How Damage Falloff is Calculated
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 พ.ค. 2024
- Exploring the implementation of damage falloff in Overwatch, how Tracer's damage falloff was broken during season 1, and some miscellaneous observations about this system.
These techniques are not unique to Overwatch, so you can apply these concepts to most other games. Furthermore, these functions are typically not hand-written and are instead abstracted away in math libraries, e.g. Mathf.Lerp() in Unity.
CORRECTION: My comment at 7:54 is not true, since Orisa did not have damage falloff in Overwatch 1. (thanks Juan Ayala)
TIMESTAMPS:
• 0:00 Introduction
• 1:00 Step 1: Distance
• 3:12 Step 2: Normalization
• 4:29 Step 3: Linear Interpolation
• 6:47 Tracer's Broken Falloff
• 7:23 Interesting Gamer Observations™
REFERENCES:
• Camera Height of Every Overwatch Hero - • Camera Height of Every...
• Overwatch Wiki - overwatch.fandom.com/wiki/Ove...
MUSIC:
• Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards
ME:
• Twitch - / marblr
• Twitter - / marblrr
Footage captured on game versions 2.1.2.0.107076 and 2.2.0.2.107804 - เกม
![[TH] VCT Pacific - Playoffs Grand Final // PRX vs GEN](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/G345ud5yRGA/mqdefault.jpg)
This felt like a math class but I loved every second of it
Are you implying you don’t like math class? -your math teacher in 8th grade
Applied mathematics
It's more programming since the math is really simple
This is what they should do in math class, yes
@@meowcow21 true
Orisa used to not have fall off either. It was only added if OW 2
oh damn. not sure how I missed this. thanks, added to the description.
@@Marblr In OW1 the real killer for Orisa's weapon was her spread along with the dumb pattern of her projectiles. Made it hard to hit far off targets even though it didn't have falloff.
she was the go-to hero when you wanted to shut down turrets and brig
*Technically* Reinhardt’s Firestrike also has no falloff, but I’m not sure we’re counting that
@@kasm7870 his normal weapon doesn't have falloff too xD
i feel like you could have made a 1 minute video by just saying it was a step function, but then realized your audience is gamers.
8:52 I have been wondering how they animated Sojourn’s backwards slide to have her legs go behind her without breaking her back. Kinda hard to see exactly in-game, but now I know!
Pause on the frames when she's about to hit the deck
I mean, she IS pretty robotic.
@@snewp_e2139 And, as rochrich showed, made out of rubber
They could’ve just had her lower torso twist backwards 180 degrees since she’s mostly cybernetic
@@RochRich.Bro, that's elastigirl shit right there.
Marblr could post a 10 hour video just reading the source code and I’d still watch it
a great voice can sell a video on its own
@Marblr, You heard 'em, start reading
The great thing about Marblr is that in addition to being a great dev with experience from what you can see, he still leaves the bubble of most devs and knows how to explain very clearly each point he is going to explain, without ''internal'' jargon of developer and knows how to communicate with the end user :D
by the way, I would love to see an explanation of how the game itself makes it easier for cheaters to appear and how they could mitigate this if the commands were not on the client side and hardware protection
He's a dev?! Of what game(s)!?
@@DatAhsan He's a dev for Marble It Up and used to be the producer for TF2.
@@0osk titanfall 2 of team fortress 2?
@@MarvelousButter OG TF2. I love titanfall but Team Fortress 2 is TF2.
His simplicity should not to be confused with a lack of understanding, he dumbs it down for us
"Baptiste is the only support with a hitscan weapon" - immediately shows Ana
Ana's noscope is a projectile, though. I assume he meant Bap was the only support with range falloff.
@@ArchSchizo yeah, I just thought the irony was funny
8:10 "Baptiste is the only support with damage falloff since he's the only one with a hitscan weapon"
*Immediately cuts to the other support with a hitscan weapon USING her hitscan weapon*
I love these videos lmao
The funny thing is that Ana most probably does have falloff as well, it's just that her impact damage is 0, but she applies a burn status effect for 70 damage over .6s
Ana does not have hitscan at all. In fact the bullet is quite slow.
Edit: I’m half right. It’s hitscan when zoomed in, projectile when not.
@@huntedperson3147 She doesn’t have falloff since like you said, it just applies a burn effect. It does have a heavy bullet drop though so you shouldn’t be doing it from far.
The projectile doesn’t do any damage though, so I don’t think it really matters
The most surprising part about this video was not just learning that Widowmaker's sniper rifle has falloff, but that S1 Sojourn's minimum railgun damage was _almost twice as high_ as Widow's minimum sniper damage.
What the heck were they thinking when they made Sojourn?
Let's nerf gengu since soj is so op! #blizzardlogic
So this proof that soljuorn is broken
They were thinking ‘how can we move more of these s1 battle passes?’
the editing here looks really neat, keep it up dude!
There is something so satisfying about learning information like this. I have like no use for it, but its cool. I love your videos
Ikr!
I’ve noticed something since overwatch 2 actually. For projectile heroes specifically, they don’t shoot from their cameras anymore like they used to, they shoot from their weapon within a very close range and, which then centers to their crosshair shortly after. It’s hard to describe, but it’s especially obvious with Torbjörn’s primary fire, since it has a trail. It shoots from the barrel of his rivet gun and will hit any objects in its path, then once it gets to the center of your screen it goes straight, basically making a turn midair. Just something i thought was interesting.
I can imagine that this is solely the visuals that behave this way. In most games, people shoot from the cameras center, but the shooting trail gets rendered from the weapons barrel towards the point they aim at. This is why if the weapon is behind an object like a wall, you can see how the trail goes through the object. They probably implemented that projectiles visuals quickly go towards where the projectiles hitbox is for visual clarity for enemys who might want to dodge the projectile
Edit: Rephrase to make it clearer
You’re to Overwatch 2 what shounic is to Team Fortress 2. I don’t even play, but the way you explain the inner workings of different mechanics is utterly captivating. Keep it up!
The quality of these videos is by far the best on this platform for any content like this. Absolutely love this
perfect for my break at work, great content!
I always find your videos helpful, thank you so much for making me understand something probably won't need it in my life, but thank you!
Bro you breakdown these concepts so well. You make everything so digestible.
Love these videos
The presentation on your videos is always phenomenal.
Hey man. Love your videos and editing style. Keep up the good work
Dude, you editing is insane! Good video
Your videos are top-notch. I can't even comprehend how much time and passion is in every second of it.
Your videos editing is so good I would love seeing you explain a wider variety of things
Only found out about you recently. Loving these videos. Even if it's something I already understand. Having it visualised helps a lot with extra understanding.
These videos are so strangely addictive, then again I love learning about weird number calculations, thanks for the vids
Hey, Marblr, have you made a video about Armor changes? The one that the damage reduction decreases as the amount of armor decreases
no, but that is a good idea! demonstrating the change visually would be great.
awesome idea dude
@@Marblr Also please check out stacking effects. I know that Ramattra block stacks with armor but I don't know how much
@@Harevald his block is a flat 75% dmg reduction, i believe it stays at 75% no matter if you have armor or nano applied, because normally dmg reduction is capped at 50%, there was a bug with doomfist, that lowered his block to 50% if he got nano, because of this rule, but its fixed now
This content is so refreshing and impressive to watch
Just seeing 90% of the comment section being praise is insane, keep it up
As always, fantastic breakdown. Super interesting stuff.
Very high quality as usual! Great work!
out with another BANGER
keep it up, dude!
Every single one of your videos is always so interesting
Top tier content as always!
These videos are absolutely fantastic. Each and every one of them.
Love your videos, also, shoutouts to the Kirby 64 music, it fits so well !
This video has greatly helped me understand game making technics, even though I havent started making 3d games (or any where close to doing so), This has greatly opened my mind to how a lot of technics work and I have since made my own damage fall off system on a 2d scale. Thank you! 🙏
I LOVE these deep dives into mechanics
7:43 “Tank heroes, on the other hand, do have projectile range falloff”
Well that aged well
Marblr is the Overwatch equivalent to Tf2's Shounic. (Or Shounic is Tf2 equivalent to Ow's Marblr, however you want to look at it.)
Both make real nice thumbnails, both have this relaxed voice when talking, both overanalyse certain game features and bugs (and why they happen) and every once in a while making fun video.
Incredibly professional video. I enjoyed it a lot!
I don’t comment very often, but damn, i’m in love with your editing dude 😍
Amazing video as always. I love the kirby 64 music so much.
And now tracer is 5.5 dmg
Your best video yet 10/10
Great video. Helpful for my game development
Your content is so amazing!
Great video as usual!
I hope you get the 1 mill play button 1 day, your videos are so good and high quality i love watching them so much
the way it calculates the percentage of the minimum and maximum damage to deal is really clever, hats off to whoever came up with it
Math but in a language I as an American can understand: firearms
Love your work 👌🏻
istg shounic and u gave educational video that burns brains but yet felt like a guilty pleasure
Thank you for this explaination .
Another banger video. He does it everytime.
another banger as always
thanks for this, great video
These videos help in game dev so much :D
Awesome as usual!:)
i love this guy
these videos are so informative and expertly designed
i even understand the tech stuff because of the way it's explained
please never stop making these kind of videos.
Amazing content as always. If I may suggest a subject for the next video is: how does the new competitive rank system works, it's still a mystery as we can't track our SR anymore, I think not even the Blizzard devs know how it works..
Great video! As always! I have a suggestion: how "headshots" are calculated for non-standards powers? Like, a few days ago, a Reinhardt "headshot me" with Earthstrike o.O
good video. one thing im missing is a list of every heroes max/min damage plus the range values like u showed with cassidy. also anas scoped in weapon is hitscan.
Conclusion. Nerf Sojourn.
If all my programming classes were explained that well, I would've actually loved coding
Godlike editing
Awesome video as always. I didn't get all the math right away but I might watch again another time, are you into maths in general or did you just got into this stuff because of the video ?
Great choice of osts for the background too. I always have a thing for Nintendo games osts in TH-cam videos. I don't know why but to me they just have something that some other background musics don't have ... Maybe because they aren't specifically made for TH-cam, yet they work great. Or probably because I just recognize them.
Anyway, very interesting stuff, I'll share it as always, hope you're doing good
I love seeing the natural TH-camr progression in which you slowly start to put more and more of your personality into your fact based videos. Very awesome ❤
my favorite video in my subscribed feed
I’m glad you posted this because i headshot a pharah with widow to 16 hp was so confused
Just sourced this video for one of my final papers, thank you for all you do Marblr
the ways these videos are structured remind me of shounic which i love
easily the most interesting overwatch youtuber
Heres 2 ideas id like to see in a video!
How does Mai's attack work? Is it a line trace with a particle thats all for show, or is it like Pyro in TF2 where the particles are supposed to be the hitboxes?
How does the spawn room collisions work? Like the door has a texture displaying where the door is, but if thats separate to a box collider in spawn, it feels always perfectly aligned. Which would be hard to do since door frames poke out alot in OW and theres no map to my knowledge where you can get the healing properties by smothering a spawn wall on the outside.
what a surprise, the damage is calculated exactly how you think it would what a great video
A small critique on the script for this video. When speaking about the normalized distance between targets you were explaining it correctly, but what was happening on screen actually lined up to be opposite of what you were saying when you were saying it. This could confuse some people and it would be better to switch it or double check the timing when talking about something similar in the future.
Super informative though. 👍🏼
You're like AsumSaus for overwatch. That is a high compliment .
Ah yes, these are totally calculations I can quickly run in my head before each shot.
Always great videos! How do you produce it ?
You are such an important part of this game. I wish you were more well supported blizzard or others !
Love these thecnical ow vids reminds me of shounic
Great explanation, was hooked right after seeing the thumbnail (no pun intended).
Also, while making in-game dynamic statistics, what do you use? I mean, workshop is removed and there is no solution on the internet to be found. At least by me
although the workshop editor is disabled, you can still import workshop codes in the custom game settings. so in a way the workshop is partially accessible.
Overwatch 2 has so many bugs that Marblr will have content forever.
fun fact, mei icicles used to have damage falloff, being the only non-tank projectile with falloff
also i had no idea tanks had falloff on their projectiles, it seemed like design-wise that was the balance tradeoff for hitscan vs projectiles. hitscan have no travel time so its easy to hit far away but to balance it they do less damage, projectiles are harder to hit at range so they do more
Regarding Tracer bug, it is very simple. If-else statement will behave as such if min and max are flipped.
If-else algorithm first checks if the current distance is OUTSIDE the linear interpolation range. If min and max are flipped, any distance is outside and either one of the edge values are always chosen, hence the sudden change. It is easy to test by taking 3 points: to the left, within, and to the right of interpolation.
What's more amusing, this can also be implemented by clamping the interpolation coefficient within 0-1 range, removing the need of in-range checks. In that case if min and max were flipped Tracer's damage falloff would have been reversed. I'd love to see how'd that play out.
This chanel is awesome
These graphics are incredible and help me visualize everything so well
wow. someone's good at explaining things
This really made me sit back and wonder why I was watching this. It's as if this was something I was going to be tested on.
My first thought was that Tracer's normalized falloff value was probably rounded to an integer by mistake
So it would suddenly go from max damage to min damage
You should do a video talking again about assists but in ow2, does doom now gets assists more often? How does kiriko’s cleanse affects the assist timers, does junkerqueen, rammattra, sojourn or kiriko get any special interactions? And now that orisas supercharger is gone, what heroes no longer have the assist privilege? It would be really intresting
Top tier math class, I love knowing how the game works even if I can't apply that
that subtle roast of landing a shot being the hardest part
That calculation is rather ingeniously designed. It might be "easier" to do something like 21 +(max damage * 1/distance) or solely like that, but youd probably need an if statement so it only takes place after the intended minimum distance. This formula saves a couple lines of code by smushing it all into one equation. Pretty cool!
Many Math libarys already have Linear Interpolation (in short Lerp) implemented as an method/function. It saves time and makes the code more readable to just write it with Lerp. Also, divisions tend to run slower than other arithmetic operations on your CPU. But this is just a small microoptimization that wont impact the game that much
Edit: He even stated what I said in the description: "These techniques are not unique to Overwatch, so you can apply these concepts to most other games. Furthermore, these functions are typically not hand-written and are instead abstracted away in math libraries, e.g. Mathf.Lerp() in Unity."
Getting a random 1 shot with a road hog right click was pretty powerful before the falloff nerf. It still did randomly 1 shot someone but much less for me.
I prefer the linear interpolation algorithm a+(b-a)*t, it’s the most straightforward to me, personally.
“Baptiste is the only one with a hitscan weapon”
>immediately shows ana scoped shots
😂😂
Im currently around the school grade where we learn this level of algebra and It's so much more refreshing seeing it used in something I love rather than a sheet of irrelevant paper
Technically Sigma’s projectiles don’t have falloff, though it’s compensated by their limited range since they explode after traveling a set distance.
I think Ramattra was excluded from the damage falloff on his projectiles because they are relatively low damage unless he’s actively pursuing you which usually only happens up close, getting hit by a stray Ramattra shot isn’t as bad as a stray Orisa shot.
Overwatch? ✅
Sorta complicated math simplified in a way that makes it easily understandable? ✅
Crystal Shards music? ✅
Now *THIS* is quality content.
Im pretty sure that no character has a minimum damage, but that there is a specific modifier of 30% of maximum (this theory coming from past patch notes in OW1 where hitscan minimum damage falloff was reduced from 50% -> 30%). Although I do believe that it literally does not matter for majority of people watching this.
Only part of this that would change would be that for the linear interpolation function, "min" would be ".3 * max" instead of a preconcieved number.
Having an overarching % instead of a set number per character saves on development time but reduces customizability, it's most probably decided that it's alright to lose this customizability as there's so many other ways to increase or decrease a characters output, should they need to.
thank you for the comment, this is entirely possible. I had a feeling they may be using a multiplier for minimum damage since Tracer's minimum damage was upped to 1.80 as her maximum damage was upped to 6.