You should write a book for real. I would love to be able to turn to a detailed chapter with diagrams instead of searching through TH-cam for the info. I'd buy the hell out of it
I was just wondering when does a purchase go from just buying a product and transforms into buying the hell out of something. Is it actually buying more than one just to be able to say you have more than one. Or is it buying more than one in case you want to read it again and want to turn the pages with the same crispness as you did with the first book... Or is it that you are now thinking about what you wrote and think to yourself danggummit there I go again .... typing with my hand in fast forward while my peanut size brain is in rewind. And now saying to yourself ....I'm such a Kenny.. (in case you are wondering... a Kenny is an idiot or a person with a peanut size brain that is always in rewind while everything else is in fastforward.)
@@timothygodwin1189 wow u put alot of time and thought into this one just for me to say its just and expression used to inphasis the want or need for something in an urgent manner.
I enjoy the way you communicate your message. You don't curse your viewers nor belittle them. You could have sold these videos on DVD and book form, called it an audio installation series and charged for it but you didn't. Thank you for the entertainment and education. Keep em comin bro
I'm 46 years old. I've never heard a more perfect explanation of anything before! You, sir are inspiring me to put a system in a 95 camry! You are an excellent communicator!
I just decided to upgrade my car audio. I had a buddy help me do this in the past. It was shotty at best. I set out to find out how to do this and I've been searching the net for weeks trying to piece it all together, so I don't buy twice. I found your channel and watched 3 videos so far. Man, you've answered so many questions and will probably give me back hours and hours of time I would have spent researching. I appreciate you and the content you make. Rockstar!
Big 3 first, especially if you plan on re-locating the battery or adding batteries/ultracaps! Great cables/wiring adds efficiency and helps you “find” additional power that you didn’t know you had.
Absolutely love this channel, one of the few which are still putting out daily car audio content. Everything is always super informative as well, especially for people just starting their car audio passion. Amazing work caraudiofabrication!
Reilly Neel Totally agree. I'm an old timer audio installer from the 90's, been doing this stuff for a very long time and I have to be honest, I probably learn one or two things from every one of Marks video's. Hats off to you Mark, you're definitely one of the best in the business right now. You've come such a long way from when you first started this channel.
Thanks Mark for these fundamentals. First upgrade path may likely be improving the ground runs from body, engine, etc to battery. And also alternator to battery 12v+. In other terms, the big-3 or 4. Also will require thought on fusing, terminals and size and routing. Also, determination if OEM alternator and wiring size will be adequate for the draw of the types and amounts of amps planned for the build. No need for a big 1/0 run if driving a P Six DSP or your AudioControl class-D amps, but something to consider if the plan is 2 or 3 Zapco Z-LX high power class AB amps with significantly more power draw. I’m powering two XD1000/5v2 amps fine from a single 4awg trunk run from battery.
I'd say alternator and "big 3" first, even if you don't necessarily need them for the first stereo install, you will have the groundwork for expansions and upgrades later. I have yet to install my first system, but from what I've seen on TH-cam, once you start down the custom car audio road, you're continually planning and upgrading, so seems good to start by having adequate power delivery in place.
Upgrade wiring first. A lot of factory electrical systems are held back by the cheap thin power wires the manufacturer uses to save money. Of course they are fine for the car in stock condition but once you add more current drawing equipment it's important to make sure the electrical system is prepped and up for the challenge. The obvious upgrades are the 'big 3' or 4 in some cases. 1) upgrade the connection from the batteries negative terminal to the the cars chassis. 2) upgrade the wire from the output of the alternator to the positive terminal of the battery. 3) add one or multiple additional wires from the engine block to the negative terminal of the battery 4) another wire going from the chassis of the alternator to the negative terminal of the battery, rather than relying on one or two bolts as the alternators negative connection. If you're doing all this it is important to make sure that you use high quality (ideally OFC) power cable, and that you have a really good ground connection going from the cars chassis to the negative terminal of your amplifiers.
I always lay my own speaker wiring. Always, even if leaving the factory radio. The only factory wiring I use is the power and negative, as these are enough for even most after-market radio.
1) upgrade the connection from batteries negative terminal to the cars chassis. But I have shunt because the car have star and stop sistem so i must get stronger shunt for stronger upgread but i can not get it. How to solve this?
If you understood how many cars these manufactures manufacture every single minute of every day at thousands of factories worldwide and how many hundreds of millions of miles of copper wire they save everyday by using 16 gauge wire over 14 gauge for speaker wire on each single vehicle you might be singing a different tune.
@@JasonHenderson Could you come up with a more irrelevant comment? Why the fuck would he sing a different tune exactly? It's no fucking question why the manufacturer uses less instead of more but thanks for the insight captain dipshit...I mean obvious..
@@bsfunk44 Keeping potatoes in the dark for too much time can make them poisonous. Now that was an irrelevant comment. Although Jasons comment didn't really give us any information that most us already didnt know it was still pretty relevant to the conversation.
Wiring should be the first. Factory grounding, and power wires from the alternator are usually pretty poor. They are good for the minimum requirements your car needs. Doing the big 3 wiring upgrade is essential, and frees a lot of power in the alternator. Wiring is key for anything electrical....especially proper grounding. I have 3 separate grounds custom made out of number two welding leads. And one extra power wire coming off a 300 amp alternator. I have an optimal yellow top battery, 0 guage 1/0 power wire feeding a 1200 watt NVX jad 1200.1 class D mono block amp, pushing a JL 13W7 AE 1.5 OHM dual voice coil sub. And the wiring is the key part of the entire system.
Not so many people knows what are they talking about, you in the contrary; really knows about your topic. Congratulations man!! Keep up with your nice channel.!!
Order of upgrades IMO. 1. Chassis Ground from frame to Negative battery post. And all return path positive cables attached to your system. 2. No larger than 1 Farad stiffening Capacitors. Larger capacity caps put a load on your alternator before the next hit. 3. Before you buy anything else make sure your box is actually correct for your subwoofer! Tune can dramatically affect box rise of several ohms and free up wattage. 4. A match set of AGM Batteries and an AGM battery tender so they don't sulfate during Discharge while you park for several days and stop the chemical reaction. 5. High Output Alternator.
1) what do you mean as match set of AGM batteries, as in 2 batteries that are both AGM or one lead acid and the other AGM? 2) I wanna put another battery in my car, I have an AGM in the garage but my car is lead acid. Can I pair those two and how do I pair them safely? (dont want my car catching on fire) 3) with a higher output alternator which puts out alot of amps, do i need to put a bigger fuse? As in 100 Amp fuse to a 300 Amp fuse?
thanks for your input bro ..im abut to run 8 12" old pioneers 4ohm dvc on 4 old school 1400.2 mmatts amps ,.... 8 6.5 highs 8 6x9 ...8 large tweeters and4 smalltweeters on 2 3000/4 channel ds18 and small prv amp on tweeters.. radio run small tweeters .. what batteries and cap ..amp alternator i shou use ..72' buick ..thanks inadvance
@knock904 XS Power. Has what are called Superbanks. These are beyond a capacitor. They are basically fast charger car battery replacements. I am now updating my recommendations to advice the high output mechman or JS alternator as the 1st more affordable option. First all grounds 2/0 Connect the alternator with at least 2/0 COPPER KNUKONCEPTZ. FUSE to 10% below the rating of the alternator. Then install the xs power superbank in place of your starting battery under the hood. Now relocate the largest xs power AGM that will fit inside the vehicle and fuse all connections for the wire amp rating. Xs power now gives appropriate watt handling on each battery and super bank.
alt and big 3 first overkill on the wire so when you go bigger and add more power and you will. lol you will be ready for it. I run two runs of 4/0 (positive and negative ) from the xs power in the front to the xs power batt in the rear. the batt in the back is also grounded to the frame. cant stress this enough but ground is your friend! the more grounds the better!
Russell Thomas The more/better your ground the less resistance and heat build up from resistance there will be therefore your alternator will have an easier time supplying its full voltage and current to you vehicles complete electrical system. Of course you want to make sure your positive cables are upgraded also. The original poster said he uses two runs of 4/0 for negative and positive and he also implies that he only has two batteries, he waisted a lot of money because I can guarantee you that if he only needs a second battery then he’s maybe running a 300 amp alternator and his system is probably around 5000w rms. One run of 4/0 would be more than enough to fully power a system that only requires one extra battery. Two runs of 1/0 would do the job perfectly. Honestly he’s probably full of shit. 4/0 awg wire is about the size of the stuff on residential power poles. Only a moron would waste that kind of cash on something so unnecessary. Hope I shed some light on things for you.
Insulation is the last priority for current carrying conductors for car audio use. You should always use cable sheaths regardless of which cable you're using in the engine bay.
Bro thank you so much for your videos life saver. These system places don’t tell you shit they sell you equipment that is bound to fail so you can keep coming back to them buying what you actually need piece by piece paying labor on top of each new piece. Means a lot!
I just bought a 12" Nightshade V4 to make my first system! I've dreamed of this day, finally make enough to afford it, but I want to do it right, so I thank you so much for your videos. I am learning so much!!!
Bro I have been to 5 different stereo places and I thought my issue was to upgrade the alternator and every place gave me different crap to do, thank u sooooo much!!!
@@CarAudioFabrication I love your work & love that car... I own a Pontiac Grand Prix GXP w/ the 5.3L motor... only thing that I hate, is how congested that area near the battery is. smh ... I swear it only like 2 or 3in between the battery [w/ upgraded cables] and the engine belt assembly.
My 2007 Hummer H3 already had 4 gauge wire at these 3 points from the factory. I did upgrade the battery terminals to gold plated and added a 1.5 farad capacitor. Using 0 gauge wire for power to the back at the power distribution block. Using a grounding distribution block on 8 gauge wire from the chassis. Been building systems since 1990 and this latest build on the Hummer is first time I've used a cap. I swear by them now. It was 30 bucks and did 3 things I was looking for. Kill noise. Stop headlight flickering. Clean up the bass to hit harder. That cap made COMPLETELY different performance out of my amps.
Id say the decision would be very car dependent. If your working on an older car, you might want to look at sprucing up the big 3 just to keep the old girl running! I have a 1990 LS400 so for me, the alternator could do with an upgrade and the wiring is probably shot too. As a general rule tho, battery1, earth strap/wiring2, altinator3
Big 4 .....1... B+ alt to positive batt....2....alt case to neg batt.......3.....upgrade neg batt wire to good tested ground....4...ground wire from engine to good tested ground on body... more ground the better......and you can also run neg wire from 2nd battery directly to first battery.
Hey. Nice work. The criteria i work towards in any upgrade on any project is.... The “proper” intersection of RESOURCES. TIME vs MONEY vs. GOAL vs REALITY
Mike Whitenton exactly. Gotta pay to play. Im upgrading my alternator this weekend and im only running one scv2000d on 2 SA 12s. Well, other than the sae 500.d on the mids and highs. Id rather be safe than sorry. Already got the proper wire.
Add a good ground to the back end housing of the alternator. They usually have an unused bolt hole and measure depth. Copper connector, flat washer, Star washer on bottom, lock washer on top = bolt length with 3-4 threads to spare. Dielectric grease is sold at home improvement stores in the auto section, pay twice that at parts store. Best price per oz. is your marine dealer. Get some and use it. Throw away the Red/Green felt things under the battery cables. The are tapered and different sizes. Please connect the battery the right way and cover the terminals with dielectric grease or petroleum jelly. This keeps hydrogen sulfide, oxygen and moisture in the air from oxidation. Buy the wire based upon the end cross-section of copper, not the thickness of PVC plastic melted over the wire when made. Create a ground wire that bolts to the alternator, engine, body and battery ground all one piece. Use copper pipe, hack-saw and buy a hammer type crimp tool. Cover all connections with dielectric grease and spend your money on the best multi-strand wire you can afford. At this point, an accurate amp clamp with a tested known good battery. Turn on everything in the vehicle and rev engine RPM’s to 2k. Take your measurement at the Red cable at B+ off the alternator. If impossible to get to, measure each Red from alternator to fuse/relay centers, add them up, compare with the alternators know output usually stamped on the alternators case. (Note; some vehicles have fuse/relay centers inside, under the back seat.) Once totaled up, find the amperage requirements for ALL stereo components. If 10% under the alternators output, add a 12 volt computer fan to the back of the alternator. Replace alternator with higher output if possible as many will not fit and may require longer $40 belt. A good battery at 100% state of health (Tested) requires only 0.2 of 1 amp to charge while driving unless you are in stop & go traffic all day. No need to upgrade wire from the alternators B+ as it is a waist of money. Spend your money wisely as I have laid out. Guaranteed. For those who don’t know what “RMS” means, in simpler terms, as told, A/C voltage is converted into DC (Direct Current). The diodes get hot doing this and the higher a constant output required shortens their life. (See Fan Comment) A/C voltage at a wall socket measures 172 volts positive & 172 volts negative. (+/_ 3-5 volts) To compare Apple to Apples, a mathematic formula give us “Root Means Squared”. This is the useable amount of A/C that does the same work of Direct Current. Just keeping it simple, but you can bank on it. ASE Master Tech since 1978 - Retired
Great vid, Mark! I like the way you emphasized each section of the car's electric system, including wiring and the car's chassis. I did not worry, but if I did, that look in your eyes would have put it all to rest.
I lucked out on my car 2012 Chevy Cruze LTZ turbo, it came from the factory with a high output alternator and big 4 already. I added one XS power XP3000 in the trunk and my voltage drop is non existent on 2 DC audio amps. DC 2k and 90.4. I actually over did it on the battery, but I wanted room to grow and get a 5k later. I’m gonna try it and if I have any voltage drop I will add another XP3000 to stiffen it up. Now I do charge the battery’s every couple of days just to keep my alternator from kicking on a lot and put less strain on it.
#1) Wiring. If you're planning on upgrading to a big system you need proper wiring to avoid "bottle necking" the flow of electricity. Bigger wires means more electric flow to the system being built. The big 3 is commonly known to be the wires in question. I'd like to see more information on wiring and how it's possible to upgrade. #2) Battary and alternator. Need both in sync at all times I would also like to hear about pros and cons on wiring in series or parellel. How to design a system with respect to one another. Great videos, love the detail and considerations. Shows how much thought goes into a build and your videos/channel!
Mark that was a great video on touching the bases of upgrading your cars electrical before installing a sound system!!! 👍👍👍 I personally believe that anybody should upgrade there cars electrical when running a system that will be 1000 watts RMS or more!!! I have always started by upgrading my battery, alternator and finally doing the BIG 3 upgrade!!! After that I calculate the total RMS watts that I will be running to determine how many secondary batteries I will need to install in the back of my car!!! That's just the method I have always used before doing a car audio install and it has seemed to work for me!!! Many people have other different methods of upgrading their electrical, so hopefully I didn't leave anything out!!! Once again great video!!! 👍👍👍
Take it from me . I had a cresento 2000 bc and sundown x12 on stock 90 amp alternator and wiring. It sucks . Not very loud at all. Upgraded my alternator and wiring and dam huge difference
The foundation of a system is the key to all future builds. The big 3 upgrade is is part of the foundation but there is plenty of information on this; next would be the power plant. Explanation and options for an alternator upgrade would be invaluable.
Without a doubt the most influential to sound upgrade is the alternator. 25 years messing around in car audio and I've seen so many systems with thousands of watt amps multiple batteries that they've spent thousands of dollars on and have everything connected to the factory 80Amp to depending on the vehicle maybe 160 amp alternator and before I ask any question about their system I ask what alternator did you upgrade with? And 8 out of 10 at least say I haven't, which just absolutely baffles me because if you're going to spend thousands of dollars in batteries alone and on that amplifier what's the point if you don't have the amperage that's going to push them? Furthermore they put all those batteries in there they don't put a battery cutoffwonder why they are going through an alternator every year but yet continue to buy factory remanufactured rebuilt whatever you want to call it factory alternator. Every single one of them I tell after asking them how much they spent on all those batteries of which unless it's only one extra battery most of the time they have spent more than what they would have going to Mechman and buying a high amp alternator and if they would have gone and spent the money on the alternator they would have been getting a lot higher volume, more SPL, more overall power and could have got all of it for likely less $
My grandpa used to always tell us the first thing you should do when you buy a vehicle is upgrade to literally the best battery you can get to fit in it and get the best lifetime warranty so if we are ever straightened it's not the battery. So from an audio standpoint the alternator, and again best one that will fit with the lifetime warranty.
I would say after confirming that the electrical system can handle the upgrades, I would add a sub to start and then work on sound proofing, that way you get a big difference at first then you do the things people dont think about.
0:36 AFAIK, the alternator's job is to keep the battery charged, not to run everything on the car when it's running . Yes it can keep the car running if the battery is removed, but this is only when the car is 100% stock. Sometimes they are a bit more powerful than the power demand of full car's features turned on, but when the power demand surpasses the power-generation rate of the alternator, the battery helps it out. This is proven when someone blasts music with their sound equipment on their idling car with no electrical upgrades , and then they turn off the car only to find a dead battery when trying to restart it.
Nah man, the alternator is supplying power to everything up until it runs out of capacity then the battery is used as a reserve. The reason is the voltage coming from the alternator is a little bit higher than the resting voltage of the battery. You can see this when the bass hits hard and your lights dim. The voltage drops to what the battery can produce at the given current draw.
Something to consider is voltage drop over oem cables. The cables are mean to transport the power, not consume it, they'll always take a little but not more than half a volt, to me more than .2 volts is too much. If you're hijacking positive from the fuse box you will want to consider volt drop over the cable that feeds it under load. You wont get an accurate volt drop unless you have a full load on what you're testing
Good video Mark, in the next one could you also look at how modern vehicles monitor the power output from the alternator? i've read about newer vehicles that have the alternator wire pass through some type of coil that sends a signal to the vehicles computer.
4:01 I agree in the future if you want to go all fancy, but a 24 dollar dual din from walmart with built in RCAs and bluetooth is just as good, but good alternative to those who prefer to stay stock, very helpful info btw 🤙🏼
1. Wiring - cheapest mod and allows the system to handle more power. 2. Alternator - takes strain off the battery and increases total available power per time unit 3. Capacitor - to absorb the power spikes without putting strain on the battery. Capacitors are made recharge and discharge quickly. 4. Battery - to provide electricity while the engine is off or idling, since then the Alternator doesn't not provide power or sufficient power.
Kai van der Bijl that’s just if you have a unregulated amp then you will see a few more what’s but you want hear any difference. Now if you got a regulated amp like my JL HD1200/1’s it want matter as long as your feeding it enough to make it power your good but it want make any more no matter how much your over 12.5 volts.
3. Capacitor - to absorb the power spikes without putting strain on the battery. Capacitors are made recharge and discharge quickly. -lol, did you ever make some measurements of that? Capacitor only works for first 10 seconds ,after it gives out all his power ,it need to charge again it takes a lot of power from battery and alternator -makes everything even worst... I am talking about those 1-3 farad capacitors witch is just a marketing and waste of money.... look at some pro installs-non of them use a capacitor and if they do,than its around 50-100 capacitors.... this is just a my opinion. sorry for my language
for hard bass pulse a Cap is nice because it is the fastes, but then the alternator must charge the cap and must provide the bass. if you run the system hard a cap will help your car
I used 4guage ofc pure copper wire for my power and ground to my distribution block and a ct sounds 2000.1 d for two kicker comps wired to two ohms. I also incorporated a 2500 watt capacitor on that distribution block and grounded both to the chassis of course. I used a sealed enclosure underneath the backseat of my ram 1500 crew cab but had to raise the back seats an inch and a half. I used an audiocontrol LC2I pro as well. Just breaking the subs in now. I also used a good bit of killmat in the box and in the rear of my truck. It sounds amazing.
I know this is an old post but I've been looking into the ecoflow line of generators and wanted to know if you've done any research on the alternator charger they currently offer and one of their generators as a second battery for systems. Their alternator charger puts out like 800 watts from your system and can recharge any one of their power stations very quickly while your vehicle is running and since the generator can put out 12 volts in theory it should be able to power your system and depending on the size could possibly power it for sometime if your vehicle is off... They sponsor a lot of TH-camrs and I trust you the most for my car audio needs so maybe you can get with them and see about getting one of their units and testing it out so you could help us less trained people out 😂
What is more important than doing the big three is clean mounting. Over time the grounding wire can become covered with oil, dirt, and corrosion where it connects. Sometimes replacing your ground wire with a new one, and/or cleaning the contact point will help more then anything else. You also need to make sure your battery and battery box is clean. A dirty battery or battery box can kill your battery and cause a parasitic draw on the battery.
Now, I always try to overkill whenever possible so that I don't get cornered with higher audio demand but I have grounds running all over the vehicle just for added measure. Not to mention, no positive cable or wire is running without a fuse be it ANL or regular fuses. By overkill I mean 3 AGM batteries and a 390A HO alternator when really I'm just pushing 1600w RMS. Really nice when the voltage stays constant. My first step would be a high output alternator with the big 3 to support the extra load then get a battery.
1st, you would calculate the additional power draw, at peak for the components you will be using. Then consider the power output of the alternator, then decide if you will be using more or less then the current system, also dont forget to add in the normal consumption of the car, with everything you could use at 1 time (unless you dont plan on driving or using air conditioning etc while showing off your air pumpers). How do you decide, well if your power drain is going to be the same or close to the same as the alternator output, you need to upgrade the alternator because it will overwork it, you could add a battery but then you will have down time while you recharge them. A cap pack would also do it, but again, they have to be recharged after usage. That would help if you only go over the power output of the alternator at peek times, and have enough left over from the alternator to recharge them after its used. If you are using more, you need the same, upgrade the alternator, to consider if you actually want/need multiple batteries, in my opinion, additional batteries are only effective when your power consumption is peeking which is while your amps are at their most power usage. The amps will draw way faster then any alternator system but primarily at peek times. So you will need a little extra juice to get through that, and to be able to recharge that used juice while not at peek.
Upgrade the big 3 first. You would see a huge boot from your stock electrical, then depending on you motive behind the build either and alternator or a cap bank.
Number one upgrade should always include wiring considerations. Unfortunately, CCA (Copper-Clad Aluminum) has only served to muddy the waters of this upgrade. OFC (Oxygen-Free Copper) is the most economical, energy-efficient, most durable wiring solution.
so in this video you said you would talk more about alternators and when to up grade it and when not to. A fallow up would be nice as you are my go to guy when i'm seeking info about my install
I’ve learned a lot from your channel and appreciate all your effort that goes into making these videos. I’ve ordered everything to do the “Big 3 Upgrade” on my 2008 Honda Ridgeline. I am curious as to why the power wire from the alternator to the battery positive isn’t fused in two locations, as close as possible to the alternator and the battery. If the wire were to be compromised and blow the fuse at the alternator, wouldn’t the section of wire coming from the battery positive still be hot and potentially cause a hazard? I’ve never seen anyone do that, but it stands to reason that a broken 1/0 wire coming from the battery positive wouldn’t be good.
Great intro Vid! Having sucked my system dry, adding a second battery & still killed batteries, the alternator is certainly of vital importance. Work From the ground Up! Deck (head unit) sends the Signal, Alternator sends the Power! Thats where i would start if i were starting fresh 🤘
Here is the order I chose : 1. After market radio or dsp for high to low conversion. 2. Sub Amplifier , Subwoofer , 1/0 gauge power , ground and big 4 not 3 . 3. New dual battery setup ( both new batteries not adding one new ) 4. New mids and highs 5 . Power Amp for new mids and highs and a Clarion EQ if using aftermarket radio instead of DSP for factory for low level output to subs , and full range amps . 6. High output alternator to match needs of all new amplifiers installed . NOTE : SOME VEHICLES HAVE CRAP ALTERNATORS FROM FACTORY AND SOME COME WITH SOMEWHAT HIGHER AMPERAGE ALTERNATORS . IF YOUR VEHICLES ALTERNATOR IS A LOW AMPERAGE ALTERNATOR YOU WILL NEED TO UPGRADE THE ALTERNATOR AT THE SAME TIME AS ADDING A HIGH POWER SUB AMP "OVER 1000 WATTS RMS" OR SOON AFTER TO PREVENT DAMAGE TO SUBWOOFERS , AMPLIFIER AND CAR ELECTRICAL SYSTEM .
A good battery is important to start. Without it nothing happens. The wire must be sufficient to carry the required power to each component. I've watched wires melt under a friend's hood and it continued towards the stereo so a fuse at the battery is highly recommended also. Just to start I personally think this and the alternator and if I will need a capacitor and if I do what rating. That's just to start planning in my book.
Do you have any videos explaining alternator load. Stain an why its best to change alternator even testing or what alternator is best to buy. Thanks CAF
Get a deep cycle battery and replace your stock alt with a new one if you aren't going to upgrade to a high output alt and are driving a car that's 10+ years old. Change the belt too if it's been a while, this isn't normal wear and tear, this is gung ho guns blazing. That way you keep your ride dependable. Don't wait for your stock alt to fail, replace it every 2-3 years. Worth it when compared to needing a tow or changing an alt on the side of the highway and being late for work, or worse if you don't know how and have to pay a shop. Personally I use a 2 farad cap to soften the draw from the amp, so to smooth out the voltage spikes. But keep in mind that there are cap banks that can exceed battery banks for what they were intended for: Burping builds. Finding high out put alts is a pain in the ass, especially when you find out they don't make one for your car, or it's going to cost an arm and a leg and might not even fit properly.
I would start with grounding. Finding the best path helps alot. I have also added more grounding straps to the vehicle to help it out. And cleaning the existing ones helps alot too.
On one of the other channels around here somewhere, the guy was noting sanding down the area and also using a dialectric grease to keep it from rusting in the future. I've lucked out though and never had any ground issues on installs I've done. (Can't say the same for the one single time I was lazy and paid a shop for an install. never again!).
1st... know how much power you need, check and upgrade battery, alternator and main power circuits according to your total amp usage. Ground and positive. I think one should have 20% more amperage then you will use with all electrical being operated at one time, including air conditioning. Heater, wiper motor, ect. Thank you
Good question! I feel like the answer is different for certain situations but the first thing I do when I get a vehicle is clean and upgrade the grounds. Upgrading the charge wire on a stock alternator is kind of silly. When you upgrade the alternator, is usually the time for that.
thornygravy prior to upgrading the big three on my car the absolute most my alt would put out was 14.2 volts after upgrading it instantly put out up to 14.6 I don't even know what that would translate to in amps but to call it a silly upgrade is just plain silly
Your alternator very well could have been putting out more amps at 14.2 then it currently is at 14.6.. But just for you I'll make a correction "kind of silly, assuming the stock charge wire is in good condition (connections are clean and tight, wire isn't damaged, etc)."
I could say my boss amp is underrated but that doesn't mean anything if I don't have proof, your point of my alt putting out more amps prior makes no sense as all that happened was 14 year old 8 gage wiring was replaced with 0 gauge welding cable, nothing whatsoever changed with the alt itself therefor it's output didn't change it just has less loss enroute to my battery, if you want to tell me I'm wrong give me some actual facts and science
Teegan Cathcart, Hey, an increase of 0.4volts! You go, bro! Question: do you notice the voltage more stable now than before? The voltage increase could be your new cable has less resistance, not just because of the larger conductor area, but the actual resistance of the metal conductor itself, allowing a slightly higher Voltage to push the pixies. Conductor size is only beneficial when you are pulling enough current (amps) to warrant the larger conductor. An increase in Voltage does not necessarily mean an increase in power if your alternator is at the limit of the amount of current it can supply. The real test is, how does your voltage hold up when your system is pounding with your headlights, and AC on? To calculate your amps, you would need to know your systems total power draw, in watts. Use Ohm's Law. Watts/volts= amps.
A circuit breaker at the battery and 1/0 cable for pwr and battery ground, this should be the first upgrade for systems under 1500watts rms, this will allow for future upgrades for most people
I'm guessing a good starting point is the alternator for most people because that's where most of the power usually used originates from. That's all assuming that you have already upgraded things jn your system that have been lacking like line output converters, better head units and higher efficiency amplifiers. All of which will probably be less expensive to start with than tackling a high output alternator/battery/or wiring if you are not doing it yourself
January Morris if you don’t upgrade the wires before putting in a HO alternator, it is the same as putting a high pressure pump on a garden hose. Remember, current flows through the wire while voltage passes across the wire. Increased wire diameter means more current flow due to less resistance and less stress (pressure) on the insulation. If that doesn’t work, try second battery isolated from primary battery with relay/solenoid so that your car system is pulling from primary battery and audio system is pulling from secondary. And it is key to ensure that your batteries are same class and are each new so that you do not have one fighting to keep charge balanced on the older one.
Installing thick AF power and grounds. I would say go bigger than needed in case of power upgrades later.Last build I ran a 0 gauge power and grounds from the front battery to the back and later switched the ground to a second power wire. I've already done a mechman alt and second battery. Unfortunately my Grand Prix has a electronic throttle body and responds to low voltage and dips with low rpms from closing the throttle plate, which only compounds my voltage problem
I think something that every car stereo install should have is a good line out converter. One that reduces noise and distortion, doesn't add distortion. lol. Yes, most do, so know your device and who is making it. So reduce any distortion in the signal, and then boost the signal. That really helps any stereo system without spending a great deal of money. And it's true Audio Control makes some very good to great line output converters. It's a game changer I think in sound quality. Using a combination of analog with digital processing gets you the best sound quality, one that is warm,smooth., accurate. "Hi-Fidelity is in the numbers". Honest numbers that is.
You should definitly start out the cables and do a big three upgrade if your battery is'nt old and really bad. After the cables you should upgrade the battery and if necessary put another one in there. If you need more power than that, you should upgrade the alternator.
Great video. Quick question , I have a second battery in the rear, I ran a 0gauge from battery to battery. But I've melted the fuse in the line once. Will adding another run of 0gauge help dissipate the heat? How do I avoid this from happening
Thanks for keeping his videos. Very interesting you keep meat glue to the television screen or Peter screen lol I keep up the great work. Thanks for a great personality to.😊
The first thing I would do is upgrade the Big 3. As others have pointed out in the comments, make sure that when you upgrade that you use the correct sized fuse for the amount of load that the audio system will be capable of. Not doing this is asking for a disaster.
do you have a video on wiring only? best gauges to use, for what and where? best material for running your upgraded system? what is the best wire to use from your battery to your Amp? what kind of wires to we wat to push from our Amp to Sub/ or subs?
I'm kinda new to the way systems are installed today as compared to 30 plus years ago. I can install just about any system but my question revolves around doing the big 3 to a 2012 Chevrolet Traverse. The main battery sits in the floor board of the back right passenger compartment.
2500 in the trunk. Upgraded 105 amp alt to a 140 amp Upgraded all ground wires from 8 to 2 gauge Added ground from neg to frame Added ground from alt to frame Upgraded alt + wire to 2 gauge to batt 2 Upgraded CCA batt 1 to 980 cca from 650 980 Batt feeds to 2, 4 farad caps. Power nevwr drops, spent around 250
The first thing I would do is to replace the battery if it isn't in good condition - it's no good to do any upgrades if you can't start the car. Assuming that the alternator is serviceable, the next thing to do is upgrade the alternator wiring - red sheathed (positive) wire directly to the battery positive terminal via an appropriately sized fuse and adding a ground (black sheathed) from the alternator body to the negative battery terminal. I went with #2 AWG since I believe that would be more than adequate for me. The "Big 4" upgrades say to upgrade the engine block ground but I don't see how that is helpful if you add a large ground wire (per the Big 4 upgrade tutorials) from the alternator body to the battery since the alternator is mounted to the engine with metallic supports - seems redundant to me. The alternator should be upgraded depending on the electrical load.
Crikies...what kinda power are you talking? I've run texas star 250 watt kickers with no issues with my Galaxy 99's and talk to just about anyone that I can hear across the country. When combined with a 102" whip or a Wilson 2 or 5000 they did amazingly well. Of course, when the skip is really pounding, I'm in awe when one ol boy keys up and it's nothing but him on the air! I bet you're that ol boy! How big is your Palomar? lol
Honestly Mark, I usually go for upgrading the ground. I find it to be the most overlooked thing when it comes to big power systems. Far to often do I see someone who ran a 0 gauge power wire to their amp only to use a body ground in the trunk. When you look under the hood the factory ground to the engine and battery to nothing more than an 8 gauge strap.
Tyler Andrews all you got to do is check it with a meter. If you get zero ohms your good don’t matter where it’s wired to. I have mine wired to the body and the battery so I know I’m good. But I have a XS power XP3000 in my trunk so my wires to my amp are dual runs of XS flex OFC 14” inches from the amp.
Love watching your vidios it's the most informative car audio vid's out there really explaining everything in detail THE BEST VIDIOS to learn and conker car audio thank you for tacking the time to do all these vidios for all of us dumb dumbs jk ..... please do a vidio on all the best car batteries top of the top best of the best battery for extreme car audio builds
Hey Mark, do you or will you ever do a subwoofer wall build or tutorial? I'm looking to build one but i havent gotten the electrical plans quite down to run power to rear batteries and amps. Whadd'ya think
For people who just UPGRADE to aftermarket radio and new mids and highs stock wiring is fine . I always suggest upgrading wiring to the step before adding amplifiers.
Find all of your car's grounds and clean them. Not just the ones you use for your amplifiers and battery, but the others as well. And that's a free upgrade.
The alternator is the mitochondria of the car.
Nobody likes a know it all vacuole.. mmm kay ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Nerd! )))
I hate that I understood that 😂
Now I understand. 😳
It also charges the battery. When it's got the mitochondrias full
You should write a book for real. I would love to be able to turn to a detailed chapter with diagrams instead of searching through TH-cam for the info. I'd buy the hell out of it
Such a good idea
I was just wondering when does a purchase go from just buying a product and transforms into buying the hell out of something. Is it actually buying more than one just to be able to say you have more than one. Or is it buying more than one in case you want to read it again and want to turn the pages with the same crispness as you did with the first book... Or is it that you are now thinking about what you wrote and think to yourself danggummit there I go again .... typing with my hand in fast forward while my peanut size brain is in rewind. And now saying to yourself ....I'm such a Kenny.. (in case you are wondering... a Kenny is an idiot or a person with a peanut size brain that is always in rewind while everything else is in fastforward.)
@@timothygodwin1189 wow u put alot of time and thought into this one just for me to say its just and expression used to inphasis the want or need for something in an urgent manner.
I enjoy the way you communicate your message. You don't curse your viewers nor belittle them. You could have sold these videos on DVD and book form, called it an audio installation series and charged for it but you didn't. Thank you for the entertainment and education. Keep em comin bro
I'm 46 years old. I've never heard a more perfect explanation of anything before! You, sir are inspiring me to put a system in a 95 camry! You are an excellent communicator!
Get on it!
I full heartily agree.
Love those cars
I just decided to upgrade my car audio. I had a buddy help me do this in the past. It was shotty at best. I set out to find out how to do this and I've been searching the net for weeks trying to piece it all together, so I don't buy twice. I found your channel and watched 3 videos so far. Man, you've answered so many questions and will probably give me back hours and hours of time I would have spent researching. I appreciate you and the content you make. Rockstar!
Big 3 first, especially if you plan on re-locating the battery or adding batteries/ultracaps! Great cables/wiring adds efficiency and helps you “find” additional power that you didn’t know you had.
Absolutely love this channel, one of the few which are still putting out daily car audio content. Everything is always super informative as well, especially for people just starting their car audio passion. Amazing work caraudiofabrication!
Reilly Neel
Totally agree.
I'm an old timer audio installer from the 90's, been doing this stuff for a very long time and I have to be honest, I probably learn one or two things from every one of Marks video's.
Hats off to you Mark, you're definitely one of the best in the business right now. You've come such a long way from when you first started this channel.
Thanks Mark for these fundamentals.
First upgrade path may likely be improving the ground runs from body, engine, etc to battery. And also alternator to battery 12v+. In other terms, the big-3 or 4. Also will require thought on fusing, terminals and size and routing. Also, determination if OEM alternator and wiring size will be adequate for the draw of the types and amounts of amps planned for the build. No need for a big 1/0 run if driving a P Six DSP or your AudioControl class-D amps, but something to consider if the plan is 2 or 3 Zapco Z-LX high power class AB amps with significantly more power draw. I’m powering two XD1000/5v2 amps fine from a single 4awg trunk run from battery.
I'd say alternator and "big 3" first, even if you don't necessarily need them for the first stereo install, you will have the groundwork for expansions and upgrades later. I have yet to install my first system, but from what I've seen on TH-cam, once you start down the custom car audio road, you're continually planning and upgrading, so seems good to start by having adequate power delivery in place.
Upgrade wiring first.
A lot of factory electrical systems are held back by the cheap thin power wires the manufacturer uses to save money.
Of course they are fine for the car in stock condition but once you add more current drawing equipment it's important to make sure the electrical system is prepped and up for the challenge.
The obvious upgrades are the 'big 3' or 4 in some cases.
1) upgrade the connection from the batteries negative terminal to the the cars chassis.
2) upgrade the wire from the output of the alternator to the positive terminal of the battery.
3) add one or multiple additional wires from the engine block to the negative terminal of the battery
4) another wire going from the chassis of the alternator to the negative terminal of the battery, rather than relying on one or two bolts as the alternators negative connection.
If you're doing all this it is important to make sure that you use high quality (ideally OFC) power cable, and that you have a really good ground connection going from the cars chassis to the negative terminal of your amplifiers.
I always lay my own speaker wiring. Always, even if leaving the factory radio. The only factory wiring I use is the power and negative, as these are enough for even most after-market radio.
1) upgrade the connection from batteries negative terminal to the cars chassis. But I have shunt because the car have star and stop sistem so i must get stronger shunt for stronger upgread but i can not get it. How to solve this?
If you understood how many cars these manufactures manufacture every single minute of every day at thousands of factories worldwide and how many hundreds of millions of miles of copper wire they save everyday by using 16 gauge wire over 14 gauge for speaker wire on each single vehicle you might be singing a different tune.
@@JasonHenderson Could you come up with a more irrelevant comment? Why the fuck would he sing a different tune exactly? It's no fucking question why the manufacturer uses less instead of more but thanks for the insight captain dipshit...I mean obvious..
@@bsfunk44 Keeping potatoes in the dark for too much time can make them poisonous.
Now that was an irrelevant comment. Although Jasons comment didn't really give us any information that most us already didnt know it was still pretty relevant to the conversation.
Wiring should be the first. Factory grounding, and power wires from the alternator are usually pretty poor. They are good for the minimum requirements your car needs. Doing the big 3 wiring upgrade is essential, and frees a lot of power in the alternator. Wiring is key for anything electrical....especially proper grounding. I have 3 separate grounds custom made out of number two welding leads. And one extra power wire coming off a 300 amp alternator. I have an optimal yellow top battery, 0 guage 1/0 power wire feeding a 1200 watt NVX jad 1200.1 class D mono block amp, pushing a JL 13W7 AE 1.5 OHM dual voice coil sub. And the wiring is the key part of the entire system.
Not so many people knows what are they talking about, you in the contrary; really knows about your topic. Congratulations man!! Keep up with your nice channel.!!
Order of upgrades IMO.
1. Chassis Ground from frame to Negative battery post. And all return path positive cables attached to your system.
2. No larger than 1 Farad stiffening Capacitors. Larger capacity caps put a load on your alternator before the next hit.
3. Before you buy anything else make sure your box is actually correct for your subwoofer!
Tune can dramatically affect box rise of several ohms and free up wattage.
4. A match set of AGM Batteries and an AGM battery tender so they don't sulfate during Discharge while you park for several days and stop the chemical reaction.
5. High Output Alternator.
1) what do you mean as match set of AGM batteries, as in 2 batteries that are both AGM or one lead acid and the other AGM?
2) I wanna put another battery in my car, I have an AGM in the garage but my car is lead acid. Can I pair those two and how do I pair them safely? (dont want my car catching on fire)
3) with a higher output alternator which puts out alot of amps, do i need to put a bigger fuse? As in 100 Amp fuse to a 300 Amp fuse?
@@anthonypietersz6774 matching batteries as in you order 2
thanks for your input bro ..im abut to run 8 12" old pioneers 4ohm dvc on 4 old school 1400.2 mmatts amps ,.... 8 6.5 highs 8 6x9 ...8 large tweeters and4 smalltweeters on 2 3000/4 channel ds18 and small prv amp on tweeters.. radio run small tweeters .. what batteries and cap ..amp alternator i shou use ..72' buick ..thanks inadvance
@knock904 XS Power. Has what are called Superbanks. These are beyond a capacitor. They are basically fast charger car battery replacements. I am now updating my recommendations to advice the high output mechman or JS alternator as the 1st more affordable option.
First all grounds 2/0
Connect the alternator with at least 2/0 COPPER KNUKONCEPTZ. FUSE to 10% below the rating of the alternator.
Then install the xs power superbank in place of your starting battery under the hood. Now relocate the largest xs power AGM that will fit inside the vehicle and fuse all connections for the wire amp rating.
Xs power now gives appropriate watt handling on each battery and super bank.
I upgraded my battery alternater and did the big three in one day. Big difference
alt and big 3 first overkill on the wire so when you go bigger and add more power and you will. lol
you will be ready for it.
I run two runs of 4/0 (positive and negative ) from the xs power in the front to the xs power batt in the rear.
the batt in the back is also grounded to the frame.
cant stress this enough but ground is your friend!
the more grounds the better!
Why more grounds? Why does it make it better?
Russell Thomas The more/better your ground the less resistance and heat build up from resistance there will be therefore your alternator will have an easier time supplying its full voltage and current to you vehicles complete electrical system. Of course you want to make sure your positive cables are upgraded also. The original poster said he uses two runs of 4/0 for negative and positive and he also implies that he only has two batteries, he waisted a lot of money because I can guarantee you that if he only needs a second battery then he’s maybe running a 300 amp alternator and his system is probably around 5000w rms. One run of 4/0 would be more than enough to fully power a system that only requires one extra battery. Two runs of 1/0 would do the job perfectly. Honestly he’s probably full of shit. 4/0 awg wire is about the size of the stuff on residential power poles. Only a moron would waste that kind of cash on something so unnecessary. Hope I shed some light on things for you.
Insulation is the last priority for current carrying conductors for car audio use. You should always use cable sheaths regardless of which cable you're using in the engine bay.
Chassis upgrade can give pretty sick results. Once went from a pt cruiser to a merc c300. Pretty substantial :)
Bro thank you so much for your videos life saver. These system places don’t tell you shit they sell you equipment that is bound to fail so you can keep coming back to them buying what you actually need piece by piece paying labor on top of each new piece. Means a lot!
I just bought a 12" Nightshade V4 to make my first system! I've dreamed of this day, finally make enough to afford it, but I want to do it right, so I thank you so much for your videos. I am learning so much!!!
Bro I have been to 5 different stereo places and I thought my issue was to upgrade the alternator and every place gave me different crap to do, thank u sooooo much!!!
First upgrade is to install a Tesla coil and hope for the best.
+Michael Melton Faraday loops all day every day
Lmfao
@@CarAudioFabrication I love your work & love that car... I own a Pontiac Grand Prix GXP w/ the 5.3L motor... only thing that I hate, is how congested that area near the battery is. smh ... I swear it only like 2 or 3in between the battery [w/ upgraded cables] and the engine belt assembly.
Very professional, practical / friendly advice. Greatly appreciated, CAF!
I found adding a 1.21 Gigawatt flux capacitor always helps.... :-p
"1 point 21 gigawatts!? 1 point 21 gigawatts. 1 point 21 gigawatts!!!!"
"What the hell is a gigawatt!!!?"
I can hear doc🤣😂
Great Scott!
I thought he always said jiggawatt
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
My 2007 Hummer H3 already had 4 gauge wire at these 3 points from the factory. I did upgrade the battery terminals to gold plated and added a 1.5 farad capacitor. Using 0 gauge wire for power to the back at the power distribution block. Using a grounding distribution block on 8 gauge wire from the chassis. Been building systems since 1990 and this latest build on the Hummer is first time I've used a cap. I swear by them now. It was 30 bucks and did 3 things I was looking for. Kill noise. Stop headlight flickering. Clean up the bass to hit harder. That cap made COMPLETELY different performance out of my amps.
Christopher Waggoner capacitors are junk and if it’s cheap it’ll limit power. Throw it away and add a battery.
Id say the decision would be very car dependent. If your working on an older car, you might want to look at sprucing up the big 3 just to keep the old girl running! I have a 1990 LS400 so for me, the alternator could do with an upgrade and the wiring is probably shot too. As a general rule tho, battery1, earth strap/wiring2, altinator3
Big 4 .....1... B+ alt to positive batt....2....alt case to neg batt.......3.....upgrade neg batt wire to good tested ground....4...ground wire from engine to good tested ground on body... more ground the better......and you can also run neg wire from 2nd battery directly to first battery.
Thanks bro. Add in the calculation for amp watts rms to battery amp hours needed. Forget what Doug says, keep doing you. I love it
What is this calculation
@@brapbrapmafucka add up the total amperage draw of the added accessories to determine how much alternator amperage and battery storage
Hey.
Nice work.
The criteria i work towards in any upgrade on any project is....
The “proper” intersection of RESOURCES.
TIME vs MONEY vs. GOAL vs REALITY
Upgrade your wallet first.
Mike Whitenton so true when going over 500 rms, money goes so quick.
Mike Whitenton exactly. Gotta pay to play. Im upgrading my alternator this weekend and im only running one scv2000d on 2 SA 12s. Well, other than the sae 500.d on the mids and highs. Id rather be safe than sorry. Already got the proper wire.
This is. Facts must. Have a better job to do anything over 500
Lol
I have my big goron wallet, what now?
Add a good ground to the back end housing of the alternator. They usually have an unused bolt hole and measure depth. Copper connector, flat washer, Star washer on bottom, lock washer on top = bolt length with 3-4 threads to spare. Dielectric grease is sold at home improvement stores in the auto section, pay twice that at parts store. Best price per oz. is your marine dealer. Get some and use it. Throw away the Red/Green felt things under the battery cables. The are tapered and different sizes. Please connect the battery the right way and cover the terminals with dielectric grease or petroleum jelly. This keeps hydrogen sulfide, oxygen and moisture in the air from oxidation.
Buy the wire based upon the end cross-section of copper, not the thickness of PVC plastic melted over the wire when made. Create a ground wire that bolts to the alternator, engine, body and battery ground all one piece. Use copper pipe, hack-saw and buy a hammer type crimp tool. Cover all connections with dielectric grease and spend your money on the best multi-strand wire you can afford.
At this point, an accurate amp clamp with a tested known good battery. Turn on everything in the vehicle and rev engine RPM’s to 2k. Take your measurement at the Red cable at B+ off the alternator. If impossible to get to, measure each Red from alternator to fuse/relay centers, add them up, compare with the alternators know output usually stamped on the alternators case. (Note; some vehicles have fuse/relay centers inside, under the back seat.)
Once totaled up, find the amperage requirements for ALL stereo components. If 10% under the alternators output, add a 12 volt computer fan to the back of the alternator. Replace alternator with higher output if possible as many will not fit and may require longer $40 belt.
A good battery at 100% state of health (Tested) requires only 0.2 of 1 amp to charge while driving unless you are in stop & go traffic all day. No need to upgrade wire from the alternators B+ as it is a waist of money. Spend your money wisely as I have laid out. Guaranteed. For those who don’t know what “RMS” means, in simpler terms, as told, A/C voltage is converted into DC (Direct Current). The diodes get hot doing this and the higher a constant output required shortens their life. (See Fan Comment) A/C voltage at a wall socket measures 172 volts positive & 172 volts negative. (+/_ 3-5 volts)
To compare Apple to Apples, a mathematic formula give us “Root Means Squared”. This is the useable amount of A/C that does the same work of Direct Current. Just keeping it simple, but you can bank on it.
ASE Master Tech since 1978 - Retired
Great vid, Mark! I like the way you emphasized each section of the car's electric system, including wiring and the car's chassis. I did not worry, but if I did, that look in your eyes would have put it all to rest.
I lucked out on my car 2012 Chevy Cruze LTZ turbo, it came from the factory with a high output alternator and big 4 already. I added one XS power XP3000 in the trunk and my voltage drop is non existent on 2 DC audio amps. DC 2k and 90.4. I actually over did it on the battery, but I wanted room to grow and get a 5k later. I’m gonna try it and if I have any voltage drop I will add another XP3000 to stiffen it up. Now I do charge the battery’s every couple of days just to keep my alternator from kicking on a lot and put less strain on it.
#1) Wiring. If you're planning on upgrading to a big system you need proper wiring to avoid "bottle necking" the flow of electricity. Bigger wires means more electric flow to the system being built. The big 3 is commonly known to be the wires in question. I'd like to see more information on wiring and how it's possible to upgrade.
#2) Battary and alternator. Need both in sync at all times
I would also like to hear about pros and cons on wiring in series or parellel. How to design a system with respect to one another.
Great videos, love the detail and considerations. Shows how much thought goes into a build and your videos/channel!
Mark that was a great video on touching the bases of upgrading your cars electrical before installing a sound system!!! 👍👍👍 I personally believe that anybody should upgrade there cars electrical when running a system that will be 1000 watts RMS or more!!! I have always started by upgrading my battery, alternator and finally doing the BIG 3 upgrade!!! After that I calculate the total RMS watts that I will be running to determine how many secondary batteries I will need to install in the back of my car!!! That's just the method I have always used before doing a car audio install and it has seemed to work for me!!! Many people have other different methods of upgrading their electrical, so hopefully I didn't leave anything out!!! Once again great video!!! 👍👍👍
Take it from me . I had a cresento 2000 bc and sundown x12 on stock 90 amp alternator and wiring. It sucks . Not very loud at all. Upgraded my alternator and wiring and dam huge difference
For the younger generation, the Alternator is the streaming download speed and the battery is the buffer. Simple! You're welcome.
Hahaha
I'm into car audio but I'm also going to college for IT, this is amazing lol
The foundation of a system is the key to all future builds. The big 3 upgrade is is part of the foundation but there is plenty of information on this; next would be the power plant. Explanation and options for an alternator upgrade would be invaluable.
Without a doubt the most influential to sound upgrade is the alternator. 25 years messing around in car audio and I've seen so many systems with thousands of watt amps multiple batteries that they've spent thousands of dollars on and have everything connected to the factory 80Amp to depending on the vehicle maybe 160 amp alternator and before I ask any question about their system I ask what alternator did you upgrade with? And 8 out of 10 at least say I haven't, which just absolutely baffles me because if you're going to spend thousands of dollars in batteries alone and on that amplifier what's the point if you don't have the amperage that's going to push them? Furthermore they put all those batteries in there they don't put a battery cutoffwonder why they are going through an alternator every year but yet continue to buy factory remanufactured rebuilt whatever you want to call it factory alternator. Every single one of them I tell after asking them how much they spent on all those batteries of which unless it's only one extra battery most of the time they have spent more than what they would have going to Mechman and buying a high amp alternator and if they would have gone and spent the money on the alternator they would have been getting a lot higher volume, more SPL, more overall power and could have got all of it for likely less $
My grandpa used to always tell us the first thing you should do when you buy a vehicle is upgrade to literally the best battery you can get to fit in it and get the best lifetime warranty so if we are ever straightened it's not the battery. So from an audio standpoint the alternator, and again best one that will fit with the lifetime warranty.
I would say after confirming that the electrical system can handle the upgrades, I would add a sub to start and then work on sound proofing, that way you get a big difference at first then you do the things people dont think about.
0:36 AFAIK, the alternator's job is to keep the battery charged, not to run everything on the car when it's running . Yes it can keep the car running if the battery is removed, but this is only when the car is 100% stock. Sometimes they are a bit more powerful than the power demand of full car's features turned on, but when the power demand surpasses the power-generation rate of the alternator, the battery helps it out.
This is proven when someone blasts music with their sound equipment on their idling car with no electrical upgrades , and then they turn off the car only to find a dead battery when trying to restart it.
VochoTalacha correctamundo
Wrong.
Kyle Sonsalla why wrong, explain
Nah man, the alternator is supplying power to everything up until it runs out of capacity then the battery is used as a reserve. The reason is the voltage coming from the alternator is a little bit higher than the resting voltage of the battery. You can see this when the bass hits hard and your lights dim. The voltage drops to what the battery can produce at the given current draw.
The alternator electrical output is between 13.5 to 15 volts and runs every electrical system in the car which include charging the battery as well.
Something to consider is voltage drop over oem cables. The cables are mean to transport the power, not consume it, they'll always take a little but not more than half a volt, to me more than .2 volts is too much. If you're hijacking positive from the fuse box you will want to consider volt drop over the cable that feeds it under load. You wont get an accurate volt drop unless you have a full load on what you're testing
Good video Mark, in the next one could you also look at how modern vehicles monitor the power output from the alternator? i've read about newer vehicles that have the alternator wire pass through some type of coil that sends a signal to the vehicles computer.
4:01 I agree in the future if you want to go all fancy, but a 24 dollar dual din from walmart with built in RCAs and bluetooth is just as good, but good alternative to those who prefer to stay stock, very helpful info btw 🤙🏼
1. Wiring - cheapest mod and allows the system to handle more power.
2. Alternator - takes strain off the battery and increases total available power per time unit
3. Capacitor - to absorb the power spikes without putting strain on the battery. Capacitors are made recharge and discharge quickly.
4. Battery - to provide electricity while the engine is off or idling, since then the Alternator doesn't not provide power or sufficient power.
Kai van der Bijl that’s just if you have a unregulated amp then you will see a few more what’s but you want hear any difference. Now if you got a regulated amp like my JL HD1200/1’s it want matter as long as your feeding it enough to make it power your good but it want make any more no matter how much your over 12.5 volts.
3. Capacitor - to absorb the power spikes without putting strain on the battery. Capacitors are made recharge and discharge quickly. -lol, did you ever make some measurements of that? Capacitor only works for first 10 seconds ,after it gives out all his power ,it need to charge again it takes a lot of power from battery and alternator -makes everything even worst... I am talking about those 1-3 farad capacitors witch is just a marketing and waste of money.... look at some pro installs-non of them use a capacitor and if they do,than its around 50-100 capacitors.... this is just a my opinion.
sorry for my language
I suggest to use that money on more powerful alternator and deep cycle battery
for hard bass pulse a Cap is nice because it is the fastes, but then the alternator must charge the cap and must provide the bass. if you run the system hard a cap will help your car
I used 4guage ofc pure copper wire for my power and ground to my distribution block and a ct sounds 2000.1 d for two kicker comps wired to two ohms. I also incorporated a 2500 watt capacitor on that distribution block and grounded both to the chassis of course. I used a sealed enclosure underneath the backseat of my ram 1500 crew cab but had to raise the back seats an inch and a half. I used an audiocontrol LC2I pro as well. Just breaking the subs in now. I also used a good bit of killmat in the box and in the rear of my truck. It sounds amazing.
I know this is an old post but I've been looking into the ecoflow line of generators and wanted to know if you've done any research on the alternator charger they currently offer and one of their generators as a second battery for systems. Their alternator charger puts out like 800 watts from your system and can recharge any one of their power stations very quickly while your vehicle is running and since the generator can put out 12 volts in theory it should be able to power your system and depending on the size could possibly power it for sometime if your vehicle is off... They sponsor a lot of TH-camrs and I trust you the most for my car audio needs so maybe you can get with them and see about getting one of their units and testing it out so you could help us less trained people out 😂
I really appreciate these videos you make...they are informative and I learn from them...thanks and keep up the good work
What is more important than doing the big three is clean mounting. Over time the grounding wire can become covered with oil, dirt, and corrosion where it connects. Sometimes replacing your ground wire with a new one, and/or cleaning the contact point will help more then anything else. You also need to make sure your battery and battery box is clean. A dirty battery or battery box can kill your battery and cause a parasitic draw on the battery.
Alternator than battery and wires , and of course good solid connections!!
Now, I always try to overkill whenever possible so that I don't get cornered with higher audio demand but I have grounds running all over the vehicle just for added measure. Not to mention, no positive cable or wire is running without a fuse be it ANL or regular fuses. By overkill I mean 3 AGM batteries and a 390A HO alternator when really I'm just pushing 1600w RMS. Really nice when the voltage stays constant. My first step would be a high output alternator with the big 3 to support the extra load then get a battery.
I start with the Big 3 Upgrade.
1st, you would calculate the additional power draw, at peak for the components you will be using. Then consider the power output of the alternator, then decide if you will be using more or less then the current system, also dont forget to add in the normal consumption of the car, with everything you could use at 1 time (unless you dont plan on driving or using air conditioning etc while showing off your air pumpers). How do you decide, well if your power drain is going to be the same or close to the same as the alternator output, you need to upgrade the alternator because it will overwork it, you could add a battery but then you will have down time while you recharge them. A cap pack would also do it, but again, they have to be recharged after usage. That would help if you only go over the power output of the alternator at peek times, and have enough left over from the alternator to recharge them after its used. If you are using more, you need the same, upgrade the alternator, to consider if you actually want/need multiple batteries, in my opinion, additional batteries are only effective when your power consumption is peeking which is while your amps are at their most power usage. The amps will draw way faster then any alternator system but primarily at peek times. So you will need a little extra juice to get through that, and to be able to recharge that used juice while not at peek.
Upgrade the big 3 first. You would see a huge boot from your stock electrical, then depending on you motive behind the build either and alternator or a cap bank.
1.wiring,
2.battery
3.alternator
Big 3 upgrade! Then probably alternatetor, unless it's a Honda, then do the battery first 😂
thanks for adding the little the details young kids like us need all the details
Number one upgrade should always include wiring considerations. Unfortunately, CCA (Copper-Clad Aluminum) has only served to muddy the waters of this upgrade. OFC (Oxygen-Free Copper) is the most economical, energy-efficient, most durable wiring solution.
I use welding copper wire 99.9 copper
rocknroller1999
It’s actually illegal to install CCA wiring in homes and you can’t really get the stuff unless you are a contractor.
@@thegreatempire3882 Really?!
so in this video you said you would talk more about alternators and when to up grade it and when not to. A fallow up would be nice as you are my go to guy when i'm seeking info about my install
I’ve learned a lot from your channel and appreciate all your effort that goes into making these videos. I’ve ordered everything to do the “Big 3 Upgrade” on my 2008 Honda Ridgeline. I am curious as to why the power wire from the alternator to the battery positive isn’t fused in two locations, as close as possible to the alternator and the battery. If the wire were to be compromised and blow the fuse at the alternator, wouldn’t the section of wire coming from the battery positive still be hot and potentially cause a hazard? I’ve never seen anyone do that, but it stands to reason that a broken 1/0 wire coming from the battery positive wouldn’t be good.
Yes I would fuse both ends for safety.
Great intro Vid!
Having sucked my system dry, adding a second battery & still killed batteries, the alternator is certainly of vital importance.
Work From the ground Up!
Deck (head unit) sends the Signal, Alternator sends the Power!
Thats where i would start if i were starting fresh 🤘
What amperage alternator would you recommend upgrading to if you have a 140 amp alternator and are using 1200 RMS of mainly class D?
Here is the order I chose :
1. After market radio or dsp for high to low conversion.
2. Sub Amplifier , Subwoofer , 1/0 gauge power , ground and big 4 not 3 .
3. New dual battery setup ( both new batteries not adding one new )
4. New mids and highs
5 . Power Amp for new mids and highs and a Clarion EQ if using aftermarket radio instead of DSP for factory for low level output to subs , and full range amps .
6. High output alternator to match needs of all new amplifiers installed .
NOTE :
SOME VEHICLES HAVE CRAP ALTERNATORS FROM FACTORY AND SOME COME WITH SOMEWHAT HIGHER AMPERAGE ALTERNATORS . IF YOUR VEHICLES ALTERNATOR IS A LOW AMPERAGE ALTERNATOR YOU WILL NEED TO UPGRADE THE ALTERNATOR AT THE SAME TIME AS ADDING A HIGH POWER SUB AMP "OVER 1000 WATTS RMS" OR SOON AFTER TO PREVENT DAMAGE TO SUBWOOFERS , AMPLIFIER AND CAR ELECTRICAL SYSTEM .
Thank you Mr. Garcez! But what is the Big 4 upgrade for a vehicle?
A good battery is important to start. Without it nothing happens. The wire must be sufficient to carry the required power to each component. I've watched wires melt under a friend's hood and it continued towards the stereo so a fuse at the battery is highly recommended also. Just to start I personally think this and the alternator and if I will need a capacitor and if I do what rating. That's just to start planning in my book.
Do you have any videos explaining alternator load. Stain an why its best to change alternator even testing or what alternator is best to buy. Thanks CAF
Get a deep cycle battery and replace your stock alt with a new one if you aren't going to upgrade to a high output alt and are driving a car that's 10+ years old. Change the belt too if it's been a while, this isn't normal wear and tear, this is gung ho guns blazing.
That way you keep your ride dependable. Don't wait for your stock alt to fail, replace it every 2-3 years. Worth it when compared to needing a tow or changing an alt on the side of the highway and being late for work, or worse if you don't know how and have to pay a shop.
Personally I use a 2 farad cap to soften the draw from the amp, so to smooth out the voltage spikes.
But keep in mind that there are cap banks that can exceed battery banks for what they were intended for: Burping builds.
Finding high out put alts is a pain in the ass, especially when you find out they don't make one for your car, or it's going to cost an arm and a leg and might not even fit properly.
I added 2 of the " cheaper " L7's. I drained 2 alternator's left and right. Added a 2nd battery and all is good now
I would start with grounding. Finding the best path helps alot. I have also added more grounding straps to the vehicle to help it out. And cleaning the existing ones helps alot too.
On one of the other channels around here somewhere, the guy was noting sanding down the area and also using a dialectric grease to keep it from rusting in the future. I've lucked out though and never had any ground issues on installs I've done. (Can't say the same for the one single time I was lazy and paid a shop for an install. never again!).
07wrxtr1 Yeah, I've paid dearly for that as well.
1st... know how much power you need, check and upgrade battery, alternator and main power circuits according to your total amp usage. Ground and positive. I think one should have 20% more amperage then you will use with all electrical being operated at one time, including air conditioning. Heater, wiper motor, ect. Thank you
Good question! I feel like the answer is different for certain situations but the first thing I do when I get a vehicle is clean and upgrade the grounds. Upgrading the charge wire on a stock alternator is kind of silly. When you upgrade the alternator, is usually the time for that.
thornygravy prior to upgrading the big three on my car the absolute most my alt would put out was 14.2 volts after upgrading it instantly put out up to 14.6 I don't even know what that would translate to in amps but to call it a silly upgrade is just plain silly
Your alternator very well could have been putting out more amps at 14.2 then it currently is at 14.6.. But just for you I'll make a correction "kind of silly, assuming the stock charge wire is in good condition (connections are clean and tight, wire isn't damaged, etc)."
I could say my boss amp is underrated but that doesn't mean anything if I don't have proof, your point of my alt putting out more amps prior makes no sense as all that happened was 14 year old 8 gage wiring was replaced with 0 gauge welding cable, nothing whatsoever changed with the alt itself therefor it's output didn't change it just has less loss enroute to my battery, if you want to tell me I'm wrong give me some actual facts and science
Teegan Cathcart, Hey, an increase of 0.4volts! You go, bro! Question: do you notice the voltage more stable now than before?
The voltage increase could be your new cable has less resistance, not just because of the larger conductor area, but the actual resistance of the metal conductor itself, allowing a slightly higher Voltage to push the pixies. Conductor size is only beneficial when you are pulling enough current (amps) to warrant the larger conductor.
An increase in Voltage does not necessarily mean an increase in power if your alternator is at the limit of the amount of current it can supply.
The real test is, how does your voltage hold up when your system is pounding with your headlights, and AC on?
To calculate your amps, you would need to know your systems total power draw, in watts. Use Ohm's Law.
Watts/volts= amps.
@@bmbgarage3405 He meant the cable not the alternator..
A circuit breaker at the battery and 1/0 cable for pwr and battery ground, this should be the first upgrade for systems under 1500watts rms, this will allow for future upgrades for most people
I'm guessing a good starting point is the alternator for most people because that's where most of the power usually used originates from. That's all assuming that you have already upgraded things jn your system that have been lacking like line output converters, better head units and higher efficiency amplifiers. All of which will probably be less expensive to start with than tackling a high output alternator/battery/or wiring if you are not doing it yourself
January Morris if you don’t upgrade the wires before putting in a HO alternator, it is the same as putting a high pressure pump on a garden hose. Remember, current flows through the wire while voltage passes across the wire. Increased wire diameter means more current flow due to less resistance and less stress (pressure) on the insulation. If that doesn’t work, try second battery isolated from primary battery with relay/solenoid so that your car system is pulling from primary battery and audio system is pulling from secondary. And it is key to ensure that your batteries are same class and are each new so that you do not have one fighting to keep charge balanced on the older one.
Installing thick AF power and grounds. I would say go bigger than needed in case of power upgrades later.Last build I ran a 0 gauge power and grounds from the front battery to the back and later switched the ground to a second power wire. I've already done a mechman alt and second battery. Unfortunately my Grand Prix has a electronic throttle body and responds to low voltage and dips with low rpms from closing the throttle plate, which only compounds my voltage problem
i meant always use 0 gauge for big 3 and power to amps and initial ground wires from amps ..
I think something that every car stereo install should have is a good line out converter. One that reduces noise and distortion, doesn't add distortion. lol. Yes, most do, so know your device and who is making it. So reduce any distortion in the signal, and then boost the signal. That really helps any stereo system without spending a great deal of money. And it's true Audio Control makes some very good to great line output converters. It's a game changer I think in sound quality. Using a combination of analog with digital processing gets you the best sound quality, one that is warm,smooth., accurate. "Hi-Fidelity is in the numbers". Honest numbers that is.
You should definitly start out the cables and do a big three upgrade if your battery is'nt old and really bad. After the cables you should upgrade the battery and if necessary put another one in there. If you need more power than that, you should upgrade the alternator.
Without question the most important first thing to do is wiring!!!!!
Great video. Quick question , I have a second battery in the rear, I ran a 0gauge from battery to battery. But I've melted the fuse in the line once. Will adding another run of 0gauge help dissipate the heat? How do I avoid this from happening
Thanks for keeping his videos. Very interesting you keep meat glue to the television screen or Peter screen lol I keep up the great work. Thanks for a great personality to.😊
The first thing I would do is upgrade the Big 3. As others have pointed out in the comments, make sure that when you upgrade that you use the correct sized fuse for the amount of load that the audio system will be capable of. Not doing this is asking for a disaster.
Good connection from negative battery terminal to car chassis
Mark is the man!
do you have a video on wiring only? best gauges to use, for what and where? best material for running your upgraded system? what is the best wire to use from your battery to your Amp? what kind of wires to we wat to push from our Amp to Sub/ or subs?
Mark I believe that to answer your question you would need to know how many amps etc... that you will be installing in that vehicle.
I'm kinda new to the way systems are installed today as compared to 30 plus years ago. I can install just about any system but my question revolves around doing the big 3 to a 2012 Chevrolet Traverse. The main battery sits in the floor board of the back right passenger compartment.
Would love to see something similar about hybrids. Seems to be a much larger gap in knowledge on them in the biz
Because hybrids are shit. You wouldnt put subs in a prius would you?
2500 in the trunk.
Upgraded 105 amp alt to a 140 amp
Upgraded all ground wires from 8 to 2 gauge
Added ground from neg to frame
Added ground from alt to frame
Upgraded alt + wire to 2 gauge to batt 2
Upgraded CCA batt 1 to 980 cca from 650
980 Batt feeds to 2, 4 farad caps.
Power nevwr drops, spent around 250
The first thing I would do is to replace the battery if it isn't in good condition - it's no good to do any upgrades if you can't start the car. Assuming that the alternator is serviceable, the next thing to do is upgrade the alternator wiring - red sheathed (positive) wire directly to the battery positive terminal via an appropriately sized fuse and adding a ground (black sheathed) from the alternator body to the negative battery terminal. I went with #2 AWG since I believe that would be more than adequate for me. The "Big 4" upgrades say to upgrade the engine block ground but I don't see how that is helpful if you add a large ground wire (per the Big 4 upgrade tutorials) from the alternator body to the battery since the alternator is mounted to the engine with metallic supports - seems redundant to me. The alternator should be upgraded depending on the electrical load.
Battery, wire, and H/O Alt. if you wanna go HAM!
Crikies...what kinda power are you talking? I've run texas star 250 watt kickers with no issues with my Galaxy 99's and talk to just about anyone that I can hear across the country. When combined with a 102" whip or a Wilson 2 or 5000 they did amazingly well. Of course, when the skip is really pounding, I'm in awe when one ol boy keys up and it's nothing but him on the air! I bet you're that ol boy! How big is your Palomar? lol
bigger battery? or different battery type and what kind of wire?
Which is the best battery for sound systems
First I would say is ofc cable. It gets overlooked and cans be a big impact on price of overall system.
This video has hella tips. I need to upgrade my alternator to a 240 mechman alt
Definitely Big 3 and ofc wire..hey Mark even better video for you to make....my new car doesn't have an alternator.
Honestly Mark, I usually go for upgrading the ground. I find it to be the most overlooked thing when it comes to big power systems. Far to often do I see someone who ran a 0 gauge power wire to their amp only to use a body ground in the trunk. When you look under the hood the factory ground to the engine and battery to nothing more than an 8 gauge strap.
Agreed, and I think the stock system worsens as the car ages. Sand down/upgrade = cheap insurance.
Tyler Andrews all you got to do is check it with a meter. If you get zero ohms your good don’t matter where it’s wired to. I have mine wired to the body and the battery so I know I’m good. But I have a XS power XP3000 in my trunk so my wires to my amp are dual runs of XS flex OFC 14” inches from the amp.
How do you ohm check a ground on the body? Where would I put the positive lead of the meter?
@@tammyforbes2101 why do u dual run? Please explain
Jack khol negative post of battery to what your checking
Big 3 upgrade first
Alternator second
Secondary batteries after
Love watching your vidios it's the most informative car audio vid's out there really explaining everything in detail THE BEST VIDIOS to learn and conker car audio thank you for tacking the time to do all these vidios for all of us dumb dumbs jk ..... please do a vidio on all the best car batteries top of the top best of the best battery for extreme car audio builds
Hey Mark, do you or will you ever do a subwoofer wall build or tutorial? I'm looking to build one but i havent gotten the electrical plans quite down to run power to rear batteries and amps. Whadd'ya think
I always upgrade the alt and charging cables first
For people who just UPGRADE to aftermarket radio and new mids and highs stock wiring is fine . I always suggest upgrading wiring to the step before adding amplifiers.
Math is the most important step. Specifications of components new & existing need to be calculated to determine if any upgrades are needed.
Find all of your car's grounds and clean them. Not just the ones you use for your amplifiers and battery, but the others as well. And that's a free upgrade.
Mark, you need to upgrade the alternator first then the wiring.