I think we will see something very similar built into Steam os in the future. It would be pretty awesome to have this just like we have System wide FSR. Even if we had an option to Lock at 30 native and generate up to 60 would be amazing
@@skapsh amd gpu adrenalin driver has AFMF2 built in (for amd rx and rdna gpu). If amd is starting to support the steam deck under windows probably these features will come in the near future... ?
Personally you want like 45-55+ FPS for lossless scaling to be a good experience. This is a great way to get a OLED steamdeck to 90hz, but is pretty poor to go from 30-->60. To much input latency.
I have a 3gb GTX 1060 and 7600k and this app breathes life back into the system. Sure there are artifacts, but with a high fps display, the added fluidity and motion resolution is great to have.
Playing cities skylines on a laptop with ls from 30 to 90fps. Little artifacts around the edges but otherwise amazing. Yes it's not for fast paced games, but slower ones that can reach 30/45fps on the deck? Hell yeah.
I think honestly if you play slower paced games and only stick to 2x frame gen, it isn't too bad. I've noticed this especially with emulation, it really brings those old games locked to 30 fps back to life
The quality of Lossless Scaling is very impressive considering it gets zero information from the games it scales. Edit: I'm saying it's impressive for not getting motion vectors or any sort of hint at what is ui and what is not.
Hey, your issue on hogwartz legacy is probably due to the fact that it’s recommended to have at least 30 fps stable in a game for the frame gen technology to work properly :)
Thanks for covering this. I've been using the OLED SD like this for several months now and it really is a game changer being able to use this scaling / frame gen on Xbox titles and other store games. It doesn't always work properly but most of the time it is good enough to level up the experience without impacting latency too much.
@@jimmelton5846 the official Bluetooth drivers did but we've been able to use existing graphics drivers and WiFi drivers since launch. On mine I was just using a basic USB BT dongle to add external controller and audio support. Even now the official audio drivers don't support audio through the built in speakers.
I have rtx 3090 24GB Vram and to be honest i still use Lossless Scaling app, it's not for the weak devices only. I can play AAA games at 4k while my pc remains whisper quiet. FanControl, undervolt, losless scaling 1440p upscaled to 4k fsr and it basically uses 1/2 of power and you can't even hear the pc is turned on. Also some games allow to set fps manually so you can get exactly 2x, 3x of any given number with frame generation but obviously at the cost of slight artifacts. Hope that helps for the ones considering using it on gaming PC's. Regards
I have been using Lossless Scaling for years. I initially got it to upscale old games to fit Ultrawide and help with performance in new games. It was only $5 at the time. I am playing at 3440x1440 with an old Vega 56. I noticed that Helldivers was chugging into the 20's fps. I was still having a blast. Noticed frame generation was added. Then boom, it was locked to the monitor hz. Great application
love your videos bro always great quality and loaded with info! I do wish you did tests of games on other quality settings instead of just low, do a quick show of med and high as well I think it's be a helpful insight :) but otherwise keep up the the great work
Lossless Scaling doesn't have access to the game's motion vectors or normal maps. However, there is a Reshade shader called Launchpad that uses a sophisticated algorithm to rebuild that information from nothing more than 2 frames and a depth map. It's one of "Marty's Mods". How awesome would it be if LS could use the same technique?
Allocating dedicated memory in the BIOS isn't a good practice anymore. If the iGPU needs more VRAM, it can already dynamically allocate some more RAM and return it to the OS and programs when it isn't needed anymore. Reserving those 4GiB just makes sure that this amount of memory becomes unusable for the CPU at all times.
These are top end games, developed by studios with access to top end cards for those top end cards, or specially optimized for console GPUs. They don't have time to optimize for every PC configuration. Your expectations for a handheld iGPU are very high. Of course, the game will run well at high settings on something like a RTX 4090. You pay good money for good graphics.
@@PomuLeafEveryday Hogwarts legacy is not top end game. It barely has content, runs on old UE4 engine, and is very bad optimized. Games 10 years ago were more ahead in older engines by same company. Batman Arkham Knight, etc.
as the new fps is derived from the old i take it that means if the starter frames are far too low then inserting extra frames at that point wont help much, there is a sort of hard floor limit before results are bad, go over that minimum floor limit and things are better.
How many times does the phrase 'Steam deck OLED' need to be mentioned? It sounds like an advert. However, that aside, this software tech option really does look impressive when you take all things into account. It would be interesting to see what it could do on a much lower powered device such as one with an Intel N97 or AMD Ryzen 5 6600H, where AAA some gaming might just be possible but where older titles that might still be sluggish could potentially get quite the boost and add additional value to the purchase.
That's what I found. It uses so many resources that it drops fps so much that at 2X it was basically the same as without but with hitching and artefacts. Didn't matter what settings I tried. People say to reduce settings 😂 but I can just do that natively, so what would be the point. Then they tell me I am missing the point. Make the game look like ass for minimal frame gain ... No. Even just the scaling would reduce fps by 20fps.....it's supposed to go faster, not slower lol DLSS and FSR have positive effect, not this thing.
Usually, you don't want to run two different upscaling algorithms at the same time. If you have FSR on inside cyberpunk, don't enable upscaling in Lossless Scaling. Lossless Scaling's framegen should still work if the game is in fullscreen mode if you set the scaling type to "Off" in Lossless Scaling. (That is to say it worked for me when I tested it. ymmv) Also, windows on a handheld is not a tradeoff I would make.
You really need to cap your fps to something your hardware can handle at all times, with at least a little bit of margin, for Lossless Scaling to shine. These examples aren't good applications of the software. If you have the 90hz Steam Deck, you should lock the 45fps and make sure to play games that don't go below, then apply LS. Below 45, there will be lots of glitching on some games, but even so, a locked 30fps smoothened to 60 with LS will play much better.
If getting over 100 fps on Dirt 5 doesn’t interest you, I was also able to run Dirt 5 at 6 watts w/ Steam Deck windows & still get stupidly high frame rates. No native windows device can do that, or if it can you will get major audio bugs from trying. Only the 8000 series AMD mobile chip can run games at 6-8 watts, but not w/o bugs. Turn the steam deck into a windows device, run lossless & play AAA games at 6 watts & you are gonna get insane battery life. & any pc handheld that can come anywhere close to that battery life still doesn’t have an OLED display 😉
rather than pc gaming me using lossless scaling for emulation and the result is great !!! donkey kong tropical freeze at 120 fps or super mario wonder i felt as if i played two new games
This looks pretty sick but... I just prefer Steam OS. I have zero doubts we will see more performance get squeezed out of this device. I would REALLY love to see an automatic settings change option introduced that sets games to the optimized levels if you choose. Nvidia offers something like that.
Yeah swapped to Bazzite on the ROG Ally.. Picked the Ally at the start for Windows 11 (so I could use it with frame gen and for game compatibility), but I can't leave Bazzite now that I've tried it, lol. Hope to see Lossless Scaling ported to Linux soon.
This is fine for games that don't require twitch inputs. But the second you use this one something like a fighting game, or some sort of action or racing game that requires quick inputs, it feels really bad.
I’m convinced this technology allows you to surpass the capabilities of your display. Yes it is downloading the frames spoofing the frames in a sense the frames aren’t real but your computer will treat them as if they are real & I installed windows on an OLED steam deck just yesterday for this purpose & I was running Grid Legends at over a 100 fps on the Deck’s 90 hertz monitor. But, the frames will jump & if you want to stabilize your framerate you need to limit the frames. Limit the Deck to 30 fps run lossless 3x & you might just get a constant 90 frames that doesn’t fluctuate. It will stay at that exact # at all times. Don’t limit frames tho & you could exceed 100 fps with fluctations.
How does it feel? Games like Ghost of Tsushima or Wukong are unplayable with frame gen. The lag is so noticeable that the games feel slower to control with 60fps frame gen than 30-40 without. Ghost at 40fps feels infinitely more responsive than with frame gen at 60fps where it feels extremely laggy. This is the thing people don’t like hearing - frame gen is not designed for “under” 40fps or actually 60fps. Ghost with frame gen on pc from 80fps to 120fps feels great. On steam deck it doesn’t as you are still running a 30fps game with extra lag.
If this ever runs native on the deck i would buy it in a second,i cant stand windows 11 and 12,like seruously otherwise i would dual boot Many thanks for showing how this works
This will never be ported over to Linux, not because its a program but due to its reliance on windows specific software. This uses windows specific render pipeline to interpolate frames, there is no Linux counterpart. This uses kernel driver software, you can't emulate it with a wrapper.
This App is a lifesaver on handheld. I use it constantly on my Legion Go - just set the game to 30fps (using in-game settings or Legion Go frame limiter), then activate Lossless scaling to get smooth 60fps in games that would normally run at something like 40 or below.
I want to try this with AMD Fluid motion frames, for games that sometimes drops from 60 to 49 to have a perfect 60fps...hows the input lag and tearing tho?
@@albertomon Don't know if the same frame gen works differently between an Ally or a Go (I have an Ally) I have tried both AFMF and LS on my Ally, and by my taste, LS is preferrable for me than AFMF. AFMF turns itself off during fast camera motion which is usually all the time in shooters or third person action games. I end up with stuttery frame pacing because of this. LS is active all throughout, thus I get much better frame pacing. Artifacts are there more than AFMF but nothing that significantly distracts me from the game. And to my surprise AFMF feels far laggy in regards to input lag versus LS. In fact LS simply feels playing on the expected input latency of the base fps you are generating from - which is not much noticeable to me.
Wouldn't it be best to frame rate cap at 45 Hz using Special K or RivaTuner? Then it can run at native 90 Hz. As long as you get game settings where it can consistently hit 45 FPS
I’m using my OG Steam Deck as a windows mini pc. Basically, I’m using windows as a backend with a debloating script and disabling auto updates.. I mostly play free to play anticheat games and emulation on it. I know it can run natively on steam os but don’t have to sudo this and that to make a particular game run. Just want to click launch and it just loads.
you can play almost any game on Linux out of the box, I don't know what are you talking about... and sorry, but even with a "debloat script" windows is still bloat AF
@@DienerNoUta They said they mainly play games with an anti-cheat. Most games with anti-cheats won't work well with Linux. So, in this case Windows makes a lot of sense. For someone that came from Windows (on an ROG Ally) to Bazzite, Bazzite is absolutely amazing as I don't play multiplayer games.
It uses so many resources that at 2X, the frame rate is no better than without it. Tried all settings, read everything, even just using scaling alone, it drops FPS by 20fps+. FSR/DLSS doesn't do that. I haven't seen the point of this on the 2060. There is no better frame rate but ugly artefacts and stuttering.
Use special k fps limiter and cap the fps and inject reflex to the game. LSFG 2X with a cap of 30 fps to get 60, or 3x with a cap of 40 for 120 fps. If you don't have enough gpu headroom then turn on performance on LS. You are right in that it will have arrifacting, it doesn't have access to the same resources that DLSS3 has, but ita still a usfull tool to have in hand. Depending on the game, there could be hardly any artifacts, or you just don't notice them. It can also help get higher fps on games that are cap at 60, and have no mods to un cap it. It truly a useful tool to have.
I can't get this to work. All i want to do is simply upscale 480p or lower TH-cam videos and not generate any aditional frames. I have scaling at nearest neighbor or interger. I have frame gen off and but i only get a black screen with an fps counter in the corner and my mouse cursor doesn't show up unless it's the very very top and it glitches copies and flashes. I just cant get this pos software to work. I can get other crappy video upscaling software to work but it isn't good.
How about on games where even 30 fps is not natively achievable? Still smooth? If the screen is high refresh rate such there won't be much sense going from 60 fps to 100 fps, can you tell the difference?
There is no such thing as lossless scaling. It's oxymoron. Either you compress or you do not. If you do - you have to lose data. Thing you're discribing is "fooling your eye".
Loseless scaling was working with the first released drivers. It does not care which gpu and driver you are using. Just make a proper video showcasing the lack of hardware acceleration on windows. Much more usefull
This is a very cool tool but falls a bit to the mis-marketing of frame generation. Frame gen is something that should have only been marketed as a way to get games that are already able to run at 120FPS to 240FPS. I say this because of the latency that results from the processes. The higher the base frame rate is, the lower the felt latency will be. Personally, I could see myself using this for games that already run at a base 70-80FPS on my Ally X and I use it to get the full 120 the screen can do. But trying it on games that run below 60FPS has just too much of a felt latency, Like ok, Maybe I am seeing a much smoother 80FPS vs 40, but there is no so much input delay that feels like I am playing at 20fps lol. As an example, I tried playing RE4:RM and had a base of 51FPS and a generated 102FPS. The input latency was felt pretty strong to the point it felt like I was using a cloud gaming service. Not unplayable, but the smoothness was not worth the lower response time. However, I then played CoD:MW2, showed a base of 74 (which is oddly much lower than I normally get with this off), and a generated 148. This felt way more responsive and totally playable. But it was also still not as responsive as having it off but still a much better experience than RE4 was. Same with GTAV, base of around 80 and it the input latency was totally playable and felt pretty good.Its for these reasons I really think Frame Gen is more geared for titles already getting 120FPS and trying to push 240.
Yes it depends on the game. On my Nvidia card with Nivida reflex, some games are fine even with only 80 generated frames, and 55 fps without frame gen, seems choppy when moving the mouse. On other games, even with reflex it's not great. So i hope that most games will have low latency in near future.
![[Eng] AccessGaming #10: Star Wars Outlaws, Balatro, Skullgirls, Astrobot, MK1, Diablo IV, controlers](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/6lUS8qOGLQU/mqdefault.jpg)
I think we will see something very similar built into Steam os in the future. It would be pretty awesome to have this just like we have System wide FSR. Even if we had an option to Lock at 30 native and generate up to 60 would be amazing
@@ETAPRIME Just wondering, what do you base it on? Just expectation or have there been signs that something like that is being worked on?
Hey, how do you setup your msi and riva tuner to show the gpy usage? on msi i only get the cpu usage shown and not the the gpu one
@@skapsh amd gpu adrenalin driver has AFMF2 built in (for amd rx and rdna gpu). If amd is starting to support the steam deck under windows probably these features will come in the near future... ?
Personally you want like 45-55+ FPS for lossless scaling to be a good experience. This is a great way to get a OLED steamdeck to 90hz, but is pretty poor to go from 30-->60. To much input latency.
I saw the title and I was thinking “LS on SteamOS!”, and then I read “Windows 11”. 😢
i mean, windows 10 is fine too.
@@mrsnippysnoopa8300 No, It is not..
People like to shit on custom installs but i debloated my own ISO and never had issues with windows again
Yeah all the APIs it works with are on windows, so it will much more time until we can see it native on steamos
Yea I don’t care for windows on steam deck
I have a 3gb GTX 1060 and 7600k and this app breathes life back into the system.
Sure there are artifacts, but with a high fps display, the added fluidity and motion resolution is great to have.
Make sure every game is atleast running at 40fps and x2 at that framerate else there will be many artifacts
@@ZirTech0you say this but I’ve found 30 fps to be a good sweet spot.
Imagine Steam endorses them and has it a part of SteamOS officially.
Would be grear because they already support FSR in there HUD for Pc Data
We must warn Valve to ban this app forever to secure revenue
I have to admit those Founders Edition Decks are cool.
Lossless Scaling works great on my Ayaneo Flip DS. I can work with some of the frame generation effect if it means to play AAA on 1080p.
yooo I have my KB and fsr frame gen works so well while im playing ffxvi. Perfect!
I hope that comes to Steam Deck natively
Probably wont
Frame generation looks really awful once you start going below like 45fps
on my 65” tv with frame gen I tried it at 30 fps and from the distance I was at i did not notice anything
Playing cities skylines on a laptop with ls from 30 to 90fps. Little artifacts around the edges but otherwise amazing. Yes it's not for fast paced games, but slower ones that can reach 30/45fps on the deck? Hell yeah.
AFMF2 looks quite ok even at 30 fps, Lossless Scaling generates a lot of artifacts at such low framerates.
I think honestly if you play slower paced games and only stick to 2x frame gen, it isn't too bad. I've noticed this especially with emulation, it really brings those old games locked to 30 fps back to life
@@drewzle837this... If you can hit 45fps then it's pretty solid.
With 30fps you're mileage varies a lot depending on the game.
This lossless scaling and framegen is insane. Some real Pied Piper shit.
The quality of Lossless Scaling is very impressive considering it gets zero information from the games it scales.
Edit: I'm saying it's impressive for not getting motion vectors or any sort of hint at what is ui and what is not.
Hey, your issue on hogwartz legacy is probably due to the fact that it’s recommended to have at least 30 fps stable in a game for the frame gen technology to work properly :)
Great review with lossless scaling. Just what have been waiting for
Thanks for covering this. I've been using the OLED SD like this for several months now and it really is a game changer being able to use this scaling / frame gen on Xbox titles and other store games.
It doesn't always work properly but most of the time it is good enough to level up the experience without impacting latency too much.
Didn't the windows drivers drop for Steam Deck OLED about a week ago?
@@jimmelton5846 the official Bluetooth drivers did but we've been able to use existing graphics drivers and WiFi drivers since launch.
On mine I was just using a basic USB BT dongle to add external controller and audio support.
Even now the official audio drivers don't support audio through the built in speakers.
@@nonnygb goy ya. Cheers man.
I have rtx 3090 24GB Vram and to be honest i still use Lossless Scaling app, it's not for the weak devices only. I can play AAA games at 4k while my pc remains whisper quiet. FanControl, undervolt, losless scaling 1440p upscaled to 4k fsr and it basically uses 1/2 of power and you can't even hear the pc is turned on. Also some games allow to set fps manually so you can get exactly 2x, 3x of any given number with frame generation but obviously at the cost of slight artifacts. Hope that helps for the ones considering using it on gaming PC's. Regards
I have been using Lossless Scaling for years. I initially got it to upscale old games to fit Ultrawide and help with performance in new games. It was only $5 at the time. I am playing at 3440x1440 with an old Vega 56. I noticed that Helldivers was chugging into the 20's fps. I was still having a blast. Noticed frame generation was added. Then boom, it was locked to the monitor hz. Great application
i was waiting for this GREAT VIDEO ETA
love your videos bro always great quality and loaded with info! I do wish you did tests of games on other quality settings instead of just low, do a quick show of med and high as well I think it's be a helpful insight :) but otherwise keep up the the great work
Lossless Scaling doesn't have access to the game's motion vectors or normal maps. However, there is a Reshade shader called Launchpad that uses a sophisticated algorithm to rebuild that information from nothing more than 2 frames and a depth map. It's one of "Marty's Mods". How awesome would it be if LS could use the same technique?
Maby in the future
Allocating dedicated memory in the BIOS isn't a good practice anymore. If the iGPU needs more VRAM, it can already dynamically allocate some more RAM and return it to the OS and programs when it isn't needed anymore. Reserving those 4GiB just makes sure that this amount of memory becomes unusable for the CPU at all times.
really good got it in my pc. for steamdeck oled, i use dlss enabler mod for hogwart and other game. got double-ish fps
I love my OLED deck. Wish I could've got that limited edition because it just looks so cool. Kinda cyberpunky looking
Awesome, I'm gonna give this a try
It's sad that today's graphics cards can't work on their own, but rather, we have to install all possible programs to give more FPS 😢😢
These are top end games, developed by studios with access to top end cards for those top end cards, or specially optimized for console GPUs. They don't have time to optimize for every PC configuration. Your expectations for a handheld iGPU are very high. Of course, the game will run well at high settings on something like a RTX 4090. You pay good money for good graphics.
Itb truly is the "download more ram" app.
Genius You're literally downloading FREE FPS what's there to complain about😂 it makes games playable
@@PomuLeafEveryday Hogwarts legacy is not top end game. It barely has content, runs on old UE4 engine, and is very bad optimized. Games 10 years ago were more ahead in older engines by same company. Batman Arkham Knight, etc.
@@itzdcx7991 You are just inserting blank frames between real frames. It is fake performance.
ive seen many vids of this. but most of them dont lock the fps and refresh rate to reduce artifact and latency...
In my opinion the best usecase of lossless scaling is using it with frame locked games or emulators to get around the 30/60fps cap.
as the new fps is derived from the old i take it that means if the starter frames are far too low then inserting extra frames at that point wont help much, there is a sort of hard floor limit before results are bad, go over that minimum floor limit and things are better.
How many times does the phrase 'Steam deck OLED' need to be mentioned? It sounds like an advert. However, that aside, this software tech option really does look impressive when you take all things into account.
It would be interesting to see what it could do on a much lower powered device such as one with an Intel N97 or AMD Ryzen 5 6600H, where AAA some gaming might just be possible but where older titles that might still be sluggish could potentially get quite the boost and add additional value to the purchase.
Very heavy and it’s FG is bugged as hell full of motion artifacts. Not worth it IMHO
That's what I found. It uses so many resources that it drops fps so much that at 2X it was basically the same as without but with hitching and artefacts. Didn't matter what settings I tried. People say to reduce settings 😂 but I can just do that natively, so what would be the point. Then they tell me I am missing the point. Make the game look like ass for minimal frame gain ... No. Even just the scaling would reduce fps by 20fps.....it's supposed to go faster, not slower lol DLSS and FSR have positive effect, not this thing.
@@Berserkismgpu?
Usually, you don't want to run two different upscaling algorithms at the same time. If you have FSR on inside cyberpunk, don't enable upscaling in Lossless Scaling. Lossless Scaling's framegen should still work if the game is in fullscreen mode if you set the scaling type to "Off" in Lossless Scaling. (That is to say it worked for me when I tested it. ymmv) Also, windows on a handheld is not a tradeoff I would make.
If it’s not working on Linux then what’s the point really?
You really need to cap your fps to something your hardware can handle at all times, with at least a little bit of margin, for Lossless Scaling to shine.
These examples aren't good applications of the software.
If you have the 90hz Steam Deck, you should lock the 45fps and make sure to play games that don't go below, then apply LS.
Below 45, there will be lots of glitching on some games, but even so, a locked 30fps smoothened to 60 with LS will play much better.
If getting over 100 fps on Dirt 5 doesn’t interest you, I was also able to run Dirt 5 at 6 watts w/ Steam Deck windows & still get stupidly high frame rates. No native windows device can do that, or if it can you will get major audio bugs from trying. Only the 8000 series AMD mobile chip can run games at 6-8 watts, but not w/o bugs. Turn the steam deck into a windows device, run lossless & play AAA games at 6 watts & you are gonna get insane battery life. & any pc handheld that can come anywhere close to that battery life still doesn’t have an OLED display 😉
Hopefully the developers can incorporate LS in steam OS
rather than pc gaming me using lossless scaling for emulation and the result is great !!! donkey kong tropical freeze at 120 fps or super mario wonder i felt as if i played two new games
Do the new drivers work with the LCD or are we still stuck with drivers from November?
Is it possible with Lostless Scaling to play Zelda: TotK via EmuDeck at 60 fps or more?
This looks pretty sick but... I just prefer Steam OS. I have zero doubts we will see more performance get squeezed out of this device. I would REALLY love to see an automatic settings change option introduced that sets games to the optimized levels if you choose. Nvidia offers something like that.
Yeah swapped to Bazzite on the ROG Ally.. Picked the Ally at the start for Windows 11 (so I could use it with frame gen and for game compatibility), but I can't leave Bazzite now that I've tried it, lol. Hope to see Lossless Scaling ported to Linux soon.
Linux needs Fluid Motion Frames yesterday. 2x FPS boost for free and not noticable on a 720p display.
Dont forget to cap the fps, having constantly fluctuating will make the game a jittery mess
This is fine for games that don't require twitch inputs. But the second you use this one something like a fighting game, or some sort of action or racing game that requires quick inputs, it feels really bad.
I really hope this gets put on lynix too. Update us plz.
I’m convinced this technology allows you to surpass the capabilities of your display. Yes it is downloading the frames spoofing the frames in a sense the frames aren’t real but your computer will treat them as if they are real & I installed windows on an OLED steam deck just yesterday for this purpose & I was running Grid Legends at over a 100 fps on the Deck’s 90 hertz monitor. But, the frames will jump & if you want to stabilize your framerate you need to limit the frames. Limit the Deck to 30 fps run lossless 3x & you might just get a constant 90 frames that doesn’t fluctuate. It will stay at that exact # at all times. Don’t limit frames tho & you could exceed 100 fps with fluctations.
About the frame latency, maybe try to change CPU core affinity to see if it help?
I'm super interested in how well Lossless Scaling would do to get 4k60 gaming on some of the mini pcs you've been using!
With Discrete GPU's yes, with iGPU's forget about 4k.
This worked on my Commodore 64,......honest.
Raga but do you know that on stem OS the application of incompatible that is, come on.
Hey try it on a 8700g build
How did you boot to the bios? When I go to do that it just boots windows normally
have you tried odin 2 pro o max with winlator?
How does it feel? Games like Ghost of Tsushima or Wukong are unplayable with frame gen. The lag is so noticeable that the games feel slower to control with 60fps frame gen than 30-40 without. Ghost at 40fps feels infinitely more responsive than with frame gen at 60fps where it feels extremely laggy. This is the thing people don’t like hearing - frame gen is not designed for “under” 40fps or actually 60fps. Ghost with frame gen on pc from 80fps to 120fps feels great. On steam deck it doesn’t as you are still running a 30fps game with extra lag.
I have a LCD and dont I feel like an underclass
I wonder if they could make this an addon for decky loader to allow the app to run in the background somehow.
I tried and it feels off, very delayed input, for me its unplayable. I'd rather take 40-50fps than 90 fps with input lag
If this ever runs native on the deck i would buy it in a second,i cant stand windows 11 and 12,like seruously otherwise i would dual boot
Many thanks for showing how this works
Why dont test games like monster hunter world, helldivers, destinh 2?
You don't want this for games like helldivets, because of the input latency
This will never be ported over to Linux, not because its a program but due to its reliance on windows specific software.
This uses windows specific render pipeline to interpolate frames, there is no Linux counterpart. This uses kernel driver software, you can't emulate it with a wrapper.
Why don't you ever show stats for warzone?
What's battery life like on the OLED with windows on it?
Hi eta prime. Does this app over heat vram.
I think this might make FF16 playble on my laptop!
This App is a lifesaver on handheld. I use it constantly on my Legion Go - just set the game to 30fps (using in-game settings or Legion Go frame limiter), then activate Lossless scaling to get smooth 60fps in games that would normally run at something like 40 or below.
I want to try this with AMD Fluid motion frames, for games that sometimes drops from 60 to 49 to have a perfect 60fps...hows the input lag and tearing tho?
@@albertomon Haven't noticed any tearing (I do have vsync on) nor any problems with input lag - but I'm not very sensitive to that.
@@albertomon Don't know if the same frame gen works differently between an Ally or a Go (I have an Ally) I have tried both AFMF and LS on my Ally, and by my taste, LS is preferrable for me than AFMF.
AFMF turns itself off during fast camera motion which is usually all the time in shooters or third person action games. I end up with stuttery frame pacing because of this.
LS is active all throughout, thus I get much better frame pacing. Artifacts are there more than AFMF but nothing that significantly distracts me from the game.
And to my surprise AFMF feels far laggy in regards to input lag versus LS. In fact LS simply feels playing on the expected input latency of the base fps you are generating from - which is not much noticeable to me.
May I suggest testing lossless scaling on the steam deck in the game alan wake 2?
Wouldn't it be best to frame rate cap at 45 Hz using Special K or RivaTuner? Then it can run at native 90 Hz. As long as you get game settings where it can consistently hit 45 FPS
Hi, can you check performance of valorant on steamkdeck running windows??
I’m using my OG Steam Deck as a windows mini pc. Basically, I’m using windows as a backend with a debloating script and disabling auto updates.. I mostly play free to play anticheat games and emulation on it. I know it can run natively on steam os but don’t have to sudo this and that to make a particular game run. Just want to click launch and it just loads.
you can play almost any game on Linux out of the box, I don't know what are you talking about...
and sorry, but even with a "debloat script" windows is still bloat AF
@@DienerNoUta They said they mainly play games with an anti-cheat. Most games with anti-cheats won't work well with Linux. So, in this case Windows makes a lot of sense. For someone that came from Windows (on an ROG Ally) to Bazzite, Bazzite is absolutely amazing as I don't play multiplayer games.
It uses so many resources that at 2X, the frame rate is no better than without it. Tried all settings, read everything, even just using scaling alone, it drops FPS by 20fps+. FSR/DLSS doesn't do that. I haven't seen the point of this on the 2060. There is no better frame rate but ugly artefacts and stuttering.
Use special k fps limiter and cap the fps and inject reflex to the game. LSFG 2X with a cap of 30 fps to get 60, or 3x with a cap of 40 for 120 fps.
If you don't have enough gpu headroom then turn on performance on LS.
You are right in that it will have arrifacting, it doesn't have access to the same resources that DLSS3 has, but ita still a usfull tool to have in hand.
Depending on the game, there could be hardly any artifacts, or you just don't notice them. It can also help get higher fps on games that are cap at 60, and have no mods to un cap it.
It truly a useful tool to have.
purchased LossLess scaling when it was just $1.9 😂.. if it was an investment.. i already Rich today because the price is just 50x more now.
The lag is way to real, I can't with frame gen, it feel like poopo at lower FPS.
Anybody else have that issue where Lossless Scaling disables controller input? I'm having this issue on my Aya Neo 2 and my Triton 500
Imagine what SD2 can do with this mod
I can't get this to work. All i want to do is simply upscale 480p or lower TH-cam videos and not generate any aditional frames. I have scaling at nearest neighbor or interger. I have frame gen off and but i only get a black screen with an fps counter in the corner and my mouse cursor doesn't show up unless it's the very very top and it glitches copies and flashes. I just cant get this pos software to work. I can get other crappy video upscaling software to work but it isn't good.
Good video!
Hi, can i use this on a Vega 8 iGPU? (Ryzen 3 3200G)
I think you need 35fps for vectorless frame generation
System wide AMD AFMF incomming on steam deck 2. expected.
what tool used to show the fps?
LS or fluid motion better?
LETS GO!!!! putting windows on Steamdeck was the best decision ever did all the games that ran like ass run so much better now with this software
yeah lossless has been a boon to windows handheld pcs. Steam OS has a disadvantage at the moment
Does this work with videos??
if they could nail some frame gen software on the deck, they wouldnt have to make steam deck 2
I still would like to see a new SD with the 370. Add frame gen and 1200p oled display.
How about on games where even 30 fps is not natively achievable? Still smooth? If the screen is high refresh rate such there won't be much sense going from 60 fps to 100 fps, can you tell the difference?
You generally want around stable 45 fps (capped) with frame generation. And yeah, you can definitely tell the difference between 60 to 100 fps.
Pretty nice but I will never install windows on the sd
Makes my RTX 2060 feel somewhat good again.
Why
i had an old 980, I tried it and it was no bueno lol
@@protivationsrtcartel2360agreed. I also tried this in my old 980m laptop and you're right, no bueno
@@protivationsrtcartel2360 I think that you also need a somewhat morenmodern CPU.
i got soooooooo exsisted i thought it s on steam os 😢😢😢😢😢
There is no such thing as lossless scaling. It's oxymoron. Either you compress or you do not. If you do - you have to lose data. Thing you're discribing is "fooling your eye".
Waiting for the Pixel 9 series emulation video to be dropped
Can you not just enable FSR frame gen in Cyberpunk?
Can't remember if that was a mod or native...
Most likely a mod, it isn't official supported with AFMF yet.
Thannksss for wartchingg…
Loseless scaling was working with the first released drivers. It does not care which gpu and driver you are using. Just make a proper video showcasing the lack of hardware acceleration on windows. Much more usefull
Is there anything like this but for Steam VR?
Lossless 10 minutes, no more no less.
Maybe install a version of Tiny11, where most of the bloatware of windows is removed for a much lighter OS.
I’ve actually thought about doing a tiny 11 install on this now that we have drivers
can you please try the FFXVI demo with this?
This is a very cool tool but falls a bit to the mis-marketing of frame generation. Frame gen is something that should have only been marketed as a way to get games that are already able to run at 120FPS to 240FPS. I say this because of the latency that results from the processes. The higher the base frame rate is, the lower the felt latency will be. Personally, I could see myself using this for games that already run at a base 70-80FPS on my Ally X and I use it to get the full 120 the screen can do. But trying it on games that run below 60FPS has just too much of a felt latency, Like ok, Maybe I am seeing a much smoother 80FPS vs 40, but there is no so much input delay that feels like I am playing at 20fps lol.
As an example, I tried playing RE4:RM and had a base of 51FPS and a generated 102FPS. The input latency was felt pretty strong to the point it felt like I was using a cloud gaming service. Not unplayable, but the smoothness was not worth the lower response time. However, I then played CoD:MW2, showed a base of 74 (which is oddly much lower than I normally get with this off), and a generated 148. This felt way more responsive and totally playable. But it was also still not as responsive as having it off but still a much better experience than RE4 was. Same with GTAV, base of around 80 and it the input latency was totally playable and felt pretty good.Its for these reasons I really think Frame Gen is more geared for titles already getting 120FPS and trying to push 240.
Yes it depends on the game. On my Nvidia card with Nivida reflex, some games are fine even with only 80 generated frames, and 55 fps without frame gen, seems choppy when moving the mouse. On other games, even with reflex it's not great. So i hope that most games will have low latency in near future.
Maybe the steam deck 2 will use it
Really cool tech. :)
Windows💙💙💙
if only we had something like this on steam os. would be nice if AFMF 2 was available from the performance menu.
Damn I really hope this makes its way to linux soon!
YES!!!!! It's here!!!!!!!!
NOOOO!!! It's in Microsucks Windonts