I've left a long winded comment to explain my reasons. But long story short, this headset was made for me, and I'm pre-ordering it to use as my daily driver. There's players like me who don't mind fresnel lenses and prioritize features and tracking support. I love all this has to offer, it's the headset I've been waiting for personally :)
For anyone who would like to know why I'm pre-ordering this to be my daily driver, I'm copying and pasting my comment to avoid the task of having to go fishing for it. : "This is pretty much exactly what I was looking for. I will be using this as my daily driver for pcvr. I can definitely understand the incompatibility with users who get too distracted by a fresnel lense. But being a vr user who started with pc and standalone play sessions from the vive to the quest 2 I am someone who can focus on my own performance ignoring fog glare or lense distortion, this headset is the perfect match for me. I've wanted eye tracking and foveated rendering combined with full body tracking support in a headset that can be used with swappable batteries for a standalone experience if needed on a case to case basis. As for the controllers and the chipset.. Also perfect for me! A lightweight feathery lightsaber of a controller is completely immersion breaking for me. I play Battle Talent and battle royal shooters or shooters in general. I add weights to the controllers and handstraps myself for added weight and physical enjoyment. So I likely will not be using hand tracking unless in a social experience or I'm watching media or playing something on mixed reality like maybe a board game on rare occasions. As for graphics, I've come to the found opinion that better graphics are usually fluff that detract from an immersive experience of being in a surreal virtual environment. I love seeing a high visual fidelity and pixel dense experience on some pancake lenses as much as anyone else. But to me that is the gimmicky problem of vr the same way that modern aggressively competitive uncanny graphics improvements detract rather than improve on artistic originality and immersing myself in a virtual world. Unless of course the lenses are a problem for someone as I said. This comes from my biase of being a guy who uses haptics and enjoys hopping into The Haunted Apk or Resident Evil 4 or Cosmodread standalone (my preferred graphical version) or cod style zombie maps for arcade type of fun as much as I play anything else I play. With of course the enjoyment for graphically impressive story or experience games whether action or haptic orientated or not. So my use of vr is very much as an immersive arcade or virtual surreal world with features at the forefront, and creativity rather than graphics emphasized. I am someone who's first vr experience was beach head 2000 on a beach head 2002 360 vortex drop down helmet arcade machine with connected shooting sticks in a physical arcade running on quarters when they existed popularly. And I am someone who can enjoy vr being purposefully tailored to be physically demanding. So when I want something to be ultra realistic I'll just do what I want in real life, however long it takes me to get there or aquire or use a simulator. The focus vision is also great for a social experience which I hop into as well and I enjoy multiplayer online games regularly. But my emphasis is that I personally play vr to enter a world with a challenging environment both against other players and against high difficulty set opponents for the thrill of improving my virtual skills. I will play a game with a relaxing experience just sitting down in vr or on controller out of vr if I feel like enjoying something more relaxed than what I've described. That's my two cents, this headset is all I've wanted. The price works for me. I'm going to pre-order the headset :)"
So this is the Vive Pro 2, same lenses and resolution, with features that should have been there from the start (eye tracking) with a standalone part than only businesses will use Should have been released in 2021 instead of late 2024
@@zerocool6452 HTC do not care about keeping the price down. If they did care, it would not have eye tracking or the chip it has. Im sure ppl would rather have better lens and forgo the chip it has or eye tracking.
@@zerocool6452the thing is once I tried pancake lenses I can't going back . Even with automatic ipd adjustment... The difference between the 2 is too big... Comfort and clarity without the frustration to set everything perfectly are for me everything..
This is pretty much exactly what I was looking for. I will be using this as my daily driver for pcvr. I can definitely understand the incompatibility with users who get too distracted by a fresnel lense. But being a vr user who started with pc and standalone play sessions from the vive to the quest 2 I am someone who can focus on my own performance ignoring fog glare or lense distortion, this headset is the perfect match for me. I've wanted eye tracking and foveated rendering combined with full body tracking support in a headset that can be used with swappable batteries for a standalone experience if needed on a case to case basis. As for the controllers and the chipset.. Also perfect for me! A lightweight feathery lightsaber of a controller is completely immersion breaking for me. I play Battle Talent and battle royal shooters or shooters in general. I add weights to the controllers and handstraps myself for added weight and physical enjoyment. So I likely will not be using hand tracking unless in a social experience or I'm watching media or playing something on mixed reality like maybe a board game on rare occasions. As for graphics, I've come to the found opinion that better graphics are usually fluff that detract from an immersive experience of being in a surreal virtual environment. I love seeing a high visual fidelity and pixel dense experience on some pancake lenses as much as anyone else. But to me that is the gimmicky problem of vr the same way that modern aggressively competitive uncanny graphics improvements detract rather than improve on artistic originality and immersing myself in a virtual world. Unless of course the lenses are a problem for someone as I said. This comes from my biase of being a guy who uses haptics and enjoys hopping into The Haunted Apk or Resident Evil 4 or Cosmodread standalone (my preferred graphical version) or cod style zombie maps for arcade type of fun as much as I play anything else I play. With of course the enjoyment for graphically impressive story or experience games whether action or haptic orientated or not. So my use of vr is very much as an immersive arcade or virtual surreal world with features at the forefront, and creativity rather than graphics emphasized. I am someone who's first vr experience was beach head 2000 on a beach head 2002 360 vortex drop down helmet arcade machine with connected shooting sticks in a physical arcade running on quarters when they existed popularly. And I am someone who can enjoy vr being purposefully tailored to be physically demanding. So when I want something to be ultra realistic I'll just do what I want in real life, however long it takes me to get there or aquire or use a simulator. The focus vision is also great for a social experience which I hop into as well and I enjoy multiplayer online games regularly. But my emphasis is that I personally play vr to enter a world with a challenging environment both against other players and against high difficulty set opponents for the thrill of improving my virtual skills. I will play a game with a relaxing experience just sitting down in vr or on controller out of vr if I feel like enjoying something more relaxed than what I've described. That's my two cents, this headset is all I've wanted. The price works for me. I'm going to pre-order the headset :)
@@Anakin-dl6eb Thats true but we already have plenty of those kinds of headsets. Many of them aren't out just yet but soon enough (Pimax and Somnium) We need more midrage priced headsets.
A very compelling option for anyone who benefits from eye-tracking. Fresnel lenses really aren't as bad as people make them out to be, unless you simply can't be bothered to adjust a headset into position. There are drawbacks to pancake optical stacks such as significant light loss and limited field of view, and aspherics are prone to geometric distortion. No current optical stack is perfect, but I wish people wouldn't write off every fresnel headset as unusable junk without even giving it a shot
While I do find Fresnel lenses to be a significant step back w.r.t. the pancake lenses of a Quest 3; I do agree that an important part of that stems from "misaligned Fresnel lenses = sadness", which the Quest 2 (and Quest 3S) cause, with their 3 hard-coded IPD knobs, which have meant only a very small part of the population could properly enjoy those headsets. Here, however, we have eye-tracked automatic IPD adjustment, and that will probably lessen the issues of these lenses quite significantly, to the point it will probably just be a slightly more front-heavy headset with smaller edge-to-edge clarity, but a smaller price-point (in theory; hard to see at $1200), and a more power-efficient headset (nice for standalone).
@@markus301 No, Crystal uses a glass aspheric stack. They look very sharp and clear, but they suffer from a "geometric sweet spot" that causes some barrel distortion if you aren't positioned perfectly.
These fresnel lenses are as bad. They are the same lenses that Vive Pro 2 and Focus 3 have. They are garbage. There are not many people able to use Pro 2 due to that. Even most hardcore HTC fans were trashing all over the headset due to lenses (among other reasons but lenses were no 1 issue).
@@chadef555 yeah, I tried the Pro 2 when it first launched and I remember not being super impressed with it, vertical FoV cut off making an awkwardly letterbox image. I mostly defend fresnel because PSVR2 on PC is my favorite headset at the moment
Personally I'm willing to give that a pass since no other headset has DP but also eyetracking (except for a some other few headset but those are generally much more expensive) and I would believe a face tracking module will arrive. Can't have everything I guess.
We need more headsets that use foveated rendering and eyetracking. Especially for the stand alone headsets that could benefit from the GPU increase it would bring.
@@Blattie 2026 will probably be the next year that a major game changing headset comes out, but I'm basing that entirely on the Quest 4 timing. I think most big players will release around the same time as that's how it usually goes.
I have owned many vr headsets, and the Quest Pro is my favorite thus far for pcvr using virtual desktop rtx 4080 i9 13th gen GODLIKE settings pancake lens Quantum dot local dimming pretty large glass lens ect... I currently have the Q3 while its great the lenes are smaller and the quality of the LCDs are not as good and the Pro version as far as contrast and colors! I would have def purchased this headset if it had pancake lens! I like that you can connect the headset to PC via display port for maximum uncompressed fidelity with those 5K displays could have been somthing amazing but the OLD Fresnel lens kill it! I've owed the Vive Pro 2 and it sucks compared to the Quest Pro even though it had way higher resolution those old lens makes everything look rough plus that headset was heavy as shit lol!
@@CarlosHernandez-rq5rx Can we also have 165hz headset with low latency/response time. I want to play PC games with a virtual ultrawide display and it feels like NOW is the time. I do it now on the Quest pro with Moonlight and Reverse Thetering (weird thing that allows you to use your usb-c cable as an ethernet cable) but there's still noticeable lag and the games don't run as smooth as on my monitor.
I think it looks great. ill preorder. it's going to replace my pico 4 and reverb g2. that's what I was looking for, thought valve would do it first. cheers to HTC for looking out for pcvr!
Fresnel lenses don't have to be that bad. I almost prefer my Reverb G2 visuals over my Quest Pro, except for the edge-to-edge clarity. With 120° FOV, I think these could outperform my Quest Pro lenses if they have big enough of a sweet spot. We'll just have to wait for the reviews.
Dunno why people hate on this. Price may be high, but compared to my bsb amd pcl....i still find myself usinf the quest 3 the most and even my index more.... Pcl was a disappointment along with bsb....may give this a try as all i want is a index with better resolution or quest 3 but display port. Ill give this a try
Which VR headsets are recommended nowadays? I already have a useless Hololens 2 at work and thought of buying an "old" HTC VIVE PRO 2. I had the first HTC vive at my last job and it worked fine. Now the Vision shows up and it seems like a good combination... But with wo many negative comments I'm not sure anymore... What do people actually recommend?
This is what drives me crazy about HTC. They never fail to release a product that looks really good in most areas, but they always have to include one crippling stupid design decision that basically kills it before it gets started. This would be very interesting except for one thing, Fresnel lenses. I could get the Pimax Crystal Light for a lot less with even higher resolution and far better visuals with pancake lenses. Add this to the steaming pile of HTC products that I looked at and said "Nope, would never consider because of this, or would never consider because of that.
Anxious for Sebastian's assessment. High resolution panels, Display Port and eye-tracking are big pluses for flight simmers so hopefully we'll see how it performs in DCS with eye-tracking enabled. Seems a little pricey but won't rule it out yet. Want to know about the FOV, weight and comfort of the headset too. Would've hoped for QLED or OLED displays, and pancake lenses to allow a more compact design, but willing to wait and see. Will it be a solid upgrade option from the Quest 3? How will it perform against the Pimax Crystal Light with local dimming at $899?
Thanks for your video mate. I've preordered one from my local Vive Australia store (au$1899, which includes the wired streaming cable and DP adapter). I'm looking forward to seeing how it compares to my current favorite flight sim headset = Meta QPro/i913900k/rtx4090 with the official link cable connected to my z790mb usb3.2 gen2 type-c port at 650mbps encoding bitrate. Of course I would have preferred it came with pancake lens and Qled screens rather than fresnel. Hopefully, together with auto-IPD, DisplayPort, and the higher res 2449x2448 lcd screens, it will look and perform well. Time will tell I guess. Thanks again mate and best cheers from Australia.
Old lenses + old chipset = 1200 eur? What the hell are they smoking at HTC? The guy who is responsible for this should be fired imo... this product is basicly DOA.
I have never returned a headset so fast before. I bought it with high hopes, but it failed completely. I am looking forward to your review, because there are a lot of negatives that you will have to cover. So far, people are generally reviewing it very negatively on Reddit and Amazon. Especially troublesome was the issue with eye and face tracking not working properly, since it was advertised so strongly as a primary feature.
@@mixedrealityTV Despite calibrating and having used a Vive Pro Eye for years (works great), eye tracking in the Focus Vision has issues where the eyes shake and blink constantly. Also, the automatic IPD triggers every 15-30 minutes and crams itself into my nose causing a bit of pain.
Someone out there, please just make a PCVR head that has:- pancake lenses, manual IPD, light and cool to wear when playing, .....with .....Some style of G sync hardware in the headset to help your PC rig when playing! I personally think that would be a massive selling point, this headset helps your PC when playing...?
@@calcariachimera Bigscreen Beyond hired optic technician few months ago. Glare and sweetspot problem will be obsolete on next version. So far my Beyond FOV and resolution and brightness is just perfect!
Another DOA from HTC. Besides the higher screen resolution and DisplayPort, I don't see a good reason to buy this over a Quest Pro which is better in every other way and also has face tracking, can't forget that. I'm guessing you still have to buy that Squidward-nose face-tracking add-on judging by that panel just above the nose area. I got excited hearing it has eye tracking but that is immediately negated when paired with Fresnel lenses because you cannot look around much due to the small sweet spot.
Finally, HTC is planning to release a good headset with an excellent field of view and great resolution comparable to the Apple Vision Pro with display port which is really exciting news , welcome back HTC 👍😍
I don't know much about the Focus, and am a bit nervous from the description that it may not keep up with newer gen tech, but eagerly await more in depth info. The Vive works with Linux due to working through SteamVR alone, correct? Will this one also?
No, it requires streaming software. for Linux you need to use a streamer called ALVR, which I don't think supports ultimate trackers or eye/face tracking yet. VR on Linux is still a struggle and very buggy in general.
@@cheapcrackers4772 Thanks! Bummer. From what research I'd been able to do, it sounded like any headset using Steam VR alone works natively, which seemed to include the Index, Bigscreen Beyond and original Vive. So was hoping that meant this one would as well. Back to waiting for an Index 2?
It seems to be an HTC Vive version of the original Pimax Crystal (edit, but minus anything Crystal...) - please compare specs, quality, ergonomics and prices, as well as ease of integration with body-trackers. Kthx. 😁
I’m sorry, but for the first time I feel that this video was more of an ad sponsored video than actually presenting useful information about how this over-priced unit will actually perform…. I remember all of the hype from the Vive Cosmos, which was the first and only headset I wound up ever returning…. because of all of the hype.
@@MannyVel Hi Manny, how could I talk about how this thing performs when they literally have just announced it in the moment this video goes live? I only got the press release and a few pics. Don't you think your comment is a bit entitled and actually completely inappropriate? This is not a review!
@@mixedrealityTV Sorry guy. This does not need to a review. For this we'll patiently wait. He just meant that as far as your knowledge about this thing goes (like you said, this is a brand new thing), you're somewhat seem somewhat overexcited over it. We get that you are very eager to actually try it out and then share the news - we appreciate this, but this really sounded like a promotional video a bit. I imagine it was not, but then perhaps it would be beneficial to review the style, to avoid such comments. Cheers.
@@Terrylovesjougurt Which part of the style do you mean? This is an announcement, not a review. How about giving the device a chance before we crucify it? For the one concern I have I am clearly letting you know about my thoughts about the lenses! And then in the end of the video I when the scripted part ends I even let you know that if course you get the standard mrtv treatment with review etc once I have it. So no, I cannot understand both of your comments and I think it's inappropriate.
@@mixedrealityTV :) No one is crucifying it. I for one don't have an opinion at all. And I won't have one until I try it for myself, if this even happens. I don't think no one is suggesting that it is a paid promotion either. I'm just explaining to you why Manny wrote what he wrote. Take this in good faith. He even said that this is the first time that he felt like this, so this just seems like a fluke. We both will be waiting for an actual and accurate review, as always. Cheers.
It's reasonable for content creators talking about VR headsets to evaluate the technology used, considering the many other headsets out there that are making advances in quality. Many times VR headset content creators talk about a new headset with a big smile, not even highlighting the clear disappointments that most everyone else will mention.
Their specs page does not provide information about the lenses type or how heavy the headset is.. Almost like they dont want to give that info because they know it will hurt pre-orders. How is it possible that an official specs webpage does not include those 2 infos for a VR headset? Sus.... I am glad to see a new VR headset from HTC that is more appealing to me to finally upgrade my WMR, but I would also like to see that they do not intentionally hide information about their new headset. It does not inspire trust in the brand when i notice those shady tactics. Am also curious and actually waiting on what Valve will launch (hopefully soon... perhaps this HTC launch is them wanting to do so just before Valve makes their own announcement).
I started out with the rift-s so having gone to a Quest 2 and then Quest 3 I can see the appeal. Unfortunately even as a PC VR gamer I don't find this appealing at that price. The Quest 3 has a big sweet spot so adjustment of the ipd manually is a hassle. Eye tracking isn't something I'm particularly fussed about either. At first glance it seems overpriced, over gimmicky,underspec. Give me a Quest 3 equivalent with displayport and bring the price down by a few hundred then yes.
I have owned many vr headsets, and the Quest Pro is my favorite thus far for pcvr using virtual desktop rtx 4080 i9 13th gen GODLIKE settings pancake lens Quantum dot local dimming pretty large glass lens ect... I currently have the Q3 while its great the lenes are smaller and the quality of the LCDs are not as good and the Pro version as far as contrast and colors! I would have def purchased this headset if it had pancake lens! I like that you can connect the headset to PC via display port for maximum uncompressed fidelity with those 5K displays could have been somthing amazing but the OLD Fresnel lens kill it! I've owed the Vive Pro 2 and it sucks compared to the Quest Pro even though it had way higher resolution those old lens makes everything look rough plus that headset was heavy as shit lol!
Man, why do these companies always have to get at least one obvious thing wrong. Add proper pancake lenses and the more powerful chip and sorted. What's the FOV though, because I really want to start seeing that greatly improved in all these headsets.
You didn't mention it has 120 fov. The psvr2 has 110 that's the best thing about the psvr2 for me. With that field of view I forget that the psvr2 even has fersnel lenses
I dunno why anyone would want to buy this to be honest. They're marketing it as 'next-gen', but there's only old tech in the device and it's being sold at a premium. For displayport wired PCVR, you can get better alternatives. For wireless PCVR, you can also get better alternatives that are much cheaper. The ancient gen 1 chip alone already makes the device redundant on release and that's far from the only issue. It's essentially a Quest 2 with a displayport, higher resolution and a few more features.
Nearly 2025 already, so this headset definitely needs micro OLED displays as nothing else comes close in quality. And there should be an option to pay extra and have it come with VR hand gloves that support precise finger tracking (visual hand tracking will never be precise enough) and have 8 button emulation by touching finger tips to thumbs and some forcefeedback ideally; clunky game controllers put people off VR, and as good as it sounds, even though I have an RTX4090 PC, I won't invest in any VR system without micro OLED and VR gloves.
@madigorfkgoogle9349 you have that backwards - OLED has the best colours with the highest possible contrast. Organic Light-Emitting Diodes are individually lit, with unlit diodes completely black, so infinite contrast. LED is trash in comparison, and far less power efficient unless the entire display were constantly white light at its brightest settings, which NEVER happens with games. The Big Screen Beyond uses micro-OLED and is acknowledged as the best VR display for colours and contrast.
@@TimLongson no I dont, OLED do have terrible colour accuracy, vibrant colours yes, accurate and natural colours? You kidding. Highest possible contrast? Again yes, but poor dynamic contrast. It is easy to have high contrast ratio, since it is a simple ratio between darkest and lightest light level level. The problem is all in between, and here is OLED utter trash, sorry. I worked in printing industry and I am a colour mangement specialist so I know what Im talking about. Even the cheapest LCD panels today easy reach lower then Delta E 2.0 easy, meanwhile I really have to get to measure OLED display that can reach Delta E 2.0, some claim it, never measured one to achieve it. Meanwhile top LCD panels can do around Delta E 1.0 or even less. You can see Delta E higher then 2.0 with naked eye easy mostly in natural colours like skin tones, blue sky, green foliage. Also close to full intensity RGB colours are very hard for OLED to master, so you cant distinct between two different red cars for example. While OLED can make the traffic light red very good, it is hard to make a Ferrari red for OLED, it will be either to yellow or too traffic light red, if you understand what I mean. Also OLED has problems with edge luminosity levels in general, so yes OLED can do full black (that is useless since human eye cant see in pitch black so you cant see black in reality) but cannot display few steps of lighter black. Also in the middle of the curve there is a lot of noise and bad levels linearity, same effect as in dark tones we can observe in highlight tones where the clipping is even more observable. I prefer the slightly lighter dark black with a lot of gradation in shadows for some information to absolute black with clipping out the information in shadows. The stepping of tonality curve of luma and its linearity is the dynamic contrast, and here the OLED has to walk a long way yet. So yes OLED has vibrant "candy" colours that are popping, but you dont have such colours in nature, and natural colours are hard nut to crack for OLED yet.
Does anyone know if 2.0 base stations and 3.0 trackers are compatible with the headset? i bought fbt ages ago and i wanna buy this headset but it would seem like a waste if i cant use the trackers i already have
The headset uses its own inside out tracking. However there’s no reason why you wouldn’t be able to use your trackers. They all still show up in SteamVR.
I honestly don’t care if a headset has LCD panels but they should have at least tried to do pancake lenses. The visuals in pancake lenses are just much better than freshnel lenses
I agree with you. But this is not a new headset but more of a refresh. And probably since they have automatic IPD adjustment, you wont have such a hard time finding the sweetspot! We will know soon! Thanks for commenting!
@@mixedrealityTV This might be a good replacement for the reverb g2 if it stays on when plugged into the DisplayPort and does everything it’s supposed to. I mean you get eye tracking, wireless, and wired capabilities in one headset for $1000 and it seems like a great deal. Hopefully you’ll test it out soon
There is a big catch with the displayport as I read the HTC notes carefully, it requires a $149 costing adapter (which you get for free if you pre-order it)..... So HTC is not telling the truth out right..
I started with the Original Vive in 2016. Would have loved to have gone Vive Pro but HTC's pricing was CRAZY! Still is! Their current offering is too similar to Quest and Pico but Double Price?!? No Huge Features to justify it?!? NOPE!!! I eventually ungraded to the Valve Index. Really wanted a native Steam VR headset WITHOUT any middleman software requirement! Too Pricey but the headset is Ok. Controllers function Ok. However, I have had one Thumbstick wear out and two Grip panels snap off from normal use. The video cable may also be failing? I am not hard on my tech. I consider this to be outrageous for a $1000 product. I still don't think there is any Perfect HMD for the everyman. Each and every one has some BIG negative! It's such a shame! Me sad 😞
HTC are stuck in a time machine. Wonder when they will get out. Pricing is disrespectful to the consumers. No PC cable for PCVR headset and still using fresnel lenses with the audacity to price at $999... They better not wonder why it doesn't sell lol
Everyone’s complaining about the Fresnel lenses which pancake lenses would have been better. But because of the 5K display, eye tracking for foveated rendering and the display port to eliminate compression it will still have a much better image than the Quest 3 on PCVR. Pancake lenses aren’t making up for all that, there good but not that good. But had they added them that would have been the icing on the cake.
AND the Vive Focus 3 had the Worst fresnel lenses ive used. I returned it and continued using quest 2 for a while. So if its the same ones, Man HTC is just being HTC, and F'ing up something that should have been great. They always do this!
Is eye tracking, for foveated rendering, pointless with a frenel lens and a small sweet spot? You don't want to look at the blurriness of a frenel lens away from the centre, so you only need foveated rendering in the centre, so you don't need eye tracking. Or am I missing something? Our choices now seem to be: This for display port and sharper visuals in the centre of the lens. Q3 for streamed artifacts, lower resolution but consistent across the lens. Or much better visuals via display port if you want to trust that Pimax have finally got their act together. All so close with just 1 small change each. A display port on a quest. Pancake lens on the HTC. Sticking to their promises at Pimax. 🤷
pretty concerning that you didnt get a pre release to test but htc gave one to someone not answering any questions and having a fluffy 6 minute video..
This is definitely getting a bit too much hate for what it is. We've got same price point as quest pro. Displays are not pancake, but they are higher resolution. Fov is supposedly larger by around 15 degrees. Has eye tracking. Loses a point because face tracking add on is an extra 100. Loses a point on controllers, as they can't compete with either quest pro controllers or index. Hand tracking, assuming it works well is fantastic. You should definitely wait for a proper review, but it's got real potential with a caveat. The connection cable only being free for preorder will hurt their sales past their first wave.
@@CorporateZombi hehe, not necessarily, though I understand the sentiment. I'm sure it's irritating for the company, but hey, return policy is valid. You've essentially got a 2 week free trial. Don't be afraid to be inconvenient for your consumer benefit. I am guilty of doing that with a few bluetooth speakers back when I was Christmas shopping for my parents.
oh my god when will these companies stop ruining their headsets by compromising on things you cant compromise on. Compromise on your straps, your plastic, your speakers, remove automated IPD, etc. Force users into after market solutions for those instead of compromising on things required to reach minimum viability.
It's WIRELESS!!!!!! I won't buy any headset, no matter the resolution, if it does not have Wireless connectivity. This headset is somewhat exciting. Concerned about the lenses though.
Why would you use this over any other dedicated PCVR headset at this price range? It doesn't offer anything compelling in standalone as it's a Quest 2 on HTC's ecosystem lol.
Eye tracking. To get eye tracking + display port you'd have to pay more for a Pimax Crystal or Somnium VR1. That said, it is is mostly the same as the Focus 3, it won't be possible to charge it while you use it - let alone mains power it - so it'll be a terrible PCVR HMD.
After the Somnium turning out to be astronomical 4k€ instead of 2k€-2.5k€ I am looking for any kind of sane new nex-gen headset, again Focus Vision is not it. We are stuck in perpetual VR 1.5 land since years and 4000€ is not even enthusiast pricing anymore. Valve is the only hope then (I hope to live to see that day).
They could have upgraded the lenses and the processor to the XR2+. So the lenses aren't as good as they could be, and no AV1 encoding for streaming... two pretty large downsides imo.
I'm done with VR. I have tried it time and again but no matter the HMD there is always something lacking despite the high cost of HMD's, be it Resolution, FOV, automatic IPD, eye tracking, good lenses, colours/brightness, design, comfort or something else. I keep saying give it a few more years and I keep getting disappointed. If chip tech advanced this slowly we would all still be plying Pentium based systems!
so , old chip, no oled , no pancake(which typically a premi feature) ,90 htz( stand alone) , and promised features in update - but still 999 pre order and 1149 after ... smh what is going on with these companies. rather pass 500 for a ok experience rather a 1000 for a slightly better one. --- that older chip really get me.
Was expecting disappointment... and still disappointed. I really, really want to move on from my Quest Pro, but $1k isn't chump change. I get one headset for the next several years, and this may be an upgrade in a few regards, but a downgrade in many others. Vive, will just release a truly innovative product for a change?
Once again HTC have missed the point which quest and pico understand what we want. I will keep rocking my OG Vive with the wireless adaptor. No need to buy this thing, no base station tracking, xr2 gen2 or higher and pancake lenses, no sale.
With pancake lenses and Micro OLED this would have been a great headset even for 1500 Euro / Dollars. Why didn't they go for it??? Is there really no one on in their company who knows what people really want ??? When will they finally learn their lesson???
@@Anakin-dl6eb Bigscreen Beyond hired optic technician few months ago. I think they gonna fix glare and sweet spot for next Beyond headset. My Beyond FOV,resolution and brightness are PERFECT!
HTC have great spec writers..but in reality HTC never seem to deliver...When the Vive Pro2 was announced I thought this could be everything you need in a headset ...we know how that turned out . Lets wait and see though ...but fresnel lens aint a good start
Fresnel Lenses? Why do they continue to try to lose money and not sell headsets? I might have had some interest in this if they had put any lenses in there but those. Complete deal breaker. Sad.
Is it better than the Quest 3? If not, I'm not interested! The form factor is quite disappointing; I expected we would have moved past the 'toaster strapped to your face' design by now. Fresnel lenses feel outdated, like something from five years ago. Those controllers look even worse than the Oculus Quest 1 from 2019! It's 2024!
Pre-Order from Bestware (EU) - tidd.ly/3TB9Hqd (Affiliate)
What are your thoughts about the Vive Focus Vision?
another headset dead before it hits shelve ok lets talk about weather
Are you serious? Pre-Order link? Who in their right mind would buy this VR headset?
I've left a long winded comment to explain my reasons. But long story short, this headset was made for me, and I'm pre-ordering it to use as my daily driver. There's players like me who don't mind fresnel lenses and prioritize features and tracking support. I love all this has to offer, it's the headset I've been waiting for personally :)
For anyone who would like to know why I'm pre-ordering this to be my daily driver, I'm copying and pasting my comment to avoid the task of having to go fishing for it. : "This is pretty much exactly what I was looking for. I will be using this as my daily driver for pcvr. I can definitely understand the incompatibility with users who get too distracted by a fresnel lense. But being a vr user who started with pc and standalone play sessions from the vive to the quest 2 I am someone who can focus on my own performance ignoring fog glare or lense distortion, this headset is the perfect match for me. I've wanted eye tracking and foveated rendering combined with full body tracking support in a headset that can be used with swappable batteries for a standalone experience if needed on a case to case basis. As for the controllers and the chipset.. Also perfect for me! A lightweight feathery lightsaber of a controller is completely immersion breaking for me. I play Battle Talent and battle royal shooters or shooters in general. I add weights to the controllers and handstraps myself for added weight and physical enjoyment. So I likely will not be using hand tracking unless in a social experience or I'm watching media or playing something on mixed reality like maybe a board game on rare occasions. As for graphics, I've come to the found opinion that better graphics are usually fluff that detract from an immersive experience of being in a surreal virtual environment. I love seeing a high visual fidelity and pixel dense experience on some pancake lenses as much as anyone else. But to me that is the gimmicky problem of vr the same way that modern aggressively competitive uncanny graphics improvements detract rather than improve on artistic originality and immersing myself in a virtual world. Unless of course the lenses are a problem for someone as I said. This comes from my biase of being a guy who uses haptics and enjoys hopping into The Haunted Apk or Resident Evil 4 or Cosmodread standalone (my preferred graphical version) or cod style zombie maps for arcade type of fun as much as I play anything else I play. With of course the enjoyment for graphically impressive story or experience games whether action or haptic orientated or not. So my use of vr is very much as an immersive arcade or virtual surreal world with features at the forefront, and creativity rather than graphics emphasized. I am someone who's first vr experience was beach head 2000 on a beach head 2002 360 vortex drop down helmet arcade machine with connected shooting sticks in a physical arcade running on quarters when they existed popularly. And I am someone who can enjoy vr being purposefully tailored to be physically demanding. So when I want something to be ultra realistic I'll just do what I want in real life, however long it takes me to get there or aquire or use a simulator. The focus vision is also great for a social experience which I hop into as well and I enjoy multiplayer online games regularly. But my emphasis is that I personally play vr to enter a world with a challenging environment both against other players and against high difficulty set opponents for the thrill of improving my virtual skills. I will play a game with a relaxing experience just sitting down in vr or on controller out of vr if I feel like enjoying something more relaxed than what I've described. That's my two cents, this headset is all I've wanted. The price works for me. I'm going to pre-order the headset :)"
Fresnel lenses? How antiquated.
So this is the Vive Pro 2, same lenses and resolution, with features that should have been there from the start (eye tracking) with a standalone part than only businesses will use
Should have been released in 2021 instead of late 2024
Fresnel lenses? No way!
I think they do this keep the price down. Most of the stuff seems to be almost identical to Focus 3.
WTF.... 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@zerocool6452??? it's more than twice the price of the quest 3.
@@zerocool6452 HTC do not care about keeping the price down. If they did care, it would not have eye tracking or the chip it has. Im sure ppl would rather have better lens and forgo the chip it has or eye tracking.
@@zerocool6452the thing is once I tried pancake lenses I can't going back . Even with automatic ipd adjustment... The difference between the 2 is too big... Comfort and clarity without the frustration to set everything perfectly are for me everything..
This is pretty much exactly what I was looking for. I will be using this as my daily driver for pcvr. I can definitely understand the incompatibility with users who get too distracted by a fresnel lense. But being a vr user who started with pc and standalone play sessions from the vive to the quest 2 I am someone who can focus on my own performance ignoring fog glare or lense distortion, this headset is the perfect match for me. I've wanted eye tracking and foveated rendering combined with full body tracking support in a headset that can be used with swappable batteries for a standalone experience if needed on a case to case basis. As for the controllers and the chipset.. Also perfect for me! A lightweight feathery lightsaber of a controller is completely immersion breaking for me. I play Battle Talent and battle royal shooters or shooters in general. I add weights to the controllers and handstraps myself for added weight and physical enjoyment. So I likely will not be using hand tracking unless in a social experience or I'm watching media or playing something on mixed reality like maybe a board game on rare occasions. As for graphics, I've come to the found opinion that better graphics are usually fluff that detract from an immersive experience of being in a surreal virtual environment. I love seeing a high visual fidelity and pixel dense experience on some pancake lenses as much as anyone else. But to me that is the gimmicky problem of vr the same way that modern aggressively competitive uncanny graphics improvements detract rather than improve on artistic originality and immersing myself in a virtual world. Unless of course the lenses are a problem for someone as I said. This comes from my biase of being a guy who uses haptics and enjoys hopping into The Haunted Apk or Resident Evil 4 or Cosmodread standalone (my preferred graphical version) or cod style zombie maps for arcade type of fun as much as I play anything else I play. With of course the enjoyment for graphically impressive story or experience games whether action or haptic orientated or not. So my use of vr is very much as an immersive arcade or virtual surreal world with features at the forefront, and creativity rather than graphics emphasized. I am someone who's first vr experience was beach head 2000 on a beach head 2002 360 vortex drop down helmet arcade machine with connected shooting sticks in a physical arcade running on quarters when they existed popularly. And I am someone who can enjoy vr being purposefully tailored to be physically demanding. So when I want something to be ultra realistic I'll just do what I want in real life, however long it takes me to get there or aquire or use a simulator. The focus vision is also great for a social experience which I hop into as well and I enjoy multiplayer online games regularly. But my emphasis is that I personally play vr to enter a world with a challenging environment both against other players and against high difficulty set opponents for the thrill of improving my virtual skills. I will play a game with a relaxing experience just sitting down in vr or on controller out of vr if I feel like enjoying something more relaxed than what I've described. That's my two cents, this headset is all I've wanted. The price works for me. I'm going to pre-order the headset :)
I’ve pre ordered mine as well looking forward to getting it
You lost me on the lens.
That is indeed a pitty: Why did they not ad pancake lenes and Micro OLED...
@@Anakin-dl6eb That would make the headset even more expensive espacially if it had MicroOLED.
@@zerocool6452
But anyway more interesting for VR enthusiasts....
1000 for Fresnel lenses. FAIL
@@Anakin-dl6eb Thats true but we already have plenty of those kinds of headsets. Many of them aren't out just yet but soon enough (Pimax and Somnium) We need more midrage priced headsets.
A very compelling option for anyone who benefits from eye-tracking. Fresnel lenses really aren't as bad as people make them out to be, unless you simply can't be bothered to adjust a headset into position. There are drawbacks to pancake optical stacks such as significant light loss and limited field of view, and aspherics are prone to geometric distortion. No current optical stack is perfect, but I wish people wouldn't write off every fresnel headset as unusable junk without even giving it a shot
While I do find Fresnel lenses to be a significant step back w.r.t. the pancake lenses of a Quest 3; I do agree that an important part of that stems from "misaligned Fresnel lenses = sadness", which the Quest 2 (and Quest 3S) cause, with their 3 hard-coded IPD knobs, which have meant only a very small part of the population could properly enjoy those headsets. Here, however, we have eye-tracked automatic IPD adjustment, and that will probably lessen the issues of these lenses quite significantly, to the point it will probably just be a slightly more front-heavy headset with smaller edge-to-edge clarity, but a smaller price-point (in theory; hard to see at $1200), and a more power-efficient headset (nice for standalone).
Pimax crystal is using fresnel lenses right?
@@markus301 No, Crystal uses a glass aspheric stack. They look very sharp and clear, but they suffer from a "geometric sweet spot" that causes some barrel distortion if you aren't positioned perfectly.
These fresnel lenses are as bad. They are the same lenses that Vive Pro 2 and Focus 3 have. They are garbage. There are not many people able to use Pro 2 due to that. Even most hardcore HTC fans were trashing all over the headset due to lenses (among other reasons but lenses were no 1 issue).
@@chadef555 yeah, I tried the Pro 2 when it first launched and I remember not being super impressed with it, vertical FoV cut off making an awkwardly letterbox image. I mostly defend fresnel because PSVR2 on PC is my favorite headset at the moment
Omg. The only real dealbreaker with the focus and the pro 2 was the lenses - and they still don't fix it. Unbelievable.
Yep, I bought the focus 3 a while ago and returned it after a couple weeks because the lenses were so bad. I even preferred the quest 2 at the time.
And of course no mention on the official webpage about the type of lenses, or I couldn't find at least....
Personally I'm willing to give that a pass since no other headset has DP but also eyetracking (except for a some other few headset but those are generally much more expensive) and I would believe a face tracking module will arrive. Can't have everything I guess.
@@zerocool6452 What about Pimax Crystal?
@@zerocool6452 What about the Pimax Crystal?
It's unbelievable the effort HTC puts into releasing obsolete products at a high price.
You think it's obsolete.... Surely you jest.
It may not be the headset for me, but I'm sure glad there are more options out there. Shows VR market is still strong.
I really hate this type of lens stack, they should just use pancake
We need more headsets that use foveated rendering and eyetracking. Especially for the stand alone headsets that could benefit from the GPU increase it would bring.
Yea, that is a great feature till you realize you are looking through a Fresnel lens.
This is literally a worse and pricier Quest Pro, 2 years later, with a displayport.
if they had pancakes it would still be a passable option but htc gotta htc
I wanted to upgrade my Quest Pro and that thing is NOT IT. Damn, HTC always disappoints... I'll wait 1-2 more years before upgrading.
@@Blattie 2026 will probably be the next year that a major game changing headset comes out, but I'm basing that entirely on the Quest 4 timing. I think most big players will release around the same time as that's how it usually goes.
I have owned many vr headsets, and the Quest Pro is my favorite thus far for pcvr using virtual desktop rtx 4080 i9 13th gen GODLIKE settings pancake lens Quantum dot local dimming pretty large glass lens ect... I currently have the Q3 while its great the lenes are smaller and the quality of the LCDs are not as good and the Pro version as far as contrast and colors!
I would have def purchased this headset if it had pancake lens! I like that you can connect the headset to PC via display port for maximum uncompressed fidelity with those 5K displays could have been somthing amazing but the OLD Fresnel lens kill it! I've owed the Vive Pro 2 and it sucks compared to the Quest Pro even though it had way higher resolution those old lens makes everything look rough plus that headset was heavy as shit lol!
@@CarlosHernandez-rq5rx Can we also have 165hz headset with low latency/response time. I want to play PC games with a virtual ultrawide display and it feels like NOW is the time.
I do it now on the Quest pro with Moonlight and Reverse Thetering (weird thing that allows you to use your usb-c cable as an ethernet cable) but there's still noticeable lag and the games don't run as smooth as on my monitor.
If I went back 3 years in time and watched this release, I would say 'hell yeah'! Nowadays, 'what the hell?'.
I think it looks great. ill preorder. it's going to replace my pico 4 and reverb g2. that's what I was looking for, thought valve would do it first. cheers to HTC for looking out for pcvr!
They could have gone QLED with aspheric lenses but they want over 1000 for this old thing. They always disappoint.
Fresnel lenses don't have to be that bad. I almost prefer my Reverb G2 visuals over my Quest Pro, except for the edge-to-edge clarity. With 120° FOV, I think these could outperform my Quest Pro lenses if they have big enough of a sweet spot.
We'll just have to wait for the reviews.
Dunno why people hate on this. Price may be high, but compared to my bsb amd pcl....i still find myself usinf the quest 3 the most and even my index more....
Pcl was a disappointment along with bsb....may give this a try as all i want is a index with better resolution or quest 3 but display port.
Ill give this a try
Which VR headsets are recommended nowadays? I already have a useless Hololens 2 at work and thought of buying an "old" HTC VIVE PRO 2. I had the first HTC vive at my last job and it worked fine. Now the Vision shows up and it seems like a good combination... But with wo many negative comments I'm not sure anymore... What do people actually recommend?
This is what drives me crazy about HTC. They never fail to release a product that looks really good in most areas, but they always have to include one crippling stupid design decision that basically kills it before it gets started. This would be very interesting except for one thing, Fresnel lenses. I could get the Pimax Crystal Light for a lot less with even higher resolution and far better visuals with pancake lenses. Add this to the steaming pile of HTC products that I looked at and said "Nope, would never consider because of this, or would never consider because of that.
Anxious for Sebastian's assessment. High resolution panels, Display Port and eye-tracking are big pluses for flight simmers so hopefully we'll see how it performs in DCS with eye-tracking enabled. Seems a little pricey but won't rule it out yet. Want to know about the FOV, weight and comfort of the headset too. Would've hoped for QLED or OLED displays, and pancake lenses to allow a more compact design, but willing to wait and see. Will it be a solid upgrade option from the Quest 3? How will it perform against the Pimax Crystal Light with local dimming at $899?
Thanks for your video mate. I've preordered one from my local Vive Australia store (au$1899, which includes the wired streaming cable and DP adapter). I'm looking forward to seeing how it compares to my current favorite flight sim headset = Meta QPro/i913900k/rtx4090 with the official link cable connected to my z790mb usb3.2 gen2 type-c port at 650mbps encoding bitrate. Of course I would have preferred it came with pancake lens and Qled screens rather than fresnel. Hopefully, together with auto-IPD, DisplayPort, and the higher res 2449x2448 lcd screens, it will look and perform well. Time will tell I guess. Thanks again mate and best cheers from Australia.
Sebastian, are there any displayport vr headsets which support an IPD of 55mm? Cheers.
In terms of visual quality and having a bigger sweet spot, what would you recommend as a standalone headset that is better than reverb g2?
Pimax Crystal Light?
@@andrei-un3yr yes Crystal Light for sure
Old lenses + old chipset = 1200 eur? What the hell are they smoking at HTC? The guy who is responsible for this should be fired imo... this product is basicly DOA.
💯
Shame on you HTC
@@barakoas why people always hype about htc product? Only original Vive was ok helped by Valve basestation technology
Why did you copy an paste this exact comment on both this and VoodooDE's channel?
@@antjones2281 And VR flight sim guys channel lol.
My god... I had to double-check whether this is something new, or from 2022. Fresnel lenses 🤯. But I will watch the full review anyway.
Okay the hole lens thing isn't as bad as people make it out to he ive came from quest 2 up to quest 3 and they both work amazingly
Very well summarised. Fresnel = Ko for me.
No local dimming lcd or micro oled will not convince me to buy. Fresnel lense again!!!!????😢 ill go for upcoming Valve Deckard instead
Upcoming when?
@@richardnoall3758 nobody know but possible next year because they stop restock Index headset once all the inventory clear up
I have never returned a headset so fast before. I bought it with high hopes, but it failed completely. I am looking forward to your review, because there are a lot of negatives that you will have to cover. So far, people are generally reviewing it very negatively on Reddit and Amazon. Especially troublesome was the issue with eye and face tracking not working properly, since it was advertised so strongly as a primary feature.
Eye tracking did not work? What was the issue?
@@mixedrealityTV Despite calibrating and having used a Vive Pro Eye for years (works great), eye tracking in the Focus Vision has issues where the eyes shake and blink constantly. Also, the automatic IPD triggers every 15-30 minutes and crams itself into my nose causing a bit of pain.
Frensel at the end of 2024? Rip
Seriously a bigger let down than the Somnium VR costing 4000€ instead of expected 2300
Someone out there, please just make a PCVR head that has:- pancake lenses, manual IPD, light and cool to wear when playing, .....with .....Some style of G sync hardware in the headset to help your PC rig when playing! I personally think that would be a massive selling point, this headset helps your PC when playing...?
@@calcariachimera Bigscreen Beyond hired optic technician few months ago. Glare and sweetspot problem will be obsolete on next version. So far my Beyond FOV and resolution and brightness is just perfect!
Another DOA from HTC. Besides the higher screen resolution and DisplayPort, I don't see a good reason to buy this over a Quest Pro which is better in every other way and also has face tracking, can't forget that. I'm guessing you still have to buy that Squidward-nose face-tracking add-on judging by that panel just above the nose area. I got excited hearing it has eye tracking but that is immediately negated when paired with Fresnel lenses because you cannot look around much due to the small sweet spot.
Finally, HTC is planning to release a good headset with an excellent field of view and great resolution comparable to the Apple Vision Pro with display port which is really exciting news , welcome back HTC 👍😍
We appreciate your support 💙
@@Behindthescene-z6b but it comes with lcd panel and fresnel lense really ruined it
I don't know much about the Focus, and am a bit nervous from the description that it may not keep up with newer gen tech, but eagerly await more in depth info. The Vive works with Linux due to working through SteamVR alone, correct? Will this one also?
No, it requires streaming software. for Linux you need to use a streamer called ALVR, which I don't think supports ultimate trackers or eye/face tracking yet. VR on Linux is still a struggle and very buggy in general.
@@cheapcrackers4772 Thanks! Bummer. From what research I'd been able to do, it sounded like any headset using Steam VR alone works natively, which seemed to include the Index, Bigscreen Beyond and original Vive. So was hoping that meant this one would as well. Back to waiting for an Index 2?
Could have been my next headset, but the Fresnel lenses buried that chance..
It seems to be an HTC Vive version of the original Pimax Crystal (edit, but minus anything Crystal...) - please compare specs, quality, ergonomics and prices, as well as ease of integration with body-trackers. Kthx. 😁
I’m sorry, but for the first time I feel that this video was more of an ad sponsored video than actually presenting useful information about how this over-priced unit will actually perform…. I remember all of the hype from the Vive Cosmos, which was the first and only headset I wound up ever returning…. because of all of the hype.
@@MannyVel Hi Manny, how could I talk about how this thing performs when they literally have just announced it in the moment this video goes live? I only got the press release and a few pics. Don't you think your comment is a bit entitled and actually completely inappropriate? This is not a review!
@@mixedrealityTV Sorry guy. This does not need to a review. For this we'll patiently wait. He just meant that as far as your knowledge about this thing goes (like you said, this is a brand new thing), you're somewhat seem somewhat overexcited over it. We get that you are very eager to actually try it out and then share the news - we appreciate this, but this really sounded like a promotional video a bit. I imagine it was not, but then perhaps it would be beneficial to review the style, to avoid such comments. Cheers.
@@Terrylovesjougurt Which part of the style do you mean? This is an announcement, not a review. How about giving the device a chance before we crucify it? For the one concern I have I am clearly letting you know about my thoughts about the lenses! And then in the end of the video I when the scripted part ends I even let you know that if course you get the standard mrtv treatment with review etc once I have it. So no, I cannot understand both of your comments and I think it's inappropriate.
@@mixedrealityTV :) No one is crucifying it. I for one don't have an opinion at all. And I won't have one until I try it for myself, if this even happens. I don't think no one is suggesting that it is a paid promotion either. I'm just explaining to you why Manny wrote what he wrote. Take this in good faith. He even said that this is the first time that he felt like this, so this just seems like a fluke. We both will be waiting for an actual and accurate review, as always. Cheers.
It's reasonable for content creators talking about VR headsets to evaluate the technology used, considering the many other headsets out there that are making advances in quality. Many times VR headset content creators talk about a new headset with a big smile, not even highlighting the clear disappointments that most everyone else will mention.
Their specs page does not provide information about the lenses type or how heavy the headset is.. Almost like they dont want to give that info because they know it will hurt pre-orders.
How is it possible that an official specs webpage does not include those 2 infos for a VR headset?
Sus....
I am glad to see a new VR headset from HTC that is more appealing to me to finally upgrade my WMR, but I would also like to see that they do not intentionally hide information about their new headset. It does not inspire trust in the brand when i notice those shady tactics.
Am also curious and actually waiting on what Valve will launch (hopefully soon... perhaps this HTC launch is them wanting to do so just before Valve makes their own announcement).
I started out with the rift-s so having gone to a Quest 2 and then Quest 3 I can see the appeal. Unfortunately even as a PC VR gamer I don't find this appealing at that price. The Quest 3 has a big sweet spot so adjustment of the ipd manually is a hassle. Eye tracking isn't something I'm particularly fussed about either. At first glance it seems overpriced, over gimmicky,underspec. Give me a Quest 3 equivalent with displayport and bring the price down by a few hundred then yes.
I have owned many vr headsets, and the Quest Pro is my favorite thus far for pcvr using virtual desktop rtx 4080 i9 13th gen GODLIKE settings pancake lens Quantum dot local dimming pretty large glass lens ect... I currently have the Q3 while its great the lenes are smaller and the quality of the LCDs are not as good and the Pro version as far as contrast and colors!
I would have def purchased this headset if it had pancake lens! I like that you can connect the headset to PC via display port for maximum uncompressed fidelity with those 5K displays could have been somthing amazing but the OLD Fresnel lens kill it! I've owed the Vive Pro 2 and it sucks compared to the Quest Pro even though it had way higher resolution those old lens makes everything look rough plus that headset was heavy as shit lol!
Man, why do these companies always have to get at least one obvious thing wrong. Add proper pancake lenses and the more powerful chip and sorted. What's the FOV though, because I really want to start seeing that greatly improved in all these headsets.
120 maybe...
Looking forward to your full review 👍
Oh well, hopefully we'll get some more info on Pimax Crystal Super soon ...
would be nice to have light house tracking as well
You didn't mention it has 120 fov. The psvr2 has 110 that's the best thing about the psvr2 for me. With that field of view I forget that the psvr2 even has fersnel lenses
Most likely the lied about the fov because there is no way it has bigger fov than Psvr2
@x32i77 maybe, it's what they claim on their website. But I don't understand why it can't possibly have a bigger fov than psvr2
@@ivyunknown6987 because Psvr2 has an eye relief
Does it have OLED panels?
No. LCD, and no local dimming either. Sigh.
On pre order now for au$1800 australian for short time.
I dunno why anyone would want to buy this to be honest. They're marketing it as 'next-gen', but there's only old tech in the device and it's being sold at a premium. For displayport wired PCVR, you can get better alternatives. For wireless PCVR, you can also get better alternatives that are much cheaper. The ancient gen 1 chip alone already makes the device redundant on release and that's far from the only issue. It's essentially a Quest 2 with a displayport, higher resolution and a few more features.
Nearly 2025 already, so this headset definitely needs micro OLED displays as nothing else comes close in quality. And there should be an option to pay extra and have it come with VR hand gloves that support precise finger tracking (visual hand tracking will never be precise enough) and have 8 button emulation by touching finger tips to thumbs and some forcefeedback ideally; clunky game controllers put people off VR, and as good as it sounds, even though I have an RTX4090 PC, I won't invest in any VR system without micro OLED and VR gloves.
micro OLED is trash, very bad colours and bad dynamic contrast. Also the small size of micro OLEDs makes it more challenging for lens design.
@madigorfkgoogle9349 you have that backwards - OLED has the best colours with the highest possible contrast. Organic Light-Emitting Diodes are individually lit, with unlit diodes completely black, so infinite contrast. LED is trash in comparison, and far less power efficient unless the entire display were constantly white light at its brightest settings, which NEVER happens with games. The Big Screen Beyond uses micro-OLED and is acknowledged as the best VR display for colours and contrast.
@@TimLongson no I dont, OLED do have terrible colour accuracy, vibrant colours yes, accurate and natural colours? You kidding.
Highest possible contrast? Again yes, but poor dynamic contrast. It is easy to have high contrast ratio, since it is a simple ratio between darkest and lightest light level level.
The problem is all in between, and here is OLED utter trash, sorry.
I worked in printing industry and I am a colour mangement specialist so I know what Im talking about. Even the cheapest LCD panels today easy reach lower then Delta E 2.0 easy, meanwhile I really have to get to measure OLED display that can reach Delta E 2.0, some claim it, never measured one to achieve it. Meanwhile top LCD panels can do around Delta E 1.0 or even less.
You can see Delta E higher then 2.0 with naked eye easy mostly in natural colours like skin tones, blue sky, green foliage. Also close to full intensity RGB colours are very hard for OLED to master, so you cant distinct between two different red cars for example. While OLED can make the traffic light red very good, it is hard to make a Ferrari red for OLED, it will be either to yellow or too traffic light red, if you understand what I mean.
Also OLED has problems with edge luminosity levels in general, so yes OLED can do full black (that is useless since human eye cant see in pitch black so you cant see black in reality) but cannot display few steps of lighter black. Also in the middle of the curve there is a lot of noise and bad levels linearity, same effect as in dark tones we can observe in highlight tones where the clipping is even more observable. I prefer the slightly lighter dark black with a lot of gradation in shadows for some information to absolute black with clipping out the information in shadows. The stepping of tonality curve of luma and its linearity is the dynamic contrast, and here the OLED has to walk a long way yet.
So yes OLED has vibrant "candy" colours that are popping, but you dont have such colours in nature, and natural colours are hard nut to crack for OLED yet.
Excited then heard what type of lenses and then not so much
Does anyone know if 2.0 base stations and 3.0 trackers are compatible with the headset? i bought fbt ages ago and i wanna buy this headset but it would seem like a waste if i cant use the trackers i already have
This headset does not work with base stations.
The headset uses its own inside out tracking. However there’s no reason why you wouldn’t be able to use your trackers. They all still show up in SteamVR.
I honestly don’t care if a headset has LCD panels but they should have at least tried to do pancake lenses. The visuals in pancake lenses are just much better than freshnel lenses
I agree with you. But this is not a new headset but more of a refresh. And probably since they have automatic IPD adjustment, you wont have such a hard time finding the sweetspot! We will know soon! Thanks for commenting!
@@mixedrealityTV This might be a good replacement for the reverb g2 if it stays on when plugged into the DisplayPort and does everything it’s supposed to. I mean you get eye tracking, wireless, and wired capabilities in one headset for $1000 and it seems like a great deal.
Hopefully you’ll test it out soon
We need a Review NOW
@@paulbellino5330 you are gonna get one!
There is a big catch with the displayport as I read the HTC notes carefully, it requires a $149 costing adapter (which you get for free if you pre-order it)..... So HTC is not telling the truth out right..
I started with the Original Vive in 2016. Would have loved to have gone Vive Pro but HTC's pricing was CRAZY! Still is! Their current offering is too similar to Quest and Pico but Double Price?!? No Huge Features to justify it?!? NOPE!!! I eventually ungraded to the Valve Index. Really wanted a native Steam VR headset WITHOUT any middleman software requirement! Too Pricey but the headset is Ok. Controllers function Ok. However, I have had one Thumbstick wear out and two Grip panels snap off from normal use. The video cable may also be failing? I am not hard on my tech. I consider this to be outrageous for a $1000 product. I still don't think there is any Perfect HMD for the everyman. Each and every one has some BIG negative! It's such a shame! Me sad 😞
HTC are stuck in a time machine. Wonder when they will get out. Pricing is disrespectful to the consumers. No PC cable for PCVR headset and still using fresnel lenses with the audacity to price at $999... They better not wonder why it doesn't sell lol
Leadership seems to operate with consistency
@@OzzySafa after huge mistake from vive XR headset, they still don't get it
Thank you
Fresnel lenses, man didn't realize HTC is living in 2016
Everyone’s complaining about the Fresnel lenses which pancake lenses would have been better. But because of the 5K display, eye tracking for foveated rendering and the display port to eliminate compression it will still have a much better image than the Quest 3 on PCVR. Pancake lenses aren’t making up for all that, there good but not that good. But had they added them that would have been the icing on the cake.
Why would you get this over a crystal light? Especially if your focus is PCVR
AND the Vive Focus 3 had the Worst fresnel lenses ive used. I returned it and continued using quest 2 for a while. So if its the same ones, Man HTC is just being HTC, and F'ing up something that should have been great. They always do this!
this better have a better everything after all that time
I want bigger Lens like sony Vr2
Fresnel lenses and the same SoC from the Quest 2?! FOR $1000?! 😂😂😂😂😂😂
- Shodah
First PS5 pro and now this 😂😂
I actually like the fresnel lenses vs the lenses I have in the pcl which gives me eye strain and can't get a clear Pic
ur lens must suck then. the lens in the Q3 is good and stomps any and all fresnel lens.
@@stuart3712 I guess my valve index sux then
@@volman13n0the valve index has fresnel lenses…
Dont understand why Vive not given up. They had the market them self almost but messed it up and keep doing that.
Resolution isint much difference from quest 3 lets get that straight😅
Is eye tracking, for foveated rendering, pointless with a frenel lens and a small sweet spot?
You don't want to look at the blurriness of a frenel lens away from the centre, so you only need foveated rendering in the centre, so you don't need eye tracking.
Or am I missing something?
Our choices now seem to be:
This for display port and sharper visuals in the centre of the lens.
Q3 for streamed artifacts, lower resolution but consistent across the lens.
Or much better visuals via display port if you want to trust that Pimax have finally got their act together.
All so close with just 1 small change each. A display port on a quest. Pancake lens on the HTC. Sticking to their promises at Pimax.
🤷
pretty concerning that you didnt get a pre release to test but htc gave one to someone not answering any questions and having a fluffy 6 minute video..
This is definitely getting a bit too much hate for what it is. We've got same price point as quest pro. Displays are not pancake, but they are higher resolution. Fov is supposedly larger by around 15 degrees. Has eye tracking. Loses a point because face tracking add on is an extra 100. Loses a point on controllers, as they can't compete with either quest pro controllers or index. Hand tracking, assuming it works well is fantastic.
You should definitely wait for a proper review, but it's got real potential with a caveat. The connection cable only being free for preorder will hurt their sales past their first wave.
You would have to be crazy to preorder a headset at this point.
@@CorporateZombi hehe, not necessarily, though I understand the sentiment. I'm sure it's irritating for the company, but hey, return policy is valid. You've essentially got a 2 week free trial. Don't be afraid to be inconvenient for your consumer benefit. I am guilty of doing that with a few bluetooth speakers back when I was Christmas shopping for my parents.
oh my god when will these companies stop ruining their headsets by compromising on things you cant compromise on.
Compromise on your straps, your plastic, your speakers, remove automated IPD, etc. Force users into after market solutions for those instead of compromising on things required to reach minimum viability.
It's WIRELESS!!!!!! I won't buy any headset, no matter the resolution, if it does not have Wireless connectivity. This headset is somewhat exciting. Concerned about the lenses though.
Why would you use this over any other dedicated PCVR headset at this price range?
It doesn't offer anything compelling in standalone as it's a Quest 2 on HTC's ecosystem lol.
Eye tracking.
To get eye tracking + display port you'd have to pay more for a Pimax Crystal or Somnium VR1.
That said, it is is mostly the same as the Focus 3, it won't be possible to charge it while you use it - let alone mains power it - so it'll be a terrible PCVR HMD.
There is no issue with the sweet spot, it's to do with your face. how you wear the headset. I have this headset and there's nothing wrong with that.
After the Somnium turning out to be astronomical 4k€ instead of 2k€-2.5k€ I am looking for any kind of sane new nex-gen headset, again Focus Vision is not it.
We are stuck in perpetual VR 1.5 land since years and 4000€ is not even enthusiast pricing anymore.
Valve is the only hope then (I hope to live to see that day).
They could have upgraded the lenses and the processor to the XR2+. So the lenses aren't as good as they could be, and no AV1 encoding for streaming... two pretty large downsides imo.
fresnel lenses....they were so close! why is this always the case with VR headsets...
I'm done with VR.
I have tried it time and again but no matter the HMD there is always something lacking despite the high cost of HMD's, be it Resolution, FOV, automatic IPD, eye tracking, good lenses, colours/brightness, design, comfort or something else.
I keep saying give it a few more years and I keep getting disappointed.
If chip tech advanced this slowly we would all still be plying Pentium based systems!
when i heard "stand alone headset" i paused the video . yeah ive heard enough, wake me up when valve index 2 non stand alone version is out
So it's a shitty version of the Quest Pro in 2024 with an XR2 Gen1. What the fuck are they thinking?
Weight? One of the most important factors. Looks heavy.
so , old chip, no oled , no pancake(which typically a premi feature) ,90 htz( stand alone) , and promised features in update - but still 999 pre order and 1149 after ... smh what is going on with these companies. rather pass 500 for a ok experience rather a 1000 for a slightly better one. --- that older chip really get me.
Why the fck they use snapdragon xr2 gen 1 instead of gen2?????
Probably been in development for god knows how long.
Because Christmas is coming and a lot of folks who don't know VR might snap one up?
Why why no pancake lenses here? It is a deal breaker.
Was expecting disappointment... and still disappointed. I really, really want to move on from my Quest Pro, but $1k isn't chump change. I get one headset for the next several years, and this may be an upgrade in a few regards, but a downgrade in many others. Vive, will just release a truly innovative product for a change?
I was initially excited about this......until I saw the Fresnel lenses. WTH???? I'm NEVER going back to crappy Fresnel lenses. Bad move IMO,!
dead on arrival
Once again HTC have missed the point which quest and pico understand what we want. I will keep rocking my OG Vive with the wireless adaptor. No need to buy this thing, no base station tracking, xr2 gen2 or higher and pancake lenses, no sale.
Overall i will not sell my quest 3 soon :D
With pancake lenses and Micro OLED this would have been a great headset even for 1500 Euro / Dollars. Why didn't they go for it??? Is there really no one on in their company who knows what people really want ??? When will they finally learn their lesson???
@@Anakin-dl6eb Bigscreen Beyond hired optic technician few months ago. I think they gonna fix glare and sweet spot for next Beyond headset. My Beyond FOV,resolution and brightness are PERFECT!
@@ji3200
That would be great!
Sadly it is not a VR headset that you can use to lay down on your bed like Quest 3.🙃
do they know about pimax light...
Fresnel ? No micro oled ? No buy
Fresnel and LCD - NOPE.. Shame cos my min FOV of 120 was hit..
Fresnel lenses.......why?
Lenses and Audio solution makes it a no go for me.
LCD so not interested.
What a shame. Could have been a winner!
Fov Seb?
Their web site clams is 120º. Not bad
@@jmlibre4468 Thank you
HTC have great spec writers..but in reality HTC never seem to deliver...When the Vive Pro2 was announced I thought this could be everything you need in a headset ...we know how that turned out . Lets wait and see though ...but fresnel lens aint a good start
Fresnel Lenses? Why do they continue to try to lose money and not sell headsets? I might have had some interest in this if they had put any lenses in there but those. Complete deal breaker. Sad.
Another out of date DOA Htc headset, How the hell is this company still in business, Good lord......
Is it better than the Quest 3? If not, I'm not interested! The form factor is quite disappointing; I expected we would have moved past the 'toaster strapped to your face' design by now. Fresnel lenses feel outdated, like something from five years ago. Those controllers look even worse than the Oculus Quest 1 from 2019! It's 2024!