still that could just be her fearless bravado too but i see ur point but regardless of whether she knows its weakness i highly doubt that a mortal can kill a primal demon
So if joy is a primal demon as is fear, it's completely possible the other primal demons can feed on other positive emotions Imagine the spirit of Ionia is actually the demon of peace/tranquility
I think the essence of demons is to feed off an unhealthy amount of a feeling, so I think tranquility wouldn't really qualify because it never hurts. Joy, however, can make people go crazy.
@@1990tcyta I believe only the Kinkou order refused to defend Ionia? Ionians are peace loving and most of them are not even warriors. It is only when Noxus imvades thier land that they fought led by Irelia.
The Kindred line triggered when Kindred died, so what Nilah feel is Etherfiend, the spirit (like kindred) grim reaper. the one who kills spirit or god that is forgotten, the second death and brings them to "Beyond"
@@gazelle_diamond9768 which is what Nilah is actually scared of in her other lines. She probably met the ether fiend because she was forgotten and knows what it is but doesn’t realize its like the kindred
11:38 - About defeating Azakanas by knowing their real identity/name, What if Nilah is now also vulnerable to those who knows her true origin/name after something that has happened between her and Ashlash. Hence why Ashlash erased her... for their both's sake? Or maybe the more people know about Nilah's adventures the stronger Ashlesh gets, maybe eventually taking over. Then maybe if people start remembering or dig up Nilah's true identity, Ashlesh's grasp to Nilah would weaken.
Ok so I've got a theory. At the beginning I was thinking Nilah kinda undermines other characters, she acts better, stronger, she knows how to destroy Fiddlesticks etc. But then I got it! What if Ashlesh made a pact with Nilah, wiped her name, wiped her memory then made her new memories. She feels only joy, right? So she can't feel fear, despair, anger at least that's what Ashlesh wants from her. I think she's in way worse situation than Swain, because all she does, thinks, wants is all created and manipulated by Ashlesh. She thinks she is a puppet master while being a puppet all along.
They better not nerf fiddle stick in the lore. This random backwash hillbilly florida man of a champion better get sniped by the demon of fear. He literally knows everyone's fear. Also she has her memory since she remembers kalista.
@@TheLovedUnbound Her fear definitely looks like it is being forgotten. I would have loved a Fiddlesticks voice line added for her where he just says "Ashlesh" like when encountering other demons and swain and a voice line just saying "Who?" or something else to not even acknowledge she is memorable
@@TheLovedUnbound except fiddlesticks literally has no power over her, he is the demon of fear. She literally cannot feel fear, therefore he cannot do anything to her.
Nilah is actually referencing the Second Death that comes with The Etherfiend, which is ironic as it represents "being forgotten" something Nilah is avoiding.
and as a bonus, the etherfiend in actuality is the second death, being forgotten, the fact that nilah is so scared of no one remembering her, even her saying "i will live forever in song" is completely true, if she becomes a myth she can't ever experience that second death and maybe she actually already did, maybe she is the only person on earth to have experience the second death before the first and that's why she doesn't want it to happen ever again
This makes more sense, as said the Pale Man split himself in two, he's not a third character in the tale, not even "far older", as himself is both, and a recurring guy in every runeterran version of the tale.
Since Nilah doesn't have any other emotion aside from joy, I can't help but imagine her laughing like a madwoman while covered in bruises and bloodstains
So far, I really like Nilah as a character. A girl obsessed with legends and myths and wants to become a legend herself as the ultimate goal to the point of selling her soul to a demon in return having the powers to defeat the monsters and beasts to become a legend. Design wise, reminds me of Ixtal but when revealed to be a new country on a new continent it makes her design to be tame something introductory to Kathkan as a nation.
My theory is Nilah joined the seventh layer and they fell, to prevent him from escaping she made a deal with it She gains its power, in turn for a clean slate if she is remember it remains imprisoned If she is forgotten though the seal will break and he will be freed once more So she is using its power to weaken it and try to do much as she can to be remebered so she will be remeber but also to guarentee the safety of her home and runeterra as a whole
@@randomcatname7792 just a question: if this is the case, why would the demon control Nilah’s body when all she does is slay foes to be remembered just to weaken the demon. it does not make sense. the demon wants to weaken itself? is that what is implied?
@@praviplays1256 the question is why killing those Ford would even weaken it.. Wouldn't it make people happy knowing the monsters were slain? That would make it stronger ..
@@praviplays1256 because slaying these monsters makes people feel joy! the more joy in the world the more she feeds the demon she thinks she's keeping contained, so the more people celebrating her feats, the more power ashalan (Nilah's demon) gains
@@Lunar1us Those in that paper are just branches of Fear, which is Fiddle, a primal one. And it was written by Noxians and they know nothing, so don't take it as fact.
There is a demon of secrets in the Demon Compendium image. But considering the structure of that image, with the root of the branching paths being the demon of "Fear" I doubt anything else on there is a primordial demon themselves, just an offshoot. Not to mention, if any of those demons were a primal demon, why are there only 8 named.
@@ruberose1825 theres also the fact that she didnt claim his demon as a lord where as she does with her own and fiddle not to mention im sure she wouldve noticed if he was cause she tells fiddle to send the others after her so she wouldve clued into swains demon being a primal
The Primal Demons might be connected with emotions, since the 2 we've seen so far are Joy and Fear, while the other demons are more like concepts, like Secret, Agony, Nightmare, Doubt, and Addiction.
This was my thought too. The primal demons are probably based on Carroll Izard's primary emotions: fear, anger, shame, contempt, disgust, guilt, distress, interest, surprise, and joy. I think Raum (Swain's demon) is the Demon of Interest. Swain is fed visions that lead to questions and planning. What is more interesting than a secret that you are left to speculate about?
@@cupidok2768 primal demons have been around for as long as the gods, since the primal demons was created when the universe sprung to life. I would see the primal demons as the antithesis of the gods of lol universe, or perhaps their counterpart. We simply don't know how strong the primal demons actually are, we have only seen their weakened forms.
@@cupidok2768 dunno, as i said we haven't seen the demons at full power yet. And right now the most apparent danger in the lore is void. Until we get an event or lore update about the other eight primal demons we won't know how potentially dangerous they are. The primal demon of rage/anger would be cool as hell if we get it as as a champ imo
There's an air of overconfidence in all her lines, and I love it. Since she can only feel joy, she is literally incapable of any doubts or fears or anything to ground her, so she has just pure joy and confidence in the power she has.
In Legends of Runeterra there is a card called Viper Wyrm. It's a dragon from Camavor. So she's probably telling the dragons to say hi to their dragon kin in the afterlife.
This makes lot more sense, the Fading Icon is extremely scared of being forgotten, and while Nilah might not feel fear, she also is trying to make her name remembered by everyone. The Kindred might take her life, but her "true" life lies in the hands of the Etherfiend... or is it wings? Talons? Beak?
@@louisrobitaille5810 another spirit of death who basically is the representation of second death (It was revealed that Kindred isn't the only spirit of death, but only one of many). If Kindred takes those who die, the Etherfiend takes those who are about to be forgotten
"When you meet the demon warn him of my strength" refers to the 3rd primordial demon we know- Rakhsasum. He is the collector from the spirit world. Represented by Thresh's Spirit Blossom skin
This isn't a primordial demon, they're likely just a strong spirit/azakana (based off how they feed). Nilah is also very weird with names in general, she called Darkins 'Lords of Light' like they were demons.
@@rogueObscura Darkin are literally Lords of Light tho. Corrupted, fallen Ascended, who got their power first from the Sun Disc and now from corrupted magic, specifically Blood Magic. However, they still are and will always be Ascended of Shurima, born from the Sun's Light and power.
Same thing happened when he explained Nilah's trailer and mispronounced her name, despite her pronouncing her name several times. He corrected it in his later videos but it's still somehow funny. (edit: grammar)
I only wish the twist of her character was more prominent in her lines cause it mostly seems that she's in control with no drawbacks whatsoever and you need to know her lore beforehand in order to understand what the twist is
Fiddlesticks’ story states that even though it was locked away and banished for eons, it was never killed. It also says it was created when the universe was, in the first scream of creation. From that we can infer it was born the moment their emotion was manifested, and that Fiddlesticks and the other Ten Lords can only be truly killed if the emotion they feed off of is completely removed from the universe - effectively an impossible feat, but one that Nilah can’t feel anything but positive about. It would definitely befit the idea of a Greater Demon and why they can’t be as easily removed as a lesser Azakana, and why Ashlesh would know how to kill another Primal Demon.
I think the reason she calls demons for "lords" is because she is using one of them right now for added strength in combat etc. She does not like them, but she respects the power they have i think.
"Emotions are what control us, what makes us act. Whether it may be happiness, fear, love, anger; we all are victims to our lords." Is the kind of vibe I'm getting at.
Yeah the way how Nilah Expresses her "JOY" it sounds like she is sadistic and Enjoys how she defeats her Opponents. That is why she is so Prideful and Gloats all the time.
The more I think about Nilah's situation, the more I feel like her fate just feels horrid. She is scared of being forgotten, at least she knows she should be, but she can only feel joy no matter what. That's so damned horrific.
8:40 she's probably talking about the Etherfiend which is the end of Kindred themself but it could also mean that the gray man still exist in some way and see what Lamb and Wolf see
The Etherfiend is not just the end of Kindred, it's the end of everything and everyone. It's the second and LAST death any part of existence faces. Yet it is possible that Nilah already faced it.
@@gazelle_diamond9768 unless she's saying this quote at the end of the world it wouldn't make sense anyways as too many people Know of kindred even the Etherfiend line suggests that the two aren't going to be meeting him for a while when he say theirs hearts beat strong.
@@ishla9265 keep in mind the quote is after "killing" Kindred so I honestly don't know whether or not it would show up. Kindred can't get killed by Nilah. But if Ashlash somehow wipes the memories of the "slain" (physical embodiment) like he did with Nilah its possible?
I don't think Nilah is referencing the Grey Man in that quote since the Grey Man.... kind of doesn't exist anymore. He split himself in two and became Kindred, so how could she be talking about the being she bascially just killed? Okay, fuck, after watching the rest of the video, this just became way scarier. Nilah basically already went through the second death, because she has already been completely forgotten once. This means she might have met the one responsible for it or at the very least has a hunch on its existence, which would explain the quote against Kindred. So now she is trying her best so that she will never truly die her second death, because she knows or atleast suspects the horror that is the Final Mask. The vulture that picks at that which remains. The ancient being that will someday be the end of all and the last thing that remains until even time itself stops. The Etherfiend.
@@gazelle_diamond9768 also It wouldn't make sense for the most famous of the death spirits to die a true death, Kindred has lines about how they can't stay dead for long.
@@ishla9265 My headcannon is that The Etherfiend is the last mask the death spirits will see before being eaten. While the Mask Mother is the first mask the death spirits see the first time they are awakened.
It is weird that we are getting Nilah and Fiddle encounter and fight in an alternate universe as start guardians and not in the canon lore. It wont be canon to runeterra but it might help us understand their relation a bit.
I think the idea of who won out on the deal is actually vague. While Nilah's personality may make it seem like she is this powerful character who is in control of a demon's power, it makes you think when you realize it is the Demon of Joy and she can feel nothing but joy, suppressing and hiding her true emotions from the players. The biggest hint of her not actually being in the winning position with this demon could be her obsession with being remembered. Perhaps she had an underlying fear of being forgotten, now being manifested as this joyful and somewhat cocky attitude of wanting everyone to know her name. Perhaps she is the one captured here, not the demon, and who we are fighting is a tool of the demon, rather than Nilah herself, as we don't even know he true name.
6:28 It looks like you've forgotten, but Raum (and the others then) was confirmed to not be a primal demon when Fiddlesticks' rework happened. On another note, 'Secrets' doesn't feel broad enough anyways, the strength of the Ten is that they feed off the most base emotions. 2:26 On an entirely different note, I think these lines are just Nilah gassing herself up. It's not a new thing for Riot to have champs be snarky and act like Big Cheese against other threats. Ashlesh' jar IS strong, but Nilah is still mortal and that demon is still imprisoned. Last note: Ashlesh is much more likely the '7th of Ten,' because of all the recurring 7's in its past (7 hands, 7 locks, 7th layer, 7 jars).
The voiceline against Mordekaiser left me like: °o° Mordekaiser will be literally be a final boss one day, it's like telling Thanos "GG EZ ;(" in his face.
@@serendipity4346 That.... doesn't make any sense. "Final" implies that it will be the last boss. That's literally what the word "final" means. The peak, the end the finale. Or are you telling me that we will fight Mordekaiser alongside like a ton of other powerful beings at the same time?
Nilah just reminded me of this: "When do you think people die? When they are shot through the heart by the bullet of a pistol? No. When they are ravaged by an incurable disease? No. When they drink a soup made from a poisonous mushroom!? No! It’s when… they are forgotten." - Dr.Hiriluk
I believe the reason why we don't know much about Swain's "deal" with Raum is just down to riot not writing him any new lore whatsoever. Plus, I don't think Nilah's voice line means much because it states in Swain's lore that he could see what even the demon could not, a way to wield it, basically implying that Swain outsmarted the demon and is in at least majority control of Raum's powers.
a little late to the party but the line "THE RIVER OF FATE DROWNS THE UNWORTHY" got me thinking about Nilah's use of water and how she is no longer the same girl that disappeared years ago: Baptism.
Lmao as a Mordekaiser main who fucks with his lore, I can't stand Nilah's weird ass roast attempt. Sahn Uzal ain't scared of death, one of his older stories had him laughing in the face of death as if Ashlesh had possessed the warlord. Like a real-life Norse Viking, he was expecting some sort of Valhalla for strong warriors to be among the gods after death, there was no such thing, he was disappointed and pissed off. This is not something Fiddlesticks can feed of off. There ain't no fear involved here, disappointment- his expectations of the after-life were not met, drive and anger- he refused to fade, his rage did not allow his soul and spirit to rest, he is going to make sure to create his "own Valhalla", or just conquer both living and dead now that he has the chance as Mordekaiser the Iron Revenant.
So if Ashlash is Akin to Fiddlesticks, and Fiddle is High King and Ashlash is like a Lord, would that mean fiddlesticks can force Fear into people's emotions like ashlash does with Joy?
yea, thats exactly what he does. Being near Fiddle causes people to feel fear, theres a story on universe where he enters a village and everyone goes batshit crazy cause they start losing their grip on reality and just see their fears. This isn't even fiddle like actually doing anything, hes just casually passing through
8:33 i thought this was a reference to that runeterra card, the Etherfiend who kill spirit once their are forgottent since she is only saying that when she kill kindred
Mordekaiser: I consumed the realm of the living and the dead, ruled an entire continent alone, was resurrected three times, build the immortal bastion and my weapon is made with the souls of those I have slain. Nilah: well I made a deal and now I am more powerful and happier than you are.
I know this is a farfetched assumption, but i think i would be funny if she actually battles fiddlesticks, presumably kills him, then he just comes back even stronger.
I believe fiddle can win because of one massive weakness: Nilah is forced to feel joy, it wouldn't be out of the ordinary for her to have the demon of fear let her feel fear, to finally feel other emotions.
Her asking to be remembered when she dies also ties up to the idea of true death in LoR, where spirits also "die" from being forgotten, similar as well to Volibear fading
Interesting there is no interaction with Annie. since LOR showed us that she has a demon with her, and maybe a primal one (idk, a giant fire bear demon that can destroy a noxus mage academy can't be in the same league as a dapper catfish and a hot lady). Not even like a: "hey kid you know you got a demon with you right?".
i think tibbers is technically one of morde's creations, which would make sense why Noxus wants to use it and why it's in Noxus to begun with, Immortal Bastion and all
Man i really want some context to this. There is no deal from Annie so i am wondering ehy that demon even stays with her. Imagine it beeing the demon of loneliness or something like that.
@@josuagreis353 it was bonded to her mother before her I think? I know he got bound to the stuffed bear, and the bear was Annie’s mother’s before Annie killed them and inherited it. Plus Tibbers isn’t a primal demon, just a creation of Morde.
@@Kindredflame0224 Would be wierd for the demon to stay like that after the person he made the deal with died. Annie also didnt kill her mother i think. But she did get the bear to remember her. Maybe there was a deal from the mother in which the demon has to protect annie, but that sounds super boring. Also the mordes creation thing i didnt read, but i dont know the whole annie lore, why would morde create a demon infused teddy?
@@josuagreis353 I don’t think tibbers works like a normal demon, seeing how he isn’t one. Noxus probably has some sort of magic, LeBlanc bullshit going on to keep him contained. Also she did, it’s confirmed in, I believe, a cinematic from a few years back as well as a interaction she has with Jhin in LoR
since she's living out her childhood dreams and that fits well with feeding the demon of joy, i think her being human fits rlly well for once! she could maybe have like misty extra arms tho behind her or smth but still keep her base human form in tact,
I would love to see what kind of connection the layers have with the primal demons. Maybe Ashlash is the 7th demon, so 7th layer and Fiddle would "occupy" the first. Just imagine: camavorian or kathkani mages drawing the power of the ten primordial layers to cast spells. I'm too excited for all of this.
To clear up a discretion I see online a lot. A Wyrm is a mythical beast usually like a giant snake, think Jormangandr from God of war (And the fucker in Nilah's splash art obviously) Wyrms are usually a type of dragon, they just don't have legs or wings. Some have wings, but rarely legs. Drakes are dragons with 4 legs and no wings, and are usually smaller. Wyverns are Dragons with 2 hind legs and 2 wings that act as front legs when they walk. Dragons have 4 legs and 2 wings.
I wonder in the "kill - Kindred" voice line if Nilah is sensing the man coming back from the two halves or sensing the Etherfiend coming to take kindred's masks away
Camphor- misery Raum- secrets Nocturne- nightmare Atakhan- ruin Tybaulk (tibbers)- frenzy Evelynn- agony (seduces its victims while feeling pleasure to end them with agonizing pain)
As always great explanation of the lore of a new champion through voiceline. Actually, I was wondering since the release of Renata, I believe, where Necrit would put each new champion in the powerlevel tierlist based on lore, and so, I would to discuss with some other commenters!(I know it's a little childish to ask such thing but, well, I am totally facisnated by scale of power in literraly each story that I can know!) So feel free to respond to my comment!
I personally believe that Nilah is in over her head when it comes to defeating Fiddlesticks. She can only feel joy, and seems fairly cocky. There is no killing Fiddlesticks, his is a primeval being much like Aurelion Sol. It would be interesting to watch her try to kill Fiddlesticks, especially with a lesser demon like Ashlash. This is also evident in how she talks to Pantheon and Mordekaiser, saying how she and Pantheon are powerful, even though a literal God’s power is immeasurable to a lesser Demon’s, and Mordekaiser being that he is near immortality, with the only thing actually able to destroy him is Rell’s power. You can see this coming out in Kindred, you can tell Nilah fears death, yet chides Mordekaiser on his fear of death, even though he didn’t fear death, he wished for his Valhalla and was angry enough to make it for himself. tl:dr - I don’t think Nilah is genuinely as powerful as she says, but instead that she builds it up because of her confidence she gets from Ashlash.
I agree, also Fiddlesticks being able to be fully destroyed kinda shits on his story and concept of it being a primal entity that has always been there and no one fully understands
"When does a man die? When he is hit by a bullet? No. When he suffers a disease? No. When he ate a soup made out of a poisonous mushroom? No! A man dies when he is forgotten!" - Dr. Hiriluk
I would be extremely mad if they say Swain didn't outsmart Raum but instead got outsmarted cause that would just ruin the entire point of the champion. He's a man who sees ten steps ahead. Him being 5 behind doesn't make sense
@@tselis The perfect lore end for chogath would be overfeeding him, just like the perfect end for swain would be getting "outswained". it doesnt ruin it at all. you want him to be a mary sue lol
@@saphcal I want him to be outsmartened. Not have been outsmarted. There's a difference between "this happened" and "this has already happened we just never brought it up"
@@tselis the most well done outsmarts are the ones you dont realize until way later after they happened. not knowing it was an outsmart until the consequences of being outsmarted decide to finally reveal themselves.
Being forgotten a 2nd time might be like, she just vanish people and like pe0ople don't see here even if she';s there and she can only feel joy in this loniness, which is kidna sad, it's like bunny girl senpai but nilah can only fell joy
I actually thought how Ashlash would look like if he wasn't locked inside this orb. But what makes sense, that if he's one of the primal demons, then he shouldn't have form, just like Fiddlesticks, but have different colour palette. Now I wonder what colours other demons possess!
I have a theory about the voice line when she kills kindered, i actually think that the thrid presence far older is not the Grey man but the volture spirit that kills the forgoten spirits (card in LOR, and refrenced in the story with the masks) this would make sense sincr the third presence would not be the other too combined and would br much oldet than them
Kinda disappointed that swain probably doesnt know the cost of his demon, would have loved for him to be the first person to outsmart a demon’s deal and get the power at no cost
Isn't that the whole point of his lore tho when he was dying the demon tried to steal his secrets so he sought it out and stole its power with a reverse Fautsian deal
Well I think it would be wierd for swain to have like an Ace in his sleeve against the demon of secrets. But I think it would be fun if their deal was mutual benefit, but swain doesnt know it. But the more likely angle is based on one of swains voicelines. “never make a deal wirh a demon. That you intend to keep“ or something along those lines. But i think it would be funny if Swain tries to find a way to get rid of the deal, without Raum noticing, while Raum just feeds power of that since he feeds of secrets.
8:40 She's just referencing the Etherfiend, from LoR. The Gray Man and Kindred are the same entity, why would he be a "third presence" ? The Etherfiend is especially relevant, since she was cursed with being forgotten.
See, Nilah seems cool and all but what I’m looking forward to is the totally 100% confirmed logical choice by riot to implement a PvE gamemode for the star guardian event
Swain is 100% going to end up an amnesiac old fool by the end of the story. Like an hommage to old swain , when the no-name stoic noxian face just entered an inn with a broken limb and silently did his thing.
About the Homeland quote for Karma, is interesting because there were people in the First Lands and Freljord before the Westward Migration - During the war with the Titans the Vastayashai'rei were created by mortals taking in spirits ... and then in Freljord we have the war of the 3 Sisters, that said it is possible that during the western migration a tribe from the East traveled to Ionia and mixed with the locals ... which could be the reason for the quote ...
Could possibly be that as long as she is remembered she will never truly be taken by the demon in death. Once she is forgotten then the demon consumes her completely
I really wasn't sold at first on nilah. It was truly the pretty lady facade that kept me from caring further about her lore. But boy am I glad I actually did take a look at it. I LOVe that they've expanded the lore with the primal demons. And fiddlesticks has some amazing annilihistic existential lore that I just love.
@Necrit I found this interesting, Playing ARAM as Tryndamere with a enemy Teemo on the other team and the shop keep said to Tryndamere, "Such hatred, Don't become blinded by it" and then few games later was playing ARAM as Teemo and noticed his one Eternal relating to his Q ability is named "Blinded by Hate" I never heard that shop keep voice line. I always enjoy the lore tossed in at time on ARAM you don't always hear on twisted treeline and Teemo Q eternal makes sense since since its blinds but Teemo isn't really full of Hate everyone hates him. Also i know the shop keep hates yourdle's and mentions it a lot with quotes like, "Ewww a yordle, or if you see a yordle with a little flying ship shot him for him." Any lore related to why that is? also maybe there's some hidden eternal lore reference's I'm going to look for.
"for stealing my name and my FATE i claim your power" "in death my spirit is yours but in life your strength and joy belong to me" what if it means history will change to her demon doing all these mighty deeds if her name is ever forgotten, thus opening up a possibility to gain new followers if those legends are ever discovered/remembered the demon will be portrayed as a mighty hero.
You can’t convince me that someone in Riot doesn’t reads One Piece and when they learned about the SMILE fruits, they straight up said: “How can we make this, but even worse?”
Actually, don't you think it's interesting that you can control a lessor Demon by knowing it's name? And now we have someone who has the power of a primal demon, whom no one can ever know her true name? There's a chance those two things can be linked. Also, another thing about her emotions. The only time we've ever seen her express something that wasn't technically Joy was that split moment of annoyance/anger when she high fives the demon. I know it's supposed to be more of a joke line but it's still something worth noting imo. The way she says "OW! What are you doing? That was way too hard!" just super stands out to me because it's specifically towards her demon.
I mean... since she was young she loved legends. She id going around living ger dream because of the demon. I don't feel that it is creepy at all that she wants to be remembered. She wants to become legend after she died.
Nileah being so obsessed with being remembered might later on be tempted to do something so bad she has to be remembered if she feels there is no Better option left
what if the deal is if she cant be remember for her deeds in life and will be safe when she dies but if she's forgotten then her soul is taken by the demon
Now I feel unsure about the Kindred one she said she feels a third presence... If it was the grey man presence it shouldn't be possible to feel it since lamb and wolf were created from him but what makes it more confusing is the fact that she kill someone and point at the demon after death and to conclude this I wanna add something I just noticed it's about Fiddlesticks we all know that Fiddlesticks doesn't mimics demons he call them by their names and when it comes to Kindred he call it "Grey Man" like the rest of the demons Could it mean that Kindred is a messanger for the Demon of death or something like that? Idk this is confusing and tricky but there is definitely a link
If Ashlesh annihilated her entire Emotions besides Joy, the primal Emotion hes based on, i got a feeling Nilah "would" feel sad about nobody remembering her, so even though shes always joyful, she still wants back what the Demon took from her. So, she sets out on a Journey to simply become a Legend by defeating extremely powerful beings. Now, think about it. Her Spirit will go to Ashlesh once she dies. The only thing she ever felt is Joy. All her Memories are filled with only Joy. Her entire being is pure Joy. I dont know why, but i feel like once she dies and her overly joyful spirit goes to Ashlesh, the dudes gonna be powerful enough to break out of the Seventh Layer Prison and do.. well, whatever he wants really.
Mmm I’m pretty sure it means she knew after making the deal with Ashley she’d only be able to feel joy, not that she got to choose whatever emotion she wanted and be able to feel that afterwards as that wouldn’t benefit ashlesh in any way what so ever
hes the demon of joy she wouldnt have been able to choose. but she could have known shed be stuck with only joy when choosing to wield Ashlesh's power.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 89 | คู่เอก "ยอดไอคิว vs คิริลล์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Z3vYkHJ_5Ig/mqdefault.jpg)
Just a theory but maybe Nilah knows how to defeat FiddleSticks because she is incapable of feeling fear, thanks to Ashlash, she can only feal joy.
That is the most plausible explanation
thats a pretty good theory
still that could just be her fearless bravado too but i see ur point but regardless of whether she knows its weakness i highly doubt that a mortal can kill a primal demon
That's exactly what i was thinking. Nilah can practically laugh at Fiddelstick in his face, because she can do/feel anything else at all.
@@xerxesthegodking9400 no like she can only feel joy, she is incapable of feeling any other emotion.
After all this time I just realised the reason we and Swain don't know the pact with Raum is because he is the demon of secrets.
man knows how to lay low
The "Demon of Secrets" surely knows how to keep his deal a secret.
maybe he erased swain's memory of the deal like Sukuna from jujutsu kaisen, mind editing powers sound fit for a demon of secrets
might find out in the MMO
So if joy is a primal demon as is fear, it's completely possible the other primal demons can feed on other positive emotions
Imagine the spirit of Ionia is actually the demon of peace/tranquility
Oh shit 🤯
Really good theory
I think the essence of demons is to feed off an unhealthy amount of a feeling, so I think tranquility wouldn't really qualify because it never hurts. Joy, however, can make people go crazy.
@@samuelbarros1563 how about peace
Ionia idea of peace refuse to fight back Noxus once
@@1990tcyta I believe only the Kinkou order refused to defend Ionia? Ionians are peace loving and most of them are not even warriors. It is only when Noxus imvades thier land that they fought led by Irelia.
Nilah: "Im gonna die"
Ashlesh: "think positive"
Nilah: "...IM POSITIVE IM GONNA DIE"
Exaclty
Hahahaha
I'm in danger 😊
The Kindred line triggered when Kindred died, so what Nilah feel is Etherfiend, the spirit (like kindred) grim reaper. the one who kills spirit or god that is forgotten, the second death and brings them to "Beyond"
The Etherfiend doesn't just kill spirits or gods, it kills everyone when they are forgotten. It represents the second death.
@@gazelle_diamond9768 which is what Nilah is actually scared of in her other lines. She probably met the ether fiend because she was forgotten and knows what it is but doesn’t realize its like the kindred
@@defensivepotato1998 Exactly!
@@gazelle_diamond9768 not everyone
@@GiRR007 How would you know that?
I notice that Nila does the same thing with names that fiddlesticks does by calling people by their own full names rather than special ones
11:38 - About defeating Azakanas by knowing their real identity/name,
What if Nilah is now also vulnerable to those who knows her true origin/name after something that has happened between her and Ashlash.
Hence why Ashlash erased her... for their both's sake?
Or maybe the more people know about Nilah's adventures the stronger Ashlesh gets, maybe eventually taking over.
Then maybe if people start remembering or dig up Nilah's true identity, Ashlesh's grasp to Nilah would weaken.
That's a very interesting take! I like this interpretation.
Ok so I've got a theory. At the beginning I was thinking Nilah kinda undermines other characters, she acts better, stronger, she knows how to destroy Fiddlesticks etc. But then I got it! What if Ashlesh made a pact with Nilah, wiped her name, wiped her memory then made her new memories. She feels only joy, right? So she can't feel fear, despair, anger at least that's what Ashlesh wants from her. I think she's in way worse situation than Swain, because all she does, thinks, wants is all created and manipulated by Ashlesh. She thinks she is a puppet master while being a puppet all along.
this needs more likes
They better not nerf fiddle stick in the lore. This random backwash hillbilly florida man of a champion better get sniped by the demon of fear. He literally knows everyone's fear. Also she has her memory since she remembers kalista.
holy shit what if ashlesh is using her as an avatar to fight all mythical beings, including aspects, to conclude what ashlesh itself started
@@TheLovedUnbound Her fear definitely looks like it is being forgotten. I would have loved a Fiddlesticks voice line added for her where he just says "Ashlesh" like when encountering other demons and swain and a voice line just saying "Who?" or something else to not even acknowledge she is memorable
@@TheLovedUnbound except fiddlesticks literally has no power over her, he is the demon of fear. She literally cannot feel fear, therefore he cannot do anything to her.
Nilah is actually referencing the Second Death that comes with The Etherfiend, which is ironic as it represents "being forgotten" something Nilah is avoiding.
But he is the last creation of mask mother
That Kindred Clip always gives me Goosebumps. I Love Kindred so much.
Also her Only Joy emotion reminds me of One Piece and Smile fruit.
i literally almost break into tears every time i hear lamb tell the story about the pale man.
At first I thought it was just boring positive bravado from her, now looking at the lore, it's creepy and would be hell to experience.
i believe nilah's line when she kills kindred is actually suppose to be the etherfiend who we know is partially a death to other deaths like kindred
and as a bonus, the etherfiend in actuality is the second death, being forgotten, the fact that nilah is so scared of no one remembering her, even her saying "i will live forever in song" is completely true, if she becomes a myth she can't ever experience that second death
and maybe she actually already did, maybe she is the only person on earth to have experience the second death before the first and that's why she doesn't want it to happen ever again
This makes more sense, as said the Pale Man split himself in two, he's not a third character in the tale, not even "far older", as himself is both, and a recurring guy in every runeterran version of the tale.
But he is younger than kindred
Weird that Nilah didn't have much interactions with Gwen. Gwen's literally an embodiment of Isolde's Unbridled joy.
Since Nilah doesn't have any other emotion aside from joy, I can't help but imagine her laughing like a madwoman while covered in bruises and bloodstains
Yeah, that'd be terrifying...
be me frfr
So far, I really like Nilah as a character. A girl obsessed with legends and myths and wants to become a legend herself as the ultimate goal to the point of selling her soul to a demon in return having the powers to defeat the monsters and beasts to become a legend. Design wise, reminds me of Ixtal but when revealed to be a new country on a new continent it makes her design to be tame something introductory to Kathkan as a nation.
Funny since your soul is eternal and not subject to any manipulation
My theory is
Nilah joined the seventh layer and they fell, to prevent him from escaping she made a deal with it
She gains its power, in turn for a clean slate if she is remember it remains imprisoned
If she is forgotten though the seal will break and he will be freed once more
So she is using its power to weaken it and try to do much as she can to be remebered so she will be remeber but also to guarentee the safety of her home and runeterra as a whole
It is slightly implied that she is dead and the demon is controlling her body
@@randomcatname7792 just a question: if this is the case, why would the demon control Nilah’s body when all she does is slay foes to be remembered just to weaken the demon. it does not make sense. the demon wants to weaken itself? is that what is implied?
@@praviplays1256 the question is why killing those Ford would even weaken it.. Wouldn't it make people happy knowing the monsters were slain? That would make it stronger ..
@@praviplays1256 because slaying these monsters makes people feel joy! the more joy in the world the more she feeds the demon she thinks she's keeping contained, so the more people celebrating her feats, the more power ashalan (Nilah's demon) gains
@@praviplays1256 also would you feel joy if two monsters fight each other instead of a human saving your whole village.
Because Nilah didn't react that much when talking to Swain, I really doubt that his demon is a primal demon.
He does appear on that... What's it called again, the paper where demons are written? Nvm, it says "secrets" on it so I think he is primal
@@Lunar1us Those in that paper are just branches of Fear, which is Fiddle, a primal one. And it was written by Noxians and they know nothing, so don't take it as fact.
There is a demon of secrets in the Demon Compendium image. But considering the structure of that image, with the root of the branching paths being the demon of "Fear" I doubt anything else on there is a primordial demon themselves, just an offshoot. Not to mention, if any of those demons were a primal demon, why are there only 8 named.
@@ruberose1825 theres also the fact that she didnt claim his demon as a lord where as she does with her own and fiddle not to mention im sure she wouldve noticed if he was cause she tells fiddle to send the others after her so she wouldve clued into swains demon being a primal
@@ruberose1825 well in that chart the demon of bliss, supposedly ashlash, is there too under fiddle...
The Primal Demons might be connected with emotions, since the 2 we've seen so far are Joy and Fear, while the other demons are more like concepts, like Secret, Agony, Nightmare, Doubt, and Addiction.
how can demons be stronger than gods and celestrials and angels?
This was my thought too. The primal demons are probably based on Carroll Izard's primary emotions: fear, anger, shame, contempt, disgust, guilt, distress, interest, surprise, and joy.
I think Raum (Swain's demon) is the Demon of Interest. Swain is fed visions that lead to questions and planning. What is more interesting than a secret that you are left to speculate about?
@@cupidok2768 primal demons have been around for as long as the gods, since the primal demons was created when the universe sprung to life. I would see the primal demons as the antithesis of the gods of lol universe, or perhaps their counterpart. We simply don't know how strong the primal demons actually are, we have only seen their weakened forms.
@@Confirmed105 demons stronger or void?
@@cupidok2768 dunno, as i said we haven't seen the demons at full power yet. And right now the most apparent danger in the lore is void. Until we get an event or lore update about the other eight primal demons we won't know how potentially dangerous they are. The primal demon of rage/anger would be cool as hell if we get it as as a champ imo
There's an air of overconfidence in all her lines, and I love it. Since she can only feel joy, she is literally incapable of any doubts or fears or anything to ground her, so she has just pure joy and confidence in the power she has.
In Legends of Runeterra there is a card called Viper Wyrm. It's a dragon from Camavor. So she's probably telling the dragons to say hi to their dragon kin in the afterlife.
Hey, the presence she feels when the Kindred die might also be the Etherfiend
This makes lot more sense, the Fading Icon is extremely scared of being forgotten, and while Nilah might not feel fear, she also is trying to make her name remembered by everyone. The Kindred might take her life, but her "true" life lies in the hands of the Etherfiend... or is it wings? Talons? Beak?
@@SeventeenGhost That's exactly what I was thinking.
Dahek's the Etherfiend?
@@louisrobitaille5810 the second death. If the representation of death(Kindred and others) got forgotten, the Etherfiend will devour them.
@@louisrobitaille5810 another spirit of death who basically is the representation of second death (It was revealed that Kindred isn't the only spirit of death, but only one of many). If Kindred takes those who die, the Etherfiend takes those who are about to be forgotten
"When you meet the demon warn him of my strength" refers to the 3rd primordial demon we know- Rakhsasum. He is the collector from the spirit world. Represented by Thresh's Spirit Blossom skin
This isn't a primordial demon, they're likely just a strong spirit/azakana (based off how they feed). Nilah is also very weird with names in general, she called Darkins 'Lords of Light' like they were demons.
@@rogueObscura Darkin are literally Lords of Light tho. Corrupted, fallen Ascended, who got their power first from the Sun Disc and now from corrupted magic, specifically Blood Magic. However, they still are and will always be Ascended of Shurima, born from the Sun's Light and power.
@@dragonheart1357 Oh, I didn't think of it like being Lords of the Sun. Yes, that interpretation makes sense.
@@dragonheart1357 She only calls the Primordial Demons "Lord" though 🤔. Why would she call the Darkins the same thing 🧐?
@@louisrobitaille5810 emphasizing the power and influence they (primal demons, sunborns, aspects) have, drawing their powers from the cosmos
I like that Nilah pronounced her demon's name for you and then you continued to mispronounce it.
Same thing happened when he explained Nilah's trailer and mispronounced her name, despite her pronouncing her name several times. He corrected it in his later videos but it's still somehow funny.
(edit: grammar)
He is dyslexic after all, so he isn't the smartest fella
I only wish the twist of her character was more prominent in her lines cause it mostly seems that she's in control with no drawbacks whatsoever and you need to know her lore beforehand in order to understand what the twist is
She really is mostly in control though
@@dominicguye8058 I think they mean she can only feel joy. I agree with him that should be a major thing
Fiddlesticks’ story states that even though it was locked away and banished for eons, it was never killed. It also says it was created when the universe was, in the first scream of creation. From that we can infer it was born the moment their emotion was manifested, and that Fiddlesticks and the other Ten Lords can only be truly killed if the emotion they feed off of is completely removed from the universe - effectively an impossible feat, but one that Nilah can’t feel anything but positive about. It would definitely befit the idea of a Greater Demon and why they can’t be as easily removed as a lesser Azakana, and why Ashlesh would know how to kill another Primal Demon.
I think the reason she calls demons for "lords" is because she is using one of them right now for added strength in combat etc.
She does not like them, but she respects the power they have i think.
"Emotions are what control us, what makes us act. Whether it may be happiness, fear, love, anger; we all are victims to our lords." Is the kind of vibe I'm getting at.
Or Nilah knows an alleged way to kill fiddlesticks, and will fail miserably
she will fail joyfully*
@@RustinMarkJandongan Oh yeah mb
Yeah the way how Nilah Expresses her "JOY" it sounds like she is sadistic and Enjoys how she defeats her Opponents. That is why she is so Prideful and Gloats all the time.
The more I think about Nilah's situation, the more I feel like her fate just feels horrid. She is scared of being forgotten, at least she knows she should be, but she can only feel joy no matter what. That's so damned horrific.
5:16 I think it's more about them having the power of a greater being while retaining their own will
They did my boy shaco dirty
8:40 she's probably talking about the Etherfiend which is the end of Kindred themself but it could also mean that the gray man still exist in some way and see what Lamb and Wolf see
The Etherfiend wouldn't make sense tho since he's the last of the masks not the first who is supposably the mask mother.
The Etherfiend is not just the end of Kindred, it's the end of everything and everyone. It's the second and LAST death any part of existence faces.
Yet it is possible that Nilah already faced it.
@@gazelle_diamond9768 unless she's saying this quote at the end of the world it wouldn't make sense anyways as too many people Know of kindred even the Etherfiend line suggests that the two aren't going to be meeting him for a while when he say theirs hearts beat strong.
He kills the forgotten that's his whole thing his purpose
@@ishla9265 keep in mind the quote is after "killing" Kindred so I honestly don't know whether or not it would show up. Kindred can't get killed by Nilah. But if Ashlash somehow wipes the memories of the "slain" (physical embodiment) like he did with Nilah its possible?
I don't think Nilah is referencing the Grey Man in that quote since the Grey Man.... kind of doesn't exist anymore. He split himself in two and became Kindred, so how could she be talking about the being she bascially just killed?
Okay, fuck, after watching the rest of the video, this just became way scarier. Nilah basically already went through the second death, because she has already been completely forgotten once. This means she might have met the one responsible for it or at the very least has a hunch on its existence, which would explain the quote against Kindred. So now she is trying her best so that she will never truly die her second death, because she knows or atleast suspects the horror that is the Final Mask. The vulture that picks at that which remains. The ancient being that will someday be the end of all and the last thing that remains until even time itself stops.
The Etherfiend.
He's cool but too young compared to Kindred it wouldn't make sense, maybe it's the masked mother tho.
@@ishla9265 What do you mean "too young", where the heck did you get that idea from?
@@gazelle_diamond9768 he states that he was the last mask made by the mask mother its one of his lines
@@gazelle_diamond9768 also It wouldn't make sense for the most famous of the death spirits to die a true death, Kindred has lines about how they can't stay dead for long.
@@ishla9265 My headcannon is that The Etherfiend is the last mask the death spirits will see before being eaten. While the Mask Mother is the first mask the death spirits see the first time they are awakened.
It is weird that we are getting Nilah and Fiddle encounter and fight in an alternate universe as start guardians and not in the canon lore. It wont be canon to runeterra but it might help us understand their relation a bit.
I think the idea of who won out on the deal is actually vague. While Nilah's personality may make it seem like she is this powerful character who is in control of a demon's power, it makes you think when you realize it is the Demon of Joy and she can feel nothing but joy, suppressing and hiding her true emotions from the players. The biggest hint of her not actually being in the winning position with this demon could be her obsession with being remembered. Perhaps she had an underlying fear of being forgotten, now being manifested as this joyful and somewhat cocky attitude of wanting everyone to know her name. Perhaps she is the one captured here, not the demon, and who we are fighting is a tool of the demon, rather than Nilah herself, as we don't even know he true name.
6:28 It looks like you've forgotten, but Raum (and the others then) was confirmed to not be a primal demon when Fiddlesticks' rework happened. On another note, 'Secrets' doesn't feel broad enough anyways, the strength of the Ten is that they feed off the most base emotions.
2:26 On an entirely different note, I think these lines are just Nilah gassing herself up. It's not a new thing for Riot to have champs be snarky and act like Big Cheese against other threats. Ashlesh' jar IS strong, but Nilah is still mortal and that demon is still imprisoned.
Last note: Ashlesh is much more likely the '7th of Ten,' because of all the recurring 7's in its past (7 hands, 7 locks, 7th layer, 7 jars).
The voiceline against Mordekaiser left me like: °o°
Mordekaiser will be literally be a final boss one day, it's like telling Thanos "GG EZ ;(" in his face.
And dying miserably
Nah, he won't be the "final boss".
@@gazelle_diamond9768 you wish he wasnt
@@gazelle_diamond9768 He will not be "the" final boss.
I said he will be "a" final boss.
@@serendipity4346 That.... doesn't make any sense. "Final" implies that it will be the last boss. That's literally what the word "final" means. The peak, the end the finale.
Or are you telling me that we will fight Mordekaiser alongside like a ton of other powerful beings at the same time?
Nilah just reminded me of this: "When do you think people die? When they are shot through the heart by the bullet of a pistol? No. When they are ravaged by an incurable disease? No. When they drink a soup made from a poisonous mushroom!? No! It’s when… they are forgotten." - Dr.Hiriluk
My brain also went to one piece but my thought was of smile fruits
I always love this idea of people dying twice, one when your body cease to exist, another when you are forgotten.
@@cerberus1383 That was my first thought once I read about her emotional state.
Who's Rem?
this is also part of the plot of the movie "Coco."
Man, with the release of Bel'veth and Nilah, the power scaling chart is ganna get real interesting
I believe the reason why we don't know much about Swain's "deal" with Raum is just down to riot not writing him any new lore whatsoever. Plus, I don't think Nilah's voice line means much because it states in Swain's lore that he could see what even the demon could not, a way to wield it, basically implying that Swain outsmarted the demon and is in at least majority control of Raum's powers.
But he deal is with the demon of secrets what if he thinks he outsmarted but its fake
a little late to the party but the line "THE RIVER OF FATE DROWNS THE UNWORTHY" got me thinking about Nilah's use of water and how she is no longer the same girl that disappeared years ago: Baptism.
Lmao as a Mordekaiser main who fucks with his lore, I can't stand Nilah's weird ass roast attempt. Sahn Uzal ain't scared of death, one of his older stories had him laughing in the face of death as if Ashlesh had possessed the warlord. Like a real-life Norse Viking, he was expecting some sort of Valhalla for strong warriors to be among the gods after death, there was no such thing, he was disappointed and pissed off. This is not something Fiddlesticks can feed of off. There ain't no fear involved here, disappointment- his expectations of the after-life were not met, drive and anger- he refused to fade, his rage did not allow his soul and spirit to rest, he is going to make sure to create his "own Valhalla", or just conquer both living and dead now that he has the chance as Mordekaiser the Iron Revenant.
12:45
I can imagine a horrible time for that.
"Ron, Timmy just got killed!"
"YOOO POGGERS."
So if Ashlash is Akin to Fiddlesticks, and Fiddle is High King and Ashlash is like a Lord, would that mean fiddlesticks can force Fear into people's emotions like ashlash does with Joy?
yea, thats exactly what he does. Being near Fiddle causes people to feel fear, theres a story on universe where he enters a village and everyone goes batshit crazy cause they start losing their grip on reality and just see their fears. This isn't even fiddle like actually doing anything, hes just casually passing through
8:33 i thought this was a reference to that runeterra card, the Etherfiend who kill spirit once their are forgottent since she is only saying that when she kill kindred
yup
It's etherfiend
Dying won't bring the gray man back
@@VanessaCamburao But the fiend is too young compared to the other masked spirits he even says that it's the last of the masks created by the mother
Maybe when she kills someone they don't meet kindred they meet her demon, another price she has to pay for her power.
Mordekaiser: I consumed the realm of the living and the dead, ruled an entire continent alone, was resurrected three times, build the immortal bastion and my weapon is made with the souls of those I have slain.
Nilah: well I made a deal and now I am more powerful and happier than you are.
Jokes aside who would won morde vs nilah (in story) 1v1
Funfact : Nilah in Hindi/Sanskrit means Blue or The Blue one.
And Ashlesh means The First One or The Beginning of Everything in Hindi/Sanskrit.
The first one :O but fiddle is first of ten...then again she does say first of nothing :O
@@saphcal Also, in the lore, Nilah is named Nilah cuz it means River in whatever language they speak on that Island. Rivers are blue. 😬
@@saphcal Also the 'third demon' is named Rakshasum (as per thresh's Spirit Blossom skin lore.
Rakshasum or simply Rakshas means Monster in Sanskrit.
I know this is a farfetched assumption, but i think i would be funny if she actually battles fiddlesticks, presumably kills him, then he just comes back even stronger.
I believe fiddle can win because of one massive weakness: Nilah is forced to feel joy, it wouldn't be out of the ordinary for her to have the demon of fear let her feel fear, to finally feel other emotions.
Fiddlesticks is eternal. Through terror, he becomes powerful. He can overpower any other demon he pleases, even Ashlash. Nilah doesn’t stand a chance.
Her asking to be remembered when she dies also ties up to the idea of true death in LoR, where spirits also "die" from being forgotten, similar as well to Volibear fading
A swain response with her real name would be spicy
if anyone would still know her real name his demon of secrets would be the one.
Interesting there is no interaction with Annie. since LOR showed us that she has a demon with her, and maybe a primal one (idk, a giant fire bear demon that can destroy a noxus mage academy can't be in the same league as a dapper catfish and a hot lady). Not even like a: "hey kid you know you got a demon with you right?".
i think tibbers is technically one of morde's creations, which would make sense why Noxus wants to use it and why it's in Noxus to begun with, Immortal Bastion and all
Man i really want some context to this. There is no deal from Annie so i am wondering ehy that demon even stays with her. Imagine it beeing the demon of loneliness or something like that.
@@josuagreis353 it was bonded to her mother before her I think? I know he got bound to the stuffed bear, and the bear was Annie’s mother’s before Annie killed them and inherited it. Plus Tibbers isn’t a primal demon, just a creation of Morde.
@@Kindredflame0224 Would be wierd for the demon to stay like that after the person he made the deal with died. Annie also didnt kill her mother i think. But she did get the bear to remember her. Maybe there was a deal from the mother in which the demon has to protect annie, but that sounds super boring.
Also the mordes creation thing i didnt read, but i dont know the whole annie lore, why would morde create a demon infused teddy?
@@josuagreis353 I don’t think tibbers works like a normal demon, seeing how he isn’t one. Noxus probably has some sort of magic, LeBlanc bullshit going on to keep him contained.
Also she did, it’s confirmed in, I believe, a cinematic from a few years back as well as a interaction she has with Jhin in LoR
since she's living out her childhood dreams and that fits well with feeding the demon of joy, i think her being human fits rlly well for once! she could maybe have like misty extra arms tho behind her or smth but still keep her base human form in tact,
I would love to see what kind of connection the layers have with the primal demons. Maybe Ashlash is the 7th demon, so 7th layer and Fiddle would "occupy" the first. Just imagine: camavorian or kathkani mages drawing the power of the ten primordial layers to cast spells. I'm too excited for all of this.
man whenever i listen to kindrends voice lines i get goosebumps
To clear up a discretion I see online a lot.
A Wyrm is a mythical beast usually like a giant snake, think Jormangandr from God of war (And the fucker in Nilah's splash art obviously)
Wyrms are usually a type of dragon, they just don't have legs or wings. Some have wings, but rarely legs.
Drakes are dragons with 4 legs and no wings, and are usually smaller.
Wyverns are Dragons with 2 hind legs and 2 wings that act as front legs when they walk.
Dragons have 4 legs and 2 wings.
I feel like mordekaiser was like no god's?
Pulled a thanos and said "fine I'll do it myself"
I wonder in the "kill - Kindred" voice line if Nilah is sensing the man coming back from the two halves or sensing the Etherfiend coming to take kindred's masks away
But etherfield is the youngest
listen closer to when she says the demons name to learn how to pronounce it
So
Filldestciks = fear
Tahm kench = gluttony
Ashlash = joy
Evelyn = lust
I wonder what the demons are.
Camphor- misery
Raum- secrets
Nocturne- nightmare
Atakhan- ruin
Tybaulk (tibbers)- frenzy
Evelynn- agony (seduces its victims while feeling pleasure to end them with agonizing pain)
As always great explanation of the lore of a new champion through voiceline. Actually, I was wondering since the release of Renata, I believe, where Necrit would put each new champion in the powerlevel tierlist based on lore, and so, I would to discuss with some other commenters!(I know it's a little childish to ask such thing but, well, I am totally facisnated by scale of power in literraly each story that I can know!) So feel free to respond to my comment!
I personally believe that Nilah is in over her head when it comes to defeating Fiddlesticks. She can only feel joy, and seems fairly cocky. There is no killing Fiddlesticks, his is a primeval being much like Aurelion Sol. It would be interesting to watch her try to kill Fiddlesticks, especially with a lesser demon like Ashlash. This is also evident in how she talks to Pantheon and Mordekaiser, saying how she and Pantheon are powerful, even though a literal God’s power is immeasurable to a lesser Demon’s, and Mordekaiser being that he is near immortality, with the only thing actually able to destroy him is Rell’s power. You can see this coming out in Kindred, you can tell Nilah fears death, yet chides Mordekaiser on his fear of death, even though he didn’t fear death, he wished for his Valhalla and was angry enough to make it for himself.
tl:dr - I don’t think Nilah is genuinely as powerful as she says, but instead that she builds it up because of her confidence she gets from Ashlash.
Ashlesh is a primordial. The theory is Ashlesh knows how to beat fiddle but probably doesn't want to maybe for balance reasons of the world
I agree, also Fiddlesticks being able to be fully destroyed kinda shits on his story and concept of it being a primal entity that has always been there and no one fully understands
"When does a man die? When he is hit by a bullet? No. When he suffers a disease? No. When he ate a soup made out of a poisonous mushroom? No! A man dies when he is forgotten!" - Dr. Hiriluk
I would again like to guess that Ashland is the seventh demon, given the seventh layer and seven hands in their symbol.
I would be extremely mad if they say Swain didn't outsmart Raum but instead got outsmarted cause that would just ruin the entire point of the champion. He's a man who sees ten steps ahead. Him being 5 behind doesn't make sense
10 steps ahead of mortals, doesnt mean he cant be 5 steps behind something far beyond his ken.
@@saphcal again it ruins the fantasy of the character. Them doing that is like making cho'gath be like "you know what I'm quite full rn"
@@tselis The perfect lore end for chogath would be overfeeding him, just like the perfect end for swain would be getting "outswained". it doesnt ruin it at all. you want him to be a mary sue lol
@@saphcal I want him to be outsmartened. Not have been outsmarted. There's a difference between "this happened" and "this has already happened we just never brought it up"
@@tselis the most well done outsmarts are the ones you dont realize until way later after they happened. not knowing it was an outsmart until the consequences of being outsmarted decide to finally reveal themselves.
It feels like these voice lines are jam packed with nuggets of information.
"lost herself in joy"
and "fear took their voices"
I believe Nilah always wanted to be remember, that is why she chose this path. And her being forgotten would make all her hard work go to waste
Being forgotten a 2nd time might be like, she just vanish people and like pe0ople don't see here even if she';s there and she can only feel joy in this loniness, which is kidna sad, it's like bunny girl senpai but nilah can only fell joy
I actually thought how Ashlash would look like if he wasn't locked inside this orb. But what makes sense, that if he's one of the primal demons, then he shouldn't have form, just like Fiddlesticks, but have different colour palette. Now I wonder what colours other demons possess!
When I first saw Nilah's design: *yawn*
When I heard her voice: immediately makes D&D character based on comcept of joy
I have a theory about the voice line when she kills kindered, i actually think that the thrid presence far older is not the Grey man but the volture spirit that kills the forgoten spirits (card in LOR, and refrenced in the story with the masks) this would make sense sincr the third presence would not be the other too combined and would br much oldet than them
Didn't he state he was the last to be made
Kinda disappointed that swain probably doesnt know the cost of his demon, would have loved for him to be the first person to outsmart a demon’s deal and get the power at no cost
Isn't that the whole point of his lore tho when he was dying the demon tried to steal his secrets so he sought it out and stole its power with a reverse Fautsian deal
Well I think it would be wierd for swain to have like an Ace in his sleeve against the demon of secrets. But I think it would be fun if their deal was mutual benefit, but swain doesnt know it. But the more likely angle is based on one of swains voicelines. “never make a deal wirh a demon. That you intend to keep“ or something along those lines. But i think it would be funny if Swain tries to find a way to get rid of the deal, without Raum noticing, while Raum just feeds power of that since he feeds of secrets.
no, hot young characters are the only way Riot can progress the lore.
Nilah = Remember the name by Fort Minor
8:40 She's just referencing the Etherfiend, from LoR. The Gray Man and Kindred are the same entity, why would he be a "third presence" ? The Etherfiend is especially relevant, since she was cursed with being forgotten.
But he is younger
7:23 that explains her fighting the volibear in legends of runeterra
See, Nilah seems cool and all but what I’m looking forward to is the totally 100% confirmed logical choice by riot to implement a PvE gamemode for the star guardian event
Swain is 100% going to end up an amnesiac old fool by the end of the story. Like an hommage to old swain , when the no-name stoic noxian face just entered an inn with a broken limb and silently did his thing.
About the Homeland quote for Karma, is interesting because there were people in the First Lands and Freljord before the Westward Migration - During the war with the Titans the Vastayashai'rei were created by mortals taking in spirits ... and then in Freljord we have the war of the 3 Sisters, that said it is possible that during the western migration a tribe from the East traveled to Ionia and mixed with the locals ... which could be the reason for the quote ...
Can you read to us de catch up (PREVIOUSLY ON STAR GUARDIAN) that Riot posted to get a general idea of where we are right now in terms of their lore
Could possibly be that as long as she is remembered she will never truly be taken by the demon in death. Once she is forgotten then the demon consumes her completely
Looks like she stretching a deal with demon by doing heroic things so her name would not be forgoten.
I really wasn't sold at first on nilah. It was truly the pretty lady facade that kept me from caring further about her lore.
But boy am I glad I actually did take a look at it. I LOVe that they've expanded the lore with the primal demons. And fiddlesticks has some amazing annilihistic existential lore that I just love.
@Necrit I found this interesting, Playing ARAM as Tryndamere with a enemy Teemo on the other team and the shop keep said to Tryndamere, "Such hatred, Don't become blinded by it" and then few games later was playing ARAM as Teemo and noticed his one Eternal relating to his Q ability is named "Blinded by Hate" I never heard that shop keep voice line. I always enjoy the lore tossed in at time on ARAM you don't always hear on twisted treeline and Teemo Q eternal makes sense since since its blinds but Teemo isn't really full of Hate everyone hates him. Also i know the shop keep hates yourdle's and mentions it a lot with quotes like, "Ewww a yordle, or if you see a yordle with a little flying ship shot him for him." Any lore related to why that is? also maybe there's some hidden eternal lore reference's I'm going to look for.
Oh joy oh joy remember my name little boy , for it nilah is ,and and she a slayer of beasts .
"for stealing my name and my FATE i claim your power" "in death my spirit is yours but in life your strength and joy belong to me" what if it means history will change to her demon doing all these mighty deeds if her name is ever forgotten, thus opening up a possibility to gain new followers if those legends are ever discovered/remembered the demon will be portrayed as a mighty hero.
You can’t convince me that someone in Riot doesn’t reads One Piece and when they learned about the SMILE fruits, they straight up said: “How can we make this, but even worse?”
Actually, don't you think it's interesting that you can control a lessor Demon by knowing it's name? And now we have someone who has the power of a primal demon, whom no one can ever know her true name? There's a chance those two things can be linked.
Also, another thing about her emotions. The only time we've ever seen her express something that wasn't technically Joy was that split moment of annoyance/anger when she high fives the demon. I know it's supposed to be more of a joke line but it's still something worth noting imo. The way she says "OW! What are you doing? That was way too hard!" just super stands out to me because it's specifically towards her demon.
I mean... since she was young she loved legends. She id going around living ger dream because of the demon. I don't feel that it is creepy at all that she wants to be remembered. She wants to become legend after she died.
Huh, interesting, very interesting, i will look forward to see what comes next.
The price swain missed is probably the fact raum gets to eat his soul when he does, where as nilah knows very well what she has coming.
Nileah being so obsessed with being remembered might later on be tempted to do something so bad she has to be remembered if she feels there is no Better option left
This demon seeks to be the only one left amongst the 10
it would be cool if they incorporated a cute toxic positivity personality on nilah
what if the deal is if she cant be remember for her deeds in life and will be safe when she dies but if she's forgotten then her soul is taken by the demon
There must be a world ending situation that would happen. Maybe some ancient magic tied her to Ashlesh, some sort of agreement maybe related to fate.
So basically the demon fed Nilah the smiles devil fruit.
Now I feel unsure about the Kindred one she said she feels a third presence... If it was the grey man presence it shouldn't be possible to feel it since lamb and wolf were created from him but what makes it more confusing is the fact that she kill someone and point at the demon after death and to conclude this I wanna add something I just noticed it's about Fiddlesticks we all know that Fiddlesticks doesn't mimics demons he call them by their names and when it comes to Kindred he call it "Grey Man" like the rest of the demons Could it mean that Kindred is a messanger for the Demon of death or something like that? Idk this is confusing and tricky but there is definitely a link
6 months later but yes Grey Man is probably the demon of death
If Ashlesh annihilated her entire Emotions besides Joy, the primal Emotion hes based on, i got a feeling Nilah "would" feel sad about nobody remembering her, so even though shes always joyful, she still wants back what the Demon took from her. So, she sets out on a Journey to simply become a Legend by defeating extremely powerful beings.
Now, think about it. Her Spirit will go to Ashlesh once she dies. The only thing she ever felt is Joy. All her Memories are filled with only Joy. Her entire being is pure Joy. I dont know why, but i feel like once she dies and her overly joyful spirit goes to Ashlesh, the dudes gonna be powerful enough to break out of the Seventh Layer Prison and do.. well, whatever he wants really.
So you could say Shes one of the Happy Few, I wonder if she toke her joy.
"joy was my choice" might mean that when making the deal with the demon, she was allowed to choose one emotion to keep, and chose joy.
Mmm I’m pretty sure it means she knew after making the deal with Ashley she’d only be able to feel joy, not that she got to choose whatever emotion she wanted and be able to feel that afterwards as that wouldn’t benefit ashlesh in any way what so ever
hes the demon of joy she wouldnt have been able to choose. but she could have known shed be stuck with only joy when choosing to wield Ashlesh's power.
@@QuoKuo Imagine feeling no other emotion but joy. That would be mindfuck