You’re 100% correct, I used to do EICR for my local housing association, we were given 8hs to get two done, in that time it was full test and cert write up all C1+C2 corrected and you had to drive between addresses, sometime that would be over 40 miles away. All we were send was a huge list of addresses and we had to book them in ourselves with the tenants. As you can imagine corners were cut. We came up with a way of testing them, as best we could in the time, making sure we cover all the essential and that they were left safer than when we started. We gave up in the end,
A former director of mine once said: don't come to leadership with a problem if you don't also have a suggested solution. The IET shouldn't complain about external DBs without offering a pragmatic solution.
Little bit unfair towards the IET. Joining a row? I would say the IET consistently produce some of the best written articles in the trade. This is another of those. Who are they having a row with? Also who thinks they muddied the water? Im far from a fan of the IET as an institution for electricians. But the technical team there are outside of that. They are brilliant. This wont be the last industry "opinion" on the topic ohers are coming. Its just a shame we ended up in this place. All linked to the drive to dumb down what is an electrician. We see it with plug and play solar. Remove DC isolators, train people in a few weeks who are not electricians and now this. The only people benefiting are trainers and manufacturers. If we are not careful the skilled electricians will become an extinct species which doesnt help safety, lifespan value, consumers or wider industry. Debate of a topic is how everyone can learn. Rowing is just an excuse for personal victory at all costs. Trouble is those bills end up getting paid from all sides in that.
@@electrician247 I'm a little bit disappointed that the IET stopped at this paper. If the concerns raised in Craig O'Neill's paper result in a fatality, the IET won't have a leg to stand on in my opinion, as any defence council in the land will attack that grey area, and likely build a solid case on attacking it. The IET are always criticised for being late to the party, and this is another one as such. Not proposing regulations to combat this may prove costly. Again, my opinion. I'm mindful of the legalities around the electrical industry, and I think Pandora's box may be already open.
@@WB_Sparks Yeah they cant directly write regulations. That comes via JPEL64. However we are in DPC4 atm and I know these things are all getting discussed presently. I am not a fan of paint by numbers in the regs. But it seems we get more of that in each addition. AMD 3 case in point. So perhaps this should be considered as you say. In the medium term I think it will be. Just a hunch...
@@electrician247 yeah, not regulating it with a whole new chapter, but regulating it as a last engineering option. Watching your segments on Instagram today, points towards the lack of thought process behind it. It's a first design option and the only design option, and well done for calling it out Mark, and for the design, selection and erection of the installation.
To be fair we generally remain neutral in the news, the report in this episode actually presented both sides of the argument giving priority to the excellently written and thorough article from the IET. It's only fair that voices are heard on both sides of the debate. I agree with you that debating can lead to good results, unfortunately we've experienced personal attacks from others in the social media space which threatens to turn it into the row for personal victory you've described, but it comes with the territory I guess. We'll keep reporting on industry trends and leave the mud-slinging to others, I suspect this topic will drag on and it'll be interesting to see how it develops through official channels.
@@efixx I would say, there is quite a few personal victories in this. Electrical business' up and down the country have been undermined with cheap labour and poor workmanship emanating from this. Is anyone going to sit back while their training and livelihoods are being undermined? Absolutely not.
Why can't the new smart meters not include an isolator, PEN fault detection device and SPD to take care of all the problems caused by their poor system and demands. It would be safer for everyone and it should not be upto the person paying for the service to have to make it safe.
I had one, for (3) three phase . That was an initial installation. Meter boxes since then don't get implemented any longer. I don't know if it is a very costly unit or if those meters are still produced. Councils don't like or prefer that there are no isolators/breakers by the point of power entry on your property. As consumers we don't voice our rights collectively. They just don't want an isolator/ breaker in the meters or at point of entry on your property, before the meter. Costly and meter tampering is a bigger concern. Breakers do their job, but there is no warranty. Breakers can trip once or a hundred times before becoming faulty. So if those breakers fail in the on position you continue to get current via the meter,"meter embedded one's" even if there are no prepaid units loaded/paid for. My initial prepaid meter did exactly that.
Great channel thanks, the big issue with all outside installs is where do we as electricians draw the line between being an electrician and a builder. I am just completing a stunning outside install but it has involved building a wall, a concrete tiled roof, plastering and painting, aluminum custom doors etc (think more plant room than box!). Its probably the most impressive and complex install I have ever done featuring 3 inverters (2 hybrid), 2 LiFePO4 battery banks, all 1000 Mhz Cat 6, 2 x R290 heat pump feeds integrated into home automation, but its has taken months and I must admit all this 750v DC stuff has been a huge learning curve.
The local council only seems to do reactive maintenance rather than planned. My brothers council house they replaced the smoke alarms after a fire at a neighbouring property. One was just the base on the ceiling and the device itself was missing and had been for over 10 years. Don’t know if it has an eicr but no sticker on the consumer unit.
BMS engineers can earn £800 a day in the UK! I’m an ex self employed electrician and I’ve closed my business and now I’m an area manager for a national gas maintenance company. Gas engineers earn between £5-£10k more than electricians! If I could do it all again I’d be a plumber/gas engineer, both trades ruin your knees and lower back so you might as well get paid more for doing the job.
I live in a council property. In the 30 years my partner has been here, there has only been one inspection, about 3 years ago. It was a very brief check of a few socket outlets and was by no means a full EICR. We never got any paperwork, either. I was not impressed.
Really interesting re external consumer units. I am a DIY monkey who learns via great channels like yours. A well know EV charger company fitted an external unit in the meter box as first choice. We had spare ways in a separate fuse box, from the house, in the garage. The 6mm ran past the fuse box to the EV charger location on the run Our energy provider replaced the meter in the DNO box. Large hole left in the side where the water comes in. Not his problem apparently
In the US having what we call the consumer unit on the outside of a house is often required by their local building codes (which vary from place to place). The primary reason is that it allows firefighters to turn off the power without entering the building.
We kind of have this issue sorted in the sense that our meter cabinets are often outside and easy to access, the issue is how often they have isolators, not very often!!!
2:05 "any regulation change needs to be backed up with strong science and evidence". Where's the 'cue hollow laughter' emoji I can click repeatedy whilst I think about the reg requiring metal CUs..
So I fitted my first external rated consumer unit the other day. A BG EV sync. It’s aluminium construction and well sealed. Time will tell. But what I have done is seal all the holes drilled, seal around the top and sides. Along with placing it in an adequate location.
It’s not the DNO’s cabinet. It is your property and it belongs to you. They can insist on specific conditions to supply electricity but it is not theirs. If it was they would have to have a way leave to have it in your property.
The statement from the ENA makes it clear that the cabinet belongs to the customer (more accurately, the owner of the building). DNOs do not require a wayleave for equipment servicing premises on which it is installed.
Not that unusual unusual. Three weeks ago had a call where 8 houses affected. Give UKPN their due. They attended within the hour. Had a fleet of Vans there next day, repairing or replacing all damaged items.
Don't see a problem as long as they are fit for purpose and installed correctly. Every argument against that I've read, comes down to poor installation and/or materials. Apart from them looking pish.
Octopus has pretty much destroyed my electric vehicle charge point business by buying their Ohme charge points at less than independents and clearly paying their installers much less. What is perhaps more scandalous is that some of my customers have been waiting years for Octopus to do smart meter installs - is there a shortage of smart meters or just that the bonuses for installing them have dried up? Anyone have any inside information on the reasons?
Frankly I was shocked to see an external unit fitted outside my house in a public accessible position to control my heatpump, not a position I’d have place it and certainly not if it wasn’t high of the ground to stop children accessing it.
Whilst there are risks with installing external consumer units, these will be minimal / unlikely if installed well, by a competent, skilled and proud installer. Given this is increasingly unlikely, and the likelihood for unskilled people to then work on the boards potentially increasing the risk of any problems, I would suggest they should be used as a last resort.
Whilst I’m sure many would disagree, the problem for smaller companies is if they take on a woman and then she becomes pregnant they loose an employee and are forced to keep the post open. That in itself can be a real problem if one only employs 4 or 5 electricians or less. A niece of mine used just this legislation to hold onto a job then returned only to get pregnant again within a week. Hold onto the job until a few months after returning gave up the job with just a couple of weeks notice, now is that fair.
The leave is shared between the couple now. A guy in my team took almost all the paternity leave because his wife earned more and she was determined to get back to work.
Great you have covered what is a wonderful article from the IET. I feel this can of worms has only just popped. We could well be in the world of recalls and remedial work very soon. How that applies with manufacturers and those promoting this via dedicated content remains for later. Interesting. I would politely suggest avoid targeted besmirchs on technical managers within industry. You might have a large audience on the Internet. But outside of that (it's not the flex you believe it is) you will come out worse in those activities.
No besmirching took place, if you watch the episode back you'll see we presented both sides of the debate giving the IET article priority and remained neutral in the news.
IET aren’t fit for purpose, how do we get someone else in charge who can foresee issues and provide a set of standards for 2024. Something odd is going on with them, everywhere else in the world you can put different manufacturers devices in a board. Stinks of corruption.
How would this have anything to do with corruption?! It’s not like they’re pushing one brand. Manufacturers can’t guarantee that other brands will fit or work without issue. MIs are king. Not worth the risk. Buy the right brand for each board and stop being a lazy dick. It’s not hard.
And yet almost every solar installation sees a module meter added into the CU that is almost never the same brand as the MCB's etc.... It's largely a rule most sparks pay no attention to...
@@dougle03 I’d suggest that most good sparks pay attention to it. More often than not, an off brand device in a CU is serving solar, EVSE, ashp, or something in a newly fit kitchen. Essentially it’s the non sparks or partial sparks throwing it in an not giving a damn.
The outdoor CU is very easy to sort. But the IET and powers that be haven’t got the balls to do so. It’s done by putting the following as a LEGAL requirement by writing into ESQCR (not BS7671): 1 - Any outdoor consumer unit in a domestic property must be comprised of a IP65 rated GRP enclosure. 2 - All protective devices, switchgear, circuit protection components must be comprised of the correct pollution control rating. 3 - The enclosure must be big enough to allow temperature control devices to ensure protective devices work within required temperature ranges 4 - Temperature control devices are mandatory and must be installed to maintain the temperature between (choose a range eg 0-35deg C) That would cover practically any domestic property and stop the cowboys and energy companies just throwing consumer units on the wall. Finally (and this will have some spit feathers) in any domestic property with a TNCS supply the DNO MUST put in PEN fault protection that protects the whole installation downstream and originating from the service cutout. If the DNO can’t manage their network to prevent PEN faults (and I accept even a well maintained network can have a PEN fault) then they should have to provide the mitigation for it. However considering they charge a ridiculous amount to install a £20 DP isolator, they aren’t going to stump up for something like a MATT:E without being forced to.
I remember when I did my 18th one of the Authors was presenting the class, they already had their eyes on making any consumer unit upgrade require a TT earth to be put in as they knew PEN faults were becoming a bigger issue. As we and subsequent classes pointed out it's impractical to put a TT stake in for every property. The IET and DNO's are all about passing the buck to electricians rather than actually providing and maintaining a supply that's adequate for the transition to a fully electrified future.
What difference is there between a distribution board in terms of Ip and Ik ratings with DB'S in a caravan park located externally and distribution board located externally for an evse
My point is if external consumer units are not suitable for external use for an electric vehicle installation then how can they be suitable for applications in other areas of the regulations such as caravan parks or marinas
The IET are a re-active and not pro active another book print on the way , far to many items come into the country with all sorts of electrical issues , which has to be sorted by Sparky's, then along come the regs guys , your doing it all wrong😢😢
Would someone suitably qualified please answer my CU question. Can a CU be installed in its own electric box ( not meter box ) on the outside wall of my property? The electric box bought from a builders merchant recessed into wall cavity. Replies most welcome.
Of course it is an enclosure designed for the installation of electrical equipment as long as it is not modified, probably the best way to fit a ev charger installation as well.
Energy companies have a monopoly on installs. Plus those saying the meter box is theirs alone is rubbish. After the meter its yours. Some backplates show a layout. The girl after a job is claiming sexism because she couldn’t get a job. What about all the others out there? Just because you have qualifications, doesn’t necessarily mean you’re the right person or have the right qualities they’re looking for. It smells more like arrogance to me.
The electrical game is a mess be that AC rcd / batteries in lofts / MCS / octopus pulling all the strings/ updates/ training courses min training required to be a sparks/ no money in fitting EV points and many DIY home owners fitting solar including Amazon change over switches for power cuts ( to many people with fingers in the pie of the NICEIC / NAPIT / MCS and trainging colleges..
The MCS should be no more... It's a club, and nothing more. It's day was uring FiT installations, it has no business now being involved in Solar installations.... The ENA is sufficient for certification and the existing bodies for the guidance... It may be a non-profit, but there are plenty of ways to get rich running one....
We got a BG out side consumer unit after we saw your TH-cam video on it. It made the Ohme ePod installation easier for the electrician So are they safe or not. What do you think.
The so-called 'gender pay gap' is often mis-represented. The gender EARNINGS gap tends to correct itself once you factor in experience and working hours. Women entering this industry is relatively new which means their average age will be lower than men's which means less experienced on average. It's also well documented that men work more hours on average.
![เจ็บที่ยังฮัก - ม่อน วรวิทย์ [ Official Mv ] จอนนี่มิวสิค](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KALIGSRSjFs/mqdefault.jpg)
Where did the "Row" start - back here 👉 th-cam.com/video/864pJSfAuOY/w-d-xo.htmlsi=M7lZji3XxjQ2zIUJ.
The only way I’d install a CCU outside is in another large IP box you need tools to open.
Most of the council EICR’s not worth the paper they’re written on anyway!!
100%
You’re 100% correct,
I used to do EICR for my local housing association, we were given 8hs to get two done, in that time it was full test and cert write up all C1+C2 corrected and you had to drive between addresses, sometime that would be over 40 miles away.
All we were send was a huge list of addresses and we had to book them in ourselves with the tenants.
As you can imagine corners were cut.
We came up with a way of testing them, as best we could in the time, making sure we cover all the essential and that they were left safer than when we started.
We gave up in the end,
Not just the council.
Couldn’t agree more. People won’t pay the true cost. It’s all a box ticking exercise to appease insurance companies, until it goes wrong that is.
You get give 4 to 5 property's a day at 50pound a house with cert rite up
NOT WORTH THE PAPER
Quick ze pfc
Zs everything
Ring end too ends 😂
Bad tbf
A former director of mine once said: don't come to leadership with a problem if you don't also have a suggested solution.
The IET shouldn't complain about external DBs without offering a pragmatic solution.
The solution is the same it has been from 1st edition use the board in the property!
Rectifying C2 whilst at the property?! That sounds like some nonsense.
Little bit unfair towards the IET. Joining a row? I would say the IET consistently produce some of the best written articles in the trade. This is another of those. Who are they having a row with? Also who thinks they muddied the water? Im far from a fan of the IET as an institution for electricians. But the technical team there are outside of that. They are brilliant.
This wont be the last industry "opinion" on the topic ohers are coming. Its just a shame we ended up in this place. All linked to the drive to dumb down what is an electrician. We see it with plug and play solar. Remove DC isolators, train people in a few weeks who are not electricians and now this. The only people benefiting are trainers and manufacturers. If we are not careful the skilled electricians will become an extinct species which doesnt help safety, lifespan value, consumers or wider industry.
Debate of a topic is how everyone can learn. Rowing is just an excuse for personal victory at all costs. Trouble is those bills end up getting paid from all sides in that.
@@electrician247 I'm a little bit disappointed that the IET stopped at this paper. If the concerns raised in Craig O'Neill's paper result in a fatality, the IET won't have a leg to stand on in my opinion, as any defence council in the land will attack that grey area, and likely build a solid case on attacking it. The IET are always criticised for being late to the party, and this is another one as such. Not proposing regulations to combat this may prove costly. Again, my opinion. I'm mindful of the legalities around the electrical industry, and I think Pandora's box may be already open.
@@WB_Sparks Yeah they cant directly write regulations. That comes via JPEL64. However we are in DPC4 atm and I know these things are all getting discussed presently. I am not a fan of paint by numbers in the regs. But it seems we get more of that in each addition. AMD 3 case in point. So perhaps this should be considered as you say. In the medium term I think it will be. Just a hunch...
@@electrician247 yeah, not regulating it with a whole new chapter, but regulating it as a last engineering option. Watching your segments on Instagram today, points towards the lack of thought process behind it. It's a first design option and the only design option, and well done for calling it out Mark, and for the design, selection and erection of the installation.
To be fair we generally remain neutral in the news, the report in this episode actually presented both sides of the argument giving priority to the excellently written and thorough article from the IET. It's only fair that voices are heard on both sides of the debate. I agree with you that debating can lead to good results, unfortunately we've experienced personal attacks from others in the social media space which threatens to turn it into the row for personal victory you've described, but it comes with the territory I guess. We'll keep reporting on industry trends and leave the mud-slinging to others, I suspect this topic will drag on and it'll be interesting to see how it develops through official channels.
@@efixx I would say, there is quite a few personal victories in this. Electrical business' up and down the country have been undermined with cheap labour and poor workmanship emanating from this.
Is anyone going to sit back while their training and livelihoods are being undermined? Absolutely not.
Why can't the new smart meters not include an isolator, PEN fault detection device and SPD to take care of all the problems caused by their poor system and demands. It would be safer for everyone and it should not be upto the person paying for the service to have to make it safe.
I had one, for (3) three phase . That was an initial installation. Meter boxes since then don't get implemented any longer. I don't know if it is a very costly unit or if those meters are still produced. Councils don't like or prefer that there are no isolators/breakers by the point of power entry on your property. As consumers we don't voice our rights collectively. They just don't want an isolator/ breaker in the meters or at point of entry on your property, before the meter. Costly and meter tampering is a bigger concern. Breakers do their job, but there is no warranty. Breakers can trip once or a hundred times before becoming faulty. So if those breakers fail in the on position you continue to get current via the meter,"meter embedded one's" even if there are no prepaid units loaded/paid for. My initial prepaid meter did exactly that.
Great idea!
@@LambertFick here in Brazil we have an single breaker after the power meter, double breaker if the power meter is 220v and triple breaker if 380v.
Good idea but won't earn the higher ups any money
Exactly, I've been saying this for years.
In Australia the whole lot is in a metal box on the side of the house , circuit breakers , meters and service fuses
Yeah, we've been doing this in Australia since fuses were rewire able.
All new builds the consumer units should be installed on the outside walls to stop outdoor consumer units being installed outside
Great channel thanks, the big issue with all outside installs is where do we as electricians draw the line between being an electrician and a builder. I am just completing a stunning outside install but it has involved building a wall, a concrete tiled roof, plastering and painting, aluminum custom doors etc (think more plant room than box!). Its probably the most impressive and complex install I have ever done featuring 3 inverters (2 hybrid), 2 LiFePO4 battery banks, all 1000 Mhz Cat 6, 2 x R290 heat pump feeds integrated into home automation, but its has taken months and I must admit all this 750v DC stuff has been a huge learning curve.
The local council only seems to do reactive maintenance rather than planned. My brothers council house they replaced the smoke alarms after a fire at a neighbouring property. One was just the base on the ceiling and the device itself was missing and had been for over 10 years. Don’t know if it has an eicr but no sticker on the consumer unit.
BMS engineers can earn £800 a day in the UK! I’m an ex self employed electrician and I’ve closed my business and now I’m an area manager for a national gas maintenance company. Gas engineers earn between £5-£10k more than electricians! If I could do it all again I’d be a plumber/gas engineer, both trades ruin your knees and lower back so you might as well get paid more for doing the job.
I live in a council property. In the 30 years my partner has been here, there has only been one inspection, about 3 years ago. It was a very brief check of a few socket outlets and was by no means a full EICR. We never got any paperwork, either. I was not impressed.
Really interesting re external consumer units. I am a DIY monkey who learns via great channels like yours.
A well know EV charger company fitted an external unit in the meter box as first choice. We had spare ways in a separate fuse box, from the house, in the garage. The 6mm ran past the fuse box to the EV charger location on the run
Our energy provider replaced the meter in the DNO box. Large hole left in the side where the water comes in. Not his problem apparently
The DNO box is your property. So yep, your responsibility to fix it.
In the US having what we call the consumer unit on the outside of a house is often required by their local building codes (which vary from place to place). The primary reason is that it allows firefighters to turn off the power without entering the building.
We kind of have this issue sorted in the sense that our meter cabinets are often outside and easy to access, the issue is how often they have isolators, not very often!!!
Im surprised the CMA havent stepped in, energry company installers being able to pull the main fuse is an unfair advantage.
Needs a ground swell of people to complain... Perhaps one of the big bodies should formally complain...?
Maybe we need a new style of partitioned DNO cabinet …
Yes totally agree, I’ve been saying this for some time now.
2:05 "any regulation change needs to be backed up with strong science and evidence".
Where's the 'cue hollow laughter' emoji I can click repeatedy whilst I think about the reg requiring metal CUs..
In EU is quite usual in new builts, houses to have the CU outside but the CU their is in a clear front white box and very good quality.
Fantastic Content on Todays news 👍
So I fitted my first external rated consumer unit the other day.
A BG EV sync. It’s aluminium construction and well sealed. Time will tell. But what I have done is seal all the holes drilled, seal around the top and sides. Along with placing it in an adequate location.
I've not fitted one but I'd treat it the same as any other IP rated GRP box, bottom-entry only and hope for the best 😂😂
I'd add a condensation valve on the bottom also
It’s not the DNO’s cabinet. It is your property and it belongs to you. They can insist on specific conditions to supply electricity but it is not theirs. If it was they would have to have a way leave to have it in your property.
The statement from the ENA makes it clear that the cabinet belongs to the customer (more accurately, the owner of the building). DNOs do not require a wayleave for equipment servicing premises on which it is installed.
@@protectiongeek They do if they want to reserve it for their exclusive use... It's a subtle difference, but an important one all the same...
@@dougle03 if they want to “reserve it” it won’t, by definition, be servicing the premises on which it is installed, so my statement still stands.
What about when the tails need extending would you have to fit the sub inside the house before the consumer unit.
Great news weekly as always Joe 👍
Glad you think so!
Not that unusual unusual. Three weeks ago had a call where 8 houses affected. Give UKPN their due. They attended within the hour. Had a fleet of Vans there next day, repairing or replacing all damaged items.
Topiary and herrings are the two words
I would never install a outdoor one in the first place .
Topiary Herons - two words you slipped in. Great show btw!
Don't see a problem as long as they are fit for purpose and installed correctly. Every argument against that I've read, comes down to poor installation and/or materials.
Apart from them looking pish.
Octopus has pretty much destroyed my electric vehicle charge point business by buying their Ohme charge points at less than independents and clearly paying their installers much less. What is perhaps more scandalous is that some of my customers have been waiting years for Octopus to do smart meter installs - is there a shortage of smart meters or just that the bonuses for installing them have dried up? Anyone have any inside information on the reasons?
I've been out many times fixing Ohme crap unsafe installations. Customers heard the installer being on the phone and got the instructions by someone.
Frankly I was shocked to see an external unit fitted outside my house in a public accessible position to control my heatpump, not a position I’d have place it and certainly not if it wasn’t high of the ground to stop children accessing it.
Don't let the industry be hit with ANOTHER change in regulations requiring more new books to be bought.
Whilst there are risks with installing external consumer units, these will be minimal / unlikely if installed well, by a competent, skilled and proud installer. Given this is increasingly unlikely, and the likelihood for unskilled people to then work on the boards potentially increasing the risk of any problems, I would suggest they should be used as a last resort.
Whilst I’m sure many would disagree, the problem for smaller companies is if they take on a woman and then she becomes pregnant they loose an employee and are forced to keep the post open. That in itself can be a real problem if one only employs 4 or 5 electricians or less. A niece of mine used just this legislation to hold onto a job then returned only to get pregnant again within a week. Hold onto the job until a few months after returning gave up the job with just a couple of weeks notice, now is that fair.
The leave is shared between the couple now.
A guy in my team took almost all the paternity leave because his wife earned more and she was determined to get back to work.
Bugger, just realised this was an old video - sod YT for not showing it to me before now
Great you have covered what is a wonderful article from the IET. I feel this can of worms has only just popped. We could well be in the world of recalls and remedial work very soon. How that applies with manufacturers and those promoting this via dedicated content remains for later. Interesting. I would politely suggest avoid targeted besmirchs on technical managers within industry. You might have a large audience on the Internet. But outside of that (it's not the flex you believe it is) you will come out worse in those activities.
No besmirching took place, if you watch the episode back you'll see we presented both sides of the debate giving the IET article priority and remained neutral in the news.
IET aren’t fit for purpose, how do we get someone else in charge who can foresee issues and provide a set of standards for 2024. Something odd is going on with them, everywhere else in the world you can put different manufacturers devices in a board. Stinks of corruption.
How would this have anything to do with corruption?! It’s not like they’re pushing one brand.
Manufacturers can’t guarantee that other brands will fit or work without issue. MIs are king. Not worth the risk. Buy the right brand for each board and stop being a lazy dick. It’s not hard.
And yet almost every solar installation sees a module meter added into the CU that is almost never the same brand as the MCB's etc.... It's largely a rule most sparks pay no attention to...
@@dougle03 I’d suggest that most good sparks pay attention to it. More often than not, an off brand device in a CU is serving solar, EVSE, ashp, or something in a newly fit kitchen. Essentially it’s the non sparks or partial sparks throwing it in an not giving a damn.
You've been told all this for a long time, but you chose to ignore it for a few quid.
What's wrong with an IP rated plastic consumer unit?
Think it's Topiary and herons at 6:03.
I think the challenge words this week are litany and topiary.
The outdoor CU is very easy to sort. But the IET and powers that be haven’t got the balls to do so.
It’s done by putting the following as a LEGAL requirement by writing into ESQCR (not BS7671):
1 - Any outdoor consumer unit in a domestic property must be comprised of a IP65 rated GRP enclosure.
2 - All protective devices, switchgear, circuit protection components must be comprised of the correct pollution control rating.
3 - The enclosure must be big enough to allow temperature control devices to ensure protective devices work within required temperature ranges
4 - Temperature control devices are mandatory and must be installed to maintain the temperature between (choose a range eg 0-35deg C)
That would cover practically any domestic property and stop the cowboys and energy companies just throwing consumer units on the wall.
Finally (and this will have some spit feathers) in any domestic property with a TNCS supply the DNO MUST put in PEN fault protection that protects the whole installation downstream and originating from the service cutout.
If the DNO can’t manage their network to prevent PEN faults (and I accept even a well maintained network can have a PEN fault) then they should have to provide the mitigation for it.
However considering they charge a ridiculous amount to install a £20 DP isolator, they aren’t going to stump up for something like a MATT:E without being forced to.
I remember when I did my 18th one of the Authors was presenting the class, they already had their eyes on making any consumer unit upgrade require a TT earth to be put in as they knew PEN faults were becoming a bigger issue. As we and subsequent classes pointed out it's impractical to put a TT stake in for every property. The IET and DNO's are all about passing the buck to electricians rather than actually providing and maintaining a supply that's adequate for the transition to a fully electrified future.
I’m going with the Challenge words being topiary Heron
What difference is there between a distribution board in terms of Ip and Ik ratings with DB'S in a caravan park located externally and distribution board located externally for an evse
Don't caravan park electrics come under different regulations...?
No, they're in BS7671 regs, under special locations.
Caravan sites are also covered in the ESCQR as an installation which can be provided with TNCS earthing.
My point is if external consumer units are not suitable for external use for an electric vehicle installation then how can they be suitable for applications in other areas of the regulations such as caravan parks or marinas
Repairing c2 on site is open to abuse and maybe even a conflict of interest
What's wrong with fitting the CU in a weatherproof cabinet
Nothing.
Thermal effects but if that's been taken into account nothing that would be the better way than a metal lunchbox bolted at kid height on your drive
The IET are a re-active and not pro active another book print on the way , far to many items come into the country with all sorts of electrical issues , which has to be sorted by Sparky's, then along come the regs guys , your doing it all wrong😢😢
The IET is a political activist organisation, what does it have to do with electrical engineering?
Words are topiary and herron?
Octopus will fit an isolator FoC at customer request.
They fitted mine without being asked.
Topiary Herons - obviously
Topiary and herons.
I reckon!
How are we ever going to get this problem resolved until meter boxes are made bigger and divided into two sections
For new build there are much better potential solutions, just a little pre-wiring or conduit will do the job.
@@edc1569 sure that’s true.
Was the word “prosumer”
Would someone suitably qualified please answer my CU question.
Can a CU be installed in its own electric box ( not meter box ) on the outside wall of my property? The electric box bought from a builders merchant recessed into wall cavity.
Replies most welcome.
Of course it is an enclosure designed for the installation of electrical equipment as long as it is not modified, probably the best way to fit a ev charger installation as well.
Yes it can . We are installing secondary meter boxes on our new builds for swa submains via switch fuses .
Thanks to both of you.
Much appreciated.
Topiary, Herons
Heron and Campari 🤔
Energy companies have a monopoly on installs. Plus those saying the meter box is theirs alone is rubbish.
After the meter its yours. Some backplates show a layout.
The girl after a job is claiming sexism because she couldn’t get a job. What about all the others out there? Just because you have qualifications, doesn’t necessarily mean you’re the right person or have the right qualities they’re looking for.
It smells more like arrogance to me.
Topiary and Herons
Topiary & herons 😊
The electrical game is a mess be that AC rcd / batteries in lofts / MCS / octopus pulling all the strings/ updates/ training courses min training required to be a sparks/ no money in fitting EV points and many DIY home owners fitting solar including Amazon change over switches for power cuts ( to many people with fingers in the pie of the NICEIC / NAPIT / MCS and trainging colleges..
The MCS should be no more... It's a club, and nothing more. It's day was uring FiT installations, it has no business now being involved in Solar installations.... The ENA is sufficient for certification and the existing bodies for the guidance... It may be a non-profit, but there are plenty of ways to get rich running one....
Topiary and herons? ;o)
We got a BG out side consumer unit after we saw your TH-cam video on it. It made the Ohme ePod installation easier for the electrician
So are they safe or not. What do you think.
Provided it's installed correctly and with care, then yes.
Topiary and herrings
Topiary | Herons
Herons and Topiary
Do you know how I could become a SIP?
You essentially have to sign up to the same “rules” as meter installers. It’s a complex process.
Topiary and herons
Topiary Herons
A bit hypocritical when this channel was one of a few pushing these "outdoor" boards in the last year l.
Topiary herons
Topiary Herons ;)
topiary herons
cool
The so-called 'gender pay gap' is often mis-represented. The gender EARNINGS gap tends to correct itself once you factor in experience and working hours. Women entering this industry is relatively new which means their average age will be lower than men's which means less experienced on average. It's also well documented that men work more hours on average.
I’m going with the Challenge words being topiary Heron
Topiary, Herons
Topiary and Herons
Topiary Herons
Topiary herons
Topiary Herons
Topiary Herons