TWA B 727 LANDING AT STL, COCKPIT VIEW
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ย. 2024
- TWA B727-200 LANDING R/W 30L STL, VISUAL, (Added Dec. 2) When this video was made, the intro music of "St. Louis Blues" seemed appropriate. The source of that music was a piano roll that was a collaboration of "Blues Tone Music Rolls", John Arpin and myself. John, who died in Nov. 2007 was the pianist. Several new postings in his honor are on You Tube. Hence, this note to identify John's work, even though the sound bite is brief.
The best eras of aviation,1960s to 1990s. Now we have quiet and boring airplanes. My first plane ride was on a McDonnell Douglas MD80. I remember taxing and seeing DC10’s, Boeing 727s, Tristar L1011s, DC8, Boeing 737-200, DC9 etc while looking out the window. How times have changed.
727, l1011 best planes ever
My friend who's a commercial airline pilot thinks is funny how people think of the 60's and 70's as the "golden era" of flying. There were so many accidents during those years due to design flaws or lack of CRM. The reason we don't have as many major accidents today is because of what we learned from the disasters in the past. Today is definitely a much safer and better time to fly.
The video was made in July, 1999. Reducing the power too soon on landing would generally result in a very firm arrival. Some people explain this by saying the engine thrust at landing attitude does have some vertical component. The ideal touchdown occurs at the same instant that power is fully reduced. The 727 does not glide power off in the flare unless the speed is excessive.
Superb! If you’re reading to this, this video when was first uploaded was an inspiration for me to become a pilot! I fly a 73 now! Thank you, sir!
Back when pilots really flew passenger jets
Now the Jets, "Fly you" into the ground, into a mountain side, into a building, into the ocean, as everyone goes, "Humm, what possibly could have gone wrong. Oh shit, we forgot to tell them about 'that switch'!!
amen to that pilots loved it back then 70s 80s
Yep, and lot of them learned their stuff in the military, tons of WW2 vets keeping things safe, up until forced to retire in the mid-late 1980s...
Unbeleivable footage!!! *****
Airforceproud95 Omg I found you
From back in the days of only subsonic hot air balloons :-/
yo? is that groundpound69?
@Karmen Gallamore You're advertising your scam in a virtually dead reply section?
Here you are bro
The Hangar 12 crew was great. I remember a huge snow storm that shut down everything. The guys went out to Southern State Pkwy in the tractors, and brought people into the hangar, and put them in empty 707's, and showed movies! The commissary guys fed them, the hangar guys kept them warm with APU power. And, I heard, someone even delivered a baby! How could you not be proud of that.
@ie210 Yes, the speedbrakes are manually deployed. Some airlines did have them with the "auto deploy" option. Only three 727's were delivered to TWA with that option, but the option was removed after delivery.
When I was growing up in the 1980s, the 727 is the jet gave me the, "flying bug". The sound of those JT8D jets, and the sleek proud lines. But alas! I was born too late. As I got older and started seeing these birds dwindle for quieter, basic, cookie cutter planes, I knew I wouldn't make a career out of it. the 727 is all I used to ever want to fly. Thank you for sharing this. I can live vicariously through the gentlemen in this video. With analog instruments and actual hands on, "pilot in command" flying, the 727 is a pilot's plane. Again, thank you for sharing.
Same here. I grew up flying in the era of the 727. I always felt it was the most jet-looking of all the airliners.
Planes today, like most things, have become boring & generic.
As an engineering lab tech, I had the pleasure of helping develop the Sperry SP-50 AFCS (autopilot) for the 727, then wrote several of the maintenance manuals. Always had a fondness for this bird.
The systems you had a hand in always seemed just fine to me. No complaints.
It was also an exciting time in electronics. Until the SP-50, earlier autopilots used vacuum tubes. With the SP-50, we learned much about semiconductors. Temperature stabilization was a whole new experience.
Pilots who flew the older versions of the 727 learned to be aggressive when activating reverse thrust. The levers were difficult to move. Later, the linkage and cable system was equipped with Teflon bearings, and the levers worked much easier. The technique was to bring the levers rapidly up to the 12 o'clock position, where an interlock stopped the levers until the clamshell doors (reversers) moved.
Great video! I was hired by Delta in '88. I spent 1.5 years on the panel of the 72 and then 5 years in the right seat before moving on to the 76/75. Fantastic airplane. Thin swept wing with remarkable high lift technology for slow speeds. A bit underpowered by modern standards but it was fast once it got up a head of steam. One of the best to fly in a gusty crosswind.
Yep,TWA was great. And so was the 727.
Sure miss the ole 727. One of the best handling airplanes I've had the pleasure of flying, and there've been a lot.
The L-1011 was an easy bird to fly too.
I find myself coming back to this video time and again!
I think all respondents realize now that this is pure 727. The comments to the contrary were not malicious. It is a learning and sharing experience. That was the spirit of this post. My cockpit was not one of high drama, so the You tube should be the same. Let's have fun.
+ampicoab could you please transcribe the short exchange after the "Later that night" title??? (I am not a native English speaker... ;0) Thank you!
You were probably a captains CAPTAIN!
That's what I call a cockpit!
The ending is perfect. :) Great video, thanks for sharing.
When I lived in Chicagoland, I was under the 14L approach pattern. O'Hare was my base, then. Great airport, great city.
outstanding flying bob! my dad was with delta in stl for 30 yrs and proudly retired. i spent most of my juvenile hours in the air in those 727's and miss them deeply. it is still my favorite and i respect the old rusty knuckles vets that took their controls! you good ole boys sure are a dying breed. thanks for your service!
Prompt and aggressive reverse thrust application gives the best results. Slow, smooth application allows the engines to spool down, thus delaying reverse, and the point of maximum aerodynamic drag for braking occurs immediately upon touchdown. While the application is prompt in this vid, the amount of power applied is modest. In the cabin, the ride is smooth and not abrupt.
The 727 can have the reverse applied while the nose wheel is still off the ground. Almost no wheel braking is needed.
Those were the real pilots, mechanics and planes!
I loved sitting in my backyard & watching the jets departing & en-route to DFW. I miss the 727's. Don't see them anymore. You could always tell one from the sound, long before you spotted it in the sky.
I did as well in the early 1980s from our yard in Grapevine. I liked that Braniff painted their planes different colors. Made it fun to fly as a kid because we'd guess which color our plane would be.
Yes I come from Australia and many's the time the 727's would take off over our house in Brisbane and all the plates would rattle .I was probably the only person in the suburb who didn't mind .They were great aircraft both to look at and fly in
what a great plane. Really changed commercial aviation as we know it today by having the ability to access smaller airports, thus opening jet routes that were previously not possible. Many people forget the 727's historical significance here
guitarman 727 was DB Cooper's plane
Cooper is the reason the rear doors were sealed.
The hand must transfer from the spoiler lever to the reverse levers, and to be effective, it must be done quickly. In a crosswind, slowly deploying the spoilers can have unpredictable results and is not recommended. Both these controls are aerodynamic braking, which means they are most effective at high speed. In this landing, the wheel brakes were only briefly used as the prior aerodynamic braking slowed the A/C to taxi speed, smoothly and economically.
Nice landing Capt. Bob; even with the thermals, you make landing “Miss Piggy look so easy. Truly the mark of a consummate professional airman.
I miss TWA. Flew them often out of St. Louis. I might have been on that flight.
Thank you.
The spoilers are deployed immediately after touchdown. On this aircraft that is done manually with the pilot's right hand. The pilot then uses his right hand to reverse the thrust of the engines. The two movements happen very quickly.
At 3:55 you can see the pilot pulling the reverse thrust levers aft. Above the engine instruments, the amber "Reverser Operating" lights can be seen. The action was too fast to pan the camera.
The frame at 3:55 is this channel's icon.
cap's so calm he's almost singing out the commands
Love the old birds. I've talked briefly with a few pilots and they all raved about the 727. Seemed to be all you'd see at airports stateside for years. Nice video, thanks.
Ahh, the old 72...she stole my heart almost 40 years ago, and she still refuses to let go :-)
I sure miss TWA
Same here. I flew on TWA (as a passenger) from New York's JFK to Copenhagen, Denmark via Kastrup. Great flight and great service! I believe that was on board one of their Boeing 747-100 series.
Me too
@@nenblom
Thank you.
Thank you.
You and me both. I flew (as a passenger) from TPA to JFK in 1996 or 1997 on a TWA Boeing 727-200.
@garyleak Actually, the first officer made the call out, "Half to go". During climbs and descents, the pilot not flying calls out, "one to go" when approaching by 1,000 feet, the assigned altitude. When air traffic control gives only a 1,000 foot altitude change, then the call out at 500 feet before the assigned altitude becomes, "Half to go". Before this approach begins, a 1,000 foot descent was issued, and the 500 foot call is heard. Good question!
The Boeing 727 is my 2nd favorite single-aisle airliner (A320 being my #1). Always enjoyed flying that old bird in flight simulator, never boarded a real 727, but still have the pleasure to fly it virtually.
Back when a flight deck looked like it belonged in an airplane instead of an office cubicle
Wonderful and well managed approach and landing Capt Bob.The epitome of Pilot In Command. Smooth operator!. I flew my Commercial Pilot checkride (trained by a TWA Capt who owned a school in St Charles county near ST Louis) in similar conditions on an afternoon of Aug 11th 1990 at St,Louis Lambert field I was awarded my Commercial Single and Multi engine Pilot license. I will never forget that hot sweaty bumpy after noon(flew with my shirt unbuttoned). I will also never forget one of the hardest landings I ever experienced there on a TWA 727 from JFK. We might have flown through a windsgear but pilot did chop power hurriedly still in the air.. I did the 727 FEX exams earlier in 1990 but never got to fly this beautiful bird which is as old as myself.I got close to getting jobs on it twice in Yemen and Kenta. . I am currently on furlough PIC of VIP Embraer Legacy 650.I yesterday applied for a 727 -200F job in Africa and am expecting an interview.I am so excited at flying this old girl to punctuate my career with some invaluable history. It beats the excitement I had when I trained on my first Jet CRJ and a short while later on. A320 in 2010.I did my Legacy 650 initial type rating at FSI in St,Louis too in 2014.Watching this video takes me back home in terms of my career at St,Louis Lambert field.Thanks again Bob. Let’s chat over the 727 techniques sometime. I hear there is a difference between the 727-100 and 200 which requires some unusual methods in rotation and flare. Also saw some operators dropping Flap 40 after nose wheel on ground to help further with braking. Why was Flap 40 banned? I flew a single engine approach and GA on a Microsoft Sim and it was unbelievably manageable but high speed required. A minimum of 160KIAS I recall but closer to 180 at the heavy weight I had. .Best regards skipper!
I love tri-holers! The 727 is a rare site, even here at KLAX. Great video, great approach, great landing, great handling by the skilled pilot!
I miss jump-seating in the 727, Beautiful bird.
Absolutely admire this bird! I remember as a young boy, my uncle worked for Fed-Ex, just as the 727 was beginning to retire from the commercial fleet and emerge as a cargo backbone for Fed-Ex and UPS. He flew the 727 for 20 years before retiring into general aviation as a CFI. He comments on missing the "sport's car" like feel of it's handling characteristics. The 727 is so primitive and basic in it's operation that it could easily qualify as a giant Cessna! Even it's autopilot was common of what is seen typically in today's GA aircraft!
As you correctly stated earlier, the loud beep tone in the first part of the vid is the gear warning. Later, two types of altitude alerts are given. The first sounds at 500 feet radar altitude. The second starts softly and gets louder and stops sounding at 100 feet radar altitude. At both times the first officer makes the appropriate call out identifying the event and giving the speed and sink rate at the 500 foot tone.
@xylotone0110 Really a nice comment. Thanks. I did many flights from Lambert to Florida during the time you mentioned. Perhaps I gave you a ride!
That was very well done!! Great job, pilots and thank you for the upload!! RIP TWA and we thank you.
Teedub was a great airline and the three holer was a great airliner!
Nice video.
R.I.P., John.
Thank you for posting this Bob! My 5 year old son wanted to watch some actual cockpit vidoes of real airline pilots in action, and this was the first one I showed him. He was in absolute awe! It took me back to when I was a boy taking my first airplane ride at 5 years old. It was on a TWA 727 in 1979. My dad was in the air force, and we'd been transferred from Carswell to Anderson AFB, Guam to begin his stint as a B52 pilot. The 727 took us from DFW to LAX where we took a 742 to Hawaii and then Guam. I'll never forget how awesome the 72 looked sitting on the ramp! That was a real airplane. I'll never forgot the Captain and flight crew either. They looked like pilots, acted like pilots, and were even dressed like pilots without a wrinkle on their shirts to be seen. Partway through the flight, a flight attendant asked me if I wanted to see the cockpit. I'm sure my dad put them up to this, but it was something I'll never forget.
Hope you are enjoying every bit of your retirement!!
I almost forgot.....that pilot greased the landing just like you did!
Have a similar story. My parents put me on a plane by myself to visit my grandparents when I was 5 from Lambert to Stapleton in Denver. TWA was the operator so likely a 727. I was fascinated by aviation as a young boy as my Grandpa was a retired pilot and col in the USAF. The flight attendants were very kind and took me to the cockpit when we cruising to speak to the pilots. They gave me a goody bag with the little toy golden pilots wings!
Hey, the auto exposure on the camera was going nuts as it was panned inside to outside among the cumulus clouds. Too bad we couldn't improve that.
Thanks for the comments, and nice to have you along for the ride. Too bad the jump seats are empty when so many would love to ride up front. It was a fun job.
Love the 727!!
We have the cockpit to one of these at my A&P school it’s so funny to watch airline pilots actually put a real conscious effort into actually flying the plane
Great landing, I've always heard the 727 was hard to land soflly....I guess you had to get to know her. Thanks for the video! I remember at TL watching 727s takeoff and all the car alarms going off
!
The times when you grabbed the reverses like you were grabbing a thief by the collar
Wow! Nice video. Always flew TWA in the 50's, 60's and 70's and especially overseas.
The classic 727 is back!
@exexwhy Sorry I missed this question earlier. It was a passenger flight in the month that I retired. My retirement flight was a baseball charter, and it may be posted later. Thanks.
Now that is flying!! No FMC or Auto Pilot, just your skills!!
@ampicoab Just a little trivia. Captain Gordon Granger had all TWA aircraft lights switches reversed before delivery from the factory. So Captain Bob is actually turning off the landing lights. As a 727 Check Airman for over 5 years, I too miss "Miss Piggy" as we affectionately called the 727s. The 727 really loved the ground if you pulled the power off too soon so I told my students "leave the power on until you get to the gate"!
What a great clip! and a great demeanor with that pilot!!! 5* !!!!!!!!!
RIP TWA and 727 ❤❤ Hard working pilots!!
Very well done! Love the "Crew meals" segment. Excellent footage of a classic. Thanks for sharing.
Impressive to watch...wow.... great respect for these guys!
Y is it
TWA: one of the great airlines in the annals of aviation history. Sad to see it go.
Those were the days! Hand flying the STAR and the approach. This captain is a craftsman of aviation.
For this captain it was like driving to the store! Incredible!
@sgilman I lived in StL for a few years. I used to hang out on the other end of this runway. There was a little car park under the approach path. Since it was higher than the runway surfaces, you got a great view of arriving flights. There was also an ANG base with 4 or 5 F-15s. I worked at McDonnell Douglas and sometimes would often stop there after work to let the traffic die down. TWA had a lot of 727s even near the end. You tend to forget what a big airplane it is.
This is the only cockpit video of a TWA jet that I can find on youtube. I've watched it about 2 dozen times since you uploaded it in 07. THanks again.
I fly a CRJ and always try to hand fly the approach if the weather permits.
No there an TWA 880 cockpit video on TH-cam
Old 727 was my class plane when getting my FAA - Air Frame & Power plant license at TWA. Not many A & P can say that, most are stuck with Cessna little planes when going to technical school.
I had both the B727 and MD80 as class airplanes for my A&P license in 1986.
best plane ever built..need the 727-300
I miss these old birds, such wonderful solid airplanes!
TWA was a great airline. I flew their non-stop 747 service from HNL to STL and back several times while stationed in Pearl Harbor.
TWA.. Class airline.. Not only did I fly on TWA back n forth to the states from CDG for 10 years, where I spent my childhood growing up as an expat, but 16 years later I flew for TWA, 727/767 FO. The employees of TWA made the airline a class company to work for. I truly miss all them and I miss working for one of the last great and influential pioneers of the aviation world. So very sad how the new generation, and I can say its true, have never heard of TWA.... Such a shame...
No, many commercial flights land using visual approaches. However, almost all flights are conducted on IFR (instrument) flight rules. In other words, IFR flights can make visual approaches and landings. The flight is still on an IFR flight plan even though it makes a visual approach. The flights at Laguardia often land using the "Expressway visual approach", as an example.
I miss the "workhorse". Thanks for the video.
Great ol bird, and fun to fly. Nice landing btw :-)
@LoadedSaiga Even with the handles stowed, the wheel and its notched area for the handles, can give a jolt to the Capt. right knee, and copilot left knee. If either handle is extended, the trim paddle cutout switch should be off to preclude a very strong whack on the knee.
@patjparks That is a good question by a good observer. Yes, tower put someone on the runway for takeoff and advised us of that fact. It means slowdown if you want to land. We did by immediately extending the gear and the spacing worked out great.
A classic airline AND a classic airliner! Great job!
I really miss TWA,........thank you for posting this & God Bless you.
And thanks to you for the memory lane trip....I was in your area a lot when I was at LRD (AFB).
Excellent landing!
What I wouldn't give for a flight on the 727 again.
Indeed it is! Same goes for Pan Am, those were the good old pioneering airlines!
good old fashion flying right here buddy! thx for sharing!
Still B727 crazy, even after all these years.
Miss the old iron! Flew on all the them (as pax) back in the day. Spent some time on the ramp with Delta 30 years ago, lots of 727, L1011, MD80. And couple years later, fueled FedEx 727 almost every evening. Definitely a great airplane!
I miss TWA and all the traffic at Lambert that disappeared with it.
Wow, that was very cool. Thanks for posting it!
@malibularry Everything about the 727 was unique!
Loved to have the AC packs running on the ground in a humid environment and the condensation streaming out of the overhead vent by 1L. The sound of all three engines in cruise - sounded like a well synchronized machine. Let's not forget the windscreen "noise" from those "square" angles on the front.
former f/a and Flight Service Manager for TWA 1974-1987...joined the US NAVY NURSE CORPS 1987-2014. Was a flight nurse (Go figure) and loved what I did! Sad to leave TWA...Sad to see TWA go to American. Good thing I didn't stay on.
Rob and Rick- Chudej-Martin Thanks for your comments, and thanks for your military service!
My pleasure :)
@flirjock The left thumb switch is the electric trim switch. It is used to retrim as the aircraft slows, thus relieving the pressure the pilot has to hold on the wheel. The trim switch turns a wheel, not seen, that is rather noisy.
Thank you make you appreciate history
I love this video, thanks for posting/sharing.
I only have my PPL but have flown the 727 in a simulator a few years back now. I also love flying it in flight simulator ;)
Dreamfleet did a great job of recreating it.
Lovely. Non pilots should note the constant aspect. Which means note how the runway is kept in the same position in the windscreen when flying a stable approach. That is achieved by coordinated inputs on the three primary controls, elevators, aileron and rudder. The target airspeed is achieved with incremental adjustments to power.
Man I miss those times!
I have sat jump seat many flights ... used to work hangar 12 JFK...cool vid
*Really fantastic video/upload...thanks!!*
that is some serious yoke movement over thresh hold! Ground effect, x-winds? Amazing piloting skills. The 727 is the BEST! shame its gone :(
Thanks for sharing.
Hand Flying an uncoupled approach is almost unheard of. I remember that version of 737 with that Radar and Auto Pilot. Worked on quite a few of them. it is amazing how Technology has changed. 727 still in existence today after almost 50 years... I bet an Airbus (started in 2001) will never have a plane lasting this long... Look at the Airbus Cracks. I love the Vintage Boeing. Yesterdays Technology... Got to love it. So much easier to work on.
The radar altimeter makes the tone when the aircraft descends through 500 feet above the ground. The pilot not flying calls out the airspeed and sink rate at that time.
Question: What are you going to miss the most about flying?
Response: Crew Meals! (not serious)
The video was made during the last month of my pilot career-mandatory retirement at age 60
When this video was made, the intro music of "St. Louis Blues" seemed appropriate. The source of that music is a piano roll that I collaborated on from "Blues Tone Music Rolls". John Arpin, who died in Nov. 2007 was the artist. Several new postings in his honor are on You Tube. Hence, this note to identify John's work..a great pianist.
Damn I miss this jet!!
And that's the way they did it in the "old" days. That's what my sons would call it now. I started flying 45 years ago, and this looks like it was during that same "era".
Impressive. A real joy to watch.
I'd like to meet these pilots, they did and do a great job! Awesomeness!!!
Butter landing in the old days.