I was that kind of person, I'm afraid to say. I was miserable in that relationship and vented constantly to try and keep my sanity. I knew and agreed with what you say, why be in a relationship where you only complain about them? The day before I ended that relationship, a friend just said "Why are you even with him, you don't have a single positive thing to say about him." , and it kind of gave me the resolve to end it for good. There were a few reasons I stayed, although in the end of it those reasons were only based on my insecurities and how little I thought of myself. Add that to growing up and seeing and hearing about how men never help around the house, how they can be mean drunks but still be worth staying with, and how society generally expects people to want relationships over being happily single, and a insecure person like me felt kind of trapped. But not anymore! Sorry for the rant.
I always thought the word "straight" was offensive, and therefore came from heterosexuals. To me it sounds homophobic, it seems to mean that heteros are "straight" as in healthy, normal, honest... implying that gays are "not straight" as in devious, twisted, kinky... I'm surprised the word was coined by gays, maybe a result of internalized homophobia?
@@lililangtry1881 Maybe, but doesn't _straight_ (with the original meaning) also just provide a visual reference for what it is like to operate in a largely cisgendered, heterosexual world? It kind of reminds me of _stealth_ or _passing,_ words used in the trans community that seem similar. It just seems to convey honesty about the reality of trying to get through life safely, undetected, rather than being self-hating (imo)
Im really glad more women are getting exposure on breadtube. We never would have gotten a video like this or on amatonormativity without creating a space where women feel comfortable to speak about THEIR views and present unique and intelligent arguments. Tara’s videos on sexuality and relationships, even as a straight man, have helped me feel validated in my thoughts on relationships and sexuality. I really appreciate her, and I’m glad we’re getting more feminine voices round here :)
Some of the heteropessimism I see online just feels like repackaged “I hate the opposite sex”/“men and women are just too different to get along” shit boomers say. I think people need to differentiate between hating hetero culture and just hating being straight or hating the opposite sex.
@@theunknown5386 do you really believe the opposite sexes are too different to be in healthy relationships?... also, genuinely, if you're unhappy with being straight as it attains to dating women- you could just not date women. you don't have to be alone of course, you could find a male friend who feels similar and just be roommates with them. (as opposed to settling down with a woman i mean)
There is a great overlap between people, who dislike queer people and people, who dislike the opposite sex. The reason is quite simple: the predisposition possible to envoke both of those is simply disliking people, who are differnt from oneself.
@@theunknown5386 if that's genuinely how you feel that's honestly very sad (And let's just ignore the belittling of gay trauma for a second) do you honestly feel like gender or sex plays that much of a role in who you are as a person? Maybe you just know a lot of shitty people or do you live in a place where gender roles are such a big deal? idk but personally I have equally as many male as female friends and their gender was never any consideration in me liking them as people, or a problem for that matter. Or can you be friends with women and is it just the romantic aspect that's a problem? I'm not trying to sound sarcastic or rude btw I'm honestly just curious why it is you're feeling that way because it's quite a sad outlook on life
@@theunknown5386 Yeah no, you would never want risking your life for holfing the hand of your s/o in the street or having your rights constantly being contested by a portion of the population. Trust me
same goes for the term homosexuals - there were no real terms/definitions for this; that did not mean they did not exist, we did not exist prior to that origin of word.
@@gpu213 hahaha, the date dr. Hetero was done killing the dr. women as witches accidentally on the stakes. (Or just because there was no word for it! Not that it didn't exist but there was not a word or term for it, as it was since then.)
"I'm not changing society, just complaining about it." - Tara Mooknee. While I can deeply relate to this quote, I feel like you should give yourself more credit. The work you do here is changing.
fun fact trans people generally dont care what you use to refer to them you wont teach people basic decency by pointing out """"wrong""" usage most enbies dont even ask people they arent close with / speak to on a (near)daily basis to use different pronouns than whatever comes to mind please stop correcting pronouns its obnoxious as shit
In Ancient Rome, Bisexuality was so normal that it was considered weird to only like sex with one kind of partner. One Roman emperor was mentioned in the chronicles as “only lying with women, never having known the touch of a man.” You don’t mention something like that if it’s viewed as “normal”. Now the Ancient Romans were also top tier misogynists, which was kind of part of this, but it just goes to show that heterosexuality wasn’t always the norm.
This is why I scream when people tell me Romans were very very "gay". No, they were very bi. I'm tired of bi erasure. It gets exhausting. That's the problem I have with LGBT spaces as a bi person. Myself and others who are bi included, were practically chased out of communities of LGBT because we're "not gay enough" or "we're gay but still too scared to be "fully" gay" or "we only say that to please hetero mens fantasies" it's exhausting. Some examples of Bi iconics who have been scrubbed of their bi identity and just labeled gay: Achilles, had lovers of men _and_ women but is considered only gay. Sappho (coined the OG lesbian) the poetess who wrote of her love for men _and_ women is now labelled gay and only gay. Freddy Mercury, self identified as bisexual multiple times, spoke of his love from women _and_ men, labelled as gay only. Stop👏Bi👏Erasure👏 If the straights aren't perceiving us as a gate way drug to gaydom (yes that is a thing someone told me once, I stg) then the actual gays consider us not "gay enough" (whatever that means lol).
Well in *theory* in ancient Rome something was only labelled as "sex" when it involved a penetrating and dominant male (so two women having sex wasn't actually considered "sex") It was also fine if that said male was penetrating a child of lower class, which was also scarily common :( I understood sexuality of the Romans to be something of power, because- especially if a man from upper class was involved- there were rules of who was allowed to penetrate who, the upper class male had to be the dominant one... HOWEVER I'm convinced that in actuality there also was a lot of caring and consenting sex between men, and/or women, also of different classes and people actually were bi or gay. I just wanted to say that the terms and also the view on sexuality were not the same as today and that has to be considered :)
Tara looks like a glammed up hillbilly in the beginning, then she switches it up to a glammed up auntie. A diverse style queen who gives us what we deserve.🦇 Edit: I made it!!!!! Thanks for the likes guys. Comment what part of the world you're watching this video from.
As a bi woman married to a man, ive even had some of my closest friends ask me if i can confirm “it was just a phase.” No - it wasnt just a phase but I found my person and he happened to be a man. I got lucky since hes also bi and that.. has its perks.
Same as a bi guy. Everyone keeps on "forgetting". It mainly makes me feel rage on behalf of an ex-boyfriend who was always very sweet and loving. I've had my former therapist even forget, even though I talk about male attraction etc, ... you know, married to woman, has kid, case closed. Still saving up for the golden retriever, though.
I feel extremely sorry for you. I would argue biphobia is actually worse than homophobia today. Because homosexuality has been normalised (thankfully) so much that people think "ah ok I get men can like man and women can like women" and it's not actually that easy. Don't misunderstand me I know the struggles of bisexuals. However some people do not ask "ah so it was just a phase wasn't it?" maliciously, also because it is plenty of people who really had a phase and then changed their minds (and there's nothing wrong with actually having a phase and then changing your mind of course), so I hope your friends were doing it non maliciously too. However I support you
Honestly I'm a bi girl and I've been in two long term relationships. One with a terrible girl that I basically had to take care for like a baby, and one with a fantastic guy that cooks and washes the dishes. We gotta start treating people from a given gender as individuals and not uniform masses of sexist stereotypes. And that'd also include stop passively accepting when men present those stereotypical behaviors "because they're men".
Yeah, the thought that “oh men🙄 they can’t take care of themselves” just takes away from the fact that men don’t take care of themselves because of misogyny rather than the fact they’re just “being men”. A man can take care of himself, a misogynistic man can’t because he expects the women to do it for him.
This! My bf was raised well, he cooks and cleans and everything! We don't live together, but I know that if we would, he would help me out a lot with chores 🥰
That's why I love bi girls, I don't know about you but all the straight girls I've dated have always been like big babies ... they never want to do anything for themselves ... and they only brought drama into my life, and when I complained to them for something they always came out with the excuse of what was my role as the man to take care of them and protect them as if they were pets ..... that has not happened to me with the few bi girls I have been with ... even We are still friends after the relationship ended ... the others did not speak to me again after they broke up.
@@seniormute2364 haha 😂. People here don’t like your comment so I donated 1 like to you. “Men should not expect women to take care of them” - 100+ likes 👍 “Women should not expect men to take care of them” - only 4 likes 👎 If you think people here - including this content creator - stands for true equality, then you are dreaming. Wake-up!
I think this also feeds into compulsive heterosexuality because of the idea that if you're miserable in a heterosexual relationship that's normal. Also, in some cases, it normalizes abuse so you just accept it as the 'norm'
Yes! Saying that all men act similarly awful makes victims of domestic abuse think that they’re not going to find someone better so they listen to the emotional manipulation of their partner and stay.
@@hazeld8016 I want to agree but realistically… men raised in a similar culture will likely behave in many similar ways. No man goes untouched by it. It’s not trying to say “stay with bad because they’re all bad,” it’s more about “yes, they ARE all bad in some ways (edit: at least more complacent about certain issues, which does count as being bad because it still harms women) because of social structures, and that is a problem, and we need to fix it”
@Annie Mouse sure, you can use the "stats" but those are just common trends and averages, same argument is used for calling certain ethnic or racial groups "all bad", I mean look at the crime stats?..
Actually hetero sexual relationships are the least abusive and longest lasting. Lesbians have the highest IPV rate against women, suffer from lesbian bed death and have the highest rate of the more than any other coupling. Stop with the unwanted sexual grooming. How many times do you need to be told this to get it through your head?
That throwaway joke at the end -- "fellas, is it gay to love your wife?" -- touches on something I've dealt with as a bi woman. Especially when I first came out, there were a surprising amount of men in my life that started inviting me to participate in their misogyny with them, via jokes about women, objectifying women, talking about the women in their lives in dehumanizing ways. It revealed to me how many men view their misogyny not as a manifestation of gender -- i.e. they view women this way because they are men -- but as a manifestation of their sexuality; i.e. they view women this way because they are attracted to women. Therefore, when they found out I was also attracted to women, they assumed that I would view women the same way. And that thinking ends in this odd paradox of straight men truly not loving women in any true sense. Toxic masculinity demands that men create an emotional divide between themselves and their partners, and creates such a chasm between them and their partners that they can no longer emotionally connect -- and then, because they can no longer emotionally connect, and because they view women as a fundamentally lesser and inscrutable species, they endlessly meme about how much they hate their wives. A lot of this video focused on straight women's heterofatalism, I think an interesting sequel to this would be focusing on the heterofatalism in straight men that you touched on in this video.
@@jdbruce you are the latest evolution of feminism after the nazifemininist the nazigrammarfeminist, the feminist who watches over the web so that the grammar is saved ,you have come a long way with gender theories😂 ed ora levati dalle palle
@@Kabullo76 NAZIGRAMMARFEMINIST! Ah I love it. This is great. I am so happy we had this interaction. I don’t even consider myself a feminist, but thank you , I will gladly take on this title. Arrivederci!
Ngl my asexuality definitely fuels the heterofatalism I feel. Men throughout my life have not treated me great and pile on that I am asexual which poses a whole other difficulty, I decided to just give up in love. It makes me feel hopeless and alone because of how shitty and sexist things are (specially with the whole manosphere thing being so famous), after Andrew Tate my fear was further strengthened because you don’t know who is the sexist pig until too late. Thank you for putting words to the hopelessness I feel 😊
omg i found another asexual. i feel hopeless and alone all the time for the exact same reasons. the world is so sucky. since we're really early into human history, i just hope that all this shit we have to deal with will one day be a relic of the past. like the salem witch trials or something idk. although my distrust of men is 100% sky-high. the only things that make me feel better are videos of feminist men and women validating me haha. u got love from korea ❤
I think it is safest and happiest if asexual people just date other asexual people. Personally I could never be happy in a relationship without sex and most people feel this way... I imagine that's why many of these relationships don't work out.
I'm also asexual, but a man; I had basically the same experience with heterofatalism. The women in my life were worse than the men, and social media allowed me to be exposed to harmful ideas and vapid women that only further entrenched my idea that women were dangerous. It's been about 2 years since I last engaged with such harmful ideology, but I don't think I'll ever be able to undo all of what its done
good. u aint going to benefit from relationship without giving out the most important thing. seeing ur comment makes me think this andrew dude is even more based that i thought.
Asexuality is definitely a big hurtle for a romantic relationship with a sexual partner, my partner has a very diminished libido, but despite the fact that sexual attention is needed for me to feel loved, we make it work
whats so ironic about the thing that gays invented the phrase "straight" it its only logical that the outsiders will lable the "normal"...for example if ur in a group of mean girls, u yourselves wont start calling urselves mean girls
As a straight woman, this makes me so sad that some straight women just hate being straight women. I'm not a fan of "straight culture" or anything like that, just I think that everyone should love themselves and be happy with who they are.
Agreed, I think women are just tired of male oppression. To the point where they hate even being attracted to men cause they see them as many of their other oppressors. Still that isn’t good though.
Yep. And it becomes much worse when they start implying that they are not straight, even though they are, because they want to feel a certain way about themselves.
I'm that straight woman. I'd rather die than ever be with a man ever again. But I'm not attracted to women whatsoever. So at 22, I've accepted my fate of dying alone. Better than being with an abuser.
@@bluegreen9799 I think the best thing is for both genders to open up a little. Being gay I’m on the sidelines here but the overwhelming message I see from both sides is that they feel oppressed & not listened to. I spent my whole life as a feminist until the last year or two, I watched a documentary made by a feminist documentarian called The Red Pill. It made me question things & I saw how rigid my mindset had been. “The Patriarchy” is created by gender roles. Both those gender roles come with their own advantages and their own prisons. I think pushing equalism over feminism is one of the keys to creating harmony & ending things like heteropessimism. Right now- no one feels listened to & in order for that to change we need to dissolve the barriers creating two sides
@@vegahimsa I agree with you, but it’s a two person game, and often when one side is ready to listen and the other isn’t that causes the side who was willing to listen to go back to not listening. That’s what I feel like often happens with women. We are willing to come out of our shell and listen but don’t get much reciprocated. But that’s just personal experience. Also it’s even harder to be heard when you’re a black women cause you’re just seen as angry or ignorant, or you’re compared to what’s going on in the media. Like as a black woman when I try to talk about overt sexualization of women, meg the stallion or nicki Minaj is always mentioned as if they’re actions are my fault because they’re also black.
Bell Hooks has a great book titled "The Will To Change: Men, Masculinity, and Love." Its honestly a book that helped me, a straight man, really understand the misguided sense of self worth I attached to what I was told makes you a man. This Hetero-fatalism is tied dorectly to how our system has cultivated this power dynamic for centuries. The power to change it has always been placed upon women either through breaking point or literally survival. We men need to realize we have work to do and the ones who blame society for "favoring women" in certain instances is a false privelege. Much of those percieved benefits are built upon ideals of misogyny and opression. The idea that the court always sides with the mother is a common talking point. But this favoritism is based upon patriarchal stereotypes that men generally refuse to see or are incapable of seeing. So they instead blame the women when what they should be doing is joining the women to reform social expectation or to abolish expectations. Us men can be worth loving but we have to make the effort to show we are worth loving. We live in a time where being mediocre is no longer a guarantee of the American Dream and it shouldnt be. As individuals we need to understand how we can be our best selves.
Thank you so much.. as a woman who is a Men’s Rights Advocate..seeing So many men claim society is ‘gynocentric’ When court gives the custody to mothers is , so ridiculous like they forgot how the situation was just 40-50 years ago..When women were forced to live with their abusive husbands because they didn't have financial stability to support their children..heck, in Indian, women who's husbands passed away were burnt alive in the tradition of Sati.. Because they were viewed as burdens..
Do you even read what you type? "Us men can be worth loving but we have to show we are worth loving"? What kind of sick mindset is that? This was pushed onto me as a kid and teenager and it fucked me up for a good decade. Do not spread this bullshit. No one has to prove anything.
“Us men can be worth loving but we have to show that we are worth loving” is just a statement so full of self-apology at concept of identifying as a man that I worry you did not learn the right sorts of things about what it means to be a man from this book. Because no born-into identity should fucking be or feel like that
I get the point that sexualities are a construct, but I think it's unfair to say that if we erased it then everyone would be fluid and bi. I'm gay, and I've never liked a man in my life and I never will. I think that saying that sexuality changes/can be changed will lead to the rhetoric that lesbians and gay people can be 'turned' straight or that straight men can be with me when they just can't. But also it is important to remember that your labels can change or that your attraction can intensify at certain periods of time. I've identified as bi in the past, but even then I was a lesbian, if that makes sense. Even though I knew I could and wanted to be attracted to men, I just wasn't. Overall, whilst your label can change, I do feel like that for a group of people, they'll just never be attracted to the same/opposite gender, regardless of how society views sexuality. People's labels can change, but sometimes your sexuality is fixed. Not for everyone, this is just personal experience. Idk food for thought
I totally get what you mean. When I first read it I thought "christ the conversion therapy people would LOVE this." I know some people who are very monosexual (and it's about gender, so not in a trans-exclusionary way) and who am I to tell them they're not? I would still say that I think many more people fall onto a "spectrum" than they initially thought in the past. That's why I think the people identifying as bi or "not straight" are increasing - but that's not to say ALL people are. Though as you say - if I'm interpreting what you're saying correctly: I agree that people's *labels* change more than their orientation. But like I said - I'm really NOT an expert 😂
@@TaraMooknee Yeah that was what I was trying to say. This whole comment was purely how I feel, and I don't mean it to be applied to other people, especially not bi people (who are super valid!). This is an amazing video (and response). Sexuality is defo a spectrum, like a rainbow (get it, because-). Some people are red, some are purple but loads and loads of people fall somewhere in the middle, so we shouldn't think about it so binarily. Have a lovely day
Labels are important, i can't help but feel like wanting to get rid of them is idealistic idea that would bring more harm them good because at the end majority would take over to create status quo. It kinda sounds like erasure with extra steps, LGBTQIA fought for too long to be recognized to just go "eh let's just abandon sexualities overall" because heteronormativity will survive but everyone else will struggle.
@@papkinn totally true! Often, labels lead to action (look at the invention of the word 'bisexual' and the positive impact that had on bi rights) and unite a group of marginalized people
@@lucasAA927 Boy... I want you to put homosexuality instead of heterosexuality. And then think if that comment is still ok. If this is a joke is flying over my head
Wow, I can't believe I am three years late to this party! As an anecdote, because I feel like it is at least tangentially related to the video, when my wife and I were fairly newly married (having already been in a relationship for five years, mind), one of my friends asked me, "Who is your best friend? And don't say your wife." It struck me as such a profoundly odd condition to tack on to that question, and watching your essay brought it back to me. Thinking back on it, though, it really goes to show how pervasive that line of thinking is, that heterosexual relationships must exist in a state of opposition and conflict between partners. That answering that my wife was my best friend was somehow such a wrong choice that it had to be declared in the question.
I am nearly 60 and a 'straight' woman. I have been married, had children, had relationships. I am not planning to be in another relationship - my experience with men - particularly men my age - is that it just isn't worth it. I want to make my own choices, be free, happy and have good self-esteem. That seems to mean being single. A lot of women my age seem to have made the same choice.
I'm 35 (bisexual, single and childfree), and I believe I have already made this choice as well. I am attracted to men, I can't help that. But I am not interested in pursuing a relationship with them beyond (perhaps) friendship. I think my mom is about in the same mindset at you. She's was married to my dad. Has three children and seems content on now being single.
A lot of people seem to forget that you....dont HAVE to be in a relationship. You dont have to live the rest of your life with someone else, and theres nothing wrong with that!
If by "A lot of women my age" you mean "an extreme minority of women my age" then I agree with you. Being a volunteer at a community center in Florida means I've seen tons of senior citizens with most of them female, and haven't seen a single one who has ever said anything remotely like being happy and having good self esteem means staying away from men. When a guy says that men who want to be happy should avoid women, people come out of the woodwork to call him an incel and make fun of him for not being able to handle a woman. I won't be meanspirited like that, but I will say with sincerity that if you truly believe that you need to be single to have self esteem then you should seek a psychologist because that is a sign of past relationship trauma leaving you with issues you should work through. Having intimate relationships with other human beings is how homo sapiens has evolved over hundreds of thousands of years. Thinking you must be alone in order to be free and have good self esteem is not healthy.
@@patrickbarnes9874 Maybe not. But that is what life has taught me. I also know women other women my age. And there is only one who has chosen to remain in a relationship with a man. If you know a man who can truly let me be me and love me for it - well you are luckier than I have been. I am at peace with my decision. Not as happy as maybe I could be in a perfect world. But at peace. I haven't had an easy life but I have fought hard for what I have and the self knowledge I have - and yes that has included therapy. At the moment I choose to put my energy into my children - who are still getting over the trauma of their violent father. I'm happy for people who have known good men. Sadly I am not one of them.
I think something that awakened the knowledge of positive masculinity was, ironically, lesbians. I looked at the masculinity of butch lesbians and thought "if being manly is bad, then why do I feel safe + happy around these people?" It really opened my eyes to positive masculinity in men and that, no, men aren't predisposed to violence and hatred. Men are perfectly capable of performing masculinity through the lens of kindness and respect. And they can learn to.
I think the root of your problem stemmed from your belief that masculinity is in itself a performance. As a man, you learn that regardless of your intentions, others, especially women who are not kin, may feel at any moment as though your mere presence is threatening to some degree. Integrating this notion in a healthy way is an essential part of manhood. It is not an easy thing to do, especially if you are inclined to pursue amorous relationships with women, because being bold or playful whilst contemporaneously being able to help them feel safe is not an easy dance to pull off. Some manage this better than others though you can never guarantee how your approach will be received at the end of it all. Disarming the negative assumptions of others whilst making them feel at ease, with particular regard to women and children, is an obligation for a man. Such as if potential harm were to befall them, it would be a man's duty to try to protect them or to bring them to safety.
@@CyberChrist I think the suffering stems from society refusing to acknowledge just how much is placed on the shoulders of men. My speculation is that we refuse to acknowledge this because, in so doing, we would have to accept the notion of a certain negative bias that most individuals, and especially women may instinctually feel towards the men who are strangers to them. We are struggling to integrate this concept into the emerging culture, thus we have opted to deconstruct "masculinity" altogether by adopting a paradigm wherein manhood becomes analogous to a substance which may prove toxic at varying degrees of exposure (♂️☢️‼️). It seems to me like we are asking men to bear most of the liability in regards to social, economic and cultural activities or interactions whilst, conversely, offering neither incentive nor encouragement. This contradicts the "blank-slate" version of equality that has become fashionable for our contemporaries to champion. Therein, I believe, lies the true source of the problem.
33:10 NGL, that "They are worth loving" hit me like a truck and I almost cried. Need to think a lot about my own pessimism regarding human interaction and how, as a man, I feel like I will never live up to a standard that can justify me being worthy as a partner.
The systems in place and the stigmas that exist are not your fault. All you can do is an individual is be a good role model for those around you and to try and cultivate a happy community of people. If you put love out into the world, it will come back to you.
That's the thing. They say we are worth loving then choose the bear over us. That's the problem with ideologies such as those in the video. Everything is my fault because I happened to be born male despite having never been in a position to control anything I am told I'm guilty of. Until women start taking accountability for their actions they're not fit to talk about problems nor solutions. I'm not going to be an ally to people who hate me and who will never be my ally.
@@ElyonDominusthis is a really oversimplified view.and I can't believe ur still on the bear thing. the bear thing was designed to make people that don't understand the nuance really mad. the scenario is absurd so the answers are absurd. I don't think mens actions are biologically determined but taking no responsibility and calling measured critique of social structures 'hate' and taking it so personally is telling because it means you see yourself as inexricably part of those structures. refusing to collaborate because of a silly internet joke about a bear is ridiculous
@@ElyonDominusYou missed the part where it's a RANDOM man. While some men are great, some men are terrible, and we aren't willing to take that risk. If I had to pick between a bear and my husband....well, I've gone to the woods with my hubby before. Bears usually leave humans alone in the woods. I've had woman friends tell me about their male FRIENDS graping them. If a friend will do it, how can a woman trust a random stranger?
“I’m not changing society, just complaining about it.” Don’t sell yourself short. These are some dang complex ideas. They need to be discussed, but we don’t quite have the language or understanding to discuss them. You’re just making society-changing more accessible. Thank you for your service
I'm bisexual and with a straight man. My taste in men from a personality/gauge standpoint is more feminine even if they match the gendered expectations for looking and dressing like a man. I don't see myself ever dating a conventionally heterosexual man, because as stated in the video, the pressure to fulfill gendered expectations could be an issue. I don't feel that in my relationship with a man.
Saaaame! I have a really caring, kind, emotional boyfriend who is really into me being more masculine. Love him so much. But then there are our families and friends who still manage to ruin it by expecting or indirectly suggesting (mostly to me) to follow gender roles
I feel that. I’m a bi married to a wonderful, caring himbo of a man. Neither of us feel pressure to perform gender and it's so freeing. He’s so great that he makes me forget how insufferable some Straight Men™️ are
@@josipamatic7296 Same here I sometimes get the feeling that our relatives are quite annoyed by how unproblematic our relationships is, trying to make us feel that such thing isn't normal (and by no means I'm trying to say that our relationship is perfect or that we're better than everyone else or anything like that just to be clear) Then they describe what a "normal" relationship is and it's straight (no pun intended) up toxic like....
SAAAME I only ever had a crush on a guys that had no pressure to appear manly ir cared if they did or not. Their presentation may have been skewed as “feminine” from a societal standpoint because hetero men tend to overcompensate their masculinity even if toxic. Its a hard thing ti describe as gender non conforming does not mean fem all the time but also I perceive it that way? idk Its because there are no gendered expectations in a relationship with said guy
This hits so much as a bisexual woman, I hate the erasure that surrounds my bisexuality, especially now that I'm dating a cisgender man, and expecilly because it's easier to date a man, because society still refuses to believe my sexuality, and what people don't even understand is I'm with my boyfriend because I fell in love with the person, regardless os his gender or sexual orientation
I feel you, it's annoying when people treat my sexuality as a cry for attention or some way of making myself feel special. It took me 6 years and one girlfriend to finally accept myself and shed my internalised misogyny, allowing me to actually acknowledge my attraction to women and feel confident enough to express it. The last thing any bi person needs after having the bravery to come out is being shut out of the community that's meant to support them. Not to mention I'm on the asexuality spectrum, causing me to not really feel strong feelings for anyone, so I had to deal with a general lack of understanding and hostility from whoever I told because apparently stacking labels also means cry for attention. For so long I wanted to just be "normal" (het and allosexual) but after years of trying and failing and making myself unhappy, I've realised it's pointless and I just need to be myself.
“Homosexuals and heterosexuals are considered different because they can be divided into two groups on the basis of the belief that they can be divided into two groups.” This blew my mind. Because ain’t that any binary group of people. I need to sit down.
Whenever you take a thing and separate it, you will find some members to fit into all groups regardless if you pick two groups or two hundred. That's why you get many sideways glances for all of this. If we say there are 12,800 genders, then we can find ways to differentiate and people to put in them, but it doesn't make that categorization scheme meaningful or useful. It's a data partitioning issue, and finding what groupings make sense is a big part of the design. It's funny, but this comment speaks to a very central issue around how data is structured, why, and how your structure can lead to blind alleys (we used to call it statistical funny money, looks good on paper, but it's worthless). It's a very real and very technical problem.
Sexuality is definitely a spectrum, the thing is, some people are at the very end of that spectrum, and feel either exclusively heterosexual or exclusively homosexual. It can be fluid for those who don't identify exclusively as either. I'm bi, and I definitely don't believe being bi means you're 50/50 gay and straight. It can honestly very day to day for me.
As a bi woman myself, it really grosses me out seeing posts making fun of abusive situations as being inherent to heterosexuality and people laughing at it (REALLY?!), with the added bonus that such “humor” completely ignores that abuse isn’t exclusive to straight relationships (nor are cishet men the only ones who can be abusive) and that plenty of people in the LGBT community have been abused by their partner(s). While abuse patterns are largely the same regardless of identity, a lot of them are blindsided by it because the idea that LGBT relationships are "purer" is really pushed on us by our own community. Not to mention some people outright use the “I can’t be abusive because we’re both women/men and therefore equal” as a way to manipulate, or outright believe it themselves so they don't have to take any responsibility for their behavior.
The rates of intimate partner abuse are not really equal between couples, it goes like WW >> MW >> MM. That doesn't necessarily mean women are more abusive in relationships, it very well might be that men have a narrower definition of what constitutes abuse and/or they are less likely to admit being victimized because of social pressure, we'd probably need to know how the data is collected first before jumping to conclusions.
Thank you for calling this out, I've seen the sentiment previlant in some ocassions where it's used to scapegoat responsibility for bad behavior in relationships, which are not exclusive to sexual identity.
I think the reason why bi couples are even more violent than lesbian ones is the fact you need more than a partner to be bi, ergo more jealousy is inherent.
I think you're missing up the term bisexual (attraction towards both the same and opposite sex) and poly couples (a relationship between more than 2 people). But yes bisexuals do face a high rate of dv
@@squishydishy1593 The thing is I'm of the opinion that the ~sexual suffix denotes sexual relations, not attraction (that would be ~philia) ;) Also, twice the competition to worry about = twice the jealousy :P
Ugh i can’t get over how much i like this… I’d never heard of heterofatalism before and now i feel so educated but also legit more optimistic abt het relationships. I skimmed seresin’s essay and I was worried that it was gonna start saying smth along the lines of like ugh straight women need to stop complaining abt men, and then instead it turned around and said actually, straight women dissociating from their own heterosexuality is essentially just another form of woman-shaming bc it shames women for liking men and does absolutely nothing to arouse change in men.
it really frustrates me that whenever people talk about positive masculinity, they always forget that masculinity isn't equivalent to maleness. like butches exist, we aren't the same as men, and being masculine does not always reinforce the gender binary or heterosexuality
Came to say something similar. A lot of cultures view masculinity and femininity as energies, not even necessarily opposing. And all people embody both to varying degrees regardless of any biological factors. That seems to match my experience more. Under that model a lot of the toxic traits come from trying to excise parts of yourself to be perceived as a more perfect avatar. And the psychological damage that comes with it.
@@nezumired I’ve always seen feminine and masculine as energies that don’t have anything to do with gender or sex. Unfortunately, it gets me into a lot of trouble (especially with feminists) when I say things like “being the provider of your family or being strong and independent is masculine.” Plus, as a black woman, I see femininity and masculinity differently than mainstream.
@@Trollestiatumblur I think they either must think you're calling them "men" or want those behaviors to be gender neutral. And tbh, they kind of are. It's what responsible humans do, no matter the gender identity or amount of masculinity or femininity. It's just hard to peel back how many behaviors are actually purely masc or fem with that pesky society getting in the way.
@@Callimo Western culture has sex, gender and masculinity/femininity so hopelessly entangled it's hard to talk about any of them. People just assume you're talking about anatomy no matter how specifically it's stated. I don't know if we need new language or a shift in understanding the words we use.
I noticed in some ppl a tendency to shame women for doing "women things" like baking or being feminine in general, meanwhile men sometimes even get praised for that. Could you make a video with this topic?
@@tmoe-2581 think make up, a lot of people will consider it a women thing but shame women for too much or too little, so yeah it exists. Though I’m not sure about other concepts that are “women things”
Million dollar idea: throw a gender reveal party where the gimmick is "is the baby a poodle (pink) or a husky (blue)". Do the whole cake thing, get everyone really into it. Only to reveal that you are not revealing the gender of a baby. In fact, you aren't even pregnant. This was just to announce that you're getting another dog. (And it's a poodle, because, well, they're adorable). Bonus points if someone comes out holding said puppy as well.
Oh, I'm so abusing this. I can see it already. Theist: Pride is a sin. Me: The meaning of words change, you know, but tell me, are you gay, bisexual, asexual, or straight perhaps? Theist: Straight as an arrow. Me: So you used to be gay. So what happened? Your god died in a car accident and you got so angry that you lost all faith in your relationship and turned hetero? You angry militant ex-gays are so illogical.
i spent a really long time denying my attraction to men and identifying as a lesbian because men hurt me in the past and i associated attraction to men with weakness. i think my view of "heterosexual" relationships was based in heterofatalism. i had to realise that (as you put it) men are worth loving and let go of the shame surrounding attraction to men which has made me so much happier. thank you tara for this incredible video which you clearly put so much effort into, and for articulating something i couldn't put into words before :)
Are they really? I think there's a difference between not being "ashamed" of an attraction vs actually dating men. Why bother taking the risks of a disproportionate chance of domestic violence and unsatisfactory relationships when you can be statistically happier single?
im crying at “fellas is it gay to love your wife” that’s literally the energy they give like why would you marry someone you fucking hate 😭doesnt make any god damn sense🦇
Same 😂 But at the same time, I can name at least 5 men (either from family and friends) that would probably ask this question. They're mostly boomers or older, though, so it appears to be a generational thing. Let's hope that this trend of making fun of and/or bemoaning your marriage will be a thing of the past soon!
Yeah, me and my husband often stand out at family gatherings as we actually like one another, and have shared interests as opposed to inventing ways to spend time appart .
@@trikitrikitriki Imagine being a grown ass man and whining about cleaning after yourself... it might surprise you, but It's not every woman's dream to clean after other people every single day 🤐🤫
🦇 just found your channel today when the Hating Children isn't a personality video came up on my feed. And I'm so happy it did. Looking forward to binging your backlog content then get pissed I have to wait for more :P
I sometimes struggle with the statement that “sexuality is fluid” because it seems much more fluid for some than for others. As a lesbian, I can confidently say I’m not ever going to be into men. That’s something I know is not going to change (it can often be a touchy subject given how rampant lesbophobia can be in our community; that attitude that everyone *must* be a little bit into both binary genders, that being a lesbian is outdated or boring somehow; I see those a lot, unfortunately). The same (or rather, inverse) can be said of many gay men; a lot of them know they won’t ever be into women. At the same time, of course, some people may feel their sexuality is VERY fluid, which is totally valid. The issue arises, I think, because a lot of people interpret “fluid” as specifically meaning one’s sexuality is likely to change or shift, when really sexuality is only ever *universally* “fluid” in that human sexuality is just too complex for labels or boxes to ever fully describe our experiences. The way nonbinary people can exist inside the lesbian label might be good example of that. Also, shoutout to the bi women in the comments beating heterofatalism back with a stick. You’re doing great! 💜
Well maybe you're ignoring the role of consciousness has in it? Women by nature are bisexual but when men show such a distasteful disgraceful revolting image of everything they do and say, that fact and reality affects the subconscious. Opposite of that is with women. Women often are the better sex no matter how you look at it so a lot of straight women actually choose to be in same sex relationships or have at least been attracted to whatever degree to other women (excluding women who are brainwashed heavily who as a result have internalized misogyny). The stats on how much girls in free environments been with other women as opposed to how men have been with other men also differ greatly with the number for women being way higher. Just like in smaller same sex crowds. In female prisons for example, romantic lasting sexual relations among women form and stay even after they go free. In male prisons, usually the numbers are WAY lower and the ones that happen usually are fear/assault ones rather than romantic or lasting ones.
in my opinion "its not a choice" is kind of a foot in the door. it doesnt matter if its a choice, its ok to be gay because it hurts no one, the idea that it -not- being a choice makes it ok, relies on the assumption that it wouldnt be ok otherwise
I mean, it depends on how you interpret it. Sexuality not being a choice is a basic fact of life for many, many people (just look at countries where being gay is illegal: if we can choose our sexuality, why are there still gay ppl in these countries? How insulting to them would that mindset be ?). And saying it doesn't matter diminishes the experience of many gay people and how we discovered ourselves. However, I do agree that if society weren't that awful to LGBT people that question wouldn't matter. To homophobes, it would justify treating gayness as an illness. To a lot of us, it's a protective measure and a helping hand to figure out who we are. Homophobia is the reason why this is such a big topic, but it doesn't mean "sexuality isn't a choice" is something to stop considering.
The problem is, “it’s not a choice” is important because if I could choose not to be gay you bet ur ass I would, it’s not fun, to imply that anyone would choose the harder way out is strange
I agree. I don't believe sexuality is a choice for most people. However, even if it were, it wouldn't be immoral or an illness. Even if it were a choice, it wouldn't be ok to persecute or mistreat others because of it. It hurts no one, it's nobody else's business. It's a matter of personal autonomy and freedom. I do of course understand why it's important to emphasize that it's not a choice due to reasons that others have stated. But it's not because it's not a choice that it is ok to be LGBTQ. It's just ok to be.
Understanding that sexuality isn’t a choice was what helped me overcome homophobia so I still think it’s fundamental and important but I totally see what you’re saying.
i think the idea behind it is more 'sexuality is fluid, and can be influenced by outside factors though the change can't be forced' not 'you choose who you're attracted to'
Just finished watching and felt like getting this off my chest. Alot of this heteropessimism seems to be centred around women, yet i feel like the hatred towards the opposite sex is equal. I'm not from an English speaking country, but here i hear men talking shit about their wives and gfs all the time. Comedians LOVE to make whole acts about how their wives are always bitchy, nagging, taking away all their money and all that. Once i was on a bus with my dog and she was getting up at every stop, thinking we were getting off. The bus was full and i was stressed. A man in his late 50s, early 60s (who clearly had a drink or two) said to me that he used to have a dog, now he has a wife and it's better. Then he got off. Kinda left me conflicted. Also, all my female friends have shit men. Edit: Remembered another real life example. My neighbor wanted to go on a walk with her friend, but her husband yelled at her to clean dog hair off furniture. Yes, yelled. So her friend ended up sitting in front of the house and waiting. Idk, this hurts me and i'm not even married to that person.
Either that’s fragile/toxic masculinity or just straight up abuse I feel like parents teach their sons that it’s okay to verbally (or sometimes physically) abuse women because it’s makes them more “manlier.” That’s just…disgusting 🤢
I have really been enjoying your videos! This one was fantastic too. There was just one point i felt a slight wistful pinch at, around minute 21 - when your response to 'political lesbianism' thoughtfully included lesbian erasure, but there was no inclusion or acknowledgement of ace erasure from that discussion, even as there was care and thought put into not invalidating the identity of some political lesbians. It was a momentary pinch; i thoroughly enjoyed the rest of the video❤
Yeah that part at the end where men pretend that being married is the worst thing in the world or how their girlfriend is the villain in their life. It's part of so many standup comedy bits. Dude, if that's how you feel, divorce is legal.
Khadija Mbowe has a great video where she discusses what I think she calls "psychological patriarchy." It's a great way to examine and explain of a lot of this.
@@creativeideas5985 >Marriages are toxic by default. Ad not because of the men, they try their best. Are you implying it's the women's fault? Plenty of marriages without women. So how about toxic marriages between men. Who's at fault then? If you're in a toxic marriage or relationship, get out. But don't broad brush all people who are married ...
It happens both ways. As a man, I've heard countless humiliating and disparaging remarks about men, especially coming from women in a relationship. Most of those remarks are about male incompetence and shortcomings. In fact, incompetence, especially when it comes to household matters, has been at the core of many a sitcom. Oh no, those stooges can't change a diaper or make pancakes without setting the house on fire! I've read women's blogs that routinely claim that men can't do anything right. Women complain about their husbands in much the same manner, but ... their grievances are taken seriously, whereas when men present - in a joking manner - the problems they face in a relationship, they are ridiculed, accused of misogyny, etc. Btw, have you not noticed the phrasing of the comment of a bi woman sited in the video? She said that women are wonderful, while men are a bad choice. The attitude is way more common than you think: we, girls, can do no wrong and fart rainbows and roses, while men are the worst thing ever. Many women can't bring themselves to say they love their men - they have to pass it as a joke or portray their partner as their mistake or vice. God forbid you say anything nice about a man!
It's a joke. It's made for people to laugh, people laugh because universally, if you've been married for more than a few years there's been at least one time that your spouse has made you crazy. The jokes are popular because everyone can relate (male and female, depending on the joke). That's what compromise is, not getting what you want the majority of the time. If you're getting what you want the majority of the time (I'd say any more than 25%) then you're not compromising. If having a partner or a family isn't worth that to you then that's all good. But that's what a relationship is. Not getting what you want most of the time, giving up your sovereignty to another (which they reciprocate, and suffer the same consequences).
I believe there's a difference between "men" as a group of people, and "men" as a social construct under patriarchy. The later being the standards to which the former are held by 🎶sOCieTY🎶, to the detriment of all. I don't hate men, I hate patriarchy. I wish that more men had the chance to cultivate the freedom of thought to realize patriarchy is a prison for them too.
I agree! Men can be feminists too; I think it's so important for men to be able to talk to other men about the patriarchy. Because like you said, it does also effect their lives as a trickle down effect. It's upsetting when 'feminism' is gendered or sometimes worded in a way that implies exclusivity for the man. We're all in this together~~
Patriarchy? The US is a consumerist society. And consumers are very female driven. You can argue that its a matriarchal society since you control the way the market goes. And on the part of societal expectations. That is not a patriarchal thing. That's human nature. That's how we get to have other people to like us. So yes, men are expected to act a certain way-not just because we want approval of being a man but that's how women choose to date men. Thats what women find attractive in men. The problem you have is that you conflate insecure men with masculinity and patriarchy. But guess what? Even us men make fun of those dudes because they overcompensate trying over do things and they come off us as insecure. And im not a feminist because its literally in the name. Its funny because its you that is in the fringes of society with your thought yet the rest of humanity and men are the ones that need to "cultivate" our thoughts? Even if it were true that these "expectations" are placed on me as shackles. I proudly wear them because its the guideline in which I follow to strive to be a better man every day. But also realizing there is a fine line in what being a man is and not over doing. For example. Being confident and not being arrogant. Being strong and not being abusive. Being a leader but learning how to listen to others. Being stoic but not being afraid to ask for help. Not showing emotion but knowing there is a time and place to cry and that its ok to cry. All lines I try not to cross something I use "patriarchy" as a guideline. Being a moral outstanding citizen was a cultural norm back in the day. Wether people actually lived by it is another story. But of course your feminist revisions will not let you see history through that lense. Instead of holding those individuals accountable. We abolish virtue. Patriarchy means working towards a goal to keep society moving. Yes, that means having roles but also understanding their is outliers to those roles. What we are living is far from patriarchy. Its all about the individual and doin what they feel like doing without the consequences. And its funny because its mainly women that push that message of doing what ever they want and what ever makes them feel good. But at the same time criticize men that party, drink, smoke, play video games as childish. That make them feel good does it not? They are doing what they want? So we are far from living a patriarchy.
I always thought this was the default understanding in this debate, but after hearing 'not all men' the thousands time I realized that people can not understand this concept. 🙄
Women have to work outside of the household, but we are also expected to do most or all of the household work as well. And at the same time, we are seen by men as weaker and less intelligent. Make it make sense.
@@alexanderd6793 A wild con appears... Obviously trying to shift attention from his failed socioeconomic and theoethnocentric ideals and blame everything that is bad on socialism, having absolutely no idea how it could even possibly make sense himself, as expected. The fact that western and ancient capitalist and socialist societies were influenced by the vermin that is evangelical christianism and other christian sects, making BOTH view women as inferior and in need to be controlled by men never crossed your mind. And never will...
@@ViniSocramSaint Um , my guy, I'm a Social Democrat and I'm agnostic. All I was trying to say is that religion isn't the main thing that does it, since it happens in secular nations. It also happens a lot in nations like Japan, that weren't influenced my Christianity that much.
@@alexanderd6793 Dang! It's hard to tell a person's intentions through an internet comment, specially when it's so simple and blends in with the predictable rest. Thought I had my 5th tally mark of con hunting for the week. By the way, revisit your sources on the conservative influences in the east. There is a lot of intermingling(?). Japan has a class problem based on sex, age and labour, with an unhealthy degree of obssession on who is inferior and who is superior, to the point of half their language being based in announcing, assuming and performing under classes (having even 3 versions of kanji and katakana - I guess - to do it) and adapt interrelations to turn classes even more evident; also, India did come up with the idea that "the fair skinned are more desirable and should be given everything"; also mentioning the asian and oceaniac(?) practice of considering islanders and the brown skinned "dirty asians". But not all prejudices are purely native. By the way, the fact you mention "secular nations" and label yourself "social democrat" bugs me. Maybe there is a considerable age gap or ideology-loyalty difference between us. Please don't tell me you are one of these "labelvores" that spend way too much time gawking at political wikis, ignorig close to anything other than scattered little details related to political labels... AND ONLY LABELS, just so you keep yourself politically confused and change denominations as frequently as I change underware... Not assuming, just hope you aren't one of those. Sorry in advance for the animosity but do not feel like being patient today.
Honestly I'm beyond tired of "we don't choose this" as the 'why' we shouldn't be treated like second class citizens...even if I could 'choose' I'd still choose to be pansexual, even if we CHOSE to be attracted to x it doesn't become wrong because someone else wants to choose for me something else? We're all different, and some people are more strongly attracted to different types of people, but it's all fluid and no matter how much we 'choose' or 'cultivate' or 'don't choose and just are this way' we STILL GET TO BE OURSELVES. None of that 'lack of choice' is what imbues humans with the right to love the way they love. The right is there period, and we can 'choose' as much as we damn well please without it detracting in the slightest from that right.
I had a teenager ask me once "why should I support lgbtq+ rights?" and I was like: mate... you support them cuz they have human rights. Does gay make you not human somehow? What does it even matter what gender you are or who you love if you still are a person. I think it's an idea conservatists will have a hard time disagreeing with.
Yes! It's horrofying and incredible to wrap my mind around how most discrimination against miniroty groups just boils down to "you are different from us and that's why you don't deserve humanity."
On Sheila Jeffries’ description of men as “oppressors” colonizing women’s bodies, may I present to you Catie Curtis’ song “Radical”, with the lyrics: “But I'm not being radical when I kiss you I don't love you to make a point” describing her feelings towards her wife at the time. Lesbian sex and love isn’t inherently radically feminist, and therefore straight sex and relationships aren’t inherently misogynistic or anti-feminist
I wonder what makes these people think they are... Do they just search for more and more validation so they think "if we can make lesbians into feminism, we have even more influence!"... Or do they scapegoat all the problems to another group of people while generalizing? All the while thinking "Oh, we can't be hateful, because our cause if just"...
I think there's a bit of context missing here. I don't think most people would argue that straight sex and relationships are inherently misogynistic/anti-feminist on their own, outside of a patriarchal social structure. However, within a patriarchal society, and underneath the traditional gender roles that such a system propagates, heterosexual relationships end up functioning on the concept of male power and agency, and on the requirement of female submission and subjugation to male authority. And, while women have made a lot of progress over the decades, vestiges of this power-imbalance between men and women still exist, both consciously and unconsciously, in the workplace, in the home, in marriage/relationships, in politics, in academia, in childhood, in healthcare, and so on and so forth. I mean, just look at something as subtle as the unequal division of domestic labor and how working women/mothers work "double shifts" everyday due to the fact that they come home from their jobs and spend another 'work shift' at home taking care of kids, cleaning the house, cooking, and taking care of other domestic tasks, even though they have partner/husbands that could easily help more, but don't. Something so subtle and unconscious costs women a lot in economic opportunities and wages. Married men and fathers don't have this issue. In fact, the domestic labor expended by their wives allows men more time to compete for better economic opportunities and pay. So, obviously there's nothing wrong with being heterosexual or having heterosexual relationships/sex, but it would disingenuous to say that patriarchal social structures don't fundamentally corrupt heterosexual relationships and create artificial power imbalances b/w men and women that provides more disadvantages for women more than men.
@@biggtk Great points! The patriarchy does totally corrupt heterosexual relationships. I grew up with lesbian parents and am queer myself, so sometimes I have a hard time remembering how prevailing of an issue sexism is in relationships. I haven't read much of Sheila Jeffries, but to me, she seemed to be saying that straight relationships are, if not inherently misogynistic, unavoidablly so, (in a way that most people would never argue) and I wanted to make the point that having a heterosexual relationship with an individual needs to be separated from the larger forces of misogyny present across the board.
On the topic of men not helping around the home, I think part of it has to do with them feeling like doing minimal work is a revolutionary act due to the previous generations teaching that women are the ones who do the housework
As a man living alone not doing anywhere near as much housework as would be necessary let me tell you there is no deliberation behind it (only speaking for myself of course but I think this applies to many other men as well). Many men just aren't being raised to do housework that often. Now I don't know how women are raised but (maybe that's partly due to my ADHD) pretty much every time when I tried to do any housework alongside a woman (and I tried really hard) she was always so much faster at it that I would at least guess that this must have come from experience to some degree. Of course that's a societal issue in itself; Not that women are brought up so prepared to do housework but that men are so unprepared for it (tbh, I'd rather not spend several days getting my place in order each time). However, it might explain why men tend to overestimate their housekeeping efforts. If you're used to mom doing everything to provide for you growing up including stuff you should be doing by yourself at that age changing your bed sheets every four months or so can feel like a major act of self care. Of course that doesn't excuse being unwilling to improve on these things and there are definitely some men out there who just don't bother because it's too comfortable or because they're assholes who think they're somehow entitled to having everything done for them. So... you're pretty much right in that it's due to the norm of women doing housework to some degree. Just wanted to add some more perspective.
@@eggileierkopf9421 You're absolutely right. Heck, I can relate even though I grew up in a female role. My mother never taught me to cook/do housework or allowed me to help with it at all because of her OCD. I was really unprepared and had no idea what to do when I shared a house with a roommate. I would try to help with cooking and housework but it would take me forever and I couldn't get very much done. Doing small things felt like a big accomplishment to me yet my roommate was frustrated with me, saying that I barely helped out. Fortunately I knew how to do traditionally male chores really well (I learned stuff like barbecuing, car maintenance, basic carpentry from my dad) so I didn't feel completely useless, lol. I think it's definitely important for parents to teach kids of any gender how to do ALL important chores It's harmful and unnecessary to separate knowledge by gender. Makes things much harder to learn down the road, otherwise!
@@globalist1990 I think someday soon we'll see the day when women refuse to date men who don't know how to take care of themselves. (I'm already there.) Cooking and cleaning are not feminine. They are Adulting 101.
@@lynnes1864 i fully support your decision. But lots of people don’t want to do adult, doesn’t mean they are misogynists necessarily. Sometimes it’s not that simple. It might be that one is not really a slob, it’s just the other being super OCD with cleanliness. So people just need to partner with the right people for them I guess…
so damn true. I dislike the idea that women and us queers have to regect everything that's heterosexual in any way. we should get to a time where every relationship is beautiful, including the "straight" ones, without demonizing queer ones
What's even worse is that some of the "ew hetro" etc is also from ppl in the LGBTQ+ community. Im bi and non-binary. When I was dating my boyfriend my friends would go "ew straight" SO MUCH. Like it wasn't even funny anymore (i don't think it was funny in the first place). And it made me feel weird like I can't do anything like hold hands with him bc it was "ew straight". I just felt so weird and angry every time someone would say "ew straight".
@@haunted2882 Lmfao people do that?! They sound like they want to feel *🌸sPeciAl🌸* and *🌸qUirKy🌸*. Instead of "Not Like Other Girls" they sound like "Not Like The Majority" - look at me I'm part of the LBGT+. I'm a heterosexual female and I feel bad for genuine members of the LGBT+ community. So many bandwagoners - I was called a basic bxtch by a 12 year old for telling her I'm hetero - She was part of the LGBT+ to not feel 'basic'.
@@alemoncitrus8285 Well, yesnt? Just generally being such isnt, but actively partaking in the social media and activities of such very much is. Along the lines of coined terms, communities and social behaviour specifically for those groups. Probably more than just one organization actually, divided like any other topic that's a red string through life. Sort of a social structure community led organization kinda thing?
I also feel that heteromiserabilism can be seen as a sort of reaction to the romanticization of the fixing of broken men. A lot of cultural productions, from The beauty and the beast to Twilight, depict toxic relationships as desirable, and I have the impression that this message is really pushed forward everywhere ( being a man, I didn't personally experience it but it is what I heard from friends). In that way, I think that heterofatalism as a sort of subversion of this dominant narrative can have some kind of positive impact (aka, toxic masculinty isn't cool and shouldn't be your burden). Anyway, loved the video, tell the cow that the sentence "Is loving your wife gay ?" is the funniest thing I ever heard and sorry for my crappy English.
As a girl i never liked the narrative that depicts love at first sight or men changing for the better (Aka stop being selfish and aggresive) for love. The first one because it was feeling attracted to a person (woman in most cases) primarily for the apearance, putting personality and inteligence in second place. And the second one implies that the male partner will instantly stop being abusive if you continue being kind to them. Wich i know is not true and i have my dad as an example. PD: sorry the text is so long.
Great Video!!! I feel like I learned so much from watching and analyzing your video, as a cis male, I always felt so troubled on how toxic my own peers would treat women and themselves in social circles. It can be really hard to be constantly judge and to be pushed towards a certain ideal of “what you are suppose to be”. I don’t know the answer to solving this toxic hyper hetero normativity, it’s not the end all be all. I can only hope all genders and sexualities can create a new perspective where we can work together and understand the fluidity that is life and love.
Regarding "positive masculinity": I can't find it now, but I just read a super interesting thread where someone said, half-jokingly, "Jack Black is cis but he has transmasc swag," and someone responded with a surprisingly insightful theory that this is because he's "short, fat and Jewish", and therefore performs masculinity in an 'unconventional' way. As in: 1. He exudes confidence and is comfortable in his own desirability, despite not conforming to stereotypical male body image standards, and 2. Jewish masculinity tends to focus on different things than mainstream North American masculinity. That is to say, the expectation of mainstream North American masculinity is typically muscular, physically dominant and aggressive, and "tough", while the expectations of masculinity in Jewish circles/families/communities/traditions tend to focus more on being smart, well-dressed, witty and funny, polite, able to hold your own in a lively debate, and able to support yourself financially. As a Jewish person myself, I was like "😲" because the Jewish masculinity thing made SO MUCH SENSE and mirrored (to varying degrees) almost all of the Jewish men I know; and I'd never even thought about it! -- Now, I am NOT saying that this form of masculinity is necessarily perfect or "superior" in any way, or that it's the "solution to misogyny" or the patriarchy or anything like that -- It is definitely not without its own issues and toxicity. But I do find it to be more open to empathy and vulnerability in many ways than mainstream North American masculinity. Honestly... I can't really remember what my point was gonna be, exactly... but the positive masculinity part just made me think about that and I think it's fascinating. I would be fascinated to learn more about other standards of masculinity specific to different cultures
Wow, I guess that the jewish side of my family was more influential than I thought. You pretty much described my dad, although he's tall and skinny, and pretty much described what is seen as a desirable man in my family.
That wifi and bluetooth analogy was beautifully dismantled by somebody pointing out that bluetooth will only establish a connection when both devices independently agree to establish a connection between each other, while wifi constantly displays it's availability, and unless it has a password will allow itself to connect to anyone nearby. The moral is don't use arbitrary technology to make comparisons between human beings
@@carolinemcgovern4488 I feel like it compresses the audio when you're sending audio to a bluetooth speaker. I'd just rather use a cable when it comes to audio personally. Even though I always step on the cable and tear it out of the port bending my cable and my ports. Oh well such is life!
18:26 "even incels, overflowing with heteropessimism, stress the involuntary nature of their condition" I just finished reading Undoing Yourself with Energized Meditation by Christopher S Hyatt and it's astounding how applicable his theses of human behavior are to this. That condition of hating something and feeling trapped but also feeling that you absolutely must be doing the thing. Classic.
I was hetero pessimistic but I think that was because I spent a lot of time on the internet during lockdown, I got to interact with a lot of incels. It made me so pessimistic and made me wonder if most men are narcissists.
My religious mom made me think all men were rapists and bad people (*cough cough* projecting her frustrations with my dad), but then would act shocked when I was scared to be around men. 🙄🙄🙄
As someone that has had several bad experiences with men, I get you. I always think "I'm gonna take a break from men" but then some guy appears and I let my guard down. I guess I can't stop being attracted to them.
Omfg the Bi but married to a man part hurts because it’s like I’m not going to start identifying as straight and pretend experiences and feelings didn’t happen, but if I’m questioned and explain this, I’m the annoying one bringing up something that happened long ago.
I don't think it's necessarily gauche or annoying--you can still find people outside your monogamous relationship attractive, even without having any desire to act on those feelings, and queerness is often as much a culture as it is an internal experience. I think it's worthwhile to be honest about the safety that a loving, supportive, straight-passing (or m/f or whatever terminology you prefer) relationship offers but that doesn't mean it's necessary to hide, dismiss or downplay your bisexuality! Being bi is great
@@mikealaniz7236 i don’t think that’s the best analogy. being married doesn’t mean you stop being attracted to people other than your spouse. if it did then infidelity likely would not exist. no one bats an eyelid when heterosexual women who are already married express their attractions to men other than their spouses e.g. celebrities and that’s because we recognise that attraction doesn’t just disappear when you settle down with one person. it is unfair to expect bisexual people (especially women) to pretend that their attraction to the same sex no longer exists when they are in relationships with the opposite sex. op should be allowed to express her appreciation of female beauty without external backlash because regardless which gender she is married to she is STILL bisexual.
I think sexuality is fluid for a lot more people than we think, that being said it doesnt erase the fact that there are many people out there, gay, lesbian and het that will never stray outside of their desired sex, which is totally okay. Everyone is different!
Honestlyyyyy she needs to make a whole video about this! Heterosexual culture doesn’t just affect gay people, but also asexual people who are not heterosexual and are always told that “they’ll find the right person one day”. Very infuriating and a topic that is not touched upon enough!
@@retrodiisiac it’s also a deeply scary thing when you really fucking love someone who’s cis. I’m a guy who is with a girl, but idk what the fuck will we do when it comes to anything sex 🙃 It’s kinda weird when she asks if I like her outfit or that one time she was like “Daaamn I have a nice ass don’t I?” Like yeah, you do. You have a great butt, but wth am I supposed to feel from this? 🥲 I love her and she loves me, and she knows that she won’t get what the usual male approval is from me. I can say she has a hot bod, she’s really worked for it, and I really admire her for it, but it’s just not a thing that creates any form of sexual attraction. I’m scared that admiration and love won’t be enough 😐
i would say in allosexual culture in general, i feel like we are in serious need of academic approaches of asexual experiences, i'm not saying this is the only thing that matters and would ‘validate’ us (validation for me is kinda empty, a non-substantial representation) but would certainly help more people comprehend asexuality.
@@heatweve True!! People need to know that not all people feel sexual attraction. Also I wholeheartedly agree with you on the “valid” thing. It kind rubs me the wrong way when people say “you’re valid!!” because it seems like they’re just saying that. It doesn’t show the meaning behind it. Of course it’s in good intention, but it feels empty and lackluster.
@@AsteroSloth Maybe, if you feel comfortable, you can come out to her? That’s what I did with my bf and he’s very supportive! Try to tell her your own ace experience and educate her. If she loves you, she’ll accept you because sex isn’t required in love.
As I get older, labels seem more annoying and hollow. I honestly give up on trying to define my type of attraction to people and file it into society like the outdated card catalog system in an old library. My attractions change and vary
SAME - (if i may vent a little) I tried to find a label that “fit” me waaaay too early, and as I got older I was still trying in vain. Then I realised that I wasn’t actually trying to find a specific label that fit “for me” - I was trying to find a label that was digestible for other people (mainly straight people). Now I just skip all the kerfuffle and go by “queer”; tells ya everything you “need” to know lol
Funnily enough, labels and categorization is something that humans naturally excel at, but is directly contradicted by the inherent chaos and disorder of reality. Existence cannot be organized in any meaningful way, everything overlaps with everything else, and we cannot create any truly meaningful definitions. So this pain and hollowness we feel over labeling is part of a larger existential issue with how we perceive reality.
Hey all. Just for transparency I want to add that I've cut the comment where I say 'it's fair to argue bisexual women have "straight passing privilege"'. Here's why: a) The language of "passing" derives from critical race theory and I don't want to co-opt CRT terminology and distract from race issues. That's enough to convince me to stop saying it but there is another reason. b) In short: I don't still stand by the statement. As for the long version: When I said "it's fair to argue" I was expressing my mixed feelings about the phrase "straight passing". I've seen some people use it to dismiss people's queerness, but I've also seen it used in good faith to discuss how "appearing" queer to straight people can be dangerous. I am aware that as a bi/pan woman if I walk down the street with a man I am less likely to be "clocked" as queer and therefore attacked. In those types of situations I am safer and I can't deny there can be benefits to people thinking I'm straight. But not all bi people are in "straight" relationships. Even if they are they still might "appear queer" in other ways. There are benefits to being *perceived* as straight. But bi people aren't at the top of the "social pyramid" and they *aren't* straight, therefore being perceived as straight is erasure. So I'm not sure if "privilege" is the right word. Thank you to the people who explained the issues with this phrase. Thank you for not assuming the worst and allowing me to learn and grow. If you decide to continue this discussion in the comments, please respect each other. 💖💜💙
I don't really understand what the problem with using "passing" is since it's very applicable across different marginalized identities; white passing, straight passing and cis passing all refer to people of a marginalized group who can pass undetected in the "socially acceptable" group. Passing is always about erasure because the only privilege a passing person gets is dependent on their "true identity" remaining hidden. Passing is used because the meaning fits different identities. Meanwhile when the term "Karen" got co-opted it lost its original meaning from "privileged white woman who will leverage her whiteness as a weapon against black people" to just "entitled annoying lady". A Karen went from being a more serious threat to being the laughingstock of the internet, and it's easier to see hoe something like that is problematic. I just feel like "passing" is similar to "privileged" in that it can be used by different groups but convey similar meaning. White privilege isn't the same as straight privilege but the concept is the same. Am I making any sense?
Thank you so much Tara. I'm a bisexual with a very little attraction to opposite gender and living in a very conservative country. Till today I haven't been in a relationship with someone I like because doing so can get me beaten, even killed. Add some useless and harmful, frustrating gender stereotypes, it's safe to say that the consequences of "appearing queer" can be nightmarish here for a bisexual
Saying sexuality is fluid is highly problematic, it forces everyone to be like the people who claim that. They happen to be bisexual or panszxual and project their identity onto everyone else.
In summary: the straights are absolutely not OK, and heterofatalism is a somewhat sad coping mechanism for everyone involved. (also, I loved the edited commentary with the cow pictures.)
Excellent summarization, and to comment I disagree with the analysis as it delves into a very pessimistic viewpoint of heterosexuality based on old fashioned, rude, constantly evolving definitions and typical gender stereotypes and comes from a biased perspective.
🦇🦇🦇! Thank you so much for this video. I know I'm late to the party but this type of content makes me feel comfort from what the internet portrays often as a neverending battle of identities
This was really interesting! A great video! I'm a straight man and me and my fiance (who is a Bi Woman) we're recently talking about how depressing and disturbing it is that many straight relationships and marriages talk and "joke" about how much they hate and feel tied down by their relationship or marriage, and how ridiculous that is, and even more so how ridiculous it is to say that non straight people can't get married, even though they seem to hate their own straight marriage so much. It's wild!
Bi NB here. I was in a creative writing class and wrote a "soul mates" short story about a girl who always assumed her match would be a man, because that was the narrative heavily pushed on her. Then she actually meets her soulmate, who is a woman. Que the "Wow, I've never even asked myself of I was straight or not, I just assumed" reflection. I wrote the story about my own grapples with comp het. My teacher said I was "undermining gay rights" by suggesting "they weren't born this way." 🙄 🦇🦇🦇
God this is true for me, I always assumed I was straight and after years of ruining potential friendship with men I finally realized I’m just not into men that way lol
As a Pansexual man it took me a while to actually start dating women, I felt this pressure to follow masculine roles if I wanted to date a woman. Bisexual and pansexual men are seen as lesser partners by heterosexual cis women , I can only talk from my own experiences but the moment I don’t appear masc or mention how I’ve dated men and non binary folk they stop talking to me.
damn, i'm so sorry about that. i hope things look up for you, and that if you do end up with a woman, she doesn't look down upon you for your sexual orientation. :)
Yeah it kinda sucks being pansexual, people always look down on me and tease me for being pansexual, even people in the community, (which is a shame) people started to doubt i was pansexual because of my age and I have "never dated", and the our community most of them usually say pan and bi and any other "don't exist" only lesbians and gays :/
🦇 looking forward to your video about positive masculinity. There’s a lot of great information out there. I’ve often described myself as a man (who looks like your typical dude) who got a feminine OS. I’m straight (ish) but I relate to women, most of my friends are women, and women feel at ease around me. My friend (who is a woman and gay, and has always disliked and not trusted men) was shocked by what she calls the “nurturing masculine” she found and really came to love in me. I’m so lucky to have her friendship and everything that comes along with being privy to the world of “somebody as gay as [her]” (her words not mine) lol. Anyways, sorry about the rambling comment. Love your videos. Keep up the good work!
Love island is my favourite sneak peak into the world of the straights, it’s like watching a heteroseggsual train wreck but it’s a bunch of conventionally attractive people trying to 👀 all summer long.
Really random but I've seen that we're subscribed to a lot of the same channels and I've been seeing your comments a lot lately ( I swear I'm not a stalker) but anyway hi I just subscribed to your channel. Can't wait to see you grow and brag that I was there when you had 1.44k subs.
People who support straight pride parades are either trolling or delusional god fearing old people. I feel a more accurate analogy for the general population goes as follows: heterosexuals enjoy their own cake and don’t care what people under the rainbow banner eat, but the rainbow people keep making loud remarks about how their cake is better, “normal” cake is boring and dumb, and heterosexual people secretly want their cake too, all while poking and prodding people that just want to enjoy their cake. Most straight people don’t give a single fuck, just eat your damn cake and let me eat mine in peace.
@@Rieneger it would be nice if everyone could eat their damn cake in peace, but the fact that homosexuality was seen as wrong to begin with created a stigma that's still boiling down.
Wow, I never thought of heteropessimism as the spiritual descendent of political lesbianism. You really nailed it with "heteropessimism silences womens' expressions of desire." Even in the tiny clip you cited, it's pretty obvious that Jeffreys is repulsed and disgusted by sex, and if she's typical of the movement... Also, in framing men as the enemy, both place the entire onus for progress onto women, which is...I don't know if it's misogynist exactly, but it sure reminds me of how women in heterosexual couples are expected to do most of the housework.
Agree with the last, unfortunately all of that propaganda are infecting the minds of girls and young woman and some mid age too, I don't want to be a species of Atlas god carrying with the height of lots changes, and this why probably the mental sanity of women will have drop in the next years
Honestly, I don't think it should matter if sexuality is a choice or not. What should matter is autonomy, and the right to people's lives not being unjustly interfered with. What matters is not expecting everyone else to live by a subset of the populations personal outlook on life. Who people have romantic or sexual relationships hurts no one and is no one's business. If your god says that it's wrong... well that doesn't apply to me because that's not my god.
Indeed. Most people are hard wired, some change through their life, and for some it seems its a choice. I was cishet until my 40s when I changed. Regarding hereteropessimisim, and all relationships and sex problem, the answer is always the same: tulpas, dolls, bots and tech. None of this will matter when we all have ssxbots.
@@someonesomeone25 don't use your tulpas for sex and relationships, it's not ethical. the tulpa community hates when people make tulpas for love/sex and nothing else.
@@monbub I disagree with it being unethical, esp since they weren't deliberate creations on my part, they came to me organically long before I even knew what the word tulpa was. I could just have easily used the words succubus and incubus from another religious tradition. We are deeply in love with each other and that's not going to change. Edit: I'm not sure where the ethical problem arises?
So I'm a straight man so take my opinion with a grain of salt. I also hope I can articulate this as good as it sounds in my head, but it seems that heterofatalism comes from the fact that, even as society becomes slowly more gender equal in a sense, or that feminist analysis becomes more accepted and mainstreamed, it's pretty evident that men haven't kept up with the efforts needed to properly depose of the gender roles that patriarchy have historically created. And, this failure of deposition is both on a societal and individual level, with the latter being evident with the fact mentioned in the video about housework done in a relationship. Obviously with that, like you mentioned in the video, men need to do some serious work also to ensure those roles can be ended, both individually and societally. This will require the deconstruction of our history, especially our Hunter and Gatherer era history. For instance, the patriarchy assumes these roles are innate, but the fact of the matter is, in hunter gatherer times humans were a lot more egalitarian, and that was across gender lines too. So yeah I hope this makes sense, and I hope I didn't ramble too much
There is evidence that our view of what Hunter Gathering society was like is incorrect. It was not strictly gendered for those roles like we have firmly believed and there was more equal participation in all of society.
Yeah, it seems like men only tolerate the existence of feminism. But they generally don’t view it positively nor would they incorporate it into their lives. They know they can more easily enforce their interests with patriarchy/misogyny. So, they’re not gonna give that up. A lot of women with hetero-fatalism are getting frustrated with one side trying to relive their glory days of exploitation while the other wants to go in a completely different direction. It’s like men and women are not compatible lately. It’s weird.
Gender roles developed as an evolutionary strategy due to sexual dimorphism. Society can influence what superficial forms it takes and to what severity it is socially or legally enforced, but the underlying urges and differences are biological in nature. It's not some patriarchal conspiracy.
As to hunter gatherer society, there are remote tribes that disprove your theory. They usually have pretty strict division of labor along gender lines as well as religious significance atributed to the difference between man and woman. It's also not a good argument to use them as examples if you want to argue what should be, as hunter gatherer societies are not as adaptable and persist only at the mercy of more efficient and inovative systems of social organization, which is why so few persist. The way people idealize hunter gather society as though it's utopian or something is childish.
@@LoneWulf278 It's almost like men and women really do have innate differences on average that can not be socially costructed away. Men are not bad for having more of a hypercompetitive nature, nore are women bad for having a more nurturing nature. The division is caused by the gender wars in which we vilify the out group along sex and gender lines, and then wonder why we no longer cooperate and compliment eachother's natures anymore. I suspect the person who started this thread is a less competative man with a more nurturing and emotional side, just as I am a woman who is high in trait disagreeableness and introversion which are more common in men. I used to make the mistake of thinking I disproved the norm just by existing, but the reality is that we outliers have our value, but so do the people who fit the norm more. Hell, they have a great value to humanity as a species in general because left to their own devices, they contribute far more in terms of reproduction, continuing the species. With modern first world nations mostly achieving sub-replacement birth rates, it's no time to demonize or deconstruct them and their norms, or our societies will collapse and be taken over by far more aggressively patriarchal cultures that reproduce at high rates.
🦇 UGH, YOUR PINK OUTFIT- IT'S EVERYTHING!!! 💗 Also, I hope the Cow's Tinderdate was satisfactory. She deserves all the good things. Edit: THAT OUTFIT AFTER THE PINK ONE THO?! You have impeccable style, for real!!!👏🏽 Edit 2: the part 3 outfit is LOVELY and I just need to know where you keep getting these amazing outfits from!! Edit 3: added the bat emoji 😌 also Nim is, indeed, an angel. 19/10 would die for him.
Very late to the party, but I found this extremely fascinating! Also I love that you were watching Buffy! 💞 It's been my favourite show (along with Angel, the spin off) my whole life 😄
25:14 this is a HUGE issue in Poland where new generation of men want to be progressive and help at home but they have no idea how. Their families never taught them anything because "your wife will do everything for you" and now their girlfriends/ wives have to teach them not only how to do things but guide them through a process of developing habits for cleaning, cooking ect. x_x
I appreciate seeing this comment. I'm polish living in the US and i was born and raised here. I've always wondered what the culture between men and women and dating is in Poland and what are the gender expectations. Of course my parents made me and my brother do chores but they definetly split the chores by gender. Like i do the traditional women's tasks like vaccuuming and laundry and my brother now's the lawn and takes out the trash. My brother could not do what I do and i probably couldn't now the lawn lol. They always said that these would be the expectations for us when we get married
@@gabyk4439 Yea, meanwhile in modern world everyone needs to be able to take care of themselves and others if need be. Luckily, while my family was dead set on teaching me "all the things good housewife must learn to do", they also believed that on top of that, I must be able to do other chores too. In practice they never taught me other chores but at least they had the right opinions and they always appreciated women who can do house repairs, deal with electronics, do hard physical work etc. So AT LEAST I adopted that mindset.
i don’t think LGBT subcultures will die out. the way i see it, the history of the community and the shared suffering that we’ve endured is what binds us. and as the binary is deconstructed, that history will continue to bind everyone on the spectrum, they will just be a lot more people participating in it
I feel like LGBT subcultures came into being because they had to struggle against the norm just to exist in a way that feels natural and right. So without straightness to struggle against, they'd likely still be there. Just maybe without all the trauma or clearly defined labels.
Or it will, and people will become fine with it if it results in less discrimination. The culture will just change, and if we are serious about teaching History, we won't forget the struggles of the past.
Here a bi girl and an historian: yes, homophobia history and gay people tortures will be remember as well any other discrimination that humans created. But to remember that those horrible things happend, doesn't necessarily bind us all together and less with the LGBT community. Also, you're talking like if the members of that community would bel the entire gay population of the planet (surprise: it's not). Let me explain it: I'm a girl, I know how we women are discriminated too; I'm a gifted person, I know how we gifteds are discriminated to be the black sheeps of our societies; I'm an art historian and I know how we art historians are not take seriously... and not because of that I feel naturally bind to other women, gifteds or art historians. I feel near to people because I'm aware that they, as the animals we are, have feelings, dignity and can suffer; because I can feel natural empathy for them, no matter how related with me they are. I feel empathy for others homo/bi people because I know they're suffering homophobia and see their pain hurts me, but not because we both share a simple biological trait (sexual orientation). I can't feel I'm bonded with someone just because be both like boobs, we both have vagina, or dark hair, or an illness... that's just a trait we share, like the 5 fingers in the hands and none of us feel bind to other person just because the number of fingers or the eye color, right? I'm social and empathetic, but not gregarious like a sheep: I have not the instinct of gather with others just because they're barely alike me in one simple trait. (I'm not bragging, just explaining how my personality works. The way my mind and heart are don't make me better or worst that anyone else). LGBT community is not the entire population of homos/bis: LGTBs are a bunch of people who thinks that being gay is their entire identity (they talk about being gay the 24 hours per day), use their own vocabulary (like in the video) and have an ideology (queer), dress weird and dye their hair, go to the carnnival Pride and support Pink Capitalism, want to tell you which is your identity (I'm a tomboy, LGBTs told me to be "transphobic" because "you don't want to admit you're trans or agender") and hate heteros. They're a pretty well specific political and subculture of gay people, with whom the most of us gays don't feel identify. So in conclusion, remember our history: yes, of course. To become part of a political-subcultural club of people just because you share a biological trait with them: no, no need of that. Ps: Yes, my english isn't perfect. ¿Que le vamos a hacer? 🤣
I think another big problem is that straight culture has normalised dating people just purely based on physical attraction. People jump straight into committed relationships without making sure that they're compatible, and then those couples wonder why they often fight or have disagreements when it comes to living arrangements, beliefs, boundaries, sex drive, children, and other future plans. And there's a huge misconception that marriage fixes broken relationships; news flash: it doesn't. Reasons why divorce rates are so high. But yeah, I speak from experience when it comes to the whole moving-too-fast thing. Not long after I found out I was bi but hadn't come out yet, in high school I dated a guy who had a crush on me and I thought I was crushing on him too. (I should probably mention that I was kind of peer-pressured into it as well.) But after several months, the red flags started popping up. We had our first kiss one night and I was unprepared, but I went with it anyway because that's normal, right? And afterwards, I didn't feel good at all. It felt emotionally nauseating, if that makes any sense? And every kiss we had after that didn't get better, I never felt any spark or giddiness, and I found myself wishing to be around him less and less for that reason. Don't get me wrong, he was a sweet guy, and he eventually voiced his unhappiness with my contribution in the relationship (he was always the one to call me, he was always the one to organise outings, etc). The only thing he did that was kind of shitty was he dumped me at the end of our last date (he'd gotten me gifts and everything so I didn't see the break up coming at all). But yeah, that destroyed me. For, like, a day. After that, I was over it so surprisingly quickly, and for a while I wondered why, because I knew that I was the reason the relationship failed. I wanted to know what was wrong with me, and then one day, it finally hit me: it was simply because I didn't romantically love him. I forced myself to believe that I did because that's just the norm: boy meets girl, you know? And I got over the relationship quickly because I finally felt the weight and pressure on me lifted. I just wasn't ready for a relationship, and certainly not one with him. Maybe we could've worked if I knew then what I know now, but oh well. Everything is a learning experience. Moral of the story, just get to know the person you're attracted to before you start dating, because I didn't even know my ex's full name when we did. Y i k e s.
I do not agree with this. Straight women precisely complain about the lack of comittement of some men. Meanwhile, in the lesbian world, u-hauling is a thing.
@@JackDespero Straight women complain about the lack of commitment, BECAUSE a big straight-culture thing, is as she said above, *dating someone based on purely physical attraction and not checking compatability.* The man ain't committed, he's a shitty dude, but she chose to date him because she thought he was hot and didn't check whether their personalities would line up or if he was even a good person, at all. And if you're implying that lesbians *never* cheat on their partners, then hoooo buddy you couldn't be more wrong.
This video is interesting to me, as I grew up without a lot of this straight culture even though most people in my family are straight. Even my grandparents had a very loving and caring relationship on both sides. Yes, they made some misogynistic jokes, but it isn't reflected in their relationship, at least not from what i can see from the outside, which is why the internet was such a whiplash to me in a sense. Your video was very interesting and it made me kind of sad. Being straight can be miserable in a culture that jokes about abuse situations and enforces toxic gender roles.
You may notice the part where I talk about “Straight CPULTURE". Let's pretend that never happened.
My eyes are glued shut
@@theinternetisqueer GLUED
It was such a grevious mistake, I turned the video off and cried myself to sleep
👩🏻🦯👩🏻🦯👩🏻🦯
how dpare you do that to us :(((
I absolutely hate it when people joke about hating their partners, like, if you don't love them, why are you with them?
It’s jsut annoying I would rather lie about it then joke about being “miserable”
I was that kind of person, I'm afraid to say. I was miserable in that relationship and vented constantly to try and keep my sanity.
I knew and agreed with what you say, why be in a relationship where you only complain about them?
The day before I ended that relationship, a friend just said "Why are you even with him, you don't have a single positive thing to say about him." , and it kind of gave me the resolve to end it for good.
There were a few reasons I stayed, although in the end of it those reasons were only based on my insecurities and how little I thought of myself.
Add that to growing up and seeing and hearing about how men never help around the house, how they can be mean drunks but still be worth staying with, and how society generally expects people to want relationships over being happily single, and a insecure person like me felt kind of trapped.
But not anymore!
Sorry for the rant.
Because they're not serious. Stop creeping.
It's more a total sense of comfort that you can make those jokes and still wake up the next day rather than actually hating your significant other
They’re too pathetic and proud to be single
Wifi is polyamorous.
Khadija !!! Fancy seeing you here!
hii
Lmao
When TH-camrs I love, watch each other.
Good for her😌
It legit blew my mind that “straight” originated as gay slang.
Someone tell the organizers of those straight pride parades…….
Right? Next time someone wants to shove their straight 'pride' in my face, the first thing I'll say to them is 'oh, you're an ex-gay?'
it actually makes sense, why would the “normal” people need a word to differentiate themselves if heterosexuality is the only valid way of being
Straight is a slur /s
I always thought the word "straight" was offensive, and therefore came from heterosexuals. To me it sounds homophobic, it seems to mean that heteros are "straight" as in healthy, normal, honest... implying that gays are "not straight" as in devious, twisted, kinky... I'm surprised the word was coined by gays, maybe a result of internalized homophobia?
@@lililangtry1881 Maybe, but doesn't _straight_ (with the original meaning) also just provide a visual reference for what it is like to operate in a largely cisgendered, heterosexual world? It kind of reminds me of _stealth_ or _passing,_ words used in the trans community that seem similar. It just seems to convey honesty about the reality of trying to get through life safely, undetected, rather than being self-hating (imo)
Im really glad more women are getting exposure on breadtube. We never would have gotten a video like this or on amatonormativity without creating a space where women feel comfortable to speak about THEIR views and present unique and intelligent arguments. Tara’s videos on sexuality and relationships, even as a straight man, have helped me feel validated in my thoughts on relationships and sexuality. I really appreciate her, and I’m glad we’re getting more feminine voices round here :)
Yep - people - _all_ people - should be able to speak their mind. Especially when it's about matters important for 50-51% of the population
You don't sound very straight bro
@@emanueldelacruz1101 what about what he said makes you think ‘’queer’’?
Some of the heteropessimism I see online just feels like repackaged “I hate the opposite sex”/“men and women are just too different to get along” shit boomers say. I think people need to differentiate between hating hetero culture and just hating being straight or hating the opposite sex.
@@theunknown5386 do you really believe the opposite sexes are too different to be in healthy relationships?...
also, genuinely, if you're unhappy with being straight as it attains to dating women- you could just not date women. you don't have to be alone of course, you could find a male friend who feels similar and just be roommates with them. (as opposed to settling down with a woman i mean)
There is a great overlap between people, who dislike queer people and people, who dislike the opposite sex. The reason is quite simple: the predisposition possible to envoke both of those is simply disliking people, who are differnt from oneself.
@@theunknown5386 u make it so obvious that youve never met a gay person who hates the sex theyre attracted to
@@theunknown5386 if that's genuinely how you feel that's honestly very sad
(And let's just ignore the belittling of gay trauma for a second) do you honestly feel like gender or sex plays that much of a role in who you are as a person? Maybe you just know a lot of shitty people or do you live in a place where gender roles are such a big deal? idk but personally I have equally as many male as female friends and their gender was never any consideration in me liking them as people, or a problem for that matter. Or can you be friends with women and is it just the romantic aspect that's a problem? I'm not trying to sound sarcastic or rude btw I'm honestly just curious why it is you're feeling that way because it's quite a sad outlook on life
@@theunknown5386 Yeah no, you would never want risking your life for holfing the hand of your s/o in the street or having your rights constantly being contested by a portion of the population.
Trust me
"Prior to 1868, there were no heterosexuals" is probably the greatest out-of-context quote I've ever found
You were either a pole fancy or a muff tickler or both.
@@MEAT_CANNON "Do you prefer oysters or snails" as was coded in Spartacus movie during the Hays code era
same goes for the term homosexuals - there were no real terms/definitions for this; that did not mean they did not exist, we did not exist prior to that origin of word.
Ah yes, the date when dr. Hetero invented being straight when he tried to marry his boyfriend and accidentally married a woman
@@gpu213 hahaha, the date dr. Hetero was done killing the dr. women as witches accidentally on the stakes.
(Or just because there was no word for it! Not that it didn't exist but there was not a word or term for it, as it was since then.)
“Fellas is it gay to love your wife?” Lol I love this
It is if you are a woman
timestamp plsjsjdjdje
OH WAIT IS IT NOT A QUOTE- IM DUMB SORRY🙁👍
36:26 nvm found it😭
Idk. Is your wife gay? Lol
I never realized until this video that the overly attached girlfriend meme had so much depth in satire and pointing out double standards.
OAG was social commentary that really whooshed by many keyboard warriors' and online memers' heads at lightspeed.
"I'm not changing society, just complaining about it." - Tara Mooknee. While I can deeply relate to this quote, I feel like you should give yourself more credit. The work you do here is changing.
The act of educating people creates change. Knowledge is power. They definitely should give themself more credit!
I definitely learned something new here,🦇 on a completely different note, wait did we finally see the cow in this video?
@@siennalewis1088 @Sienna Lewis I believe her pronouns are actually "she/her", listed on her TH-cam account 😊
fun fact trans people generally dont care what you use to refer to them you wont teach people basic decency by pointing out """"wrong""" usage most enbies dont even ask people they arent close with / speak to on a (near)daily basis to use different pronouns than whatever comes to mind please stop correcting pronouns its obnoxious as shit
No, she got it right. It's ironic because this type of criticism and video is quite typical. Deconstruction alone does nothing but destroy.
In Ancient Rome, Bisexuality was so normal that it was considered weird to only like sex with one kind of partner. One Roman emperor was mentioned in the chronicles as “only lying with women, never having known the touch of a man.” You don’t mention something like that if it’s viewed as “normal”.
Now the Ancient Romans were also top tier misogynists, which was kind of part of this, but it just goes to show that heterosexuality wasn’t always the norm.
This is why I scream when people tell me Romans were very very "gay". No, they were very bi. I'm tired of bi erasure. It gets exhausting.
That's the problem I have with LGBT spaces as a bi person. Myself and others who are bi included, were practically chased out of communities of LGBT because we're "not gay enough" or "we're gay but still too scared to be "fully" gay" or "we only say that to please hetero mens fantasies" it's exhausting.
Some examples of Bi iconics who have been scrubbed of their bi identity and just labeled gay:
Achilles, had lovers of men _and_ women but is considered only gay.
Sappho (coined the OG lesbian) the poetess who wrote of her love for men _and_ women is now labelled gay and only gay.
Freddy Mercury, self identified as bisexual multiple times, spoke of his love from women _and_ men, labelled as gay only.
Stop👏Bi👏Erasure👏
If the straights aren't perceiving us as a gate way drug to gaydom (yes that is a thing someone told me once, I stg) then the actual gays consider us not "gay enough" (whatever that means lol).
@@fawnieee I had NO idea Freddy was bisexual. Wow, never heard a single person ever mention that. It really is like erasing a part of who they were.
Yes wasn't it: if you were a free Roman man, you could f whomever as long as you didn't bottom or do oral
Well in *theory* in ancient Rome something was only labelled as "sex" when it involved a penetrating and dominant male (so two women having sex wasn't actually considered "sex") It was also fine if that said male was penetrating a child of lower class, which was also scarily common :(
I understood sexuality of the Romans to be something of power, because- especially if a man from upper class was involved- there were rules of who was allowed to penetrate who, the upper class male had to be the dominant one...
HOWEVER I'm convinced that in actuality there also was a lot of caring and consenting sex between men, and/or women, also of different classes and people actually were bi or gay. I just wanted to say that the terms and also the view on sexuality were not the same as today and that has to be considered :)
yup.
Tara looks like a glammed up hillbilly in the beginning, then she switches it up to a glammed up auntie. A diverse style queen who gives us what we deserve.🦇
Edit: I made it!!!!! Thanks for the likes guys. Comment what part of the world you're watching this video from.
Are you kidding, We don't deserve her
@@luciadreaming9 yea
low key the style icon we have been needing
Can someone explain if hillbilly is offensive or not? I keep hearing it is, but my soul is telling me no.
@@bichen-up-ur Its not offensive. It typically refers to Caucasians in the South.
As a bi woman married to a man, ive even had some of my closest friends ask me if i can confirm “it was just a phase.” No - it wasnt just a phase but I found my person and he happened to be a man. I got lucky since hes also bi and that.. has its perks.
They never seem to end do they?
@@insertname3977 apparently not unfortunately
Same as a bi guy. Everyone keeps on "forgetting". It mainly makes me feel rage on behalf of an ex-boyfriend who was always very sweet and loving. I've had my former therapist even forget, even though I talk about male attraction etc, ... you know, married to woman, has kid, case closed. Still saving up for the golden retriever, though.
So do you folks do when I date a bi guy and play date/marry/bang? 😂
I feel extremely sorry for you. I would argue biphobia is actually worse than homophobia today. Because homosexuality has been normalised (thankfully) so much that people think "ah ok I get men can like man and women can like women" and it's not actually that easy. Don't misunderstand me I know the struggles of bisexuals. However some people do not ask "ah so it was just a phase wasn't it?" maliciously, also because it is plenty of people who really had a phase and then changed their minds (and there's nothing wrong with actually having a phase and then changing your mind of course), so I hope your friends were doing it non maliciously too. However I support you
Honestly I'm a bi girl and I've been in two long term relationships. One with a terrible girl that I basically had to take care for like a baby, and one with a fantastic guy that cooks and washes the dishes. We gotta start treating people from a given gender as individuals and not uniform masses of sexist stereotypes. And that'd also include stop passively accepting when men present those stereotypical behaviors "because they're men".
Yeah, the thought that “oh men🙄 they can’t take care of themselves” just takes away from the fact that men don’t take care of themselves because of misogyny rather than the fact they’re just “being men”. A man can take care of himself, a misogynistic man can’t because he expects the women to do it for him.
This! My bf was raised well, he cooks and cleans and everything! We don't live together, but I know that if we would, he would help me out a lot with chores 🥰
That's why I love bi girls, I don't know about you but all the straight girls I've dated have always been like big babies ... they never want to do anything for themselves ... and they only brought drama into my life, and when I complained to them for something they always came out with the excuse of what was my role as the man to take care of them and protect them as if they were pets ..... that has not happened to me with the few bi girls I have been with ... even We are still friends after the relationship ended ... the others did not speak to me again after they broke up.
@@piffba WELL👏FUCKING👏SAID
@@seniormute2364 haha 😂. People here don’t like your comment so I donated 1 like to you.
“Men should not expect women to take care of them” - 100+ likes 👍
“Women should not expect men to take care of them” - only 4 likes 👎
If you think people here - including this content creator - stands for true equality, then you are dreaming. Wake-up!
I think this also feeds into compulsive heterosexuality because of the idea that if you're miserable in a heterosexual relationship that's normal. Also, in some cases, it normalizes abuse so you just accept it as the 'norm'
Yes! Saying that all men act similarly awful makes victims of domestic abuse think that they’re not going to find someone better so they listen to the emotional manipulation of their partner and stay.
@@hazeld8016 I want to agree but realistically… men raised in a similar culture will likely behave in many similar ways. No man goes untouched by it. It’s not trying to say “stay with bad because they’re all bad,” it’s more about “yes, they ARE all bad in some ways (edit: at least more complacent about certain issues, which does count as being bad because it still harms women) because of social structures, and that is a problem, and we need to fix it”
@@haley3020 that just sounds like you don't agree, and are making excuses...
@Annie Mouse sure, you can use the "stats" but those are just common trends and averages, same argument is used for calling certain ethnic or racial groups "all bad", I mean look at the crime stats?..
Actually hetero sexual relationships are the least abusive and longest lasting. Lesbians have the highest IPV rate against women, suffer from lesbian bed death and have the highest rate of the more than any other coupling.
Stop with the unwanted sexual grooming. How many times do you need to be told this to get it through your head?
That throwaway joke at the end -- "fellas, is it gay to love your wife?" -- touches on something I've dealt with as a bi woman. Especially when I first came out, there were a surprising amount of men in my life that started inviting me to participate in their misogyny with them, via jokes about women, objectifying women, talking about the women in their lives in dehumanizing ways. It revealed to me how many men view their misogyny not as a manifestation of gender -- i.e. they view women this way because they are men -- but as a manifestation of their sexuality; i.e. they view women this way because they are attracted to women. Therefore, when they found out I was also attracted to women, they assumed that I would view women the same way.
And that thinking ends in this odd paradox of straight men truly not loving women in any true sense. Toxic masculinity demands that men create an emotional divide between themselves and their partners, and creates such a chasm between them and their partners that they can no longer emotionally connect -- and then, because they can no longer emotionally connect, and because they view women as a fundamentally lesser and inscrutable species, they endlessly meme about how much they hate their wives. A lot of this video focused on straight women's heterofatalism, I think an interesting sequel to this would be focusing on the heterofatalism in straight men that you touched on in this video.
@@Kabullo76 It must have also caused you to be incapable of writing
@@jdbruce bitch please, dont give a fuck , its google translate, im italian
@@Kabullo76 It’s ironic that you have almost perfect grammar now that I’ve pissed you off 🤣
@@jdbruce you are the latest evolution of feminism after the nazifemininist the nazigrammarfeminist, the feminist who watches over the web so that the grammar is saved ,you have come a long way with gender theories😂
ed ora levati dalle palle
@@Kabullo76 NAZIGRAMMARFEMINIST! Ah I love it. This is great. I am so happy we had this interaction. I don’t even consider myself a feminist, but thank you , I will gladly take on this title. Arrivederci!
Ngl my asexuality definitely fuels the heterofatalism I feel. Men throughout my life have not treated me great and pile on that I am asexual which poses a whole other difficulty, I decided to just give up in love. It makes me feel hopeless and alone because of how shitty and sexist things are (specially with the whole manosphere thing being so famous), after Andrew Tate my fear was further strengthened because you don’t know who is the sexist pig until too late. Thank you for putting words to the hopelessness I feel 😊
omg i found another asexual. i feel hopeless and alone all the time for the exact same reasons. the world is so sucky. since we're really early into human history, i just hope that all this shit we have to deal with will one day be a relic of the past. like the salem witch trials or something idk. although my distrust of men is 100% sky-high. the only things that make me feel better are videos of feminist men and women validating me haha.
u got love from korea ❤
I think it is safest and happiest if asexual people just date other asexual people. Personally I could never be happy in a relationship without sex and most people feel this way... I imagine that's why many of these relationships don't work out.
I'm also asexual, but a man; I had basically the same experience with heterofatalism. The women in my life were worse than the men, and social media allowed me to be exposed to harmful ideas and vapid women that only further entrenched my idea that women were dangerous. It's been about 2 years since I last engaged with such harmful ideology, but I don't think I'll ever be able to undo all of what its done
good. u aint going to benefit from relationship without giving out the most important thing. seeing ur comment makes me think this andrew dude is even more based that i thought.
Asexuality is definitely a big hurtle for a romantic relationship with a sexual partner, my partner has a very diminished libido, but despite the fact that sexual attention is needed for me to feel loved, we make it work
"Communism is when Harry Styles wears a dress"
-Karl Marx 1869
"One communism please"
-me
I'm in
@Dynamitewolf t4 My apologies Comrade 😔
@@animatedintrovert6256
No, *our* apologies
The irony of the fact that the term "straight" came from the "gays" is just overwhelming... How did I not know this before?! 😂
They’ve named and labeled everything 😂 . . So organized.
I can't believe I didn't know it either!!
@@JDMimeTHEFIRST they are obsessed with labels...
whats so ironic about the thing that gays invented the phrase "straight" it its only logical that the outsiders will lable the "normal"...for example if ur in a group of mean girls, u yourselves wont start calling urselves mean girls
@@jupiter5719 exactly...
As a straight woman, this makes me so sad that some straight women just hate being straight women. I'm not a fan of "straight culture" or anything like that, just I think that everyone should love themselves and be happy with who they are.
Agreed, I think women are just tired of male oppression. To the point where they hate even being attracted to men cause they see them as many of their other oppressors. Still that isn’t good though.
Yep. And it becomes much worse when they start implying that they are not straight, even though they are, because they want to feel a certain way about themselves.
I'm that straight woman. I'd rather die than ever be with a man ever again. But I'm not attracted to women whatsoever. So at 22, I've accepted my fate of dying alone. Better than being with an abuser.
@@bluegreen9799 I think the best thing is for both genders to open up a little. Being gay I’m on the sidelines here but the overwhelming message I see from both sides is that they feel oppressed & not listened to. I spent my whole life as a feminist until the last year or two, I watched a documentary made by a feminist documentarian called The Red Pill. It made me question things & I saw how rigid my mindset had been. “The Patriarchy” is created by gender roles. Both those gender roles come with their own advantages and their own prisons. I think pushing equalism over feminism is one of the keys to creating harmony & ending things like heteropessimism. Right now- no one feels listened to & in order for that to change we need to dissolve the barriers creating two sides
@@vegahimsa I agree with you, but it’s a two person game, and often when one side is ready to listen and the other isn’t that causes the side who was willing to listen to go back to not listening. That’s what I feel like often happens with women. We are willing to come out of our shell and listen but don’t get much reciprocated. But that’s just personal experience. Also it’s even harder to be heard when you’re a black women cause you’re just seen as angry or ignorant, or you’re compared to what’s going on in the media. Like as a black woman when I try to talk about overt sexualization of women, meg the stallion or nicki Minaj is always mentioned as if they’re actions are my fault because they’re also black.
Bell Hooks has a great book titled "The Will To Change: Men, Masculinity, and Love."
Its honestly a book that helped me, a straight man, really understand the misguided sense of self worth I attached to what I was told makes you a man. This Hetero-fatalism is tied dorectly to how our system has cultivated this power dynamic for centuries.
The power to change it has always been placed upon women either through breaking point or literally survival. We men need to realize we have work to do and the ones who blame society for "favoring women" in certain instances is a false privelege. Much of those percieved benefits are built upon ideals of misogyny and opression. The idea that the court always sides with the mother is a common talking point. But this favoritism is based upon patriarchal stereotypes that men generally refuse to see or are incapable of seeing. So they instead blame the women when what they should be doing is joining the women to reform social expectation or to abolish expectations.
Us men can be worth loving but we have to make the effort to show we are worth loving. We live in a time where being mediocre is no longer a guarantee of the American Dream and it shouldnt be. As individuals we need to understand how we can be our best selves.
Thank you so much..
as a woman who is a Men’s Rights Advocate..seeing So many men claim society is ‘gynocentric’ When court gives the custody to mothers is , so ridiculous like they forgot how the situation was just 40-50 years ago..When women were forced to live with their abusive husbands because they didn't have financial stability to support their children..heck, in Indian, women who's husbands passed away were burnt alive in the tradition of Sati.. Because they were viewed as burdens..
Do you even read what you type? "Us men can be worth loving but we have to show we are worth loving"? What kind of sick mindset is that?
This was pushed onto me as a kid and teenager and it fucked me up for a good decade. Do not spread this bullshit. No one has to prove anything.
@@Iamhere829 and the Victorian BRITISH stopped that.
Also, the main problem is that we ignore the main problem:
Economics.
“Us men can be worth loving but we have to show that we are worth loving” is just a statement so full of self-apology at concept of identifying as a man that I worry you did not learn the right sorts of things about what it means to be a man from this book. Because no born-into identity should fucking be or feel like that
What do you think abolishing expectations will accomplish that would be so positive that it outweighs the negatives?
I get the point that sexualities are a construct, but I think it's unfair to say that if we erased it then everyone would be fluid and bi. I'm gay, and I've never liked a man in my life and I never will. I think that saying that sexuality changes/can be changed will lead to the rhetoric that lesbians and gay people can be 'turned' straight or that straight men can be with me when they just can't. But also it is important to remember that your labels can change or that your attraction can intensify at certain periods of time. I've identified as bi in the past, but even then I was a lesbian, if that makes sense. Even though I knew I could and wanted to be attracted to men, I just wasn't.
Overall, whilst your label can change, I do feel like that for a group of people, they'll just never be attracted to the same/opposite gender, regardless of how society views sexuality. People's labels can change, but sometimes your sexuality is fixed. Not for everyone, this is just personal experience. Idk food for thought
I totally get what you mean. When I first read it I thought "christ the conversion therapy people would LOVE this."
I know some people who are very monosexual (and it's about gender, so not in a trans-exclusionary way) and who am I to tell them they're not?
I would still say that I think many more people fall onto a "spectrum" than they initially thought in the past. That's why I think the people identifying as bi or "not straight" are increasing - but that's not to say ALL people are. Though as you say - if I'm interpreting what you're saying correctly: I agree that people's *labels* change more than their orientation. But like I said - I'm really NOT an expert 😂
@@TaraMooknee Yeah that was what I was trying to say. This whole comment was purely how I feel, and I don't mean it to be applied to other people, especially not bi people (who are super valid!). This is an amazing video (and response). Sexuality is defo a spectrum, like a rainbow (get it, because-). Some people are red, some are purple but loads and loads of people fall somewhere in the middle, so we shouldn't think about it so binarily. Have a lovely day
Labels are important, i can't help but feel like wanting to get rid of them is idealistic idea that would bring more harm them good because at the end majority would take over to create status quo.
It kinda sounds like erasure with extra steps, LGBTQIA fought for too long to be recognized to just go "eh let's just abandon sexualities overall" because heteronormativity will survive but everyone else will struggle.
@@papkinn totally true! Often, labels lead to action (look at the invention of the word 'bisexual' and the positive impact that had on bi rights) and unite a group of marginalized people
I'm genderfluid and abrosexual I'm a shape shifter
somehow i read the title as “hetero fanfiction” and just kind of accepted it? like yeah that’s understandable
Me too!
Imagine being straight ...
Same hahaha
Oh my god, in the God fandom on Wattpad Evam shippers are insufferable 🙄
@@plainbagel4411 say what now
The “daddy poked my head until I came out” baby shirt legit made me spit out my drink. Imagine buying that for your child that’s just obscene 😭
Performant heterosexuality is embarrassing...
@@lucasAA927 Boy... I want you to put homosexuality instead of heterosexuality. And then think if that comment is still ok.
If this is a joke is flying over my head
@@supergamergrill7734 Buddy I am not talking about being straight, i am talking about the performance of heterosexuality. Did you see the video?
@@lucasAA927 Sorry I was so Out of it yesterday. God don't Stay awake past 6 am
Out of the closet
Wow, I can't believe I am three years late to this party! As an anecdote, because I feel like it is at least tangentially related to the video, when my wife and I were fairly newly married (having already been in a relationship for five years, mind), one of my friends asked me, "Who is your best friend? And don't say your wife." It struck me as such a profoundly odd condition to tack on to that question, and watching your essay brought it back to me. Thinking back on it, though, it really goes to show how pervasive that line of thinking is, that heterosexual relationships must exist in a state of opposition and conflict between partners. That answering that my wife was my best friend was somehow such a wrong choice that it had to be declared in the question.
I am nearly 60 and a 'straight' woman. I have been married, had children, had relationships. I am not planning to be in another relationship - my experience with men - particularly men my age - is that it just isn't worth it. I want to make my own choices, be free, happy and have good self-esteem. That seems to mean being single. A lot of women my age seem to have made the same choice.
I'm 35 (bisexual, single and childfree), and I believe I have already made this choice as well. I am attracted to men, I can't help that. But I am not interested in pursuing a relationship with them beyond (perhaps) friendship. I think my mom is about in the same mindset at you. She's was married to my dad. Has three children and seems content on now being single.
A lot of people seem to forget that you....dont HAVE to be in a relationship. You dont have to live the rest of your life with someone else, and theres nothing wrong with that!
I have a dad who's the same way.
If by "A lot of women my age" you mean "an extreme minority of women my age" then I agree with you. Being a volunteer at a community center in Florida means I've seen tons of senior citizens with most of them female, and haven't seen a single one who has ever said anything remotely like being happy and having good self esteem means staying away from men. When a guy says that men who want to be happy should avoid women, people come out of the woodwork to call him an incel and make fun of him for not being able to handle a woman. I won't be meanspirited like that, but I will say with sincerity that if you truly believe that you need to be single to have self esteem then you should seek a psychologist because that is a sign of past relationship trauma leaving you with issues you should work through. Having intimate relationships with other human beings is how homo sapiens has evolved over hundreds of thousands of years. Thinking you must be alone in order to be free and have good self esteem is not healthy.
@@patrickbarnes9874 Maybe not. But that is what life has taught me. I also know women other women my age. And there is only one who has chosen to remain in a relationship with a man. If you know a man who can truly let me be me and love me for it - well you are luckier than I have been. I am at peace with my decision. Not as happy as maybe I could be in a perfect world. But at peace. I haven't had an easy life but I have fought hard for what I have and the self knowledge I have - and yes that has included therapy. At the moment I choose to put my energy into my children - who are still getting over the trauma of their violent father. I'm happy for people who have known good men. Sadly I am not one of them.
"You may not have expected to see a small women with a mullet screaming about the heterosexuals."
Ma'am that is exactly why I clicked on this video.
Errr
@@calebagbortabot8281 Wow thank you for your input Caleb
Me flipping too
@@calebagbortabot8281 yes Caleb you cool!!
I think something that awakened the knowledge of positive masculinity was, ironically, lesbians. I looked at the masculinity of butch lesbians and thought "if being manly is bad, then why do I feel safe + happy around these people?" It really opened my eyes to positive masculinity in men and that, no, men aren't predisposed to violence and hatred. Men are perfectly capable of performing masculinity through the lens of kindness and respect. And they can learn to.
Unfortunately, confirmation bias is one hell of a drug.
I think the root of your problem stemmed from your belief that masculinity is in itself a performance.
As a man, you learn that regardless of your intentions, others, especially women who are not kin, may feel at any moment as though your mere presence is threatening to some degree.
Integrating this notion in a healthy way is an essential part of manhood.
It is not an easy thing to do, especially if you are inclined to pursue amorous relationships with women, because being bold or playful whilst contemporaneously being able to help them feel safe is not an easy dance to pull off. Some manage this better than others though you can never guarantee how your approach will be received at the end of it all.
Disarming the negative assumptions of others whilst making them feel at ease, with particular regard to women and children, is an obligation for a man. Such as if potential harm were to befall them, it would be a man's duty to try to protect them or to bring them to safety.
@@MisyeDiVre Double binds are a sure-fire way to make people crazy.
@@CyberChrist I think the suffering stems from society refusing to acknowledge just how much is placed on the shoulders of men.
My speculation is that we refuse to acknowledge this because, in so doing, we would have to accept the notion of a certain negative bias that most individuals, and especially women may instinctually feel towards the men who are strangers to them.
We are struggling to integrate this concept into the emerging culture, thus we have opted to deconstruct "masculinity" altogether by adopting a paradigm wherein manhood becomes analogous to a substance which may prove toxic at varying degrees of exposure (♂️☢️‼️).
It seems to me like we are asking men to bear most of the liability in regards to social, economic and cultural activities or interactions whilst, conversely, offering neither incentive nor encouragement. This contradicts the "blank-slate" version of equality that has become fashionable for our contemporaries to champion. Therein, I believe, lies the true source of the problem.
"They can learn to." Honestly, around what kind of Neanderthals do some of you live. Most men know kindness and respect. Some women do to.
33:10 NGL, that "They are worth loving" hit me like a truck and I almost cried.
Need to think a lot about my own pessimism regarding human interaction and how, as a man, I feel like I will never live up to a standard that can justify me being worthy as a partner.
The systems in place and the stigmas that exist are not your fault. All you can do is an individual is be a good role model for those around you and to try and cultivate a happy community of people. If you put love out into the world, it will come back to you.
That's the thing. They say we are worth loving then choose the bear over us. That's the problem with ideologies such as those in the video. Everything is my fault because I happened to be born male despite having never been in a position to control anything I am told I'm guilty of.
Until women start taking accountability for their actions they're not fit to talk about problems nor solutions. I'm not going to be an ally to people who hate me and who will never be my ally.
@@ElyonDominusthis is a really oversimplified view.and I can't believe ur still on the bear thing. the bear thing was designed to make people that don't understand the nuance really mad. the scenario is absurd so the answers are absurd. I don't think mens actions are biologically determined but taking no responsibility and calling measured critique of social structures 'hate' and taking it so personally is telling because it means you see yourself as inexricably part of those structures. refusing to collaborate because of a silly internet joke about a bear is ridiculous
@@yayforfood100 When someone tells you what they think of you believe them. I believe them. Is that not what we're supposed to do?
@@ElyonDominusYou missed the part where it's a RANDOM man. While some men are great, some men are terrible, and we aren't willing to take that risk. If I had to pick between a bear and my husband....well, I've gone to the woods with my hubby before. Bears usually leave humans alone in the woods. I've had woman friends tell me about their male FRIENDS graping them. If a friend will do it, how can a woman trust a random stranger?
“I’m not changing society, just complaining about it.” Don’t sell yourself short. These are some dang complex ideas. They need to be discussed, but we don’t quite have the language or understanding to discuss them. You’re just making society-changing more accessible. Thank you for your service
I'm bisexual and with a straight man. My taste in men from a personality/gauge standpoint is more feminine even if they match the gendered expectations for looking and dressing like a man.
I don't see myself ever dating a conventionally heterosexual man, because as stated in the video, the pressure to fulfill gendered expectations could be an issue. I don't feel that in my relationship with a man.
Saaaame! I have a really caring, kind, emotional boyfriend who is really into me being more masculine. Love him so much. But then there are our families and friends who still manage to ruin it by expecting or indirectly suggesting (mostly to me) to follow gender roles
I feel that. I’m a bi married to a wonderful, caring himbo of a man. Neither of us feel pressure to perform gender and it's so freeing. He’s so great that he makes me forget how insufferable some Straight Men™️ are
@@josipamatic7296
Same here
I sometimes get the feeling that our relatives are quite annoyed by how unproblematic our relationships is, trying to make us feel that such thing isn't normal (and by no means I'm trying to say that our relationship is perfect or that we're better than everyone else or anything like that just to be clear)
Then they describe what a "normal" relationship is and it's straight (no pun intended) up toxic like....
SAAAME I only ever had a crush on a guys that had no pressure to appear manly ir cared if they did or not. Their presentation may have been skewed as “feminine” from a societal standpoint because hetero men tend to overcompensate their masculinity even if toxic. Its a hard thing ti describe as gender non conforming does not mean fem all the time but also I perceive it that way? idk Its because there are no gendered expectations in a relationship with said guy
Then you are a homosexual. Men aren't supposed to be feminine
"I'm not changing society, just complaining about it" - I need that on a tshirt 🦇
yes please
I would buy it!
i get not the cow references but what a wild and enlightening ride!
wish you every lettuce leaf. tyvm! 🦇
i've been waiting for this one! also, shout-out to u and the cow for all your hard work. i'm super proud of u two
hey fellow sinners
AHH THANK YOU PAL ❤️
🤩
Thank you, my dear! It is deeply appreciated
@@editingcow4630 omg cow I'm such a huge fan!!!
This hits so much as a bisexual woman, I hate the erasure that surrounds my bisexuality, especially now that I'm dating a cisgender man, and expecilly because it's easier to date a man, because society still refuses to believe my sexuality, and what people don't even understand is I'm with my boyfriend because I fell in love with the person, regardless os his gender or sexual orientation
Same, I Feel this very greatly.
As another bi woman dating a cis man atm, I 100% agree with you on this. :(
Yes!
I know my wife struggles with this and often has to correct people who assume she's straight.
I feel you, it's annoying when people treat my sexuality as a cry for attention or some way of making myself feel special. It took me 6 years and one girlfriend to finally accept myself and shed my internalised misogyny, allowing me to actually acknowledge my attraction to women and feel confident enough to express it. The last thing any bi person needs after having the bravery to come out is being shut out of the community that's meant to support them. Not to mention I'm on the asexuality spectrum, causing me to not really feel strong feelings for anyone, so I had to deal with a general lack of understanding and hostility from whoever I told because apparently stacking labels also means cry for attention. For so long I wanted to just be "normal" (het and allosexual) but after years of trying and failing and making myself unhappy, I've realised it's pointless and I just need to be myself.
“Homosexuals and heterosexuals are considered different because they can be divided into two groups on the basis of the belief that they can be divided into two groups.”
This blew my mind. Because ain’t that any binary group of people.
I need to sit down.
yup. i was high and thought about this in the shower, it blew my mind
That was a moment for me too.
I have written this text down so I can use it at stupid people making stupid categories. 🦇
Whenever you take a thing and separate it, you will find some members to fit into all groups regardless if you pick two groups or two hundred. That's why you get many sideways glances for all of this. If we say there are 12,800 genders, then we can find ways to differentiate and people to put in them, but it doesn't make that categorization scheme meaningful or useful. It's a data partitioning issue, and finding what groupings make sense is a big part of the design. It's funny, but this comment speaks to a very central issue around how data is structured, why, and how your structure can lead to blind alleys (we used to call it statistical funny money, looks good on paper, but it's worthless). It's a very real and very technical problem.
@@TheTerryscotttaylor that is why everything is a spectrum !
Sexuality is definitely a spectrum, the thing is, some people are at the very end of that spectrum, and feel either exclusively heterosexual or exclusively homosexual. It can be fluid for those who don't identify exclusively as either. I'm bi, and I definitely don't believe being bi means you're 50/50 gay and straight. It can honestly very day to day for me.
As a bi woman who is in a relationship with a man, this was so touching. I can love men and not apologize
People care way too much about what society thinks, love the person not the gender.
No shit Sherlock
@@Sindrijo and stop letting society diarrea in your skull
@ok ok both are very valid! all depends on preference
@ok ok you can leave now
As a bi woman myself, it really grosses me out seeing posts making fun of abusive situations as being inherent to heterosexuality and people laughing at it (REALLY?!), with the added bonus that such “humor” completely ignores that abuse isn’t exclusive to straight relationships (nor are cishet men the only ones who can be abusive) and that plenty of people in the LGBT community have been abused by their partner(s). While abuse patterns are largely the same regardless of identity, a lot of them are blindsided by it because the idea that LGBT relationships are "purer" is really pushed on us by our own community. Not to mention some people outright use the “I can’t be abusive because we’re both women/men and therefore equal” as a way to manipulate, or outright believe it themselves so they don't have to take any responsibility for their behavior.
The rates of intimate partner abuse are not really equal between couples, it goes like WW >> MW >> MM. That doesn't necessarily mean women are more abusive in relationships, it very well might be that men have a narrower definition of what constitutes abuse and/or they are less likely to admit being victimized because of social pressure, we'd probably need to know how the data is collected first before jumping to conclusions.
Thank you for calling this out, I've seen the sentiment previlant in some ocassions where it's used to scapegoat responsibility for bad behavior in relationships, which are not exclusive to sexual identity.
I think the reason why bi couples are even more violent than lesbian ones is the fact you need more than a partner to be bi, ergo more jealousy is inherent.
I think you're missing up the term bisexual (attraction towards both the same and opposite sex) and poly couples (a relationship between more than 2 people). But yes bisexuals do face a high rate of dv
@@squishydishy1593 The thing is I'm of the opinion that the ~sexual suffix denotes sexual relations, not attraction (that would be ~philia) ;)
Also, twice the competition to worry about = twice the jealousy :P
Ugh i can’t get over how much i like this… I’d never heard of heterofatalism before and now i feel so educated but also legit more optimistic abt het relationships. I skimmed seresin’s essay and I was worried that it was gonna start saying smth along the lines of like ugh straight women need to stop complaining abt men, and then instead it turned around and said actually, straight women dissociating from their own heterosexuality is essentially just another form of woman-shaming bc it shames women for liking men and does absolutely nothing to arouse change in men.
19:10 the voice in my head definitely followed up with "and strap-on"
it really frustrates me that whenever people talk about positive masculinity, they always forget that masculinity isn't equivalent to maleness. like butches exist, we aren't the same as men, and being masculine does not always reinforce the gender binary or heterosexuality
Came to say something similar. A lot of cultures view masculinity and femininity as energies, not even necessarily opposing. And all people embody both to varying degrees regardless of any biological factors. That seems to match my experience more.
Under that model a lot of the toxic traits come from trying to excise parts of yourself to be perceived as a more perfect avatar. And the psychological damage that comes with it.
Agreed. I've seen both men and women exhibit masculinity in general and toxic masculinity.
@@nezumired I’ve always seen feminine and masculine as energies that don’t have anything to do with gender or sex. Unfortunately, it gets me into a lot of trouble (especially with feminists) when I say things like “being the provider of your family or being strong and independent is masculine.” Plus, as a black woman, I see femininity and masculinity differently than mainstream.
@@Trollestiatumblur I think they either must think you're calling them "men" or want those behaviors to be gender neutral. And tbh, they kind of are. It's what responsible humans do, no matter the gender identity or amount of masculinity or femininity. It's just hard to peel back how many behaviors are actually purely masc or fem with that pesky society getting in the way.
@@Callimo
Western culture has sex, gender and masculinity/femininity so hopelessly entangled it's hard to talk about any of them. People just assume you're talking about anatomy no matter how specifically it's stated. I don't know if we need new language or a shift in understanding the words we use.
I noticed in some ppl a tendency to shame women for doing "women things" like baking or being feminine in general, meanwhile men sometimes even get praised for that. Could you make a video with this topic?
Wait really thats a thing
@@tmoe-2581 think make up, a lot of people will consider it a women thing but shame women for too much or too little, so yeah it exists. Though I’m not sure about other concepts that are “women things”
@@ads605 oh ok that makes sense thanks for the explaintion
@@ads605 and oh ok thats fine
What are you on about.... all I hear is people complaining about how women just act like men now....
Million dollar idea: throw a gender reveal party where the gimmick is "is the baby a poodle (pink) or a husky (blue)". Do the whole cake thing, get everyone really into it. Only to reveal that you are not revealing the gender of a baby. In fact, you aren't even pregnant. This was just to announce that you're getting another dog. (And it's a poodle, because, well, they're adorable).
Bonus points if someone comes out holding said puppy as well.
And, just to confuse people even more, a male poodle.
@@jvgreendarmok It's perfect. Give it a gender neutral name as well, like Aaron.
Get two dogs. The poodle and the husky. The reveal is that you're keeping the dogs.
It's only valid of forests get destroyed 😅
Yes, it has been decided. Tara you're getting a poodle and having a party.
Style , snark , hilarious writing -- did I mention style!! AND the PATAGONIAN MARA ?!? YOU ARE LEGEND!!! BRAVO !!
"straight used to mean ex gay"
you've just made all of my comebacks 85% more efficient with just one sentence
Oh, I'm so abusing this. I can see it already.
Theist: Pride is a sin.
Me: The meaning of words change, you know, but tell me, are you gay, bisexual, asexual, or straight perhaps?
Theist: Straight as an arrow.
Me: So you used to be gay. So what happened? Your god died in a car accident and you got so angry that you lost all faith in your relationship and turned hetero? You angry militant ex-gays are so illogical.
omfg that makes so much more sense 💀 an "ex" gay person would call themselves straight because they have been "straightened up" aka fixed.
That doesn't make sense, try again with a new coping method.
@@SuukunaKaisen 🤡
@@SuukunaKaisen🤡
i spent a really long time denying my attraction to men and identifying as a lesbian because men hurt me in the past and i associated attraction to men with weakness. i think my view of "heterosexual" relationships was based in heterofatalism. i had to realise that (as you put it) men are worth loving and let go of the shame surrounding attraction to men which has made me so much happier. thank you tara for this incredible video which you clearly put so much effort into, and for articulating something i couldn't put into words before :)
I'm so happy you've come into yourself - love whoever makes you happy and makes your life better 😍❤️
Yes, I've had a very similar experience over the years, but never articulated it to myself. You described it very well.
I'm going to say what I always say: Not every man is a misogynist dog and not every woman is like what dickheads like Andrew Tate say they are
Are they really? I think there's a difference between not being "ashamed" of an attraction vs actually dating men. Why bother taking the risks of a disproportionate chance of domestic violence and unsatisfactory relationships when you can be statistically happier single?
@@yeayeayeah933 kinda weird to use statistics to tell people what they should feel when they are trying to tell you how they feel.
im crying at “fellas is it gay to love your wife” that’s literally the energy they give like why would you marry someone you fucking hate 😭doesnt make any god damn sense🦇
Same 😂 But at the same time, I can name at least 5 men (either from family and friends) that would probably ask this question. They're mostly boomers or older, though, so it appears to be a generational thing. Let's hope that this trend of making fun of and/or bemoaning your marriage will be a thing of the past soon!
Yeah, me and my husband often stand out at family gatherings as we actually like one another, and have shared interests as opposed to inventing ways to spend time appart .
You marry someone you hate because you need a maid. You don't want to cook, you don't want to clean. So you have to get a wife
@@trikitrikitriki Imagine being a grown ass man and whining about cleaning after yourself... it might surprise you, but It's not every woman's dream to clean after other people every single day 🤐🤫
@@trikitrikitriki good one man we’re dying over here. be sexist elsewhere
🦇 just found your channel today when the Hating Children isn't a personality video came up on my feed. And I'm so happy it did. Looking forward to binging your backlog content then get pissed I have to wait for more :P
I sometimes struggle with the statement that “sexuality is fluid” because it seems much more fluid for some than for others. As a lesbian, I can confidently say I’m not ever going to be into men. That’s something I know is not going to change (it can often be a touchy subject given how rampant lesbophobia can be in our community; that attitude that everyone *must* be a little bit into both binary genders, that being a lesbian is outdated or boring somehow; I see those a lot, unfortunately). The same (or rather, inverse) can be said of many gay men; a lot of them know they won’t ever be into women. At the same time, of course, some people may feel their sexuality is VERY fluid, which is totally valid.
The issue arises, I think, because a lot of people interpret “fluid” as specifically meaning one’s sexuality is likely to change or shift, when really sexuality is only ever *universally* “fluid” in that human sexuality is just too complex for labels or boxes to ever fully describe our experiences. The way nonbinary people can exist inside the lesbian label might be good example of that.
Also, shoutout to the bi women in the comments beating heterofatalism back with a stick. You’re doing great! 💜
🙏🏾 This. I thought I was the only one that struggled with that statement.
i feel the same way and im glad someone could put it into words
But then why insist on this label if human sexuality is too complex to be categorized so strictly?
I feel the same way as a straight woman. I'm just not into v*ginas and boobs. But I totally get that some/a lot of people are fluid, like you said.
Well maybe you're ignoring the role of consciousness has in it? Women by nature are bisexual but when men show such a distasteful disgraceful revolting image of everything they do and say, that fact and reality affects the subconscious. Opposite of that is with women. Women often are the better sex no matter how you look at it so a lot of straight women actually choose to be in same sex relationships or have at least been attracted to whatever degree to other women (excluding women who are brainwashed heavily who as a result have internalized misogyny). The stats on how much girls in free environments been with other women as opposed to how men have been with other men also differ greatly with the number for women being way higher. Just like in smaller same sex crowds. In female prisons for example, romantic lasting sexual relations among women form and stay even after they go free. In male prisons, usually the numbers are WAY lower and the ones that happen usually are fear/assault ones rather than romantic or lasting ones.
in my opinion "its not a choice" is kind of a foot in the door. it doesnt matter if its a choice, its ok to be gay because it hurts no one, the idea that it -not- being a choice makes it ok, relies on the assumption that it wouldnt be ok otherwise
I mean, it depends on how you interpret it. Sexuality not being a choice is a basic fact of life for many, many people (just look at countries where being gay is illegal: if we can choose our sexuality, why are there still gay ppl in these countries? How insulting to them would that mindset be ?). And saying it doesn't matter diminishes the experience of many gay people and how we discovered ourselves. However, I do agree that if society weren't that awful to LGBT people that question wouldn't matter.
To homophobes, it would justify treating gayness as an illness. To a lot of us, it's a protective measure and a helping hand to figure out who we are. Homophobia is the reason why this is such a big topic, but it doesn't mean "sexuality isn't a choice" is something to stop considering.
The problem is, “it’s not a choice” is important because if I could choose not to be gay you bet ur ass I would, it’s not fun, to imply that anyone would choose the harder way out is strange
I agree. I don't believe sexuality is a choice for most people. However, even if it were, it wouldn't be immoral or an illness. Even if it were a choice, it wouldn't be ok to persecute or mistreat others because of it. It hurts no one, it's nobody else's business. It's a matter of personal autonomy and freedom. I do of course understand why it's important to emphasize that it's not a choice due to reasons that others have stated. But it's not because it's not a choice that it is ok to be LGBTQ. It's just ok to be.
Understanding that sexuality isn’t a choice was what helped me overcome homophobia so I still think it’s fundamental and important but I totally see what you’re saying.
i think the idea behind it is more 'sexuality is fluid, and can be influenced by outside factors though the change can't be forced' not 'you choose who you're attracted to'
Just finished watching and felt like getting this off my chest. Alot of this heteropessimism seems to be centred around women, yet i feel like the hatred towards the opposite sex is equal. I'm not from an English speaking country, but here i hear men talking shit about their wives and gfs all the time. Comedians LOVE to make whole acts about how their wives are always bitchy, nagging, taking away all their money and all that. Once i was on a bus with my dog and she was getting up at every stop, thinking we were getting off. The bus was full and i was stressed. A man in his late 50s, early 60s (who clearly had a drink or two) said to me that he used to have a dog, now he has a wife and it's better. Then he got off. Kinda left me conflicted. Also, all my female friends have shit men.
Edit: Remembered another real life example. My neighbor wanted to go on a walk with her friend, but her husband yelled at her to clean dog hair off furniture. Yes, yelled. So her friend ended up sitting in front of the house and waiting. Idk, this hurts me and i'm not even married to that person.
Are you from Germany, because same and I hate the way marriage is depicted here
@@marykate845 this is literally the entire world lmao
@@marykate845 No, Eastern Europe. Oh, wow, i thought Germany was more progressive.
Either that’s fragile/toxic masculinity or just straight up abuse
I feel like parents teach their sons that it’s okay to verbally (or sometimes physically) abuse women because it’s makes them more “manlier.”
That’s just…disgusting 🤢
@@nunyo9441 Pretty much, am in Brazil and its not much different, maybe worse because murder rates are high, so it extends to men killing their wives.
I have really been enjoying your videos!
This one was fantastic too.
There was just one point i felt a slight wistful pinch at, around minute 21 - when your response to 'political lesbianism' thoughtfully included lesbian erasure, but there was no inclusion or acknowledgement of ace erasure from that discussion, even as there was care and thought put into not invalidating the identity of some political lesbians.
It was a momentary pinch; i thoroughly enjoyed the rest of the video❤
Can we just take a moment to appreciate Tara’s pink power suit
as soon as the wardrobe changed happened and I saw that pink power suit I was like "how do i channel that kind of power"
Yeah that part at the end where men pretend that being married is the worst thing in the world or how their girlfriend is the villain in their life. It's part of so many standup comedy bits.
Dude, if that's how you feel, divorce is legal.
Marriages are toxic by default. Ad not because of the men, they try their best.
Khadija Mbowe has a great video where she discusses what I think she calls "psychological patriarchy." It's a great way to examine and explain of a lot of this.
@@creativeideas5985 >Marriages are toxic by default. Ad not because of the men, they try their best.
Are you implying it's the women's fault? Plenty of marriages without women. So how about toxic marriages between men. Who's at fault then?
If you're in a toxic marriage or relationship, get out. But don't broad brush all people who are married ...
It happens both ways. As a man, I've heard countless humiliating and disparaging remarks about men, especially coming from women in a relationship. Most of those remarks are about male incompetence and shortcomings. In fact, incompetence, especially when it comes to household matters, has been at the core of many a sitcom. Oh no, those stooges can't change a diaper or make pancakes without setting the house on fire! I've read women's blogs that routinely claim that men can't do anything right. Women complain about their husbands in much the same manner, but ... their grievances are taken seriously, whereas when men present - in a joking manner - the problems they face in a relationship, they are ridiculed, accused of misogyny, etc. Btw, have you not noticed the phrasing of the comment of a bi woman sited in the video? She said that women are wonderful, while men are a bad choice. The attitude is way more common than you think: we, girls, can do no wrong and fart rainbows and roses, while men are the worst thing ever. Many women can't bring themselves to say they love their men - they have to pass it as a joke or portray their partner as their mistake or vice. God forbid you say anything nice about a man!
It's a joke. It's made for people to laugh, people laugh because universally, if you've been married for more than a few years there's been at least one time that your spouse has made you crazy. The jokes are popular because everyone can relate (male and female, depending on the joke).
That's what compromise is, not getting what you want the majority of the time. If you're getting what you want the majority of the time (I'd say any more than 25%) then you're not compromising. If having a partner or a family isn't worth that to you then that's all good. But that's what a relationship is. Not getting what you want most of the time, giving up your sovereignty to another (which they reciprocate, and suffer the same consequences).
I believe there's a difference between "men" as a group of people, and "men" as a social construct under patriarchy. The later being the standards to which the former are held by 🎶sOCieTY🎶, to the detriment of all. I don't hate men, I hate patriarchy. I wish that more men had the chance to cultivate the freedom of thought to realize patriarchy is a prison for them too.
YESSSSS 👏
I agree! Men can be feminists too; I think it's so important for men to be able to talk to other men about the patriarchy. Because like you said, it does also effect their lives as a trickle down effect. It's upsetting when 'feminism' is gendered or sometimes worded in a way that implies exclusivity for the man. We're all in this together~~
That was very well said
Patriarchy? The US is a consumerist society. And consumers are very female driven. You can argue that its a matriarchal society since you control the way the market goes. And on the part of societal expectations. That is not a patriarchal thing. That's human nature. That's how we get to have other people to like us. So yes, men are expected to act a certain way-not just because we want approval of being a man but that's how women choose to date men. Thats what women find attractive in men. The problem you have is that you conflate insecure men with masculinity and patriarchy. But guess what? Even us men make fun of those dudes because they overcompensate trying over do things and they come off us as insecure. And im not a feminist because its literally in the name. Its funny because its you that is in the fringes of society with your thought yet the rest of humanity and men are the ones that need to "cultivate" our thoughts? Even if it were true that these "expectations" are placed on me as shackles. I proudly wear them because its the guideline in which I follow to strive to be a better man every day. But also realizing there is a fine line in what being a man is and not over doing. For example. Being confident and not being arrogant. Being strong and not being abusive. Being a leader but learning how to listen to others. Being stoic but not being afraid to ask for help. Not showing emotion but knowing there is a time and place to cry and that its ok to cry. All lines I try not to cross something I use "patriarchy" as a guideline. Being a moral outstanding citizen was a cultural norm back in the day. Wether people actually lived by it is another story. But of course your feminist revisions will not let you see history through that lense. Instead of holding those individuals accountable. We abolish virtue. Patriarchy means working towards a goal to keep society moving. Yes, that means having roles but also understanding their is outliers to those roles. What we are living is far from patriarchy. Its all about the individual and doin what they feel like doing without the consequences. And its funny because its mainly women that push that message of doing what ever they want and what ever makes them feel good. But at the same time criticize men that party, drink, smoke, play video games as childish. That make them feel good does it not? They are doing what they want? So we are far from living a patriarchy.
I always thought this was the default understanding in this debate, but after hearing 'not all men' the thousands time I realized that people can not understand this concept. 🙄
I love hearing new opinions. Thank you for video
Women have to work outside of the household, but we are also expected to do most or all of the household work as well. And at the same time, we are seen by men as weaker and less intelligent. Make it make sense.
Cuz GOD WANTS!!!
wait... that still doesnt make sense... well I tried
@@ViniSocramSaint That was basically how communism was, so try again.
@@alexanderd6793 A wild con appears... Obviously trying to shift attention from his failed socioeconomic and theoethnocentric ideals and blame everything that is bad on socialism, having absolutely no idea how it could even possibly make sense himself, as expected.
The fact that western and ancient capitalist and socialist societies were influenced by the vermin that is evangelical christianism and other christian sects, making BOTH view women as inferior and in need to be controlled by men never crossed your mind. And never will...
@@ViniSocramSaint Um , my guy, I'm a Social Democrat and I'm agnostic. All I was trying to say is that religion isn't the main thing that does it, since it happens in secular nations. It also happens a lot in nations like Japan, that weren't influenced my Christianity that much.
@@alexanderd6793 Dang! It's hard to tell a person's intentions through an internet comment, specially when it's so simple and blends in with the predictable rest. Thought I had my 5th tally mark of con hunting for the week.
By the way, revisit your sources on the conservative influences in the east. There is a lot of intermingling(?). Japan has a class problem based on sex, age and labour, with an unhealthy degree of obssession on who is inferior and who is superior, to the point of half their language being based in announcing, assuming and performing under classes (having even 3 versions of kanji and katakana - I guess - to do it) and adapt interrelations to turn classes even more evident; also, India did come up with the idea that "the fair skinned are more desirable and should be given everything"; also mentioning the asian and oceaniac(?) practice of considering islanders and the brown skinned "dirty asians". But not all prejudices are purely native.
By the way, the fact you mention "secular nations" and label yourself "social democrat" bugs me. Maybe there is a considerable age gap or ideology-loyalty difference between us. Please don't tell me you are one of these "labelvores" that spend way too much time gawking at political wikis, ignorig close to anything other than scattered little details related to political labels... AND ONLY LABELS, just so you keep yourself politically confused and change denominations as frequently as I change underware...
Not assuming, just hope you aren't one of those. Sorry in advance for the animosity but do not feel like being patient today.
Honestly I'm beyond tired of "we don't choose this" as the 'why' we shouldn't be treated like second class citizens...even if I could 'choose' I'd still choose to be pansexual, even if we CHOSE to be attracted to x it doesn't become wrong because someone else wants to choose for me something else? We're all different, and some people are more strongly attracted to different types of people, but it's all fluid and no matter how much we 'choose' or 'cultivate' or 'don't choose and just are this way' we STILL GET TO BE OURSELVES. None of that 'lack of choice' is what imbues humans with the right to love the way they love. The right is there period, and we can 'choose' as much as we damn well please without it detracting in the slightest from that right.
This! I first became aware of this when I read something Terre Thaemlitz wrote about it and it has bothered me since.
I had a teenager ask me once "why should I support lgbtq+ rights?" and I was like: mate... you support them cuz they have human rights. Does gay make you not human somehow? What does it even matter what gender you are or who you love if you still are a person. I think it's an idea conservatists will have a hard time disagreeing with.
Yes! It's horrofying and incredible to wrap my mind around how most discrimination against miniroty groups just boils down to "you are different from us and that's why you don't deserve humanity."
yes. yes. yes. yes, a thousand times.
“Fellas, is it gay to love your wife?” Cackles while checking for my cookie from Tara and the cow. 🦇
This has aged like fine wine, Tara. Thank you for the addition to my vocabulary! ❤🎉❤
On Sheila Jeffries’ description of men as “oppressors” colonizing women’s bodies, may I present to you Catie Curtis’ song “Radical”, with the lyrics: “But I'm not being radical when I kiss you
I don't love you to make a point” describing her feelings towards her wife at the time. Lesbian sex and love isn’t inherently radically feminist, and therefore straight sex and relationships aren’t inherently misogynistic or anti-feminist
i wish i could save this comment
I wonder what makes these people think they are... Do they just search for more and more validation so they think "if we can make lesbians into feminism, we have even more influence!"...
Or do they scapegoat all the problems to another group of people while generalizing? All the while thinking "Oh, we can't be hateful, because our cause if just"...
How do I like this comment multiple times?
I think there's a bit of context missing here. I don't think most people would argue that straight sex and relationships are inherently misogynistic/anti-feminist on their own, outside of a patriarchal social structure. However, within a patriarchal society, and underneath the traditional gender roles that such a system propagates, heterosexual relationships end up functioning on the concept of male power and agency, and on the requirement of female submission and subjugation to male authority. And, while women have made a lot of progress over the decades, vestiges of this power-imbalance between men and women still exist, both consciously and unconsciously, in the workplace, in the home, in marriage/relationships, in politics, in academia, in childhood, in healthcare, and so on and so forth.
I mean, just look at something as subtle as the unequal division of domestic labor and how working women/mothers work "double shifts" everyday due to the fact that they come home from their jobs and spend another 'work shift' at home taking care of kids, cleaning the house, cooking, and taking care of other domestic tasks, even though they have partner/husbands that could easily help more, but don't. Something so subtle and unconscious costs women a lot in economic opportunities and wages. Married men and fathers don't have this issue. In fact, the domestic labor expended by their wives allows men more time to compete for better economic opportunities and pay. So, obviously there's nothing wrong with being heterosexual or having heterosexual relationships/sex, but it would disingenuous to say that patriarchal social structures don't fundamentally corrupt heterosexual relationships and create artificial power imbalances b/w men and women that provides more disadvantages for women more than men.
@@biggtk Great points!
The patriarchy does totally corrupt heterosexual relationships. I grew up with lesbian parents and am queer myself, so sometimes I have a hard time remembering how prevailing of an issue sexism is in relationships. I haven't read much of Sheila Jeffries, but to me, she seemed to be saying that straight relationships are, if not inherently misogynistic, unavoidablly so, (in a way that most people would never argue) and I wanted to make the point that having a heterosexual relationship with an individual needs to be separated from the larger forces of misogyny present across the board.
On the topic of men not helping around the home, I think part of it has to do with them feeling like doing minimal work is a revolutionary act due to the previous generations teaching that women are the ones who do the housework
As a man living alone not doing anywhere near as much housework as would be necessary let me tell you there is no deliberation behind it (only speaking for myself of course but I think this applies to many other men as well). Many men just aren't being raised to do housework that often. Now I don't know how women are raised but (maybe that's partly due to my ADHD) pretty much every time when I tried to do any housework alongside a woman (and I tried really hard) she was always so much faster at it that I would at least guess that this must have come from experience to some degree.
Of course that's a societal issue in itself; Not that women are brought up so prepared to do housework but that men are so unprepared for it (tbh, I'd rather not spend several days getting my place in order each time).
However, it might explain why men tend to overestimate their housekeeping efforts. If you're used to mom doing everything to provide for you growing up including stuff you should be doing by yourself at that age changing your bed sheets every four months or so can feel like a major act of self care.
Of course that doesn't excuse being unwilling to improve on these things and there are definitely some men out there who just don't bother because it's too comfortable or because they're assholes who think they're somehow entitled to having everything done for them.
So... you're pretty much right in that it's due to the norm of women doing housework to some degree. Just wanted to add some more perspective.
@@eggileierkopf9421 You're absolutely right. Heck, I can relate even though I grew up in a female role. My mother never taught me to cook/do housework or allowed me to help with it at all because of her OCD. I was really unprepared and had no idea what to do when I shared a house with a roommate. I would try to help with cooking and housework but it would take me forever and I couldn't get very much done. Doing small things felt like a big accomplishment to me yet my roommate was frustrated with me, saying that I barely helped out. Fortunately I knew how to do traditionally male chores really well (I learned stuff like barbecuing, car maintenance, basic carpentry from my dad) so I didn't feel completely useless, lol.
I think it's definitely important for parents to teach kids of any gender how to do ALL important chores It's harmful and unnecessary to separate knowledge by gender. Makes things much harder to learn down the road, otherwise!
Or they don’t actually do it anyway if living by themselves. Let the ones wanting work done do it. 😅
@@globalist1990 I think someday soon we'll see the day when women refuse to date men who don't know how to take care of themselves. (I'm already there.) Cooking and cleaning are not feminine. They are Adulting 101.
@@lynnes1864 i fully support your decision. But lots of people don’t want to do adult, doesn’t mean they are misogynists necessarily. Sometimes it’s not that simple. It might be that one is not really a slob, it’s just the other being super OCD with cleanliness. So people just need to partner with the right people for them I guess…
Outstanding sourcing, quips, research, and wonderful explanation. U are a fantastic human and here is your bat🦇
so damn true. I dislike the idea that women and us queers have to regect everything that's heterosexual in any way. we should get to a time where every relationship is beautiful, including the "straight" ones, without demonizing queer ones
What's even worse is that some of the "ew hetro" etc is also from ppl in the LGBTQ+ community. Im bi and non-binary. When I was dating my boyfriend my friends would go "ew straight" SO MUCH. Like it wasn't even funny anymore (i don't think it was funny in the first place). And it made me feel weird like I can't do anything like hold hands with him bc it was "ew straight". I just felt so weird and angry every time someone would say "ew straight".
@@haunted2882 Lmfao people do that?! They sound like they want to feel *🌸sPeciAl🌸* and *🌸qUirKy🌸*. Instead of "Not Like Other Girls" they sound like "Not Like The Majority" - look at me I'm part of the LBGT+. I'm a heterosexual female and I feel bad for genuine members of the LGBT+ community. So many bandwagoners - I was called a basic bxtch by a 12 year old for telling her I'm hetero - She was part of the LGBT+ to not feel 'basic'.
@@Elliecham You say LGBT people like it's an organization.
@@alemoncitrus8285 Well, yesnt?
Just generally being such isnt, but actively partaking in the social media and activities of such very much is. Along the lines of coined terms, communities and social behaviour specifically for those groups. Probably more than just one organization actually, divided like any other topic that's a red string through life.
Sort of a social structure community led organization kinda thing?
Why the between quotes? Straight ones are just straight ones, not quotes there
I also feel that heteromiserabilism can be seen as a sort of reaction to the romanticization of the fixing of broken men. A lot of cultural productions, from The beauty and the beast to Twilight, depict toxic relationships as desirable, and I have the impression that this message is really pushed forward everywhere ( being a man, I didn't personally experience it but it is what I heard from friends). In that way, I think that heterofatalism as a sort of subversion of this dominant narrative can have some kind of positive impact (aka, toxic masculinty isn't cool and shouldn't be your burden).
Anyway, loved the video, tell the cow that the sentence "Is loving your wife gay ?" is the funniest thing I ever heard and sorry for my crappy English.
I think there’s a lot of truth to this. Nice insight.
As a girl i never liked the narrative that depicts love at first sight or men changing for the better (Aka stop being selfish and aggresive) for love.
The first one because it was feeling attracted to a person (woman in most cases) primarily for the apearance, putting personality and inteligence in second place.
And the second one implies that the male partner will instantly stop being abusive if you continue being kind to them. Wich i know is not true and i have my dad as an example.
PD: sorry the text is so long.
Thank you, heteropessimism sucks but at least it saved me from going too far down the fixing men rabbit hole
@Arthur Frayn that's no the definition. And Is stupid to asume that women like something that "naturaly".
your english is really good!! And that was a very insightful analysis
I never assumed you were straight, Tara.
Great Video!!! I feel like I learned so much from watching and analyzing your video, as a cis male, I always felt so troubled on how toxic my own peers would treat women and themselves in social circles. It can be really hard to be constantly judge and to be pushed towards a certain ideal of “what you are suppose to be”. I don’t know the answer to solving this toxic hyper hetero normativity, it’s not the end all be all. I can only hope all genders and sexualities can create a new perspective where we can work together and understand the fluidity that is life and love.
“Fellas, is it gay to love your wife?” Should've been the title of the episode! When I share it with friends that the caption I'm going to use 😂😂😂🦇🦇🦇
Regarding "positive masculinity": I can't find it now, but I just read a super interesting thread where someone said, half-jokingly, "Jack Black is cis but he has transmasc swag," and someone responded with a surprisingly insightful theory that this is because he's "short, fat and Jewish", and therefore performs masculinity in an 'unconventional' way. As in: 1. He exudes confidence and is comfortable in his own desirability, despite not conforming to stereotypical male body image standards, and 2. Jewish masculinity tends to focus on different things than mainstream North American masculinity. That is to say, the expectation of mainstream North American masculinity is typically muscular, physically dominant and aggressive, and "tough", while the expectations of masculinity in Jewish circles/families/communities/traditions tend to focus more on being smart, well-dressed, witty and funny, polite, able to hold your own in a lively debate, and able to support yourself financially. As a Jewish person myself, I was like "😲" because the Jewish masculinity thing made SO MUCH SENSE and mirrored (to varying degrees) almost all of the Jewish men I know; and I'd never even thought about it! -- Now, I am NOT saying that this form of masculinity is necessarily perfect or "superior" in any way, or that it's the "solution to misogyny" or the patriarchy or anything like that -- It is definitely not without its own issues and toxicity. But I do find it to be more open to empathy and vulnerability in many ways than mainstream North American masculinity. Honestly... I can't really remember what my point was gonna be, exactly... but the positive masculinity part just made me think about that and I think it's fascinating. I would be fascinated to learn more about other standards of masculinity specific to different cultures
I also read that post! This is from the blog covington-shenanigans on tumbler
I didn't read that post, but I have always been fond of Jewish men because they have feelings and talk about them.
This IS fascinating!
Wow, I guess that the jewish side of my family was more influential than I thought. You pretty much described my dad, although he's tall and skinny, and pretty much described what is seen as a desirable man in my family.
Wow! That surprised me with how spot on it is with my experience. Thanks for sharing
That wifi and bluetooth analogy was beautifully dismantled by somebody pointing out that bluetooth will only establish a connection when both devices independently agree to establish a connection between each other, while wifi constantly displays it's availability, and unless it has a password will allow itself to connect to anyone nearby.
The moral is don't use arbitrary technology to make comparisons between human beings
And sometimes bluetooth is a pain in the ass to use even if you're sure that you have a stabel connection.
@@carolinemcgovern4488 I feel like it compresses the audio when you're sending audio to a bluetooth speaker. I'd just rather use a cable when it comes to audio personally. Even though I always step on the cable and tear it out of the port bending my cable and my ports. Oh well such is life!
Ummm that is actually a view on women that existed back in medieval times
Ikr
The wifi/bluetooth thing to me is just someone looking for justification for men to sleep around and women to attach to "the strongest" man.
18:26 "even incels, overflowing with heteropessimism, stress the involuntary nature of their condition"
I just finished reading Undoing Yourself with Energized Meditation by Christopher S Hyatt and it's astounding how applicable his theses of human behavior are to this. That condition of hating something and feeling trapped but also feeling that you absolutely must be doing the thing. Classic.
"i swear im not heterophobic ive got lots of straight friends" JHDSFGKLJHSLKGJH
me though LMFAO
That’s a racist statement yet no one wants to talk about that
@@manic6461 ....how is it racist, it's literally parodying homophobes
@@3starsburningbright yeah but it originated from “I have black friends”
@@manic6461 ..but homophobes say that but with homophobic and gay friends….
I was hetero pessimistic but I think that was because I spent a lot of time on the internet during lockdown, I got to interact with a lot of incels. It made me so pessimistic and made me wonder if most men are narcissists.
My religious mom made me think all men were rapists and bad people (*cough cough* projecting her frustrations with my dad), but then would act shocked when I was scared to be around men. 🙄🙄🙄
Damn I feel you... not only incel but all the manosphere
Sameee girl!!! I am still very pessimistic about men, but at least I'm trying to understand that there might be some cool dudes out there.
As someone that has had several bad experiences with men, I get you. I always think "I'm gonna take a break from men" but then some guy appears and I let my guard down. I guess I can't stop being attracted to them.
No. Your circle of interaction was the problem. Maybe take responsibility for how your expierences are watering down your brain.
Omfg the Bi but married to a man part hurts because it’s like I’m not going to start identifying as straight and pretend experiences and feelings didn’t happen, but if I’m questioned and explain this, I’m the annoying one bringing up something that happened long ago.
I mean it’s kinda like bringing up an ex. If you’re monogamous then why bring up feelings about someone else.
I don't think it's necessarily gauche or annoying--you can still find people outside your monogamous relationship attractive, even without having any desire to act on those feelings, and queerness is often as much a culture as it is an internal experience. I think it's worthwhile to be honest about the safety that a loving, supportive, straight-passing (or m/f or whatever terminology you prefer) relationship offers but that doesn't mean it's necessary to hide, dismiss or downplay your bisexuality! Being bi is great
@@mikealaniz7236 i don’t think that’s the best analogy. being married doesn’t mean you stop being attracted to people other than your spouse. if it did then infidelity likely would not exist. no one bats an eyelid when heterosexual women who are already married express their attractions to men other than their spouses e.g. celebrities and that’s because we recognise that attraction doesn’t just disappear when you settle down with one person.
it is unfair to expect bisexual people (especially women) to pretend that their attraction to the same sex no longer exists when they are in relationships with the opposite sex. op should be allowed to express her appreciation of female beauty without external backlash because regardless which gender she is married to she is STILL bisexual.
They shouldn't ask questions they don't want the answer to.
Also how do they know their "husband" is even a man. Just because they look like a man still means they could be a trans-woman or non-binary.
I think sexuality is fluid for a lot more people than we think, that being said it doesnt erase the fact that there are many people out there, gay, lesbian and het that will never stray outside of their desired sex, which is totally okay. Everyone is different!
Growing up in straight culture was depressing when I was actually asexual
Honestlyyyyy she needs to make a whole video about this! Heterosexual culture doesn’t just affect gay people, but also asexual people who are not heterosexual and are always told that “they’ll find the right person one day”. Very infuriating and a topic that is not touched upon enough!
@@retrodiisiac it’s also a deeply scary thing when you really fucking love someone who’s cis. I’m a guy who is with a girl, but idk what the fuck will we do when it comes to anything sex 🙃
It’s kinda weird when she asks if I like her outfit or that one time she was like “Daaamn I have a nice ass don’t I?” Like yeah, you do. You have a great butt, but wth am I supposed to feel from this? 🥲
I love her and she loves me, and she knows that she won’t get what the usual male approval is from me. I can say she has a hot bod, she’s really worked for it, and I really admire her for it, but it’s just not a thing that creates any form of sexual attraction. I’m scared that admiration and love won’t be enough 😐
i would say in allosexual culture in general, i feel like we are in serious need of academic approaches of asexual experiences, i'm not saying this is the only thing that matters and would ‘validate’ us (validation for me is kinda empty, a non-substantial representation) but would certainly help more people comprehend asexuality.
@@heatweve True!! People need to know that not all people feel sexual attraction. Also I wholeheartedly agree with you on the “valid” thing. It kind rubs me the wrong way when people say “you’re valid!!” because it seems like they’re just saying that. It doesn’t show the meaning behind it. Of course it’s in good intention, but it feels empty and lackluster.
@@AsteroSloth Maybe, if you feel comfortable, you can come out to her? That’s what I did with my bf and he’s very supportive! Try to tell her your own ace experience and educate her. If she loves you, she’ll accept you because sex isn’t required in love.
As I get older, labels seem more annoying and hollow. I honestly give up on trying to define my type of attraction to people and file it into society like the outdated card catalog system in an old library. My attractions change and vary
same
We know you're just not straight but you don't seem to have any problems constantly trying to sexually groom other people.
It's harassment.
SAME - (if i may vent a little) I tried to find a label that “fit” me waaaay too early, and as I got older I was still trying in vain. Then I realised that I wasn’t actually trying to find a specific label that fit “for me” - I was trying to find a label that was digestible for other people (mainly straight people). Now I just skip all the kerfuffle and go by “queer”; tells ya everything you “need” to know lol
@@the_mulattos huh
Funnily enough, labels and categorization is something that humans naturally excel at, but is directly contradicted by the inherent chaos and disorder of reality. Existence cannot be organized in any meaningful way, everything overlaps with everything else, and we cannot create any truly meaningful definitions. So this pain and hollowness we feel over labeling is part of a larger existential issue with how we perceive reality.
Hey all. Just for transparency I want to add that I've cut the comment where I say 'it's fair to argue bisexual women have "straight passing privilege"'.
Here's why:
a) The language of "passing" derives from critical race theory and I don't want to co-opt CRT terminology and distract from race issues. That's enough to convince me to stop saying it but there is another reason.
b) In short: I don't still stand by the statement.
As for the long version:
When I said "it's fair to argue" I was expressing my mixed feelings about the phrase "straight passing". I've seen some people use it to dismiss people's queerness, but I've also seen it used in good faith to discuss how "appearing" queer to straight people can be dangerous.
I am aware that as a bi/pan woman if I walk down the street with a man I am less likely to be "clocked" as queer and therefore attacked. In those types of situations I am safer and I can't deny there can be benefits to people thinking I'm straight. But not all bi people are in "straight" relationships. Even if they are they still might "appear queer" in other ways. There are benefits to being *perceived* as straight. But bi people aren't at the top of the "social pyramid" and they *aren't* straight, therefore being perceived as straight is erasure. So I'm not sure if "privilege" is the right word.
Thank you to the people who explained the issues with this phrase. Thank you for not assuming the worst and allowing me to learn and grow. If you decide to continue this discussion in the comments, please respect each other.
💖💜💙
I was just watching this video for the third time and I really appreciate you saying this!! Thanks!!!
I don't really understand what the problem with using "passing" is since it's very applicable across different marginalized identities; white passing, straight passing and cis passing all refer to people of a marginalized group who can pass undetected in the "socially acceptable" group. Passing is always about erasure because the only privilege a passing person gets is dependent on their "true identity" remaining hidden.
Passing is used because the meaning fits different identities. Meanwhile when the term "Karen" got co-opted it lost its original meaning from "privileged white woman who will leverage her whiteness as a weapon against black people" to just "entitled annoying lady". A Karen went from being a more serious threat to being the laughingstock of the internet, and it's easier to see hoe something like that is problematic.
I just feel like "passing" is similar to "privileged" in that it can be used by different groups but convey similar meaning. White privilege isn't the same as straight privilege but the concept is the same. Am I making any sense?
Thank you so much Tara. I'm a bisexual with a very little attraction to opposite gender and living in a very conservative country. Till today I haven't been in a relationship with someone I like because doing so can get me beaten, even killed. Add some useless and harmful, frustrating gender stereotypes, it's safe to say that the consequences of "appearing queer" can be nightmarish here for a bisexual
Thank you so much Tara! It really means a lot as a bi woman who has occasionally heard that before
Saying sexuality is fluid is highly problematic, it forces everyone to be like the people who claim that. They happen to be bisexual or panszxual and project their identity onto everyone else.
I'm a straight neurodivergent girl so I also watch love island with confusion.
The author of Not Gay reaaaallly missed a great opportunity to title her book No Homo
In summary: the straights are absolutely not OK, and heterofatalism is a somewhat sad coping mechanism for everyone involved. (also, I loved the edited commentary with the cow pictures.)
Excellent summarization, and to comment I disagree with the analysis as it delves into a very pessimistic viewpoint of heterosexuality based on old fashioned, rude, constantly evolving definitions and typical gender stereotypes and comes from a biased perspective.
I can confirm: we are not.
Don't worry it'll happen to you too
I’m straight and I’m okay. No need to worry about me.
@@winstonmarlowe5254 Yes dear, you are clearly not okay either.
Wow, this really opened my eyes as to why so many people erroneously think asexuality is just pessimistic straightness lol
Nobody cares.
Hybrid Vigour proved your point!
@whatisgoingonhere Hybrid appears to be a troll trying to stir the pot, pay them no mind and maybe they will go back under their bridge
Pessimistic straightness is now my band name.
@@the_mulattos and yet you cared enough to read the comment and comment on the comment.
🦇🦇🦇! Thank you so much for this video. I know I'm late to the party but this type of content makes me feel comfort from what the internet portrays often as a neverending battle of identities
This was really interesting! A great video! I'm a straight man and me and my fiance (who is a Bi Woman) we're recently talking about how depressing and disturbing it is that many straight relationships and marriages talk and "joke" about how much they hate and feel tied down by their relationship or marriage, and how ridiculous that is, and even more so how ridiculous it is to say that non straight people can't get married, even though they seem to hate their own straight marriage so much. It's wild!
@The Golden Sphere ah I see I struck a nerve lol. Nice
@The Golden Sphere Damn. You are a personified meme lol. Good work there, sport!
@The Golden Sphere Awwh, look at the little troll desperate for attention.
@@briannab4037 - He spoke the truth
@@Rapewomen-mt4ur No, sweetie. He wouldn't know what "truth" was even if it slapped him across the face.
Bi NB here. I was in a creative writing class and wrote a "soul mates" short story about a girl who always assumed her match would be a man, because that was the narrative heavily pushed on her. Then she actually meets her soulmate, who is a woman. Que the "Wow, I've never even asked myself of I was straight or not, I just assumed" reflection. I wrote the story about my own grapples with comp het.
My teacher said I was "undermining gay rights" by suggesting "they weren't born this way." 🙄 🦇🦇🦇
Was the teacher straight?
It seems interesting how yeah we all asume were straight until were not is really weird when you think about instead of figuring out
Oof, creative writing classes can be full of toxic advice and behaviour, it sounds like a great story though.
@@luis956476 I mean, that's heteronormativity.
God this is true for me, I always assumed I was straight and after years of ruining potential friendship with men I finally realized I’m just not into men that way lol
As a Pansexual man it took me a while to actually start dating women, I felt this pressure to follow masculine roles if I wanted to date a woman. Bisexual and pansexual men are seen as lesser partners by heterosexual cis women , I can only talk from my own experiences but the moment I don’t appear masc or mention how I’ve dated men and non binary folk they stop talking to me.
damn, i'm so sorry about that. i hope things look up for you, and that if you do end up with a woman, she doesn't look down upon you for your sexual orientation. :)
well as a gay guy i can safely say that they are missing out lol! if they don't want pan/bi men i will take them ! ♥
Yeah it kinda sucks being pansexual, people always look down on me and tease me for being pansexual, even people in the community, (which is a shame) people started to doubt i was pansexual because of my age and I have "never dated", and the our community most of them usually say pan and bi and any other "don't exist" only lesbians and gays :/
@@Rainbowztars for real it fucking sucks, I thought we were supposed to support each other.
To the pan and bi s on the comment did you stop conforming to gender roles in your gay relationship just wondering sorry if it is asking tmi
🦇 looking forward to your video about positive masculinity. There’s a lot of great information out there. I’ve often described myself as a man (who looks like your typical dude) who got a feminine OS. I’m straight (ish) but I relate to women, most of my friends are women, and women feel at ease around me. My friend (who is a woman and gay, and has always disliked and not trusted men) was shocked by what she calls the “nurturing masculine” she found and really came to love in me. I’m so lucky to have her friendship and everything that comes along with being privy to the world of “somebody as gay as [her]” (her words not mine) lol. Anyways, sorry about the rambling comment. Love your videos. Keep up the good work!
Love island is my favourite sneak peak into the world of the straights, it’s like watching a heteroseggsual train wreck but it’s a bunch of conventionally attractive people trying to 👀 all summer long.
can we clarify this into "vapid, shallow straights"? Bc holy shit im straight(ish) and it blows my mind watching that.
Really random but I've seen that we're subscribed to a lot of the same channels and I've been seeing your comments a lot lately ( I swear I'm not a stalker) but anyway hi I just subscribed to your channel. Can't wait to see you grow and brag that I was there when you had 1.44k subs.
@@KnockknockNox omg now that you mention it. I've seen their comments on other channels too haha
hey i see your comments around on many channels i watch just wanted to say hi
So we are basically watching same channels
I see u more often on other channels than on your own👁️👄👁️
Straight pride is like not letting someone have cake, and getting upset that they didn’t give you part of the cake they made for themselves
And then screaming about that cake you made whenever they share a piece of cake with someone else
People who support straight pride parades are either trolling or delusional god fearing old people. I feel a more accurate analogy for the general population goes as follows: heterosexuals enjoy their own cake and don’t care what people under the rainbow banner eat, but the rainbow people keep making loud remarks about how their cake is better, “normal” cake is boring and dumb, and heterosexual people secretly want their cake too, all while poking and prodding people that just want to enjoy their cake. Most straight people don’t give a single fuck, just eat your damn cake and let me eat mine in peace.
@@Rieneger it would be nice if everyone could eat their damn cake in peace, but the fact that homosexuality was seen as wrong to begin with created a stigma that's still boiling down.
Lmao nice
Most pride is like that.
Ah yes, that famous musical, _Het Miserables_ 🦇
🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇
This made me snort
🤣🤣🤣
Wow, I never thought of heteropessimism as the spiritual descendent of political lesbianism. You really nailed it with "heteropessimism silences womens' expressions of desire." Even in the tiny clip you cited, it's pretty obvious that Jeffreys is repulsed and disgusted by sex, and if she's typical of the movement...
Also, in framing men as the enemy, both place the entire onus for progress onto women, which is...I don't know if it's misogynist exactly, but it sure reminds me of how women in heterosexual couples are expected to do most of the housework.
Agree with the last, unfortunately all of that propaganda are infecting the minds of girls and young woman and some mid age too, I don't want to be a species of Atlas god carrying with the height of lots changes, and this why probably the mental sanity of women will have drop in the next years
Why woman believe that men is "a woman's mind in a male body"?
Honestly, I don't think it should matter if sexuality is a choice or not. What should matter is autonomy, and the right to people's lives not being unjustly interfered with. What matters is not expecting everyone else to live by a subset of the populations personal outlook on life. Who people have romantic or sexual relationships hurts no one and is no one's business. If your god says that it's wrong... well that doesn't apply to me because that's not my god.
Indeed. Most people are hard wired, some change through their life, and for some it seems its a choice. I was cishet until my 40s when I changed. Regarding hereteropessimisim, and all relationships and sex problem, the answer is always the same: tulpas, dolls, bots and tech. None of this will matter when we all have ssxbots.
I would like to speak to your God
@@mo.ka.9661 what about?
@@someonesomeone25 don't use your tulpas for sex and relationships, it's not ethical. the tulpa community hates when people make tulpas for love/sex and nothing else.
@@monbub I disagree with it being unethical, esp since they weren't deliberate creations on my part, they came to me organically long before I even knew what the word tulpa was. I could just have easily used the words succubus and incubus from another religious tradition. We are deeply in love with each other and that's not going to change.
Edit: I'm not sure where the ethical problem arises?
So I'm a straight man so take my opinion with a grain of salt. I also hope I can articulate this as good as it sounds in my head, but it seems that heterofatalism comes from the fact that, even as society becomes slowly more gender equal in a sense, or that feminist analysis becomes more accepted and mainstreamed, it's pretty evident that men haven't kept up with the efforts needed to properly depose of the gender roles that patriarchy have historically created. And, this failure of deposition is both on a societal and individual level, with the latter being evident with the fact mentioned in the video about housework done in a relationship. Obviously with that, like you mentioned in the video, men need to do some serious work also to ensure those roles can be ended, both individually and societally. This will require the deconstruction of our history, especially our Hunter and Gatherer era history. For instance, the patriarchy assumes these roles are innate, but the fact of the matter is, in hunter gatherer times humans were a lot more egalitarian, and that was across gender lines too. So yeah I hope this makes sense, and I hope I didn't ramble too much
There is evidence that our view of what Hunter Gathering society was like is incorrect. It was not strictly gendered for those roles like we have firmly believed and there was more equal participation in all of society.
Yeah, it seems like men only tolerate the existence of feminism. But they generally don’t view it positively nor would they incorporate it into their lives. They know they can more easily enforce their interests with patriarchy/misogyny. So, they’re not gonna give that up. A lot of women with hetero-fatalism are getting frustrated with one side trying to relive their glory days of exploitation while the other wants to go in a completely different direction. It’s like men and women are not compatible lately. It’s weird.
Gender roles developed as an evolutionary strategy due to sexual dimorphism. Society can influence what superficial forms it takes and to what severity it is socially or legally enforced, but the underlying urges and differences are biological in nature. It's not some patriarchal conspiracy.
As to hunter gatherer society, there are remote tribes that disprove your theory. They usually have pretty strict division of labor along gender lines as well as religious significance atributed to the difference between man and woman.
It's also not a good argument to use them as examples if you want to argue what should be, as hunter gatherer societies are not as adaptable and persist only at the mercy of more efficient and inovative systems of social organization, which is why so few persist. The way people idealize hunter gather society as though it's utopian or something is childish.
@@LoneWulf278 It's almost like men and women really do have innate differences on average that can not be socially costructed away. Men are not bad for having more of a hypercompetitive nature, nore are women bad for having a more nurturing nature. The division is caused by the gender wars in which we vilify the out group along sex and gender lines, and then wonder why we no longer cooperate and compliment eachother's natures anymore.
I suspect the person who started this thread is a less competative man with a more nurturing and emotional side, just as I am a woman who is high in trait disagreeableness and introversion which are more common in men. I used to make the mistake of thinking I disproved the norm just by existing, but the reality is that we outliers have our value, but so do the people who fit the norm more. Hell, they have a great value to humanity as a species in general because left to their own devices, they contribute far more in terms of reproduction, continuing the species. With modern first world nations mostly achieving sub-replacement birth rates, it's no time to demonize or deconstruct them and their norms, or our societies will collapse and be taken over by far more aggressively patriarchal cultures that reproduce at high rates.
🦇 UGH, YOUR PINK OUTFIT- IT'S EVERYTHING!!! 💗 Also, I hope the Cow's Tinderdate was satisfactory. She deserves all the good things.
Edit: THAT OUTFIT AFTER THE PINK ONE THO?! You have impeccable style, for real!!!👏🏽
Edit 2: the part 3 outfit is LOVELY and I just need to know where you keep getting these amazing outfits from!!
Edit 3: added the bat emoji 😌 also Nim is, indeed, an angel. 19/10 would die for him.
Thank you, dear!
i couldn't agree more! Tara looks insanely extra beautiful in this video-from start to finish, dear gods.
Very late to the party, but I found this extremely fascinating! Also I love that you were watching Buffy! 💞 It's been my favourite show (along with Angel, the spin off) my whole life 😄
25:14 this is a HUGE issue in Poland where new generation of men want to be progressive and help at home but they have no idea how. Their families never taught them anything because "your wife will do everything for you" and now their girlfriends/ wives have to teach them not only how to do things but guide them through a process of developing habits for cleaning, cooking ect. x_x
I appreciate seeing this comment. I'm polish living in the US and i was born and raised here. I've always wondered what the culture between men and women and dating is in Poland and what are the gender expectations. Of course my parents made me and my brother do chores but they definetly split the chores by gender. Like i do the traditional women's tasks like vaccuuming and laundry and my brother now's the lawn and takes out the trash. My brother could not do what I do and i probably couldn't now the lawn lol. They always said that these would be the expectations for us when we get married
@@gabyk4439 Yea, meanwhile in modern world everyone needs to be able to take care of themselves and others if need be. Luckily, while my family was dead set on teaching me "all the things good housewife must learn to do", they also believed that on top of that, I must be able to do other chores too. In practice they never taught me other chores but at least they had the right opinions and they always appreciated women who can do house repairs, deal with electronics, do hard physical work etc. So AT LEAST I adopted that mindset.
@@AmberyTear lol i agree i had to be the one that adopted that mindset and learned to do it myself when I had to
Disgusting. All women should stop dating men. It’s really draining and sad
@@waverider6133 You're talking to a happily married woman. XD
i don’t think LGBT subcultures will die out. the way i see it, the history of the community and the shared suffering that we’ve endured is what binds us. and as the binary is deconstructed, that history will continue to bind everyone on the spectrum, they will just be a lot more people participating in it
I feel like LGBT subcultures came into being because they had to struggle against the norm just to exist in a way that feels natural and right.
So without straightness to struggle against, they'd likely still be there. Just maybe without all the trauma or clearly defined labels.
Or it will, and people will become fine with it if it results in less discrimination. The culture will just change, and if we are serious about teaching History, we won't forget the struggles of the past.
Here a bi girl and an historian: yes, homophobia history and gay people tortures will be remember as well any other discrimination that humans created.
But to remember that those horrible things happend, doesn't necessarily bind us all together and less with the LGBT community.
Also, you're talking like if the members of that community would bel the entire gay population of the planet (surprise: it's not).
Let me explain it: I'm a girl, I know how we women are discriminated too; I'm a gifted person, I know how we gifteds are discriminated to be the black sheeps of our societies; I'm an art historian and I know how we art historians are not take seriously... and not because of that I feel naturally bind to other women, gifteds or art historians.
I feel near to people because I'm aware that they, as the animals we are, have feelings, dignity and can suffer; because I can feel natural empathy for them, no matter how related with me they are.
I feel empathy for others homo/bi people because I know they're suffering homophobia and see their pain hurts me, but not because we both share a simple biological trait (sexual orientation).
I can't feel I'm bonded with someone just because be both like boobs, we both have vagina, or dark hair, or an illness... that's just a trait we share, like the 5 fingers in the hands and none of us feel bind to other person just because the number of fingers or the eye color, right?
I'm social and empathetic, but not gregarious like a sheep: I have not the instinct of gather with others just because they're barely alike me in one simple trait.
(I'm not bragging, just explaining how my personality works. The way my mind and heart are don't make me better or worst that anyone else).
LGBT community is not the entire population of homos/bis: LGTBs are a bunch of people who thinks that being gay is their entire identity (they talk about being gay the 24 hours per day), use their own vocabulary (like in the video) and have an ideology (queer), dress weird and dye their hair, go to the carnnival Pride and support Pink Capitalism, want to tell you which is your identity (I'm a tomboy, LGBTs told me to be "transphobic" because "you don't want to admit you're trans or agender") and hate heteros.
They're a pretty well specific political and subculture of gay people, with whom the most of us gays don't feel identify.
So in conclusion, remember our history: yes, of course.
To become part of a political-subcultural club of people just because you share a biological trait with them: no, no need of that.
Ps: Yes, my english isn't perfect. ¿Que le vamos a hacer? 🤣
IT WILL DIE ONCE JESUS RETURNS TO EARTH, HE WILL SEND YOU ALL TO HELL
I think another big problem is that straight culture has normalised dating people just purely based on physical attraction. People jump straight into committed relationships without making sure that they're compatible, and then those couples wonder why they often fight or have disagreements when it comes to living arrangements, beliefs, boundaries, sex drive, children, and other future plans. And there's a huge misconception that marriage fixes broken relationships; news flash: it doesn't. Reasons why divorce rates are so high.
But yeah, I speak from experience when it comes to the whole moving-too-fast thing. Not long after I found out I was bi but hadn't come out yet, in high school I dated a guy who had a crush on me and I thought I was crushing on him too. (I should probably mention that I was kind of peer-pressured into it as well.) But after several months, the red flags started popping up. We had our first kiss one night and I was unprepared, but I went with it anyway because that's normal, right? And afterwards, I didn't feel good at all. It felt emotionally nauseating, if that makes any sense? And every kiss we had after that didn't get better, I never felt any spark or giddiness, and I found myself wishing to be around him less and less for that reason. Don't get me wrong, he was a sweet guy, and he eventually voiced his unhappiness with my contribution in the relationship (he was always the one to call me, he was always the one to organise outings, etc). The only thing he did that was kind of shitty was he dumped me at the end of our last date (he'd gotten me gifts and everything so I didn't see the break up coming at all). But yeah, that destroyed me.
For, like, a day.
After that, I was over it so surprisingly quickly, and for a while I wondered why, because I knew that I was the reason the relationship failed. I wanted to know what was wrong with me, and then one day, it finally hit me: it was simply because I didn't romantically love him. I forced myself to believe that I did because that's just the norm: boy meets girl, you know? And I got over the relationship quickly because I finally felt the weight and pressure on me lifted. I just wasn't ready for a relationship, and certainly not one with him. Maybe we could've worked if I knew then what I know now, but oh well. Everything is a learning experience.
Moral of the story, just get to know the person you're attracted to before you start dating, because I didn't even know my ex's full name when we did. Y i k e s.
I do not agree with this. Straight women precisely complain about the lack of comittement of some men. Meanwhile, in the lesbian world, u-hauling is a thing.
@@JackDespero Straight women complain about the lack of commitment, BECAUSE a big straight-culture thing, is as she said above, *dating someone based on purely physical attraction and not checking compatability.* The man ain't committed, he's a shitty dude, but she chose to date him because she thought he was hot and didn't check whether their personalities would line up or if he was even a good person, at all. And if you're implying that lesbians *never* cheat on their partners, then hoooo buddy you couldn't be more wrong.
Same shit happened to me too. Never again 😡
@@chubbybunny6975 but how is that straight culture, that’s just lust
‘Straight culture’ is the dumbest phrase I’ve ever seen not gonna lie
This video is interesting to me, as I grew up without a lot of this straight culture even though most people in my family are straight. Even my grandparents had a very loving and caring relationship on both sides.
Yes, they made some misogynistic jokes, but it isn't reflected in their relationship, at least not from what i can see from the outside, which is why the internet was such a whiplash to me in a sense.
Your video was very interesting and it made me kind of sad. Being straight can be miserable in a culture that jokes about abuse situations and enforces toxic gender roles.