It is great to have a representative from the manufacturer that actually knows ALL about the product and not just spitting out quotes from sales literature. This guy has true product and industry wide knowledge AND is obviously comfortable with the build/assembly process - great demonstration ! The diff is pretty sweet as well !
@@JimBrodie They also offer a lifetime warranty? I’ve used Wavetrac in all of my builds, I mainly like the natural feel of the diff and the fact that it does not interfere with any electronic driving aids. I’ll need to look into ATB design, I think I recall them having Yellow font and a blue box? Cheers.
@@7eamGhast I didn't mean a specific company, i meant as in this style of diff. ATB being an acronym for automatic torque bias, which is what the helical design does as a function. =]
Absolutely love my Wavetrac. Having a lightweight front wheel drive big turbo hatchback, coming off corners with hard power used to be a hopping mess. Now its hard pulls and feels like I am on a roller coaster.
That says a lot when the company says go have fun and go abuse it.. nobody that doesn't trust what they've built will EVER say this.. plus a lifetime warranty means they know they've built a solid product THAT WORKS.
Depends on how much power u throw at it if ur only playing with 1000 hp that's nothing but u start playing with over 3k I'm questioning what's gonna break next and will I get another past
@@theunluckycharm9637 1000 hp isn't alot it doesn't take alot of money or time to make 1000 hp u don't need to machine anything everything is bolt on. U gotta tune ecu change fuel pump, fuel injectors change the cam port the factory exhaust manifold remove catalytic converters run strait pipe. add a cheap turbo kit or go with electric turbos turn it up to 22 psi yup 1000 hp. U don't need to rebuild a whole motor to make power u don't even need arp studs for 1000 hp. U can make more power by getting removing accessories like ac belts power steering waterpump hell u don't even need an alternator.
@@jackdaniels2657 looks like you doesn't what are you talking about, 1000hp with stock internals is very risky, And the tranny definitely can't handle it, You need built transmisión, diferential and axles.
@@theunluckycharm9637tbf in high school I built 3 cars with over 1000hp albeit not all mine. 1400hp ls build in a gto. 1700hp hemi in a gto. Gm big block old school style making like 1100hp. These days with cheap ls bits and other random bits you can find. 1000hp isn't that crazy. Still alot but I mean. We have production 1000hp vehicles now.
I had the Mitsubishi LSD put in my shep stage 2 transfer case originally. When I broke that. I had them put in the wavetrac and the difference is definitely noticeable at the road course. I can push harder around and out of a corner than before. It's amazing.
I have 2 FWD cars, one is an Open Diff FWD the other is a Helical Diff FWD (Close to Wavetrac). The difference between the two car's ability to hold traction is absolutely insane, completely different experience!
The wavetrac is a great evolution of the Quaife type gear differential with the wave design operating in a similar fashion to a camshaft to increase tension. This eliminates the disadvantages of a normal gear type Torsen differential with one wheel off the ground. With the advantage of a direct fit for most differentials with quiet operation and a lifetime warranty included it's a great low maintenance solution. I hope they expand the range because these types of differentials even work well in Hybrids and electric vehicles without disrupting the vehicles electronic control systems excessively. 😎🇦🇺👍
I have one of these in my BMW can confirm they are great. It's been installed for about 10 years and 120,000 miles in a tuned twin-turbo car. I see there is also a part for a Ford 9" with 35 splines. I was going to get the Eaton Truetrac, but wouldn't mind paying a little more for the Wavetrac.
Really cool to learn how these work. While rebuilding my rear diff of my Dodge 3500, I found out someone had already installed one of these. I knew it was a upgrade over the open diff and that it was better for on road applications then the clutch or lockers (my dodge lives mostly on-road but sometimes pulls into a field), but I never quite understood how these work. Never would have guessed it worked by using the gears as a friction surface by jamming them into the case.
New sub here, I own a 19 crosstrek bought new. I’ll never own or build an EJ 25 but man, the amount of info and technical experience you have is OFF the charts, I’m gonna binge all of your videos just for an education. Information is power.
Can you drift with this diff? Or what What do you say would be the best differential for 350z to get both back wheels spinning on a drift completely locked
@@redline350zHR the Wavetrack is a strong dependable posi traction diff. Perfect for drifting. BUT u need to find out if drifters need a 1-way, 1.5, or a 2-way style diff. A 1-way is locked (posi turns both wheels) only under acceleration. 1.5 is locked under acc but also 50% under de-acceleration. A 2-way is both. I think a 2-way would be dangerous on the street. Ask a guy who drifts what they use. But the Wavetrack is good just not the cheapest diff.
I remember Mike from SCC days. Always loved his articles because they broke things down scientifically and in a way that was special. Dave Coleman was awesome as well.
@@jamest.5001 The original Humvee uses a torsen center iirc. Driver needs to press the brake or something when a wheel is in the air, but is otherwise very good from my understanding. No personal experience with the platform however.
I ran a factory helical for years on a fast turbocharged front wheel drive street car. Loved it. Couldn't take the noise and steering feedback of the clutch types.
This is really interesting! I've checked Wavetrac's website and they have no differentials for any Subaru application. I would love to get a front and rear for my 2006 WRX.
nice to see, thanks would also be awesome, to see how the different diffs work in action for example drifting or track use and what the drivers say, Wavetrac, Quafe, Torson etc.
Im on the fence about changing from a torsen to a clutched lsd in the rear of a low power rwd car (miata). The reason im not over the fence yet is the fact that my priority with the build is driver engagement and predictability, just to get out on the track and dance with, knowing ill never set any lap records, and im worried about the clutch being just slightly less smooth. Do you think this would be the answer? Asking in theory so idc whether they have an option for miatas or not rn.
Study up. This is significantly different from a Torsen. It definitely follows the Torsen idea, but it solves the Torsen's problems in a way that Torsen's inventor never imagined.
@@alainbelisle643 First of all, the inventor of the first Torsen differential, Vernon Gleasman, did not come up with the arrangement of components that all have their axis facing in the same direction. That was invented at least a decade later. Wavetrac copied that design. But Wavetrac introduced the cam. That's two steps away from the original design. BTW, I've known plenty of engineers. A few of them made me wonder how they got their degrees. One was a mechanical engineer who didn't believe that a water heater could explode. Two others were structural engineers. One hadn't heard of Gothic cathedrals with their vaults and buttresses. The other couldn't solve a problem that only needed tension connectors to hold an octagonal roof together at the top of the walls.
@@deezynar So what they are calling a Torsen isn't then. The whole point of the differential designed by Gleasman was it was based on a worm gear. The worm wheel at 90° to the worm gear and attached to the housing can't turn the worm gear. If it's in an axial configuration I don't see how that works . The original design worked quite well, but it was expensive to make. The limited slip wasn't due to friction, but due to the gear design.
@@kilomike5792 I agree with you that this design is significantly different, and better, from Gleason's original idea. This version doesn't use worm gears and worm wheels at all. Not at all. It has all gears oriented with all their axis in the same direction. That means all of them share the same helical pitch. The worm gear and worm wheel action only works if the pitch of the meshed gears are different from each other. One has to be greater than 45 degrees, the other less. This design ignores that method of function completely. Not only that, but the so-called "pinions" in this style aren't even on bearings! Their perimeters rub right against the pumpkin to create friction. And the way they interleave with the other pinions means they can't rotate in relation to each other unless both axles are turning in relation to each other at the same time. The torque of one axle is not enough to cause the whole mess of components to rotate and transfer torque to the opposite axle. Gleason was a genius to come up with his design, but this evolution which came about years after Gleason's idea, is genius on top of genius. I say that even though the original introduced the concept. This method of doing the same thing is much more elegant. That cam addition made by this company is a minor refinement compared to the overall idea.
Here's the wild thing about WaveTrac - I learned about them years ago from hearing about 2000+HP small tire door cars running them(Ford 9" app of course, they have them for 31, 33, and 35 spline)! Absolutely one of the baddest diffs on the planet! I don't tend to believe in products that can "work great in practically all applications" - but, honest to goodness, these things are seriously one of the best diffs for a whole variety of different applications. Only thing I don't know about is off-roading, trail rig kind of stuff, I'm not sure how these perform with the leverage & weight of REAL big, heavy tires, and large variances in tire to tire traction. Of course, it's hard to beat selectable lockers off road(and, frankly, an open diff isn't the worst thing in the world for trail rigs on big tires running around on the street, keeps them predictable in winter weather, and you can still always flip a switch and lockem' up of course), so it's a bit of a non issue regardless; but damn they're tough to beat for a LOT of straight line and corner carving applications for sure, regardless of the power level. I think the only negative is the price lol, but, frankly, that's only compared to the clutch types - they're in line with the usual suspects in the gear type market.
I'm building a 35 spline 9" for an off road application with 37" tires and was ready to buy a Truetrac because the vehicle will not be trailered and I want something when driving on the road, especially in snow, but honestly even when it rains I have issues in the truck now with an open rear diff. I know HMMWV's come with torsen diffs front a rear. The trick with them is if you get a tire off the ground hold the brake to apply some resistance to that tire and a torsen will bias more torque to the other wheel based on the bias ratio. Technically this works with an open diff too, but the bias ratio is only 1:1. I was going to make tone rings and install wheel speed sensors in the 9" to maintain the factory traction control system which automatically does the same thing. With a torsen it'll work a lot better than a open diff. If that fails I'll use the foot or parking brake if lifting tires. I'll have an air locker in front. It this was a full time trail rig I'd consider an air locker in the rear, but a locker on a snow covered curvy road doesn't sound like a great idea. It could be fun, but I wouldn't expect it to be the safest option. The torsen will always be working in the background to seamlessly balance torque. I see Wavetrac have a high friction variant for the 35 spline 9" application. I think I might go with that now. I've had good luck with the Wavetrac in my BMW for the past 10 years. It does great in the snow with RWD and proper tires. Of course with enough throttle it'll kick the rear out, but if I drive sensibly it does all the hard work. It would be tough in the winter with an open diff and the Wavetrac has been holding up well. The car is twin turbo 335 and after 190,000 miles the transmission is starting to flare from 3 -> 4, but the Wavetrac is going strong. I have no doubt the considerably bigger 9" differential will be fine.
I have an audi q5 2016 model with the torsen quattro system and open diffs front and rear. I was thinking of changing the open diffs for wavetrack, at least the rear one. My thinking is: my q5 us a great all around vehicle, it has dsg, rear based awd, double wish bone suspension and handles pretty well. Im not looking to turn it into a track car, or 4x4 rig to go rock climping. I just want to have a vehicle thats gonna handle all the offroading i ll ever need to do while still being fun and comfy on the road, as maintance free as possible and without a whole lot of alterations. So clutch type lsd or proper lockers where not an option as a locker is good offroad, but on the road is just an open diff, and clutch type lsd are complicated, electronically controlled most of the times, noisy, not very smooth and require maintance. And of course they are very expensive. I was thinking of pytting torsens or quiafe but they have are gonna have some traction issues once a wheel is up in the air, so the wavetrack to me seem the best of both words with just a little bit of comprimise.
@@loukasantoniou8054 If money is no object do both axles. The great thing about Toesen diffs in general is they work great on road, and if you do ever find yourself off road with one wheel in the air/mud/on ice, just apply moderate throttle and ease on the brake with your left foot. This will create resistance on the slipping wheel and transfer torque to the wheel with traction. I bet your Q5 has an eLSD system that applies breaking pressure to the spinning wheel using the ABS system. Systems like this are great compliments for Toesen diffs.
@@Fix_It_Again_Tony yes i know that, however this can put some wear to the brakes. However with quattro doing it for me, it wont be that bad lol. I was hoping i could find a non clutch style lsd with enough lock and i though wavetrack was a good option, but after reading a lot of comments, im 50-50 now. maybe a clutch type lsd like the first and second gen cayenne is a good option. I have an engineering teacher(turor) who is quite a car geek whom i could ask for advice.
@@loukasantoniou8054 I would stay away from a clutch type LSD in your application. They will change how the car feels on the road, especially in parking lots or other tight maneuvering. I think brake wear is a non issue because brakes will only be applied at low speeds when one wheel loses traction. The brakes are designed to quickly bring the vehicle to a stop from highway speeds. One other aspect is maintenance. Gear type LSDs are maintenance free. Just normal diff oil changes required, same as with standard equipment. Good luck with your decision.
I put a Wavetrac in my 93 Camaro, road racing machine, (a Moser 9"), and it acted the same as an open diff. on the road course tracks, I had a different brand of diff. in my streetcar, they both have the same engine, LT1's producing 640 lb-ft of torque, so I swapped out the diffs, the Wavetrac is working fine on the street, and the other diff is working fine on the racetracks.
Nice video brother, can you please tell me if wavetrac offers differentials for the 2010 Jeep Grand Cherokee WK1 SRT8 if so what are the part numbers or where i can buy them from, thanks in advance
This may be a dumb question, but would anyone recommend using this to be used in a car that will be driven in snow? I have a 2020 Civic as my daily and and drive it in snow. I have snow tires(Bridgestone Blizzak WS90) and chains, but that open diff can only do so much.
I maybe wouldn't get it specifically for that cause it could be somewhat of an expensive part/install but I would think that it would help in certain situations for sure. Say you are driving on a snow covered road and you run on a frozen ice underneath with say your front passenger wheel - your current car would then just push more power to the wheel that's spinning on the ice and you wouldn't go much further. If you had this or any other lsd installed, once the front passenger wheel starts slipping on the ice your driver's front wheel will get some power transferred to it and you would be able to get out of the situation.
I have a Wavetrac in the rear of my RWD car and it does great in the snow with proper tires. It'll also prevent spinning tires in the rain when taking off from lights. No traction control cutting in, just acceleration.
I'd love to see this application offered for the UTV market and offroading. Can Am x3 are notorious for shearing the spider gearset teeth off under torque.
Face cam like that is really OLD tech but people always come up with new uses for it. Using outside of housing to hold gears in place instead of a bearing is novel idea, how high is the friction load? I looked up 8620 and 9310, both low carbon high toughness steels designed for case hardening, impressive stuff.
The friction due to the lack of axial thrust bearings is key to the torque biasing action. The lack of bearings for radial location is more strange, less important to the way it functions, and normal for differentials of this general design (of which there are multiple brands).
@@brianb-p6586 I actually found it interesting as I've never seen it before plus didn't know there were similar designs. (since I stopped teaching I stopped researching stuff)
I was always fascinated by Torsen's differential, and although the geometry / config is different, the fundamental principles are the same. These appear to all depend on 1 thing: Friction. The friction is achieved by resisting the axial thrust load on helical gears. That friction is controlled by design, at a few interfaces that are not readily obvious; 1. The axial bearing. In WaveTrac's case, they introduce some fiber reinforced plastics and other abrasive friction materials. But basically, stopping the helical gears from shooting out the sides of the diff, whether metal on metal OR metal on ceramic fibers. 2. The radial bearing. As you can see, the gears ride in a flower pedal array of offset cylindrical bores. Disregard the axial thrust; Those helical gears still get loaded against the sides of the case, and that metal on metal friction contributes to the differential splitting load from a freewheel to the loaded wheel. 3. The helical gears pitch / twist: This one took me the longest to wrap my head around. But if you disregard the other points, this one is essentially the MOST fundamental one. The more the planet gears look like a screw vs. like a spur gear, the more they resist axial load (like the ARP bolts; they are screws in tension due to their fine thread pitch). If you, as a designer, change the pitch of the planet helical gears, you change how the locking action behaves, because the pitch affects friction as the gears slide against each other and jam themselves against the load bearing surfaces of point 1 and 2! This one is tricky, however, because it is subject to not only the lubricity of the gear oil being used, but also the material properties, surface finish, tribology and surface treatments of the gears. 4. The WaveTrac signature feature: The sinusoidal cam profile which in effect introduces pulsations of load into the helical gears during wheel slip. This one seems the most obvious in terms of functionality and it sure is clever; If one wheel is spinning and one held stationary, and you could see through the differential, you'd see that for every revolution of the free wheel, the splined sun gears on each axle are spread apart and pushed back together 4 times, this forces pulsation of all the frictions above in points 1,2,3 to cycle up and down, which allows the freewheel to lock up in pulses! Pulsing is always good for traction, remember examples of pulsation used as a benefit: Anti-loc Brake Systems V4 Ducati MotoGP power delivery to rear wheel hammer drills / impact guns (ubiquitous in all trades now) etc etc Let me know if i got anything wrong!
Was thinking of putting wavetracks on my 2016 q5 with the torsen center diff. Reason being i want a simple reliable smooth easy to fit and maintain lsd that will improve both on road and offroad performance. Im not talking about track use, or rock climping, but better traction in every type scenario. I know wavetrack can handle sport driving, but can they handle offroad use as well? I want to avoid a clutch type lsd or a locker as the first one ia expensive and needs alterations prior to installation and the locker while the beat option offroad, on road, it wont make any difference.
Not sure why but I want to install a clutch type LS carrier on my 82 911 SC 915 transaxle which a used unit will likley need a rebuild before installing. It's only street used and why I say not sure is from a purely technical perspective, along with the added weight of engine placement, at 180hp or even a ROW car with 204hp, these air cooled 911's really doesn’t technically make enough power to require a LS yet I still want one. From a technical perspective, any non clutch gear type makes the most sense on a 915 gearbox as the syncros don't like the requirred added slippery additive to keep the clutches from sticking.
If a wheel comes off the ground for more then 3 seconds, or an axle snaps, would this diff be able to send power to the side with the most traction, under low wheel speeds?
No. They dont at ALL. The friction plates are non-serviceable and dont do anything. Look up BMW ice wavetrac testing to watch this LSD fail miserably at its marketing claim. Use a Quaife, or otherwise if you want a Torsen. For BMW, Miata, or any RWD vehicle, you most definitely want a clutch pack rear diff. Look into OS Giken, and "Gripper" brand diffs from Europe
This is completely wrong. A Wavetrac has more lock than a Torsen or Quaife when one wheel starts spinning but not as much as a clutch type diff. It is one of the best diffs for the front of an awd car, the front of a lower power more narrow tired FWD car, Good on the rear of a lower powered narrower tire RWD car, good on any end of a late model car with a lot of electronic nannys, good for people who don't want to put up with juddering and clunking. It is not good for wide tired, high power cars except for people who have a hard time handling power oversteer, its is not good for drifting, not my first choice for a race car.
@@brandonlittle6444 I have a Wavetrac in the rear of my RWD 335i and it has been doing great rain, shine or snow for the past 10 years and 140,000 miles.
I have a similar drivetrain, but with no LSDs (xdrive M140i). The car is driven on track rarely, 5 or 6 times a year only for 1h stints. Would you recommend wavetrack or OSGiken for me? Edit: for the rear axle, would do the front in the future but not soon
Does going RWD pick up any extra speed by shedding the weight of that diff? It seems like a popular option when I look around. Im wondering if the front diff makes an experience that makes it worth the weight and complexity in a car like this.
When a true track starts to peg leg when a wheel looses traction completely like an open diff, the Wavetrac has a secondary clutch that keeps sending power to the spinning wheel
Would this be a suitable upgrade for a rwd like say a Maserati 4200 Gransport (power roughly 400hp at flywheel)? What advantage would it provide over the standard LSD?
I've a helical LSD in my Dodge 3500 with a up build 800 horse power cummins. Never knew until I took the diff apart to rebuild it because a pinion bearing went bad at like 350K miles. I tow upwards of 18K pounds with this truck.
whe wave aspect was explained in a manner that would lead one to conclude that there is smoke and mirrors in play - the wheels left and right axles are " virtually never" syncronised at the exact speed for any length of time, even in normal operation - as the axles rotate relative to each other, the wave feature will vary the preload on the locker in normal operation, not just come into play with significant wheel slip now I am not saying the system is bad (or good), just that the explanation does not match reality
I am interested in the wavetrac, however before I make a purchase like that I need to see a demonstration of a zero traction situation. For example, one wheel on ice and one wheel on a solid, hard surface. I want to see show it performs. I have yet to find a video of that.
@@roberthuffer6591 actually the cam mechanism is working, as the car moves pretty well off the ice. An open diff or a Quaife or Torsen would have more trouble moving off the ice, a trick with these diffs is a little left foot braking will load the helix and get them to work a little better. These diffs work by load sensing, not wheel speed differential like a conventional LSD. The Wavetrac cam works a little better in a wheel speed differential situation than just the helix of the gears.
Thank you for that explanation! That helps a lot! Another question. The vehicle I am considering this for. 1984 VW Rabbit. Diesel. Non turbo. 4 speed manual. On the wavetrac website, I have seen that it is available for the 5 speed, but there is nothing mentioned about the 4 speed. Offhand, do you know if it is compatible? The car has no performance parts and I have no intentions to add any, except for some kind of lsd.
Isn't the problem with these differentials compered to a LSD with brake discs that this type torsen or what ever, when you have one slippery surface on one wheel it never really locks up and because of that you get stuck?
Im Just Surprised those tiny gears can Stand upto the power of a high power Skyline (Like 1500-2000HP) Specially if 1 front wheel is locked under braking and little tiny 15mm gears holding all that force :O
We feel that it is the best in the front of an AWD car, up to a moderately powered FWD car and great in lower powered small tire RWD cars. It is not the best for drifting or really big tire high powered cars as the primary differential. It is also one of the best diffs for someone who does not tolerate the jerking and clunking of clutch type diffs.
In ice there is not enough friction to create camming force. Other gear type diffs do not do well either unless you left foot brake some. A Wavetrac will work like this too.
It's a shame they don't make one for the R200, it's such a common diff and I was surprised to find out they didn't have anything listed for them.. Hopefully one day they decide to manufacture one.
They are preloaded differently. They use springs to provide initial break away resistance where as the Wavetrac uses the camming action of the wave disc. In the steering wheels this should result in less off throttle understeer.
@@motoiq guy has replied to every single comment saying how rubbish wavetrach is compared to quiafe. I hope the pay him or something cause thats seem like a lot of work to do for free.
@@motoiq I watched it but not sure i get the advantage. I see has preload, does this means it engages quicker or doesn't slip as much? I have a 03 Ford Excursion 7.3 diesel 2WD and it's a great road warrior but sandy soil / mud is not its friend. I am looking at swapping the diff to hopefully help with that.
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It is great to have a representative from the manufacturer that actually knows ALL about the product and not just spitting out quotes from sales literature.
This guy has true product and industry wide knowledge AND is obviously comfortable with the build/assembly process - great demonstration !
The diff is pretty sweet as well !
Literally one of THE MOST SLEPT ON car part manufactures is Wavetrac, Ridiculously reliable and lifetime warranty, feels so natural.
ATB Helical diff is probably the most slept on mod.
@@JimBrodie They also offer a lifetime warranty? I’ve used Wavetrac in all of my builds, I mainly like the natural feel of the diff and the fact that it does not interfere with any electronic driving aids.
I’ll need to look into ATB design, I think I recall them having Yellow font and a blue box?
Cheers.
@@7eamGhast I didn't mean a specific company, i meant as in this style of diff. ATB being an acronym for automatic torque bias, which is what the helical design does as a function. =]
@@JimBrodie LOL I'm a dummy! thanks!
I had a wavetrac after I bought a kaaz/Cusco diff that seized and blew! Only thing that broke it in the end was me crashing the car 😂
Absolutely love my Wavetrac. Having a lightweight front wheel drive big turbo hatchback, coming off corners with hard power used to be a hopping mess. Now its hard pulls and feels like I am on a roller coaster.
That says a lot when the company says go have fun and go abuse it.. nobody that doesn't trust what they've built will EVER say this.. plus a lifetime warranty means they know they've built a solid product THAT WORKS.
Depends on how much power u throw at it if ur only playing with 1000 hp that's nothing but u start playing with over 3k I'm questioning what's gonna break next and will I get another past
@@jackdaniels2657 "only playing with 1000hp"
@@theunluckycharm9637 1000 hp isn't alot it doesn't take alot of money or time to make 1000 hp u don't need to machine anything everything is bolt on. U gotta tune ecu change fuel pump, fuel injectors change the cam port the factory exhaust manifold remove catalytic converters run strait pipe. add a cheap turbo kit or go with electric turbos turn it up to 22 psi yup 1000 hp. U don't need to rebuild a whole motor to make power u don't even need arp studs for 1000 hp. U can make more power by getting removing accessories like ac belts power steering waterpump hell u don't even need an alternator.
@@jackdaniels2657 looks like you doesn't what are you talking about, 1000hp with stock internals is very risky, And the tranny definitely can't handle it, You need built transmisión, diferential and axles.
@@theunluckycharm9637tbf in high school I built 3 cars with over 1000hp albeit not all mine. 1400hp ls build in a gto. 1700hp hemi in a gto. Gm big block old school style making like 1100hp.
These days with cheap ls bits and other random bits you can find. 1000hp isn't that crazy. Still alot but I mean. We have production 1000hp vehicles now.
I had the Mitsubishi LSD put in my shep stage 2 transfer case originally. When I broke that. I had them put in the wavetrac and the difference is definitely noticeable at the road course. I can push harder around and out of a corner than before. It's amazing.
I run a Wavetrac in my Viper, love it 👍
I have 2 FWD cars, one is an Open Diff FWD the other is a Helical Diff FWD (Close to Wavetrac). The difference between the two car's ability to hold traction is absolutely insane, completely different experience!
It makes me happy that you're still upgrading the GT-R after all this time
The wavetrac is a great evolution of the Quaife type gear differential with the wave design operating in a similar fashion to a camshaft to increase tension. This eliminates the disadvantages of a normal gear type Torsen differential with one wheel off the ground. With the advantage of a direct fit for most differentials with quiet operation and a lifetime warranty included it's a great low maintenance solution.
I hope they expand the range because these types of differentials even work well in Hybrids and electric vehicles without disrupting the vehicles electronic control systems excessively.
😎🇦🇺👍
I have one of these in my BMW can confirm they are great. It's been installed for about 10 years and 120,000 miles in a tuned twin-turbo car.
I see there is also a part for a Ford 9" with 35 splines. I was going to get the Eaton Truetrac, but wouldn't mind paying a little more for the Wavetrac.
You just saved me a headache I've been trying to solve for over 5 months. Thank you.
Really cool to learn how these work. While rebuilding my rear diff of my Dodge 3500, I found out someone had already installed one of these. I knew it was a upgrade over the open diff and that it was better for on road applications then the clutch or lockers (my dodge lives mostly on-road but sometimes pulls into a field), but I never quite understood how these work. Never would have guessed it worked by using the gears as a friction surface by jamming them into the case.
New sub here, I own a 19 crosstrek bought new. I’ll never own or build an EJ 25 but man, the amount of info and technical experience you have is OFF the charts, I’m gonna binge all of your videos just for an education. Information is power.
I had a wavetrac installed and now I’m a believer. It completely transformed my car!
Can you drift with this diff? Or what What do you say would be the best differential for 350z to get both back wheels spinning on a drift completely locked
@@redline350zHR the Wavetrack is a strong dependable posi traction diff. Perfect for drifting. BUT u need to find out if drifters need a 1-way, 1.5, or a 2-way style diff. A 1-way is locked (posi turns both wheels) only under acceleration. 1.5 is locked under acc but also 50% under de-acceleration. A 2-way is both. I think a 2-way would be dangerous on the street. Ask a guy who drifts what they use. But the Wavetrack is good just not the cheapest diff.
I have worked on many diff's (just regular cars) and I can honestly say this is the first one that I would call Beautifully elegant.
I remember Mike from SCC days. Always loved his articles because they broke things down scientifically and in a way that was special. Dave Coleman was awesome as well.
A good follow up video would be "torque bias ratio" vs lockup of a clutch pack diff and the benefits and drawbacks of each.
Can this system be useful in 4x4/awd transfer cases?
@@jamest.5001 The original Humvee uses a torsen center iirc. Driver needs to press the brake or something when a wheel is in the air, but is otherwise very good from my understanding. No personal experience with the platform however.
I ran a factory helical for years on a fast turbocharged front wheel drive street car. Loved it. Couldn't take the noise and steering feedback of the clutch types.
I love the wavetrac I have it in both my cars. Works like magic
This is really interesting! I've checked Wavetrac's website and they have no differentials for any Subaru application.
I would love to get a front and rear for my 2006 WRX.
Can't wait ta see more of the GTR project.
It's coming big time soon!
nice to see, thanks
would also be awesome, to see how the different diffs work in action for example drifting or track use and what the drivers say, Wavetrac, Quafe, Torson etc.
Best explanation of gear lsd ever.
Im on the fence about changing from a torsen to a clutched lsd in the rear of a low power rwd car (miata). The reason im not over the fence yet is the fact that my priority with the build is driver engagement and predictability, just to get out on the track and dance with, knowing ill never set any lap records, and im worried about the clutch being just slightly less smooth. Do you think this would be the answer? Asking in theory so idc whether they have an option for miatas or not rn.
I think the torsen just might be better on a narrow tire low power lightweight car.
@@motoiq even over the wavetrac? Sorry, realized my comment didnt specify for sure that thats what i was asking about at the end
The wavetrac is superior to the torsen or quaife but its probably not worth it to take out a torsen from a stock Miata and switch with a Wavetrac.
@@motoiq respect for honesty
It's basically a Torsen diff, it's been around for decades. Invented in 1958. There are different types, they work on the worm gear dynamic concept.
Study up.
This is significantly different from a Torsen.
It definitely follows the Torsen idea, but it solves the Torsen's problems in a way that Torsen's inventor never imagined.
@@deezynar OK Explain that to me, I want to know what was the fundamental improvement compared to a Torsen ? I'm an engineer, so tell me.
@@alainbelisle643
First of all, the inventor of the first Torsen differential, Vernon Gleasman, did not come up with the arrangement of components that all have their axis facing in the same direction. That was invented at least a decade later. Wavetrac copied that design. But Wavetrac introduced the cam. That's two steps away from the original design.
BTW, I've known plenty of engineers. A few of them made me wonder how they got their degrees. One was a mechanical engineer who didn't believe that a water heater could explode. Two others were structural engineers. One hadn't heard of Gothic cathedrals with their vaults and buttresses. The other couldn't solve a problem that only needed tension connectors to hold an octagonal roof together at the top of the walls.
@@deezynar So what they are calling a Torsen isn't then. The whole point of the differential designed by Gleasman was it was based on a worm gear. The worm wheel at 90° to the worm gear and attached to the housing can't turn the worm gear. If it's in an axial configuration I don't see how that works . The original design worked quite well, but it was expensive to make. The limited slip wasn't due to friction, but due to the gear design.
@@kilomike5792
I agree with you that this design is significantly different, and better, from Gleason's original idea.
This version doesn't use worm gears and worm wheels at all. Not at all. It has all gears oriented with all their axis in the same direction. That means all of them share the same helical pitch. The worm gear and worm wheel action only works if the pitch of the meshed gears are different from each other. One has to be greater than 45 degrees, the other less. This design ignores that method of function completely.
Not only that, but the so-called "pinions" in this style aren't even on bearings! Their perimeters rub right against the pumpkin to create friction. And the way they interleave with the other pinions means they can't rotate in relation to each other unless both axles are turning in relation to each other at the same time. The torque of one axle is not enough to cause the whole mess of components to rotate and transfer torque to the opposite axle.
Gleason was a genius to come up with his design, but this evolution which came about years after Gleason's idea, is genius on top of genius. I say that even though the original introduced the concept. This method of doing the same thing is much more elegant.
That cam addition made by this company is a minor refinement compared to the overall idea.
I run a wavetrac in my 996 turbo track car. Best all around lsd on the market imo. Fantastic company and technology
I wish Wavetrac would make fitments for Toyota Land Cruiser front and rear diffs, I want them for snow and ice driving!
Not a gtr owner, but thank you for quality, informative content. Keep it up.
Finally a gear type diff that will work properly. Thank you!
Gutted! They don't do a wavetrack for r32/33/34 gtr.💔
Here's the wild thing about WaveTrac - I learned about them years ago from hearing about 2000+HP small tire door cars running them(Ford 9" app of course, they have them for 31, 33, and 35 spline)! Absolutely one of the baddest diffs on the planet! I don't tend to believe in products that can "work great in practically all applications" - but, honest to goodness, these things are seriously one of the best diffs for a whole variety of different applications.
Only thing I don't know about is off-roading, trail rig kind of stuff, I'm not sure how these perform with the leverage & weight of REAL big, heavy tires, and large variances in tire to tire traction. Of course, it's hard to beat selectable lockers off road(and, frankly, an open diff isn't the worst thing in the world for trail rigs on big tires running around on the street, keeps them predictable in winter weather, and you can still always flip a switch and lockem' up of course), so it's a bit of a non issue regardless; but damn they're tough to beat for a LOT of straight line and corner carving applications for sure, regardless of the power level.
I think the only negative is the price lol, but, frankly, that's only compared to the clutch types - they're in line with the usual suspects in the gear type market.
I'm building a 35 spline 9" for an off road application with 37" tires and was ready to buy a Truetrac because the vehicle will not be trailered and I want something when driving on the road, especially in snow, but honestly even when it rains I have issues in the truck now with an open rear diff. I know HMMWV's come with torsen diffs front a rear. The trick with them is if you get a tire off the ground hold the brake to apply some resistance to that tire and a torsen will bias more torque to the other wheel based on the bias ratio. Technically this works with an open diff too, but the bias ratio is only 1:1.
I was going to make tone rings and install wheel speed sensors in the 9" to maintain the factory traction control system which automatically does the same thing. With a torsen it'll work a lot better than a open diff. If that fails I'll use the foot or parking brake if lifting tires. I'll have an air locker in front. It this was a full time trail rig I'd consider an air locker in the rear, but a locker on a snow covered curvy road doesn't sound like a great idea. It could be fun, but I wouldn't expect it to be the safest option. The torsen will always be working in the background to seamlessly balance torque.
I see Wavetrac have a high friction variant for the 35 spline 9" application. I think I might go with that now. I've had good luck with the Wavetrac in my BMW for the past 10 years. It does great in the snow with RWD and proper tires. Of course with enough throttle it'll kick the rear out, but if I drive sensibly it does all the hard work. It would be tough in the winter with an open diff and the Wavetrac has been holding up well. The car is twin turbo 335 and after 190,000 miles the transmission is starting to flare from 3 -> 4, but the Wavetrac is going strong. I have no doubt the considerably bigger 9" differential will be fine.
I have an audi q5 2016 model with the torsen quattro system and open diffs front and rear. I was thinking of changing the open diffs for wavetrack, at least the rear one. My thinking is: my q5 us a great all around vehicle, it has dsg, rear based awd, double wish bone suspension and handles pretty well. Im not looking to turn it into a track car, or 4x4 rig to go rock climping. I just want to have a vehicle thats gonna handle all the offroading i ll ever need to do while still being fun and comfy on the road, as maintance free as possible and without a whole lot of alterations. So clutch type lsd or proper lockers where not an option as a locker is good offroad, but on the road is just an open diff, and clutch type lsd are complicated, electronically controlled most of the times, noisy, not very smooth and require maintance. And of course they are very expensive. I was thinking of pytting torsens or quiafe but they have are gonna have some traction issues once a wheel is up in the air, so the wavetrack to me seem the best of both words with just a little bit of comprimise.
@@loukasantoniou8054 If money is no object do both axles. The great thing about Toesen diffs in general is they work great on road, and if you do ever find yourself off road with one wheel in the air/mud/on ice, just apply moderate throttle and ease on the brake with your left foot. This will create resistance on the slipping wheel and transfer torque to the wheel with traction. I bet your Q5 has an eLSD system that applies breaking pressure to the spinning wheel using the ABS system. Systems like this are great compliments for Toesen diffs.
@@Fix_It_Again_Tony yes i know that, however this can put some wear to the brakes. However with quattro doing it for me, it wont be that bad lol. I was hoping i could find a non clutch style lsd with enough lock and i though wavetrack was a good option, but after reading a lot of comments, im 50-50 now. maybe a clutch type lsd like the first and second gen cayenne is a good option. I have an engineering teacher(turor) who is quite a car geek whom i could ask for advice.
@@loukasantoniou8054 I would stay away from a clutch type LSD in your application. They will change how the car feels on the road, especially in parking lots or other tight maneuvering.
I think brake wear is a non issue because brakes will only be applied at low speeds when one wheel loses traction. The brakes are designed to quickly bring the vehicle to a stop from highway speeds.
One other aspect is maintenance. Gear type LSDs are maintenance free. Just normal diff oil changes required, same as with standard equipment.
Good luck with your decision.
Run one in my kswapped civic, must have for any fwd car imo.
Great video, got the largest on they make on my ford 9". Can't wait to try it out on a big tire
Fantastic video. I have been wanting a wavetrac fro my Focus St
Don't concern yourself with the cost.
It will transform your car.
Do it before you do any other mods to your Focus.
I put a Wavetrac in my 93 Camaro, road racing machine, (a Moser 9"), and it acted the same as an open diff. on the road course tracks, I had a different brand of diff. in my streetcar, they both have the same engine, LT1's producing 640 lb-ft of torque, so I swapped out the diffs, the Wavetrac is working fine on the street, and the other diff is working fine on the racetracks.
Yeah for the rear of a high power RWD car I would probably use a clutch type diff.
I wish they made one of these for the ecoboost SHO, since it’s fwd dominant it would help a lot! Great informational video, learned some new things.
Contact them directly. They may be able to help
Nice video brother, can you please tell me if wavetrac offers differentials for the 2010 Jeep Grand Cherokee WK1 SRT8 if so what are the part numbers or where i can buy them from, thanks in advance
Makes me want a project car that much more! Very cool...
Thanks for the info! I want one for my G if i can ever build it.
Best sleep I’ve ever had by accident. Imma rewatch this cause I do need to fix my car
Is that prevent torque steer on FWD car? Is it a good drag diff?
This may be a dumb question, but would anyone recommend using this to be used in a car that will be driven in snow? I have a 2020 Civic as my daily and and drive it in snow. I have snow tires(Bridgestone Blizzak WS90) and chains, but that open diff can only do so much.
I maybe wouldn't get it specifically for that cause it could be somewhat of an expensive part/install but I would think that it would help in certain situations for sure. Say you are driving on a snow covered road and you run on a frozen ice underneath with say your front passenger wheel - your current car would then just push more power to the wheel that's spinning on the ice and you wouldn't go much further. If you had this or any other lsd installed, once the front passenger wheel starts slipping on the ice your driver's front wheel will get some power transferred to it and you would be able to get out of the situation.
Way more than an open diff!
I have a Wavetrac in the rear of my RWD car and it does great in the snow with proper tires. It'll also prevent spinning tires in the rain when taking off from lights. No traction control cutting in, just acceleration.
I have a Detroit Truetrac in my '94 Toyota Pickup. Works like money.
Also when is wavetrac making a diff for the skyline gtr.
That's crazy about the gears. That's owsom I've never heard or seen one. Wow
That's some confidence in your product.
I've been waiting for so long.
so its like a eaton truetrac. cool. do that make any for the skyline gtr?
I'd love to see this application offered for the UTV market and offroading. Can Am x3 are notorious for shearing the spider gearset teeth off under torque.
Face cam like that is really OLD tech but people always come up with new uses for it.
Using outside of housing to hold gears in place instead of a bearing is novel idea, how high is the friction load?
I looked up 8620 and 9310, both low carbon high toughness steels designed for case hardening, impressive stuff.
having bearings would reduce the effectiveness of this diff.
The friction due to the lack of axial thrust bearings is key to the torque biasing action. The lack of bearings for radial location is more strange, less important to the way it functions, and normal for differentials of this general design (of which there are multiple brands).
@@brianb-p6586 I actually found it interesting as I've never seen it before plus didn't know there were similar designs. (since I stopped teaching I stopped researching stuff)
@1crazypj other brands of this type include Torsen T-2, Quaife ATB, and Eaton Truetrac.
I was always fascinated by Torsen's differential, and although the geometry / config is different, the fundamental principles are the same. These appear to all depend on 1 thing: Friction. The friction is achieved by resisting the axial thrust load on helical gears. That friction is controlled by design, at a few interfaces that are not readily obvious;
1. The axial bearing. In WaveTrac's case, they introduce some fiber reinforced plastics and other abrasive friction materials. But basically, stopping the helical gears from shooting out the sides of the diff, whether metal on metal OR metal on ceramic fibers.
2. The radial bearing. As you can see, the gears ride in a flower pedal array of offset cylindrical bores. Disregard the axial thrust; Those helical gears still get loaded against the sides of the case, and that metal on metal friction contributes to the differential splitting load from a freewheel to the loaded wheel.
3. The helical gears pitch / twist: This one took me the longest to wrap my head around. But if you disregard the other points, this one is essentially the MOST fundamental one. The more the planet gears look like a screw vs. like a spur gear, the more they resist axial load (like the ARP bolts; they are screws in tension due to their fine thread pitch). If you, as a designer, change the pitch of the planet helical gears, you change how the locking action behaves, because the pitch affects friction as the gears slide against each other and jam themselves against the load bearing surfaces of point 1 and 2! This one is tricky, however, because it is subject to not only the lubricity of the gear oil being used, but also the material properties, surface finish, tribology and surface treatments of the gears.
4. The WaveTrac signature feature: The sinusoidal cam profile which in effect introduces pulsations of load into the helical gears during wheel slip. This one seems the most obvious in terms of functionality and it sure is clever; If one wheel is spinning and one held stationary, and you could see through the differential, you'd see that for every revolution of the free wheel, the splined sun gears on each axle are spread apart and pushed back together 4 times, this forces pulsation of all the frictions above in points 1,2,3 to cycle up and down, which allows the freewheel to lock up in pulses!
Pulsing is always good for traction, remember examples of pulsation used as a benefit:
Anti-loc Brake Systems
V4 Ducati MotoGP power delivery to rear wheel
hammer drills / impact guns (ubiquitous in all trades now)
etc etc
Let me know if i got anything wrong!
You are right in every way except the pulsating load, it doesnt pulsate, it is more like a cam adding load.
@@motoiq you're right, I was wrong about the cam action! The cam is constrained and cant skip over, it just loads up the friction disc further.
Yes sir!
couldn't find Subaru WRX/STI on the applications page... is there going to be some made? or is a different application compatible?
So a locking torsen differential is a new thing ??
It does not lock like a traditional locker. It will never force the wheela to spin at the same rotational speed.
Excellent video!!🏁🏁🏁
Was thinking of putting wavetracks on my 2016 q5 with the torsen center diff. Reason being i want a simple reliable smooth easy to fit and maintain lsd that will improve both on road and offroad performance. Im not talking about track use, or rock climping, but better traction in every type scenario. I know wavetrack can handle sport driving, but can they handle offroad use as well? I want to avoid a clutch type lsd or a locker as the first one ia expensive and needs alterations prior to installation and the locker while the beat option offroad, on road, it wont make any difference.
I mean a locker is better for pure offroad but a wavetrac works all around.
@@motoiq maybe a ln lsd with enough lock
the ramp works like a clutch type but its for the worm gears. That's how I understand it
Good description and show how it work. Feel like this was a pretty straightforward video.
Not sure why but I want to install a clutch type LS carrier on my 82 911 SC 915 transaxle which a used unit will likley need a rebuild before installing. It's only street used and why I say not sure is from a purely technical perspective, along with the added weight of engine placement, at 180hp or even a ROW car with 204hp, these air cooled 911's really doesn’t technically make enough power to require a LS yet I still want one. From a technical perspective, any non clutch gear type makes the most sense on a 915 gearbox as the syncros don't like the requirred added slippery additive to keep the clutches from sticking.
You can WPC the plates, it works really well. I prefer clutch types in the rear of cars myself.
still a clever use of the torsion style diff.
watch the full video th-cam.com/video/XuqdWkYiO-M/w-d-xo.html
If a wheel comes off the ground for more then 3 seconds, or an axle snaps, would this diff be able to send power to the side with the most traction, under low wheel speeds?
To a degree, not as much as a clutch type or detroit locker but more than a Torsen or Quaife.
No. They dont at ALL. The friction plates are non-serviceable and dont do anything. Look up BMW ice wavetrac testing to watch this LSD fail miserably at its marketing claim.
Use a Quaife, or otherwise if you want a Torsen. For BMW, Miata, or any RWD vehicle, you most definitely want a clutch pack rear diff. Look into OS Giken, and "Gripper" brand diffs from Europe
This is completely wrong. A Wavetrac has more lock than a Torsen or Quaife when one wheel starts spinning but not as much as a clutch type diff. It is one of the best diffs for the front of an awd car, the front of a lower power more narrow tired FWD car, Good on the rear of a lower powered narrower tire RWD car, good on any end of a late model car with a lot of electronic nannys, good for people who don't want to put up with juddering and clunking. It is not good for wide tired, high power cars except for people who have a hard time handling power oversteer, its is not good for drifting, not my first choice for a race car.
th-cam.com/video/H3FTG0RVBJU/w-d-xo.html and here is one sending power to the wheel with more traction on ice
@@brandonlittle6444 I have a Wavetrac in the rear of my RWD 335i and it has been doing great rain, shine or snow for the past 10 years and 140,000 miles.
Do they also make a differential for symmetric tricycle? Like a 2 wheel on the rear and 1 wheel on front.
Contact them
Do you change the helix angle to change the amount of bias or is it mainly just preload? Do you make a similar system for a transfer case?
The helix angle changes the torque bias
I put a Wavetrac in the front of my Golf R and it is brilliant. I later put one in the rear, and it completely messed up the car's balance.
I have a similar drivetrain, but with no LSDs (xdrive M140i).
The car is driven on track rarely, 5 or 6 times a year only for 1h stints.
Would you recommend wavetrack or OSGiken for me?
Edit: for the rear axle, would do the front in the future but not soon
For casual performance driving, this is a great choice.
Does going RWD pick up any extra speed by shedding the weight of that diff? It seems like a popular option when I look around. Im wondering if the front diff makes an experience that makes it worth the weight and complexity in a car like this.
Sure when you have power AWD helps a lot.
Never understood why gtr front diff was open. Like wow STI and EVO X are economy cars with lsd's everywhere
How well can you combine a limited-slip differential with torque vectoring? Can you still make super sharp turns?
They are two different things.
11:37 it’s a 🌸😮
I have a true track installed in my Tacoma runs like a dream what's the difference between that and this wave track
When a true track starts to peg leg when a wheel looses traction completely like an open diff, the Wavetrac has a secondary clutch that keeps sending power to the spinning wheel
Does it work as well for off road use compared to the Torsen, geared or helical differentials?
Yes
I have a 370Z sport coupe and would like to replace my viscous LSD with a Wavetrac when it starts to fail.
Do they make this for the modern Ford Ranger/Bronco front axle?
They make them for the Ford 8.8" diff which is in nearly everything.
So it's a torsen with an added cam and brake?
Would this be a suitable upgrade for a rwd like say a Maserati 4200 Gransport (power roughly 400hp at flywheel)? What advantage would it provide over the standard LSD?
Not sure what the OEM diff is like or if Wavetrac makes an application for a Maserati
I've a helical LSD in my Dodge 3500 with a up build 800 horse power cummins. Never knew until I took the diff apart to rebuild it because a pinion bearing went bad at like 350K miles. I tow upwards of 18K pounds with this truck.
is this cloes to the toyota torsen 2 type lsd?
It is the same gearing design as a Torsen Type 2. The friction pads and cam are unique to the Wavetrac.
1 wheel peel, 1 tire fire, 1 hide fried, but my favorite all timer is...."No, it's a Single-Traction."
You must own a Wavetrac also. 1 tire fire is life
whe wave aspect was explained in a manner that would lead one to conclude that there is smoke and mirrors in play
- the wheels left and right axles are " virtually never" syncronised at the exact speed for any length of time, even in normal operation
- as the axles rotate relative to each other, the wave feature will vary the preload on the locker in normal operation, not just come into play with significant wheel slip
now I am not saying the system is bad (or good), just that the explanation does not match reality
The amount the wave cams is in proportion to the differential difference and torque load, it's as clear as day. No smoke and mirrors.
Is that prevent torque steer on FWD car? Is it a good drag diff?
No it won't prevent torque steer, that is a function of many things. It is more of a good diff for road racing.
@motoiq should I go with a Quaife then?
No this is better than a quaife. Consider a clutch type or if its a race car, a spool
@@motoiq Thank you very much :) I subscribe to your channel
I am interested in the wavetrac, however before I make a purchase like that I need to see a demonstration of a zero traction situation. For example, one wheel on ice and one wheel on a solid, hard surface. I want to see show it performs. I have yet to find a video of that.
th-cam.com/video/H3FTG0RVBJU/w-d-xo.html
Thank you. I watched the video. I am a little ignorant when it comes to this. Why didn’t the cam mechanism work in this situation?
@@roberthuffer6591 actually the cam mechanism is working, as the car moves pretty well off the ice. An open diff or a Quaife or Torsen would have more trouble moving off the ice, a trick with these diffs is a little left foot braking will load the helix and get them to work a little better. These diffs work by load sensing, not wheel speed differential like a conventional LSD. The Wavetrac cam works a little better in a wheel speed differential situation than just the helix of the gears.
Thank you for that explanation! That helps a lot! Another question. The vehicle I am considering this for. 1984 VW Rabbit. Diesel. Non turbo. 4 speed manual. On the wavetrac website, I have seen that it is available for the 5 speed, but there is nothing mentioned about the 4 speed. Offhand, do you know if it is compatible? The car has no performance parts and I have no intentions to add any, except for some kind of lsd.
That would be better answered by them. Give them a call.
For race track n cornering also road. Quaife or wavetrac
nice! I wish the mfg had some graphic fill-ins, 4 Illustration! good luck!!
He said there's for evo4-6 but it's not on the site, which made me choose a different brand diff
I would give them a call
Isn't the problem with these differentials compered to a LSD with brake discs that this type torsen or what ever, when you have one slippery surface on one wheel it never really locks up and because of that you get stuck?
Watch the video
@@motoiq I did, hence why I'm asking...
we explain why this works better in that condition.
He should do his demonstrations with a bigger diff, so it’s easier to see.
For those coming from short 11:31
Gear type diffs will not allow one wheel to turn faster then the other , it will allow one wheel to turn slower then the other .
so is this a helical LSD but enhanced version?
I would love to see how this does in an Escalade front and rear...I bet it would be a glorious ride with a supercharger on it too.
Im Just Surprised those tiny gears can Stand upto the power of a high power Skyline (Like 1500-2000HP)
Specially if 1 front wheel is locked under braking and little tiny 15mm gears holding all that force :O
Do Wave trac diffs need friction modifier additive?
They dont
This video convince me wavetrac is the best on the market
We feel that it is the best in the front of an AWD car, up to a moderately powered FWD car and great in lower powered small tire RWD cars. It is not the best for drifting or really big tire high powered cars as the primary differential. It is also one of the best diffs for someone who does not tolerate the jerking and clunking of clutch type diffs.
Watch BMW ice wavetrac and see the marketing claims fail.
Watch other gear type LSD's fair worse.
In ice there is not enough friction to create camming force. Other gear type diffs do not do well either unless you left foot brake some. A Wavetrac will work like this too.
Can you use this in a truck 4x4, front diff application
If they make one, I haven't checked.
Use a Locker
The HMMWV uses torsen diffs front a rear. Nothing to engage except a little left foot braking when lifting wheels.
Great video! Thanks for covering these technical topics. 👍
It's a shame they don't make one for the R200, it's such a common diff and I was surprised to find out they didn't have anything listed for them.. Hopefully one day they decide to manufacture one.
the 350z/370z is an r200 and they make a wavetrac for it..
These suitable for offroad?
Yes
Torsen T2R has clutch discs for preload
They are preloaded differently. They use springs to provide initial break away resistance where as the Wavetrac uses the camming action of the wave disc. In the steering wheels this should result in less off throttle understeer.
Wavetrac friction surfaces dont do a thing. Except break and cause problems.
Use a Quaife, the real company, or move to a clutch pack diff.
Ah you are a youtube expert. Have you ever actually used one of these diffs?
@@motoiq guy has replied to every single comment saying how rubbish wavetrach is compared to quiafe. I hope the pay him or something cause thats seem like a lot of work to do for free.
I have never heard the term "one tire fire," but always hear "one wheel peel."
How is this different then a Torsen Diff?
We explain this in the video
@@motoiq I watched it but not sure i get the advantage. I see has preload, does this means it engages quicker or doesn't slip as much? I have a 03 Ford Excursion 7.3 diesel 2WD and it's a great road warrior but sandy soil / mud is not its friend. I am looking at swapping the diff to hopefully help with that.
Gear LSD's act like an open diff once one wheel gets unloaded. This diff has a cam that provides some lock even if one wheel gets unloaded.
@@motoiq ok thats nice. Thanks for taking the time to explain
So hype to get my wavetrac into my CLS 55 AMG ! Check out my video of my track day, and imagine when I dont have an open diff!!
It's too bad they don't offer any for dana axles.
so the quaife is useless in the wet and on ice?
Quaife isn't as good on split mu surfaces, like one wheel on dry and the other on ice or water
@@motoiq thanks for the reply, unfortunately I didn't know the wavetrac when I purchased the quaife 😭😭😭
Quaife isn't bad, you just need to understand its shortcomings and avoid them. They are good for the front of an AWD car or a FWD car.
Pretty cool, it’s like a fancy truetrac for cars. I wonder how it would do off-road comparatively.
Works good except in some situations a locker is better.