I’m writting this comment with my Quest 3 on, connected to my work mac using Immersed, looking at your video in one of my 4 screens at the top of my field of view, topping a 5x3m screen with a fullscreen terminal in it, with vim, where i’m doing all my code. Aside that i have 2 extra screens for email and chat. I was using a similar setup on my Quest 2 (though with less pixels as it didn’t make sense to have a 4k screen on that setup) and on the pico4 (which was almost as good as the Q3, but with more aliasing/moire problems. You should really give Immersed a shot, it can be used for free and has advantages over Virtual Desktop and Workroom, it gives more freedom in screen management as well as passthrough mode. It also supports Linux as well as macOS and Windows, i’ve been using on these 3 platforms in the last 2+ years.
I see Immersed supports multiple headsets, and doesn't say . Would you say it specifically supports the Quest 3, but does say the Quest 2 and Pro. Any issues with the Quest 3? Any idea if that's the best headset for resolution/other features?
@@dubious-membrane Immersed supports Quest 2, Pro and 3, as well as Pico 4 (but without hand-tracking), and HTC VIVE Focus 3, and XR Elite. Right now the best headset for the price to do these things is the Quest 3 indeed, given its great optic clarity. Pico 4, if you can get it for around 200-250 bucks on second hand, would be a decent cheaper contender, but really, making the stretch to the Q3 is otherwise worth it. If you are not in a hurry, you could wait for the Visor; it's more expensive now, alas (1000 usd, it used to be pre-purchasable for 750!), but it will have 4k/eye OLED screens, like the Apple Vision Pro, and will be less than half the weight of a Q3. But if you've never tried this, the Quest 3 is probably a more cautious starting point, and if you really enjoy it, could get a Visor later on, as in 2025. There is a TH-cam channel, called WorkInVR, with great tips, and a very recent video about this very topic :)
@@dubious-membrane i agree with @yandrosyoutube, the Quest 3 is certainly the best right now, and the upgrade from pico4 to quest3 was well worth the price for me, the image is really clearer, especially when looking at text, i had aliasing effects with the pico, good enough to work, but still bothering, that's gone with the quest3, and the camera passthrough is also significantly better. I started with a quest2, and i'd say now unless you are really cheap or don't want to commit too much money, it's not worth getting for Immersed, the difference in image quality is just too great. I just got my Quest3 recently, not too many issues with it, still pondering if i'll get an alternative strap for it, and other comfort adaptations, but it's not too bad for me in that regard, although other people have different experiences and some say it's just not usable with the default one. Battery duration is not good enough to work the full day (or even a couple hours), so you have to work tethered, or to have some swappable battery system to be able to work for long stretches of time, but usually a wire is not big of a deal when you are at your desk anyway.
Linux only in X11 Desktop environment protocol. So no Wayland for now (maybe someday, I hope). UPD: OH! WAIT! Experimental Wayland support from 21 of December!
Immersed is my preferred app, it allows you up to five monitors, the keyboard/mouse environment cutout you were asking for and allows you to plug it in via usbc and do a wired connection (as well as turn up settings for retina and encoding quality). I have a quest 2 so I needed some extra resolution, you can do that through side quest
@@BellaArtur on macos at least, there is an "advanced" setting for encoding and retina quality, low encoding is faster but produces at my more artifacts.
@@ToshisanMotonaka not all tech. What you're talking about might as well be as difficult as curing cancer. For the kind of thing you're talking about, we would need micro-sized AND transparent cameras and batteries embedded into the lens.
The issue is the difficulty to read anything in these portals, including a real keyboard. I have a Quest 3 and found very hard to read the keyboard. A major issue, in my opinion, but I understand it is a limitation of the hardware (Quest 3) not the software.
@@serlcb Yeah but how often do you actually need to look at your keyboard? I'm an okay typist, no expert, and I really only need to glance at my keyboard very occasionally, usually for special characters.
I've just tried immersed. Found it to be way better than Virtual Desktop. But the cursor movement is so laggy it's almost unusable. I tweaked with the settings a bunch, but couldn't find anything that would speed it up. Is this true for everyone, or am I just special?
I also tested the same options, and I reached a similar conclusion. Meta Horizons Workrooms would be my current recommendation if anyone also wants to try developing in VR/MR. But there are some things I didn't see in your video. 1.: I also have the option to add my keyboard to the "VR" mode, and the Quest will match its position in VR with my real keyboard. This way, I can use my actual keyboard in VR without having to use the MR "window." At least in the latest version I tried, I couldn't choose my actual key mapping (German), and my mouse was still invisible, so the window is still better. Also, the virtual hands didn't always perfectly align with my actual hands, causing me to mistype even more when looking down at my keyboard. 2.: I can also add virtual screens. I am using two monitors by default, but within Workrooms, I could add a third screen, which then can be used as if I have three physical screens. I like that feature very much. I am using Windows, though, so different functionality may be available there. But in the end, I agree that this is more of a gimmick than anything I like to use "in production." If you're working from a hotel and want more screen space than your laptop, then you can bring your Quest and also play some games between your work sessions :D But at home, I still prefer my actual screens. Also, even though I am not usually prone to VR-sickness, I get a funny feeling in my stomach if I use Workrooms for too long. That could be related to my Wifi connection, and that it adds some delay.
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You're just using the wrong app. Immersed solved this problem years ago and is to go solution to work in VR. Give a try. They also have a amizing community in the discord channel
@ Yep, I work in VR on the quest pro like 3 days a week for 8 hours. I agree that at home I still use my screen setup but in the office or when travelling nothing beats it.
I'm a programmer/network architect and I've been working in vr for about 3 years or so. Originally, I did that every day, but now only when I travel. When I'm not traveling, I work the old-fashioned way, a macbook pro with two huge external displays. I used meta Horizon and ImmersedVR, but I found Immersed to be extremely buggy, so I canceled my subscription. Last year I traveled about 6 months in or camper, I worked in vr the entire time when I was working.
I'm a developer thinking of doing something similar, since I work remotely and would live to travel a bit. I've seen lots of seemingly great headset add ons that make the headset more comfortable over the default strap. About how long can you work in VR with one of those compared to default? I watch movies with the default strap, usually with my head tilted slightly back against the couch, and I can usually get through about 1 - 1.5 hours before it bothers me, but If I could get a solid 2-3 hours in, that would make it viable.
@@AbadonBIack I can do pretty much all day. You will naturally take breaks, coffee, bathroom, lunch etc. I did change my headset to one that balances better. I have the battery in the back, but also sound have to have it plugged in after 3 hours or so. The Meta quest 3 is a huge upgrade for working in VR. I'm still using Meta Horizon Desktop. Immersed is coming out with a new vr glass option that may be worth checking out, just not sure it's worth the price with how buggy I found their VR app to be. I also have Nreal (xreal) with nebula stream, it's horrible as a working desktop. It's okay connected to my phone as a screen or to Gaming console, where it excels, but not the virtual desktop.
Thanks a lot for your insights! How is your Mac connected to the Q3? How is the latency? And what did you bring back to the "old-fashioned" way? I am also working in IT and traveling a lot, thinking about trying the same! Sounds so cool!
@@Mira.travels Regarding the 'Old Fasioned' way.... That is my Macbook with external monitor on a typical desk with a magic keyboard and Mouse. I use this when I am not traveling. There are some advantages and some disadvantages. the advantage is that I am more 'present' in the physical world. I can see and interact with my wife or dog or other things going on around me. I have a funny story about a time that I was at home working in VR. We had just rescued a puppy and she was in my office with me while I was working in VR. I heard her playing, but was working and ignored what she was doing. My son-in-law came over and asked me how long I had been working in VR. I took my headset off to answer and saw the destruction that prompted his question around me. The puppy had torn up a whole bunch of dog toys and there was stuffing all over my office and into the foyer outside of my office. It was a mess! The advantages of working in VR when at home... I tend to be more focussed. You are in a vitrual world, there are even sounds playing (birds or whatever) and no visual distractions. Being ADHD, that is a good thing. You can spin up three screens (in Meta Horizon Desktop) or five (in ImmersedVr), so you can put TH-cam or some other distraction on a monitor and still be distracted if you want to . One thing to note, you can't open lots of content with digital rights (Netflix, TH-camTv or Prime Video for instance) on a Meta virtual (or ImmersedVr) desktop. You will hear sound, but get no video. Another advantage of working in VR is that the computer automatically changes your sound output to your Meta Quest, more immersive in meetings for me. So far, the microphone does not work in any meeting I have tried (Teams, Chime, WebEx, Zoom), so you have to change your microphone to one on your computer.
@@AbadonBIack You MUST change the manufacturer head strap. The Meta/Oculus straps are not comfortable for long term use. You can find stronger, balanced ones that are a much better option and some provide batteries. On my Q2 I used KiWi design and the 8VR head strap with battery. On my Q3 I use the Aubika head strap with battery. I like it because many of the battery headstraps are not strong enough to change your device while you are using it, so it slowly dies. This one can charge it while using it, prolonging how long you can be in VR without charging. I also have an over the shoulder battery by Zybervr that I can use with a short cord if that all runs out. I can run for 8 full hours in VR with that setup if I want to.
This is actually perfect for working at a coffee shop. You do look weird but you wouldn't know that since you can't see yourself. I do prefer Immersed over other options.
This would be super useful for people who move around a lot. I used to move places every couple of months few years back, so I had to work on a laptop and it didn't make sense for me to buy an external monitor. This would have been a life saver
Super keen for the future of VR based workflows. Would be cool if you could "portal" windows and have them floating around the virtual environment - changing the dynamic away from the conventional desktop flow. Also needs controller free/hand based controls. Headsets need to be lighter and wired - something like the big screen beyond but not cost a billion dollars and have better software.
Thanks for sharing! I'm curious, is the scene shaking a lot, or is it possibly due to the video recording? It seems a bit uncomfortable from this perspective. How about your experience? Is the scene stable for you?
It's just shaky because the camera is basically strapped to his head. Your head naturally moves around a lot, but your brain will permanently compensate for this. It is actually a big problem in first person games with natural movement if you also try to render the body. Whenever they just attached the camera to the face of a virtual body, it would shake around like in the video (it's a lot worse when walking or running) and they have to use a lot of tricks to prevent that effect. Fun fact: This is one of the reasons why birds move their head in this funny intervals. It's a lot easier keep the head in a stable position than processing a constantly moving image. This is why they usually keep their head in a very stable position and move it in very quick intervals in between. While they move their heads, they are almost blind. It's a lot easier when it's a really smooth motion, like flying. If you're wearing a headset, you won't have this effect. But everybody else will. You'll see this effect on pretty much any first person VR footage.
I've been using the Quest 3 quite a lot (both for games and more serious stuff like this), and I will say that recordings always look shaky and hectic, but you don't really feel that when you're in it.. Because I guess it's just how you move your head around. I don't know, but it has always felt perfectly stable and natural to me, even though the recordings don't look like it.
its because it’s strapped to our head and our head moves a lot unconsciously so when displayed on a 2d screen this is what you get. but you wont notice it when you have it on because fortunately our eyes are attached to our heads and moves exactly in the the same direction so every thing just looks still and natural inside the headset
How does the resolution compare to the Mac's native screen? I'd love to try this out but I'm also really addicted to "retina" (or at least 4k) resolution displays. Will I be disappointed? Edit: Also, thanks for making this video! I've been wondering about this kind of set up for a while but didn't want to spend the cash to test it out.
Thanks for posting this, Arjan. I'm currently ISO a smart glass and mostly concerned with the screen resolution and smoothness. Coming from a 5k-ish monitor (the iMac) that probably renders at 2x, did you have the impression the fonts were pixelated or that the resolution was low? Also, did you feel the screen is fluid? Moving the mouse around seems choppy? I've been considering buying the Xreal Air 2 glasses but most reviews don't cover these questions.
When I move my head (that's almost unavoidable during the time) in a "real" coding environment, all the outside objects (table, monitor, keyboard, ..etc) were kept firmly at their position. But by putting on this "device", as I saw in this video, every objects vibrates according to the head movement. Won't it makes one feel daze and uncomfortable during coding?
I work 3years now in VR and and will not switch back. For me it is a game changer as a developer. But I use immersed which is for me the best option for coding. Workrooms and Virtual Desktop do not work for me on my Mac.
I really want to buy a quest 3 to work without multiple screens on my Mac when abroad, but it works well? How many hz can it run in immersed on Mac? Please tell me it’s 120hz or at least 90 😅
Good insight and analysis, but Immersed is definitely something you should review and include. I think Virtual Desktop is slightly sharper on the Quest 3, but immersed is hands down better in all other regards. Lately I've been using it for development at least 2-3 hours per day, with the limiter being comfort. You may also want to research the Immersed Visor, which may really shake up this space when it is released.
I do not know if you found out how to make the browser bigger, and I have not had time to read through all of the comments to see if someone else told you howto make your browser bigger , so I am going to tell you anyways. If you click right out side the browser, you will see a gray out line all the way around the browser. After you block on it, push your hand forward to make the box bigger and pull your hand back to make it smaller. That is what works for me. Hope this helps.
I like the concept because it could be a convenience and cost saving feature. If you already have the device and a single monitor you can have the best of both worlds. Instead of buying extra monitors, you have the option of working in vr from your desk, bed, couch, patio, etc... all with multiple screens like a work station. And of course you could always just use your normal monitor if desired. This is where I hope Valve's Project Deckard and the Apple Vision Pro take things.
I enjoy using the meta quest 3 for coding because it helps keeps me focused for longer periods of time on a task being able to be in a lonelier environment with less distraction.
for now i think XREAL is the best option for working on big screens, escecially it can run from a power from your laptop/tablet/phone, its light weight and looks like a casual sun glasses. also there are not many concerns on the safety cuz there is no remote connection so you do know where your company data are actually going.
Can you walk why having these screens open with stable distance from you ? ie can you pin virutal displays with certain angle and distance and start walking ?
Thank you very much for the great video! I've just got a question: Do you know how big the difference is between the 3 and 3s? Would really appreciate an answer!
thanks for this great video..i got the same set up..but somehow i can`t get the multiple monitors up and running..do u have a video on the technical side of virtual desktop..
I think this would be good to develop vr/ar experiences and be able to test immediately each change you make, like when you develop some mobile or web frontend.
Spot on bro. I was just thinking of how I'll need at least one more monitor to test out stuff when I'm working on the FE but with this I could even test for multiple devices at the same time
pretty interesting topic.. as much ive seen, you should plan a comparison/follow-up video. The Apple Vision Pro looks a lot promising to create a actual productive environment with serveral monitors.
@@faizanahmad7730Yea you can buy 10 monitors that you can also resize as well as making them float in your room and have a robot companions with you in the room for only $2500!! Can you recommend me such setup because I spend all day looking for such products thanks
If horizon workspaces allowed for multiple monitors, than that would be the best option. But I think that now with Apple Vision Pro it will spice up a bit the competition
Just got a surprise Quest for Christmas so I’ve been getting up to speed on all the applications. AR/MR looks potentially promising and useful. I’m wondering if some of the AR glasses on the market work better right now (they certainly seem more practical for wearing all day at least). I will say, though, that the Quest is really good for taking some quality breaks during a workday: get up and moving a bit for some fun and physical activity, blow off some steam with a game like Pistol Whip, guided meditations and similar experiences for calm and focus, etc.
In Immersed app, what if, we took our bluetooth KB and Mouse, out of the bluetooth range from computer and Still Laptop and Quest 3 is connected in same network
Thanks. The meta page has a list of officially supported keyboards. I gather it works best with contrasting colors - e.g. dark desktop+white keyboard. Also, can you try immersed?
how are you even using virtual desktop on Mac? I have an m1 MacBook and have really heavy lag with this. Airplay mirroring has no lag and VD from my windows pc also 0 lag.
The issue I have is that I am not a freelance programmer. I, like many, work for a large conglomerate, on their laptop, where I cannot install any software and the connection is through a VPN and so cannot "see" my home network. So, I would love to see a hardware-based solution for this. Ideally, there would be a breakout box (I think there is some AR glasses that do this) with an HDMI input that then connects to the headset. Further, if the headset could connect to the mouse and keyboard and then connect to the breakout box over the LAN, then I could feasibly work from any room in my house. Obviously, the main desire would be to have resizable virtual monitors, more than one please, so that I could have as much screen real estate as I need. But until then, I will remain chained to my desk using my 2 Samsung 43" 4K monitors... a decent second option. Love my Quest 3, just not for productivity.
In all of them the internet connection is always very bad. There is so much lag. I am using 2 devices on my wifi its like 150mbps and you cant watch a video without loosing some frames. I have seen that immersed has a better connection. However I wanna know if anyone can connect with a usbc cable. Would that be better? I know immersed has it but it crashes whenever I try it.
Oof getting dizzy. Is that the way it is in the headset also, or is this just an effect of being a viewer. Do they have a stabilization mode for these kinds of recordings that are intended to be shared?
The movement is his head movement so for him there is no shaking at all. For Arjan: there is a stabilization option in the Meta settings that will make it easier to watch if you plan future videos with Meta.
I've purchased all 3 quests for this specific purpose. Quest 2 works, but the Quest 3 experience is significantly better. It's lighter and the optics are much clearer.
Am I the only one that have been watching this for multi monitor setup ? This would actually provide value if you can set up few of them instead of buying few physical screens.
Maybe it's my headset (HP reverb 2), or my eye-sight issues, but after maybe half an hour to an hour in VR I am exhausted, my eye are tired as heck. Gaming sesseions in burst are okay, but working in VR, for now, don't think so.
I would use it for 8 hours at a time, but at the end of the day it’s nice to crash on the couch and write a few emails or watch a tutorial online in VR
Now that they figured out the resolution and new lense tech so you don't have the screen door issues, this technology is going to advance fast. Before, it was niche but now that the normal users can see it working for them, the adopiton will be quick. I know that when I bought the Samsung Odyssey Arc 55", I figured it would be the last time I purchased a monitor like this. Now that the meta quest 3 is out, this is a wrap.
Can you ? Sure you can. Is it worth it ? Not right now. If Meta makes it work, sure I would give it a try. I want it to work as a monitor for my computer. Since I'll be sitting down, I can plug it on power and HDMI (?)
wow it’s amazing 😂 you can basically have a unlimited virtual space to store screens and manipulate surrounding and yet still they create a virtual desktop machine with one screen 😂😂😂😂
why you post this 2 weeks ago hahaha, i boutght my quest 3 a month ago and i was looking for this video, i have the same experience, not confortable at all with any app, i hope with apple vision pro / or apple vision pro 2 yes, i think this is the future, not more Tv screen, no more tv monitor, all in one in your head set
A 4K TV provides more resolution than you can possibly hope to use in most cases for development, you don't have to fight multiple screen edges, it's cheaper, can be repurposed for movies etc, doesn't go on your head, has nothing to do with meta... I would expect the price of screens to drop so precipitously that we put them on our walls like portraits or paintings before VR becomes standard. The fake cartoon mountain background also gave me a bit of a panic attack, it just seems so dystopian like the start an episode of black mirror.
And melt your eyes over an hour trying to focus on small detail on the nauscia causing display. U cant watch a filn do work or anything. Prolonged focus and everyone will get sore eyes and migrane
I could care less about trying to use a VR headset for daily work. I would never wear a VR headset to do my daily jobs, too much of an eye strain. I only use my VR headset for gaming where I don't have to read allot of documents. Enjoy doing gaming with VR. I will stick with my large HD display monitor for doing work, thank you. You do what you want, but I am not doing work with VR headset.
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I stopped at 'you can't install vscode'. I'll wait until this have a real operating system then.
This is exactly the kind of thing I think about when I think of how our future generations will get work done lol. It looks so ridiculous 😂🤦♂️ Also, the latency involved in going from output of your mind to input into the computer virtually is much higher than it is physically. Still not practical at this time IMO.
Maybe you would be able to just move around your mouse with your keyboard and have like 6 monitors everywhere. Or just having a lot of monitors without having to buy multiple, at the size that you want etc, so quite interesting. There are quite a lot of applications
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I’m writting this comment with my Quest 3 on, connected to my work mac using Immersed, looking at your video in one of my 4 screens at the top of my field of view, topping a 5x3m screen with a fullscreen terminal in it, with vim, where i’m doing all my code. Aside that i have 2 extra screens for email and chat. I was using a similar setup on my Quest 2 (though with less pixels as it didn’t make sense to have a 4k screen on that setup) and on the pico4 (which was almost as good as the Q3, but with more aliasing/moire problems.
You should really give Immersed a shot, it can be used for free and has advantages over Virtual Desktop and Workroom, it gives more freedom in screen management as well as passthrough mode. It also supports Linux as well as macOS and Windows, i’ve been using on these 3 platforms in the last 2+ years.
I see Immersed supports multiple headsets, and doesn't say . Would you say it specifically supports the Quest 3, but does say the Quest 2 and Pro. Any issues with the Quest 3? Any idea if that's the best headset for resolution/other features?
@@dubious-membrane Immersed supports Quest 2, Pro and 3, as well as Pico 4 (but without hand-tracking), and HTC VIVE Focus 3, and XR Elite. Right now the best headset for the price to do these things is the Quest 3 indeed, given its great optic clarity. Pico 4, if you can get it for around 200-250 bucks on second hand, would be a decent cheaper contender, but really, making the stretch to the Q3 is otherwise worth it. If you are not in a hurry, you could wait for the Visor; it's more expensive now, alas (1000 usd, it used to be pre-purchasable for 750!), but it will have 4k/eye OLED screens, like the Apple Vision Pro, and will be less than half the weight of a Q3. But if you've never tried this, the Quest 3 is probably a more cautious starting point, and if you really enjoy it, could get a Visor later on, as in 2025.
There is a TH-cam channel, called WorkInVR, with great tips, and a very recent video about this very topic :)
@@dubious-membrane i agree with @yandrosyoutube, the Quest 3 is certainly the best right now, and the upgrade from pico4 to quest3 was well worth the price for me, the image is really clearer, especially when looking at text, i had aliasing effects with the pico, good enough to work, but still bothering, that's gone with the quest3, and the camera passthrough is also significantly better.
I started with a quest2, and i'd say now unless you are really cheap or don't want to commit too much money, it's not worth getting for Immersed, the difference in image quality is just too great.
I just got my Quest3 recently, not too many issues with it, still pondering if i'll get an alternative strap for it, and other comfort adaptations, but it's not too bad for me in that regard, although other people have different experiences and some say it's just not usable with the default one.
Battery duration is not good enough to work the full day (or even a couple hours), so you have to work tethered, or to have some swappable battery system to be able to work for long stretches of time, but usually a wire is not big of a deal when you are at your desk anyway.
Linux only in X11 Desktop environment protocol. So no Wayland for now (maybe someday, I hope).
UPD: OH! WAIT! Experimental Wayland support from 21 of December!
I’m a fan of Immersed too. Got my Logitech keyboard and mouse just to work in VR.
Immersed is my preferred app, it allows you up to five monitors, the keyboard/mouse environment cutout you were asking for and allows you to plug it in via usbc and do a wired connection (as well as turn up settings for retina and encoding quality).
I have a quest 2 so I needed some extra resolution, you can do that through side quest
How do you change the encoding quality?
@@BellaArtur on macos at least, there is an "advanced" setting for encoding and retina quality, low encoding is faster but produces at my more artifacts.
I tried it today. It was definitely fun to play with. I can imagine this will be the norm in about 15 years. We won’t need physical monitors any more.
in 15 years this XR stuff will be embedded into our eyes, tech moves way too fast.
@@ToshisanMotonakanah, dont be too optimistic
@@ToshisanMotonaka not all tech. What you're talking about might as well be as difficult as curing cancer.
For the kind of thing you're talking about, we would need micro-sized AND transparent cameras and batteries embedded into the lens.
Not 15 years. It’s already here brother. Give it 5 years
prob a lot sooner
Immersed can create "portals", which are exactly as you'd described: a way yo cut a hole in your desk so you can see the keyboard.
The issue is the difficulty to read anything in these portals, including a real keyboard. I have a Quest 3 and found very hard to read the keyboard. A major issue, in my opinion, but I understand it is a limitation of the hardware (Quest 3) not the software.
@@serlcb Yeah but how often do you actually need to look at your keyboard?
I'm an okay typist, no expert, and I really only need to glance at my keyboard very occasionally, usually for special characters.
You should try immersed for multi-monitors setup, resizable.
Thanks for the tip!
I've just tried immersed. Found it to be way better than Virtual Desktop. But the cursor movement is so laggy it's almost unusable. I tweaked with the settings a bunch, but couldn't find anything that would speed it up. Is this true for everyone, or am I just special?
@@James-lw3gi You probably already figured it out. But there is an option to use a virtual cursor in immeresd. After I turned that off it worked great
I also tested the same options, and I reached a similar conclusion.
Meta Horizons Workrooms would be my current recommendation if anyone also wants to try developing in VR/MR.
But there are some things I didn't see in your video.
1.: I also have the option to add my keyboard to the "VR" mode, and the Quest will match its position in VR with my real keyboard.
This way, I can use my actual keyboard in VR without having to use the MR "window."
At least in the latest version I tried, I couldn't choose my actual key mapping (German), and my mouse was still invisible, so the window is still better.
Also, the virtual hands didn't always perfectly align with my actual hands, causing me to mistype even more when looking down at my keyboard.
2.: I can also add virtual screens. I am using two monitors by default, but within Workrooms, I could add a third screen, which then can be used as if I have three physical screens. I like that feature very much.
I am using Windows, though, so different functionality may be available there.
But in the end, I agree that this is more of a gimmick than anything I like to use "in production."
If you're working from a hotel and want more screen space than your laptop, then you can bring your Quest and also play some games between your work sessions :D
But at home, I still prefer my actual screens.
Also, even though I am not usually prone to VR-sickness, I get a funny feeling in my stomach if I use Workrooms for too long.
That could be related to my Wifi connection, and that it adds some delay.
You're just using the wrong app. Immersed solved this problem years ago and is to go solution to work in VR. Give a try. They also have a amizing community in the discord channel
@ Yep, I work in VR on the quest pro like 3 days a week for 8 hours. I agree that at home I still use my screen setup but in the office or when travelling nothing beats it.
I'm a programmer/network architect and I've been working in vr for about 3 years or so. Originally, I did that every day, but now only when I travel. When I'm not traveling, I work the old-fashioned way, a macbook pro with two huge external displays. I used meta Horizon and ImmersedVR, but I found Immersed to be extremely buggy, so I canceled my subscription. Last year I traveled about 6 months in or camper, I worked in vr the entire time when I was working.
I'm a developer thinking of doing something similar, since I work remotely and would live to travel a bit.
I've seen lots of seemingly great headset add ons that make the headset more comfortable over the default strap. About how long can you work in VR with one of those compared to default? I watch movies with the default strap, usually with my head tilted slightly back against the couch, and I can usually get through about 1 - 1.5 hours before it bothers me, but If I could get a solid 2-3 hours in, that would make it viable.
@@AbadonBIack I can do pretty much all day. You will naturally take breaks, coffee, bathroom, lunch etc. I did change my headset to one that balances better. I have the battery in the back, but also sound have to have it plugged in after 3 hours or so. The Meta quest 3 is a huge upgrade for working in VR. I'm still using Meta Horizon Desktop. Immersed is coming out with a new vr glass option that may be worth checking out, just not sure it's worth the price with how buggy I found their VR app to be. I also have Nreal (xreal) with nebula stream, it's horrible as a working desktop. It's okay connected to my phone as a screen or to Gaming console, where it excels, but not the virtual desktop.
Thanks a lot for your insights! How is your Mac connected to the Q3? How is the latency? And what did you bring back to the "old-fashioned" way? I am also working in IT and traveling a lot, thinking about trying the same! Sounds so cool!
@@Mira.travels Regarding the 'Old Fasioned' way.... That is my Macbook with external monitor on a typical desk with a magic keyboard and Mouse. I use this when I am not traveling. There are some advantages and some disadvantages. the advantage is that I am more 'present' in the physical world. I can see and interact with my wife or dog or other things going on around me. I have a funny story about a time that I was at home working in VR. We had just rescued a puppy and she was in my office with me while I was working in VR. I heard her playing, but was working and ignored what she was doing. My son-in-law came over and asked me how long I had been working in VR. I took my headset off to answer and saw the destruction that prompted his question around me. The puppy had torn up a whole bunch of dog toys and there was stuffing all over my office and into the foyer outside of my office. It was a mess! The advantages of working in VR when at home... I tend to be more focussed. You are in a vitrual world, there are even sounds playing (birds or whatever) and no visual distractions. Being ADHD, that is a good thing. You can spin up three screens (in Meta Horizon Desktop) or five (in ImmersedVr), so you can put TH-cam or some other distraction on a monitor and still be distracted if you want to . One thing to note, you can't open lots of content with digital rights (Netflix, TH-camTv or Prime Video for instance) on a Meta virtual (or ImmersedVr) desktop. You will hear sound, but get no video. Another advantage of working in VR is that the computer automatically changes your sound output to your Meta Quest, more immersive in meetings for me. So far, the microphone does not work in any meeting I have tried (Teams, Chime, WebEx, Zoom), so you have to change your microphone to one on your computer.
@@AbadonBIack You MUST change the manufacturer head strap. The Meta/Oculus straps are not comfortable for long term use. You can find stronger, balanced ones that are a much better option and some provide batteries. On my Q2 I used KiWi design and the 8VR head strap with battery. On my Q3 I use the Aubika head strap with battery. I like it because many of the battery headstraps are not strong enough to change your device while you are using it, so it slowly dies. This one can charge it while using it, prolonging how long you can be in VR without charging. I also have an over the shoulder battery by Zybervr that I can use with a short cord if that all runs out. I can run for 8 full hours in VR with that setup if I want to.
THANK YOU!! This is the exact review I've been looking for as a traveling software engineer
Glad to hear the video was helpful!
This is actually perfect for working at a coffee shop. You do look weird but you wouldn't know that since you can't see yourself. I do prefer Immersed over other options.
This would be super useful for people who move around a lot. I used to move places every couple of months few years back, so I had to work on a laptop and it didn't make sense for me to buy an external monitor. This would have been a life saver
you must test Immersed, probabbly it's the best option for work in VR
What is the resolution of the text? Is it easy to read? Are there any visibility issues?
Instead of codespace, you can actually run a VSCode Server on your machine, then open a browser to connect to it just as you did with the codespace
5:25 you can actually change the distance with the bar below the mid window
Super keen for the future of VR based workflows.
Would be cool if you could "portal" windows and have them floating around the virtual environment - changing the dynamic away from the conventional desktop flow.
Also needs controller free/hand based controls.
Headsets need to be lighter and wired - something like the big screen beyond but not cost a billion dollars and have better software.
I can definitely seeing myself using this in the future but not quite yet. Want to wait for alot of these kinks to be worked out first.
Thanks for sharing! I'm curious, is the scene shaking a lot, or is it possibly due to the video recording? It seems a bit uncomfortable from this perspective. How about your experience? Is the scene stable for you?
It's just shaky because the camera is basically strapped to his head.
Your head naturally moves around a lot, but your brain will permanently compensate for this.
It is actually a big problem in first person games with natural movement if you also try to render the body. Whenever they just attached the camera to the face of a virtual body, it would shake around like in the video (it's a lot worse when walking or running) and they have to use a lot of tricks to prevent that effect.
Fun fact: This is one of the reasons why birds move their head in this funny intervals. It's a lot easier keep the head in a stable position than processing a constantly moving image. This is why they usually keep their head in a very stable position and move it in very quick intervals in between. While they move their heads, they are almost blind. It's a lot easier when it's a really smooth motion, like flying.
If you're wearing a headset, you won't have this effect. But everybody else will.
You'll see this effect on pretty much any first person VR footage.
I've been using the Quest 3 quite a lot (both for games and more serious stuff like this), and I will say that recordings always look shaky and hectic, but you don't really feel that when you're in it.. Because I guess it's just how you move your head around.
I don't know, but it has always felt perfectly stable and natural to me, even though the recordings don't look like it.
its because it’s strapped to our head and our head moves a lot unconsciously so when displayed on a 2d screen this is what you get. but you wont notice it when you have it on because fortunately our eyes are attached to our heads and moves exactly in the the same direction so every thing just looks still and natural inside the headset
How does the resolution compare to the Mac's native screen? I'd love to try this out but I'm also really addicted to "retina" (or at least 4k) resolution displays. Will I be disappointed?
Edit: Also, thanks for making this video! I've been wondering about this kind of set up for a while but didn't want to spend the cash to test it out.
Tried it today, definitely not as good. I used it for about 30 min and when I took it off, I fell in love with my retina screen all over again.
Thanks for posting this, Arjan. I'm currently ISO a smart glass and mostly concerned with the screen resolution and smoothness.
Coming from a 5k-ish monitor (the iMac) that probably renders at 2x, did you have the impression the fonts were pixelated or that the resolution was low?
Also, did you feel the screen is fluid? Moving the mouse around seems choppy?
I've been considering buying the Xreal Air 2 glasses but most reviews don't cover these questions.
When I move my head (that's almost unavoidable during the time) in a "real" coding environment, all the outside objects (table, monitor, keyboard, ..etc) were kept firmly at their position. But by putting on this "device", as I saw in this video, every objects vibrates according to the head movement. Won't it makes one feel daze and uncomfortable during coding?
Obviously, the image will be stable in the headset. Nothing moves. You are in a VR environment.
Can you use multiple monitors or like ultrawide on the virtual desktop option?
How do you find it on the eyes?
I work 3years now in VR and and will not switch back. For me it is a game changer as a developer. But I use immersed which is for me the best option for coding. Workrooms and Virtual Desktop do not work for me on my Mac.
I really want to buy a quest 3 to work without multiple screens on my Mac when abroad, but it works well? How many hz can it run in immersed on Mac? Please tell me it’s 120hz or at least 90 😅
@@DYNNI.mp3 Sry but I do not use Quest 3. I only tested it for some hours. I can not tell you the exact Hz number.
Uhm 🧐
Uhm 🧐
What vr device do you use and how much does the battery last ?
Good insight and analysis, but Immersed is definitely something you should review and include. I think Virtual Desktop is slightly sharper on the Quest 3, but immersed is hands down better in all other regards. Lately I've been using it for development at least 2-3 hours per day, with the limiter being comfort. You may also want to research the Immersed Visor, which may really shake up this space when it is released.
I do not know if you found out how to make the browser bigger, and I have not had time to read through all of the comments to see if someone else told you howto make your browser bigger , so I am going to tell you anyways. If you click right out side the browser, you will see a gray out line all the way around the browser. After you block on it, push your hand forward to make the box bigger and pull your hand back to make it smaller. That is what works for me. Hope this helps.
Now that I taught you that, can you now teach me how to code ? Lol
Can you share your experience with glasses, does it make comfortable using meta quest with them ?
It's not really a test until you've done it for a full day with the brick attached to your head.
I like the concept because it could be a convenience and cost saving feature. If you already have the device and a single monitor you can have the best of both worlds. Instead of buying extra monitors, you have the option of working in vr from your desk, bed, couch, patio, etc... all with multiple screens like a work station.
And of course you could always just use your normal monitor if desired. This is where I hope Valve's Project Deckard and the Apple Vision Pro take things.
I enjoy using the meta quest 3 for coding because it helps keeps me focused for longer periods of time on a task being able to be in a lonelier environment with less distraction.
How is the text? Is it clear and crisp?
Yes it is - text is really easy to read.
for now i think XREAL is the best option for working on big screens, escecially it can run from a power from your laptop/tablet/phone, its light weight and looks like a casual sun glasses. also there are not many concerns on the safety cuz there is no remote connection so you do know where your company data are actually going.
Can you walk why having these screens open with stable distance from you ? ie can you pin virutal displays with certain angle and distance and start walking ?
Great when commuting or in the office where you don't have multiple monitors
Nice vidéo ! But i still have one question: when using virtual desktop or meta horizon can you have multiple screens from your computer too ?
how are you sharing the headset feed in widescreen? :)
can i use the same function to project the screen of a windows desktop?
Thank you very much for the great video! I've just got a question: Do you know how big the difference is between the 3 and 3s? Would really appreciate an answer!
thanks for this great video..i got the same set up..but somehow i can`t get the multiple monitors up and running..do u have a video on the technical side of virtual desktop..
Varjo XR-4 is out for $4,000USD but it has 51 pixels per degree and the max the human eye can see is 60.
I think this would be good to develop vr/ar experiences and be able to test immediately each change you make, like when you develop some mobile or web frontend.
This seems like a very interesting idea!
Spot on bro. I was just thinking of how I'll need at least one more monitor to test out stuff when I'm working on the FE but with this I could even test for multiple devices at the same time
I need this to work from my van !!! Nomad working as IT software architect
how is the screen door effect/eyestrain for a full days work?
pretty interesting topic.. as much ive seen, you should plan a comparison/follow-up video. The Apple Vision Pro looks a lot promising to create a actual productive environment with serveral monitors.
Bruh actual several monitors plus their entire setup would cost less than a vision pro 😂
@@faizanahmad7730Yea you can buy 10 monitors that you can also resize as well as making them float in your room and have a robot companions with you in the room for only $2500!! Can you recommend me such setup because I spend all day looking for such products thanks
If horizon workspaces allowed for multiple monitors, than that would be the best option.
But I think that now with Apple Vision Pro it will spice up a bit the competition
I can see that Svalboard Datahand being a fantastic input device for VR typing.
I love immersed. It is fantastic.
The Horizon Workroom, does it work on Windows 11?
Just got a surprise Quest for Christmas so I’ve been getting up to speed on all the applications. AR/MR looks potentially promising and useful. I’m wondering if some of the AR glasses on the market work better right now (they certainly seem more practical for wearing all day at least).
I will say, though, that the Quest is really good for taking some quality breaks during a workday: get up and moving a bit for some fun and physical activity, blow off some steam with a game like Pistol Whip, guided meditations and similar experiences for calm and focus, etc.
you are so lucky. its a dream for me
Is it possible to connect the quest 3 via cable to the Mac to have low latency for edit videos?
Is alles in een IDE zoals VS code of intellij goed te lezen? En is dit echt iets wat je een week zou kunnen gebruiken of gewoon leuk voor een keer?
Did you try immersed?
In Immersed app, what if, we took our bluetooth KB and Mouse, out of the bluetooth range from computer and Still Laptop and Quest 3 is connected in same network
another option that run really well is to have a vnc server on your PC and a vnc client on your HMD it's low latency and work just fine for me
Thanks. The meta page has a list of officially supported keyboards. I gather it works best with contrasting colors - e.g. dark desktop+white keyboard. Also, can you try immersed?
how are you even using virtual desktop on Mac? I have an m1 MacBook and have really heavy lag with this. Airplay mirroring has no lag and VD from my windows pc also 0 lag.
are you using it with glasses on? on ordered prescribed lenses?
I use it with lens inserts. I have pretty large glasses and they barely fit inside the headset. But the lenses work great!
The issue I have is that I am not a freelance programmer. I, like many, work for a large conglomerate, on their laptop, where I cannot install any software and the connection is through a VPN and so cannot "see" my home network. So, I would love to see a hardware-based solution for this. Ideally, there would be a breakout box (I think there is some AR glasses that do this) with an HDMI input that then connects to the headset. Further, if the headset could connect to the mouse and keyboard and then connect to the breakout box over the LAN, then I could feasibly work from any room in my house. Obviously, the main desire would be to have resizable virtual monitors, more than one please, so that I could have as much screen real estate as I need. But until then, I will remain chained to my desk using my 2 Samsung 43" 4K monitors... a decent second option. Love my Quest 3, just not for productivity.
In all of them the internet connection is always very bad. There is so much lag. I am using 2 devices on my wifi its like 150mbps and you cant watch a video without loosing some frames.
I have seen that immersed has a better connection. However I wanna know if anyone can connect with a usbc cable. Would that be better? I know immersed has it but it crashes whenever I try it.
Oof getting dizzy. Is that the way it is in the headset also, or is this just an effect of being a viewer. Do they have a stabilization mode for these kinds of recordings that are intended to be shared?
The movement is his head movement so for him there is no shaking at all. For Arjan: there is a stabilization option in the Meta settings that will make it easier to watch if you plan future videos with Meta.
I really like this idea. I'm going to try it with my quest 2 next week
Glad you enjoyed the video!
Ready to switch to C#?
Should try immersed.
can we open multiple screens in multiple desktop ? My PC can handle them .. I just don't want to invest in monitors.
Can you do these same things in the quest 2?
I've purchased all 3 quests for this specific purpose. Quest 2 works, but the Quest 3 experience is significantly better. It's lighter and the optics are much clearer.
why your head moving so often? it is imposible for us to see characters
This video is very useful. Now can I buy one and declare it as business expenses 😜
You got me, that was the only reason I did a video about it. 😋
You can host your own vscode server
I will wait for the quest 4 to see if they can fix the blurry screen while programming…
Am I the only one that have been watching this for multi monitor setup ? This would actually provide value if you can set up few of them instead of buying few physical screens.
woow great idea to use a github codespace.
Maybe it's my headset (HP reverb 2), or my eye-sight issues, but after maybe half an hour to an hour in VR I am exhausted, my eye are tired as heck. Gaming sesseions in burst are okay, but working in VR, for now, don't think so.
I would use it for 8 hours at a time, but at the end of the day it’s nice to crash on the couch and write a few emails or watch a tutorial online in VR
Now that they figured out the resolution and new lense tech so you don't have the screen door issues, this technology is going to advance fast. Before, it was niche but now that the normal users can see it working for them, the adopiton will be quick. I know that when I bought the Samsung Odyssey Arc 55", I figured it would be the last time I purchased a monitor like this. Now that the meta quest 3 is out, this is a wrap.
Can you ? Sure you can.
Is it worth it ? Not right now.
If Meta makes it work, sure I would give it a try.
I want it to work as a monitor for my computer. Since I'll be sitting down, I can plug it on power and HDMI (?)
now you can do that
Future is not glasses or VR headsets. Futur is transparant screens and 3D screen.
Surprised he didn't use immersed.
I wish it was possible to use intellij ides. That would be awesome 😊
I prefer Vspatial, or emersed
Sadly, you never showed how it worked with multiple monitors, as you mentioned in the beginning. It looks cool though.
The bouncing around/jitter in the video was giving me motion sickness. On a different note, this might be useful as a stock market trading desk.
I just sideload IDEs like GODOT and Squircle. Easy peasy.
I think is better for trading stocks
woww this is soo awesome
Glad you liked the video!
Why?
whatever you got going on with your VS Code there, I seriously thought you were running Windows XP 😂😂😂
wow it’s amazing 😂 you can basically have a unlimited virtual space to store screens and manipulate surrounding and yet still they create a virtual desktop machine with one screen 😂😂😂😂
Immersed is very good
why you post this 2 weeks ago hahaha, i boutght my quest 3 a month ago and i was looking for this video, i have the same experience, not confortable at all with any app, i hope with apple vision pro / or apple vision pro 2 yes, i think this is the future, not more Tv screen, no more tv monitor, all in one in your head set
I can see this becoming THE META for working on the go ahhahahaha
A 4K TV provides more resolution than you can possibly hope to use in most cases for development, you don't have to fight multiple screen edges, it's cheaper, can be repurposed for movies etc, doesn't go on your head, has nothing to do with meta...
I would expect the price of screens to drop so precipitously that we put them on our walls like portraits or paintings before VR becomes standard. The fake cartoon mountain background also gave me a bit of a panic attack, it just seems so dystopian like the start an episode of black mirror.
And melt your eyes over an hour trying to focus on small detail on the nauscia causing display. U cant watch a filn do work or anything. Prolonged focus and everyone will get sore eyes and migrane
I could care less about trying to use a VR headset for daily work. I would never wear a VR headset to do my daily jobs, too much of an eye strain. I only use my VR headset for gaming where I don't have to read allot of documents. Enjoy doing gaming with VR.
I will stick with my large HD display monitor for doing work, thank you.
You do what you want, but I am not doing work with VR headset.
I stopped at 'you can't install vscode'. I'll wait until this have a real operating system then.
And not a line of code!
So not yet.
It look so shaky. I doubt this will be a thing for another decade.
It’s shaky on the exported video, not when using the headset
What are we even looking at? Its so shaky and unclear
This is exactly the kind of thing I think about when I think of how our future generations will get work done lol. It looks so ridiculous 😂🤦♂️
Also, the latency involved in going from output of your mind to input into the computer virtually is much higher than it is physically. Still not practical at this time IMO.
Looks awfully lot like a ”Solution to a problem which does not exist”😅
Maybe you would be able to just move around your mouse with your keyboard and have like 6 monitors everywhere.
Or just having a lot of monitors without having to buy multiple, at the size that you want etc, so quite interesting.
There are quite a lot of applications
Agree. I’ve been using this in Q2: just an okay-ish solution. And it is hot.
I actually thought about buying a quest instead of external monitors, but I'd stop working and start playing beatsaber after 3min
Lol you had 0 idea of how much powerful and potential vr have. Yea right now there are okayish software until there will be better one
Idk man. My problem is that I travel. I can't travel with a monitor. This and a small laptop is best option.
the latency makes me throw up