Did the Sun Stop Moving (Joshua 10)?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ก.ค. 2022
- Joshua 10 seems to suggest that Joshua commanded the sun to stop moving in the sky, but is this really what the Hebrew says? Have we misunderstood this verse for centuries? A special thanks to the scholars, John Walton and Mark Chavalas for helping make this video.
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I have no problem with this interpretation, but I find it ridiculous anyone would suggest that if God had literally stopped the Earth from rotating he wouldn’t also take care of the physical by-products of such a miracle.
True, but the bigger problem is that if it actually happened that the sun didn't set for 24 hours, this would have been noticed and recorded by everyone everywhere , which it wasn't
@@Michael-bk5nz plus it seems an overelaborate miracle. Why change the earth spinning and mitigate all the effects of that to give the Israelites longer to win a battle why not just help them in some other way. I believe God does miracles and he can do anything vyr it seems our of character for God to modify the scientific laws he set up for one day on a massive basis in order to achieve a relatively trivial outcome.
@@Michael-bk5nz Good point, but I also feel like that’s a bit of an argument from silence. We don’t have an exhaustive collection of writings from all the ancient cultures so several of them could have written about it and they’ve simply been lost to history. So idk how compelling IP’s argument is
@@ravikeller9626 We don't need exhaustive records, just one country somewhere, and it doesn't have to be from the exact same time period, as such an event would no doubt be remembered for generations, many civilizations, like China and India already had writing at that time period and we have extensive knowledge of their history....such a memory surely would have survived at least in mythology, yet there is no evidence of any culture anywhere having such a myth
The request was, “Sun, stand still over Gibeon”, not over the whole Earth. If stopping the Earth/Sun is possible (as creating them was), then dilating time locally or bending light for a few hours is even more possible. On a small scale false sunsets happen frequently with reflections and refractions in our atmosphere. A miraculous version of this would be seen on a local scale. I’m not saying that’s what happened, but if we’re looking into possible ways to execute a miracle, I put that on the table.
This interpretation is plausible but other points and possibilities:
1. Interpreters aren't sure which sections are being quoted as being from the book of Jasher (I.e. where the quotation marks properly belong). It could be this book is giving us a poetic, hyperbolic or picturesque take on the event.
2. Even if this is indicating that the sun and moon stopped, for some period, in one location in the sky, it could simply be a local phenomenon, essentially a miraculous optical illusion that only affected those involved in the battle.
I would say option 2 makes more sense
and thus we can simply say that the entire bible is "illusion", or "exaggeration" or whatever other excuses you want to use, and not believe that any of it is literal.
@@velkyn1 Two separate issues
The Bible does contain hyperbolic language. But that's neither uncommon nor deceptive.
Some miracles might involve optical illusions, used to mislead God's enemies. But that happens at God's behest, it isn't some blanket explanation for any and all miracles.
@YAJUN YUAN That's your own commentary. The text doesn't say the earth stopped rotating.
@@davidgadbois6839 "Two separate issues
The Bible does contain hyperbolic language. But that's neither uncommon nor deceptive.
Some miracles might involve optical illusions, used to mislead God's enemies. But that happens at God's behest, it isn't some blanket explanation for any and all miracles."
Oh, now the bible contains "hyperbolic language". Yep, it does. Funny how all of the essential events are full of it, and since Christians can't agree if those events occured as described or as something else, it shows that you all simply make up your religion in your own images. So, no reason to think that any of it should be believed as true. You all use your personal magic decoder rings to come up with what you want to claim this god "really" meant.
It is quite deceptive, if Christians claim this nonsense is true. Happily it isn't and no one has to be afraid of some magical being and its "hell". I do enjoy watching Christians depower their god repeatedly since the stories are so hilariously ridiculous that even they can't believe them.
30 years ago, as a young teen at school, I sat with this text and just couldn't believe it. My teacher (and the educational system they were part of) said, "Just take it at face value. If it says stopped then it stopped."
I have spent 30 years of my subsequent Christian life absolutely struggling against this framework for reading the ancient scriptures. I now know that there are other well informed hermeneutical methods, but what a waste of 30 years to have to slowly unpick and disentangle things...some which are not consequential to our lives today (such as this battle event) but much which is very consequential.
Thanks IP for this piece of work. Great communication and research skills you have, and more importantly, great commitment to curiosity and accuracy.
Joshua, like Jesus, is a personification of the sun.
@Harvey Wabbit there is no evidence to support that. Also, you have to be a complete idiot to think that sun and son are the same.
Or.... maybe the Bible was wrong on the cosmology of the earth and it shouldn't be taken as the absolute perfect infallible word of god?
@@Raiyoken1
Especially since the priests invented the biblical God. Check out the story of Satan and the Priest, by Gibran.
Christians need to stop shooting themselves in the foot.
I have never thought of it this way. Thank you for going beyond what we read and putting it in perspective of the “day/era”. It helps me understand more of Gods word and power!
Isaiah 38:8
Behold, I will bring again the shadow of the degrees, which has gone down in the sundial of Ahaz, ten degrees backward.’” So the sun returned ten degrees by which degrees it had gone down.
2Kings 20:9
And Isaiah said, This sign shalt thou have of the Lord, that the Lord will do the thing that he hath spoken: shall the shadow go forward ten degrees, or go back ten degrees?
10 And Hezekiah answered, It is a light thing for the shadow to go down ten degrees: nay, but let the shadow return backward ten degrees.
11 And Isaiah the prophet cried unto the Lord: and he brought the shadow ten degrees backward, by which it had gone down in the dial of Ahaz.
Psalms 104:5 Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.
Where does scripture say the earth moves? Where does scripture of the text say to read any other doctrine? Including book of jubilees or any other religious doctrine? Good to read I guess but are the authors inspired by God to write those books?
Read your Bible:
Joshua 10:
11 While they fled before Israel along the descent of Beth-horon, the LORD hurled great stones from the heavens* above them all the way to Azekah, killing many.d More died from these hailstones than the Israelites killed with the sword.
12 It was then, when the LORD delivered up the Amorites to the Israelites, that Joshua prayed to the LORD, and said in the presence of Israel:
Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
Moon, in the valley of Aijalon!
13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
…
The Bible CLEARLY states that God hurled great stones from the sky onto the enemies of Israel, and these stones killed more of these enemies than were killed by the Israelites..
So you can’t interpret these stones other than what they are described: stones sent as missiles by the creator to kill certain people he doesn’t like….
As for stopping the sun and the moon. You interpretation (speaking on behalf of god) ignores the obvious and clear assertion in Joshua 10:13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
This is recorded in the Book of Jashar. The sun halted halfway across the heavens; not for an entire day did it press on.
@@doyouknoworjustbelieve6694do you think God likes you, considering you speak against him like this? When you’ve figured out that God doesn’t favor you(due to your unbelief, cause his will is simply that you believe on him that’s John 6:29-40, and you haven’t even done that) and you realize he doesn’t kill you, it should spark something in your mind to help you understand that these people weren’t simply unfavored by God. They were being wicked AS HELL. When you see how wicked these ppl were, you’ll wonder “why did God ONLY hurl stones”
Hi from Australia
I came across your site recently. I appreciate sites that give an intelligent perspective on biblical issues. Love this site.
You know it's a ip video when he says your looking at it with your current culture eyes and he's right. We have to look at it at all angles
You are a blessing IP. Thanks so much for all your videos and your efforts
Great job as always!
Interesting, thanks IP. This help’s us to think deeper on text we don’t understand
Thank you for covering this.
Your videos on these subjects are really good man, thank you watching from Australia.
I'm learning so much from your video lecutures! Thanks!
Learn from the Holy Spirit my friend, you’re fed lies on here.. I pray that the Lord will open the eyes of your understanding so that you can see what believing these lies is doing to your faith in the word of God
Read your Bible:
Joshua 10:
11 While they fled before Israel along the descent of Beth-horon, the LORD hurled great stones from the heavens* above them all the way to Azekah, killing many.d More died from these hailstones than the Israelites killed with the sword.
12 It was then, when the LORD delivered up the Amorites to the Israelites, that Joshua prayed to the LORD, and said in the presence of Israel:
Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
Moon, in the valley of Aijalon!
13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
…
The Bible CLEARLY states that God hurled great stones from the sky onto the enemies of Israel, and these stones killed more of these enemies than were killed by the Israelites..
So you can’t interpret these stones other than what they are described: stones sent as missiles by the creator to kill certain people he doesn’t like….
As for stopping the sun and the moon. You interpretation (speaking on behalf of god) ignores the obvious and clear assertion in Joshua 10:13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
This is recorded in the Book of Jashar. The sun halted halfway across the heavens; not for an entire day did it press on.
One of my favorite characters of the books. Thanks for sharing.
My dude, that was a fantastic breakdown and interpretation 💪🏼🙏🏼
Read your Bible:
Joshua 10:
11 While they fled before Israel along the descent of Beth-horon, the LORD hurled great stones from the heavens* above them all the way to Azekah, killing many.d More died from these hailstones than the Israelites killed with the sword.
12 It was then, when the LORD delivered up the Amorites to the Israelites, that Joshua prayed to the LORD, and said in the presence of Israel:
Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
Moon, in the valley of Aijalon!
13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
…
The Bible CLEARLY states that God hurled great stones from the sky onto the enemies of Israel, and these stones killed more of these enemies than were killed by the Israelites..
So you can’t interpret these stones other than what they are described: stones sent as missiles by the creator to kill certain people he doesn’t like….
As for stopping the sun and the moon. You interpretation (speaking on behalf of god) ignores the obvious and clear assertion in Joshua 10:13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
This is recorded in the Book of Jashar. The sun halted halfway across the heavens; not for an entire day did it press on.
THANKS FOR ALL THIS EFFORT AND CLEARING IT UP
What an insane game play. Love watching you dive everyone man. Also you have the best outro music, jam got stuck in my head for how the other day.
Love these videos but always feel like that was so obvious why didn't I think of that, just from how well he breaks it all down then explains it
Read your Bible:
Joshua 10:
11 While they fled before Israel along the descent of Beth-horon, the LORD hurled great stones from the heavens* above them all the way to Azekah, killing many.d More died from these hailstones than the Israelites killed with the sword.
12 It was then, when the LORD delivered up the Amorites to the Israelites, that Joshua prayed to the LORD, and said in the presence of Israel:
Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
Moon, in the valley of Aijalon!
13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
…
The Bible CLEARLY states that God hurled great stones from the sky onto the enemies of Israel, and these stones killed more of these enemies than were killed by the Israelites..
So you can’t interpret these stones other than what they are described: stones sent as missiles by the creator to kill certain people he doesn’t like….
As for stopping the sun and the moon. You interpretation (speaking on behalf of god) ignores the obvious and clear assertion in Joshua 10:13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
This is recorded in the Book of Jashar. The sun halted halfway across the heavens; not for an entire day did it press on.
I remember thinking that the sun standing still for Joshua was the reason for leap days. I'm glad I'm not that dumb anymore
You are correct, there is a connection to the solar-lunar calendar. Have you noticed that many commenters have missed one simple definition and that is the solstice. "The solstice (combining the Latin words sol for “Sun” and sistere for “To Stand Still”) is the point where the Sun appears to reach either its highest or lowest point in the sky for the year and thus ancient astronomers came to know the day as one where the Sun appeared to stand still."
Regarding the idea that other cultures would remember it, I took the same theory and applied it to mythology, here's what I found:
China: The Ten Suns of the Chinese week rose at the same time and stayed out for too long, hence the sun was long and unusually hot until Yi the Archer shot down 9 of them.
Greece: Phaethon, son of Helios, took his father's chariot (the Sun) on a joy ride and torched the earth, hence the sun again was out too long and got too hot until Zeus hit him with a lightning bolt.
Aztecs: The Aztecs believed in 5 cycles where the sun was destroyed and recreated, and during a dark period (as in, a long night) they decided to sacrifice a god to make a 5th sun. The ugliest god bravely sacrificed himself and became the sun. But, the most honored god was shamed so he sacrificed himself as well, and so there were too suns and the world was too hot. So the other gods slapped the second sun with a rabbit and he became the moon.
Maya: When the Hero Twins were trapped in the underworld, one of them was beheaded but they had a ball game to play in the morning--while trying to reanimate his brother's body, the living twin asked the "old one" (the buzzard) to keep the sun out, and the buzzard made the night last longer to give him time.
Maya again: During the time of the long night when the land was dark, wet, and had no sun, the gods decreed the sun would appear. When it appeared, it was hotter and brighter than normal, but that was a good thing--it dried the land and made it useful.
So, we've got long days on one side of the world connected to the sun being way too hot, and we've got long nights on the other side of the world connected to the sun suddenly appearing way too hot.
Not really proof of anything (especially since there are a few long nights in the Old World like Heracles' birth) but I found it interesting and wanted to share.
Connor, you did great. How about expounding on the divine fish who fathers or saves the savior. You will find Nun (fish) the "father" of Joshua on the heads of Catholic biggies. All trained Catholic know that Joshua and Jesus are personifications of the ram constellation (Aries). They also know that Simeon/Simon is the southern fish in Pisces. Simon Peter = Pisces.
@@harveywabbit9541
😆 what New Age nonsense are you talking about
@@justanotherbaptistjew5659
Levi is the bond/band of stars connecting the two fish in Pisces. At one time the northern fish was a birdie. This birdie was involved in the impregnation of the Goddess Isis who is the mother of our Jesus in Egypt. You will find Levi in Leviathan.
I've heard stuff like this before, especially the Chinese one. I never connected the dots. You make a very interesting argument. You give my favorite miracle a chance again to be taken literally, not symbolically.
@@philippbrogli779
When reading this type of story you should recognize that when this myth was written the earth was considered to be the unmoving center of the universe.
Wouldn't God causing the sun and moon to appear outside of their normal phases just as miraculous as God stopping Earth's rotation? Wouldn't the sun and moon going outside of their phases cause a whole bunch of side effects to the solar system? It doesn't seem to avoid that issue as with assuming the Earth stopped moving.
I agree. It’s a solution that causes as many problems as it solves. Plus, what ancient Jew would have interpreted it that way from the text? It seems like a desperate attempt to fit current cosmology with ancient.
@@Iamwrongbut
Look up the definition of solstice.
That's a good point. I love IP's videos but I'm not completely convinced on this one.
@@joesteele3159
Did you look up the word solstice?
@@harveywabbit9541 I always see you in different Christian yt comment sections spamming and trolling. There must be something more to your life, don’t you think? The effort you put especially for something you don’t believe in, seems obsessive and pathological. I am in fact worried about you. Just say the word if you need someone to talk to❤️
“And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for _SIGNS,_ and for seasons, and for days, and years!”
Ah yes … signs … and wonders.
There are signs for the six days (Aries thru Virgo) and signs for the six nights (Libra thru Pisces). Every story, in the bible, is keyed to Ptolemaic astronomy.
Personally, I think if God can create the universe in 6 literal days (which I believe he did), he can keep everything stable for 1 day and stop any catastrophe. There is nothing in the passage to say anything is symbolic or an omen.
Yeah, there's nothing in the passage to say it's an omen, because this would have been understood by those it was written to and therefore there would have been no need for the author to mention such a detail. Of course God could have kept everything stable for one day, but there's still the issue of this not being mentioned in any ancient accounts, which is impossible to overlook, regardless of religious affiliation.
Why is it so hard for you people to believe that ancient Jews would write using parables and symbolisms?
If this kind of astronomical event happened, it must have been witnessed around the world. While difficult to corroborate, there are various ancient legends of an incredibly long “day” or “night” from numerous cultures. Harry Rimmer briefly summarized some of them: “In the ancient Chinese writings there is a legend of a long day. The Incas of Peru and the Aztecs of Mexico have a like record, and there is a Babylonian and a Persian legend of a day that was miraculously extended. Another section of China contributes an account of the day that was miraculously prolonged, in the reign of Emperor Yeo.
“Herodotus recounts that the priests of Egypt showed him their temple records, and that there he read a strange account of a day that was twice the natural length.”
Surveying the numerous parallel records of an extended day is another study. They are, as yet, difficult to corroborate through archaeology.
@@cv4809 there is no evidence in the text to indicate that.
@@lepterfirefall "no evidence in the text" is begging the question. Why would you assume that there would ever be a flag around a common turn of phrase? Why would you even suspect you had the right to detect it a priori?
Awesome work - thank you!
Thanks for shedding some light on this very culture-related passage. It's sometimes a bit confusing how many passages in the Bible require a knowledge of ancient Near East beliefs, but I'm glad that you and John Walton are able to explain all this to lay Christians. I guess what confuses me is that it means that God essentially kept everything working normally, yet the incident is seen as a miracle where God listened to a man's request. It's confusing how some passages with supernatural stuff seem to be able to be interpreted somewhat literally (like there being a flood, or the ten plagues), but then some passages (ages of the patriarchs, the sun standing still) require cultural context knowledge.
Are we to interpret the other scriptures of the luminaries moving opposite how they should as omens as well? If thisnis to be interpreted through the lens of an "omen" then what about the other occurneces?
@@thebarenecessities what other scriptures talk about luminaries moving in opposite directions or moving in unnatural paths?
@@nox567 look up the steps of Ahaz....
@@thebarenecessities bro can you give me a direct Bible passage reference? I rarely ever check online as a primary source for anything in the bible since there are so many articles with so many opposing views
@@nox567 2 kings 20
Well done! I wrote a paper on that passage many years ago. I did the best I could at the time, but your view is more accurate. Many thanks.
What did you say in your article?
Read your Bible:
Joshua 10:
11 While they fled before Israel along the descent of Beth-horon, the LORD hurled great stones from the heavens* above them all the way to Azekah, killing many.d More died from these hailstones than the Israelites killed with the sword.
12 It was then, when the LORD delivered up the Amorites to the Israelites, that Joshua prayed to the LORD, and said in the presence of Israel:
Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
Moon, in the valley of Aijalon!
13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
…
The Bible CLEARLY states that God hurled great stones from the sky onto the enemies of Israel, and these stones killed more of these enemies than were killed by the Israelites..
So you can’t interpret these stones other than what they are described: stones sent as missiles by the creator to kill certain people he doesn’t like….
As for stopping the sun and the moon. You interpretation (speaking on behalf of god) ignores the obvious and clear assertion in Joshua 10:13
The sun stood still,
the moon stayed,
while the nation took vengeance on its foes.
This is recorded in the Book of Jashar. The sun halted halfway across the heavens; not for an entire day did it press on.
I have been waiting on this one. Cant wait to see you're investigation on this subjuct. One of my favorite stories too
When is the next February 29?
Excellent exposition! Thank you!
I think this is also interesting, this is how Young’s Literal rendered the quote from Jasher, “and the sun standeth in the midst of the heavens, and hath not hasted to go in-as a perfect day?” That sounds like a perfect day for the Israelites, if the Amorites gave up before the battle even started because of what was a bad omen to the Amorites.
There are no humans in the bible.
@@harveywabbit9541 What? Could you elaborate please?
@@carlknaack1019
We only have personification of natural phenomena.
Go back and read about the father of Joshua and the father of his father.
Nun means fish and has reference to Pisces and the southern fish in this constellation. The father of Nun, the fish, is Caleb. Caleb means dog and both Canis major and Canis minor. Note how they writers associate Caleb (dog) with Ephraim. Ephraim is the Taurus constellation. You must study the Hebrew Mazzaroth in order to understand the biblical stories.
I'd like someone on this site explain how a Fish could father a human being and how a Dog can father a fish. Good luck in you sudies.
@@carlknaack1019 avoid people who tend to lead you astray from the Biblical truths. per Harvey, no one since Adam till Christ existed. it sounds like some astrological, etymological, New Age conspiracy. avoid.
@@harveywabbit9541 I disagree with characterizing Biblical characters solely by their namesakes. Many people are named Smith in English now but they are not actually Metalsmiths. And I find post-2nd temple Hebrew traditions to be very interesting, but not of the same interpretational caliber as Ancient Near Eastern documents. For example, the Amarna Letters from Canaanite kings which describe invasions before the time of Joshua and follow a very similar literary pattern to the later conquests of the Joshua narrative, which imply to me that the genre of Joshua is less poetry and more history.
Thank you, and good luck to you in your studies as well.
Bro, this is a major stretch. You say that the weird thing about the day was that "God heeded the voice of a man", but the way God heeded the voice of a man was putting celestial bodies in certain positions. It doesn't matter if the reason was time and the sunset, or good and bad omens. The omen itself was the position of the celestial bodies, so even if you change the reason why Joshua asks for it, the request itself doesn't change after your explanation.
Let'sake sure we aren't conceding that miracles don't happen.
The Book is filled with physics-breaking miracles.
How about the fish father (Nun) of Joshua? You can see the father of Joshua in the fish hats worn by Catholic biggies. Have you seen them?
CAN happen doesn't mean DID happen
I would like to give you a kindhearted challenge not to take such a shallow view of the text. Of course God can perform any miracle he wants. But I think the fact that no other civilization records an event like this highly discredits that God chose to step into the course of human history to this great of degree.
When presented with two choices of God performed a massive world altering miracle with no evidence that clearly would have been there. Such as other civilizations noticing something strange. Or a second option that this is just a cultural and modern misunderstanding which is far more plausible then I think it is an easy choice. The second option doesn’t diminish Gods power at all while also being the most plausible understanding of what happened.
Excellent video! Thank you.
Good video. But there’s a third option. You don’ have to stop the rotation of earth; you can just alter the procession like 5%, and it would have the same effect.
The proper word is precession of the equinoxes. Look up the meaning of solstice.
;)
Without watching, I always imagined about this. My thoughts were that he either stopped the earth’s rotation while perfectly conserving everything on the ground(because he can do anything) or he dilated time in one area.
Is it true that Jesus is the son of the Roman soldier pantera ?
@@Bluesky-ew7hv lmao
@@Bluesky-ew7hv no.
@@Bluesky-ew7hv
The Philistines are the "winter" constellations of Libra thru Pisces. As the sun rises in Aries, winter is "killed." Story is repeated over and over. For instance, as Aries rises we have the firstborn of the Hebrews and the escape from Egypt (winter season) aka six nights in Genesis one or Libra thru Pisces. Be careful when you read the bible, the writers often added numbers to confuse those ignorant of the Mazzaroth.
@@Bluesky-ew7hv
The writers are a bit sneaky of this one. Pantera refers to the Panther companion of Bacchus/Dionysus. In reality this "pantera" refers to a hallucinogen.
Hello
Your explanation is useful and enlightening concerning idioms , expressions, poetic language, contemporary events and scripture
Quite interesting to understand and interpret the biblical passages and events!
I read Joshua 10 again !
I found that the passage relates the direct speech of Joshua and command in that specific situation!
The emphasis laid in the passage is obviously a supernatural and sovereign act of God!
Joshua command caused the sun and moon to stop on specific geographical location !
I noticed it is not a figurative language!!!
Thank you for this context. I hope that people truly understand context and why it is so important in understanding the Bible. God bless, all.
This is the most plausible explanation. IP God bless you.
The Iceland Midnight Sun, also known as 'polar day', is a natural phenomenon that occurs during the summer months when the sun remains visible 24 hours a day.
That's due to the position of the Earth, not the rotation.
@@TaxFraudCommitter Perhaps they fought this battle in Iceland?
I appreciate the great research you put into this video and find it very convincing. I agree that we should try and understand the bible in the way that those who wrote it would wish. However, I don't agree with the idea of claiming a miracle is impossible simply because modern readers scoff. As scripture itself states, scoffers have always existed. We should definitely seek what is true, but not to pander to unbelievers and scoffers, but rather to have a firmer foundation in our faith. Let the scoffers scoff and the seekers seek.
A good example of this would be how so many people attempt to find the Xmas star in the history of the sky to give an answer to modernists. However, we know from the Church Fathers that the Christmas star was understood to be a miracle rather than a normal star that could be found in the constellations. The Church Fathers believed that it was either an angel or a special star created only for that moment in time, and entered into Christ's heart once it's mission was complete. The other issue with looking for it in the sky is that it was known to be an aerial star rather than a terrestrial, showing even more that it must have been a miracle. I am not saying that there are not amazing things in the stars that point towards telling the gospel story - something great in of itself, but simply that we should not look for naturalistic explanations for the sake of it. If it is natural then fine, but we should always trust how the Church Fathers interpreted scripture since they were more close to the time of the apostles, some of them direct students of them.
None of the church fathers who talked about the star were students of apostles themselves. Only Ignatius writes a song about a star of Christ but it is probably not about that star from Christs birth but a metaphore of Christ himself. Others come quite late when stories are already embelished. Like every different father gives different names of the magi.
@@magnificentuniverse3085 its time for people to start interpreting the Bible literally again
@@uwvadertje No. Metaphores certainly do exist. This study that IP quotes is interesting. Joshua prayed for Sun to stop in the morning which is strange if he wanted sunlight. And if there are so many sources from semitic cultures around Joshuas time that have these omens about the position of Sun and Moon during the battle it is reasonable to assume that the earliest readers of Joshua at least had that interpretation in the back of their minds. But still even if the reason is different (ie. omen instead of prolonging the sunlight) Joshua specificly prayed for some kind of astronomical change. He either prayed for Sun and Moon to literally stop above those locations which will prolong the good luck coming from the omen until they beat Amorites or he prayed that the Sun and Moon should change their positions and go to towards those specific places where good luck comes from. Either way something miraculous clearly happened. Also does IP really want us to believe that the right meaning of "there wasnt any day like this nor will there ever be one" is that God listened to a man then but never again in human history? 🤔
@@magnificentuniverse3085 You claim that none of the Church Fathers who wrote about the star were direct disciples of the apostles. Two things on that. The first, is that it would make no difference. The faith was passed on orally and in writing, and not everything made it into the bible - something the bible itself states in the Book of Acts. The faith is passed on, and the Church Fathers were those who had a good understanding of the proper interpretations since it was passed onto them, and from them to us. To claim such things were embellished is nonsense and would require evidence. The things we do know were embellished tend to be gnostic material, not things from the Church Fathers. I would certainly put more of my trust in the early Church Fathers rather than modernists who wish to spread and glorify doubt on almost all matters of faith. If we trust the Fathers to hand us down the scripture then we must also trust their interpretation - especially compared to novel interpretations of today.
Second of all, your statement is factually untrue. St Ignatius, for example, since he is the one you mentioned, is considered to have been a disciple of St John the Apostle. Why do you claim he was not? He has writings about the star. When explanations are given to interpret scripture there is no reason to consider it a metaphor unless that what they say. We should take them at their word. Today, unfortunately, many use the term 'metaphor' as a pretext to dismiss a plain meaning. In reality, most metaphors in scripture are a secondary deeper meaning to the literal. In other words, it is not an alternative to the literal but an additional layer.
You say that every Father gives different names of the Magi. This is news to me. Could you give some examples? I am only aware of three names.
Lastly, this is not just opinions of the Church Fathers. Whenever they are unanimous about something it is certain to be true. The saints, doctors, and fathers have all agreed on this for about 2000 years. It is even written in the canonical hours of prayer during Epiphany season.
"It was a new and unknown star, entirely different from other stars, and did not belong to the heavenly system. In a word, it was miraculous." Cornelius a Lapede. He also names 9 particular things that make the star superior to ordinary stars. I won't mention all of them here, but one is that the star was aerial - in inner space rather than outer space. We know this to be true for many reasons, including that it came down and rested on a house. You would have to do violence to scripture to claim that a star in space rested on a house. Even as a metaphor it would make no sense, since such things need a purpose - in other words, the very reason for the star resting on the house can only be understood as literal because of its reason for doing so. Another is that the star was also bright by day as it was by night. It was compared to the pillar which led the Israelites due to the fact that it rested when the Magi rested and moved when they moved. Not everyone could see the star because it required faith to be led to Christ.
@@uwvadertje The problem is that many use "metaphor" as a pretext to dismiss what the scripture says. There are certain things that cannot be literal or are unlikely literal - such as the Song of Solomon (seen as a poetical love son between Christ and the Church (His bridegroom). However, most things in the bible have layers of meaning. Symbols don't replace the literal meaning but are layered onto it. We should all strive for the truth. My deep concern is that there are naturalists who wish to spread doubt by dismissing everything supernatural in the bible. They are like the serpent asking "Did God really say that?" They use language manipulation to mislead people. My pet peeve is those who pretend to know Greek and use "literal Greek" to claim it has an entirely different meaning than the authentic translation. Yet, translators actually know Greek and Hebrew and Latin, and did not just look up a Greek word on the internet one afternoon. Anyway, that's my rant. God bless.
Ty you God, for letting this man to have much understand and sharing 🙏
Thank you for helping clear the air like always! I was wondering if you’d be able to help clear the air on another topic as well (Maybe? possibly? If you have the time my good sir 🥺👉👈). My uncle recently made the claim that reincarnation was removed from the Bible in 800 A.D. and I really didn’t know how to respond to that. I personally haven’t been able to find anything that would indicate such a thing, but I was wondering if you knew any information that either helps or hurts his claim? Regardless of if you respond or not, I still appreciate all your outstanding work my good sir 😎🙏
Why does he believe that's the case?
Burden of proof is on your uncle in this situation. We cannot go around and claim random things. I can say that they removed the names of some of other Israel deities from the bible in a random year but in this case it is on me to support this claim. (it is totally made up by the way :) )
Yes, the sun stopped implying that the sun do move and the Earth is fixed. It is as described in the Genesis because the sun and moon and are under the firmament since the waters is above us.
Exactly. This is a wicked whirled (sic), and we have all been deceived.
“… the Lord threw down large stones from heaven on them” was this another omen or literal?
Yea, this is a question that must be answered by IP, let's wait for the reply.
@@godexists3868
but he doest speak to you ?
@@peregrinegrace8570 no
Great explaination!
Glad at the end he brought it back to what was still miraculous about the event, even if it doesn't feel the same, still giving glory to what God did still do
Amen, love it
Excellent overview. Context is key.
Context always!
Is it true that Jesus is the son of the Roman soldier pantera ?
@@Bluesky-ew7hv Stop spamming.
Very nice. I enjoy the language and history lessons.
I would be more inclined to believe this within the context of Joshua praying for the Sun and Moon to be in a position that the Amorites would consider to be a bad omen if the Amorites were superstitious.
This study that IP quotes is interesting. Joshua prayed for Sun to stop in the morning which is strange if he wanted sunlight. And if there are so many sources from semitic cultures around Joshuas time that have these omens about the position of Sun and Moon during the battle it is reasonable to assume that the earliest readers of Joshua at least had that interpretation in the back of their minds. But still even if the reason is different (ie. omen instead of prolonging the sunlight) Joshua specificly prayed for some kind of astronomical change. He either prayed for Sun and Moon to literally stop above those locations which will prolong the good luck coming from the omen until they beat Amorites or he prayed that the Sun and Moon should change their positions and go to towards those specific places where good luck comes from. Either way something miraculous clearly happened. Also does IP really want us to believe that the right meaning of "there wasnt any day like this nor will there ever be one" is that God listened to a man then but never again in human history? 🤔
Morning will typically represent the spring equinox and evening will represent the autumn equinox, mid day is the summer solstice. When the writers uses the word day, in the singular, he means summer and the period from the spring equinox to the autumn equinox. Night (singular) will mean the period from the autumn equinox to the spring equinox.
Also you might look at the father of Joshua who was a fish (Nun). The father of Nun (the fish) was Caleb (the dog). You should also take a look at the fish hats worn by Catholic biggies. You will find Barabbas in this story of the fish and dog. Good luck.
@@harveywabbit9541 no
@@magnificentuniverse3085
Joshua is still alive as the constellation of the Ram. His father, the fish, is a bit below the Ram.
It was about God listening to a man request making the sun and moon appear as a bad omen to his enemies. That is the right meaning of "there wasn't any day like this nor will there ever be one".
There are some who believe this referred to a total eclipse, which apparently some scientists have found did happen around when this would have occurred - so that is another possible explanation.
In bible speak, a full day (singular) means six months. Morning to Evening means from the spring equinox to the autumn equinox. This six months is divided by mid day aka the summer sun stand still. Also, Evening to Morning is the six months from the autumn equinox to the spring equinox (six months).
You must understand that Sun stand still simply means a Solstice.
@@harveywabbit9541 You are making all this stuff up.
An eclipse is unlikely if you consider that the sun and moon would have been on opposite sides of the horizon according to the description in Joshua 10:12
Some scientists? Which ones? There are several different possible dates of the exodus and thus for Joshua. We know the conquest of Canaan never happened, so that also is a problem. When you say "around", do you mean within a millennium or so?
@@davidhawley1132
Do you actually believe that a fish fathered Joshua?
This this interpretation is very interesting. I never heard about it. It think it should be explained along with the passage In Isaiah when the sun moved back a couple of degrees. Then, I would think we would get a better view explaining both events.
Actually this is very accurate, and factual, because in the bible Johua not only stopped the sun from moving but the moon also in one stop, so this tells us that The earth really stopped moving! Because the moon also was stopped from moving orelse the moon would have not been there with earth by now!
@InspiringPhilosophy One problem:
“Remember how he held back the sun and made one day as long as two?”
Sirach (Ecclesiasticus) 46:4
Perhaps 29 February.
@YAJUN YUAN More seriously than he takes the cult of Jehova’s Witnesses, yes.
@YAJUN YUAN BTW They’re the deuterocanonicals, not apocrypha.
@YAJUN YUAN Worse, still. A hypocritical, pseudo-Christian cultist who denies the one true Church because, you know, why would people like William Miller, who got everything else wrong, and was guided by Satan posing as angel of light-like what happened to Muhammad-be wrong about Sabbatarian Adventism, too? You try to be Judaizers and you can’t even do that right because you use electronics and machines on the sabbath when even a spark is considered a flame; and there is no lighting fires nor extinguishing them on the sabbath.
“Technically”, they’ve always been part of the Hebrew canon and the Jews even read from those same books today; deuterocanonical, neither apocryphal nor pseudepigrapha. That’s just propaganda because you can’t accept that Christ appeared to and gave the authority to Peter, (St Matthew 16:18-19), not Millerites like Joseph Bates and Ellen G. White.
Talk about yet another Great Disappointment.
Great video! Keep on making them. Despite the ancients like Joshua, the Israelites and other people having outdated pre-scientific thoughts about the sun "moving" across the sky (like Psalm 19:4-6), the Bible is still important for understanding humanity's moral purpose. As what Michael Heiser, my favorite Bible scholar, said, the Creator also uses flawed ideas to communicate the infallible truth. To read the Bible, we need to read it like a collection of ancient writings, just like people do for history and mythology.
Is this conclusion: So Joshua appeal to God was not to change anything about celestial mechanics since the Sun and Moon would be at the same positions without Joshua's prayer, but that God would bring victory upon those bad omens for the enemy?
Or I missed it?
No one is killed in this story.
Very nice explanation. I can get behind this.
The only other explanations I've thought were reasonable is that the earth slowed for a longer day, or it was an "illusion" by God. But this explanation is very good.
A quick something something from the web:
_"Many cultures have legends that seem to be based on this event. For example, there is a Greek myth of Apollo’s son, Phaethon, who disrupted the sun’s course for a day. And since Joshua 10 is historical, cultures on the opposite side of the world should have legends of a long night. In fact, the New Zealand Maori people have a myth about how their hero Maui slowed the sun before it rose, while the Mexican Annals of Cuauhtitlan (the history of the empire of Culhuacan and Mexico) records a night that continued for an extended time."_
Can those events be dated around the time of Joshua? And are those long days and nights only few hours longer than usual or like lasting for months and years?
@@magnificentuniverse3085 No idea, it just would have been nice if he'd discussed or even mentioned it instead of saying there aren't any in other nations
@@isaacmarshmallow8751 thats why I asked the question. Most of them are like that ie. coming from different times than Joshua and mentioning like a hundred years of darkness or something. Unfortunately some of the apologists I read on internet included those cases as well as proofs.
Its like those creationists including horned wolves and seven headed iron fire breathing dragons and hoofed sea creatures with lion or wolf heads that have whiskers as proof of ancient cultures living together with dinos
@@magnificentuniverse3085 oh yeah that stuffs bonkers, I ain't a YEC
Man. The video's not even started yet and the comment section's already spicy. 😆
The Sun and Moon were stopped for about a day (24 hours) to allow for the adjustment of the calendar aka February 29.
@Harvey Wabbit dude, what’s your obsession with February 29th?
@@ryankrakinski8926 it's his birthday perhaps
@@harveywabbit9541 Wouldn't that take a day off every calendar month also too? and in ancient Judaism (and in some modern jewish communities also) they never used the Gregorian calendar
Great video!
Great exposition and clarification. Have you looked at the Sun moving backwards on the steps for Hezekiah?
Flat earthers love this passage.
Indeed they do, but if one goes the physics interpretation route as they typically do, a problem arises: they like to cite this passage as the NORMAL workings of celestial mechanics, whereas the passage in a physics interpretation reads instead as a MIRACLE, plus the entire Flat Earth interpretive approach is to ignore the frame of reference (here, what the Sun appears to do from the frame of reference of a battle transpiring at ground level).
For the physics interpretation I can think of another variety of miracle--purely speculation on my part--which satisfies all the described details of the passage, keeps the appearance of the Sun within its proper ground level frame of reference, and avoids any issue of the planet and/or atmosphere changing speed and occasioning catastrophic stop-start inertia consequences. That very speculative solution is that God superimosed a 'bubble' of faster-running time over the battlefield area/participants such that, looking up at the Sun, it appeared to those inside the bubble to 'stand still' for a while, whereas time continued to run normally outside the bubble for everyone else.
I certainly don't INSIST upon this solution, and need to consider the 'omen phraseology' interpretaion at more length anyway. I do have great respect for the integrity of biblical Hebrew to not have outside notions imposed upon it anachronistically by modern readers.
While I'm open to this interpretation, it doesn't fully fit well with the passage's implication that God performed a miracle. If IP's proposed interpretation were true, then no actual miracle was performed nor an unusual prayer answered.
This is exactly where I'm at.
I agree. Either a miracle occured or not. If a miracle occured, the day was literally extended or God literally caused the heavenly objects to come at a time where the sun and the moon are seen. This means whether we take the traditional view, or IP's view, there still is the accusation of natural disasters, collapsing of the atmosphere etc., which would imply God would personally stop natural disasters to occur based on these movements
The miracle could be that the sun and moon did this on a different day than expected
The miracle is the VISIBILITY of the sun and moon to Joshua's enemies.
Great explanation
I interpreted it as Joshua fought on the summer solstice and that's why the sun stayed out for so long
This happens on every February 29.
This passage always had me kind of stumped.
The bible stories are based upon the idea that the Earth is the unmoving center of the universe. It was only a few centuries ago that a person who said the earth rotated around the sun would be burned at the stake.
Which Bible character had no parents?
Joshua, son of Nun
Nuun
Noon
Strong's h5126
- Lexical: נוּן
- Transliteration: Nun
- Part of Speech: Proper Name Masculine
- Phonetic Spelling: noon
- Definition: father of Joshua.
- Origin: Or Nown (1 Chron. 7:27) {nohn}; from nuwn; perpetuity, Nun or Non, the father of Joshua.
- Usage: Non, Nun.
- Translated as (count): of Nun (29), Nun (1).
@@TheLionFarm You missed the joke, Bro
😂
And how do you explain away 2 Kings 20:8-11?
It should be noted that before that battle, all nations observed a 360 day year. Within five years after Joshua's Long Day, all calendars ahad beed adjusted to a 365 day year!
It's pretty clear in the scriptures that the sun AND moon did stand still in Joshua 10:12-15. What's the problem??? Prior to this the LORD cast down large hailstones onto the enemies of the children of Israel which killed more of them than were killed by the sword.
Christians have a unnecessary problem trying to unnecessarily explain this away whilst still trying to hold onto the resurrection. Dont you people see how much faith you actually lack by creating disparity between the miraculous events?? You believe the Lord Jesus went to the grave and physically rose again three days later - a supernatural phenomenon that defies all the scientific laws of the universe and is not possible for any living thing in creation to do. Yet people worry about mistakingly thinking they need to explain other miraculous events in the Bible? Why????
When the LORD pours out His bowls of wrath in Revelation, do you have an explanation to smooth over that too???
What about the 10 plagues of Egypt where the LORD was demonstrating His total authority over every false god in Egypt? What about Elijah calling down fire from heaven, defeating baal and making an axe head float? What about Jesus calming the storm and sea? What about Jesus walking out across the sea to the disciples and when He entered into the boat IMMEDIATELY they were on the other side on the shore? The Bible goes on and on and on to show that the LORD has total control of all creation and can do with it as He wishes. None of this is impossible for God. None of it.
He can do all of this, bring the entire cosmos into being by speaking it into existence, yet you have trouble when He stops the celestial bodies?? Is it not written that the entire creation is only upheld by His word?!
You've got to get rid of your silly misconceptions where you try to explain away these things. All it shows is that you don't actually believe the LORD is who He says He is.
My God, the Lord Jesus Christ has no trouble with any of this at all. On Christ the rock I stand, all other ground is sinking sand.
Maranatha ✝️, Amen.
So does that mean that the Lord will use literal bowls, perhaps bowls the size of countries of continents, to pour out his wrath? Is wrath a liquid? When Jesus said "I am the door" in John 10:9, was he a literal door that one could open, shut and lock? In John 6:35 he said that he's "the bread of life." So is Jesus a loaf of bread or a matzo?
Have to agree. No one knows what God is truly capable of.
We simply can't conceive.
@@Frodojack You're ignoring the obvious inconsistencies with approach when I have given many examples.
The Bible uses a lot of similies, metaphors and other descriptive language that saints of their time period used to do their best to describe the Heavenly things they saw. It doesn't make them any less true/incorrect at all. The Bible is literally true, in the correct context and when placed in the correct categories and the Bible makes this clear to us.
The Lord Jesus will tread the wine press of God's wrath upon His return to enact judgement on this fallen world. Have you seen an ancient wine press? We still use them today. Its language being used to describe how the Lord Jesus is going to crush His enemies and gives us an indication of just how much blood is going to be spilled as a result.
Stay in context and learn with patience how to interpret correctly and where the Bible is silent on a matter, we do not throw in our understanding as if it is canon, we leave it as one of God's mysteries. If you are not a Christian then there is no way you can read God's word and hope to get into the deeper meanings of God word because you won't have the Holy Spirit and are walking in darkness.
If you are a Christian then you need to be discipled better - this is a good thing - edification in truth and love.
Thanks.
@@no-one-knows321 Amen, let God be true and every man a liar.
When the LORD remakes heaven and earth this entire cosmos cannot contain Him, it is going to boil away. "tHaTs iMpOsSiBLe, eVeRyOnE wILL DiE" - not for the LORD it isn't and we will have glorified resurrected bodies that can never die anyway, so it will be no problem for us as saints.
People really do throw the baby out with the bathwater trying to come up with answers to preposterous questions that try to de-deify the LORD and take us away from the truth of His revealed nature that is recorded for us by Himself, the Holy Spirit who is the Spirit of Truth.
It's the same lame tactic from Genesis 3. Satan has no new tricks. He gets people to question God's word and then has them doubt God's word. And peoples attempts to explain away God's miracles (which, as per the revealed nature of God is no problem for Him what so ever) is ridiculous to start with.
@@discipleaj So the historical and cultural context is used throughout the Bible, including metaphors and other figures of speech, but just not those verses where the Sun stood still. Sounds like cherry-picking. Context and figures of speech are fine when it agrees with my preconceived notions, but not when it disagrees with them because...reasons. Got it. Maybe if you're a Christian you need to be educated better, and accept a little humility in the process. This is a good thing.
This was a very interesting topic. However, the information shown here seems to be more of an opinion and a theory than a fact.
Studying the ancient cultures is the only way we can even begin to have an understanding of the Bible.
@@GEES44DC in 1985, NASA made a documentary proving that the Earth had one day missing. But for some reason this documentary is no longer available.
Studying Ancient cultures, does not mean they were right.
@@carloswater7 it is an undeniable fact that we cannot understand much of the Bible by a) reading it in English and b) applying our modern day understandings to something that was not written in our culture.
@@GEES44DC In the way you're right, but most of that, is just your opinion. So you think what's in Joshua 10 is symbolic and not literal?
@@carloswater7 No, it's not literal. It makes absolutely no sense for it to be literal. Can he break the very laws of physics and nature that he created? Sure. Why would he? It doesn't make sense that he would literally stop the planet's rotation and then have to account for the chaos that would bring to EVERYTHING.
Just as the language for the serpent and the fall in the garden is impossible to understand in English and with modern eyes, things like these passages take a deep understanding of their culture and their writing styles to understand as well.
I've seen other explanations as well that this is breaking into a song glorifying their victory wherin a poetic view of the sun and moon are presented as personified. As you point out, the problem is us reading it in the modern context and understanding rather than the historical context and understanding where the phraseology and meanings would have been clear. This is quite a challenge in much of the old testament for example the account of "Nimrod" seems positive until one discovers that "Nimrod" is not a name, but a title (as most names were) and it means "The extremely impious rebel" and now that brief paragraph takes an entirely different meaning.
as always, well said
Most events of the Bible are also found in other cultures historical accounts, I never thought about this story the way you explained it and it does make sense. The whole earth would have noticed such an event and would be as wide spread as the flood accounts.
I feel like it wouldn't be. "The whole freaking planet got wiped out" and "yeah the sun did this weird thing once" dont seem like equally noteworthy events.
Some dude in this comment section actually looked into other accounts and found some pretty compelling myths
If the same miracle happen today, no one would say: "Look, the Earth stopped". As terrestrial people, our point of view is automatically geocentric. Just like the GPS is also geocentric. I really don't understand how people can struggle over this.
Zidon is aka Sidon Lebanon, where the shellfish that produced the royal purple used to color the robe of the priest/king. Sidon is also the biblical BethSaida or house of the fish. Think Pisces on this one. This is also the sign of Nun (fish/dag) father of Joshua/Jesus.
Is it true that Jesus is the son of the Roman soldier pantera ?
@@Bluesky-ew7hv says who?
@@Bluesky-ew7hv
Pantera is a reference to the panther and Dionysus. Look it up.
That's not the difficulty people have. The main difficulty has to do with the ramifications of a full stop to the Earth's rotation.
Can you do a video on the shadow going back a few steps?
I don’t know if one of the previous 390 comments asked this, sorry if they did and it was already addressed, but what about the part that says the sun delayed going down about a full day? I understand that this is about omens, that makes sense, but I think this is a legitimate question that an honest skeptic would have. If the sun is not stayinh out longer than normal then why mention the fact that it delayed going down for a full day? That should already be expected from morning to evening, and I understand and accept the reasoning that it was morning when he prayed. I just couldn’t help but notice that this part is maybe the most difficult of all but wasn’t addressed at all. Any help? Appreciate it, thanks!
In bible speak, a full day (singular) means six months. Morning to Evening means from the spring equinox to the autumn equinox. This six months is divided by mid day aka the summer sun stand still. Also, Evening to Morning is the six months from the autumn equinox to the spring equinox (six months).
You must understand that Sun stand still simply means a Solstice.
For me, I generally believe the sun did stood still. We cannot beat around the bush, we need to trust God and not lean on our own understanding, lest we doubt God.
The same atheist are the same one refuting or finding it hard to believe that God created everything in 6 days
Or refusing to believe that Jesus was literally a vine.
@@gareth2736 👍
YEC is not supported by the Bible, so atheists are at least right about the fact that the entire universe is not 6,000 years old. Considering Gen. 1:2 shows the results of the evil angels' rebellion, this universe was clearly here long before humans were created.
@@theeternalsbeliever1779 Millions of years is not supported by the Bible either. And how are atheists correct?
The Bible isn't a science book.
Well, _this_ might be theologically divisive. Still, pretty good video.
Also, IP, if you ever get the chance, look into the sermon of John Jasper titled “The Sun Do Move.”
Joshua's father's name is “Nun”. What does it mean? A. It actually means a fish, from a root that means to sprout or flourish (e.g. Psalm 72:17). Note how the writers connect Nun with Ephraim (Taurus constellation). Caleb, the father of Nun should be read as Dog father of the Fish. There are two dog constellations connected with Nun (Pisces constellation) and they are Caleb major and Caleb minor.
The Philistines, in this story, are identical to the Egyptians and Babylonians.
Good stuff IP.
Really nicely done. I do have a question though: What exactly did the ancient Near East consider a ''new moon''? Is it a full moon, or the slightest waxing crescent immediately after a 'new moon' as we consider it today?
The word Jerico means moon. The solar calendar is far superior to the lunar calendar but are sometimes figured as a solar-lunar calendar of 30 days each. There is a lunar calendar of 28 days which was used in the story of Solomon building his palace (the year of 12 months).
It was stopped on two recorded occasions. One of which sent the sun backwards (2 Kings 20:8-11).
@@twitherspoon8954
That was a hard way to adjust the calendar, like February 29.
Yeah not sure how to handle that passage that's for sure. How was the Lord was able to set shadows the opposite direction they generally go? Intervening in cosmology itself? Perhaps simply adjusting time itself, somehow? No clue.
@@twitherspoon8954 lol
Is it true that Jesus is the son of the Roman soldier pantera ?
@@Illycrium
Shadow, like shade, in bible speak refers to the period when darkness is greater than light (the six nights in Genesis one). Darkness will refer to winter, and light will refer to summer (six days in Genesis one).
I would like to see the mental gymnastics (or revisionist history) about Joshua 3:16.
According to the geology of the region, springtime mudslides occasionally block the Jordan River. This has happened historically, (as recently as 1927 for around 20 hours).
Ancient people did not perceive the world the same way we do because their world view was not based in science with its concrete approach to the minutae of things. Phenomena were described in the texts differently. There are no mental gymnastics needed to understand Joshua 3:16. All that is required is the willingness to accept that these people had a different perspective from you and I. Science calls this empathy.
@@regularfather4708 This is kind'a odd. Because Hebrew bible scholars use the same technique of cultural and historical context. Ancient languages and idioms to back up the documentary hypothesis. But guys like IP denies the documentary hypothesis. (Probably because he doesn't understand it that well.) So why accept archaeologist claims for one case. But, not for the other?
@@michael119castro4 the word Bible means "library." Libraries tend to have a great number of books written in a variety of styles. The Christian Bible is no different. There are books of poetry, books of songs, books of allegory, historical narratives, letters, and first hand accounts. All of them were written in a certain time and place, reflecting a certain type of thinking that scientifically oriented, hyper literate minds have trouble grasping without cultural and historical context. You can't rip a single passage out of context and say it is ridiculous, when it is merely describing a phenomenon within the context of the culture.
Excellent video.
Curious how you explain what earth orbited while it waited for the sun to be created🙄
This is a quality video although Im yet to accept it as a new fact that dismisses what was previously considered to be a fact. Here's why:
The video is taking the hard position that standing still is actually "waiting". While the video rightly recognizes that "waiting" is anthropomorphic and relative to perception...we would now have to believe that God:
Either orchestrated the timing of the battle so that it would fall on a demoralizing day...
Or God moved celestial bodies around to provoke demoralization according to their traditions.
You have to pick one of those options if you're going to make an appeal to omen traditions.
And?
@@ncpolley As I said, if you're going to appeal to ancient celestial traditions, you'll still have conclude one of the options I listed. There's nothing else.
@@ncpolley When you decide to pick one, let me know😁
@@heyman5525 There is something else. Making the sun and moon VISIBLE to Joshua's enemies without moving celestial bodies. An increased brightness over Gibeon?
Vain philosophy
I can believe the earth stayed motionless on its axis, or the earth shifted some way to make it appear still, but I can't comprehend the sun stoping when it already doesn't move,
The thing is we want to tie God down to our human understanding we are talking about God the one who created everything and who determine what we see, we hear or perceive. Him stopping the sun and ensuring all processes are still in order and no one else perceives it in the world would be no more difficult than him creating a universe from nothing. We limit God, God is so much more powerful than we can even fathom.
Although God is powerful, in fact omnipotent, can doesn't mean did. God doesn't do nonsense and go against His own designed laws of nature for the entire universe when Joshua made a LOCAL request: "over Gibeon" (NOT the whole world). Creating the universe was a methodical, purposeful event. 2 different things.
It would have been effortless for God the stop the rotation of the Earth in a way we wouldn't notice.
It would be the greatest act of the divine since creation, but still effortless. It's harder for me to snap my fingers.
Can doesn't mean did. God doesn't do nonsense and go against His own designed laws of nature for the entire universe when Joshua made a LOCAL request: "over Gibeon" (NOT the whole world).
@@abc_12333
You don't know everything
@@jasonbuford496 I don't know everything. But we have to examine the CONTEXT of the passage. The details are the key to interpreting the text. Joshua's enemies were AFFECTED by the sun and moon standing still. The standing still of the sun and moon would not affecting anyone that way unless it was CULTURAL. Their culture took omens seriously and that's why a bad omen affected them. In a modern western society it is a challenge for us to identify with them. Therefore we just take texts literally - which is wrong. This was written 1000s of years ago in a MIDDLE EASTERN culture. It also says "OVER GIBEON". I didn't make that up. That's what it says! Also, God warned the Israelites in Deuteronomy 18 NOT to take omens seriously because He knew that the people surrounding the Israelites did. Just as God instructed the Israelites about Mount Ebal in Deuteronomy and they fulfilled it all in Joshua 8, they fulfilled the instructions of Deuteronomy 18 in Joshua 10. Context is EVERYTHING.
Except there are legends that describe a long night as would be expected on the opposite side of the earth if the Sun and moon appeared to have stopped from our perspective. There is a Maori legend of Maui and the Sun, in the legend the sun raced across the sky, and slept long making the day short and the night long. The Sun bragged to the people that they could not catch him, so the warrior Maui found the place where the Sun slept, and made a net to slow him down. This may be a connection to Joshua's long day.
The bible has Og/Gog/God sleeping on an iron bed during winter. Iron is a winter symbol and the metal associated with Iron is Mars.
If an atheist ever asks you a question that is difficult to explain because it defies all reason and logic, I recommend two solutions:
1. Say that it is god's miracle. Say this if it is a positive act.
2. Say that 'god works in mysterious ways'. Say this if it is a negative act.
This helps to back-up virtually everything in the bible or to align everything that happens in the world to the bible (and to disprove anything an atheist can claim based on 'science'!)
One of my favorite books was "The Day the Sun Stood Still : Three Original Novellas" by Poul Anderson, Gordon Dickson, Robert Silverberg. 1972. Enjoy ! Plus "Hello ? We're talking about God here."
Joshua wasn't superstitious. He prayed for a miracle and it happened. You're quoting so-called theologians who are too critical of the Bible. That's why many of them dismiss Christ's miracles. You doubt God's power. You think God must perform His deeds according to our understanding. Your interpretation is too scholarly and diminishes my faith in God. I also listened to your interpretation of the creation of Eve. You said God didn't create her from Adam's rib, but cut Adam into two. Be careful of your interpretations. This high criticism of the Bible underestimates God's power. You're making the Bible sound like an academic or science textbook. Be careful. You may lead people astray. Joshua prayed for the sun to stop. It happened. God is infinite & omnipotent. Nothing is impossible with Him. Don't see Him as a human being.
I don't understand why if an interpretation doesn't make God do the most grandiose miracle possible, it's somehow wrong? The point of the video was that if God made the sun stay in place in the sky, God would by extension have to do a bunch of other miraculous things not actually mentioned in the text and therefore a deeper look would be needed as to what it meant in context.
@@renren1641 It doesn't have to. Because Joshua prayed and it happened. Simple.God controls nature- it serves His purpose. Didn't He command a fish to swallow Jonah? Didn't God challenge King Hezekiah to pray for his shadow to go forward ten steps? Were these incidents real? Yes. If you start dissecting the scriptures to prove that such events couldn't have happened, you'll not believe any miracle in the Bible. That's what the Joshua interpretation does.
About the creation of Eve---that's literally what the original Hebrew means. The rib part is a transliteration into an idiom that English readers would understand, sort of.
Just because God can doesn't mean God did. God doesn't do NONSENSE. Joshua made a LOCAL request ("over Gibeon") and God answered with a UNIVERSAL demonstration??? No. Plus Joshua's enemies were affected by the sun standing still. NOT possible for this to affect a small group unless it's a CULTURAL occurrence. A bad omen makes perfect sense. God doesn't change. He is the SAME yesterday, today and forever.
1st.
Always enjoy IP videos they just make more sense
Well done...
Yes because that’s what it says since the Earth is flat it’s no problem. I’m a long time subscriber and you’ve taught me to follow the evidence and it all points to Earth being stationary plane.
Yikes
See here: th-cam.com/video/6EK8Ma83g5g/w-d-xo.html
Except there is not a single piece of evidence for your Mythological pizza world . Here are ten pieces of evidence for the Globe
Number ten. All the other planets and stars we've ever seen are round, and there's no reason to indicate that the earth should be any different.
Number nine. Time zones. Day and night happen at different times at different places on earth. In fact it's always day somewhere and night somewhere else.
Number eight. The Coriolis Effect means freely moving things like cannonballs or hurricane winds are deflected to the right, but only if you're north of the equator. If you're south of the equator, they're deflected left.
Number seven. Triangles. If you walk 10,000 kilometers straight along the earth's surface, turn 90 degrees to your right, walk 10,000 kilometers more, turn right again and walk another 10,000 kilometers, you'll be back to where you started, having successfully made a triangle with three 90 degree angles. As any geometry student can tell you, this is impossible on a flat surface.
Number six. The sun in general gets lower and lower in the sky as you travel away from the equator, and you can use this to directly measure the earth's curvature. Pick two places a few hundred miles directly north and south of each other, and at noon measure the shadows cast by a vertical meter stick at each location. You can use the shadow lengths to figure out the angle between the sticks, and once you add in how far apart they are you can calculate the earth's curvature.
Number five. The stars at night change as you go north or south. For example, Orion is upside down if you're in Australia.
Number four. Ferdinand Magellan and many people afterwards circumnavigated the earth. That means he left headed west, continued going west, and came back to where he started still going west. Actually Magellan was dead, but one of his ships led by Juan Sebastian Elcano finished the journey. If you head west and circumnavigate the earth yourself, you'll be able to tell because you will observe one fewer sunrise than everyone who stays at home.
Number three. The horizon. Ships on the ocean or tall Chicago buildings viewed over Lake Michigan disappear bottom first, and you can see the sunset twice if you watch it lying down and then quickly stand up. The simple fact is, if the earth were flat, there wouldn't be a horizon beyond which things could disappear. So from across Lake Michigan, you'd be able to see all of Chicago as well as the Rocky Mountains.
Number two. During a lunar eclipse, the shadow of the earth on the moon is curved.
And number one. We know the earth is round because we have photographic evidence.
Now what’s your evidence for your pizza world little flerf ?
@@twitherspoon8954 your ignorance is a reflection of your biases: your IQ has nothing to do with your biases: its a willful denial of things you aren't willing to investigate.
@@twitherspoon8954 atheist nazi
All of this, providing the heliocentric sun-worship model is accurate. Which one of us has been outside the earth to actually look at it?
This passage never baffled me the way it did for most others. What baffled me at first was its phrasing, "There has never been a day like it before or since, a day when the Lord listened to a man." Because obviously God listened to Abraham when he talked him down to spare Sodom and Gomorrah if ten righteous souls lived there, and obviously God listened to Moses when he argued that wiping out the Israelites would not look good to Israel's neighbors. If this was the writers' way of saying Joshua was an ordinary man compared to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Moses, then fair enough, but I would argue that when someone like Moses handpicks you to succeed him, you stop being "ordinary."
Ever heard of a solstice?
@@harveywabbit9541 Have any evidence that this would have happened on that particular day?
@@jasonspencer8558
It will take a long time before the Age of Taurus returns.
@@harveywabbit9541 I heard someone apply this type of thinking to Jesus recently, something about the Son of Man representing a specific constellation that is the starting point of a new universe after this one burns. I can't remember the specifics, but it sounded similar to your thoughts.
@@jasonspencer8558
"The Man" will refer to the man in the Aquarius constellation. The bible writers made sure we understood that this "the man" is Moses.
Interesting. But I’ve heard another explanation that actually interpreted it from the ancient Hebrew as an eclipse occurred during the battle. Furthermore, that it was an annular eclipse. Unfortunately I don’t remember exactly the date. But that this annular eclipse was visible in this particular region