Give credit for prior knowledge and you might get more people retraining. I've worked on control systems in industrial environments. Years of fault finding complicated control systems from three phase to component level. Have done inspection and testing of circuits to IET guidance note 3. Have done my regs. Looked into retraining as a spark and was told I have to start from scratch and learn ohms law when what I need is to update my regulations knowledge and get up-to-date current practice and techniques of instalation.
I entered this business because I viewed it as a trade I could turn my skill set to and it was one that didn't move particularly quickly, after all, what really changed over the long course of 16th Edition aside from breakers taking over from fuses and the introduction of RCDs? There wasn't a lot, outside of bonding madness, and the old boys of the day didn't have to reskill too much just to carry on. I get that the pace of change in technology is much faster now, but it feels like information overload just trying to keep up. Indeed, I told my NIC assessor I had no intention of keeping up, not with renewables, not with Prosumer nonsense, not with smart tech. Still, he told me I'd be expected to be informed and able to demonstrate requisite knowledge even if avoiding these areas because I may go into premises that are so equipped. I'm not surprised there's a shortage of yoof wanting to get onto this ladder - if I were younger I don't think I'd consider it now either.
I thought Brexit meant Brexit ( of course I'm just talking about EU harmonisation nothing else ) look at the USA, haven't changed since the 80s electrical wise.
@@bilpat5123Very true,the jobs become a joke in its self,I know guys working 45 hour weeks earnings over £50,000 not breaking a sweat doing supervisor jobs in warehouses
Probably cost is a factor, I bet with the multi-function testers that sparks use, they must cost so much that you'd get very little change out of £1,000 and think about the value of all the tools in your vans, that's a big outlay for someone wanting to become a spark
Its because there is way to many hoops to jump through and memberships. Why do we pay to work? If your under the napit or niceic money extractors for membership fees, all your equipment calibration costs, insurance costs, van costs , tool costs etc etc. Plus all the CPD and paper work. Then there's the jib card scam, paying to work, again. High responsibility, constant hassle, not enough pay. There's easier jobs that pay the same and usually more, so why bother..?
I think all the above is why smaller businesses just limit the range the types of work they take on . Much as I dread the annual NIC EIC inspection it does help maintain standards and keep you on the right track. A necessary evil if you like.
From the outside looking in, electrician seems to be the only job that at this rate will regulate itself out of existence, Who wants to get a job that requires more reading than doing. As for take up of green energy, again, it is being overwhelmed with layers of regulation which in affect is basically putting people off or making it impossible to retro fit anything.
I do wonder if these regulations are heading into the "lets regulate it for the sake of it" territory. Take section 716 as an example. The requirements of PoE safety are very well addressed in IEE802.3 I am not sure what BS7671 can add to this other than another layer of rules.
Probably trying to bring PoE under the electricians remit and making cat 6 getting building control so you can’t install your own networking cables unless you get building control permission. Better not because that will be bollox and I for one will ignore it.
@@TheBrick2 Yes, I have seen this in a lot of places in the UK. This just looks like another example. I wonder how much money BSI Group makes from regular releases of updated standards and whether there is a conflict of interest going on.
On top of that the IT industry generally works to international standards such as those from IEC so that it can make a single product and sell it worldwide. Anything in a national standard that deviates from the international standard is a major problem as having different products for different markets bumps up costs and in some cases means a product will not be sold in markets that don't follow the international standard.
I can’t tell you how happy I am I quit and went back to work in IT recently. The amount of physical work, training, and responsibility you have to be a competent electrician is eye watering, brain breaking and kneecap shattering compared to other career paths available. Absolute 100% mugs game at this point. Respect to you if you love the job and do it for the love. I did. Couldn’t support my family in the way I wanted though, love for the job wasn’t enough. Can get paid twice the wage for 1/4 the effort and 1/8 the responsibility in IT. My advice to anyone looking to get in to the trade. DON’T. Get some specialist IT qualifications related to commercial and enterprise networking (avoid programming and stuff like that), things like administration of cloud computing, things like that.
@@maxtroy Funnily enough I was a Cisco engineer for 15 years, CCNA, CCNP. But.... The demand for onsite engineers doing cli has dropped off so much now due to Meraki and cloud provisioning. I got so disillusioned with the networking industry that I have re trained as a commercial electrician, mostly in telecoms and data centre DC systems. I don't miss it at all.
Before I read the comments, I thought over regulation and low pay, i used to be an electrician with the CEGB who made the dammed stuff but my qualification would't cut the mustard these days, most older sparkies just do maintenance type work instead, same with Gas engineers once they get to a certain age they cant be bothered with going through all the courses every 5 years. The min wage is going up to £12.21, I still see some sparkie roles advertising £14/15 per hour, the young'ens are not stupid? If you are a really good sparks and have your own company you could do well but not everyone wants that level of resposibilty or risk.
I was "just" an electrician for many years and honestly started to get out when the rubbish they called part P came in. Look how bad it is now with the CPD they are asking you to do. I know painters that earn more then a employed electrician. I do mainly building/carpentry work now, mostly signed of by council/ private inspectors and i earn more then 3 times the advertised roll of £15 ph for sparkies
It's funny. I was a 16th edition sparks. I fancied getting off the tools, studied hard and became a database consultant and software engineer. I left that world when it exploded in a million directions and I lost the will and capacity to keep up. So I returned to sparking believing it would be slower pace of change did the 18th edition. 6 year's later and the IEC are clearly getting very bored indeed. I reckon there's a real risk of an epidemic of common sense taking over and the IEC legislating themselves into a position of increased irrelevance.... The irony of the same video talking about the lack of sparks and adding more and more nonsense to BS7671 is not lost on me.
@@efixx yeah and all this stuff you need extra qualifications to do it. All this trade has become is a money racket where the IET just keep fleecing electricians. No wonder so many people are getting out of the game
I don't see how electric wall paper is an alternative to heat pumps, or in any way mitigates for poor thermal insulation. Without thermal insulation behind, it will increase wall losses by virtue of the higher wall temperature. It's just a novel innovation of resistance heating. Radiated heat feels warmer than the air temperature would indicate which may reduce running costs slightly compared with more conventional electric radiators. Main features appears to about space saving & maybe more even heat distribution. Runs on 24v, and you can cut holes in it for small fixtures like switches without major reduction in performance.
There's some embedded ceiling elements still going strong 40+ years on in some flats in my catchment area. The elements survive, the thermostats need changing every now & then. (edit) Just sanity checked the date of construction of the flats - 1960s. So 50+ years old (/edit)
Try paying them a lot more than plumbers, it’s about 16 x more difficult. It’s also very paperwork driven and a lot more technical than putting in a length of copper pipe
And brickies and chippies, we need way more tools, qaulifications, know-how governing bodies etc and all they need is a couple of trowels or some wood cutting gear
Only an electrician would say that. The electrician's limited knowledge of plumbing is 'putting in a piece of copper pipe'. Its a completely different trade that can never be compared. Maybe become a plumber instead?
@coxyjmz I don't think it's about being more difficult. The other building trades are equally as skilled. No, it's the responsibility. In my opinion only a gas fitterhas a similar responsibility and a constant requirement to re-tain.
@ how much renewable work do you do? Set up and commissioning is far more complicated, it doesn’t always go smooth even when you follow the instructions! It’s added grief to a job you already have to be skilled to do.
I’ve been in the game 15 years and am ready to get out you can get better pay doing different jobs and without the need for constantly updating regulations. I’ve seen a comment on this post and it describes it perfectly “seems to be the only job that will regulate itself out of existence” even electricians in the trade now don’t want to do it never mind young kids leaving school
If the graphic is correct, its ceiling paper! I remember a developer building some houses in Birchanger near Stansted tried ceiling heating over 40 years ago, didnt catch on.
Thank you Joe. "That works out at a thousand pounds of ADMIN for every upgraded home"..... call me a cynic but that is a lot of brown envelopes being thrown around for nothing. Regarding the Martindale MFT, I don't know if it is me but apart from the LCD screen, it looks a bit "Fisher Price" and not quality. If they spent just a little more on the body's aesthetics, they might bring in a few more interested sparks.
Ive been in the industry for over 15 years, self funded qualification adult learner, started self employed on an agency. Ive almost always self funded everything, ECA say i cant get eca card satus because i have 2330, 2391-52 and 16th 3rd, 17th, 1,2,3, 18th 1,2,3. But not AM2 or NVQ, at the moment I'm trying to pay mortgage 3 kids van food ect, cant take the time off for more courses let alone the 4k in fees. This is the reality. Almost, almost regret not being a plumber.
Exact same story as me mate. I quit after Covid and went to work in IT. It’s still a shock to me seeing the difference in my life before and life after. Everything I was led to believe about being an electrician was a lie. Still I carried out for over 15 years because I thought one day I’d get ahead if I just worked a bit harder and concentrated a bit more.
Just imagine what's going to happen when all poe installations need to be done by a "qualified" elctrician..😂😂😂😂. Good for the sales of VERY expensive test eqiptment though!
I'm not surprised there aren't enough electricians. I've looked at it as a career change and found the qualification side far too complicated. I appreciate there is a lot to learn, but the path to qualification needs to be made a lot more straightforward. Far too many hoops, snakes and ladders to negotiate. It's worse than trying to get a motorcycle licence.
@@DelticEngine being an electrician is not for someone who’s failed in their chosen profession. It’s a skill set that requires the ability to learn academically and manually. Learning a trade that will keep you employed or running your own business.
@@andyc7946 Failed? That's a very presumptuous and insulting way to begin a comment! I have no issue that it requires the ability to learn both academically and manually to develop the skillset. Maybe such an attitude also presents a barrier to those wishing to enter the profession? My argument is that there is, on the face of it, no reason that the whole qualification could not learned at a suitable academic institution. My research suggested that I had to find a company to work for as well as organise the academic side of things. Yes, there are obviously going to be aspects that are really only learned about out in the field but I don't see this as being a requirement and therefore a potential huge block to learning sufficient skills to be a competent electrician.
@ there is a lot involved in being an electrician and I do think electricians are under paid. It annoys me that people think, I’ll just jump into that profession as it seems easier than what I’m doing. I do apologise for saying u failed, obviously u didn’t, it was klick bait 😂😂 sorry, that’s what they do on all the TH-cam channels. I’m not a TH-camr. I’ve been a spark since I left school in 1980 and in my experience if your employed don’t worry about all the changes, your employer will update you and put you on the relevant courses. 👍
@@andyc7946 Thanks for the apology, it's appreciated. I come from an electronics background and people think they can 'just do it' in that field as well having no idea of all the knowledge and skill involved. I've never thought it would be a case of 'I'll just jump into that profession'. I keep my eyes on things like this TH-cam channel and download what I can. I realise there's a LOT involved and the rules are ever-changing making it a kind of never-ending training. I'm not saying that a qualification should be made easier or require less skill to achieve, but rather that the training should be simplified in sense that one long course will gain you the qualification at the end or a clearly laid out path of shorter courses will go it. My issue is that there is such a plethora of courses and seemingly no clear path to achieving the desired outcome. For watch it's worth, I've turned 50 years old I feel I can do more both for others and myself. I have always been interested in electrical work and maybe I didn't get the career advice I needed. I look around and I see various opportunities along the lines of 'if only I was a qualified electrician I could do that' and solve problems for people. Maybe it's a bit late in the day for me or possibly not too late, I don't know. If there are smart people interested in retraining then why not? Why not have a training and qualification path that is clearly laid out so someone can work out how to achieve it in a straightforward way, rather than the convoluted mess of various courses that don't qualify you to be an electrician and still no obvious way to actually qualify as an electrician? I shouldn't need to have a 'careers adviser' or the like explain how to navigate this mess. Are there no flowcharts or planners that explains it all and makes it clear, like there is for other training schemes that involve a lot of smaller steps? This is what I meant by it being easier to get a motorcycle licence in that there are a lot of smaller stages but a least there are published flowcharts to enable you to work out what you need to do to achieve your desired goal or level of competency. I agree that electricians are underpaid. People just don't seem to want to care about something or have any kind of understanding about something they cannot see. A water leak is generally visible in some way whereas a live part is completely indiscernible until it's too late! Sorry for the long comment, but it seems nobody is touching on the problem of the skills path. With a future of supposedly 'electric everything' this is an important issue and needs sorting out and clarifying.
I'm not aware on a limit of amendments on BS 7671, 15th edition which was introduced in 1981 had 5 amendments before being updated to the 16th edition in 1991.
There's no shortage of sparks. It's just that most sparks have had enough of being shafted as site subbys. Places still act like £25 is a high rate, when you're taxed before you can even pay for your expenses, deducted breaks and have to pay doggy payroll companies £80/month for the privilege of getting paid. Hours are becoming longer and yet the day rates don't move. Agencies are shafting everyone by paying the bottom rate to the subby and charging huge rates to contractors, so there's a massive disparity in what companies expect from agency sparks. As soon as you start getting your own jobs you realise how terrible you're paid as an average site spark.
Here’s what I’ve learned. There are 3 things that attract electricians to the job, and 2 that keep them in it. 1. Money. People think the money is good because it was historically. Not any more, try and realise that before you invest in the career. You won’t be able to support a family on this wage, your wife will have to work too. See how long you can be half housewife and half jobbing electrician before you want to quit. The other things are 2. Masculine pride in the nature of the job and 3. The particulars of electrical vs the other trade (thinking man’s trade which is BS, they all are, cleaner than plumbing, sometimes true, etc). 1 is a lie. 2 is a sin (it’s the blindness of this pride that results in men wasting their best years and wrecking their bodies for what … for nothing other than the pride). And 3 somewhat BS and somewhat a point of view. If you had twice the time to do the work and the job paid twice as much, it would be worth it.
To me it appears the IET are striving for a perfect world with no appreciation of the cost and skills impact, let alone a customers willingness to accept the resultant costs. It appears the level of risk is being driven down in the IET drive for perfection. I’m all for safe installations but the regulations have to be pragmatic not theoretical. Customers won’t pay or we have to increase prices to reflect the changes, with the inevitable reduction in customers!
Jacobean and Salamander I believe are today's offerings. My head is still buzzing from not just the amendments, but all the additional costs in training, testing and the like - the cowboys charter just got bigger 😮
Experienced and qualified engineers and electrician wages are being driven lower and lower. No wonder there is a massive skills gap. Many are leaving trades to go and work elsewhere
Over regulation and absurdly high course and training costs along with high annual costs just to keep doing the job - that's the main killer. It's no wonder a spark nowadays costs an absolute fortune they need to charge that just to exist. You want more sparks? - make it cheaper to become a spark, a LOT cheaper, and stop regulating the absolute crap out of everything. POE under IET - i've heard it all now. Next they'll be requiring you to get a spark in to build a PC. Overreaching regulators looking to regulate anything involving a wire as they have to justify their existence somehow (and make some lovely money charging for constant amendments).
Power over Ethernet has nothing to do with electrical regulations. It is extra low voltage for a bloody good reason, so it is exempt. The IEE needs to keep their noses out of something that has nothing to do with them.
Reading through this post I’m saddened by the comments from those who say ‘it isn’t worth it anymore’. I respect all trades but electrical installation work is getting to the point where it is in danger of over regulation and associated higher costs. Appreciate the ‘safety’ aspect but how on earth have we managed over the years. Doesn’t stop the rogue ones.
Makes sense I’m from same school ,what would be new in perspective I mean how to motivate young people to explore such a potentially “growing industry” 2009 if anyone recall,anyone please 😮
Or a DJ, I used to have custom GOBO's made for a scanning spotlight at weddings etc. Always used to be a nice touch to project a customised logo or message across the dancefloor!
There is a lack of Sparky's cuz people like me have been pissed off at the never ending money grabbing and fragmentation of the electrical industry. The trade is constantly getting shat on.. i was not even in the industry for a decade before getting pissed off giving the money grabbing gatekeepers my money in never endingly increasing amounts with ever more tick box certificates for things we have always done.
Electric Wallpaper? Does this mean that Decorators will have to sit an Electrical qualification to hang Wallpaper? Or am I mising something? Maybe Electricians will have to pay £400 to sit another qualification, just like the one for Extractor Fans.
I thought Brexit meant Brexit ( of course I'm just talking about EU harmonisation nothing else ) look at the USA, haven't changed since the 80s electrical wise.
As an electrician in training, working on my AM2: Its shocking and depressing how many fully qualified electricians don't actually understand the regs, or the underlying principles behind them, and just bluff the customer into thinking that things are mandatory when they're not just because it's less work for the electrician that way. I've spoken to 4 different electricians who were adamant that SPDs were mandatory for new installations, when as far as I can understand they are not mandatory as long as the customer understands and fully acknowledges the risks associated with not having surge protection. The end result is a bunch of customers who have to pay more for equipment that they'd rather not have, and because it's of no consequence to them if an installation is damaged from a surge, the job ends up being more expensive as a result. Customers are frustrated with the cost of work, and while a lot of that is down to a shortage of electricians and a rise in cost of parts, billing the customer for unwanted and unneeded parts is a big problem too.
Should be cashing S ram A electrical he took COVID loan and brought a house while he was employed by FedEx and he was also running a company. As for electric bollox. Bring on hydrogen its what we need
Corporate short sightedness as usual. " Let's force ALL of the 'green' tech onto everone at the same time! Oh wait, we didn't expect a shortage of people to install it all..." Pure theatre and self obsessed lobbyists.
![กี่หมื่นฟ้า | Your Sky Series EP.1 [2/4]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qJbQs_nhjD4/mqdefault.jpg)
Give credit for prior knowledge and you might get more people retraining. I've worked on control systems in industrial environments. Years of fault finding complicated control systems from three phase to component level. Have done inspection and testing of circuits to IET guidance note 3. Have done my regs. Looked into retraining as a spark and was told I have to start from scratch and learn ohms law when what I need is to update my regulations knowledge and get up-to-date current practice and techniques of instalation.
Exactly bud. It's a bit ridiculous for those with the prerequisite underpinning knowledge/prior learning.
@@TheBrick2 they wouldn't make as much money off you then! Absolute joke of an industry.
@@dvrn86 100% Compare with the hydraulics industry. None of this bullshit. Just as dangerous. Less bullshit.
I entered this business because I viewed it as a trade I could turn my skill set to and it was one that didn't move particularly quickly, after all, what really changed over the long course of 16th Edition aside from breakers taking over from fuses and the introduction of RCDs? There wasn't a lot, outside of bonding madness, and the old boys of the day didn't have to reskill too much just to carry on. I get that the pace of change in technology is much faster now, but it feels like information overload just trying to keep up. Indeed, I told my NIC assessor I had no intention of keeping up, not with renewables, not with Prosumer nonsense, not with smart tech. Still, he told me I'd be expected to be informed and able to demonstrate requisite knowledge even if avoiding these areas because I may go into premises that are so equipped. I'm not surprised there's a shortage of yoof wanting to get onto this ladder - if I were younger I don't think I'd consider it now either.
Definitely agreed Dave😊
It’s bad enough now I can’t even fit extractor fans without a qualification
@@kevinpearson1600lol
Aye. True ..and me ,a very competant diy,r can check regs, etc. on the web. and do a good job..coz its not rocket science@@kevinpearson1600
I thought Brexit meant Brexit ( of course I'm just talking about EU harmonisation nothing else ) look at the USA, haven't changed since the 80s electrical wise.
Lack of electricians….. the job simply doesn’t appeal to younger people now. Low pay, high responsibility. Forget it. Get a job working from home.
Nah its more like you have to jump through hoops to get any sort of hands on experience or anyone willing to take you on whilst your training.
@@bilpat5123Very true,the jobs become a joke in its self,I know guys working 45 hour weeks earnings over £50,000 not breaking a sweat doing supervisor jobs in warehouses
Increasing regulations meets decreasing workforce (demographics). There's only going to be one winner.
Probably cost is a factor, I bet with the multi-function testers that sparks use, they must cost so much that you'd get very little change out of £1,000 and think about the value of all the tools in your vans, that's a big outlay for someone wanting to become a spark
@@leeroberts1192 have a look at a network tester...
Its because there is way to many hoops to jump through and memberships. Why do we pay to work? If your under the napit or niceic money extractors for membership fees, all your equipment calibration costs, insurance costs, van costs , tool costs etc etc. Plus all the CPD and paper work. Then there's the jib card scam, paying to work, again. High responsibility, constant hassle, not enough pay. There's easier jobs that pay the same and usually more, so why bother..?
I think all the above is why smaller businesses just limit the range the types of work they take on . Much as I dread the annual NIC EIC inspection it does help maintain standards and keep you on the right track. A necessary evil if you like.
@@arcadia1701e exactly. Risk to reward is killing this trade.
From the outside looking in, electrician seems to be the only job that at this rate will regulate itself out of existence, Who wants to get a job that requires more reading than doing. As for take up of green energy, again, it is being overwhelmed with layers of regulation which in affect is basically putting people off or making it impossible to retro fit anything.
Paying through the nose for update courses just to do the bloody job too.
Yep, the big green hoax.
I do wonder if these regulations are heading into the "lets regulate it for the sake of it" territory. Take section 716 as an example. The requirements of PoE safety are very well addressed in IEE802.3 I am not sure what BS7671 can add to this other than another layer of rules.
Administrators love to administrate. They think adding more rules makes things safer. they don't understand abstraction.
Probably trying to bring PoE under the electricians remit and making cat 6 getting building control so you can’t install your own networking cables unless you get building control permission. Better not because that will be bollox and I for one will ignore it.
@@TheBrick2 Gotta do something to justify their existence.
@@TheBrick2 Yes, I have seen this in a lot of places in the UK. This just looks like another example. I wonder how much money BSI Group makes from regular releases of updated standards and whether there is a conflict of interest going on.
On top of that the IT industry generally works to international standards such as those from IEC so that it can make a single product and sell it worldwide. Anything in a national standard that deviates from the international standard is a major problem as having different products for different markets bumps up costs and in some cases means a product will not be sold in markets that don't follow the international standard.
I can’t tell you how happy I am I quit and went back to work in IT recently. The amount of physical work, training, and responsibility you have to be a competent electrician is eye watering, brain breaking and kneecap shattering compared to other career paths available.
Absolute 100% mugs game at this point. Respect to you if you love the job and do it for the love. I did. Couldn’t support my family in the way I wanted though, love for the job wasn’t enough. Can get paid twice the wage for 1/4 the effort and 1/8 the responsibility in IT.
My advice to anyone looking to get in to the trade. DON’T. Get some specialist IT qualifications related to commercial and enterprise networking (avoid programming and stuff like that), things like administration of cloud computing, things like that.
@maxtroy when your talking about pay what sort of figure are you talking? In industrial maintenance there are lots of jobs around 50k on the books
@@maxtroy Funnily enough I was a Cisco engineer for 15 years, CCNA, CCNP. But.... The demand for onsite engineers doing cli has dropped off so much now due to Meraki and cloud provisioning. I got so disillusioned with the networking industry that I have re trained as a commercial electrician, mostly in telecoms and data centre DC systems. I don't miss it at all.
Before I read the comments, I thought over regulation and low pay, i used to be an electrician with the CEGB who made the dammed stuff but my qualification would't cut the mustard these days, most older sparkies just do maintenance type work instead, same with Gas engineers once they get to a certain age they cant be bothered with going through all the courses every 5 years. The min wage is going up to £12.21, I still see some sparkie roles advertising £14/15 per hour, the young'ens are not stupid? If you are a really good sparks and have your own company you could do well but not everyone wants that level of resposibilty or risk.
I was "just" an electrician for many years and honestly started to get out when the rubbish they called part P came in.
Look how bad it is now with the CPD they are asking you to do.
I know painters that earn more then a employed electrician.
I do mainly building/carpentry work now, mostly signed of by council/ private inspectors and i earn more then 3 times the advertised roll of £15 ph for sparkies
It's funny. I was a 16th edition sparks. I fancied getting off the tools, studied hard and became a database consultant and software engineer. I left that world when it exploded in a million directions and I lost the will and capacity to keep up. So I returned to sparking believing it would be slower pace of change did the 18th edition. 6 year's later and the IEC are clearly getting very bored indeed. I reckon there's a real risk of an epidemic of common sense taking over and the IEC legislating themselves into a position of increased irrelevance....
The irony of the same video talking about the lack of sparks and adding more and more nonsense to BS7671 is not lost on me.
It's a crap trade. You make money being a tiller / bathroom fitter..no qualification required every few years.
Glad I am at the end of my electrical career and not just starting out. No wonder there is a shortage of people entering the trade,
There's still a lot of good stuff going on to be fair. 😊
@@efixx yeah and all this stuff you need extra qualifications to do it. All this trade has become is a money racket where the IET just keep fleecing electricians. No wonder so many people are getting out of the game
I’m assuming by you saying you’re nearing the end of your career that you are retiring. I can’t imagine keeping this trade up until retirement
I don't see how electric wall paper is an alternative to heat pumps, or in any way mitigates for poor thermal insulation. Without thermal insulation behind, it will increase wall losses by virtue of the higher wall temperature.
It's just a novel innovation of resistance heating. Radiated heat feels warmer than the air temperature would indicate which may reduce running costs slightly compared with more conventional electric radiators. Main features appears to about space saving & maybe more even heat distribution.
Runs on 24v, and you can cut holes in it for small fixtures like switches without major reduction in performance.
It gets more difficult by the day being a spark
There's some embedded ceiling elements still going strong 40+ years on in some flats in my catchment area. The elements survive, the thermostats need changing every now & then. (edit) Just sanity checked the date of construction of the flats - 1960s. So 50+ years old (/edit)
Who would want to be a spark these days with all these regulations??
All the lovely people making them regs probably can’t do the work either! It’s only the uk that is so ridiculously anal.
So very pleased that I am well and truly out of all of this now.
Try paying them a lot more than plumbers, it’s about 16 x more difficult. It’s also very paperwork driven and a lot more technical than putting in a length of copper pipe
And brickies and chippies, we need way more tools, qaulifications, know-how governing bodies etc and all they need is a couple of trowels or some wood cutting gear
Only an electrician would say that. The electrician's limited knowledge of plumbing is 'putting in a piece of copper pipe'.
Its a completely different trade that can never be compared. Maybe become a plumber instead?
@coxyjmz I don't think it's about being more difficult. The other building trades are equally as skilled. No, it's the responsibility. In my opinion only a gas fitterhas a similar responsibility and a constant requirement to re-tain.
@ how much renewable work do you do? Set up and commissioning is far more complicated, it doesn’t always go smooth even when you follow the instructions! It’s added grief to a job you already have to be skilled to do.
I’ve been in the game 15 years and am ready to get out you can get better pay doing different jobs and without the need for constantly updating regulations. I’ve seen a comment on this post and it describes it perfectly “seems to be the only job that will regulate itself out of existence” even electricians in the trade now don’t want to do it never mind young kids leaving school
If the graphic is correct, its ceiling paper! I remember a developer building some houses in Birchanger near Stansted tried ceiling heating over 40 years ago, didnt catch on.
There is no shortage of electricians. Just a lack of electricians willing to jump through all the hoops for ever diminishing returns.
Installed "electric wallpaper" in my campervan floor and ceiling, works great!
Thank you Joe. "That works out at a thousand pounds of ADMIN for every upgraded home"..... call me a cynic but that is a lot of brown envelopes being thrown around for nothing.
Regarding the Martindale MFT, I don't know if it is me but apart from the LCD screen, it looks a bit "Fisher Price" and not quality. If they spent just a little more on the body's aesthetics, they might bring in a few more interested sparks.
Heyyy!. Most of my stuff is Kewtech, and it all looks like fisher price!
Ive been in the industry for over 15 years, self funded qualification adult learner, started self employed on an agency. Ive almost always self funded everything, ECA say i cant get eca card satus because i have 2330, 2391-52 and 16th 3rd, 17th, 1,2,3, 18th 1,2,3. But not AM2 or NVQ, at the moment I'm trying to pay mortgage 3 kids van food ect, cant take the time off for more courses let alone the 4k in fees.
This is the reality. Almost, almost regret not being a plumber.
Exact same story as me mate. I quit after Covid and went to work in IT. It’s still a shock to me seeing the difference in my life before and life after. Everything I was led to believe about being an electrician was a lie. Still I carried out for over 15 years because I thought one day I’d get ahead if I just worked a bit harder and concentrated a bit more.
Just imagine what's going to happen when all poe installations need to be done by a "qualified" elctrician..😂😂😂😂. Good for the sales of VERY expensive test eqiptment though!
Getting harder too make a profit 😢and keep up with regulations and a geek on electrical 😮 alot to take in sometimes but keep pushing 💪
I'm not surprised there aren't enough electricians. I've looked at it as a career change and found the qualification side far too complicated. I appreciate there is a lot to learn, but the path to qualification needs to be made a lot more straightforward. Far too many hoops, snakes and ladders to negotiate. It's worse than trying to get a motorcycle licence.
@@DelticEngine being an electrician is not for someone who’s failed in their chosen profession. It’s a skill set that requires the ability to learn academically and manually. Learning a trade that will keep you employed or running your own business.
@@andyc7946 Failed? That's a very presumptuous and insulting way to begin a comment! I have no issue that it requires the ability to learn both academically and manually to develop the skillset. Maybe such an attitude also presents a barrier to those wishing to enter the profession?
My argument is that there is, on the face of it, no reason that the whole qualification could not learned at a suitable academic institution.
My research suggested that I had to find a company to work for as well as organise the academic side of things. Yes, there are obviously going to be aspects that are really only learned about out in the field but I don't see this as being a requirement and therefore a potential huge block to learning sufficient skills to be a competent electrician.
@ there is a lot involved in being an electrician and I do think electricians are under paid. It annoys me that people think, I’ll just jump into that profession as it seems easier than what I’m doing. I do apologise for saying u failed, obviously u didn’t, it was klick bait 😂😂 sorry, that’s what they do on all the TH-cam channels. I’m not a TH-camr. I’ve been a spark since I left school in 1980 and in my experience if your employed don’t worry about all the changes, your employer will update you and put you on the relevant courses. 👍
@@andyc7946 Thanks for the apology, it's appreciated. I come from an electronics background and people think they can 'just do it' in that field as well having no idea of all the knowledge and skill involved.
I've never thought it would be a case of 'I'll just jump into that profession'. I keep my eyes on things like this TH-cam channel and download what I can. I realise there's a LOT involved and the rules are ever-changing making it a kind of never-ending training.
I'm not saying that a qualification should be made easier or require less skill to achieve, but rather that the training should be simplified in sense that one long course will gain you the qualification at the end or a clearly laid out path of shorter courses will go it. My issue is that there is such a plethora of courses and seemingly no clear path to achieving the desired outcome.
For watch it's worth, I've turned 50 years old I feel I can do more both for others and myself. I have always been interested in electrical work and maybe I didn't get the career advice I needed. I look around and I see various opportunities along the lines of 'if only I was a qualified electrician I could do that' and solve problems for people. Maybe it's a bit late in the day for me or possibly not too late, I don't know.
If there are smart people interested in retraining then why not? Why not have a training and qualification path that is clearly laid out so someone can work out how to achieve it in a straightforward way, rather than the convoluted mess of various courses that don't qualify you to be an electrician and still no obvious way to actually qualify as an electrician? I shouldn't need to have a 'careers adviser' or the like explain how to navigate this mess.
Are there no flowcharts or planners that explains it all and makes it clear, like there is for other training schemes that involve a lot of smaller steps? This is what I meant by it being easier to get a motorcycle licence in that there are a lot of smaller stages but a least there are published flowcharts to enable you to work out what you need to do to achieve your desired goal or level of competency.
I agree that electricians are underpaid. People just don't seem to want to care about something or have any kind of understanding about something they cannot see. A water leak is generally visible in some way whereas a live part is completely indiscernible until it's too late!
Sorry for the long comment, but it seems nobody is touching on the problem of the skills path. With a future of supposedly 'electric everything' this is an important issue and needs sorting out and clarifying.
Thought British standards could only have three amendments before they have to issue new book ?
I'm not aware on a limit of amendments on BS 7671, 15th edition which was introduced in 1981 had 5 amendments before being updated to the 16th edition in 1991.
With big government, lots of good self employed trades are saying enough, i know so many closing or retiring early.
There's no shortage of sparks. It's just that most sparks have had enough of being shafted as site subbys. Places still act like £25 is a high rate, when you're taxed before you can even pay for your expenses, deducted breaks and have to pay doggy payroll companies £80/month for the privilege of getting paid. Hours are becoming longer and yet the day rates don't move. Agencies are shafting everyone by paying the bottom rate to the subby and charging huge rates to contractors, so there's a massive disparity in what companies expect from agency sparks. As soon as you start getting your own jobs you realise how terrible you're paid as an average site spark.
@@storyrole those umbrella companies are one of the biggest scams going.
4:23 You said borough here instead of county, they're not interchangable, boroughs are subdivisions of counties.
Here’s what I’ve learned. There are 3 things that attract electricians to the job, and 2 that keep them in it. 1. Money. People think the money is good because it was historically. Not any more, try and realise that before you invest in the career. You won’t be able to support a family on this wage, your wife will have to work too. See how long you can be half housewife and half jobbing electrician before you want to quit.
The other things are 2. Masculine pride in the nature of the job and 3. The particulars of electrical vs the other trade (thinking man’s trade which is BS, they all are, cleaner than plumbing, sometimes true, etc).
1 is a lie. 2 is a sin (it’s the blindness of this pride that results in men wasting their best years and wrecking their bodies for what … for nothing other than the pride). And 3 somewhat BS and somewhat a point of view.
If you had twice the time to do the work and the job paid twice as much, it would be worth it.
Eu spek. 😂 In Spain they often use the earth cable as a live / twist mains cables together and still use wire fuses.
My guess for the challenge words are Jacobean and salamander. Cheers :)
To me it appears the IET are striving for a perfect world with no appreciation of the cost and skills impact, let alone a customers willingness to accept the resultant costs. It appears the level of risk is being driven down in the IET drive for perfection. I’m all for safe installations but the regulations have to be pragmatic not theoretical. Customers won’t pay or we have to increase prices to reflect the changes, with the inevitable reduction in customers!
Jacobean and Salamander I believe are today's offerings. My head is still buzzing from not just the amendments, but all the additional costs in training, testing and the like - the cowboys charter just got bigger 😮
Experienced and qualified engineers and electrician wages are being driven lower and lower. No wonder there is a massive skills gap. Many are leaving trades to go and work elsewhere
Over regulation and absurdly high course and training costs along with high annual costs just to keep doing the job - that's the main killer. It's no wonder a spark nowadays costs an absolute fortune they need to charge that just to exist.
You want more sparks? - make it cheaper to become a spark, a LOT cheaper, and stop regulating the absolute crap out of everything. POE under IET - i've heard it all now. Next they'll be requiring you to get a spark in to build a PC.
Overreaching regulators looking to regulate anything involving a wire as they have to justify their existence somehow (and make some lovely money charging for constant amendments).
£50M for admin and they wonder why we have a lack of trained electricians.
Electric wallpaper…is it April 1st…🤣🤣🤣
the 2 magic words are definitely "Jacobean" and "Salamander" XD
Power over Ethernet has nothing to do with electrical regulations. It is extra low voltage for a bloody good reason, so it is exempt. The IEE needs to keep their noses out of something that has nothing to do with them.
Reading through this post I’m saddened by the comments from those who say ‘it isn’t worth it anymore’. I respect all trades but electrical installation work is getting to the point where it is in danger of over regulation and associated higher costs. Appreciate the ‘safety’ aspect but how on earth have we managed over the years. Doesn’t stop the rogue ones.
8:08 "...rolled out..." lol
😂
Ha Ha ...infra red wallpaper to be rolled out...😮
It amazes me how they can’t get it right for any decent length of time
Sooooo many electricians have appeared from other countries, guessing this is part of Starmers 'need more elctricians' drive 🤣
Makes sense I’m from same school ,what would be new in perspective I mean how to motivate young people to explore such a potentially “growing industry” 2009 if anyone recall,anyone please 😮
Challenge words
1. Salamander
2. Lion
Sure apologies if any disagreement
I’m just communicating with fellow electricians 😊
Great news weekly as always Joe , do you want to buy a new unused teletonika 7.4kw EV charge point?
Gobo (goh bo) holder. Winner must be a theatre lighting technician.
Or a DJ, I used to have custom GOBO's made for a scanning spotlight at weddings etc. Always used to be a nice touch to project a customised logo or message across the dancefloor!
Why do we need to harmonise with the EU? Does the US harmonise with Canada or Mexico? Its all very confusing
CPD is the biggest money grab I’ve ever seen. It’s an absolute joke and belittles all those in the trade.
There is a lack of Sparky's cuz people like me have been pissed off at the never ending money grabbing and fragmentation of the electrical industry. The trade is constantly getting shat on.. i was not even in the industry for a decade before getting pissed off giving the money grabbing gatekeepers my money in never endingly increasing amounts with ever more tick box certificates for things we have always done.
Challenge words
1. Jacobean
2. salamander
so is poe many home user use to cameras etc going to be restricted ?
Im 39, currently doing my Level 3 C&G. Gotta say the comments here are concerning lol, maybe I should have done plumbing...
Electric Wallpaper? Does this mean that Decorators will have to sit an Electrical qualification to hang Wallpaper? Or am I mising something?
Maybe Electricians will have to pay £400 to sit another qualification, just like the one for Extractor Fans.
Challenge Words - Jacobean & Salamander
Scottish homes are poorly insulated because they need to let the vast amount of heat escape from deep frying everything. 😂
@davideyres955 Aye very good healthy Cranium Heed
Did Dixon pay all the money back ? Was he fined
Jacobean and salamander for sure :)
I thought Brexit meant Brexit ( of course I'm just talking about EU harmonisation nothing else ) look at the USA, haven't changed since the 80s electrical wise.
The US National Electrical Code (NFPA 70) is updated every 3 years. The latest is the 2023 edition.
Salamander & Jacobean :)
Jacobean, Salamander
salamander & campari
Salamander, Lion
Jacobean & salamander
more bullshit
Enquiry, salamander
jacobean and salamander
As an electrician in training, working on my AM2:
Its shocking and depressing how many fully qualified electricians don't actually understand the regs, or the underlying principles behind them, and just bluff the customer into thinking that things are mandatory when they're not just because it's less work for the electrician that way.
I've spoken to 4 different electricians who were adamant that SPDs were mandatory for new installations, when as far as I can understand they are not mandatory as long as the customer understands and fully acknowledges the risks associated with not having surge protection.
The end result is a bunch of customers who have to pay more for equipment that they'd rather not have, and because it's of no consequence to them if an installation is damaged from a surge, the job ends up being more expensive as a result.
Customers are frustrated with the cost of work, and while a lot of that is down to a shortage of electricians and a rise in cost of parts, billing the customer for unwanted and unneeded parts is a big problem too.
Should be cashing S ram A electrical he took COVID loan and brought a house while he was employed by FedEx and he was also running a company. As for electric bollox. Bring on hydrogen its what we need
Corporate short sightedness as usual. " Let's force ALL of the 'green' tech onto everone at the same time! Oh wait, we didn't expect a shortage of people to install it all..." Pure theatre and self obsessed lobbyists.
Am4 Chinese copy please
Great so the tester tells morons how to suck eggs. I am old and bitter
Salamander, lion
Slippery.
Salamander.
Jacobin and salamander
Salamander and Jacobean
Jacobean and salamander
Salamander Wallpaper
Slippery and salamander
Jacobean and salamqnder
For the love of God, will you Stop speaking so fast
jacobean, salamander,
Excellent video.
Glad you liked it!
salamanda niggles
Jacobean, Salamander
Jacobean salamander
Jacobean salamander
Salamander and Jacobean
Jacobean and salamander
Jacobean and salamander
Jacobean and salamander
Jacobean and salamander
Jacobean and salamander