Can Portal 64 be saved? - Libdragon
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 พ.ค. 2024
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nah, quitter
@@stanb1455?
@@stanb1455bruh, what? You know what Valve and Nintendo could do, touch grass
Awe sheet, I'm SCEARED, you will be sued, so lets buy the support, let's go bois!!!!!!
stop being a push over and just make the damn game, god i hate people that are cowards because of big companies
the art for that new game is very beautiful, like it a lot
Love your videos! Hope you find some more micro seconds 👍
The man, The Myth, The Legend: Kaze!
Arianna what are you doing here! Love your work my guy.
I love how this N64 community comes together and supports each other like this
Meeting the geenius
I feel the only reason Nintendo has so many active devs doing things on their consoles is because those devs know that, if they don't do it, Nintendo will be perfectly fine with letting all their consoles die.
Nintendo doesn't deserve the community and fans it has.
I'd still love to know why they care this much about projects built on top of source code from 26 years ago
@@RoshiGaming I think a big misunderstanding is that all of Nintendo is against fan projects and stuff, which simply isn't the case. The main people against it are the people working at Nintendo HQ in Japan and those are scared shitless of losing their successful IPs by not protecting them. Nintendo is nothing without having Mario or Zelda so they'll do everything to protect them.
I think the main factor at play is the legal trouble they found themselves in when Warner Bros tried to steal Donkey Kong from them due to Nintendo supposedly copying King Kong. Ever since then Nintendo has been very careful with their IPs and source code because they fear to lose it all from just a small legal miss-step
Sad to say, too, this also applies to most console manufacturers. They don't care about game preservation or hardware preservation, because those things have an impact on their ability to foist newer and "better" products on their customers. Nintendo is just the most egregious example of this.
@@RoshiGaming Property owners need to be able to own everything they possibly can and be able to leverage anything possible at any time, even if it has no use to them anymore. It's just how those kinds of people are.
We have Disney to thank for the intellectual property laws that force Nintendo to do this if they realistically want to stay in business.
I'm glad you were able to get a vertical slice of Portal64 done, and I think that was the most interesting part; most of the rest of the effort would probably have been just remaking the levels. Getting the tech to work was the cool aspect. It's for the best you can spend your time on something you created yourself, and it already looks awesome.
Yeah, the Demo showed that it was totally possible and only needed more time and resources.
uhhh it's still under active development on github. it'll be out eventually. y'all are declaring defeat wayyy too early
As far as i can tell it's still being worked on github with the portal64: still alive repo having commits 2 days ago. Its effectively become community only now as he can't work on it since valve said no.
My respect for you suddenly went up when you said "This new library is great because when the code crashes it tells you what line it crashed on".
Making Portal64 was clearly harder than I'd realised
Fancy seeing you here, AI safety dread man.
This is why they would record their gameplay on VHS and have the code in the corner
My favorite AI safety commentator!
A big problem is that there's basically three states a project like this can be in: Valve can officially sanction it, officially refuse it, or turn a blind eye and pretend it doesn't exist. That first one is really hard to achieve, most companies don't want to sanction random fan projects... and the second one means you don't get to do it any more. So generally you want to aim for that third one... try to skate by and avoid rocking the boat so that Valve can pretend you don't exist.
The problem is that once you leave that state, you can't really go back. Once Valve's hand has been forced and they give an official "no", you can't really go back to Valve pretending they've never heard of you. Which means that just removing the libultra code that was the original sticking point isn't going to be enough.
The only way to lose that official "no" is to get an official "yes", because any lifting of the official "no" _will be interpreted as_ an official "yes", that veil of plausible deniability is gone.
Which is exactly why I don't believe anyone should show a fan project before it's entirely finished. This happens time and time again and yet still people are like, look at this cool thing I'm making, then are surprised when it gets shut down. I know you want to show off your work and it can be motivating to see people loving what you've done, but in the end if your goal is to put out a finished thing, just wait until you have a finished thing. Then it doesn't matter what happens.
As long as it's distributed as a mod for Portal, Valve doesn't get a say either way. As far as I know, this whole problem started because James wanted to distribute Portal64 on Steam. If he drops that, legally, he doesn't need Valve's permission to continue development, even using libultra (although that would expose him a lawsuit from Nintendo, so switching to libdragon would be a good idea anyway).
What I really think is happening is that he grew bored of the project (all the technical challenges solved, only grind left) and this is a convenient excuse to quit.
This is generally the worst legal advice for fan projects. Feigning ignorance isn't a valid defense strategy.
OpenGL 1.1 in n64!
I think Silicon Graphics will be proud of the libdragon team.
Is amazing how an SGI hardware can run an SGI API 20 years later.
edit: s/a SGI/an SGI/g
edit 2: fix second occurence.
Well, OpenGL 1.1 is from 1 year after the N64. Still impressive though, I wouldn't even know where to start with something like that.
@@henryfleischer404 Imagine if n64 ship with OGL 1.0 back in the days!
all games would be more or less compatible with modern hardware.
and of course emulators will be easier in some aspects because an ogl 1.0 compliant application should work the same on any other ogl 1.0 implementation.
That would be awesome!
PS: Even today, Mesa have to emulate fixed function pipeline in modern hardware to run OGL 1.0 apps.
*an SGI (because "ess-gee-eye" starts with a vowel sound)
"A" vs "an" is determined by the _sound_ that immediately follows, not the letter. It also doesn't matter what an initialism stands for.
@@alvallac2171 Thanks! I am not a native english speaker I will edit that! :)
@@alvallac2171 its up for debate in text
Dont worry, on Internet it dont will die
is there still a way to get the original Portal 64?
@@TalentedAndHot there isn't a phorum where you can't find the ROM AND you can't download ir if you dont search portal For Nintendo 64 rom
not unless there is a release, we can't seed from nothing.
If only there was some kind of archive, like an org if you will... 🤔🤔🤔
💪🏽🏴☠️👍🏽
@@bunnybreaker the romance of CD
It would be interesting if a game called "Hortal64" came out, that allowed you to use physics and travel though colored holes called "Hortals."
Cool concept. I think he could get away with it if he uses a complete diferent lore/story and aesthetics. Also, he needs to twist a little all the levels so they aren't exactly the same. In the end, it is completely unrelated to Valve and/or Nintendo.
Something similar to Super Tux Kar compared to Mario Kart.
Hell from Hortal getting Had by haDOS- the Hideo ga-
*gets copyrighted by Kojima*
Effectively, @@lmk10000, it becomes an iteration of Narbacular Drop for the N64.
Unless if there are problems copying the aesthetics of that game. Which means going in a theme different from "science lab" and "fantasy".
@@oscarcacnio8418 could be very interesting copying that concept or something similar.
That wizard idea is so cool, I've long since thought about the limitation of wizard classes, in anime and media, wizards are scholars who make their own spells, but how the hell does someone program that without it feeling like you need a computer science degree to make a fireball
There's a few games that actually have spell crafting similar to this, Mages of Mystralia being one that's on steam and very cute, however it's top down.
However having it as a 3D platformer also sounds great so I'm looking forward to where this project is going.
That’s so wizard anni
reminds me of the owl house's magic
@@adora_was_takenrune magic systems are so cool tbh it's a good execution of one for the medium of TV
One of the most interesting solutions I've seen to this problem is to implement a system where the player *draws* their spells using representational pictographs. Then you can use shared similarities to 'invent' new spells before they're taught to you. Let's say you know a wind spell and a fireball spell, and then you learn a 'strong wind' spell that just looks like the regular wind spell with an extra circle around it. Well, why not add a circle like that to your fireball spell? Congratulations, you've just created a 'strong fireball' spell.
Okami implements a drawing system that would be perfect for that kind of experimentation, but doesn't utilize it as well as it could. The original DS version of Ni no Kuni did the same thing but *much* better, since you were physically drawing on the bottom screen. It's tragic that this spell-drawing system was replaced with a simple list in the PS3 remake instead of being implemented with an on-screen drawing function like Okami. But at least you can play the DS version with a full fan-translation!
will any wizards be able to use a teleportation spell? maybe one with some sort of preview of where they'll go to? ;)
I guess that's the problem with doing development publicly like this... If the development were anonymous and secret until it was finished, the game may have been completed before Valve or Nintendo even had a chance to stop it. Of course, it may not have been legal, but tons of fan works have walked that line before, and even if the project were shut down, the game itself would probably be archived by someone else. See Pokemon Uranium, for example. Anyway, it's too bad corporate interests ended this project prematurely, I would have loved to play a full version. Maybe you can revisit it in 85 or so years when these works enter the public domain...
It is impossible for me to feel truly bad for people who publicly advertise the project they are making that uses an IP they don't own and how sad / upset / disheartened they are by the inevitable and completely understandable C&D. It is why I always recommend to anyone who is planning to spends years making a game to just make their own unique content from the get go, just take concepts and elements from the game you so desperately want to appropriate.
@CrAzYpotpie they don't need you to do that and I hope they continue spitting in the face of Nintendo forever
@@halcyonacoustic7366 Feel free to point out what I said that you disagreed with.
@@CrAzYpotpie Shakespeare should've just stopped writing about that silly Lear guy, what an unoriginal hack
@@slizzysluzzer Feel free to point out what I said that you disagreed with.
Quest 64: 2 confirmed.........
my immediate thought haha
hahah so right
Finally... Quest 65
truuuuu
Magicka is a really fun game where you combine elements in real time to cast spells! I played a lot of it with my friend!
Made by the same people as Helldivers! Did you ever play the mobile spinoff?
if you go much much further back LOOM is also similar in the way that you construct spells, but in that case out of notes.
Don't bother with single player. Their Gauntlet remake was not good either.
@@balsalmalberto8086 Single player is significantly harder for sure~ but learning how to protect against certain elements and what does/doesn't work to kill certain enemies was part of the fun for me.
I still have QFQFAAD embedded in my brain from Magicka 1. Loved the game! :)
beefing with companys until this gets green lit
*companies
To pluralize a noun that ends in -y, drop the -y and add -ies.
@@alvallac2171always nice to get a grammar lesson in yt comments! /gen
@@alvallac2171loser, singular
lol
@@alvallac2171 somebody called the grammar police
One indie game that IMO requires more attention is Astlibra Revision. It's a sidescrolling action JRPG developed over a period of over a decade by KEIZO, a Japanese salaryman who developed this game almost entirely on his own simple because "he felt there weren’t enough 2D action RPG games that filled the niche he most enjoyed". I finished it the other day and it's one of my favourite games of all time. It's available on Steam as well as the Switch and recently it received a DLC with a new roguelike-style campaign.
Be the change you want to see in the world
Portal 64 Still Alive fork: *_Am I joke to you?_*
How is that project going?
Oh my god, dude's making Noita 3D :)
I know it isn't Noita, it's got its own art style and everything and I love what I'm seeing so far, but the magic system is very Noita-ish and I love that too. Good luck with the project my dude!
Noita is addicting af
Noita was hardly the first game to use parametric spell creation. Magica is a well known example that this game feels much closer to, though I like the Minecraft mod Ars Magica 2, and its successors Wizardry and Psi.
@@Scrogan Hex casting is also interesting
Even if you never got to distribute it, I thought watching you develop, demo and play Portal 64 and just seeing it was extremely satisfying.
Don't forget that exploring code/coding can be very popular on youtube if done well. Example: Sebastian Lague. I think your style lends itself to that kind of content.
In addition you could run the project open source and if you record/stream yourself developing your own game as open source code, using Libdragon, you will uncover bugs or missing features in Libdragon, and you might inspire some of your viewers to work on improving libdragon at such pain points, when they normally wouldn't have, either because they didn't know about Libdragon, or because there was nothing to make it interesting for them
Woah, that rune system reminds me of Arx Fatalis, where you had to draw runes on the screen and combine them in order to cast magic spells
6:40 that's something Oblivion did! It wasn't overly fancy, but you could mix and match existing spells and balance their intensity into a new one to fit your needs.
Morrowind too. It also wasn't super fancy but it let you combine effects of every spell you knew and set things like the spell's range, duration, and strength, all of which would affect its magicka cost to cast and its gold cost to make. I wonder if anyone's ever modded a system like that into Skyrim.
@@IndigoGollum This exists. It's called Spell Crafting for Skyrim on the nexus
Thr title was such a tease
YAY!!!....wait yay
Clickbait but clickbait that I enjoy
James Lambert x Kaze Emanuar collab when?
We believe in you! You did amazing job, and if you will finish it, it would be extremely cool!
Time for a PSX port; PortalStation.
Unfortunately that wouldnt work either, again due to distribution outside of steam
@@commander3494 There is an SDK called PSn00bSDK that has nearly all of the features of the Sony SDK, but is independent of it, so at least that wouldn't cause a problem.
@@commander3494 Just bundle the rom inside an emulator executable and only distribute that. Or just fake it and do a demake with intentional affine texture warping.
"Sony shall not be as kind as VALVe."
Unless if they truly do not care about the PS1 anymore.
@@soviut303 or add DRM that requires the ROM to call home via steamworks API, i've done that for other projects that run on retro hardware, and with modern flashcarts its easy to implement on the N64, you can even encrypt the payload with a custom IPL3 or embedded AES key that's fused in a cart for a physical release, not impossible to workaround of course, as pirates have little morality in such matters.
You describing your issue with spells in videogames reminds me of a game that solves that exact problem. At some point you have to play noita it solves that exact problem. And by understanding the core spells of that game and combining them together you can create wands that destroy the entire world in a click. Wonderful game.
*Ultima Underworld: The Stygian Abyss* (1992) also has a system of combining runes to cast different spells. As you find new runes you get access to spells you didn’t have before, which is a cool way to reward exploration.
WOW I love that demo of the FMV on the TV model!
Good luck on your new project!! I absolutely adore the idea that you have, about having basic magic that you build up to create unique spells! Looking forward to more content regarding it in the future~
I've had a similar idea that I've messed around with in pen and paper, and been hoping to try it in a video game as well. Really curious to see if we end up having any overlap in ideas!
Your game idea reminds me of Magicka. In that game you combine basic elemental powers to cast different spells. Glad to hear you are developing an original game.
Also the wizard in the "Gauntlet" remake
you are great james, love to hear updates about what you’re working on
A sponser. Glad to see this project being supported.
*sponsor
*sponsor
That is such a cool concept for a game, and the snippet we've seen looks gorgeous. So evocative of the best art of that era.
That new project looks super cool! I'm really excited to see how it turns out!
Really exciting new project. Already looking forward to seeing more about it.
Hey man I found your channel via your Portal64 project but am excited to see the new projects you do. Awesome this development isn't getting you down too much.
I love that low poly scenes, with fake lighting using vertex colors.
You've done such an incredible job with this project. Maybe an anonymous person with incredible skills like yours might pick up where you left off - you never know. Thank You!
Love hearing about this. Im excited to see your work in the future.
Ive also been working on my own game.
your new game looks dope! keep up the good work, James!
Magician’s Quest on DS actually used your Idea before hand like 1:1 but I’m gonna love seeing your take on it in your game!
An indie game rec: Super Kiwi 64! The studio is a solo dev - Siactro is Marcus Thorn - they're dedicated to creating N64 inspired collectathon experiences. I had a blast playing Super Kiwi, and I think fans of you would appreciate it too.
Good luck with the new game. The spell mixing concept sounds fun, it reminds me of the elemental spell system they had in the Magicka series of games.
So the new game idea is fantastic, and I'm excited to see where it goes! Customizing spells is always a cool feature even when it's more base level than your idea, so that seems like a really solid idea that I'd love to see get completed!
But speaking on Portal 64, I don't honestly get how they could police you if you're not using LibUltra anymore. Who cares if it can run on the N64 hardware or an N64 emulator? I don't understand under what legal grounds they could legally stop you if it was no longer using LibUltra.
Love the growth of your channel!!
Best of luck man. Looking forward to your success.
Excited to see your progress on your new game! I also loved the shoutout for Let’s Revolution. Great indie title.
I am here for anything you make. You are brilliant. :)
The new game looks awesome! Really cool idea to shout out a game at the end of your videos
New game preview looks super good, cannot wait!
Good luck on next project!
Portal 64 may have not been saved, but the legacy that was built upon it will live on.
you earned yourself a subscriber, looking forward to your game !
3:29 Lets all love lain
the fact valve said they were worried they couldn't "track the project" because it would effectively just be a ROM doesn't track for me, Micro Mages is available thru Steam and it's also a just a ROM and an emulator. I understand it's their IP, but I would like to know what about that bothers them. Either way, it seems like it just wouldn't have been worth the effort, so I'm glad you're moving onto something new, it looks fantastic
I would love to see this project revived but understand if it never is. Much respect for how you’re handling the situation. Love the content. I also have a YT channel (not this account) and I have to ask - is that your script on your legs? I’ve tried a teleprompter as well as your approach (presumably) and I’ve found benefits and drawbacks to both. Hoping I just get better at winging it the longer I do this 😂
It happens that the description given for the new game aligns with something I have been intermittently searching for. In my personal ideal world you would be able to bind each of the spell runes to a controller button and chain inputs together in a combo with generous timing while simultaneously being able to control the characters movement. This sort of thing could be used in both combat where enemies are appreaching you and movement and timing based puzzles. I think this would result in a system that feels both versatile and fluid.
It’s a shame that portal 64 has to be cancelled but your new project looks sick! Can’t wait to see this idea come to life
Also I have one Indi game I would like to suggest covering and that is BloodDome 99, a stylised roguelike with a unique levelling system that looks like it would be right at home in an 80’s era arcade, it’s really fun but deserves more love and is also getting updates from the devs to add new powers and make it as good as possible. I feel the devs would highly appreciate this publicity and it might encourage them to keep making the game better and better :)
Oh man, you'd love the casting system in Arx Fatalis
The rune system is really cool. Ultima Underworld has a similar rune mechanic, but it is very clunky to change spells and there aren't a ton of viable combinations of runes. But, it feels awesome finding a new rune and experimenting with it. Would recommend looking at it for ideas.
I really hope so. I was really excited to see this finished
1:05 At this point, without having ever heard of the thing you bring up next sentence, I very confidently said “but someone’s already done that”. Because of course they had.
Really excited to see what you can accomplish.
the game looks so cool can’t wait to see more
Looking forward to that wizard game, it looks nice. That spells thing you mentioned reminded me of the game Noita, it has that "make your own spells" idea, in a way.
Stay strong . Just see the concept you did on portal 64 is already huge and show your skills. Making your own ip sounds very nice
I loved Lost Magic on the DS so that magic shaping feature seems right up my alley
Really really cool to see libdragon implement stack unwinding for its crash handler! ^^
As much as it sucks to accept at times, especially in cases like this where significant work has already gone into the project, props to you for seeing the risks involved and acting appropriately. I guess it's probably like asking for a unicorn to hope Nintendo ever open-sources Libultra or offers reasonable licensing terms that an individual could stomach, but it's always heartening to see a dev shine a spotlight on all the adjacent work being done in an area. With any luck, maybe this can inspire more to contribute to these projects and get closer to a ground-up reimplementation of the features needed without any Libultra components, at least to help people down the line avoid running into these showstoppers.
By any chance, is the magic system of that new game inspired by a Minecraft mod named Ars Nouveau?
Excited for your magic game. Arx Fatalis is a longtime favourite of mine, but few other games dare to take this approach. Tibia, kind of. Ultima, I've heard. Arx at least had "hidden spells" that you had to discover through understanding the system and I've craved that ever since
6:25 - sounds like 3D Magicka, I'm game
i had my own ideas to make a similar magic system, good luck!
love the idea for your game, cant way to see where it goes
When the new game comes out if you buy a cart would you let us download the rom too? I like having everything on my flash cart and not having to dump it would be easier.
nice stuff. New game sounds neat.
Reminds me of Psi & Hexcasting, 2 of my favorite minecraft mods with complex spell crafting systems.
Would reccomend checking them out for possibly ideas
(Psi being tile based where tiles can point to adjacent tiles & have a flow order based on location in addition to theire connections, & hexcasting being stack & writing lots of symbols to memorize on a triangle / hexagonal based grid, I still have many of the symbols memorized & love it artistically.
Thinking about robust magic systems, something that made Mass Effect's biotics systems feel so good and work so well is that the entire system works on one fundamental rule: dump ions into Eezo, create a mass effect field. Mass effect fields manipulate kinetic energy levels by distorting the "mass effect" (space magic buzz word) of a, well, mass. It would be neat to build from scratch a magic system with one simple rule like that.
Have you seen the wand building in Noita? Thats awesome in how it can change your spells.
The game Magicka has the mechanic of combining elements to create spells, there’s no limit on casting. It might be worth checking into to see if there’s any overlap with your game mechanics.
The new game sounds fun!! I already wanna share it with my D&D friends 😁
If you've never played magicka, go play it, it's the concept of mixing runes and may help with inspiration and ways to do it.
That sucks that you won't be able to complete the game, however it was really cool to be able to look at it! Great job, and we look forward to whatever you can build next.
Also it would be cool if you got permission from another company (if not valve) to do a remake of a more modern game on the 64. I think it would still be cool to see.
will you package your game as a standalone with an emulator runtime around to, like, sell it on steam? The rom would still be there for those to flash it onto a cardridge but everyone else yould just go and play right from steam.
Recently fell in love with Lunacid and Pseudoregalia, so seeing an original game inspired by/for 5th gen consoles warms my heart.
6:22 That's so Magicka
Great game, it's a good idea to take inspiration from it !
So excited for the magician game! I agree that magic in most games feels empty, but what you've shown so far seems lile it'd be really fun!
Your spell system kind of reminds me of the game loom. A point-and-click adventure game developed by Lucas and created by Brian Moriarty. It's interface with music based, so every "verb"in the game was essentially a spell he would cast by playing specific notes in order. And every time the game taught you a new spell you would have to figure out what the spell was and write the notes down in the included spell book. Maybe for a physical release you could include a mock spell book with a section to allow players to write down the spells they get in the game.
I will definitely buy your new game. No question!!
The rune combination effect reminds me of Lost Magic on Nintendo DS! You'd draw sequences of runes with the stylus to combine their effects.
Among the chaos, there is a silver lining after all. Excited to see what is to come!
I adore the wizard idea. I'm really glad you're still going to do development on the N64
The new game sounds really cool!
I really enjoyed Let's Revolution! Such elegant puzzle design.
Noita is the obvious comparison of a spell system like that, though I also enjoyed the detective game Case of the Golden Idol which also featured puzzles around magic runes.
To me, your game concept sounds a lot like Magicka, which I loved as I kid, so I'm excited!
That's a nice game you're developing. I really wish there were more games with magic spell development.
Have you played Arx Fatalis for the PC? The magic system you describe for your upcoming game reminds me of that.
Imagine if Miyamoto received a parcel one day, and it was a Portal64 cartridge made just for him. Maybe then he'd have a chat with Valve.
very very cool love it love it love it!!!! best wishes!