Should Cold Steel STOP Using German 4116 Krupp?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ก.ค. 2024
- #edcgear #pocketknife #coldsteel
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Thanks for the review, Aaron. I actually have a Pocket Bushman, which is in the same 4116, and I've never had a problem with the performance. I'll also add that 4116 has big advantage for me in my always hot, always humid environment - it's SUPER resitant to corrosion. The problem though, is that the rent on this puppy is too **** high. This has been an issue since the takeover - the company keeps throwing out ridiculously high prices for knives made with budget steel like 4116 and 4034, pretty much to see if people will buy them anyway. I'm of the view that the best way for Cold Steel lovers to correct that pattern is to simply not buy overpriced, low-budget products from them. They may not hear the written complaints, but they will sho' 'nuff hear the unsold inventory.
I think you're right on that
I own the spear point version. I chose the Verdict for it's almost neutral handle, without all the pronounced finger grooves that CS typically uses on their folding knives. I also love the very simple and straight pocket clip, unlike the typical CS clips. This Verdict design is just going back to a simpler style that I tend to favor. It has performed very well at various tasks and was able to carve out a Try Stick with no problems. As for the steel, it has held its edge like new throughout the various cutting and carving jobs thrown at it over time. But I am the type that will run the edge on a honing steel after a day's worth of use to touch it up and keep it sharp. I highly recommend the Verdict for EDC use in both urban and outdoors applications. Best part is, it's easily replaceable if lost, stolen, gifted away, or confiscated, and won't break the bank if you have to.
I actually got a Range Boss in 4116 (evidently they changed from 4034 for a little while) and have been very happy with the steel. Had to sand the crap out of the spot under the clip, but a 4 inch, 3.5oz, full flat clip point for 30-some bucks is a good deal if you can find it.
My CS Verdict is in my car in the drivers side door bin and is my emergency knife in case I need to protect myself. The Verdict is small, unobtrusive, inexpensive, has the tri-ad lock, and makes a great beater/self defense knife. I got mine for $48 at BladeHQ a couple of months ago. I also wanted a blade that was 3 inches or smaller, and didn't look like it was worth much (so it wouldn't be stolen if I dropped my car in for servicing) but packed a big punch. This knife hit all the marks. I have a Dozier but it feels very cheap to me.
The voyager is also a great knife for budget and comes with better steel, usually my go to, and I gave better knives, but then I don’t own a verdict 🤷♀️
I have a custom Seax in my driver's side pocket
lol that expression about price "the world we live in" 😂 classic Aaron...so true
I've had new generation fidget friendly liner locks fail on me. So I replaced them with a Mini Recon and Verdict. Glad to hear the Verdict is tougher than most knives with handle liners, and tougher lock than liner locks.
i just don't use liner locks if i can avoid it. i've never had one fail on me, but it *feels* like it will and trust is the most important part of relying on something
Coming late to the game with this steel (just got a Pocket Bushman a couple weeks ago as my edc). Thank you for this video!
Own the clip point Verdict, it’s light, slim, and solid. Sharpens pretty easily. Comfortable to edc in casual clothes, and the pocket clip is perfect. I have the SR1 tanto and the 4max which are great for job sites, and outdoor work with gloves on. CS knives are decent tools.
Paid $45 for mines, Cold Steel Verdict makes a decent EDC knife.
I have had great results with 4116. I have been carrying the prolite for the past 2-3 years. I can't complain at all. It sharpens easily and holds an edge fairly well.
I'd go for the AUS10A but not opposed to the 4116, It's absolutely adequate for EDC tasks and I don't need to impress anyone. I'd go AUS10a simply for the fact it's just as easy to strop up or sharpen and requires that less frequently. And the Triad Lock is my all time fave!
@@RookCAF I agree totally. These
Are cheap knives. I'm serious about
Using them for rough work. Perfect
For that.
Bought several of the budget
Cold steel knives with the 4116
Steel. Very durable,non rust, and will not sharpen. Great for
Opening bags of. Fertilizer or
Manure.
I don't own one yet! But I will. Thanks for your great review and the work you put into the video! God bless you and your family!
Thank you! Really appreciate it!
Thanks for the great review as always , here in Australia they're about 149 Australian dollars so far , that's about US100 , for that much money i'd rather a CIvivi or QSP.
I use mine on thé field nearly every day. Happy with the steel and it's easy to sharpen. And at that price, difficult to find a stronger lock mechanism.
When it comes to Strength and Durability there is Nothing Like a Cold Steel Baby ...... I really like 4116 Krupp , especially on their Budget Fixed Blades because it's really easy to Sharpen , it takes a really Fine Edge , and it's a Super Rust Resistant SS ..... 👍🖖
Right on
Interesting review but still like my Mini Recon with Aus10. BTW Aaron test the Joker Avispa fixed blade if you’ve a mind to. Full tang, 3 inch Sandvik flat grind blade, Kydex sheath, about $60. I ordered one but haven’t received it yet. Wanted a small fixed blade for hiking. Hope it’s decent.
I have a clip point Mini Recon and it’s the knife I’ve settled on as my every day carry knife for work. I like it so much it’s just about taken the place of my not-at-work knives, of which I have several from Benchmade, Spyderco, Buck, etc…not to mention several Cold Steel knives, including a Code 4 (the perfect big brother to the Mini Recon). It’s a perfect sized knife for the pocket and most every day work chores. It’s not too expensive to feel comfortable putting it to work in the hands of an auto mechanic where it’s gonna get handled with greasy hands and used hard. Just today I was thinking it would be nice if they’d do a version of this knife in G10 just to upgrade it it a bit and I’d buy one for my off work knife. It looks like when the premium Verdict comes out it might fill that role. I LOVE the AUS10 steel because it holds an edge well enough it it sharpens super easy I don’t remember if you mentioned it but hopefully the premium Verdict will be AUS10 or S35VN.
I have the American Lawman. I bought it shortly after Coldsteel was bought out. It's a great knife, just like my older Coldsteel knives. My favorite Coldsteel is the Counter Point 1 it's been a great blade, and I definitely put through some hard work.
I think the aus 10 version is the one I would go with. I have the cold steel free reign and the aus 10 on it was great.
Thanks Aaron for the video. I'm still holding out for them to bring the Immortal back, but with a six (6) inch blade!
I've owned Cold Steel and they are great knives and some of the strongest on the market for sure. But they always seem overpriced for the material to me.
As a student of kali and a knife collector the coldsteel counterpoint 1 is my daily carry.
What was the button lock knife at the beginning? I have good experiences with the German 4116. The range boss and the pro lite are very good knives and especially for the price.
Thanks for the great review. I am interested in the more premium one.
Good choice!
enjoy the reviews, entertaining & informative
Glad you like them!
4116 when done right is a damn good steel, as seen on midrange kitchen knives. There is a reason why this steel is still being used despite development of fancier, higher carbide modern steels.
For the more nerdy people, 4116 is the go to for high corrosion resistance, high toughness steel on a budget. It's less expensive than basically all other stainless knife steels of the same corrosion resistance, can be fine blanked (die stamped ) so it's cheap to make and avoid heat damage from heavy grinding and laser cutting. It's also capable of getting to 60HRC but not many companies do that which is kind of a shame because it'd have kickass edge stability.
Thanks for the video
No problem!
Amazon still have some prolite in their inventory for around $30
I just purchased my first two cold steel knives. Recon one mini and the recon one micro. I really think they knocked it out of the park. I actually like the micro better for every day use. I wish they used Aus 10a. What is your opinion on 4116 steel? Thank you.
should have jumped on those xhp and bds knives when they came out. The worst part is I had just finished my preferred cold steel shock & awe collection a few months before the switch 😮💨
looks very similar to the old prolite model they had, which was $22-25, so ill take a pass on it when i can buy better knives from cold steel for about the same money, also the airlite and SR1 series is almost always on sale at midway usa, even the AD15 is $56 right now
Is it thicker or thinner then the air lite
My 4116 Krupp knives do a little better than VG10. The pocket bushman has held up better than the Canadian belt knife and Roach Belly.
I like it, but honestly the Svörd peasant knife I bought 10 years ago still serves me well everyday. Didn't think I'd like it as much as I do. If I remember right it was around $10 at the time, think it's swiss A2 tool steal, made in New Zealand. Super simple design, no lock but nice tail on blade is easy to hold firm in the handle. making new handles is easy if you don't like the plastic ones it comes with. Blade, 2 handle scales a bress pin an 2 Chicago screws an that's it.
I've just lost mine, will buy another . Great little cheap knife.
Steel is 15n20 Swedish band saw steel. Very tough.
Just as the CS Working man was an over priced Pro Lite (when Lynn owned the Company) so is this. 1.4116 is a decent steel and as Aaron pointed out do some fact checking , ie: Pete at Cedric and Ada. Also Jimmy Slash has Beat the crap out of this steel. Fortunately I have several Pro Lite's , so set for life!
Love the new approach you take on making your videos. Long time subscriber, just wanted to say thank you. God bless
Decent budget knife but I’m gonna wait for the G10 version!
I'm curious about their soon-to-be-released Engage 3" with their ATLAS Lock - There's one with a Stonewash Black PVD AUS-10A blade & GFN Handles for about $80.
Please do another follow-up with that when it is released! It might hit that sweet spot for length, lock-up, materials, and price.
Check out how I broke the atlas lock on then engage a few months back. 👍
@gideonstactical Ha! I remember that video. Nothing is quite like the Triad I guess when it comes to hammer splitting firewood. 💁🏻♂️ Definitely a Project Farm-level durability test for that poor Engage. To quote you "If I had to be an idiot with my pocket knife, I'd go with the Triad." 😆
Mini Recon 1 is one of my favorite edc's, I love the bowie style clip and AUS10a. I was gonna get big brother but damn...there's so many choices with decent steel at affordable prices. So I'm just gonna take it slow, I do like to have stainless steel blades for food and citrus. Not to mention it's lower maintenance.....
Recon 1 mini is almost a perfect EDC.
Between mini recon 1 (aus10A) and the verdict which one has better corrosion resistance?
i just recieved my rat 2 today fell in love with it , it's more solid than i thought it would be , i thought i ordered d2 but it's the aus 8 i guess it'll be alright
I heard a few videos, say that some how the aus8 holds a better edge???
@@gideonstactical thanks
Cold Steel lockback just gets on with it, I work outdoors and for pocketknife, carry either Buck 112 Lite or now this Verdict which I picked up for £25.00, ( a steal). I keep a small fine waterstone at side of workshop door, so a quick hone no problem. I have a Benchmade bugout which I love, but the mechanism is too complex and wear prone for EDC. Edge retention on these tools is secondary to toughness and price point for me. Biggest cause of death in my knives is loss. I can bear £25.00 (just about), but £125.00 would be a heartbreaker.
The Buck 112 is one of my favourites, but the quality of assembly is rubbish compared to Eastern standards now. Love the reviews by the way Aaron, don't change anything.
I was wondering what you did with your CS Engage. I remember you developed an issue with the pivot. Were you able to fix it yourself? Did you warranty it with CS and what was the result? Or did you just throw it in a drawer never to be seen again? Looking forward to this year’s content.
Yes, Cold Steel Warranty day and it took about six weeks. I got a brand new one.
@@gideonstactical 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 I’m glad they took care of you. How a company handles warranty issues speaks volumes them.
It looks like a budget American Lawman. Ive had my American Lawman so long that its a AUS8 steel. It was $65 ish bucks when I bought it, many years ago. Looks to be a solid budget, yet tough as hell, knife.
Nice!!!
I have CS Pro Lite,i buy it it was 3 years ago. The price the steel tri adlock excellent balance, very hard use knife
I like that very much. You might not believe me, but I don't own any Cold Steels. This could be my first one. Thanks for another great review!
Awesome!
I Like 1.4116, because it's one of the most Rust resistence Steel that i now. I always use the Cold Steel Pendelton Hunter Lite, when i am at the Sea or in the Jungle....Great Steel for the Price! Greatings from Germany.
kershaw cut blades i prefer it last a bit longer in day two day.. the finer flip open is another...
will you test the spyderco leafjumper?
Possibly at some point but it is not on the short list.
Good steel for working kitchen knives
Gideon you should take a look at the Aubey 11 inch camping knife in 440c steel. It's sort of a no name brand and I would never consider it for that reason but it's only 40 bucks and man is it beautiful. One of the best looking knives I've ever seen. And 440c ain't bad. That's what it's called there's no direct name but it's the 440c version. There's no videos on it.
G'day Aaron, I'm really digg'n this design, but yeah 4116 doesn't do it for me at any price.
I would however be keen to try AUS 10 at a fair price point.
FYI; the AUS 8A on my Finnwolf has held up very well over the years, significantly better than other AUS 8 in my experience and good to have a folding scandi in the collection too.
I note CS are still putting thumb studs in the cutting/sharpening path, not so bad on this model, but I wish they'd address it completely. Personally I'd rather have a nail nick, (and I hate nail nicks), or simply pinch it open, than have this issue. Cheers Duke.
I would like to see the Verdict in an uncoated Aus-10
4116 steel - low end steel for high end price. 4116 is equivalent of 5cr15 aka X50crmov15, so bottom of the steel chart.
I have a set of kitchen knives in 4116 stainless steel and it works perfectly in the kitchen, not sure how it would be as an edc
They could probably make the knife in D2 for the same price but to a novice German stainless sounds better when they read the box at Cabelas
My best knife was the cold Steel hold out 3 in aus8 for 75€ in Germany.
Robust, best lock and nice blade.
I gave it to a friend, who lost his knife.
After a few other knifes like the bugout and Delica, i will buy a hold out again.
I put the little cold Steel trough hard times, tip broke off a bit and i reprofiled the tip.
My other knifes would Not handle the same Tasks for shure.
Delica devoloped play in the backlock after some whittling and the bugout is too fragile.
I miss the little tank hold out 3.
I don't like the new versions in Pulversteel, to hard to sharpen.
Every knife after the cold Steel feels a bit like a toy, if you compare to similar weight and size .
the triad is the lock i most trust for hard work.
I only like two models, the air lite and the hold out 3.
I am not a fan boy, just a german CNC operater with master degree and over 30 jears of pocketknifes.
Only my personal opinion. I like American knifes, but the laws in Germany sucks.
Only two hand opening on locking knifes is ok.
The Delica, bugout, dozier etc. are all not allowed to cary.
My dream woud be a hold out 3 or a smaller air lite or smaller broken skull with nailneck and strong spring.
Even if you remove the thumpstuds, its cosidered as an one hand opening knife.
The are only allowed, if they not lock.
I don't like this non locking one hand flipper shit.
Bette to go with a sak, when not locking.
Grüße aus Deutschland 😊
I have a cold steel spike that's in German 114 I've had it for about 5 years and it is still going strong no rolling no chips I've pried with it Cut wire And probably a few things that I shouldn't have done with it that a normal knife would have broke possibly lol
Mini Recon 1 $40 on MidwayUSA at the moment - AUS10 is amazing for that price point.
I'll stick with my mini Recon1. Wish they had at least used D2 on the Verdict, I would then be interested.
I like the knife. the steel is adequate for the price and I love the weight
I have the premium version of this with g10 and aus10 steel. It's a bit slimmer, and super solid only like 2.5 ounces. Don't even feel it in pocket.
Nice!!
👍 If one wants a Cold Steel folding knife the AD10 is the best choice.
One of my many favorites along with the American lawman, the icon recon 1
I don't know I like the Espada large with the G10 handles
How do you think the Ontario Rat II compares to the Verdict. The Rat II is $35 vs $50 for the Verdict.
The rat2 will slice better, the but the ergos and triad lock are better on the verdict.
I have 10 cold steel knives and a few less on spyderco but I’m done with cold steel as they’re warranties suck, they don’t stand behind there products and treat their clients like thieves, this happened with the GSMO takeover and the peon the phone actually don’t know anything about knives or warranties. It’s sad to see such a great legend go down.
Yep I agree and I won't buy any more Cold Steel Knives neither
How is it that now that Cold Steel is firmly in GSM Outdoors hands that they are even slower at releasing new models? "New for 2022" models (and i mean the premium version of the verdict) are still not even in stores in late January of 2023...
Because GSM sucks
I am very happy with my Cold Steel American LawMan pocket knife. But I plan on buying the Cold Steel Grik pocket knife.
The lawman is awesome, the smallest knife I carry but not the least capable. It would be on my 10 3 list
@@stevefoster443 yeah the Cold Steel American LawMan is pretty awesome pocket knife. The cold Steel American LawMan is my go to pocket knife. I know I can beat the snot out of it. And it will not break. I only trust the Tri-ad lock. I don't trust any other type of knife locking system.
@@JAMESGREGORYKULP1985 I looked at the grik interesting and aus 8 decent gust the grivery handles, I modified my voyager to my liking, but for 39 dollars on blade HQ 🤷♀️ but for 46 dollars you get the 3 inch voyager I would take a look also on blade hq
@@stevefoster443 yeah the Cold Steel Grik does seem like an interesting pocket knife. And I will take a look at the cold Steel voyager
Is there anything really 'wrong' with 4116 (assuming good heat treat) - no - providing you're not paying too much for it & don't expect too much from it. At sub US$50 (I wouldn't pay any more than this) you're not going to get super steels so let's be realistic. While I think this knife has a lot of compromises in terms of steel & handle material - it's still well made & has a triad lock. This would make a good beater blade or backup blade - one that you can use hard (or loan to others) & not care too much if it gets damaged. Sharp blades all.
Good analysis thank you for sharing!
The og cold steel tri-ad lock is bullet proof. I won't buy a cold steel without it.
Love my AD-10... favorite knife
Same 😅
Nah the engage lock is actually better
I don’t think the engage lock is better. I had one with blade play. The lock itself is easy to accidentally disengage no pun intended. I’ll take triad lock all day
Going backwards at this price. Pro Lite was a lot less. Inflation?
How about a look inside the handles??? Skeletonized steel liners, no liners???
No liners
The jabar dozier in D2 is #42 on amazon right now. The dozier kickback is more than adequate and the steel much better. To me it's a no brainer.
Kabar and lockback! Can't type!
Krupp is a solid steel.
Cold Steel’s Aus8 & Aus10 are great. The KaBar Dozier’s Aus8 is horrible. Gotta be the heat treat.
Heat treatment is everything, look only to buck knives for proof.
Ka-Bar's AUS-8 is so soft like pot metal 👎
Just stop it people and get 8670, Infi, S7, Zwear, CD#1, Caldi, Calmax or K600. And put a hight end coating and your good to go for a no nonsense EDC. Leave the stainless steel for the kitchen or unless you're going diving.
My understanding is that 4116 is similar to what Victorinox uses for their knife steel.
In most cases yes but Cold Steel's heat treat bumps it up a bit similar to how Buck's heat treat makes their 420HC beat a lot of other companies' "higher end" steels
I think Victoriinox is Sand ok 12C27
I really like 4034ss for some reason most budget steels bug me .
Cold Steel Verdict in D2 would be the SHE IT!!!
being the knife is new, the price is higher, as all new knives cost more, but after 6 months to year, drop in price to where the other blades you've shown are at as they have been on the market a lot longer...
Their pricing is crazy and I expect it will drop, like they did with their Airlite. Why would you pay $90 for a 3” Verdict in AUS10 when you can get a 3.5” Cold Steel Airlite in Aus10 for $60 on Amazon?
Imagine if they started using 14c28n as their base model steel.
That would be great!!
Total pass 45$ for garbage materials
It’s high for the materials for sure.
Love your reviews btw
😀😀cool
I'll echo what many have said here. I don't mind 4116 steel. As long as you have the proper expectaion of what it is, it's a great budget steel that takes a keen edge quickly and is very rust resistant. Makes for a great budget/beater knife, or one to throw in the get home bag in the car and not worry about it. HOWEVER. My biggest beef is the pricing structure the new Cold Steel has. The brand has always been about delivering really strong, good performing knives at a better price point than most other competitors. But now their business model seems to be expanding into the "blister pack big box store" market to sell as many cheap material knives at inflated prices. Its disappointing. I just looked on Amazon...$57-60 for this 3" knife with 4116 and FRN handles, and a Cold Steel AirLite with a 3 1/2" AUS10 blade, G10 handles is $60. Give me the AirLite all day long over the Verdict.
for that price I'd rather go with a voyager
For sure, but the voyage is much bigger not for everyone.
True. I forget that they stopped making the smaller version of it.
What's the verdict lol
Hahah
@@gideonstactical pun intended. How you travelling mate? Love the knife vids
Just get an American Lawman
I won't buy any more Cold Steel Knives. GSM turn me off. No warranty no sharpening service no customer service no extra parts no pocket clips adios cold-steel
4116 is a really low budget steel. Not sure it’s as good as Buck 420 hc.
Just depends on the edge and grind angle. Just sharing my experience
4116 Is ekvivalent of 5cr15 so yes, it's awkward on knife for 50 bucks or more. Ganzo has D2 on knives for 30-40 bucks and cold steel is made in Asia as well. No, I'm not a fan of cold steel. Cold steel knives are not completely bad, they are just way to overpriced.
Cold Steel is fast becoming a nonentity to me, better knives can now be had for the same money at the low end. At the high end the the quality and materials doesn’t justify the exorbitantly high prices, they can’t even use the excuse that it’s made in the USA.
Hey man, just my opinion, but I miss the longer discussion format of your older videos vs the newer ones that are a mashup of 3-5 second sound bites. So much cutting and editing, it’s distracting to me. Maybe that’s just me, but just wanted to throw it out there. Still love the channel though!
Nice looking knife. People better get one before the Chinese take over Taiwan and it says made in China, oops.
Like you almost mentioned the world is going crazy, rapidly.
It's shameful that company like cold steel use this steel for 50 plus dollars knives. So many brands offers better steel for similar or better price. Real steel. Cjrb, civivi, srm, ruike etc.
I will still keep with "old" models as big CS fan. This new, even with Triad lock, are not even close to be something new, exciting etc., not mentioning trying out new locks are just 👎🏼from my perspective.
Never buy 4116 it makes Aus8A look like a super steel and thats sad.
Interesting, I agree that what Cold Steel does with aus-8a is better than 4116, but compared to what Cold Steel does and what other companies do with their AUS8 or 8CR is a little bit better. Most of the time.
Honestly I don't want Cold Steel any where near making light weight edc knives. They are meant to be tough overbuilt monsters. Recon 1, Voyager, AD10, SRK, American Lawman. That's the legacy and what they SHOULD be doing.
Not everyone wants a pocket hog with a 4 inch blade on it. As a blue collar American I appreciate a good hard use knife, and I have a few. But my tanto verdict is one of my go to's. Shockingly rugged and durable for how lightweight it is
You were far more critical of 4116 steel in your Cold Steel Kiridashi video than in this one. I would certainly not spend $50 on a 4116 steel knife. There are many other options out there with that price point with better steels that will hold an edge longer.
As much as I love Cold Steel, my only reason that I own only 9 folding knives of theirs is due to blade length (must be at least 4 inches for me to consider to buy) and the thumb studs must be the same length. These 2 things I hold above all physical characteristics of a folding knife, so being picky has prevented my stock to get bigger. Steel choice or handle material does not bother me because they will be primarily for light duty. I have Cold Steel fixed blades and machetes for medium and heavy use.
What tasks are you doing that you need a folding knife with such a long blade?
At that size, I’d be looking at fixed blades for a better tool. You are going to get a better bang for your Buck as far as steels go and the handles will undoubtedly be more comfortable.
They suck. No warranty.
Actually just got my broken engaged replaced only took 6 weeks.
Got a knife as a gift and the clip broke. I was not the purchaser of the knife so they said the warranty did not apply.