292 INTAKE SHOOTOUT-FAIL!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ย. 2024
- DYNO RESULTS!! STOCK v CLIFFORD v OFFY v PES! WHICH ONE MAKES THE MOST POWER? WHICH ONE MAKES THE MOST TORQUE? WHICH ONE REQUIRES THAT THE MOTOR BE RUNNING PROPERLY TO TEST? HOW MANY OF US TAKE SHORT CUTS? HOW MANY TIMES DOES THAT COME BACK TO BIT YOU? DOES WORKING ON A MOTOR EVER GO PERFECT?
![We Put All the Tricks into Newcomer Racing's Big Power Jeep Engine Build [Dyno Surprise]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YWcZMjA7ZgQ/mqdefault.jpg)
It's funny, Inline 6 guys love all Inline 6 engines brands be damned. I've had 300 Fords, 250 Chevy's, and 225 Mopars and loved them all.
Because only morons want rod bearings half the size.
Yep...Love my 200cid/3.3L Ford.
All SEVEN mains. And can run forever.
OHC Pontiac for me! Smooth and liked to rev.
@@wakjob961 You should look up the videos of the guys in Argentina racing the same engine. Big lumpy cams, triple weber carbs, straight pipes out the side turning 8000 rpm. The only difference between their engines and ours is they have a removable intake manifold. Wicked little engine.
I’ll take any old straight six. Don’t forget the AMC. 👍
Does it ever go perfect? Yes, always. I've never:
Busted my knuckles
Been burned by touching something hot.
Stripped a bolt.
Cross threaded a nut.
Cross threaded a bolt.
Got the wrong part(s).
Got the wrong parts again.
Lost tools.
Broke tools.
Bought the wrong tool.
Burrowed the wrong tool.
Made the wrong tool work anyway.
Performed a basic repair only to find out something mysteriously went wrong with a completely unrelated part.
Had to redo a basic job (mostly brakes).
Spilled any one of about 2 dozen fluids.
Broke drill bits.
Broke taps.
Broke a drill bit drilling out a broken tap.
Got dirt in my eyes.
Got rust in my eyes.
Got any number of over a dozen fluids in my eyes.
Got metal in my eyes.
Flashed my eyes with a welder.
Never once. ;)
hey you been watching me? isn't it fun
I would buy that t shirt. And I hate buying t shirts! Probably buy like 10 of em if they're a durable material that will withstand those aforementioned things that we all have definitely never done!
I have done all the the above, plus changed a tire and had the bottle jack loose pressure and the car come down on my fingers... thank god the spare was also flat and save my fingers from being broken. also getting ready to put the carburetor back on and I dropped a wing nut down the intake, past the intake valve and down in the the cylinder.... after replacing a blown head gasket. had to start all over again. and my personal favorite, showing off by doing a burn out after replacing a broken u-joint, only to break another u-joint.
You forgot the magically disappearing 10mm lol
Don't forget about your buddy helping you whose IQ is on par with a potato.
Dude. I love the vids. Just...the intro---and the conclusion. One word. Tripod. OMG. I had to look away. The shakes were killing me!
6 en linea mi motor preferido.durable y facil de reparar
Everything goes wrong after the auto parts store closes for the night...
FACT!
Every time
I feel that pain!!!!!
Thats when its beer thirty.
Every time!
Not if your a Buick Guy 😋😋😋😋😋😋😋😋😋😋😋
Did they ever make a triple Weber set up for these! Love to see this with a wild cam and head!!!😀Loving this 292 series of vid’s.
Yes they did
The head has Siamese ports, a triple Porsche IDA would probably be a nice intake
Would love to see that.
In Brazil is Very Common with triple weber
@@andrebcr I suspected that is where a webered set up would come from. Compression, porting, valves and a healthy cam would be needed first. And even then because of the stroke about 6000 rpm and it would be all over. Though probably as much as 350hp real. Or 500 in the pub!
So Richard, you are saying this test is pointless!
I’m sure he’ll enjoy that you pointed it out.
So it doesn't mean its not well grounded.
dalesince59 I don’t get the point.
@@johnhickman7922 me either im gonna have to dwell on it !!!
charles sowers I don`t think any of you have the capacity to dwell on it, this whole debate seems pointless.
The late version of these engines had an H.E.I.
Nuevo seguidor. Tengo una camioneta GMC HIGH SIERRA 84' motor 250 en linea, yo quiero hacer la conversión a 292, transmisión 700r4. Me gustan tus vídeos. Gracias por tus consejos. ❤
Get a Factory HEI. Remove a variable. It will be dead-consistent. Points=garbage.
He will once I gets in the the engine harder
Ballast resistor is needed.....
I believe the old GM with points ignition vehicles used a resistor (either ballast or resistor wire) to reduce the "electrical load" seen by the points. They "started" with the full 12+ volts going to the coil via a bypass circuit originating at the starter solenoid. Once running, they ran through the ballast resistor, reducing the voltage to the positive side of the coil.
Full 12 volts full time = very reduced points life.
Why do I know such useless info? I started hot rodding back in the "dual point ignition in my 370hp LT-1" era.
Looking forward to that old 292 making ~ 500 lbs ft and at least 370hp @ below 5000rpm with some old school dual carb boost.
Now let us all bow our heads and pray for really low run temps, good race gas, strength for the worn out ring lands in those ancient cast pistons, and strength for the weak ass, 6.760 inch long, SBC looking con-rods in that 6 lunged dinosaurs. LOL
Will an H.E.I from a seventies era 250 straight six bolt up on the old 292?
@@ronnelson7828 Not sure, a 292 is basically a tall deck long stroke 250 AFAIK. I'd guess a good possibility though.
it has one under the cap
@@richardholdener1727 are you sure your not confusing the condenser with the ballast resistor?
The ballast resistor is usually a rectangular white porcelain block with a terminal on each end. Usually not inside the cap, either.
@@richardholdener1727 if you are using the points and condenser to trigger an MSD box the points should last forever. Unless they are already compromised. You can sand them and bring them back to life. Emory board can work wonders.
I love to see you simply put an HEI distributor on this motor then redo the tests. When I switched to an HEI it seemed like it made a bigger difference than doing the intake and adding a 4 barrel. Of course the intake and carb will support all the other upgrades, but in stock form, the better ignition was a huge upgrade. I’m currently building a 292 and can’t wait to see how this series turns out.
i love inline 6's... built a 194 chevy in 1974, 60 milled head, w/202 & 194 valves and v8 springs with a TRW high lift cam (>600 lift) headers. over 250 hp. sold the chevy II (1967 sedan) to a local super stock racer. He ran so fast he had to cage the car... all done with my engine.
Stock points can not stand up to more power on the 6. I talked to Jack Clifford about running the carb sideways, symmetrical, on his intake. He said it flowed better straight, not how you ran.
Lump ports -big cam-compression-1/8” over bore -yes! 4” bore! Should =400hp!
Sissell/Kirby 12 port head =600 hp!
Dick Bertolucci pushed 4o% Nitro for 1200 hp. Still holds record at Sacramento Raceway.
Richard..!!..my Good Sir..!!!.
1st, I LOVE YOUR WORK MAN….!!🫶it!!..
…(Especially This Series).
2nd, I can not find the final intake/turbo/shootout
video…Can you PLEASE HELP & direct me to it/them?🙏😗🙏…..(I know you had to have finished the 292’ series by now) Surely.?, tell me it’s so..😬..Tell Meee!!!
🙏
Thanks, Brando
there is a turbo video up-but no intake shoot out
slap on a HEI instead of the points distributor
Really hope you finish this test one day. I'm looking to build a 292 for my C10 and this series has been really helpful and I feel like this intake test, especially the offy with double 2 barrels and turbo would be interesting to see
Richard was so upset that when he got home his Everlast bag failed before he could get a punch in.
Man I miss my 292 so much that i6 sound never gets old
A simple switch to an HEI distributor will get you more horsepower and smoothing running. I never thought it made that much of a difference until I replaced the points distributor on my Chevy 250 6 cyl. Plus with HEI you get longer dwell and aren't limited by point bounce, etc.😉
Lol, yep, goes wrong alot. I have a Jeep 4.0, Clifford Intake, Holley 390 4150 and copper gasket. Slapped it all together, chased my own tail. Though the Holley had issues tuning, etc. Took intake off and ports weeble/wobbled on my granite. Called Clifford, said it's normal, use a Felpro gasket. Lol. WTH? I used cork, but now going to flatten it and make a flange.
It never goes perfect, lol.
Bummer. I. Think. Most. Viewers. Here. Understand. How. Much. Time...n... effort. Go. Into. Changing. Manifolds.... just. Torque. Sequences. Are. Time. Consuming.... now. As. For. Myself.... i.ll. be. Watching... for. The. 2x4bbl. Test....I. have. Never. Seen. Quads. Onna. 6 cyl... before. And. As. Long. As. Your. Testing.... you. Might. Try... increased. Compression...for. cleaner. And. More. Complete. Mixture. Burn... at. 11 to. One. With. Sunoco. 94. Octane... headers. With. Split. Exhaust... will. Help... Especially. On. Naturally. Aspirated. Engine manifolds... and. If. You. Can. Find. The. Time.. maybe. The. Electronic. Ignition. Option... with. Some. Kind. Of. Fuel. Injection...even. if. After market.. t...b...i....is. available......it's. Amazing. What. These. Kids. Can. Do.. now. Days.... and. Get. To. Work.. properly. With. Improved. Results..... i.m. a...... . Man. Who. Appreciates. Your. Time. On. This. Older. But. Great. Engine. Thankyou. And. Have. A. Nice. Day...
If you get a chance could you run the 292 with one of the aftermarket manifolds and the stock 1bbl. carburetor. I think it would be interesting to see what only changing one thing would to the torque and hp curves..
Do a proper test, ya I get it. This is a budget. But come on. Put an HEI distributor on there and then test all the intake and carbs....seriously!
I'm an amc 258 guy so I'm loving this series of test you're doing. I do think you need to get real with cam changes and a head mill to get at least 9.5 compression. Also on the last test you turned the carburetor. I've had issues with the vacuum signal being stronger on the inboard primary. I personally run a offenhauser intake, Holley 600, voodoo cam and Rhoads lifters with 10.2 compression. Don't know about horsepower but my 3200 pound rambler runs 13.9 with 3.54 gears. Please follow through with all the 292 testing. You are doing testing we could never afford to. I believe it's results are accurate for all American six cylinder engines with intake and exhaust ports on the same side. Thanks bro.
Same here
You should wear a mask in the dyno room so you don't get covid-292 virus
I WANT 292 COvid
I would say everything goes perfectly about 50 percent of the time. The other 50% of the time a lot of cuss words are used and tools get tossed around my shop.
I like to cuss even when its going well-sort of preemptive-just for the future stuff
Can you dyno the points ignition vs a electronic ignition?
Too much carb kills your low end torque. Biggest 4 bbl carburetor I would attempt to use on that engine is a 390 cfm Holley 4160 carb with vacuum secondaries.
I have the same carb on my Ford 302 V8 and it is perfect. Very snappy and pulls well.
Don't fall for "More's Law" when it comes to carburetors!
When I lived in South Africa in the 1980’s...
Because I’m a gear head...I noticed everything automotive, when perhaps I should have been more aware of the history being made in front of my very eyes (I was in my early 20’s...that’s my excuse).
But instead...one of the automotive details I clearly remember was the 292 insignia on virtually all the grills of the right hand drive mid-70’s to early 80’s era Chevy pickup trucks ( note: no one drove pick-up trucks there... they were only used by businesses)
Yet, At home here in Michigan ( 30 miles from my house, where Chevy trucks are built). All the Chevy truck in that era had 350, 400, or 454 grill insignias... never ever 292...Never!
So....when I saw this vid. It brlriught me back to Johannesburg
Plz run it again with al new modern electronics and injectors will like to see hp. Compare to a modern 6 cylinder engine like jeep or similar
it makes more with a carb
Richard I was starting to get concerned. I was expecting this, this morning and well nothing.🥺 You've spoiled us. Keep up the good work.👍
change the points and condenser. Gap the points with a match book LoL.
My '72 Nova had a 250ci version of this engine. My only complaint was the misfires it had when it rained. The inside of the distributor cap used to collect moisture and condensation. Anybody else experience that with their old points automobile?
Yep. I had a 73 Malibu coupe with a 250 six cylinder. Everytime it rained, or drove through puddles, it misfired.
HELL NAH NOTHING EVER GOES RIGHT.thats why i blew up so much shit and thats how i got so damn good..haha
No ballast resistor ......points will be toast sooner or later. Probably sooner, if you are using stock setup instead of MSD white wire trigger input. Great 6 banger series, loving it.
Basics before you even try putting it on the dyno. Check everything electrical. IF the points failed every test has been a waste of time. Plug condition, coil condition and lead condition is always done before. And for an old gunker like that at least look at the valve springs for broken ones.
As for those carbs being sideways,, a Holley bowl goes to the front. That may not affect the dyno run but useless in a vehicle. And for that poor old thing it needs all the help it can. And a 600 vacc would be a better carb. Or even a 465. Max 3500 rpm does not need a very big carb.
Max power should be around 3500 an max torque below. And a failing ignition will screw the results.
And did you actually use 8Volts? Or a full 13volt? All GM stuff is 8 volts. Otherwise the points and condensor last about an hour. I suspect there is your problem!
Yea, please don’t abandon the 292. Even tho I don’t have one, I am still interested in knowing how this engine performs. Maybe install a electronic ignition, fuel injection, more turbo stuff. Very interesting how an older engine that has been modernized, can make more reliable power in today’s world.
I hope he puts the Lump Port kit in the head, it greatly increases air flow.
John Parrish
If I’m not mistaken, horsepower tv did a 292 turbo build and it was pretty rad. It sounded good, almost like a 2JZ.
Yes, please keep the project rolling! Very interested in seeing more results. :-)
The 74 or 75 and later inline 6 Chevy's do have HEI distributors. The 199 through 292 all use the same distributor so fine a 250 they are super common.
If you see an old engine and it isn't running right the problem is ALWAYS points, I repeat ALWAYS the points. Ignition points are the sole reason old cars had a reputation for unreliability. I would never use them in a build today.
Usted no sabe nada, no tiene idea, ni se es imagina como es, usted muestra un motor sin carga, usted le reemplaza diferentes componentes y sigue haciendo funcionar un motor sin carga, muy diferente es el mismo motor con carga, jalando y levantando rpm y velocidad jalando en tiempo real bajo condicion real, usted no sabe nada.
that is so disappointing...bad pun intended
I have bought 2 inline 6 chevy cars in the last few years, I don't even care how they are running, very first thing I do is HEI. points in a distributor is about the last thing I am going to have just out of nostalgia
I had a LS250 1968 Chevy C10 short bed step side with over 300 thousand miles 3speed Saginaw
Give Pertronix a call, see if they will send you one of their modules for that 292 .
Yes. Clifford did make a triple Weber intake. They at one time even showed a roots blower that bolted directly to the intake ports.
Should check with the Aussie companies they love straight sixes and have a lot cool stuff for em
I can't wait to see these intake combos compared on the modified engine - compression, cam and head, but having said that, it's been great to see how they all work on the stocker, as it'd be rare to see someone take such a path, particularly with the 'wilder' 4bbl variants. Loving this!!!
Why don't you try three single barrels, Like they would have in the fifties into the sixties
Put a Pertronix Ignitor in or HEI from mid-ish 70s till the end of production. It's one less thing you need to worry about. They don't need the resistive wire that points need to keep from premature wear.
Yeah, HEI!
I'd love to see you do this with a 300 6!
yes
The big ford one ?
Still want to know how the PES performs. Pretty please, come back and finish this!
Did you ever run the PES intake on the 292? I couldn't find the video?
I'm one of those "other guys" too. Building a 230 Chevy right now, doing extensive head work with upsizing the valves, lump porting the intakes, springs to match the cam and bolting on an Offy with a Holley 600. Any idiot with a credit card can do an LS swap.
lol
I think a HEI is needed. The spark plugs we get now are resistor plugs. and points ignition simply doesnt have enough poop in its pants to fire a resistor type spark plug at high RPM. The increased air flow is blowing the spark out like the wind blows the flame on a candle out. Ive ran a Offy 4 bbl intake with hedders and a HEI on a 250 engine in a 66 GMC pickup. It was great except for the lack of exhaust heat on the intake in colder weather. I got carb icing.
I remember when i was an apprentice and had a holden 173 (basically baby version of this engine) and changed to a HEI distributor and it made a huge difference. And no points to wear out!
a straight 6 is so reliable because it doesn't have enough power to blow itself up.
I bet David Freiburger pulls some of his engines out of lakes when no one is looking.
I have an atk 292
Moderate cam.
Hydraulic lifters.
Ported and decked head. Offenhouser intake. Holley sniper.
Hooked headers. Custom exhaust, Borla x muffler. 280 hp 400 ft lbs of torque
I for sure was expecting big gains like the Ford 300 gets.
This reminds me so much of Charlie Brown Christmas. Merry Christmas Richard!
GM rated several years of the 292 to put out peak torque at 1600rpm or less with the 1bbl
For the want of a nail.... At the beginning when you said you had a failure and it started missing I was afraid it swallowed a valve. Whew!
I would install pertronix electronic ignition and try again.
give the people the 3800 buick induction tests
Hey Richard , Thanks for giving us what you had on that stocker 292 , hope you are able to finish up soon like you had planned . Too bad you run out of time , good stuff man !! Thanks Dan Fager
If a motor is misfiring, the first place to look should have been at the distributor. Any hack mechanic would know this..... SERIOUSLY???..!!!!!!!!
IT'S MY FIRST TIME EVER RUNNING A MOTOR
Let's see you do a dodge slant 6 and then build the engine to make more power turbo, nitrous it doesn't matter I would like to see that. I've heard a lot of people building them but never seen them or how well they preform. Thanks for your time and your videos
yes on the slant
@@richardholdener1727 thank you so much for your videos sometimes I miss 2 or 3 videos but I try to watch all that I can. I like learning new things from someone that knows what they are doing. Thanks for your time and all the hard work you put in to your builds and videos looking forward to the slant 6 build that would be awesome 👍💯✌🇺🇸🗽
This isnt sloppy mechanics bro. Put points on it and keep going
Dont get me wrong. I love Sloppy.
Hopefully there is a resistance wire to drop the voltage down to 9. something so the points won't burn out again?
HEI uses all 12 + volts, hotter spark.
I was gunna, I was gunna, I was gunna...but I didn't.
Is this engine and shoot out ever going to be completed?
The 292 put in 63 model Chevrolet Impala
Evening Richard 😇 thanks for all the hard work and as always another great video I really appreciate it. I was thinking while you're going to be redoing everything how about stepping up a little bit and swapping out the points for an inexpensive electronic upgrade to something like a pertronix ignitor box instead of running a new set of points?. It's cheap reliable and efficient and should add a little more and the game's Department across the board?
Since you're a Ford guy and I'm a Chevy mechanic and worked at three dealerships I will tell you something about the old points..
. You have to hit with a dwell meter a perfect 31° of dwell... To maximize the blast of a Chevy coil now I imagine that it's probably the same for just about any coil because that 31° is hyper important so when you reset the points on that thing make sure that you hit it at 31 and you'll get the best ignition of the mixture that you can possibly achieve..
I'M NOT A FORD GUY-I'M AN ENGINE GUY WHO UNDERSTANDS DWELL METERS TOO
That's 650 Holly's too much fuel for that inline 6. You should have tried a 450 Econo Master Holly
These motors in Australia were downsized to 161,179,186 and 202 cid in our Aussie designed holden cars, engines are similar with slight differences .
Lindsay McPherson : Um, totally different engine block and heads with startling similarities. Not one part is common. The Vauxhall 3.3, Opel-Bitter 2.5/2.8/3.0/3.6/3.9 the Holden 149- 202, any of the Chev sixes ..nothing in common. Bore spacings on the Uk and Europeans, 4.125, Holdens, 4.08.Chev, 4.40. The Holden is a Bonsai GM six, but everything is different. Theres more similarity in a 250 Ford six...it shared the 4.08 bore spacing.
Because Holden copied it....
By god you`re honest. It`s refreshing. I enjoy your videos very much, I don`t have access to a dyno any more so I watch yours for any information I can get. I`d really like to see how you map some of those fuel injection parameters some day
How about some love for the ford inline 6? The 300 has big power potential and the 200/250 has aftermarket cylinder head support from vintageinline.com where one made 227 hp to the rear wheels NA... 🤷🏽♂️ just saying
That cylinder head is way expensive. It would nice if we could get some 2v heads over here from Australia for our Ford small block inline 6s.
It's so sad to not see this hit the 5252 marker. It's like a diesel. Love these old engines from before my time. Head and cam!!! Head and cam!!! If money permits.
The 292s have a really long stroke and a really long crank. You have to spend a lot of money to get them to live above 5K. But you can make a lot down low.
On another channel they got one with a stock short block except for hypereutectic pistons to 372 HP and 510 TQ all under 5K with 10.5 lbs of boost.
He's getting cams and a lump port head from 12bolt.com
I like your testinh but please get a tripod. You get to excited when you hold the camera. It is very shakey. Also I would never run an old engine I knew nothing about without doing basic tuneup, points, condensor, plugs, wires. Oil change and check the timing. Otherwise the test is just not accurate. And a new cap & rotor. Waiting patiently for the accurate test.
Richard, any plans to continue testing this engine, with a better HEI distributor and maybe a cam or two ?, or different rocker ratios on intake and exhaust
yes
I'm not going to say you made a rookie mistake, but not installing a new set of points when you strapped the motor to the dyno is a rookie mistake. If I had a dollar for every time a set of points caused an issue like that with me I'd be like $15 richer.
True but these days aftermarket parts for old stuff can be hit or miss. I’ve been bitten by a new, DoA condenser. I don’t blame him for thinking, “ignition seems good, let’s rock”.
The 292 inline six cylinder is a fun engine that deserves more horsepower and attention
Did you even change the oil and filter?
Oh man, you had me going. I thought the little 292 blew up lol.
Glad to to hear it's just the points.
Your right s@#t happens all the time working on cars.
Thanks for the test Richard.
I look forward to seeing that 292 clean with some new points lol
Please upgrade the valve springs before doing the test again. Heck go ahead and do some porting and angles on the head. Give these intakes more of a chance to show what they can do on top where their biggest gains will be.
Love that you show the failures- great video. Did I ever tell you about the time I got my 4cylinder, 5valve, DOHC fuel injected engine all set up and ready to go on the dyno, but it wouldn't start? They're like that when you forget to bolt the internal trigger wheel to the crankshaft. Never been so embarrassed.
Why didnt you make this test with a built motor? save money save time screw up your viewers no more vids will i watch of you on.
I (like most car guys) ran what I had-you will be missed
Yo Rich, when are you gonna quit messing around and put some cam in that thing?!
When we going back to the 292
Great stuff, really enjoying the good,the bad and the ugly of this engine.
Does P.E.S make inline intakes for Mopar, Ford, or AMC?
not sure
Wow good low torque numbers
I laughed when he mentioned something about crate motors working perfect. I think some builders don’t even own parts washers judging by what I’ve seen inside oil filters.
Sorry it didn't work out this go around! Look forward to seeing what the 292 will do after the points are fixed. Thanks Richard we enjoy your work! (Watch out for the shaky camera during intro/conclusion)
Richard...points? Shame on you...shame shame...
Points!
@@richardholdener1727 Ha!
It needs an hei at least not points
Don't forget the condenser?
Needs more fire distributor
Great job I'm looking forward to the redo keep it up brother
Get an HEI from a 250...
Would one of these or a 300 FORD hold together as a truck engine with turbo boost??? I have several of both engines and have been wandering about this for a long time , but don't have the $$$ to invest to make an oil slick. I have a 292 in a C60 12 ft dump truck I guess considered a 2-1/2 ton truck. It has pulled some monster loads but comfortable speed is around 48MPH , 55 sounds like a fire truck siren. I would like to use them in 3/4 or one ton trucks , and figured that a turbo would be just enough power to pull any tractors or loads we needed. Also our C60 gets better fuel economy than any bigger truck I've ever had.