Ruth, if you find chapter 4 of Elders Training Book 7 offensive, wait until you’ve read chapters 5,6 and 7. In those chapters W Lee appoints himself as the 1. Top Apostle on the earth (Ch 5) 2. Commander in Chief of God’s Army (Ch 6) 3. Unique Wise Master Builder of the church (Ch 7) Some years later W Lee said to the saints in the Recovery that he never called himself an apostle. Witness Lee was a liar, a deceiver. Witness Lee was a self appointed apostle in the vein of Rev 2:2.
The passages are weird. You cannot hear those passages and think they are up-to-date revelation without prior conditioning. Had you read the passages and attributed them, sneakily, to David Koresh, Mary Baker Eddy, Jim Jones, Idi Amin, Herbert W Armstrong, Joseph Smith, or any of a number of authoritarian sect leaders, everyone in The Recovery would condemn such passages. I read those passages as a part of my early devouring of everything I could get my hands on (from LSM) and I absorbed them uncritically as from the Lord’s Oracle. Now, with a step back and a discerning ear: it’s weird. So weird
sounds like an abusive relationship. you can’t expose the sins of the leaders or else you’re a rebel and we’ll excommunicate you, but also if you leave you’re divorcing yourself from the proper standing with God and relation to his greatest move in history think about that. if that’s not spiritual abuse what is it? if that doesn’t describe a cult what else is it? Lee sounds like an abusive husband here, and he’s making the churches out to be an abusive environment 100% this attitude and way of thinking has permeated the local churches as well. they absolutely still have this attitude. they look down on others who are not meeting with them, yet simultaneously they’re puzzled as to why they can’t grow their numbers 🙄 When I left I was more or less condescended to over my decision and borderline laughed at by one of the leading brothers who contacted me. I had known this brother for years and worked closely and intimately with him. I was lucky to even get that contact, because no one else contacted me and asked what was wrong or how I was doing. they’ll pray for you, but only in the context of hoping you’ll return because theyre convinced and psychologically conditioned that only the local churches are doing the right thing. this reminds me of like Mormonism or Scientology or something. if you’re not in their thing then you might as well be on another planet. this was one of the biggest things that made me realize it’s a cult the leading speakers and leading brothers have been saying the same thing for decades. “if you leave the recovery you won’t be able to go on spiritually and your spiritual life will go down.” they’ve even threatened physical death, I’ve heard them say it as a warning. it’s almost like warning their captives not to escape. I especially heard this around 2007-2008ish. looking back I realize that was a time when there was a lot of exposing truth going out on the internet and the leaders didn’t want the members to go read it. it was always in that context. “don’t go on the internet and read what the dissenters are saying” can you imagine in any other church context if the leaders stood up and told the congregation that if they leave or read dissenting things that God might kill them. think about how crazy that is
@@Just-n9x yes. “Dissenters” are those who pray for the Lord’s leading. For godly men to stay around a day longer after such a word is incredible… until you understand cult dynamics. When a few godly leading brothers did graciously exit a couple years AFTER Witness Lee spoke this about being a (abusive) husband, and after trying to address leaders’ sins and errors, they were spoken and written about in “ The Fermentation of the Present Rebellion” by Witness Lee and “Response to Recent Accusations” by Ron Kangas and Kerry Robichaux…. (Etc.) And anyone who speaks out about such abusive patterns is deemed rebellious and negative and poisonous and shunned.😔 NOT a proper “husband’s” way… and NOT God’s way at all!!!!
Is there a Lord's Recovery without Living Stream Ministry? If one says yes, then I say set aside the LSM publications and just take the Bible as our basis for fellowship.
_The one publication is not only a testimony of our oneness in the Body but also a safeguard for the unique ministry in the Lord’s recovery. Without one publication, there is no way to preserve the integrity of the Lord’s ministry among us, which is crucial to the practical oneness among the local churches. Brother Lee gave this word of testimony on this crucial matter in the Lord’s recovery._ _Today we must be diligent to continue this practice of the trumpeting in the one publication in a practical way through the publication service of Living Stream Ministry and Taiwan Gospel Book Room._ *(Publication Work In The Lord’s Recovery, published by Living Stream Ministry)*
@@Peanut9527 😔publication is a testimony of our oneness??? Publication safeguards the “unique ministry in The Lord’s Recovery”? So what about all those ministers of Christ today and throughout the centuries, none of whom have/had a publishing company…??? I believe that their NOT having a publication center preserved their ministry from influence of profit and platform..
When I read W. Lee's phrase in one of these works a few years ago that I was not only a New Testament apostle, but also Paul, it was probably a translation error, I thought in disbelief.😢 Yesterday I reread D.'s book.Ingals, where he says that U.Lee told him that he was thinking about a new path, but couldn't talk to him about it because John hadn't perfected enough yet.... At the same time, he surrounded himself with young elders. D.I. was warned that if W. Lee said something he didn't like, he would look for a way to get rid of the man, but John I. chose to follow his conscience and the Lord. chose to follow It is clear that this man, when talking about mixing, did not allow anyone to touch him in order to be measured, balanced, corrected. Moreover, he turned out to be not so smart, which is what we see, rogue, swindler.
Ruth, if you find chapter 4 of Elders Training Book 7 offensive, wait until you’ve read chapters 5,6 and 7.
In those chapters W Lee appoints himself as the
1. Top Apostle on the earth (Ch 5)
2. Commander in Chief of God’s Army (Ch 6)
3. Unique Wise Master Builder of the church (Ch 7)
Some years later W Lee said to the saints in the Recovery that he never called himself an apostle.
Witness Lee was a liar, a deceiver. Witness Lee was a self appointed apostle in the vein of Rev 2:2.
The passages are weird. You cannot hear those passages and think they are up-to-date revelation without prior conditioning. Had you read the passages and attributed them, sneakily, to David Koresh, Mary Baker Eddy, Jim Jones, Idi Amin, Herbert W Armstrong, Joseph Smith, or any of a number of authoritarian sect leaders, everyone in The Recovery would condemn such passages.
I read those passages as a part of my early devouring of everything I could get my hands on (from LSM) and I absorbed them uncritically as from the Lord’s Oracle. Now, with a step back and a discerning ear: it’s weird. So weird
sounds like an abusive relationship. you can’t expose the sins of the leaders or else you’re a rebel and we’ll excommunicate you, but also if you leave you’re divorcing yourself from the proper standing with God and relation to his greatest move in history
think about that. if that’s not spiritual abuse what is it? if that doesn’t describe a cult what else is it? Lee sounds like an abusive husband here, and he’s making the churches out to be an abusive environment
100% this attitude and way of thinking has permeated the local churches as well. they absolutely still have this attitude. they look down on others who are not meeting with them, yet simultaneously they’re puzzled as to why they can’t grow their numbers 🙄
When I left I was more or less condescended to over my decision and borderline laughed at by one of the leading brothers who contacted me. I had known this brother for years and worked closely and intimately with him. I was lucky to even get that contact, because no one else contacted me and asked what was wrong or how I was doing. they’ll pray for you, but only in the context of hoping you’ll return because theyre convinced and psychologically conditioned that only the local churches are doing the right thing. this reminds me of like Mormonism or Scientology or something. if you’re not in their thing then you might as well be on another planet. this was one of the biggest things that made me realize it’s a cult
the leading speakers and leading brothers have been saying the same thing for decades. “if you leave the recovery you won’t be able to go on spiritually and your spiritual life will go down.” they’ve even threatened physical death, I’ve heard them say it as a warning. it’s almost like warning their captives not to escape. I especially heard this around 2007-2008ish. looking back I realize that was a time when there was a lot of exposing truth going out on the internet and the leaders didn’t want the members to go read it. it was always in that context. “don’t go on the internet and read what the dissenters are saying”
can you imagine in any other church context if the leaders stood up and told the congregation that if they leave or read dissenting things that God might kill them. think about how crazy that is
@@Just-n9x yes. “Dissenters” are those who pray for the Lord’s leading. For godly men to stay around a day longer after such a word is incredible… until you understand cult dynamics. When a few godly leading brothers did graciously exit a couple years AFTER Witness Lee spoke this about being a (abusive) husband, and after trying to address leaders’ sins and errors, they were spoken and written about in “ The Fermentation of the Present Rebellion” by Witness Lee and “Response to Recent Accusations” by Ron Kangas and Kerry Robichaux…. (Etc.) And anyone who speaks out about such abusive patterns is deemed rebellious and negative and poisonous and shunned.😔 NOT a proper “husband’s” way… and NOT God’s way at all!!!!
They also forbid members of their community to communicate with those who disagree with W. Lee as spiritually ill. They intimidate people very much.
Is there a Lord's Recovery without Living Stream Ministry? If one says yes, then I say set aside the LSM publications and just take the Bible as our basis for fellowship.
_The one publication is not only a testimony of our oneness in the Body but also a safeguard for the unique ministry in the Lord’s recovery. Without one publication, there is no way to preserve the integrity of the Lord’s ministry among us, which is crucial to the practical oneness among the local churches. Brother Lee gave this word of testimony on this crucial matter in the Lord’s recovery._
_Today we must be diligent to continue this practice of the trumpeting in the one publication in a practical way through the publication service of Living Stream Ministry and Taiwan Gospel Book Room._
*(Publication Work In The Lord’s Recovery, published by Living Stream Ministry)*
@@Peanut9527 😔publication is a testimony of our oneness??? Publication safeguards the “unique ministry in The Lord’s Recovery”? So what about all those ministers of Christ today and throughout the centuries, none of whom have/had a publishing company…??? I believe that their NOT having a publication center preserved their ministry from influence of profit and platform..
When I read W. Lee's phrase in one of these works a few years ago that I was not only a New Testament apostle, but also Paul, it was probably a translation error, I thought in disbelief.😢
Yesterday I reread D.'s book.Ingals, where he says that U.Lee told him that he was thinking about a new path, but couldn't talk to him about it because John hadn't perfected enough yet....
At the same time, he surrounded himself with young elders. D.I. was warned that if W. Lee said something he didn't like, he would look for a way to get rid of the man, but John I. chose to follow his conscience and the Lord. chose to follow It is clear that this man, when talking about mixing, did not allow anyone to touch him in order to be measured, balanced, corrected.
Moreover, he turned out to be not so smart, which is what we see, rogue, swindler.
Supreme and utter nonsense.