HONDA CIVIC HYBRID !!COMEBACK!! STALLS/NO COMM PART 2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 พ.ค. 2020
- In today's video we continue with the 2007 Honda Civic Hybrid that intermittently stalls and has no communication with the TCM. In the first video we decided to replace the ECM because we found oil or liquid inside of the connector at the ECM. In part 2 I will show you how to program a used ECM for a Honda or Acura using a very affordable scan tool. We also take a look inside of the original computer to find what went wrong.
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Due to factors beyond the control of Advanced Level Auto, I cannot guarantee against improper use or unauthorized modifications of this information. Advanced Level Auto assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. Use this information at your own risk. Advanced Level Auto recommends safe practices when working on vehicles and or with tools seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of Advanced Level Auto, no information contained in this video shall create any expressed or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage, or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or from the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not Advanced Level Auto. - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
I was a mechanic from 1964 to 1987 I always thought I was decent and never gave up on a problem or problems, but I never came close to your abilities, I don't know where you received your education or maybe you are just a natural with an outstanding mind? What a pleasure to watch you in action, not many around like yourself, Thanks for your great videos...
You fixed it. Having had this problem myself, I could've told you the problem was the PCM from the second video. I could've also told you that heat doesn't touch their gasket-you have to pry it open, which breaks the seal. Basically, the ECU portion of the PCM runs on the ignition power lead, while all the rest of the PCM runs on the standby 12v line (the one that remains powered for some 30 minutes after turning the car off), switched on or off by a set of power transistors. Somewhere, a temperature sensitive fault happens where those transistors either fail, have a broken solder joint, or receive intermittent signal, causing the entire PCM to intermittently shut down except for the ECU portion. So the engine can keep running, but everything else in the PCM randomly shuts off as if you turned the ignition off, thus losing CVT control, all bus communication, and all feedback to the engine and IMA. I believe that without electronic control of its three solenoids, the CVT torques its internal belt to maximum tension and about mid-range ratio, while internally pulsing the clutch based on road speed and engine speed. Normally, the electronics have the clutch locked once you're over about 7 mph. I was doing 70mph when mine was cutting out, and I kept driving (now at 3500-5000 RPM!) and ended up smoking the CVT (high engine RPM with high belt tension). Miraculously, when I came back to the car the next day, the CVT was working again, and I was able to limp home, a few minutes at a time until it the day cooled off, and then I did hundreds of miles without any further issues. The problem literally flared up out of nowhere on an extremely reliable car (400k miles) as I drove from a cooler climate to a warmer climate. I promptly replaced the PCM and have had no issues since. I would strongly recommend that the customer NOT sell this car.
Also, thank you for sharing the ThinkDiag tool. What all can it do for the Honda Civic Hybrid? I would really like to reprogram or modify the PCM's behavior regarding how it controls the CVT. I saw a lot of options on there briefly in the video and am just wondering what it can do.
Man. That was a cool case study! Like you said, the TCM and PCM are in the same unit, so if they cannot communicate with each other, there's not a lot of things that can really be wrong.
Thank you so much Eric. I had exactly the same symptoms happening with a low mileage Civic Hybrid - after running for about 20mins it would stall in gear or would not shift out of Park. I noticed that just prior to the issue happening each time, the indicator for Drive would intermittently flash (even if in another gear position), then after a few more minutes the gear position indicator would completely switch off and all the warning lights would come on. P16D6 and U0100 were the most consistent codes coming up, and interestingly the ECM sockets and plugs were clean and dry. Honda Australia quoted me $2,410 (approx. US$1,750) to fix the problem (and a potential 3 month wait for the part to arrive from Japan), but after purchasing a used ECM and a ThinkDiag tool (which both arrived in a few days), the car is now running perfectly. Thanks again!
Oil is not a current conductor and does not corrode, so you don't have to worry. I had a case where antifreeze got in there and rusted a few pins, I put silicone grease in the connector to prevent shorting. Very good video!
Good job Eric....As a professional electronics technician, I would not worry about oil film in the connector. Instead welcome it as a corrosion prevention for the pins. I encourage you to spray Deoxit in every connection and finish it with Dyelectric grease. Water Moisture in connections is your greatest enemy.
I used to think that .but the amount of times(been in this trade for 20+ years) i have seen transmissions playing up due to oil come up through the connector is crazy
@@xenith0351Yes I agree, i would not use lubricating oils on connections. Some will react badly over time including the weather proof seals. Only use Deoxit, Dielectric grease, or other specifically designed connectors cleaner.
Eric is the man. Just can't get enough of these videos. Can't wait until the next one!
Awesome, thanks for the closure. I think a lot of people have been eagerly anticipating this video. I really liked the music you played during the test drive/ taking apart the ecm btw. Great diag as usual. Looking forward to more videos!
I bought this based off your video and love it. They have made it even better since. I did get the two down loads and purchased more. Please do more videos using this thank you.
Thanks for sharing the case study. BTW, oil leak on top of tranny is actually from camshaft thrust cover retainer, top right side of the engine. Yes, it is quite tricky. Cheers Eric.
dude that scan tool is awesome ! i have the same car,, and i concluded the same repair, was the ECU... but difference i had to take my car to the dealer to input the vin and program my immobilzer.... did my fix and car is running 230K now.. keep up your energy and passion
Keep on keeping on. You are a hard worker. Capillary action doesn't require pressure. It's the same thing that causes a wick to get entirely wet if one end is placed in a liquid. Liquid just wants to crawl along and wet a surface.
Would like to add that wire insulation and connector weather seals usually work both ways - they won't let moisture in and also should not let anything come out. Unless inside pressure and flow rate is so high that things start to have visible effects on outside.
Good video Eric. I retired from the business after 40 years with 30 plus years working on Hondas. In early 2012, I gave a demonstration to a group of new Honda customers showing them items from their cars. During the demonstration, I had the Honda laptop computer hooked up to a vehicle and used an old TV ad phrase "This isn't your father's Oldsmobile" and showed them what the mechanics have to go through to diagnose the newer cars. I enjoyed having problem "Childs", but as you found out, they don't pay well considering the amount of time invested. I am so glad that I am out of the business and feel sorry for the upcoming mechanics. You have to be very intelligent with a good sense of logic and a lot of patience like you. I will keep watching your videos because I enjoy them very much.
Thank you Eric. Good job again. Have a blessed and safe week to you and your family.
More videos about the ThinkDiag tool.... You just taught me something valuable...!!! Thank You...!!!
Just want to say mate, keep pushing and doing what you do.
Hope things are looking up after closing your shop.
Awesome fix, just like you I some times spend too much time before calling a component bad especially a PCM but I do get to re-fix a lot of other guys work who replaced parts that weren't causing the problem so that's my excuse for checking and rechecking. Now if I just had a dollar for every bad sensor connector or fuel pump plug or PCM connector that I repaired after someone replaced the component that wasn't bad, oh wait I do get paid well to do just that LOL Keep your head up and keep up the good, honest work.
I've seen much more oil in such connectors, without making any damage inside components. The only trouble with the oil is that it will slowly damage the insulation by inflating it and drying it out. Impressive how easy it is to program pcm on these hondas.
That step between scan tools capable of programming is huge, usually at least an extra thousand dollars, especially when you consider that the tool is outdated in a few years. For DIY guys who rarely need programming and who work on only a few vehicles, paying $40 per vehicle is a big improvement. I can see giving that option a try....
Dang man. I have a headache now but I stayed with you to the end. Glad you solved the problem if not the cause. I would have set fire to the vehicle in the first video. LOL
Man! This worked like a charm. Everything cool so far. Follwed the video to a T and the Thinkdiag is a little beast. So glad I didn't have to go the shop to program the key. These ecm's are junk from Honda. Picked up 2 from the junk yard yesterday just in case one of those is junk. 😪
Thanks for the hook up on that think diag. I ordered mine last time you mentioned it. I got $20 off with the amazon coupon plus the 10% off with your promo code. Paid $94 after tax and everything! Can’t wait till it gets here👍
Dude, you are the bomb! You know you your shit, and what you don't, you figure like a dog after a bone; you don't quit! Thank you for sharing your "magic." Charles Stewart; a mobile auto mechanic from Mesa, AZ ♥
Thanks for for your hard and thorough work man these videos helped me to fixed the same issue I was having with my car as well, thanks a million!
Nice job and thanks for sharing your knowledge. You're the man !
Great case study & fix👍
Honestly from the first 2 videos it seemed a very difficult task, but you fixed it😉
Keep up the good work, & more interesting case studies🕵️♂️
Thanks for sharing Bro👍
Stay safe❤
Giant like, thank you for sharing info about diagnostics tool. please do final video on Lexus LS460
Great job like always myfriend
Thank you!
Love your videos, keep strong man
06 hybrid 172k miles, dealing with this for the past year, started hot june last year, after hot driving, idling, summer car pickupline, the ima lights come on, and some fail safe mode kicked in, reduced power , as soon as you put into park car would refuse to shift anymore to drive, if you shifter lock override with screw driver insert, you would feel the abs brakes activate to prevent driving, manage to crawl over to curb, waiting for tow realized after about 30-40min rest, car started up and can drive back local. this happen half a dozen times, solution was always let it sit cool off, reset all the obd codes, drive, installed various airflow cooling fan for hybrid battery supplemental cooling, thought it was deteriorated ima battery, changed drove for moths fine during winter probably no issues b/c cooler monts, happen on a hot april day after lots of stop and go, $2k new ima over committed felt like $ flush down drain, then your video SAVED ME!!!!, I also followed your instruction meticulously to the T!, found a ebay ECU with the model serian matching as close to my original as possible same year hybrid, no key reprogramming using this video!!!, you deserved to be honored my friend, i've been advocating this channel since. i've driven all over long distance stop go, this summer will be the ultimate test , but car has not hiccups, next issue is to deal with possible cat deterioration
I ordered a thinkdiag from your last video . I have not gotten it yet... but please keep on making videos using it … So can have a better understanding on how to use some of the important functions ..Thanks
What is the model/version (e.g. X431, ..) of the THINKDIAG used in the video ?
Good video my friend. I was waiting for it.
You spent too much time on the oil residue Phenomenon for him not caring about it. But like me, It would drive me crazy not knowing where it came from... So Eric, a loose ground bolt and a $55.00 ECM/TCM module? Not bad. Unfortunately, it was kind of intermittent so it took a while to diagnose, but that's what makes you that guy. Sometimes it's better to be good (the best) than lucky.. Thanks for another great diag. I know this is 3 yrs old but I was in need of a decent Scan tool and already bought the XTool (2023), Could have saved some $ on the ThinkDiag. I'll see, should be here tomorrow and I might return it. I know I'll miss the 10% promotion (3 yrs later) but no big deal... Thanks again!
Thank you very much man, you did your best as always.
First a big like for your channel and your superior detailed diagnosis. Great work! Concerning the oil in the ecu connector, this can happen indeed. Fine stranded cables can actually work like a wick in a oil lamp. So it is capillary indeed, pressure is not needed. I guess that the oil leakage you noticed meets somewhere the end of a cable or a crack in the insulation and starts to creep its way to the other end of the cable.
Eric great job. I’m huge huge fan !!
Thank you!
KEEP IT UP WITH THE GREAT CONTENT
Glad you go it finished. 👍
man i really like your videos....great content....
Very determine , I really enjoy your videos since i have 2006 honda civic with charging issues. Hoping that changjng the battery will fix the problem.
Love this channel 👍👍👍👍👍
Hi. Same exact problem here in Ukraine. Having same Civic Hybrid but EU version.
Customer brought this car to us for CVT replacement (because of noise coming from inside). And while testing it after replacement those ECM problems started.
Thanks for your deep video report - now I know that we’re moving in right direction.
Привіт,я також з України,та сама проблема пропав зв'язок з PCM , шукаю донора,таке питання номер ебу має бути ідентичним з рідним
@@ArturKeshyshian У амеров та європейців різні номери. Якщо вибору нема, я б «підкинув» для перевірки що є, і подивився, чи виходить на звʼязок модуль PCM та CVT (почекати, щоб нагрівся)
Дякую
Hello Master Eric great diagnostic repair again have you ever considering become an instructor for a major company I'm sure you could teach them many things and put more professional techs in the field which is drastically needed , we love you brother God bless you and your family
Clearly the computer was the problem you set out top find. The oil in the connector is a separate issue.
Most technology failures are caused by expansion and contraction stresses due to temperature cycling. Interment electrical problems are almost always caused by this.
I'm glad you saw that there were not two physical circuit boards in that computer, just one computer doing two things. I'm glad you learned how difficult it can be to open a piece designed to keep part swapers out. I believe I would have made sure the 'new' computer worked at least as well as the old one before i took the old one apart.
The oil is coming up =INSIDE= one or more of the wires. In between the metal conductor and the plastic insulation. You will not see it in the harness unless you nick the insulation on the wire carrying it. To find where it's coming from you have to disconnect each connector on that harness. When you come to the problem it will be obvious. As you pointed out when you discussed the seal around the connector on the computer, it's hard for liquid to get in or out. Something like a crank sensor or cam sensor or transmission valve solenoid or sensor has had the seal behind the connector fail and the area between the harness connector and the device connector has filled up with oil. The seal is keeping it on the inside so it looks dry until you disconnect it.
Love your videos!
I bought one thur your link only because it had bi directional capabilities hope it meets my expectations
Good call ,Handy new tool as I said before, I have someone who might buy one .All the best Cheers from Tassie..
The owner tried to do some flip cash on this lemmon ... LOL. Good job Eric as usual. And nothing like driving alone for some time in a not busy road.
Fantastic! Thanks for the post!!
Thanks Eric to share good Educational video
I had this same issue on the same year civic hybrid. Took me a while to figure out due to it being an intermittent issue. Long story short it was a bad ground on the driver side of the cylinder head. If you remove the air box you can access the ground and harness easier.
Sounds like Honda decided to use dielectric grease only on the one terminal bank. Great series by the way. Yeah I believe the grease or oil was intentional by the manufacture.
Great job! Great job!
Good man, became a follower
Great information thanks for the videos and the tool is awesome
I love this thinkdiag
Good job! The oil definitely looked like CVT fluid. You should be able to take a sample of it and compare it to the other fluids. How it got into the gasket sealed connector is weird. It would have to come from the cable side and up through the pin gaps because there is no way to get past those red gaskets if they are not worn.
Thank you for your work
I like to say very good Info like your style, and great DG aloha from hawaii
You are smart 🤓 brother, thank you for sharing 🙏
Excellent once again=)...good shit
Great job 👍
Nice job bro, only thing i can think of is the installation grease there put during assembly, some pcm at capacitors and transistors has dielectric grease which is good for insulation but when it gets too hot it melts and run like oil, i think pcm shouldn't be in the engine bay, its just too hot
Solid Fix , Str888🆙 👊
Thanks for the video 👍
Love it🔥
If you look at the front tire, it is very close to your connection. Running down a wet road or even driving into a hole of water might be where the liquid is coming from.
Eric, you won't see any oil on the wire loom as it will travel withing the cable insulator. Remove and check connectors is the best way
Yep right on itsinside the insulation
Hey Erick, you da man!! That ECM is definitely not user serviceable. If there was no oil in the harness right behind the plug from the ECM, then the oil is not wicking up the wiring harness. Could be some sort of die electric grease installed at the factory.
Hey Dude, that ECM got
damaged
with that loose
connection
that you found
earlier, some components
got
stressed
and now, when it heats up, it
breaks
down
.
You got
that
problem
licked dude. Tell your customer they don’t have to sell the car if they don’t want to. Sometimes it’s good to multitask, you took the car for a test drive and you cleared your head at the same time. What ever it is, it’s going to be ok, your thought process is very logical and that applies not only to mechanics, but to every thing else in life. Stay strong as always man.
Ours had some light oil/grease in the upper white connector too.
I assumed it was there from the factory install - to help o-ring & rubber seals slide on with the plug-connector. It was clean looking oil.
Oil should not affect electronics. It's a good insulator. Some electronics are put in an oil bath... I wasn't worried about it.
that's most common in mercedes, the connector in the transmission is sealed and it basically destroy the computer module up to the hood.
Computers, aren't they lovely? I miss the old engines where a feller could work on them WITHOUT having a computer to diagnose a computer that runs another computer!
Just imagine what an EMP can do to a car with computers...
Great job
This channel considered to be the best content i have ever seen on TH-cam and all automotive channels should do the same
Thank you!
Another Good One
I realize this video was two months ago.
I made an observation. You were looking on the outside of the insulation. Wouldn't the oil be on the inside where the copper is? The insulation being the pipe?
Thanks for the video!
nice work
Given that both computers had oil in the top socket I believe this to be a factory corrosion protection. You could have exposed the wires as they entered the white plug to see that they were dry proving that oil had not got into the harness.
Kudos to you Eric, my question is what type of wiring diagram is that?
I like building gaming PC's and that "oil" that you see is normal on circuit boards, I've seen them on motherboards and graphics cards (GPU). A few months after I got my brand new GPU those "oil" stains appeared on the pcb, I'm no expert but for what I've found out is something related to humidity and the manufacturing (soldering) process, nothing to worry about and since is not causing problems there is no need to clean it.
By the way my GPU has already more than 1000 hours with "oil" on it and no problems.
fantastic!
Nice video and Good job, it was very interesting. Thank you ////////////////////
Did you try sniffing the connectors to determine if it was engine oil or brake fluid? (The brake fluid reservoir was above and to the side of the ECU),
Was his phone number flashed on the internet? 😂 Old hybrids are just not worth it. $1900?? Someone will buy it sadly. Good work!
Very good video. Was THINKDIAG X431 or what model used in the video?
SALUDOS DESDE PANAMA
Eric what camera are you using? I tried making videos off of phone but I am not able to get a good video off of it. Anyways thanks for teach/showing us what you do, learned a lot from your channel.
Eric, I have a C7 Corvette. Would you recommend using a Range AFM Disable device?
Great video!
How do you just buy another control unit. In Russia, it is necessary to repair at the level of components.
I have not seen such a destructive effect from oil.
Nice Video 👍👍
Should mention this Connectors Oil or Water issue are horrible.
Pls someone guide that this is possible with Water + Heat + Gun on Harness Tape = Oily stick thing which we show in Video?
If it's water, it's coming from the fender well where the splash apron is missing. Otherwise, it's probably some sort of electrical contact spray that someone used as a corrosion inhibitor or to improve contact with the pins. There's way oil or other fluids could make it's way to that connector. Those connectors are supposed to be waterproof.
One thing that can happen to these boards is Silver Migration, because the boards have to be ROHS compliant, meaning that they can't use lead solder...
So, instead of a tin/lead solder, they use a tin/silver (lead free) solder....
So, over time, the solder joints start to grow little silver hairs, which can extend to other solder solder joints, causing short circuits.
Using a board cleaner and a toothbrush should be able to get rid of it... (it may come back over time...)
Did this solve the problem for the figure? I’m currently experiencing the same problems on a 2006. Your video really really helped me thanks
Have you tried changing the pcm? I’m having the same issues as well. Was wondering if you got an update?
Whats the software you used to see the electric diagrams on your lap top?
you wont get this problem on a Ford.. just saying ! and if you haven’t already check out the previous video on the mustang ! Great stuff !
Seen this esact type of fault on a ford from oil cominb up a wire feom a power steering switch
I found oil on the ecu plug like that on a PT cruiser. Owner gave up on that POS quickly
@ 14:54 Where you cut the harness open, Do I see a cut wire with corrosion on it? I hope you check it out and see where it goes. I bought the thinkcar Bluetooth scan tool.
Good
With capillary effect some looms have a cotton or fine woven plastic starter line( you know the white shit in the middle you always have to cut back ) this will act like a candle wick for most liquids try putting a piece of thin cotton rope in a glass of water with dye in it and watch it suck up fluid a few inches it happens more often than you think but I was wondering if the residue might be gummy like it is resin from soldering on the board in behind the connector if it gets hot enough the residual flux from manufacturing can re melt and seep through connector pin holes as there is no seal from computer side, just a thought!!!
Did you remove the fender liner or was it gone when the car showed up? That'll cause a lot of water infiltration issues....