Model Railroading 101 Diesel Locomotives For Beginners Pt 1
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 พ.ค. 2017
- #trains #Diesel #ModelRailroading101 #MR101
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Welcome back to class! In this episode of MR101 we take a look at early diesel locomotives. We discuss some information about how they work, and there is also a fairly detailed look at several types of locomotives - even hydraulics and turbines.
Another great primer for beginners, and a great reminder for someone with a little more experience. You might learn something new that you didn't already know!
Production note: it was brought to my attention that the segment in this program on F units contains inaccurate information. Our presenter plagiarized, verbatim, incorrect information that was published to Wikipedia in his script when this program was released; so it would behoove you to check with more accurate sources if you need precise information. I apologize for any inconvenience. I have chosen to leave the program on line because it is still effective at providing enough general information to pique someone's interest, and should still be effective at encouraging others to learn more.
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Another huge difference between steam and diesel: To start a large steam locomotive from cold takes in the area of 8 or more hours to raise steam. Plus there are hours of checks and maintenance (usually split up among 2 or 3 men) that goes on concurrently to the firing. A diesel needs a lot fewer checks and maintenance. It is much more like starting a car. From cold, a diesel can be ready to go in 15 to 30 minutes.
Consider if a train has an 8 to 12 hours layover. On steam locomotive, either you have someone mind it and spend the fuel to keep it hot, or you have to do the hours long start up to build steam. One could start out with less than full pressure and build pressure while rolling, but that might not work well with a heavy load or climbing a hill. With a few minutes of warm up, the diesel is ready to make full power.
All of the above is why you often see steam locomotives being moved for short trip by being pushed or pulled by a diesel. It is impractical to spend 8 hours building steam for a one-hour trip or just to move the locomotive around the yard.
I was attached to a diesel submarine in the late 60s with 4 Fairbanks-Morse 12 cylinder opposed piston engines. The old WW2 boats had GMC 10 cylinder engines. The piston-rod assembly weighed 273 lb.
Gas turbine is like a jet engine. The turbine turns a shaft, jet uses thrust for power. Great series. Keep up the good work.
13:25 Huh, neat. I never knew there were dual-mode locomotives in the US. Turns out the first FL9s were even triple-mode: they had pantographs for overhead wires, too. Some of the locomotives were still in use into the 21st century.
Answer: They copied each other.
Alco seems to have invented the hood unit yard switcher in about 1930 with it's HH (High Hood) series. EMD (orignally called EMC) started building their more successful SW's from about 1935.
EMD may have originated the cab unit, car body (E unit, then F unit "covered wagon") type in about 1937 - 1939. Alco and others quickly copied the concept from about 1939 - 1940.
Alco may have been the progenitor of the hood unit road switcher (basically a yard switcher with a washroom / storage closet extension under the "short hood") with their RS1 in about 1940, but there is some disagreement over this. EMD didn't start selling their (highly successful) GP's until about 1948, after Fairbanks Morse and Baldwin introduced their equivalent road switcher types.
During the 1950's, any successful new development by one manufacturer (eg. cut down short hood) was quickly copied by the others.
Figured it had to be something like that. Innovation invites imitation!
Very true. Alco's RS1 certainly originated the road switcher body style. EMD tried to combine the best of both worlds, (cab unit and hood unit) with the BL2 - a short lived offering that was so ugly it's kind of beautiful - but quickly realized that the road switcher layout pioneered by Alco was the ideal design, and the superb GP7 was the result. I must admit, though, I do love the lines of the early Alco RS series locomotives. Prettiest road switchers ever built.
I don't necessarily think EMD copied Alco's design so much as they just recognized a good thing when they saw it. Let's face it, there aren't exactly an infinite number of ways to configure a locomotive. Like cars, eventually they all kind of look the same.
I know ALCO also pioneered the 6 axle road switchers in 1941 with the export model RSD-1 which was a C-C 6 axle 1'000 or 1'350hp road switcher for Russia during world war II, after the war unfortunately Russia Copied the design and made their own 1'500hp 6 axle road switcher called Class RS-15C and they made thousands of them, ultimately replacing steam by 1956.
The Republic of Russia still uses some for transporting space rockets, passengers, Etc. Just FYI.
The RS1 was Alco's last locomotive to be a big hit, EMD copied the RS1 when they designed the GP7 from that point on ALCO was playing catch up.
If I remember correctly with the FT model, "F" stood for Freight, and "T" stood for the 1350 horsepower of the unit. Also from what I understand F units, and I guess E units as well, are not legal for use as the controlling locomotive when doing switching operations. I think F7/F9 series units had slightly different main electrical system set-ups than those of the GP7/GP9 models too, but it's been awhile since I've read a GP7 or GP9 operators manual from cover to cover.
You said you weren't going to show examples of every diesel.. but you came close (I think).. impressive.
Dan's collection is even bigger than he realizes. :)
Missed my fave, the SW1...
weres the bl2?
shoud do a video for just the switchers, boxcabs and critter types
I missed why steam generation in a diesel is required for passenger trains. But I started researching and it's used for producing hot water in the passenger cars and heat generation in cold climates.
Yep. Steam-era passenger cars had low-power electrics for lighting but the easiest way to get heat was from the gigantic kettle at the front of the train. Early diesel locomotives had steam generators for backwards-compatibility with the existing passenger cars.
there was also the diesel mechanical locomotives that were used alot in the UK and czechaslovakia between 1960-1980 which were pretty much just tractors on rails (also a couple american railroads used them in the 1920s)
Well done! Liked!
Fun Fact, END created the idea of the GP be side their new chief engineer wanted to make locomotives that where made for functionality only and not for beauty like the F Units where.
I love steam but Lima 750's, EMD BL2's, and ALCO RSD-15's are some of my favorite freight locomotives. Diesels can be really neat, especially passenger units.
Erie Mining company Ran A-B-B-B-B-A sets of F units on ore trains until 2002!
I hope they weren't scrapped. F units are my favourite of all locomotives in the world
Black Terminal most were, Erie Mining shut down in 02 and most of there power was scrapped. An A B set is at the North Shore Scenic Railroad in Duluth, MN.
@@railsofthenorthland1181 that's terrible. How many locomotive fans would have begged to save them. I would have. F series forever imo. I love them
I did a fantasy move where I took one of the A and B units and remade them into the Batman and Robin team. Actually there were two Bachmann Hawthorne units I ordered in the 1990's. Still, the fantasy part was that my railroad now has two of the Erie Mining locomotives used in private and excursion services.
The depth of knowledge here is truly impressive! I'm in the planning stages for Pennsylvania to Massachusetts right now and this will help a lot. Thanks!
If you want to know about the various diesel locomotive builders and the models they produced and during what years, spend the money for a copy of "The Second Diesel Spotter's Guide" published by Kalmbach Publishing. For example EMD began production of the BL1 in 2/1948 but Alco began production of their hooded road units (an RS-1) in 3/1941.
Union Pacific tried Steam Turbines and The better known Gas Turbines... General Electric did the production of the different types of Turbines. The earlier types (4500 HP) were only one unit and were the regular cab model and the Verandas with the walk way along both sides. The Big Blows were the 8500 HP 3 piece units. and the turbines operated into the late 70's. Union Pacific actually built one of their own that had a PA1 as the head end unit... took a GG1 and stripped it down and built it with a turbine unit on it and a converted centipede tender to process what they used to power the turbine... COAL! Pulverized Coal!!! That one was 8500 HP too! Only one they ever built. trucks from the older turbines were traded in for use in the GE U50 .
I love this but it would be nice to hear some dates. So we beginning modelers can be more exact in our layouts. Thanks!
Easy to find out!
This is a great primer for early diesel prime movers. Keep up the great work, guys! I look forward to your next 2 enlightening episodes on diesels. -from Tom Pilling
The early slant nose EMD E-units are, to me, the best looking diesel locomotives ever made, followed by the ALCO PA, the the various other ALCO and EMD carbody units. The EMD E units came first, being released in the late 1930's with the ALCO PA's coming later after the war.
When it comes to hood units, I'm partial to Fairbanks Morse (FM) locomotives and their Canadian Locomotive Company (CLC) clones, because the mechanical oddity of their opposed piston engines. For similar reason those gas and steam turbine locomotives are also fascinating...
Important note about the MU system: The 6 - 8 hoses below the coupler are air synchro hoses, the electric control bus cable is above the coupler on either side. Modern MU is nearly all linked by the master bus cable or a wireless control link (for DPU). In an MOW application or a specialized train like those on a mine railroad, one of the synchro lines will be modified as an actuator control link for air actuated operation like the 5 bay Trinity rapid discharge hoppers or the UP side discharge Ballast hoppers.
There was steam preservation, now there's diesel preservation. I've found a video here on TH-cam, of a rare alco mrs-1 switcher locomotive on the Texas state railroad, and one on the sierra railway, in Jamestown, California. If you wanna preserve a diesel, you gotta keep it pristine, not rusting away in the siding, otherwise, you might as well scrap it. Hell, I've read an alco mrs-1 on the white river scenic railroad in Arkansas got scrapped last year, and she was falling apart. And I think the sierra railway unit is scrapped too.
Thankfully my local railroad loves diesel preservation. They own 3 of the last 4 known Lima diesels, one of which has been running for decades. A second unit is being restored to operational condition as well.
Nice assortment of locos, love the series great information.
great tips Dan, I can't wait for Part two
Very Well Done. Thanks for all your prep time and research.
Awesome information thanks for putting this series together.
I am just starting with model railroading and I think these videos are superb! Thanks for posting. :)
I love Niles Canyon. My family goes on the holiday train there every year.
and the six axle switchers were built to alleviate the track, as many smaller railway lines did not support the heavy switchers with only four axles.
Well done, impressive to say the least, thanks
13:26 yooo fl9! My favorite
My First HO scale Diesel was a Life Like Proto 1000 GP40F in UP colors
Thanks for that. Filled in a few gaps in my knowledge...........Now looking forward to the next episode in the series....
Thanks for watching!
Excellent information, ty 👍🏼
thanks for the great info as always .like your show.
Thanks very much for watching. Please share our content with your friends!
Great series Fellas
Very Interesting
Thank you
Impressive and informative vid on HO passenger cars. Into HO passenger cars myself and a member of the railroad club in Pleasanton, CA. Have the complete original CZ set.
Really enjoyed the video but I recently learned engineers are told not to use dynamic brakes except on very very light trains or when just moving the locomotive around. The reason, from the UP engineer I talked to, is if you apply brakes on the locomotive and the rest of the cars have no brakes applied, the cars will slam into the locomotive and can cause crew injuries and possible damage/derailment; instead they apply air brakes to everything but the locomotive and let the locomotive coast.
Great video guys.
17:15 Correct -- the extra axle is for weight distribution. The locomotives were too heavy to sit on just two axles. Why not power it? Because the amount of power produced by the engine and generator can be handled by four traction motors. Adding two more traction motors wouldn't achieve much and the extra unsprung mass would make the locomotives harder on the track than the version with two unpowered axles.You might gain a little reliability from running the individual traction motors at lower power but, on the other hand, you also lose reliability because there are more traction motors to fail.
Very well done. I work on most of what talked about .
This was a beautiful video very informative
Glad you enjoyed it!
Theres nothing more difficult than taking a subject in which you know a lot of information about and simplifying it down to 101. Well done.
It's true. There is always more than you have time for and you know for sure that someone will ask you about something you had to omit. Oh well. Still enough there for people to get some good info.
I have great idea for MR101 after diesels pt.2 and diesels pt.3 the idea is basic structure, buildings, bridges and roads designs for small and large layouts for N scale and HO scale
This is on our list of topics already, or at least something very similar to it. Stay tuned and thanks for the suggestion!
Lots of those switchers "long nose and cab in rear" have been used as mining trains in my area...known as Great Northern railway
ah so the great northern was local for you as well
Your great!
The F B units actually look like wagons, when I was young I mistook them for generator wagons xD
Go to the dam bathroom John...we're not stopping, Great show Dan. Backroads Bob
Man I learned a ton!
@ 13:24 805a is derailed
About the extra third axle: Not exactly sure if its true, but the reason I was given by one Loco Pilot in India, was that it aided in ground traction during start, especially when loco has to pull extra heavy loads.
That's what the third axle is for when it's powered, yes. When it's unpowered, it's for weight distribution, as stated in the video.
Your banter is silly but fun!😂🎉❤
That was the point, thanks for catching it!
RJ Corman has a gp9 iv seen it before and in lima ohio there is an abandon and/or old alco rs1 switcher
Excellent video! I consider myself a seasoned newbie, but I find the Model Railroading 101 vids great. Always something new to learn.
Really looking forward to the next parts. Then we'll get more into my eras.
One thing, what was the purpose of the high hood units in the first place? Did they contain something that they were able to miniaturise at a later time? Or was it just how they wanted locomotives due to crash worthiness?
EMD was first with the E units.
Diesel parts were no more interchangeable between manufacturers than steam. Yes, two EMD F units (that you show) have a lot of interchangeability, but different models (and definitely different manufacturers) had the same parts issues as steam. And, in the beginning, not all diesels could be MU'd, especially different makes and models.
The video doesn't claim parts compatibility between manufacturers. The point is that EMD only offered a small number of models of diesel locomotive, and they build 2400 F7As that were broadly speaking identical, rather than building 50 model 1 steam locomotives, 75 model 2's, 30 model 3's, etc.
cant wait for Model Railroader 101 Diesels pt.2 and pt.3 hope it dont take a month for each part cant wait
MR101 comes out every 4th Saturday in every month. Sorry we don't have time to do them more often!
F units are my favorites
Another great video!!! I would have liked to heard more of what the differences were between the NW and SW switchers but overall I learned a ton!
Hey David it was great to meet you!
You as well.. felt like I was meeting a celebrity! LOL Looking for to this months 101!!
:)) A celebrity!? A low rent one perhaps. :))
S = 600 horsepower
N = 900 horsepower
SW = 600 welded frame
SC = 600 cast frame.
GE came first, then the other diesel manufacturers. the reason was that GE was ahead in the electrical equipment, as they were the first ones to produce reliable diesel electric switchers. those came before the heavy locomotives. GE could use their know how from the switchers to design the long distance diesel locomotives.
It is very cool history to learn about. One wonders how long it will take US railroads to switch over to electric, as so much of Europe already has.
I have a 1964 rivarossi model of a Krauss Maffei cab unit
EMD E & F Units were first; the ALCO PA & PB were basically copies of EMD
nice video
Thanks Keith, and thanks for watching. Please share this channel with your friends if you know any one else who might enjoy it.
i had a train when i was a kid but these trains are cool . my step dad had trains too
There's an E8b unit on the railroad by me that has 4 wheel trucks
Alco PA, only had one Diesel engine and was turbocharged
Nice to see diesels getting some love, but I wanted to ask something them and steam in general.
1. What do you think of railfans saying that steam loco's should be brought back as well as adding the fact they say steamers are stronger than diesels because a lot steam locos, especially articulated ones, can pull freight trains by themselves?
A lot of people have opinions. A lot of opinions are not based in reality.
Ah. I was just wondering what you think because I feel a lot of people over exaggerate steam locomotive's capabilities sometimes.
It's kind of like thinking that airlines should go back to old non-turbo prop planes again. It will not happen. Steam locomotives should be preserved for sure, and they should also run from time to time; but to think any mainline would even consider returning to 19th century technology for business is pretty absurd.
I couldn't agree more.
But they run 20th century technology. And electric locos are the king. They can be small and have greater speeds than diesels. And with a very good acceleration and no environmental harm.
Also steam locos could do the exact same job with the exact same performance as diesels BUT you can also go to the supermarket with a motor bike same as fast as with a bike. I would though like to see different new experimental steam locos with new and untested technology just for fun, maybe something useful and romantic could come out. The thing electricity is like water for steam engines it requires some infrastructure but it has a lot of benefits.
Is SF 304 the same loco from the forth episode just redesigned
I'm out railfanning and nothing is on the scanner...seems like a good chance to watch this video!
You find time for the important stuff! :)
Well actually, about halfway through the video, a BNSF autorack came hurtling though at 60 mph.
Hope you didn't miss your run by!
That's a lot of fast weight if loaded - pretty sweet - hope the ground shook - only counts if you can feel it in your feet :)
N and W Ran long hood forward for Crew Safety..:)
No. The crew were just hopping it would turn into a steamer. 😁
I find it strange that N&W set up their power long hood forward, but put the bell on the short hood end, where as the Southern ordered their highhoods with the bell on either the short hood end, or the long hood end depending on which end was specified as the front. And now that I think about it, my understanding is the N&W highhoods were ordered with dual control stands.
Please explain about details on engines and cars, plastic versus metal.Lionel O gauge have a high line of models with sound etcAny thing similar about details and sound in HOThank you
Not sure I understand this comment/request. Metal parts tend to be a lot more durable than plastic detail parts. Is that what you mean?
The only time EMD copied ALCO was the GP 7
The M497, New York central twin jet engine budd car
That's the one!
Question..... why when two or more locomotives are used to pull the trailers one must go in reverse? why can they all go on same direction?
No, you can set them up in either direction. Most modelers put one or more facing the opposite direction because that is what we see in real life.
The locomotives work equally well in either direction. When two or more are connected together, they usually try to put a cab at each end so that the group of locomotives can equally easily be driven in either direction.
I've watched dozens of youtube videos mentioning "working sessions". I'm pretty sure what it is, but could you describe what it is, and a simple, sensible way to develop one?
An operating session would require a level of customization that is as unique as any given layout. Not sure you can do a generic program about that. Analyze the needs of the people operating, decide how to produce loads and figure out how and where to move them. It might help if your layout was fashioned after a non-fictional line and you had intimate knowledge of its operations in real life.
Interesting... maybe you could go through creating a operating session on an example layout? I'm more curious how it's created, and what it looks like, not the specifics.
Stay tuned. I may have something in mind that will fit the bill.
what about Electro diesels?
turbo train was helicpter jet engine powered...
That's about 2 grand in trains .the hobby is very expensive
mmmmmhhhhh, rio grande... :-)
Y u no own Fairbanks & Morris
Where are parts 2,3, & 4 ??? :) I'm impatient and have lots of "TH-cam" time on this 100º + day in Phoenix.
The answer to your question is at the end of the program. Episode 2 will come out on June 24.
It was a joke, guys ... unfortunately, TH-cam doesn't do smileys in the comments.
I saw the :) but wasn't sure if it meant you were joking or just smiling. :)) That is a laugh to me with two )) like that.
What manufacturers made these diesel models and what scale are they? HO right? Or N?
Hi Jack. The video is about the prototypes and the models are included simply to demonstrate what each prototype being discussed looks like. The models in the video are either HO or N scale.
@@tsgmultimedia ok what manufacturers made them? Athearn, Bachmann, Like Like, Atlas, Kato, Walters, which one?
The simple answer is "yes" as in all of the above, except Lifelike or Bachmann. Unless you're counting Proto-2000 as Lifelike.
@@tsgmultimedia well yes same
Thing right? Life like and proto 2000? Are there any rivet counter scale trains, fox valley models or intermountain railway company?
No Scale Trains in this video. Who remembers about the rest...
12:31 one of them are derailed
I think it would be neat to review train simulators and model railroad sims... yes there are simulators of the model railroading...simulating life LOL ... Sometimes space is at a premium and sometimes you just like to make layouts a lot and then make another.... and Trainz and Train Simulator... I think Microsofts train sim but i THINK they got out of the game... shame - they were good. ... anyways - those allow making and editting layouts - enjoy your shows - great job fellas :)
That would be different. Neither one of us really does the simulator thing. I have an old TRAINZ simulator from 10-12 years ago and Railroad Tycoon 3, but haven't looked at either one in almost as long.
I totally understand. I can say that without these, many of us railfans wouldnt be modeling railroads let alone the cool cab rides if it werent for the simulators. Its funny - there is more crossover than some may think... scenery tips, info about prototypes, track plan ideas... good designs and prototypical advice always applies too - its another part of model railroad - but I think there may be some push back from some... So I declare this is simply a new scale: PC Scale ;) haha Peace - Great Show!
Yes. Don't read the comments as denigrating. I just haven't had time to fire up the simulators. I have seen videos of them that look really neat.
You rock - and I didn't think anything negative at all - in fact I appreciate you plain fact candor bro! I didn't think anything bad - no way - you are always polite - anyone can see that here in the comments and on all your videos :)
"usually polite" would be more accurate. Sometimes the tolerance for BS runs low. :))
Very informative . Your sidekick is kinda annoying at times..
Maybe you should watch it a few more times!
It's funny that EMD used to be part of GM. Considering that EMD is now Progress Rail which is owned by Caterpillar. Of course, the rail industry is dying, so that may be part of that.
Go Away I wouldn't say dying. But it is stagnating.
Well this aged horribly
Steams where Made when no sytem control existe soto be able tó makle many was good
20 dislikes because they wanted him to have every model. lol
they both copied eachother well the GP7 was a copy of the RS1 but the RS11 was a copy of the GP9 and PA was a copy of the E7
Hate the music...just sayin"'...otherwise great stuff guys...
who the fuck would be pro-union?
What are you talking about?