Long story short - The 0W20 and the 5W30 performed very similar. I would feel comfortable using either. I will use the 5W30 just because the engine is now older, spaces will be slightly larger between bearings/etc. But as long as my fuel economy stays the same, I probably won’t go back to the 0W20.
Ah no the topic if clearances is bullocks. Tje same 1GR-FE 4rnr engine is used I new Zealand and Australia. Their owner manual states 5w-30 and 5w-40 for severe service. 0w-20 is for CAFE numbers and will get you past warranty. I will use 5w-30. YMMV Just take responsibility for your own decisions. 😊
There's no "one size fits all" with oil. If you're a spirited driver with a lead foot or if you tow or haul a lot of weight, then I personally wouldn't go below 5W30 or 0W30. If your car never sees high revs and you baby it, then those thinner oils will be fine. So many people say to only do what the manufacturer recommends. Some manufacturers recommend 10,000 mile oil changes and never changing transmission fluid. They will recommend what's best for their bottom line, not what will make the car last the longest. Manufacturers don't want your car to last forever.
This data proves there's virtually no difference in engine wear between 5W-30 and 0W-20. So it's ok to use whatever you feel comfortable using. Thank you so much for providing very informative data!!
Yes, I think you’re right. Data shows wear numbers being virtually the same, HOWEVER I did go longer with the 5W30 and my driving was NOT ideal during those months. Having said that, I’d feel comfortable using the 0W20. I guess the question I have going forward is…as the engine age and wear, would the 0W20 not do as well between the bearings/rings/etc?
My Nissan 3.5L calls for 0w20, I use Mobil 1 EP 5w30, that engine sounds better and runs better on 5w30, maybe its all in my head, but I have gone back and forth between those two grades and I think it runs better on 5w30
I recently upgraded my vehicle and got a 23 Toyota 4Runner. I did two quick break in oil changes 700km and 1300km respectively and lots of wear metal in both…. Did a third change at under 3000km. Virtually no metal…. Switched at that time to 5-30. Will do a 5000km change just to be sure no metal…… so surprised on how much wear in metal in this Toyota. I always do a couple quick changes in vehicles when purchasing them new. Anyway 5-30 it is .
The user’s manual recommends oil type and weight, ostensibly the engineers charged with providing the data did due diligence. Rather than fiddle with weights, maybe don’t run the oil to 10 or 12k and use the recommended weight and shorten the service interval. But it’s your machine, do what you like.
Good discussion. Those engineers are bound to the CAFE regulations set forth onto the manufacture…and those same engineers with this same engine used to recommend 5W30. In other parts of the world where this engine is used, up to 0W40 is recommended. Those long drain intervals I went on were done as an experiment, but I do my research prior, during and after. And the used oil analysis came back better than some would get if they were running their cars 5,000 miles. By the way, those same engineers you mention recommend 10,000 mile intervals on my car. For what that is worth.
It's not good in winter and if you drive hard it cavitates at the bearings and you blow engine sky high so just use what they said to use and change it more than less
A 0W oil will only be guaranteed to be thinner than a 5W oil bellow -35 degrees. I’ll never see those temperatures. They’ll perform very similar up until that point. And at operating temp the 5W30 will offer more high temperature high shear strength than a 0W20. So, I’m not giving anything up unless I’m going bellow -35…otherwise I’m possibly gaining something (as the oil analysis stated). This engine was recommended at 5W30 in its previous releases, and is suggested higher than that around the globe. Here in the U.S. CAFE regulations has a big hand in the thinner oil being chosen by the manufacturer to increase fuel economy.
@@marctorres2759 you’re right, I don’t think people understand just how much government fuel economy regulations in the U.S. determines what manufacturers are putting into engines in this country, while other countries use something thicker. I will say that my analysis with the 0W20 did fine, but the 5W30 performed just as good while going 2,000 miles longer in much more difficult conditions (higher speeds, cold temps).
I think it’s a high quality oil with superior base stocks and a very strong additive package. I think there are others that are just as good and quite a few nearly as good for most applications. I’d put Amsoil into that high end boutique segment with HPL and a few others. But they are expensive. I think it really depends on if you can get your money’s worth out of an expensive oil or not. I really can’t because I don’t push my engines that hard, or go that long between intervals. But if I was?? Yeah I’d go Amsoil every time.
Wouldn’t you say, clearances have gotten a lot smaller on modern engines? Tighter clearances. But I definitely agree with the lower tension rings, it’s an issue on some brands with these rings getting stuck in their grooves and coked up with soot and carbon. Direct injection made that worse. Leads to a lot of oil consumption and sometimes cylinder wall scoring.
@@doublebase6509 In my opinion the notion of “clearances” is a bit of a buzz word. I’m sure that bearing clearances have not changed since the 60’s. It’s only logical to assume that looser “clearances” along with thinner oil equals less drag and therefore better mpg. An oil film is very thin no matter the type of oil used. Believing that a thick oil in a modern engine would be too thick to properly lubricante is nonsense. I do believe however that a trade off must be made for finding the right viscosity for expected load and starting conditions as a thicker oil will undoubtedly cause higher startup wear. A thick oil has no place in something like a hybrid that starts and stops repeatedly even when cold and immediately revs up to 3000 rpm.
@@doublebase6509 you could run 25W60 in the 2GRFE and not cause significant damage so long as the startup temperature is not excessively cold. A 5W30 would definitely flow better at startup reducing startup wear however.
@@BeanDip125 to me it’s all about pumpability, the oil isn’t really flowing it’s being pumped. And therefore I think you’re right on all counts. As far as the cold starts, luckily I’m not in climates where I’m cranking my engine in -20 degrees weather. The coldest I’ll usually see is maybe 0 degrees once or twice a year. But the worst thing anyone can do is actually start their vehicle, luckily mine only has to crank over a 3-4 times a day. And I think you’re on to something regarding the clearances…my original video did show that the older 2GRFE had virtually the same clearances as the 2GRFE from ten years later. But I’m not sure how bearing clearances are across all brands right now. Maybe I’ll do a video on that next, might be interesting.
@@GeneG-wk2mz I agree with your mechanic on this one, but keep in mind because he is a mechanic people will say that mechanics aren’t good at giving advice on this topic because the engineers know best - when in fact the engineers are not actually making final decisions on this topic, it’s corporate along with warranty/marketing and everything else to meet CAFE regulations/maintenance parameters/marketing expectations.
@@doublebase6509 Thanks he teach mechanic school in Atlanta he finds the action problem . He tested all my solenoids in my zf transmission an found the one that was bad change it out new fluid in pan an filter went another 100k miles until I got hit in the back total it out
Do you know more than the engineers who designed that motor? Only use what the vehicle manufacturer recommends for that engine. Do not deviate from what is recommended for that engine. You're just asking for trouble
The engineers have little say in what is being put into this engine. CAFE regulations do. It’s clear you don’t have to run 0W20 - you certainly can - but 5W30 is not “asking for trouble”. The data clearly shows that.
@@doublebase6509 automobile company engineers and oil company r&d teams work together constantly to determine and develop the correct type of oil and oil viscosity for any particular engine to have optimal performance and fuel mileage for their customers.
Long story short - The 0W20 and the 5W30 performed very similar. I would feel comfortable using either. I will use the 5W30 just because the engine is now older, spaces will be slightly larger between bearings/etc. But as long as my fuel economy stays the same, I probably won’t go back to the 0W20.
Ah no the topic if clearances is bullocks.
Tje same 1GR-FE 4rnr engine is used I new Zealand and Australia.
Their owner manual states 5w-30 and 5w-40 for severe service.
0w-20 is for CAFE numbers and will get you past warranty.
I will use 5w-30.
YMMV Just take responsibility for your own decisions. 😊
There's no "one size fits all" with oil. If you're a spirited driver with a lead foot or if you tow or haul a lot of weight, then I personally wouldn't go below 5W30 or 0W30. If your car never sees high revs and you baby it, then those thinner oils will be fine. So many people say to only do what the manufacturer recommends. Some manufacturers recommend 10,000 mile oil changes and never changing transmission fluid. They will recommend what's best for their bottom line, not what will make the car last the longest. Manufacturers don't want your car to last forever.
I think this is probably the best post I’ve seen on any oil related video on TH-cam.
This data proves there's virtually no difference in engine wear between 5W-30 and 0W-20. So it's ok to use whatever you feel comfortable using. Thank you so much for providing very informative data!!
Yes, I think you’re right. Data shows wear numbers being virtually the same, HOWEVER I did go longer with the 5W30 and my driving was NOT ideal during those months. Having said that, I’d feel comfortable using the 0W20. I guess the question I have going forward is…as the engine age and wear, would the 0W20 not do as well between the bearings/rings/etc?
My Nissan 3.5L calls for 0w20, I use Mobil 1 EP 5w30, that engine sounds better and runs better on 5w30, maybe its all in my head, but I have gone back and forth between those two grades and I think it runs better on 5w30
I recently upgraded my vehicle and got a 23 Toyota 4Runner. I did two quick break in oil changes 700km and 1300km respectively and lots of wear metal in both…. Did a third change at under 3000km. Virtually no metal…. Switched at that time to 5-30. Will do a 5000km change just to be sure no metal…… so surprised on how much wear in metal in this Toyota. I always do a couple quick changes in vehicles when purchasing them new. Anyway 5-30 it is .
Yeah those first few changes really toss out high metals and moly numbers. I love the 2023 4Runner. Should last you a long time. Good luck with it!
The user’s manual recommends oil type and weight, ostensibly the engineers charged with providing the data did due diligence. Rather than fiddle with weights, maybe don’t run the oil to 10 or 12k and use the recommended weight and shorten the service interval. But it’s your machine, do what you like.
Good discussion. Those engineers are bound to the CAFE regulations set forth onto the manufacture…and those same engineers with this same engine used to recommend 5W30. In other parts of the world where this engine is used, up to 0W40 is recommended.
Those long drain intervals I went on were done as an experiment, but I do my research prior, during and after. And the used oil analysis came back better than some would get if they were running their cars 5,000 miles. By the way, those same engineers you mention recommend 10,000 mile intervals on my car. For what that is worth.
The engineers do not have the final say in anything...it's the bean counters. Don't look to manufacturers for oil advice.
@@rickss69 I could not agree more. And I imagine it’s very frustrating for them (the engineers).
Do you think I could do this on a 2015 Corolla 1800cc in uk , 0w20 is very expensive here compared to 5w30 ?
A lot of folks do and swear by it, but I personally haven’t researched it. I bet it would be fine but do some research first
It's not good in winter and if you drive hard it cavitates at the bearings and you blow engine sky high so just use what they said to use and change it more than less
A 0W oil will only be guaranteed to be thinner than a 5W oil bellow -35 degrees. I’ll never see those temperatures. They’ll perform very similar up until that point. And at operating temp the 5W30 will offer more high temperature high shear strength than a 0W20. So, I’m not giving anything up unless I’m going bellow -35…otherwise I’m possibly gaining something (as the oil analysis stated). This engine was recommended at 5W30 in its previous releases, and is suggested higher than that around the globe. Here in the U.S. CAFE regulations has a big hand in the thinner oil being chosen by the manufacturer to increase fuel economy.
@@doublebase6509 people just don't understand that. The same vehicle and engine outside the US calls for O5W30.
@@marctorres2759 you’re right, I don’t think people understand just how much government fuel economy regulations in the U.S. determines what manufacturers are putting into engines in this country, while other countries use something thicker. I will say that my analysis with the 0W20 did fine, but the 5W30 performed just as good while going 2,000 miles longer in much more difficult conditions (higher speeds, cold temps).
Amsoil is superior oil in my opinion.. Especially with turbo motors that produce a lot of heat!!
I think it’s a high quality oil with superior base stocks and a very strong additive package. I think there are others that are just as good and quite a few nearly as good for most applications. I’d put Amsoil into that high end boutique segment with HPL and a few others. But they are expensive. I think it really depends on if you can get your money’s worth out of an expensive oil or not. I really can’t because I don’t push my engines that hard, or go that long between intervals. But if I was?? Yeah I’d go Amsoil every time.
Clearances have gotten BIGGER in modern engines. Parts being further apart means less friction. Look up low tension piston rings.
Wouldn’t you say, clearances have gotten a lot smaller on modern engines? Tighter clearances. But I definitely agree with the lower tension rings, it’s an issue on some brands with these rings getting stuck in their grooves and coked up with soot and carbon. Direct injection made that worse. Leads to a lot of oil consumption and sometimes cylinder wall scoring.
@@doublebase6509 In my opinion the notion of “clearances” is a bit of a buzz word. I’m sure that bearing clearances have not changed since the 60’s. It’s only logical to assume that looser “clearances” along with thinner oil equals less drag and therefore better mpg. An oil film is very thin no matter the type of oil used. Believing that a thick oil in a modern engine would be too thick to properly lubricante is nonsense. I do believe however that a trade off must be made for finding the right viscosity for expected load and starting conditions as a thicker oil will undoubtedly cause higher startup wear. A thick oil has no place in something like a hybrid that starts and stops repeatedly even when cold and immediately revs up to 3000 rpm.
@@doublebase6509 you could run 25W60 in the 2GRFE and not cause significant damage so long as the startup temperature is not excessively cold. A 5W30 would definitely flow better at startup reducing startup wear however.
@@BeanDip125 to me it’s all about pumpability, the oil isn’t really flowing it’s being pumped. And therefore I think you’re right on all counts. As far as the cold starts, luckily I’m not in climates where I’m cranking my engine in -20 degrees weather. The coldest I’ll usually see is maybe 0 degrees once or twice a year. But the worst thing anyone can do is actually start their vehicle, luckily mine only has to crank over a 3-4 times a day. And I think you’re on to something regarding the clearances…my original video did show that the older 2GRFE had virtually the same clearances as the 2GRFE from ten years later. But I’m not sure how bearing clearances are across all brands right now. Maybe I’ll do a video on that next, might be interesting.
Clearances don't change
did you burn any oil over your oil change interval?
Very very little over 12,000 miles. Maybe half a quart.
My mechanic said always use 5w 30 even if it say 0 20
@@GeneG-wk2mz I agree with your mechanic on this one, but keep in mind because he is a mechanic people will say that mechanics aren’t good at giving advice on this topic because the engineers know best - when in fact the engineers are not actually making final decisions on this topic, it’s corporate along with warranty/marketing and everything else to meet CAFE regulations/maintenance parameters/marketing expectations.
@@doublebase6509 Thanks he teach mechanic school in Atlanta he finds the action problem . He tested all my solenoids in my zf transmission an found the one that was bad change it out new fluid in pan an filter went another 100k miles until I got hit in the back total it out
Do you know more than the engineers who designed that motor? Only use what the vehicle manufacturer recommends for that engine. Do not deviate from what is recommended for that engine. You're just asking for trouble
Square. The question is....do YOU know more?
The engineers have little say in what is being put into this engine. CAFE regulations do. It’s clear you don’t have to run 0W20 - you certainly can - but 5W30 is not “asking for trouble”. The data clearly shows that.
The same engines outside the US are recommended to use 0530 by the manufacturer.
Wow grow up, what a troll😅
@@doublebase6509 automobile company engineers and oil company r&d teams work together constantly to determine and develop the correct type of oil and oil viscosity for any particular engine to have optimal performance and fuel mileage for their customers.