Viki is one of the enigma characters is all suikoden series, along with Jeane . only the creator of Gensō Suikoden series can tell you the full story of his characters but now we will never now. R.I.P Yoshitaka Murayama . i like your critical thinking man. good job on the video. looing forward to the one you do on Jeane.
LMAO the way you end it with just "you've been listening to me ramble and i dont have a clue and neither do you" just great simply great 🤣honestly this was a good listen love the choice in music. i do hope that maybe one day we'll get more games in the future from people who helped out with the other suikoden games and maybe they can fill in the gaps and give closure to this viki-conundrum.
Hey! It's true! I legit have no idea, and neither does anyone else. If anybody says they know for certain, they're pulling it out of their ass. I hope so too. The director of Suikoden 5 is in charge of the remasters. He done an incredible job with 5, so If the remasters do well I certainly expect him to keep pushing to continue the series.
@@MaximzM I sure hope he can pull it out of the grave. There's too many stories still to tell. But we'll probably get remasters of the whole series before anything new.
@@CulganValya true though idk how i feel bout that tbh i feel 3 n 4 need a remake way more than a remaster, and 5 doesnt need a remake a remaster sure since i dont even think it was ever made available on psn
One possibility with her outfits is that her magic alters them depending on time period and possibly location, with the caveat that she will be in that time and location for a while, and is not just hopping in briefly. In Suikoden III her newer clothes don't seem like they'd be too out of place in the Grasslands, for example, while in Suikoden V, they seem like they'd fit Falenan fashion. The overall look doesn't change, such as the color scheme, but the smaller details seem almost adapted to wherever she winds up. It might even be a tell of sorts for her to know she's somewhere she needs to remain. Her dialogue about someone protecting her comes to mind. She says it to Tir, Riou, and Lazlo, and asks the Prince of Falena for his protection as well. Its been a while since I played III, mind you, so I don't recall if she said anything similar to the MC there. Yet, when she met Nash, she didn't ask for his protection, and her clothes were largely the same as they were in Suikoden II. The biggest flaw in this theory, is that I don't know if she's attentive enough to even be aware her clothes would change like that at random.
That is a possibility. The colour scheme does stay the same, but the style is completely different. It may not be the magic causing the alteration, but what if it's her subconscious doing it? Maybe she subconsciously knows where she'll end up next, even if she herself is not aware, and wears an outfit suitable to that time and place. Or it may not be that deep at all and it's just the character artist wanting to give her a new outfit that matches the setting.
The inconsistency with Suikoden 3 and Suikogaiden 2 could be fixed if Suikoden 6 was set in Jowston again. Or perhaps Jowston and another area. Just because we had one game use the area doesn't mean they can never visit it again. There's plenty more they could do, and plenty of unused space in each area. IIRC the area east of Dunan/Jowston was never really established, it's assumed there is just mountains and then water. Could retcon the east coast a bit to make it traversable and turn the ocean there into more of a sea, and add a Japanese themed landmass nearby that Genkaku could be from. Then set the game in Jowston and this new place both. That's my fanfiction explanation, lol.
You should do Jeanne next. She has also been in all the Suikoden series and always be looking different in each games. She is a mysterious one...more than Viki I'd say. Many may agree. Her info never tell much of her background story. She'll always be your rune store owner upon recruit, but playable in 4 and 5 and not just supporter.
I'll definitely be making a video on Jeane at some point. I agree, Jeane's background is quite mysterious and there's a lot about her to discuss and speculate about!
@@TheAyme83 What sentence are you referring to? I don't recall anything of the sort and I just recently replayed through the series to refresh my memory for these videos.
@@CulganValya I don't know at all. It's something I deduced years ago, but I couldn't tell if it was in a game or in on of the mangas. It was related to a bath tube talking. But I could have dreamt it too.
In "The Once and Future King", merlin is described as perceiving time backwards, that is to say he remembers tomorrow the way we would remember yesterday. Is it possible the time travel has caused Viki to perceive time the same way? Hence not recognizing herself as a child yet the child recognizes her? edit: scratch that, it's stupid. More likely child Vki met an even older version of Viki before meeting 'original' Viki. Or the writers just made an honest mistake (happens to the best)
The Once and Future King sounds interesting. I'll definitely look that up! It's possible she's experiencing time backwards, but the meetings between Viki and child Viki in Suikogaiden 2 and Suikoden 3 contradict each other. If Gaiden 2 comes first, which it does timeline wise. How did she not know child Viki in 3? And if she's experiencing time backwards, how did she not recognise child Viki in Gaiden 2 if they met in 3? Either way, she would've met herself at least once before. She might be a ditzy airhead about details, but she does remember people. I dunno, her whole timeline is a mess. Trying to make sense of it appears to be impossible.
In this instance, I believe it is implied that the jumping/warping/blinking damages her mind(I mean, if you think about it this does make sense seeing as she is just getting used to her surroundings and then suddenly you don't know where or even when you are and doing this repeatedly.) the younger Viki has not Traveled as often in this way as the older version so to me it would make sense that younger Viki's mind would be more intact.
Here's a thought: What if Child Viki is actually older? What if the wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey stuff is causing her to age backwards? Or maybe she ages inconsistently? Maybe we're dealing with two Viki timelines here. Maybe she grew up and grew old the first time, so Viki and Hellion are the same person. But then somehow, as Hellion, she tried to change things but accidentally turned herself into a child. So now Child Viki is actually the oldest version of Viki, Teen Viki is the youngest, and Hellion is in the middle.
That's an interesting way of looking at it. I personally don't believe in the theory that Hellion has anything to do with Jeane, but it could be a possibility. Although the questions remain, why is Viki not aging? She's 16 in all of the games and the games last months - years each. Plus all three of them occupy different Stars. I think Viki is intended to be mysterious character with a confusing timeline that's impossible to make sense of, and something that may not be revealed until the end of her story, if she ever gets an ending to her story.
The answer, of course, is that Viki is a Time Lord. Her "World" is her TARDIS. Her staff is her Sonic Screwdriver. It makes about as much sense as any other theory for Viki could be.
I think that Lorelay was saved by her kid version, from the info that we gathered. And all of sudden her teleport skill against enemies seems more terrifying after hear all that, lol 😂
Suikogaiden Vol 2 shows regular Viki being the one who meets Lorelai in the Deep Twilight Forest ruins. Child Viki has never had any encounter with Lorelai in any of the games or novels But that may change in the future if the series continues.
@@CulganValya as a suiko fan I have no excuse to not have played suikogaiden yet, I remember from the kazaa time that I used to download the suikogaiden intros and wondering what was that.
@@williamzeo2493 They're fun games and they're definitely worth a playthrough. Both of the games have an alternate route for chapter 3. They're at least worth a watch on youtube. Very fun stories!
We don't know if there even is a Time Space rune. And what about Suikoden 1 and 2? She doesn't have the Blinking Mirrors in those games, and the rune being an object, and not embedded in her wouldn't cause her to gain the agelessness the runes provide.
@@CulganValya well maybe you are right... but then What if the viki's are one part of herself. Like a full mirror which has been broken and brought thousands of viki into the Suiko world as a reflection of herself but not truly one. Which is why she can remember glimpses of the suiko timeline as if she experienced it herself, but not truly as they are experienced through the other vikis. All the vikis are disciples of a higher being.
Plot Twist planned end of the series was Viki waking up from a disjointed dream, mumbling waffu. Thus, it was all one big dream of a very Imaginative girl.
I think she's incarnation of True Rune, Blinking Rune, she can transport between time and space, dont age. I mean her blinking rune always find the place where the war is gonna happen, besides nobody knows her hometown or somn. She might be related to Sindar cuz her nomadic habit, always disappear after the war ended and goes to another war.
I never put much thought into the idea of her being an incarnation of a true rune. I think it would be more likely that's she's holding a true rune rather than she is one. As for being a Sindar, I don't think so. She has a strange "home" she teleports to where she lives, where her child self lives. I think it's more likely she's simply displaced in time.
Interesting side note, but you continue to reference Suikoden III where Viki says she came from the City-State of Jowston. Sorry to add another timeline wrinkle, but the City-State ceased to exist after the events of Suikoden II, it was renamed Dunan. Now, it could be, during the feast the renaming hadn't been considered, or it could be from another timeline when, say, during the time of Clift the Crusader, the territories of Jowston and the Scarlet Moon Empire wrestled control of their territory away from Harmonia...now that I think about it, that would have been a much better entry for a prequel than Suikoden IV
Viki teleported away immediately following the war, either right before or during the feast. The nation wouldn't have been renamed at the point. It'd be hard to fill out all roles of government that quickly, that process took over a year. Shu left and went back to his old life as a trader a year later once they finally had a president and the roles filled out. It can't be the time of Clift the Crusader, he was born 440ish years prior, and the City States of Jowston only formed in its infancy 150ish years prior to the game. And 50-60 years before that, it was the Dunan Kingdom that had collapsed. She definitely arrived in Suikoden 3 immediately following the war either before or during the feast.
Perhaps she knows more on the things of yet to come. You may be right on Viki acting stupid for preventing a time paradox. I am wondering, why Viki doesn't have a scene with Leknaat. Leknaat might see her potential than the leaders of the series.
She very well might be. She does have some moments where she doesn't act like a ditzy airhead. It's possibly all an act with her. Who knows. Hopefully the series continues and we'll find out some day!
i think its not just teleportation i think its cloning too .. i mean when her job was done in S1 her powers cloned her into a needed place with her memories intact hence we saw two Vikis in S3 .. so maybe there is multiple vikis just like Jeane .. i hope someone knows the answer to that besides Murayama may he rest in peace.
I always thought Little Viki was from a parallel universe rather than a clone. Viki herself could have a True Rune but we only see the Blinking Rune much like we only see a Wind Rune on Luc in S1&2 and the Eight Devil Rune on Yuber in S3. I believe Jeane is an ancient android, possible Simeon too. Loving this Suikoden content btw!
The multiple Jeanes theory is because Fumi Ishikawa (the character artist for Suikoden 2, 3, Gaiden 1 & 2, and Card Stories said during an interview in Dengeki PS Vol 217) that, "She doesn't seem like she has aged at all, but she doesn't have a true rune." She then says, "Apparently, Jeane's family all have the same face." But Fumi Ishikawa has been wrong on things she has said in the past. For starters she said Hugo's dad has black hair, but Yoshitaka Murayama said Hugo's dad has blonde hair. In Suikoden 3 Jeane has a bath scene with Lilly Lilly: I'm not one to beat around the bush, so I'll get straight to the point. Did you serve in the Dunan Army during the Unification War? Jeane: Me in the Dunan Army... Hee hee! Well... kind of, but kind of not." Lilly: Well, which is it? Jeane: Yes, which one... Well, let's say that yes, I did... Lilly: Do you know Tinto's historian. Marlowe Cody? He also serves in the army. Recently, he came by the castle and apparently saw you Jeane: Without offering so much as a greeting or a handshake... Teasingly saying maybe I did, maybe I didn't, but then gives away that she knows Marlowe. In Suikoden 3 she leaves letters in the suggestion box. One talking about Futch and addressing him as an old friend. They fought together during Suikoden 1 and 2. And another letter talking about Nash, calling him rude for asking why she hasn't changed. They met previously during Suikogaiden Vol 1 (which takes place during Suikoden 2). In Suikoden 5, Viki leaves 2 letters in the comment box. One talking about Lorelai. Swearing she's never met her before. The other letter is about Jeane. In the letter Viki talks about them having met before. Lots of times, in lots of different places. So she doesn't remember Lorelai, but knows Jeane. So this can't be the Viki from Suikoden 1, 2 or 3 or else she would also remember Lorelai. So Jeane and Viki definitely had multiple encounters in the past that we've never seen in any games. And in the Suikoden 4 bath scene between Viki and Jeane, I got the impression Jeane very clearly recognised Viki and was simply being coy. Viki's letter about Jeane in Suikoden 5 basically confirms they've met many times before. In Suikoden 5 Jeane asks you to help her recover something she left behind in the ruins that are revealed in the crater that Levi created. But those ruins are from the Ancient Armes Kingdom, a nation that existed before Falena, and has been buried underground likely since before Falena was created. Meaning the ruins are well over 700 years old at that point. So Jeane possibly has a connection to the Ancient Armes Kingdom. It's most certainly the same Jeane that's appearing in each game. But for whatever her reasons, she tries her best not to give anything away.
Unfortunately that doesn't appear to be her correct timeline. Her appearances in Suikogaiden Vol 2 and Suikoden III directly contradict each other. And her memory couldn't have been erased as you suspect in V due to the blinking rune, because one of the letters she leaves in the suggestion box is about Jeane. The letter says, "I've met Jeane before. Lots of times. In lots of different places. I wonder why we keep bumping into each other..." Plus if V was her last appearance, she would already know Lorelai, as she would've met her three times prior. In Suikoden 1, Suikoden 2 and Suikogaiden Vol 2. But she has no idea who Lorelai is in V. I suspect her timeline is meant to be a complete mess that makes zero sense to add to her mystery.
Its most likely the character isnt meant to be deciphered, and is intentionally convoluted and confusing. The outfit isnt a good source of hints cause characters designs are usually modify between games, plus a character wont have different outfits in different games even if its unrealistic because of technical reasons.
Considering they don't plan the games ahead of time, it's very likely they forget things over time or make something up and not realize it contradicted something prior or will in the future. They have to retroactively make up something for VIki with each new installment and that can be hard to keep up with, especially over years. I think little Viki is mature as a trope, to have the younger one be the opposite of her older self. I've seen it before in something, but can't name it now. To have that drastic of a personality shift requires brain damage, hypnosis, magic or something. Otherwise it's a creative choice that may not have a reason. One reason is Suikoden is pretty grounded. If Viki were to be normal, it would be a very dark, horrible fate to sneeze (randomly for whatever reason) and end up in different times and places. It would drive someone mad, so they made her personality ditzy to bypass the gravity of it and it becomes light-hearted. Consider how lucky she is to never appear in a dangerous or fatal situation and die immediately. One can think she's being guided to some extent and would have to be in order to appear at pivotal events in history and run be necessity to such efforts. If not, the creator was doing so and would come up with an answer for it later, but Viki was a staple to have in each game along with other handful of characters. Characters that appeared later in series like the True Rune bearers in Suikoden III should appear in other games as well one would imagine, but they weren't a thing in first two entries. As for outfits, I think it may be as simple as a character designer being a character designer. The outfits are all similar in color scheme and overall form. The two games that have the outfits the same I'm not sure about other than putting myself in the artist shoes and say they harkened back to a previous design for that game. Those were the games Fumi worked on, so those were her takes on her look and used it again. Think of it as the trope of characters wearing the same outfit all the time but never being an issue. Perhaps Viki is in the same outfit in each game, only the design from different artist is the thing that varies, but not an in-game fact.
This is the logical answer of course, the trick is trying to explain the logical conclusion with the pieces we have in a way that makes sense. It's the same thing as explaining who won a wrestling match with "The booker said so"
@@planescaped It usually turns out to be these sort of things in games when you look into development. Seldom is much planned and it's notable if someone plans out a whole story years ahead, usually a pet/personal project if so. You just can't plan such things over years and years and keep up with it, along with have other members remember and be on the same page.
That's definitely the logical answer. There never was a grand overarching plan. So as planescaped said, all we can do is try to piece what we have together to try and make it make sense. I don't think it's a case of forgetting something or not realising they contradicted something. Even though they didn't plan it all out, or keep records of everything, Murayama said in an interview that they regularly done continuity checks. They've done tragic and somewhat dark backgrounds for other characters, but nothing to the level of how bad Viki's could potentially have been. But it also may not drive someone mad, she has never teleported into a location where she's was in actual immediate danger. The only real consistency with her outfits are the colours. The character designer for Suikoden 1 and 4 was Junko Kawano. Colour scheme is the same, but the outfit design is completely different. Fumi Ishikawa was the character artist for Suikoden 2, 3 and Gaiden 1, and Suikoden Card Stories. Viki had the same outfit in 3 of those 4 games. Is it just the designer being a designer and wanting to change things up? Maybe. Did they change her outfit for a reason? Also maybe. We can make guesses, but we don't know for sure. We can only go by what we seen in the games and novels.
the most "logical" and also boring answer would be "parallel universes". due to your just released video about the secret dungeon in S2 having this new game + mechanic planned, which mentions "this world has million forms". Viki having multiple different versions running around all the same time could have been an idea/reason for people knowing another Viki, than the one we know. buuut this would be boring. as for some said contradictions there is also a possibility of a Suikoden 6 we never got, which could have filled a gap here and there. leaving while eating -> "S6" -> leaving before eating. so this statement is about another unknown feast. but in reality its just a running joke made of her, so... yea no explanation needed/possible. what i actually think (well want, and i don't accept anything else) the game release time line is also her timeline. and since i go for the "viki is THE Suikoden main character"-theory. going from one story to the next without much of a break due to time teleportation, winning every war. it fits the timeline. this also easily allows people to meet her, without she knowing, since its a future S6 version of her which ported back in time they met. so something that did not happened yet to the viki we know.
It might be boring, but it's very probable. Though as the content was unfinished and cut, we can't officially take it as canon. I don't think her timeline is meant to make sense, and her story may never get resolved. They created Viki with the intent of her being mysterious and a jumbled timeline that makes no sense.
Wishlist and pre-order the Suikoden HD Remaster -
Physical Switch Copy: amzn.to/474Pr5P
Physical PS5 Copy: amzn.to/3Mtnv1W
Physical Xbox Copy: amzn.to/3TvNeuX
Steam: store.steampowered.com/app/1932640/Suikoden_III_HD_Remaster_Gate_Rune_and_Dunan_Unification_Wars/
Nintendo Switch: www.nintendo.com/us/store/products/suikoden-i-and-ii-hd-remaster-gate-rune-and-dunan-unification-wars-switch/
Playstation: store.playstation.com/product/JP0101-PPSA18305_00-SUIKODENREMASTER
Xbox: www.xbox.com/games/store/Suikoden-I-II-HD-Remaster-Pre-order/9P9FM62WZXR2
Viki is one of the enigma characters is all suikoden series, along with Jeane . only the creator of Gensō Suikoden series can tell you the full story of his characters but now we will never now. R.I.P Yoshitaka Murayama .
i like your critical thinking man. good job on the video. looing forward to the one you do on Jeane.
LMAO the way you end it with just "you've been listening to me ramble and i dont have a clue and neither do you" just great simply great 🤣honestly this was a good listen love the choice in music. i do hope that maybe one day we'll get more games in the future from people who helped out with the other suikoden games and maybe they can fill in the gaps and give closure to this viki-conundrum.
Hey! It's true! I legit have no idea, and neither does anyone else. If anybody says they know for certain, they're pulling it out of their ass.
I hope so too. The director of Suikoden 5 is in charge of the remasters. He done an incredible job with 5, so If the remasters do well I certainly expect him to keep pushing to continue the series.
@@CulganValya brooooo if he could pull suikoden out of the grave after the remasters i would be so happy!
@@MaximzM I sure hope he can pull it out of the grave. There's too many stories still to tell. But we'll probably get remasters of the whole series before anything new.
@@CulganValya true though idk how i feel bout that tbh i feel 3 n 4 need a remake way more than a remaster, and 5 doesnt need a remake a remaster sure since i dont even think it was ever made available on psn
Viki is the MC!
Vikki is pretty amazing. The whole concept of her character. There is nothing else like her. Absolutely love her!
Viki is adorable. She's so sweet. I love her to bits.
i agree!
One possibility with her outfits is that her magic alters them depending on time period and possibly location, with the caveat that she will be in that time and location for a while, and is not just hopping in briefly. In Suikoden III her newer clothes don't seem like they'd be too out of place in the Grasslands, for example, while in Suikoden V, they seem like they'd fit Falenan fashion. The overall look doesn't change, such as the color scheme, but the smaller details seem almost adapted to wherever she winds up.
It might even be a tell of sorts for her to know she's somewhere she needs to remain. Her dialogue about someone protecting her comes to mind. She says it to Tir, Riou, and Lazlo, and asks the Prince of Falena for his protection as well. Its been a while since I played III, mind you, so I don't recall if she said anything similar to the MC there. Yet, when she met Nash, she didn't ask for his protection, and her clothes were largely the same as they were in Suikoden II.
The biggest flaw in this theory, is that I don't know if she's attentive enough to even be aware her clothes would change like that at random.
That is a possibility. The colour scheme does stay the same, but the style is completely different. It may not be the magic causing the alteration, but what if it's her subconscious doing it? Maybe she subconsciously knows where she'll end up next, even if she herself is not aware, and wears an outfit suitable to that time and place.
Or it may not be that deep at all and it's just the character artist wanting to give her a new outfit that matches the setting.
The inconsistency with Suikoden 3 and Suikogaiden 2 could be fixed if Suikoden 6 was set in Jowston again. Or perhaps Jowston and another area.
Just because we had one game use the area doesn't mean they can never visit it again. There's plenty more they could do, and plenty of unused space in each area. IIRC the area east of Dunan/Jowston was never really established, it's assumed there is just mountains and then water. Could retcon the east coast a bit to make it traversable and turn the ocean there into more of a sea, and add a Japanese themed landmass nearby that Genkaku could be from. Then set the game in Jowston and this new place both.
That's my fanfiction explanation, lol.
That's definitely another possibility! Viki may very well return to Jowston / Dunan again in the future, or the past.
highland
You should do Jeanne next. She has also been in all the Suikoden series and always be looking different in each games. She is a mysterious one...more than Viki I'd say. Many may agree. Her info never tell much of her background story. She'll always be your rune store owner upon recruit, but playable in 4 and 5 and not just supporter.
I'll definitely be making a video on Jeane at some point. I agree, Jeane's background is quite mysterious and there's a lot about her to discuss and speculate about!
I'm pretty sure she is Viki's mom, based on a sentense in Suikoden 3 or 5's mangas
@@TheAyme83 What sentence are you referring to? I don't recall anything of the sort and I just recently replayed through the series to refresh my memory for these videos.
@@CulganValya I don't know at all. It's something I deduced years ago, but I couldn't tell if it was in a game or in on of the mangas. It was related to a bath tube talking. But I could have dreamt it too.
In "The Once and Future King", merlin is described as perceiving time backwards, that is to say he remembers tomorrow the way we would remember yesterday. Is it possible the time travel has caused Viki to perceive time the same way? Hence not recognizing herself as a child yet the child recognizes her?
edit: scratch that, it's stupid. More likely child Vki met an even older version of Viki before meeting 'original' Viki. Or the writers just made an honest mistake (happens to the best)
The Once and Future King sounds interesting. I'll definitely look that up!
It's possible she's experiencing time backwards, but the meetings between Viki and child Viki in Suikogaiden 2 and Suikoden 3 contradict each other. If Gaiden 2 comes first, which it does timeline wise. How did she not know child Viki in 3? And if she's experiencing time backwards, how did she not recognise child Viki in Gaiden 2 if they met in 3? Either way, she would've met herself at least once before. She might be a ditzy airhead about details, but she does remember people. I dunno, her whole timeline is a mess. Trying to make sense of it appears to be impossible.
In this instance, I believe it is implied that the jumping/warping/blinking damages her mind(I mean, if you think about it this does make sense seeing as she is just getting used to her surroundings and then suddenly you don't know where or even when you are and doing this repeatedly.) the younger Viki has not Traveled as often in this way as the older version so to me it would make sense that younger Viki's mind would be more intact.
Here's a thought: What if Child Viki is actually older? What if the wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey stuff is causing her to age backwards? Or maybe she ages inconsistently?
Maybe we're dealing with two Viki timelines here. Maybe she grew up and grew old the first time, so Viki and Hellion are the same person. But then somehow, as Hellion, she tried to change things but accidentally turned herself into a child. So now Child Viki is actually the oldest version of Viki, Teen Viki is the youngest, and Hellion is in the middle.
That's an interesting way of looking at it. I personally don't believe in the theory that Hellion has anything to do with Jeane, but it could be a possibility. Although the questions remain, why is Viki not aging? She's 16 in all of the games and the games last months - years each. Plus all three of them occupy different Stars. I think Viki is intended to be mysterious character with a confusing timeline that's impossible to make sense of, and something that may not be revealed until the end of her story, if she ever gets an ending to her story.
This theory about Viki and Helion is already debunked. They have two different SoD. One person can't have 2 SoD.
The answer, of course, is that Viki is a Time Lord. Her "World" is her TARDIS. Her staff is her Sonic Screwdriver. It makes about as much sense as any other theory for Viki could be.
I think the Viki from S3 claiming that she came from a Jowston celebration is a Jowston celebration from before the events of S1
I think that Lorelay was saved by her kid version, from the info that we gathered.
And all of sudden her teleport skill against enemies seems more terrifying after hear all that, lol 😂
Suikogaiden Vol 2 shows regular Viki being the one who meets Lorelai in the Deep Twilight Forest ruins. Child Viki has never had any encounter with Lorelai in any of the games or novels
But that may change in the future if the series continues.
@@CulganValya as a suiko fan I have no excuse to not have played suikogaiden yet, I remember from the kazaa time that I used to download the suikogaiden intros and wondering what was that.
@@williamzeo2493 They're fun games and they're definitely worth a playthrough. Both of the games have an alternate route for chapter 3. They're at least worth a watch on youtube. Very fun stories!
For me, viki is one of the enigma characters is all suikoden series, along with jeane
Viki has the TimeSpace true rune. The rune is embedded on the Blinking mirrors.
We don't know if there even is a Time Space rune. And what about Suikoden 1 and 2? She doesn't have the Blinking Mirrors in those games, and the rune being an object, and not embedded in her wouldn't cause her to gain the agelessness the runes provide.
@@CulganValya well maybe you are right... but then What if the viki's are one part of herself. Like a full mirror which has been broken and brought thousands of viki into the Suiko world as a reflection of herself but not truly one. Which is why she can remember glimpses of the suiko timeline as if she experienced it herself, but not truly as they are experienced through the other vikis. All the vikis are disciples of a higher being.
i like your critical thinking bro. good job
Appreciate it! I try to keep everything as critical and unbiased as possible.
I call her the derpy TARDIS for a reason
Plot Twist planned end of the series was Viki waking up from a disjointed dream, mumbling waffu. Thus, it was all one big dream of a very Imaginative girl.
Man....Could you imagine how awful that would be? That's Dexter and Game of Thrones ending level of bad. That'd be absolutely horrendous.
It sounds a bit like the time order from Dr Who with River Song meeting every time in the wrong order.
I've never watched Dr. Who so I'm unfamiliar with that, but that sounds interesting
I think she's incarnation of True Rune, Blinking Rune, she can transport between time and space, dont age. I mean her blinking rune always find the place where the war is gonna happen, besides nobody knows her hometown or somn. She might be related to Sindar cuz her nomadic habit, always disappear after the war ended and goes to another war.
I think she's the sindar
I never put much thought into the idea of her being an incarnation of a true rune. I think it would be more likely that's she's holding a true rune rather than she is one.
As for being a Sindar, I don't think so. She has a strange "home" she teleports to where she lives, where her child self lives. I think it's more likely she's simply displaced in time.
Interesting side note, but you continue to reference Suikoden III where Viki says she came from the City-State of Jowston. Sorry to add another timeline wrinkle, but the City-State ceased to exist after the events of Suikoden II, it was renamed Dunan. Now, it could be, during the feast the renaming hadn't been considered, or it could be from another timeline when, say, during the time of Clift the Crusader, the territories of Jowston and the Scarlet Moon Empire wrestled control of their territory away from Harmonia...now that I think about it, that would have been a much better entry for a prequel than Suikoden IV
Viki teleported away immediately following the war, either right before or during the feast. The nation wouldn't have been renamed at the point. It'd be hard to fill out all roles of government that quickly, that process took over a year. Shu left and went back to his old life as a trader a year later once they finally had a president and the roles filled out.
It can't be the time of Clift the Crusader, he was born 440ish years prior, and the City States of Jowston only formed in its infancy 150ish years prior to the game.
And 50-60 years before that, it was the Dunan Kingdom that had collapsed.
She definitely arrived in Suikoden 3 immediately following the war either before or during the feast.
True Runes are known to be sentient, so probably its the rune that is messing with her.
Perhaps she knows more on the things of yet to come. You may be right on Viki acting stupid for preventing a time paradox. I am wondering, why Viki doesn't have a scene with Leknaat. Leknaat might see her potential than the leaders of the series.
She very well might be. She does have some moments where she doesn't act like a ditzy airhead. It's possibly all an act with her. Who knows. Hopefully the series continues and we'll find out some day!
@@CulganValyaamen
She travels between words that why it's different that my guess base on suikoden tierkreis
Viki's been time travelling.
i think she looks best in II
i think its not just teleportation i think its cloning too .. i mean when her job was done in S1 her powers cloned her into a needed place with her memories intact hence we saw two Vikis in S3 .. so maybe there is multiple vikis just like Jeane .. i hope someone knows the answer to that besides Murayama may he rest in peace.
I always thought Little Viki was from a parallel universe rather than a clone. Viki herself could have a True Rune but we only see the Blinking Rune much like we only see a Wind Rune on Luc in S1&2 and the Eight Devil Rune on Yuber in S3.
I believe Jeane is an ancient android, possible Simeon too. Loving this Suikoden content btw!
Wait, there are MULTIPLE JEANES? Since when? How? How dare you give me the greatest news of my life without explaining?!
The multiple Jeanes theory is because Fumi Ishikawa (the character artist for Suikoden 2, 3, Gaiden 1 & 2, and Card Stories said during an interview in Dengeki PS Vol 217) that, "She doesn't seem like she has aged at all, but she doesn't have a true rune." She then says, "Apparently, Jeane's family all have the same face."
But Fumi Ishikawa has been wrong on things she has said in the past. For starters she said Hugo's dad has black hair, but Yoshitaka Murayama said Hugo's dad has blonde hair.
In Suikoden 3 Jeane has a bath scene with Lilly
Lilly: I'm not one to beat around the bush, so I'll get straight to the point. Did you serve in the Dunan Army during the Unification War?
Jeane: Me in the Dunan Army... Hee hee! Well... kind of, but kind of not."
Lilly: Well, which is it?
Jeane: Yes, which one... Well, let's say that yes, I did...
Lilly: Do you know Tinto's historian. Marlowe Cody? He also serves in the army. Recently, he came by the castle and apparently saw you
Jeane: Without offering so much as a greeting or a handshake...
Teasingly saying maybe I did, maybe I didn't, but then gives away that she knows Marlowe.
In Suikoden 3 she leaves letters in the suggestion box. One talking about Futch and addressing him as an old friend. They fought together during Suikoden 1 and 2. And another letter talking about Nash, calling him rude for asking why she hasn't changed. They met previously during Suikogaiden Vol 1 (which takes place during Suikoden 2).
In Suikoden 5, Viki leaves 2 letters in the comment box. One talking about Lorelai. Swearing she's never met her before. The other letter is about Jeane. In the letter Viki talks about them having met before. Lots of times, in lots of different places. So she doesn't remember Lorelai, but knows Jeane. So this can't be the Viki from Suikoden 1, 2 or 3 or else she would also remember Lorelai. So Jeane and Viki definitely had multiple encounters in the past that we've never seen in any games.
And in the Suikoden 4 bath scene between Viki and Jeane, I got the impression Jeane very clearly recognised Viki and was simply being coy. Viki's letter about Jeane in Suikoden 5 basically confirms they've met many times before.
In Suikoden 5 Jeane asks you to help her recover something she left behind in the ruins that are revealed in the crater that Levi created. But those ruins are from the Ancient Armes Kingdom, a nation that existed before Falena, and has been buried underground likely since before Falena was created. Meaning the ruins are well over 700 years old at that point. So Jeane possibly has a connection to the Ancient Armes Kingdom.
It's most certainly the same Jeane that's appearing in each game. But for whatever her reasons, she tries her best not to give anything away.
@@CulganValyathe secret is related to the old ruins in S5 which i think related to the Sindar
@@CulganValya I always suspected Jeane of being a god or demigod of sorts. A supernatural entity separate from the True Runes.
I believe that the correct timeline is 1,2,Gaiden,3,4,5
some her memory shall be erased in V due to the blinking rune effect
Unfortunately that doesn't appear to be her correct timeline.
Her appearances in Suikogaiden Vol 2 and Suikoden III directly contradict each other.
And her memory couldn't have been erased as you suspect in V due to the blinking rune, because one of the letters she leaves in the suggestion box is about Jeane. The letter says, "I've met Jeane before. Lots of times. In lots of different places. I wonder why we keep bumping into each other..."
Plus if V was her last appearance, she would already know Lorelai, as she would've met her three times prior. In Suikoden 1, Suikoden 2 and Suikogaiden Vol 2. But she has no idea who Lorelai is in V.
I suspect her timeline is meant to be a complete mess that makes zero sense to add to her mystery.
wrong. suikoden 4 was hundred years before suikoden 1 thats why ted is 300 yrs old in suikoden 1 and he appear in 4
Yeah and suikoden 5 as well since you have younger georg at suikoden 5 and older Georg at suikoden 2
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Oh Viki loves to teleport anywhere near the Main characters
Hhhmmmm just realised that no one is talking about Suikoden Tierkies
Why would they be? This video is about Viki, and Viki has nothing to do with Tierkreis.
Im just sad we will never gind out how she time travels.
Its most likely the character isnt meant to be deciphered, and is intentionally convoluted and confusing. The outfit isnt a good source of hints cause characters designs are usually modify between games, plus a character wont have different outfits in different games even if its unrealistic because of technical reasons.
Is there multiverse happening in suikoden universe
Considering they don't plan the games ahead of time, it's very likely they forget things over time or make something up and not realize it contradicted something prior or will in the future. They have to retroactively make up something for VIki with each new installment and that can be hard to keep up with, especially over years. I think little Viki is mature as a trope, to have the younger one be the opposite of her older self. I've seen it before in something, but can't name it now. To have that drastic of a personality shift requires brain damage, hypnosis, magic or something. Otherwise it's a creative choice that may not have a reason. One reason is Suikoden is pretty grounded. If Viki were to be normal, it would be a very dark, horrible fate to sneeze (randomly for whatever reason) and end up in different times and places. It would drive someone mad, so they made her personality ditzy to bypass the gravity of it and it becomes light-hearted.
Consider how lucky she is to never appear in a dangerous or fatal situation and die immediately. One can think she's being guided to some extent and would have to be in order to appear at pivotal events in history and run be necessity to such efforts. If not, the creator was doing so and would come up with an answer for it later, but Viki was a staple to have in each game along with other handful of characters. Characters that appeared later in series like the True Rune bearers in Suikoden III should appear in other games as well one would imagine, but they weren't a thing in first two entries.
As for outfits, I think it may be as simple as a character designer being a character designer. The outfits are all similar in color scheme and overall form. The two games that have the outfits the same I'm not sure about other than putting myself in the artist shoes and say they harkened back to a previous design for that game. Those were the games Fumi worked on, so those were her takes on her look and used it again. Think of it as the trope of characters wearing the same outfit all the time but never being an issue. Perhaps Viki is in the same outfit in each game, only the design from different artist is the thing that varies, but not an in-game fact.
This is the logical answer of course, the trick is trying to explain the logical conclusion with the pieces we have in a way that makes sense.
It's the same thing as explaining who won a wrestling match with "The booker said so"
@@planescaped It usually turns out to be these sort of things in games when you look into development. Seldom is much planned and it's notable if someone plans out a whole story years ahead, usually a pet/personal project if so. You just can't plan such things over years and years and keep up with it, along with have other members remember and be on the same page.
That's definitely the logical answer. There never was a grand overarching plan. So as planescaped said, all we can do is try to piece what we have together to try and make it make sense.
I don't think it's a case of forgetting something or not realising they contradicted something. Even though they didn't plan it all out, or keep records of everything, Murayama said in an interview that they regularly done continuity checks.
They've done tragic and somewhat dark backgrounds for other characters, but nothing to the level of how bad Viki's could potentially have been. But it also may not drive someone mad, she has never teleported into a location where she's was in actual immediate danger.
The only real consistency with her outfits are the colours.
The character designer for Suikoden 1 and 4 was Junko Kawano. Colour scheme is the same, but the outfit design is completely different.
Fumi Ishikawa was the character artist for Suikoden 2, 3 and Gaiden 1, and Suikoden Card Stories. Viki had the same outfit in 3 of those 4 games.
Is it just the designer being a designer and wanting to change things up? Maybe. Did they change her outfit for a reason? Also maybe.
We can make guesses, but we don't know for sure. We can only go by what we seen in the games and novels.
Seems like you talking bout steins gate...
the most "logical" and also boring answer would be "parallel universes".
due to your just released video about the secret dungeon in S2 having this new game + mechanic planned, which mentions "this world has million forms".
Viki having multiple different versions running around all the same time could have been an idea/reason for people knowing another Viki, than the one we know. buuut this would be boring.
as for some said contradictions there is also a possibility of a Suikoden 6 we never got, which could have filled a gap here and there.
leaving while eating -> "S6" -> leaving before eating. so this statement is about another unknown feast. but in reality its just a running joke made of her, so... yea no explanation needed/possible.
what i actually think (well want, and i don't accept anything else)
the game release time line is also her timeline.
and since i go for the "viki is THE Suikoden main character"-theory. going from one story to the next without much of a break due to time teleportation, winning every war. it fits the timeline. this also easily allows people to meet her, without she knowing, since its a future S6 version of her which ported back in time they met. so something that did not happened yet to the viki we know.
It might be boring, but it's very probable. Though as the content was unfinished and cut, we can't officially take it as canon.
I don't think her timeline is meant to make sense, and her story may never get resolved. They created Viki with the intent of her being mysterious and a jumbled timeline that makes no sense.
I guess it's just Rick & Morty continuity at this point
it's just a redesign of each chapter outfit lmfao