AWD car everywhere.
Which is why the majority of forza players are absolute wankers with no sense of car appreciation and ownership pride
@@Uncle_Glock Yeah super true! It's all 1500 hp lambos all round. I made my own little track once (Based out of Needle Descent), picked out my favourite cars, turned em back to stock. And drove them up and down, just to notice the nuances. Made the entire game worth it!!
It’s why I stay off usually stay off s1 and up. S1 is where I start seeing awd becoming necessary and beyond. A class any drivetrain can do the job unless some nut job decides to drag race and wall ride his way to first
My Z06 uses awd and is great with fine tuning
As usual your video reveals, thanks. Like the Colin Chapman quote.
Could you please explain some of the terms you use like PI?
forza.fandom.com/wiki/Performance_Index
I don’t know a lot about this game so I go based on my logic: Green is good. I buy. Make car go zoom.