Professional heat treater and machinist here. I ALWAYS oversize threaded holes prior to hardening because when you harden steel it expands, thus making the holes smaller. You can look up expansion rates for 4130 or whatever you are working with. The long version of the story is when you heat your annealed or “stress relieved” part, the soft pearlite steel, which is a face centered cubic atomic structure, changes into a austenitic phase, and goes into a body centered cubic atomic structure. You then quench, trapping the carbon atom inside the iron lattice, making it stay in it’s expanded, body centered cutic, martensitic structure and phase, thus making the steel expand on an atomic level. Additionally the oxidized layer of steel after it is heated is thick enough to interfere with fine threads, sou you may need to use a dremel wire wheel to clean off the oxidation or “scale”. I also want to mention that flood coolant makes a huge difference with tool life, so I highly recommend you use it more often despite the mess, smell, and vapors. If you want to truly understand the mechanical properties of steel look up Professor Harshad “Harry” Bhadeshia on his TH-cam channel. The man is a compendium of steel knowledge.
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair Our Tool&Die shop would always oversize tap (each tap itself is marked GH3 GH4 GH5 etc. indicating increasingly larger oversized taps for difficult tool steel metals like D-2 , S-7, H-13. that are to be heat treated. Different type heat treating can leave some residue especially inside of threads. Other heat treating in different atmospheres, followed by tempering can shrink or distort internal threads.
I'm a Toolmaker of 42 years and enjoyed your video. I too do in-house heat treating and would suggest a 3 dimensional figure 8 for your quenching so while doing a figure 8 you also raise and lower the part. Also confirm if the oil at an 11 second quench should be pre-heated for 4130 and make sure you allowed your part to reach 1575 by allowing it to soak at that temperature based on it's thickness as per o/a dimension. If there is slight distortion you can skim the mating contact face and relevant diameters IF required with CBN in the lathe even if it's 62rc if you don't have grinding capabillities. Great job and cheers.
Awesome job!! Wow... and you did the heat treat perfectly, just as good as any shop you'd send it out to. You mentioned you were wishing it was more violent with flames when quenching for content purposes, but you actually don't want this. The flames only happen if you don't fully dunk the part in the oil (such as the shank of a knife you are holding not going into the oil). Since you did it properly where you dipped even your pliers into the oil it does not make any flames, which is a good thing! Excellent stuff!
I very much appreciate your non traditional approach from painting the equipment to your machining! Cutting Edge Engineering and you are my favorite videos!
I fully agree with you! Interesting! The editing is perfect when it comes to fast forward during repetitive operations. We have enough time to appreciate the procedures while not getting bored by it. Karen at CEE does the same in her video editing. I love that!
Excellent video, explanation of where you’re going with the project, great editing, you do a very nice job and the craftsmanship is very good, top notch. You’re a very skilled craftsman. Thank. You. We’re watching from Missouri.
You keep doing what you are doing. The more you step outside your comfort zone. The more you gain confidence and experience, the more you will gain confidence and experience. You definitely made a much more part than factory. You should probably polish the mating cerfises before assembly. With your part being harder than the handle, it'll act like a file to the other mating surface. Great job making the machine better than factory.
Excellent video, awesome machine work and a great job of videoing and editing! You have become one of my top five TH-cam channels. Thank you for making the time to produce so many very interesting videos.
Your process narration and the video were great. I enjoy listening, watching and learning with your processes. I appreciate your sharing the content very much. Thank you very much.
It’s why I love your channel as you do my favorite things, machine stuff and 3D print things. Swore I’d never have a need for a printer and now I own three of them.
I thought of half a dozen ways to cut those bevels before you said how you were going to do it. I never considered the nod on my mill. I never touch it, I guess I'm going to have to start broadening my repertoire a bit, lol. Beautiful job.
Me either I seem to be scared to do it I tried with 45 chamfer mill but it is a big cut lots of tool pressure. Nodding the head was worth it. Got to use side of cutter which works better.
You mentioned that you didn't know if the steel had been stress relieved, but it has been annealed. Stress releasing is when the steel is heated and cooled to specify temperatures and over different lengths of times. Annealing goes further then the stress relief process by allowing it to cool over as long a time as possible. If the steel has been annealed, the stress relief is kinda built into the annealing, so you that's not going to be an issue. The thing to remember is that the moment you start working the steel, you're taking it away from that nice "soft" annealed straight, which means that whether it's been stress relieved or not, you have to do it before hardening the steel.
OK, that makes some sense. Yeah I was doing a lot of reading online ahead of time and it looks like on dimensional critical parts. People recommended stress relieving multiple times throughout the machining process so what you’re saying makes sense. It also seems like it may not be necessary to relieve in the beginning then, that may be a waste of time. That is if it is annealed. I guess where it may make some senses where the material properties are more vauge
Excellent video, Love your videos, Sir. Thank you very much for all that you do.Was wondering if you ever have shown the grinder you used for the internal bore, before ? It looked interesting.
A Maintenance Machinist where I used to work arranged a heat treating set up so he could heat treat parts & tooling he made because the "official" Heat Treat Shop always pushed his work to the bottom of the list so they could get "production" parts out the door. I can't remember the details, but he definitely pre-heated his oil so that "cold" oil wouldn't shock the parts when quenched & tempered. He even had a thermometer in the oil so he knew exactly what its temperature was. I knew him well and know that he wouldn't fool with pre-heating the oil if it didn't improve his results. Perhaps that extra step would help with at least some future jobs?
There is information in my old Machierys Handbok on cutting that style of clutch. Though I think it assumes you are using a horizontal mill with an angled-face cutter.
Great tip for removing scale out of heat treated threads is to get a screw of matching threads, just hand grind a chunk/ relief off the leading edges approximately half the diameter of the screw,an about the same along the length, run this thru your holes and you'll see the crap that it removes,was that a form tap i seen you using?
I was fortunate to stumble into your channel a couple weeks ago and have found it enjoyable and useful. Nice machining work on this one. I am curious to know why you considered heat treatment necessary for the AISI 4130 chromoly replacement part. It seems to me that if the failed cast iron part lasted say, 30 years that the chromoly one could go as long without it. Do you think that hardening needed due to the material that it engages?
Probably not, more so I wanted to minimize wear on the dogs. The front of the dogs are worn on the two machines that I’ve looked at and also I just wanted an excuse to try some heat treating.
There is so much metallurgy knowledge needed as part of being a machinist. How many years of schooling and OTJ training have you completed to get to where you are?
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair Okay. It’s obvious that you did not wake up one morning and all of a sudden you were a machinist. Did you apprentice under someone?
@@dougeing6521 no I did not. Your right I did not wake up one morning and become a machinist. I learned through trial and error over several years I have no formal training or mentor. I wish I did
Just a little suggestion for someone who is looking to save money ordering material, specifically solid steel off cuts. Get into the habit of trepaning versus drilling (mostly on your Lathe(s) whenever possible, to make shop drops instead of chips! That trepaned core you just saved from sweeping chips off the floor, could be just the size and material you need for that next job? Over a period of time, trepanning with different steels and gaining the resulting accumulated sizes waitng on your steel rack, could be EXTRA profit earned! OR even sometimes the profit itself if underbid.
Regarding Rockwell C hardness: If you are getting 16-18 HRC, you are on the wrong scale. C scale is useful from 30-70 HRC, anything belowe that you are better with Brinell scales.
great video and camera shots...was that an indexer u used to mill the scallops out? Also one request when u can mention it is the speeds and feeds of the milling operations so i can get a sense of what u are using. this would help me in my own machining.
I’m really loving this boring mill project, Kyle. Thanks for taking us along for the ride. I really appreciate the context you give as to why you make certain design or machining decisions. Great stuff!! PS We need Vanover merch!
Heat treating is a black hole. Once you get sucked in, its over. Basically every alloy behaves very differently. For some steels like O1 it does make absolutely zero sense to temper them down because its also thoughest when its hard. While for others its absolutely essential because it'll shatter when you look at it the wrong way when untempered. Its a very interesting niche.
Love the work you do. A reason they MAY have made it our of CI is so that it is self lubricating. Steel on CI. You now have steel on steel (I think) and so you will probably need to provide some lubrication to it. Perhaps something dry like graphite powder would work.... Also the tap you used was fine as you were hand tapping and so could stop when you felt resistance. But that type of tap is typically for through holes as it pushes the chip ahead of the tap. A hand tap keeps it in the groove and a machine tap moves it to the back of the tap
Kyle, I have made it to minute 38:00 and I lost count as to how many times you have said that dimensions or tolerances did not matter on what ever you were measuring. Is there any features of the parts you are making that dimensions matter. I am new to machining so trying to learn from "you, CEE, ABOM79" etc.
On this part really only the bore is critical. Critical is relative term. If it’s 1-5thou I call it critical if it’s 10+ thou either way I call it non-critical
Awesome job Kyle. Very interesting project . The part turned out very nice . You now have a new subscriber all the way from the Scottish Highlands here in the UK
As someone who works with resin printers and the traditional FDM style every day for my own company. On any printer you need to account for shrinking. For your parts, a few thow won't change much. But I don't want some poor dude taking your advice to print parts and use them to measure from and cut something critical slightly too small. I may mention that in a video to not forget to account for shrinkage.
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair I imagine you do but someone starting out will not understand this. It may be obvious to you and I but a large amount of people do not understand this. I see it all the time where people order stuff from us without spec sheets and leave the tolerance slot blank in our form was just saying a 10-second "be careful prints shrink ever so slightly so make sure to compensate" may save some new backyard machinist a costly mistake. A mistake like that could leave someone unfamiliar with this kind of work to blame equipment or even drop the hobby.
Only advice I would give is....use your speed range more.... Drilling with HSS should never turn any swarf blue and countersinking should always be low speed high feed. But, otherwise well done dude.
Awesome work, my friend. I work on old Rovers in SLC and can't say how many times having some basic machining skills would save my bacon. Your explanation and attention to detail lets me at least get a ballpark understanding of what goes on and how some problems could be solved from the perspective of a machinist instead of a mechanic.
Really good video. I think you are going in the right direction with doing in-house heat treatment. The benefits far outweigh any potential downside. In this case you knocked it out of the park, and that should provide sense of pride and satisfaction. But the long term investment in yourself is priceless. Good on you ! You probably going to look back and wonder why you were hesitant, thats another learning experience entirely. Ps. My uncle was real old school, from another world almost. His peers made everything in-house, EVERYTHING! Think Leonard Lee and men like him. North America seemed to loose manufacturing, but I think things are going back the other way. Many new small foundaries today, which used to be very common. With new machines and guys like you, I see a very bright future for North America manufacturing . The part you fabricated was new old stock $7k, I would think you could setup to make a run of XX # and make a profit. But I think it demonstrates this work has a big future especially if 75 years of IC engine production is lacking support.
In the interest of better understanding machining since my limited knowledge is with some tig welding, machining on a 10" lathe and a benchtop mill, my instant concern and thought when you mentioned going from cast iron to steel was risking vibration , was that ever a thought/concern?
Hello Kyle, would you be able to list the link of the tool used to measure the hardness of the part in 54:13 ? Thanks in advance. Keep it up with your content. Huge follower
Great video! I'm curious if there was a specific reason you choose not to center drill for the tail stock center but rather used the center with a pusher plate?
Consider necking down the screws that hold the dogs in place. If you crash the spindle, something is going to break and it may as well be the screws. RTV the screw heads, though, so they don't fall out of their counterbores and get into the ring gear
Interesting. Well done! A high standard - that is getting to be normal. Why did/do you put that block at the end where you normally put a hole. Was it because you cut that piece off? there was another piece that you also cut off, what are you going to do with them?
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair To explain my questions I'll give you the time so that you can see what I am asking about. 1) 12:09 why the block? 2) 24:41 I don't know what it is called but the way you removed it I thought that you might be keeping it. 3) 39:23 again the way that you removed it I thought it was so to keep it.
That's common practice, it's so you can use the tail stocking to help support the weight of a large work piece without center drilling it. This technique is also used in pressure turning thin parts that can't be chucked.
Great job Kyle, that has come out perfectly. A nice bit of awkward machining in those angular clutch dogs too and pretty good for a first attempt ( I don't count the practice runs!)
I think because he rough faced that end because he was turning that end into a spigot to chuck it the other way around. The puck has a taper and with the cone of the center, it can adjust for slight imperfections in the rough facing. The workpiece was quite heavy at that stage so the puck helped spread the force over a larger area.
"Pressure Pad" or "Drive Puck" or some mangled combination of those words is what it's called. 😂😂 It kinda depends on who you ask and how old they are I guess. Any, that is just something you use to help hold a large or heavy work piece securely without drilling a center hole. You can also use them for pressure turning thin material where chucking it would crush it.
Great work on the piece and the video. For me, tapping holes are the part that scares me the most. I hate to go through all that work and end up ruining a part because a tap broke!
Yes Sir, we've all been there. The worst part is breaking the tap on the last hole. Sadly, mathematically, for a variety of reasons, that is always where the tap has the highest probability of breaking....
Maybe it was I thought roll taps looked a bit different but I am not an expert. I mostly use gun taps and spiral taps but in smaller sizes that’s what I had on hand so that’s what I used. I’ll look into that though your probably right
You seem to be keeping possible future owners of the machine in mind while you make these parts. That's another reason why i said your like a seasoned machinist. My father was a machinist. Tool and die maker to be exact. He did teach me about that. I see you playing with the part😜. hard not to get creative when hogging off material. lol
Yeah indeed. Of everyone respects themselfs and others we move forward as a society. When we keep pushing problems off on the next guy it just creates long term issues. If possible I like to stop those issues so the buck stops with me lol.
Great job on the tapper work (sorry about the pucker factor) Now, i'm back to getting out a Lexus crank bolt, that a VERY nice person somewhere used Loctite, So far we are on a 8' pipe cheater, No luck !
Why are you reinventing the wheel?! The drive dogs on the clutch are used to protect the gear train from over stress, and the cast iron part is hard by virtue of work hardening(essentially the peening of the surface by percussion loading), so making an ENTIRELY H&T steel alternative is adding NO value to the machine? BTW the component is cast iron, as it requires self(dry) lubrication.to minimise static friction........ Soz, I'm triggered, just like when people scrape lathe beds instead of saddle ways etc.... ie. Just because one can do something, does not mean that one NEEDS to, especially in machine tool rebuilding! Keep safe and well. 👍😮😮
OK, so I'm going to give you some advice on the many GREAT videos you generate. PLEASE know that this is constructive. Try to avoid the speaking cadence trap that too many speakers fall into. If you listen to yourself you will notice that your speaking cadence has a pattern instead of sounding natural. Typically there will be a point you are making (you and SO MANY others) and you will have a lilt on the last word of the first 2-4 sentences and a natural ending to the last word of the final sentence. Then this rhythm starts again in your next speaking point. Just let the words flow as if you were speaking with a normal conversational tempo. Watch abomb79, Keith Fenner, Keith Rucker and other people with years of experience. You are doing an outstanding job and I am looking for to watching your continued success. Remember, it's better to sound smart then be smart.
@VanoverMachineAndRepair and each time you grind them to sharpen them unless you reharden the material you're just grinding metal together not really drilling , but I guess if you want to buy a lot of tooling it's up to you it's your money .......just saying.......
Professional heat treater and machinist here. I ALWAYS oversize threaded holes prior to hardening because when you harden steel it expands, thus making the holes smaller. You can look up expansion rates for 4130 or whatever you are working with. The long version of the story is when you heat your annealed or “stress relieved” part, the soft pearlite steel, which is a face centered cubic atomic structure, changes into a austenitic phase, and goes into a body centered cubic atomic structure. You then quench, trapping the carbon atom inside the iron lattice, making it stay in it’s expanded, body centered cutic, martensitic structure and phase, thus making the steel expand on an atomic level. Additionally the oxidized layer of steel after it is heated is thick enough to interfere with fine threads, sou you may need to use a dremel wire wheel to clean off the oxidation or “scale”. I also want to mention that flood coolant makes a huge difference with tool life, so I highly recommend you use it more often despite the mess, smell, and vapors. If you want to truly understand the mechanical properties of steel look up Professor Harshad “Harry” Bhadeshia on his TH-cam channel. The man is a compendium of steel knowledge.
Wow great tips thanks
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair Our Tool&Die shop would always oversize tap (each tap itself is marked GH3 GH4 GH5 etc. indicating increasingly larger oversized taps for difficult tool steel metals like D-2 , S-7, H-13. that are to be heat treated.
Different type heat treating can leave some residue especially inside of threads. Other heat treating in different atmospheres, followed by tempering can shrink or distort internal threads.
"Probably not necessary, but I am doing things to the best of my ability." If only more people thought that way our world would be different.
Agreed 100%
Great job! You're right to be proud of your work. It must be satisfying to be able to repair your own equipment using your own skills in your shop.
It definitely is, thanks!
Very enjoyable to watch and your level of skill and attention to details is spot on.
Well done. 👍
Thank you very much!
I'm a Toolmaker of 42 years and enjoyed your video. I too do in-house heat treating and would suggest a 3 dimensional figure 8 for your quenching so while doing a figure 8 you also raise and lower the part. Also confirm if the oil at an 11 second quench should be pre-heated for 4130 and make sure you allowed your part to reach 1575 by allowing it to soak at that temperature based on it's thickness as per o/a dimension. If there is slight distortion you can skim the mating contact face and relevant diameters IF required with CBN in the lathe even if it's 62rc if you don't have grinding capabillities. Great job and cheers.
Thank you I appreciate the advice
Awesome job!! Wow... and you did the heat treat perfectly, just as good as any shop you'd send it out to. You mentioned you were wishing it was more violent with flames when quenching for content purposes, but you actually don't want this. The flames only happen if you don't fully dunk the part in the oil (such as the shank of a knife you are holding not going into the oil). Since you did it properly where you dipped even your pliers into the oil it does not make any flames, which is a good thing!
Excellent stuff!
Appreciate it thank you
I very much appreciate your non traditional approach from painting the equipment to your machining! Cutting Edge Engineering and you are my favorite videos!
I fully agree with you! Interesting! The editing is perfect when it comes to fast forward during repetitive operations. We have enough time to appreciate the procedures while not getting bored by it. Karen at CEE does the same in her video editing. I love that!
Thanks guys I wish I had more help editing I have been a one man band the last three months my editor is taking some time off.
Add 'Snowball Engineering' also. Another hands on business. Was referred to him by 'Watch Wes Work', see what he does.
@@lawrencewillard6370 I forgot to mention Snowball
@@lawrencewillard6370 like me some snow ball
Excellent video, explanation of where you’re going with the project, great editing, you do a very nice job and the craftsmanship is very good, top notch. You’re a very skilled craftsman. Thank. You. We’re watching from Missouri.
Appreciate that! Glad you liked it.
You keep doing what you are doing. The more you step outside your comfort zone. The more you gain confidence and experience, the more you will gain confidence and experience. You definitely made a much more part than factory. You should probably polish the mating cerfises before assembly. With your part being harder than the handle, it'll act like a file to the other mating surface. Great job making the machine better than factory.
Good call thank you.
Excellent video, awesome machine work and a great job of videoing and editing! You have become one of my top five TH-cam channels. Thank you for making the time to produce so many very interesting videos.
That’s really kind of you to say
Your process narration and the video were great. I enjoy listening, watching and learning with your processes. I appreciate your sharing the content very much.
Thank you very much.
Thank you so much!
It’s why I love your channel as you do my favorite things, machine stuff and 3D print things. Swore I’d never have a need for a printer and now I own three of them.
Haha I get it I got one and I want a few more but I don’t really know why
You should be proud. Well done. Thanks for the video
I am thanks
I thought of half a dozen ways to cut those bevels before you said how you were going to do it. I never considered the nod on my mill. I never touch it, I guess I'm going to have to start broadening my repertoire a bit, lol. Beautiful job.
Me either I seem to be scared to do it I tried with 45 chamfer mill but it is a big cut lots of tool pressure. Nodding the head was worth it. Got to use side of cutter which works better.
Well done. Well explained and presented. Thanks, Jer
Thanks Jer!
Very well done,admire your skills and great understanding, impressed,well done.
Thanks appreciate it
another great Vanover Machine video!
I appreciate it
I have to thank the algo for showing me your channel. First time here and subscribed and notified! Great stuff.
Thanks for checking it out
Great video. Job well done.
I appreciate it.
You mentioned that you didn't know if the steel had been stress relieved, but it has been annealed. Stress releasing is when the steel is heated and cooled to specify temperatures and over different lengths of times. Annealing goes further then the stress relief process by allowing it to cool over as long a time as possible. If the steel has been annealed, the stress relief is kinda built into the annealing, so you that's not going to be an issue. The thing to remember is that the moment you start working the steel, you're taking it away from that nice "soft" annealed straight, which means that whether it's been stress relieved or not, you have to do it before hardening the steel.
OK, that makes some sense. Yeah I was doing a lot of reading online ahead of time and it looks like on dimensional critical parts. People recommended stress relieving multiple times throughout the machining process so what you’re saying makes sense. It also seems like it may not be necessary to relieve in the beginning then, that may be a waste of time. That is if it is annealed. I guess where it may make some senses where the material properties are more vauge
...btw i love to see the broaching and shots on the big press. I have some broaching to do and it shows me that the manual press is the way to go.
Yeah those are sexy shots
Excellent video, Love your videos, Sir. Thank you very much for all that you do.Was wondering if you ever have shown the grinder you used for the internal bore, before ? It looked interesting.
Not yet it’s a cheap long neck Pnuematic die grinder.
A Maintenance Machinist where I used to work arranged a heat treating set up so he could heat treat parts & tooling he made because the "official" Heat Treat Shop always pushed his work to the bottom of the list so they could get "production" parts out the door. I can't remember the details, but he definitely pre-heated his oil so that "cold" oil wouldn't shock the parts when quenched & tempered. He even had a thermometer in the oil so he knew exactly what its temperature was. I knew him well and know that he wouldn't fool with pre-heating the oil if it didn't improve his results. Perhaps that extra step would help with at least some future jobs?
Yeah I have also seen that somewhere as well.
There is information in my old Machierys Handbok on cutting that style of clutch. Though I think it assumes you are using a horizontal mill with an angled-face cutter.
Interesting let me know what page it’s on
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair Page 571 of the 12th edition.
Great tip for removing scale out of heat treated threads is to get a screw of matching threads, just hand grind a chunk/ relief off the leading edges approximately half the diameter of the screw,an about the same along the length, run this thru your holes and you'll see the crap that it removes,was that a form tap i seen you using?
Thank you for the tip. I’m kind of thinking I was using a form tap on accident without knowing it.
merece um like, muito bem feito, é um artesão!
Thank you
I was fortunate to stumble into your channel a couple weeks ago and have found it enjoyable and useful. Nice machining work on this one. I am curious to know why you considered heat treatment necessary for the AISI 4130 chromoly replacement part. It seems to me that if the failed cast iron part lasted say, 30 years that the chromoly one could go as long without it. Do you think that hardening needed due to the material that it engages?
Probably not, more so I wanted to minimize wear on the dogs. The front of the dogs are worn on the two machines that I’ve looked at and also I just wanted an excuse to try some heat treating.
There is so much metallurgy knowledge needed as part of being a machinist. How many years of schooling and OTJ training have you completed to get to where you are?
Zero I am self taught
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair Okay. It’s obvious that you did not wake up one morning and all of a sudden you were a machinist. Did you apprentice under someone?
@@dougeing6521 no I did not. Your right I did not wake up one morning and become a machinist. I learned through trial and error over several years I have no formal training or mentor. I wish I did
Just a little suggestion for someone who is looking to save money ordering material, specifically solid steel off cuts. Get into the habit of trepaning versus drilling (mostly on your Lathe(s) whenever possible, to make shop drops instead of chips! That trepaned core you just saved from sweeping chips off the floor, could be just the size and material you need for that next job?
Over a period of time, trepanning with different steels and gaining the resulting accumulated sizes waitng on your steel rack, could be EXTRA profit earned! OR even sometimes the profit itself if underbid.
Yes, I want to get into tree panning but I need to make some custom tooling. I just haven’t got there yet.
Well done Kyle. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks Randy
Regarding Rockwell C hardness: If you are getting 16-18 HRC, you are on the wrong scale. C scale is useful from 30-70 HRC, anything belowe that you are better with Brinell scales.
👍
great video and camera shots...was that an indexer u used to mill the scallops out? Also one request when u can mention it is the speeds and feeds of the milling operations so i can get a sense of what u are using. this would help me in my own machining.
Super spacer. Honestly best way to learn is by feel. I have no idea what I run I just do what feels right.
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair makes sense thanks for the feed back
I’m really loving this boring mill project, Kyle. Thanks for taking us along for the ride. I really appreciate the context you give as to why you make certain design or machining decisions. Great stuff!! PS We need Vanover merch!
Yeah I know I need a pateron too. Got a list of stuff to do.
Heat treating is a black hole. Once you get sucked in, its over. Basically every alloy behaves very differently. For some steels like O1 it does make absolutely zero sense to temper them down because its also thoughest when its hard. While for others its absolutely essential because it'll shatter when you look at it the wrong way when untempered. Its a very interesting niche.
Yeah I am with you on that
Nice job
Thanks!
Excellent work and explanation. Thank you.
You are welcome!
I typically use my 3 flute Guhring taps to clean holes in material that's in the low 40c scale range.
That’s good to know
You can do the heat treat with screws inside the tapped holes to prevent the scale getting there.
Excellent idea
Do you have a link to the hardness tester you used?
I don’t but it’s a leeb style Chinese clone on eBay. Quick Google search will bring it up it’s blue about 150$
Do you trust those calipers to the tenths? Nice parts man!
Nope I use micrometers off camera a lot
Good work and video too. Your channel is becoming my favorite machinery video to watch and learn from.
Wow, thanks! I appreciate that
Love the work you do. A reason they MAY have made it our of CI is so that it is self lubricating. Steel on CI. You now have steel on steel (I think) and so you will probably need to provide some lubrication to it. Perhaps something dry like graphite powder would work....
Also the tap you used was fine as you were hand tapping and so could stop when you felt resistance. But that type of tap is typically for through holes as it pushes the chip ahead of the tap. A hand tap keeps it in the groove and a machine tap moves it to the back of the tap
True
Fascinating series and I enjoy watching it. But, how does that oven cook a pizza?🤣
That’s a good point I should try it I bet perfectly.
Kyle, I have made it to minute 38:00 and I lost count as to how many times you have said that dimensions or tolerances did not matter on what ever you were measuring. Is there any features of the parts you are making that dimensions matter. I am new to machining so trying to learn from "you, CEE, ABOM79" etc.
On this part really only the bore is critical. Critical is relative term. If it’s 1-5thou I call it critical if it’s 10+ thou either way I call it non-critical
Very good job! Congratulations on a job well done!
Thank you very much!
So what was the finished hardness after last heating ?
I think it was in the 30s like 36 or so
I'm worried...... Now that your making all these parts so stout, The first "jam" your motor's gonna end up lodged into the ceiling somewhere, LOL
lol yeah I get that.
Awesome job Kyle. Very interesting project . The part turned out very nice . You now have a new subscriber all the way from the Scottish Highlands here in the UK
Welcome aboard. Thank you
I really appreciate the detailed explanation of your design process. It was fascinating.
Glad you liked it!
As someone who works with resin printers and the traditional FDM style every day for my own company. On any printer you need to account for shrinking. For your parts, a few thow won't change much. But I don't want some poor dude taking your advice to print parts and use them to measure from and cut something critical slightly too small. I may mention that in a video to not forget to account for shrinkage.
I do, I scale them and measure the prints and reprint them until they are accurate.
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair I imagine you do but someone starting out will not understand this. It may be obvious to you and I but a large amount of people do not understand this. I see it all the time where people order stuff from us without spec sheets and leave the tolerance slot blank in our form was just saying a 10-second "be careful prints shrink ever so slightly so make sure to compensate" may save some new backyard machinist a costly mistake. A mistake like that could leave someone unfamiliar with this kind of work to blame equipment or even drop the hobby.
Only advice I would give is....use your speed range more....
Drilling with HSS should never turn any swarf blue and countersinking should always be low speed high feed. But, otherwise well done dude.
Thanks good points
Fantastic job. Well done
Appreciate it
Awesome work, my friend. I work on old Rovers in SLC and can't say how many times having some basic machining skills would save my bacon. Your explanation and attention to detail lets me at least get a ballpark understanding of what goes on and how some problems could be solved from the perspective of a machinist instead of a mechanic.
That’s awesome keep up the good work. Glad I could help
Great work, well done.
Many thanks!
Really good video.
I think you are going in the right direction with doing in-house heat treatment.
The benefits far outweigh any potential downside. In this case you knocked it out of the park, and that should provide sense of pride and satisfaction. But the long term investment in yourself is priceless. Good on you !
You probably going to look back and wonder why you were hesitant, thats another learning experience entirely.
Ps. My uncle was real old school, from another world almost. His peers made everything in-house, EVERYTHING!
Think Leonard Lee and men like him. North America seemed to loose manufacturing, but I think things are going back the other way.
Many new small foundaries today, which used to be very common. With new machines and guys like you, I see a very bright future for North America manufacturing .
The part you fabricated was new old stock $7k, I would think you could setup to make a run of XX # and make a profit.
But I think it demonstrates this work has a big future especially if 75 years of IC engine production is lacking support.
Yeah I probably could. Low demand I would imagine
I like your channel from the first day...always cool stuff 🤟
I appreciate that!
Good as usual, but did I miss it or what, where did you land on hardness.
Sorry I think I neglected to mention. 28-35 if I remember correctly
You learn by doing a task or job
Indeed
The piece looks alot like the compensator on a Harley Davidson crankshaft
Hmm interesting
Great work! Definitely deserves a pat on the back!
I appreciate that 👍
Kyle print out the US Navy heat treating procedures they are very detailed if you can’t find it I can send you a copy
Vanovercustoms@gmail.com send it over
sehr, sehr toller guter Job Doppeldaumen👍👍
Appreciate it
PUUURFECT! 👏
Thanks
In the interest of better understanding machining since my limited knowledge is with some tig welding, machining on a 10" lathe and a benchtop mill, my instant concern and thought when you mentioned going from cast iron to steel was risking vibration , was that ever a thought/concern?
Not really
Great job! Which hardness tester was that?
Check above comments
@@RJMachine62 answering the same question from multiple people gets repetitive
What's that tool you use for hardness testing? A name of website where you got it from, would help . Thank you
eBay. It’s a Chinese blue tester I think it was about 160$, it’s some Chinese brand.
Hello Kyle, would you be able to list the link of the tool used to measure the hardness of the part in 54:13 ? Thanks in advance. Keep it up with your content. Huge follower
I can’t post like in comments. Go on eBay type in hardness tester. It’s a copy off the 800$ leeb unit it’s blue and Chinese and about 150$
Perfect as always
I appreciate that!
Excellent work
Many thanks
What was the final hardness after tempering?
30-34rockwell
Great video! I'm curious if there was a specific reason you choose not to center drill for the tail stock center but rather used the center with a pusher plate?
I don’t remember honestly
Great work!!
I appreciate it
Brother, don’t be hard on yourself. You’re a heckuva machinist and an engineer!
Appreciate that
Nice work Kyle 👍👍👍
Thanks 👍
Kyle you made it. The Lucas get a few improvements, that is fine. You can be proud , you are a very good machinist. Greetings from Germany.
Thanks 👍
Very well done 👏
Thank you!
Great video!!!
Thank you!!
Consider necking down the screws that hold the dogs in place. If you crash the spindle, something is going to break and it may as well be the screws. RTV the screw heads, though, so they don't fall out of their counterbores and get into the ring gear
Yeah good points
Interesting. Well done! A high standard - that is getting to be normal.
Why did/do you put that block at the end where you normally put a hole. Was it because you cut that piece off? there was another piece that you also cut off, what are you going to do with them?
I am confused what time stamps are you referring to.
Thank you
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair To explain my questions I'll give you the time so that you can see what I am asking about. 1) 12:09 why the block? 2) 24:41 I don't know what it is called but the way you removed it I thought that you might be keeping it. 3) 39:23 again the way that you removed it I thought it was so to keep it.
That's common practice, it's so you can use the tail stocking to help support the weight of a large work piece without center drilling it. This technique is also used in pressure turning thin parts that can't be chucked.
Great work Kyle -
Thanks
Nice work dude
Thanks!
👍👍👍👍
What’s up, Joe? Hope your bridgeports going well.
1:39 .. I agree 100%!!! ... Soak that machine in the time of your choosing!! .. And it will forever serve you well!!
Indeed
Fantastic Kyle . Cheers from Orlando …paulie brown
Hey Paul.
Great job Kyle, that has come out perfectly. A nice bit of awkward machining in those angular clutch dogs too and pretty good for a first attempt ( I don't count the practice runs!)
Yes indeed
Question what was the puck thing you put on the live center and why? 😊~~ Cris H
I think because he rough faced that end because he was turning that end into a spigot to chuck it the other way around. The puck has a taper and with the cone of the center, it can adjust for slight imperfections in the rough facing. The workpiece was quite heavy at that stage so the puck helped spread the force over a larger area.
"Pressure Pad" or "Drive Puck" or some mangled combination of those words is what it's called. 😂😂 It kinda depends on who you ask and how old they are I guess. Any, that is just something you use to help hold a large or heavy work piece securely without drilling a center hole. You can also use them for pressure turning thin material where chucking it would crush it.
Yeah they beat me to it
Great work on the piece and the video. For me, tapping holes are the part that scares me the most. I hate to go through all that work and end up ruining a part because a tap broke!
Yeah agreed
Yes Sir, we've all been there. The worst part is breaking the tap on the last hole. Sadly, mathematically, for a variety of reasons, that is always where the tap has the highest probability of breaking....
@@shootgpI've broken a tap on the last hole a couple of times. If there is one thing I hate it is tapping blind holes.
So how many hours do you have for the project and cost?
100$ materials maybe 20 hours
What kind of tap was that? Didn't look like a normal machine or gun tap. Almost looked like a roll tap?
Yes I was thinking the same it looked like a TiN coated roll tap. Perhaps it produces a stronger thread than spiral or fluted taps ???
Maybe it was I thought roll taps looked a bit different but I am not an expert. I mostly use gun taps and spiral taps but in smaller sizes that’s what I had on hand so that’s what I used. I’ll look into that though your probably right
Roll taps don't make chips.. I saw chips
You seem to be keeping possible future owners of the machine in mind while you make these parts. That's another reason why i said your like a seasoned machinist. My father was a machinist. Tool and die maker to be exact. He did teach me about that. I see you playing with the part😜. hard not to get creative when hogging off material. lol
Yeah indeed. Of everyone respects themselfs and others we move forward as a society. When we keep pushing problems off on the next guy it just creates long term issues. If possible I like to stop those issues so the buck stops with me lol.
I am surprised you did not cut off a large chunk with a band saw leaving another piece for some other project.
Yeah that’s one approach
Nice job
Thank you
Great job on the tapper work (sorry about the pucker factor) Now, i'm back to getting out a Lexus crank bolt, that a VERY nice person somewhere used Loctite, So far we are on a 8' pipe cheater, No luck !
Thanks have fun
there is a channel where you can learn a lot, the Kurtis channel "Cutting Edge Engineering Australia"
Bump
Can you leave a link for the heat treat oven please??
Added it to description for you
@@VanoverMachineAndRepair thank you
A wiser one said, make a wooden model first. You did, 3D model is better.😊
Yes thanks
great vid! where is the rest? loving your channel
Thank you. What rest
Why are you reinventing the wheel?!
The drive dogs on the clutch are used to protect the gear train from over stress, and the cast iron part is hard by virtue of work hardening(essentially the peening of the surface by percussion loading), so making an ENTIRELY H&T steel alternative is adding NO value to the machine?
BTW the component is cast iron, as it requires self(dry) lubrication.to minimise static friction........
Soz, I'm triggered, just like when people scrape lathe beds instead of saddle ways etc.... ie. Just because one can do something, does not mean that one NEEDS to, especially in machine tool rebuilding!
Keep safe and well. 👍😮😮
👍
OK, so I'm going to give you some advice on the many GREAT videos you generate. PLEASE know that this is constructive.
Try to avoid the speaking cadence trap that too many speakers fall into. If you listen to yourself you will notice that your speaking cadence has a pattern instead of sounding natural. Typically there will be a point you are making (you and SO MANY others) and you will have a lilt on the last word of the first 2-4 sentences and a natural ending to the last word of the final sentence. Then this rhythm starts again in your next speaking point.
Just let the words flow as if you were speaking with a normal conversational tempo. Watch abomb79, Keith Fenner, Keith Rucker and other people with years of experience.
You are doing an outstanding job and I am looking for to watching your continued success.
Remember, it's better to sound smart then be smart.
Thanks for advice on how to speak
Seriously dude you're going to burn up your bits get some cooling liquid in there ......just saying.......
It’s no big deal. I re-sharpen large drills almost every time I use them. I don’t have any flood cooling on any of my machines yet one day.
@VanoverMachineAndRepair and each time you grind them to sharpen them unless you
reharden the material you're just grinding metal together not really drilling , but I guess if you want to buy a lot of tooling it's up to you it's your money .......just saying.......