Hi! 🐄 Here's the article I showed on Clinton: www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/24/hillary-clinton-feminist-icon-jessa-crispin And the article on Harris: www.them.us/story/kamala-harriss-record-on-trans-and-sex-work-issues
i love that margret thatcher "girl power" clip so much. i wonder if there's some sort of power dynamic there. girl boss "feminists" like to prop up women in power like Clinton or Harris, even if they use their power to actively infringe on the rights of of other, less powerful women (Bill's sexual assault survivors or trans women in prison). love the content you and the cow have been putting out recently queen.
I liked that video, but I do have some different opinions. There isn’t Justice in starting to make fun of another sex because, you are making fun of your own too much. Also having that mentality looks spiteful and gives me the impression that it’s gonna be more bullying than jokes. You should just.. Uk make fun of something because it’s funny and not because there isn’t a balance in how many people ur making fun off. I do also think that misogyny in men gets called out a lot. Even when women are misogynistic it’s argued because of men too.
Trying to follow the difference between "SIMP" , "nice guy", and "pick me" reminds me of trying to learn the difference between irony, sarcasm, and satire.
@@pagolainaki7175 Sarcasm (Greek for "speak maliciously"): saying the exact opposite of what you mean, e.g. letting someone know they're being a bore by saying "Veeery interesting, please tell me more." Unlike irony, sarcasm is supposed to convey scorn/disdain. Irony A: when the reality of a situation is contrary to the ideal in a kind of amusing way, e.g. student A tutors student B and then A ends up receiving a worse grade. Irony B (greek for "simulated ignorance"): Basically my definition of sarcasm but more on the humorous side, less contemptuous. E.g. a household appliance breaks after a long week and you have to repair it: "Great, I've been having too much fun this week anyway." Satire: imitating or illustrating someone's flaws in a mocking way. The flaw here is usually universally recognized as a moral shortcoming, so mocking someone's appearance alone is not satire, but mocking their greed can be.
oh god, I've seen at least 3 guys posting about this and in my opinion it would be fine if it was a thing they did off camera without having to post it.. but they do it for the the tiktok and the attention and bc they saw other guys doing it.
ngl i notice that i do this sometimes, it’s not even on purpose it’s more subconscious but almost every time i do this i realize it, so i try to reanalyze the situation and see if i’m really being lenient with the woman. so yea i’m figuring it out
Very agree. It's such an annoying topic too, because you gotta know in your heart that there's a bunch of misogynists who are gonna harass any and all women by default regardless of if they're right or wrong, so it can feel like dogpiling to add to if a woman is legitimately shitty. But also (and I'd argue, at a similar rate to men, at least in terms of public figures and politicians), sometimes individual women are just shitty people who do actually deserve to be thrown off the stage for being shitty. Yet the defense many such women will use for their own shittiness is an appeal to how oppressed they are for being a woman: that misogynists hating them is proof that they're in the right. That their real victimhood gives them the right to victimize others. And so the argument goes round and round. Idk I could ramble about this for ages, but I'm really tired of real good faith feminism being co-opted by this nonsense. We really have to learn how to call a spade a spade regardless of their gender or skin tone or whatever. Like holy shit it's not feminist to elect Mussolini's fascist grand-daughter, I fucking promise yall it's just not.
@@seanbrodney7716i hear this all the times : i saw the conversation going from "male loneliness epidemic" to "that is bs male and female are both lonely , it's your fault (we don't care about it)" To "the female lonelyness epidemic" Same when you talk about men being the primary victims of violence or getting imprisoned , You have a white liberal feminist going "nah that's bs, women have to fear getting murdered every day" And then you can talk about how you've been beaten up , how you got your head pushed under water at the pool , how you've been pinned to the ground and got farted on your face , How a girl followed your nephew in the bathroom and slammed the door on his fingers , and that girl got treated with the softest gloves imaginable ... But it doesn't matter : you're making all of it up for simpaty , And if you don't think women have it worse in every regard then you're part of the problem ...
The problem is that still only criticizes men who hurt women in some way. What about men who put down other men in order to suck up to women, but don't hurt women in any way. They are still wrong for putting down other men.
@@greywolf7577 aren't these the same men though? , a pick me guy is the person who puts down men and trys to win female attention, AND also hurts women in the process
@Izzy Izzy I'd say women pick me's put down other for not following a feminine ideal to make themselves more attractive. So pick me men would probably put down men who are hypermasculine for the same reasons. Eg. Pointing out they're a feminist or "in touch with their feminine side" and not like other guys who are misogynist, while still being misogynistic themselves, to make themselves more attractive
My own father does some of that “[NAME] I am the most feminist person you’ll ever meet” as a response to me calling him out for blaming my period on all my emotions without considering the actual cause of my emotions:)
Yeah this one ticks me off because I recognise it as something I used to do before I came out as trans. Turns out I wasn't sorry for 'my gender' - I just didn't identify with it and felt alienised within male social cycles. And it also does a terrible thing in demeaning men who aren't problematic, who are genuinely nice people who work hard at making the world a better place, and also minimalizes the awful things some men do as being "not in their control because of how they were born". Its nonsense and I'm glad I shifted away from it.
I keep hearing “Pygmy boy”, I can’t stop seeing small people in my mind’s eye. I have added nothing to this conversation, but I have added nonetheless.
What do you call a gay guy who is mysoginistic but because he's feminine he gets a pass for constantly body shaming women among other horrible traits that are branded as cute because a cis gay man is doing it
@@blankabontovics7063 the cis gay guy that cishet girls fetishize n want to be their sassy gay best friend but in reality they are not Sassy they are just ... mean but get away w. it
I think you could have socially conservative pick me men who say things like “I just want to take care of and protect my Queen who raises my kids and takes care of our home” when really he doesn’t respect women making any other choice than staying at home.
Lol omg yes. Everytime I hear some turd utter that or similar in my presence I say, you're saying princess/queen/goddess but what you actually mean is someone dumb enough to clean your house and warm your bed for free.
@@mikey6467 he's not a simp, he's judt pretending he's that nice to his wige who doesn't experience it at all, so he can put himself on a pedestal where he can't be criticized while actively trying to take away rights from women. This topic is pick me boys, not nice guys/simps.
@@maheenm.k1015 Agreed, simps are completely different. The most widely known definition represents redditors/incels who spend millions of dollars on their twitch waifu just so they could read their $3 donation. There may be others, but this is just the one I know most.
I used to know a dude who thought it was feminist to like (fetishize) fat girls. He bragged about how he gaslit a girl into giving up on losing weight by telling her he didn't see any difference in her figure after all her efforts. When I called him out on his toxic behaviour he said I was wrong, because telling women to lose weight = bad, and he was doing the opposite, and that = good.
Oh my god this made me remember a youtube clip I watched(I think it was from a tlc show) and this dude constantly cooks for his gf, I thought it was weird cause he doesn't even eat it only his gf(he also looks quite fit while his gf is obese). Some of the comments said that the reason he does that is he thinks his gf will leave him so he gets her fat so she'd stay with him, it was kind of messed up now that I remember it
I once went on a date with a “feminist” guy and after I rejected him he went around telling my friends he’d been turned off by me “ordering for him” (which didn’t happen)
Rumours are so annoying. I broke up with a guy once because I found photos of another girl on his phone and he told everyone I left him for watching porn. Trust me, these weren't porn photos.
My abusive boyfriend told everyone I was abusive and that I'd hit him and everyone thought I was a monster in class pretending to be a victim. He had a lot of friends and I had one best friend. Everyone believed him. I was so thankful for the virus so I didn't have to go to school and see them anymore.
Last TWO times I met men who claimed to be "into cooking," they genuinely did not know the functional difference between salted and unsalted butter. Like...bro. It's self explanatory.
@@colleenroberts8202 Stupid question - But what's the functional difference between those two besides ... one is salted and one isn't? You mean in regards of cooking? Like in which recipes you can use salted Butter (Soups for an example - So full blown "savory" Stuff) and in which you shouldn't?
@@DaroriDerEinzige There's very little reason to ever use presalted butter, unless you are following a recipe that explicitly calls for it or because you like it that way on toast. When cooking or baking, use unsalted. You can always add salt. You can't really take it out once it's dissolved.
Equality will increase and improve sex though so i wouldn't use it to manipulate a woman but as a society more and better sex is a good reason to be a feminist.
I LOVE how "pedantic" you are. For me, you're actually just careful about being accurate, not afraid of explaining a thing properly, and trust your audience's attention span. Love your channel.
I've been on so many dates where the dude has been a performative feminist: talked about women's issues, bemoaned the inequality that women face, claimed to care about intersectionality, and then at some point he mentions a woman (a famous woman or a woman from a personal anecdote he's telling) whom he isn't attracted to and all of that performative respect vanishes. Suddenly he can't hide his disgust and is cautiously enjoying ridiculing and/or mocking the woman, using flimsy excuses as justification for calling her names. Always a dealbreaker. I feel like so many men think only respecting women they're attracted to is what "feminism" is (and if respect is predicated on whether or not you're attracted to me, it is NOT respect lol).
YES I totally understand. And when it comes to accepting their partner or even just accepting women's self-expression in general, they are only fine with it when they find it sexy. Bisexuality is okay because they fetishize lesbian sex, but leg hair is not because that's such a turn off. It's not real acceptance because everything is still judged through the lens of male sexual approval..
@@elsie384 I knew a guy like that but he would do it with racism. He was also misogynistic, transphobic, and homophobic. I would not be surprised if he was bigoted in other ways, but he would swear up and down he was "fighting against bigotry" 🥴🙄. Also relates to 12:05
The amount of guys that respected me, constantly talked to me saying I'm one of their best friends until I made it clear I wasn't sexually attracted to them and just dropped me is just too big-
This guy I dated once told me a woman flirted with him very heavily, but later wasn’t sure whether she wanted to have sex. He then said to her “You should be careful not to do this with another men in the future, because if I was them, I would probably get very violent and hurt you. You just can’t trust anyone these days” and it was such a big red flag even though he made it sound like he was showing concern for her safety
ikr! that's why when she showed the examples given on tiktok it sounded familiar to me, and my first thought was "this is just the manipulative sadboi". it's amazing how we can have different names for the same things, or at least have some commonalities but ascribe different terms.
Yup. Same. It went from "I just want you to love me" to "I will turn up at your house and shout through the front window to get your attention cause I know you must love me despite breaking up with me". I doubt we're the only ones... :-(
Yes! It went from “I’m in love with you” to stalking me and begging me to be with them, when that didn’t work they made fake social media accounts to follow me and still sends me random things in the mail like flowers and gifts.
@@amberdelia2814 That stuff can be so hard to shut down, and restraining orders can be harder to get than people think. I'm so sorry for you. I hope you are basically safe and that the attention will die off. I hate to say that moving ended it for me, but... sometimes when every last avenue is cut off it ends. Women need to support each other in understanding how difficult the process can be. You have my support.
The girl talking about how male influence can fuel the pick me girl: that’s exactly what happened to me. I struggled with female companionship because the adult women in my life were toxic and being around the men in my family was safer physically. So ofc being a child you adopt their habits. It really sucked because as a young woman I needed to companionship that women offer. Men and women have same but different ways of bonding. I am so glad I’ve grown out of the pick me phase. Not all men are toxic, but having healthy relationships with other women has made me a stronger person mentally and physically in ways men cannot.
I think that clip perfectly described so much of where the “pick me girl” gets her views. The more women I became close to in my life the more I deeply respect women who simply know what they like and respect themselves.
I'm a former pick me girl, and I think it was a common thing if you were in male dominated hobbies/fields in the 2000s/early 2010s, since it was a survival mechanism to escape harassment yourself. So I give myself a break now that I recognize that I was doing that.
pick me-ism doesn’t come from nowhere, and it being a survival mechanism makes a lot of sense. « femininity » and things deemed feminine are definitely looked down on in society, yet propped up to this impossible standard. it’s a very effective tool for division. i hope you’re overcoming this, it’s definitely a hard journey to go through
"You never gonna get a better man than me" "I cuddle more than other guys" "I wouldnt mind taking care of the kids at home while my wife wants to work, because I would put my wife as first priority, not like other men" "Other guys will be boring and ignore you after a while" And this all while flirting with other women online. Sums up basically my abusive ex.
That's fucked up. Especially the first and the last sentence; he should see you as so loveable and know that other men can love you the same and even better than he ever can. Anyone who says "you will never find someone better than me" that's controlling and abusive..... A good partner should say, "I can never find somebody better than you." I am sorry that you endured him. You are much better than that.
I think this concept is similar to one we had for a long time here in Brazil called "esquerdomacho", roughly translated to "leftbro", but I feel that we are way more specific about what that entails. It's a guy who pretends to be a leftist and supporter of women but repeats many of the same behaviors of guys from the right with a woke excuse to do so. He is usually a guy who preachs 'free love' but he gets jealous when one of their girls starts seeing someone too. A guy who drinks beer with friends, talking about leftist politics, while asking his wife to bring them the food and more beers and leaving all the cleaning to her after the event. A guy who will ask for nudes but will try to justify it by saying that you should be more sexually liberated and acting like, in a way, he is trying to help you with this request. This is the kind of guy that an 'esquerdomacho'. Seems similar to a pick me boy, I think.
Came here to say that. I had some experience with this kind of guy and it's accurate. I was seeing this guy and he tried to make me have something with him. I said no. Long story short, he told me I'm not "free" with my choices and I should be more open to new things (remember, I just said "no")
I feel like the problem is all of these terms stem from internalized misogyny, even pick me boys. So when push comes to shove, men never actually blame other men, everyone just always blames women. So a pick me boy is really just a nice guy with the added bonus of performative misandry.
@@eMorphized The answer you're looking for is hypocrisy. Pick me boys generally show hypocrisy in their views, pick me girls generally do not. That's how you know it is or isn't performative.
I guess you you could say it like this??? Pick me girls = internalised misogyny Pick me boys = manipulation At least it often works like this, not in all cases though.
@@TaraMooknee lol thanks so much 😃I know I was joking. I probably deserve to get called out on a bunch of stuff anyways. ;-) It would be an honor to be so by you. :-) I do know though, that It's not enough to wear the t-shirt, you actually gotta show solidarity.
good feminist guys: "hey ik you have problems, and i just wanna help, please tell me what i can do :)" bad feminist guys: "HEY HEY HEY I'M SOOOOOOOOOOOOO SORRY THAT I'M A CIS MAN, BUT I'M NOT LIKE THOSE OTHER CIS MEN, SO PICK ME PICK ME I'M THE GOOD ONE!"
@@doggytheanarchist7876 well the fact that you’re considerate enough for this to cross your mind shows that you’re on the right track to being a true feminist.
I had a friend who was like this back before "pick me" was even a thing. He was a real "m'lady" type of guy and we stopped being friends when I started dating my ex and my friend said "It's not fair, it was my turn, not his." True colors
@Arthur Frayn Wow. THAT was your take on the situation? This guy was literally just being nice to her /being her friend, so he could get laid. He felt entitled to date her because he had 'put in the time' before her boyfriend came on to the scene. It was 'his turn'?! So he had 'dibs' because he knew her longer?! Eew, eew, eew! He just assumed that he should be 'next' in line, without considering her feelings or asking her previously if she was even interested in him romantically.
@Arthur Frayn I literally changed what I said before you even commented, and realized my error in initially using said word. So, your point is moot. I realized that it was the wrong tack to take and I don't generally subscribe to ad hominem attacks. Many others have already referred to you as such; I predicted that if I used the same term, that you would take umbrage with the word, while deflecting from the actual point of the comment, which is exactly what you did. Your whole attitude on here has been condescending and obnoxious to other commenters who disagree with you, by the way. 'Carefully curated'? What the actual?! You've repeated the whole 'bumper sticker' comment to others as well. It doesn't mean anything, just verbal clap-trap, trying to label and pigeon hole others whilst complaining that we are doing the same.
@Arthur Frayn Her 'friend's' entitlement that she should have dated him instead of her boyfriend because he knew her first , is the issue. She never said she thought she was oppressed in any way. Your sarcasm was duly noted. The fact that you took it that way is problematic. So she should be flattered that she was 'attractive enough' that the male friend was into her in the first place?! I guess it doesn't matter that she doesn't have any romantic feelings towards him, and should've just gone along with it?! It is incredibly deceitful-not to mention disingenous- to be someone's friend, only with the expectation that they'll date you eventually. He had a choice: he could've been honest from the get go and told her that he wanted to go out with her, but he didn't. I've had guys pull this crap with my friends and me,and it sucks, because you think the person is genuinely interested in you as a friend, only to find out that they have an ulterior motive. 9/10 times when you politely tell them that you're not interested romantically , they get angry and bugger off, and the friendship is over.
@Arthur Frayn my man the only person under this comment who sounds like a "dunce " is you. She never said she was a victim, and someone explained what the issue was in this relationship and you still react like that? Stop being So salty.
I love when , Tara Mooknee Jordan Theresa Tee noir Tiffanyferg Sarah Z Keep directing me to each other's channels Please suggest more feminist channels that deserve recognition.
A guy commented that the stretch marks on my chest were "beautiful as lightning" on a full bodied picture on fb. And then proceeded to DM me about how I shouldn't (tw: disordered eating) starve myself because I'm "a thicc goddess with thighs powerful enough to crush all men and their expectations of me" (about a post where I talked about my experience with eating disorders and the mental agony dysmorphia and dysphoria with a fairly large and curvy body brought) and that my skin looks "sweet as honey". Idk if the guy was a simp, a pick me dude or just a run of the mill cannibal with a taste for honeyed skin 🙄
That's interesting that you see "pick me" women as generally conservative. I have seen for most of my life girls that want to be "one of the boys" by drinking heavy, burping, playing video games, reading comics and so on. Not always conservative hobbies or behaviors
I dated a guy who did this. Turned out to be the most abusive partner I had had. He was the king of gaslighting, that's for sure. He also once actually complained to me "all my friends are lesbians who just want to use me for sex when they break up with girls!" It was one of the most disorienting relationships I had ever had. Luckily it was a long time ago.. but that should tell you that this is by no means a new phenomenon :-/
Yes! And irl who are the ones who get the blame? Not the pick me men but the women fighting for safe abortions. People really hate women and their rights that they’ll blame faux allies for a whole movement
Only one upped by the episode from the recent “Beavis & Butthead” revival where they actually go to an abortion CLINIC to get laid (not knowing what it is, just knowing the guy with a megaphone outside says there’s wh*res in there).
I think the woman who talked about 'wanting to be heard' was really cutting to the root of it. And whilst that's a problem for dudes too, it's more of a problem for women, so we get more Pick me girls than boys but the boys still exist.
What I got from that bit was that she was probably seen as "lesser than" by her father and brothers just for being a girl. People don't generally value the opinions of the people they see as inferior and don't want to listen to them as a result.
I know I'm late to the party but I'm just going to write a bit as a male cishet feminist. Your video is spot on. Especially with the last comment. I get enough shit from dudes who accuse me of doing it all to get laid. I really don't want to be accused by the feminists and women as well. Not that it would stop me from being a feminist but it would discourage me from speaking up when needed. I have enough anxiety in my life and it wouldn't be nice to have more introduced by the team I belong to. There's a lot of talk criticising male feminists and rightfully doubting their feminism while calling the behaviour and the group criticised as "male feminists". I get that the talk is always about a segment of male feminists that doesn't include me but I think using pick-me boys instead of the "male feminists" would be wonderful. Though I do understand it would be hard to introduce this concept and make it commonly used.
I used to say "I can't stand men who self proclaim as feminists" but for a while I couldn't quite put my finger on why... I knew I wanted a man who was a feminist, but my experience with men who said they were feminists openly and proudly was veeeeery sketchy... And yeah, basically, they were pick mes.
oh god! I have faced tons of these woke men. so there was this guy who seems a very woke person, goes to pride walk, and talks about all the philosophers all the time. And I was 18 and a freshman in the university and the man slid in my DMS...at first, he was discussing all Freud and stuff. Then suddenly he asked me for nudes. And I said no. And then he started gaslighting me into thinking that since I am a village girl since my upbringing is patriarchal thus i have these prejudices. Not sending nudes to men is a very non-feministic thing I was doing. And the guy was 28 and i was just 17 crossed 18...Jesus!! And this is just one example. Studying in one of the most famous "woke" universities in India opened a whole new door of pick me or " wokebois" in front of me. I can write a whole book about the samples I have faced. ugh!
Please do. I'm indian, that illogical manipulation is so unique to indian guys. One guy out of nowhere told his female friend he wanted to be compensated for his friendship with sex (can't remember his exact manipulative words). But the minute their parents or your guardians are around, they fully forgot their manipulative words because they know it only works when you get someone more vulnerable alone.
Yeah cis male philosophy and psychology students are definitely the worst xD him talking about freud is a huge red flag. Nobody takes freud seriously anymore. What a creep.
There's unfortunately gold star shaming in the bisexual community too, you're shamed as not being a real bisexual if you haven't dated both men and women.
I never experience this.... I only experinced it by homosexuell and straight people. But I heard from a bi guy whose grilfriend outed herself as bisexuell and he outed himself then too. She broke up with him, because bisexuell men always cheating. That really shocked me.... I feel really bad for people experience bad stuff in their own community. It should be a safe place.
There is a strong link to narcissism, I would say. If your behaviour is completely orientated on others approval and if they find you attractive, this can turn into narcissism pretty quickly. Calling internalised mysoginy out is important, but I would say that the pick-me-problem doesn’t just have a societal side but also a psychological that goes deeper than just “wanting to get laid”. Anyway, thanks for the interesting video!
As a nb gay "guy" person, I have been called a pick me boy by other men when I was in predominantly male spaces and they were saying degrading things about women and the women in my inner circle and I stood up for those women. I also think there is a moderate amount of misogyny rooted in calling feminine men a "pick me", there is already such a stigma surrounding fem guys already in our society that assuming they do it for attention doesn't particularly hold up if it is a constant thing they do. Also, a key feature of a pick me is trying to get it in with a woman, which seems like it could leave out a whole subset of gay men who seek validation from their female friends, but are really just misogynistic. I understand how it would be harder to make a distinction between the two if that were to be the case. However the difference between a true feminist and a pick me would be that the feminist believes in women's rights and respects women through their actions and the way the voice their feelings.
Well, you can't escape it, if males are nice they are call out of pick me, white nights, simp, can't win. Same when it comes to females, but they got call out when they are not nice to mysogonist men.
@@lishan4657 no it's because they're only trying to get in women's pants if they could just be without wanting to fuck every woman they see it wouldn't be as much of a problem no one has to be nice to shitty people
This is such a common thing, guys will call guys a pick me just for stating vague support of women. Making a milktoast comment like "who cares what she wears" is enough. Adding to calling feminine men pick mes there's also a flipside of guys who are labeled a pick me (like for being feminist) is also considered being less masculine, like not being misogynistic enough is somehow considered feminine.
I was worried that I was something of a “pick me” boy. Then I realized that “pick me” boys are hated so much because they’re only pretending to respect women so they can get laid. Me on the other hand, well… I’m way too honest with people if anything, and I don’t regret standing up for gender equality despite being a young adult who hasn’t gotten so much as a first kiss. Being a “male feminist” hasn’t ever gotten me a girlfriend, and though it would be nice if it did, I never really thought it would. I guess the difference is that I’m not pretending, and the fact that I also happen to want a girlfriend but I don’t know how to get one had me pretty confused.
I've totally experienced this, but had never been able to put a label on it before. I was friends with this guy, and we would talk about feminism and slut shaming from time to time. Eventually we went on a couple dates, but something felt wiggy. When I told him we were better off friends he said something like "I told my friends I had it (as in sex with me) in the bag, what happened?" It became QUITE clear very quickly that he didnt actually have any respect for women.
I used to be a pick me/nlog back when we didn't have that language. I was referred to as "the token girl" of the friend group. I would get intensely jealous when male attention went towards a different girl because "I worked so damn hard to prove myself." It took me until college to learn the error of my ways. I had a female frenemy who was also trying to be the token girl. I was the "bitchy" trope in men's eyes and she was the "cutesy" one so we clashed hard. Which meant at a party one day, they were infantilizing her super hard and she had been putting up with that bs her whole life. I was like, "no, she can make her own choices. Eff off. Hey, let's ditch this shithole and have our own party." Suddenly, we were super close friends, never gave those guys the time of day, and created our own friend group that didn't tokenize people even though it was diverse. It wasn't intentional, but it was basically a group of "misfits" that have had to try to hard their whole lives and suddenly felt like we could breathe and let our hair down. It was so damn freeing. That's why I try not to judge these people so hard because they're probably just lashing out and lashing out back does nothing to help
As a rather conventional, straight, cis girl, masculinity is hot. K? But the definition of masculinity I'm talking about is chivalrous and respectful. The definition of traditional masculinity is providing and protecting. Not dominance behavior, superiority, etc. Genuine, healthy masculinity is hot.
@@theliberation9061 look at you. Going around this comment section putting words in other people's mouths and you're convinced that it's women's fault you're like this. Have you ever listened to or cared about a person who is not yourself even once in your miserable life? Pathetic.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with those preferences, all I want in general and as someone who's into other types of men is that it shouldn't be the ideal or even standard. I want people like this to specify their type or whatever the same way I have to for people not to assume that I'm into this for example just by being a woman into men etc.
@@TheKh65 I think op meant do they still hold up those same feminist beliefs around other men, when it can't be used for their own personal gain with women?
@@videoupload6898 nope, I think the op meant if those pick me boys disrespect Men for no reason, but only respect women that way the pick me guy can use the women for personal gain
500 Days of Summer is a good example of "pick me cuz I'm a nice guy" and then he got angry when she didn't want a future with him, and got married and had kids with someone else as if she owed him something for being a nice guy
As a Latina I really appreciate the comment about fetishization b/c I've had so many guys just outwardly tell me they want me b/c I'm latina and genuinely think that we're thankful and that's something we want to hear! It's so uncomfortable and I wish it was more widely known that it's not ok to say things like that and it isn't a compliment b/c being stereotyped is not anything anyone wants to experience
Fr. I’ve seen ads about sex, specifically indicating their race. Most of times its latina too. Disgusting. Absolutely disgusting. Its just a fetish, and telling someone you like them because of their skin/ethnicity is creepy and gross.
White men branding literally any other woman of culture as “exotic” makes my skin CRAWL. Absolute biggest red flag. I’m white and that shit even scares the hell out of me.
It's absolutely okay to say things like that. It's really amazing to me how young people have completely abandoned the concept of free speech. It's weird because when I was younger, we were all about free spech. I don't understand why the young adults of today are so emotionally fragile. If someone wants to say that he is attracted to hispanic women it's not up to you to tell him it's not okay. If you don't like it that's your problem, not his.
@@patrickbarnes9874 Ok. They have their free speech to say that disgusting and creepy bs (why do people always pull that card when they say this shit?). So women don't have free speech? So they must just tolerate these disgusting comments? Because they are critisizing these comments that those men make. Or do you think that just men are allowed to have free speech? Free speech comes with consequences, you know. And it is free speech to criticize what these men have said. You cant just claim that women can't say anything when they make these comments cause that's nOt FrEe sPeECh bEcAuSe I sAy sO.
The ‘pick me’ ideology is not exclusive to heterosexuals on the basis that a ‘pick me’ seeks approval from a certain group. Under this criteria we can assume anybody can be a ‘pick me’, regardless of race, gender or sexual orientation. Most likely, being a ‘pick me’ stems from a need to please and feel important and special- to individualise oneself from the majority due to insecurities or being brought up in a demeaning environment, or being introduced to one at an early age. We live in an era where being ‘normal’ and not individual is bad, but being too out there and different is also bad. It’s a literal breeding ground for pick me’s, not to mention the constant change in radicalised belief systems and how we are viewing the world. People crave acceptance and tolerance, some go to extremes to gain this (such as ‘pick me’s’ do). Therefore we can conclusively state that being a ‘pick me’ is not exclusive to heterosexuality. Honestly, ‘pick me’ can be used as an umbrella term to envelop all different kind of pandering behaviour (gold star lesbians, battleax bi’s, nlogs, neckbeards and nice guys). It’s like a 50p picknmix, you never know what you’re going to get.
My ex boyfriend pretended to be a liberal for YEARS when he was actually quite conservative so I would continue to be with him. I’ve never thought of it in terms of pick-me.
I feel like a key difference between a "nice guy" and a "pick me" is that usually the "nice guy" is actually outwardly misogynist, while a "pick me" markets himself as a feminist. there seems to be some gray area between "pick me boys" and "sad boys"
My favourite is the nice guys, that pretend to be your friend for years. Yet constantly tell you to leave any girl/guy you are with and berate your partners. Then send you depressed messages at 3am saying they are going to be alone forever. I’m over 30. These men don’t change...
I’ve seen some cases about it and it’s always very sad, men talk about how women are always friend zoning them, but get angry if you consider them friends and _dare_ to have romantic relationships with other people, even if they haven’t expressed liking you to begin with. The betrayal of realizing a guy wasn’t friends with you because you enjoyed each other’s personality, but because he thought he had a “chance” with you if he was nice for a while
@Heh the mental gymnastics that go on in people's brains like yours. all I hear are excuses and justification for bad behavior. "being used"? what do you think you're doing if you consider yourself "in the friendzone" and not just being in a genuine friendship. what are your motives, if not disingenuous themselves? what standing do you have to call them who just want to be friends with you, "being used". I cannot fathom why one would put themselves in either of those situations. I would not want to be friends with someone who thought like you (if I was a woman) nor would I want to put myself in a situation where I pine over someone in which they've never expressed interest. either spend less than 3 months with a crush and getting to know someone and move on if it isn't reciprocated (for your own well-being) or have a genuine friendship with someone of the opposite sex. and sometimes these things do turn into something more given the right timing and person too but live your life and if you can't, you need to move on. still these are exceptions to the rule. we as humans already have a hard time moving on from people we actually have real romantic relationships with, we don't need that with things that never were.
Why the fuck are you people friends with these people then? If it is so blatantly black and white as you describe, then why do you enable these people? You even say you're over 30 and that these men never change, that seems pretty ironic coming from someone who keeps inviting these destructive people into their own life. Maybe start making use of the life experience you've got?
Moral of the story: Date people normally, and don't be desperate, no matter who you are. (Edit: Pick me boys/girls aren't bad people, they're just the result of pent up emotions of loneliness not being treated. So if you see it happen, try de-escalating the situation and helping them. Due to the replies, I thought I'd add this.)
The NLOG phenomena stems, often times, from insecurity and low self esteem. It had just been weirdly redirected as a superiority complex ("I'm not like those other girls who put makeup on just to take selfies ...) in order to hide or feel better about not conforming to this idealized feminity. I believe that this is TRUE NLOG behaviour. Now, those that put temselves down and stop at that is just insecurity, and if they were to use that insecurity in order to gathe sympathy is just emotional manipulation.
@@ededetudo2879 THIS. I grew up being bullied for my appearance by (mostly) females and males and still suffer from low self-esteem. I accepted it and confidently say I'm ugly - does that make me Not Like Other Girls? I swear people make up labels for literally EVERY. SINGLE. THING.
@@Elliecham i think being like "hey I'm ugly, but that's fine", there's nothing wrong with that! What would make it an NLOG is "_sigh_ I'm ugly, unlike all these other girls who are caked full of makeup and fake"
Fr tho. Last night this dude asked me what my boundaries were so he didn't ask any questions that would make me uncomfortable. I said I didn't care as long as they weren't sexual. Literally every question he asked was sexual
Haha, once this guy asked me if I wanted to go on a date with him and I told him that I wanted to hang out with him again but I didn't feel like I knew him well enough to go on a date with him yet. He said that he completely understood and I though "great, we're on the same page." Then a couple days later he sent me a picture of himself naked in the shower 🤔🤔🤔
Because they're hoping that you'll feel bad for them. I'm glad there is a term for this now because I knew several in college. It put me off because I'm not interested in someone without self confidence.
I’m a trans guy and i have always automatically leaned towards being friends with guys, so in elementary and middle school, before i came out, i was a huge pick-me “girl” because i was desperate for male aprovak cause i wanted to be “one of the boys”
I've been watching for a while and I still haven't seen a cow. I'm beginning to think that cows might not actually produce these videos. I'll continue to suspiciously watch
Example of pick me boy: "dude, you should learn about what makes your girl happy, or she will end up with me instead. A real man cooks, cleans and says yes to everything she says and treats her like the princess she is. You're not a real man." Example of a normal human being who happens to be a guy (my boyfriend in this case) : "yeah, I actually do most of the chores at home because she works more than I do and earns more. This is my way of supporting her." - context: people are always saying he shouldn't do those things because he is not my maid. He gets PISSED.
He needs to work more. He is being a mooch. He is a boy in a boy’s society and mooching off of you. Males get paid more for the same job and promoted more and get more raises so he needs to work more.
Are "pick me boys" not the lads that will do the bare minimum and point it out for brownie points? (Treated you like a human! 🙊🙊🙊 Cleaned up after myself! 💀💀😝) Am I doing it right? Haha
Yes, they set the bar really low by saying they are worthless and no good, then feel like doing something completely minimal for being a decent person is an accomplishment. They do it to manipulate women.
@@jessn.3851 hot take but it is almost like pick me boys and pick me girls are people who never emotionally grew past trying to impress their parents levels of expressing love.
@@claryfey They obviously have some kind of hunger for love but do not love themselves. I think that's a common problem but many people will attempt to learn to love themselves instead of putting pressure on someone else. Pick me girls have an attitude that if they just do enough, another person will love them, but that is not how it works. You cannot make someone reciprocate. We should be teaching young girls to fulfill their own needs, that way they will be happy and not look for love in the wrong places and end up with disappointment. That's codependency. I'm glad I knew about pick me guys long before they had a name. I don't like them because I prefer people with self esteem and I can't stand so much negativity. It's exhausting to be around anyone who put themselves down. They know they are not living up to their own standards but are unwilling to do anything about it. If they worked on their own happiness they would become the kind of guy that girls like and feel comfortable around without the manipulation. I think a lot of young people are shown through media that love is the most important thing, but they think it is love from other people, when it is really love for themselves that will solve the issue.
When I was a young teen entering college, the pursuit of pleasing and being a more attractive person/man to women caused me to self reflect and really consider the toxic traits I (and seemingly other young men may have) had. Which ended with me genuinely becoming a better man for myself, where I kinda forgot that I even started to change because of my pursuit of women in the first place. So in a way being or nearly becoming a pick me, nice guy, soft incel, whatever made me self-reflect and just be a better person. Since I nearly was/ was one of those guys years ago, it’s very obvious when I meet another man who is still stuck in that. I’m so glad I grew from it.
@@afroninjahd3778 I would recommend just keeping an open mind and ears to perspectives that may not naturally (instinctually) align with your own. You may not find much you agree with at times, but you will start to find bits and pieces from those differing perspectives that could add to your sense of self and well-being. I hope that helps!
@FilthyDankWastemanFabuless you're right, when we have the chance to change we either double down on what we know or we let go and change. I'm glad that I was able to grow as well, I think having my thoughts challenged and discussed with others (and with myself) helped for sure. I am lucky, and I'm self-aware enough to say that lol :)
Mini story about feminism growing up: I remember in 10th grade we were asked to define feminism to ourselves in English class. I gave a pretty normal one about how it's about helping women achieve equality except I added in a part explaining how much it matters to take it seriously in other countries where little girls can't go to school or be themselves properly without struggle. A guy behind me said "Nobody say nothin after that" I know he was talking about the one hyper conservative kid behind me but it still bothers me that there might have been someone who honestly disagreed with me that feminism is important when we were all children. Then I started meeting people who were girls or women like me but would sneer at the word feminism. It makes you feel strange when the people around you who you respect like a close friend or your peers don't agree with you about something that you're so sure is correct. I honestly started to retract the ways I felt about feminism around certain people. I've stopped doing that but the feeling of "Am I just overly enthused? Am I being too SJW?"... It lingers in you.
I've never been able to relate harder. I was friends with toxic people and I struggle now with the fact I used to distance myself from equality because of who I was around. Once the friendship ended and I cut ties with them it was almost immediately that I felt comfortable again to be a feminist, but that feeling definitely lingers
just remember that whenever women, or any minority group for that matter, speaks up/ stands up for themselves, society will call us an sjw or smthn just to put us down. please dont listen to them, they cannot silence us, not now, not ever
I have friends who also don't understand what feminism is (and many other good -isms), and they have some questionable takes on these topics because they can't be bothered to educate themselves, so instead of telling them that I'm a feminist, I try to patiently steer them in the right direction. I drop links, avoid confrontation, and guide them towards developing better takes.
I'm so glad you mentioned the queer community because there's a lot of instances among trans folks which i would consider to be pick-me behavior (although it isn't necessarily romantic). there's a certain flavor of trans person, such as, say, blaire white or kalvin garrah, who push a narrative of the trans experience that's meant to make cis people comfortable. they do this by asserting that all trans people are gender-conforming, heavily dysphoric, etc, and throwing gnc trans and nonbinary people like me under the bus. It's like they're saying "look at this person! they're not a real trans person like me! people like this are why cis people hate us and don't take us seriously :(" they definitely remind me of pick-mes.
you know, sometimes i get scared of falling in the trap of being a "pick me boy", when that fear comes over me i ask myself "would i still be doing what i'm doing if there was no female or male friends watching to make me feel validated?" if the answer is yes i keep doing it, if the answer is no i stop it immediately
I feel like any guy who unironically uses terms like "alpha, sigma, beta males" come under a subsection of the pick me guys...trying to put down others, and being the absolute picture of "masculinity"
Hi! You used one of my insanely unpopular TikToks in this video ("Here's an idea: instead of making fun of pick me girls, why don't we just make fun of men?"). The idea for that TikTok originated for me in the understanding that "pick me" girls are a product of what the patriarchy expects from women-- not only taking on traditional femininity in society, but also being excited and delighted to do so. My original point was that instead of making fun of women who take on this trope to be attractive to men, we should be discussing how and why men portray their ideal woman in this way. Obviously I didn't actually include any of this nuance because I was hoping to gain more traction (I have virtually no TikTok followers; not sure how you even found this TikTok!) but wanted to share my though process behind it!
I used to hate hearing from emotionally manipulative people but now I kind of like it “It’s ok, I’m used to rejection” “That’s good, we should all feel comfortable with it” “I ruin everything” “It’s great that you’re so self-aware”
Omg i needed that like 3 months ago when i was dealing with a serious nice guy that i rejected He'd go between agressive and then "i am so sorry, I always ruin things, i had a bad cloud over my head" I just didn't know how to act with someone who had the same age as me but acting like a toddler
Honestly, a lot of the talking points I’m hearing about pick me boys sound just like the rhetoric coming from the “anti-sjw” community. “He’s just saying that to get into women’s pants” is a common ad hominem attack on anything a male feminist ever says, used in an effort to invalidate the argument without actually engaging with it or attempting to refute it. Now, as a gay man, I am not actually very familiar with women’s dating lives, so the disingenuous feminist man could be more common than I am aware. However, whenever I’ve seen this archetype being referenced, it was almost exclusively from reactionaries attempting to invalidate the genuine beliefs of male feminists.
That's a dangerous way to look at it. I don't know if you spend a lot of time in Leftist circles, but it's actually an issue that has been a fairly big one for a while. A lot of Liberal men ARE exactly the disingenuous creeps that the reactionaries say they are. Reactionaries may apply the judgement too liberally (pun intended) but they are not at all wrong that there's a problem. Which is why we need feminist men to actively call out other men for using feminist talking points to creep on women. It's the tribalistic nature of saying "reactionaries say it so it's probably fake" that allows the creepers to smokescreen themselves and gaslight their victims into silence. Edit: By Liberal I mean the Trudeau's and Clinton's of the world, I am of course a leftist.
@@Jane-oz7pp That’s fair. As I said, I don’t really know about women’s dating lives, but I’m definitely more than familiar with the common reactionary trope. It’s frankly very sad & disgusting that men like this do exist, & it also definitely hurts our causes. I’ve even had the accusation thrown at me from reactionaries with whom I was arguing before promptly smacking my face & informing them of my gayness. I suppose it’s definitely necessary to both call out the faux-feminist man trying to pick up women, whilst simultaneously asserting that, no, this is not something that automatically applies to feminist men.
@@matthewodonnell6906 100% The absolute hardest part about advocating for social justice is that you're fighting a war on both sides, effectively. On the one hand, we HAVE to hold "our side" accountable when we mess up/call out toxicity in our own communities, but we also have to ensure the reactionaries don't use that to imply that the movement itself is toxic. It's not an easy balance to strike but I think we've been making some good progress lately. It's the main reason that it's the responsibility of male voices to tell their listeners to listen to female voices as well, because that lived experience can be really hard to see from the outside. I hope my tone hasn't come across as lecturing, btw, just my thoughts from where I sit. :)
@@flowergirl5962 I never said it wasn’t a real thing. Again, we should condemn any disingenuous faux-feminist men trying to just pick up women, but it’s worth keeping in mind that this is a common trope in reactionary rhetoric used as an ad hominem attack to try to discredit any feminist opinions men hold without actually engaging with those ideas. There’s a balance where we say, “yes, this is a problem, but this is not automatically any hetero/bi man with feminist beliefs.” Hitting this nuance is precisely why I stated that, as a gay man, I’m not very familiar with women’s dating lives and this very well could be far more common than I would personally know.
I HAVE had an experience with a pick me guy and it was traumatizing. One time at a party a guy started following me around calling me a "goddess," asking why I didn't see myself as he saw me, and explaining how women are mistreated by men, blah blah blah. It was annoying at first because I could tell it was just an awkward approach to flirting, but he was so persistent and odd that it freaked me out so much I left the party. I had been drinking, so I was only intending to go to my car to sit and get away. BUT THIS GUY FOLLOWS ME OUT OF THE PARTY and towards my car because he "wants to make sure I'm okay," all while I start walking faster and explaining how I just want to be alone. I had to drive away while drunk because he refused to leave me alone (I ended up just driving out of sight and parking, but this man almost had me drunk driving to escape him). Horrifying experience.
In Brazil, we call the pick me boys “esquerdomacho” a mix of “left male”, because feminism in BR is really related to the left wing. But the main point is, Brazilian pick me boys use feminism as a way to look sensitive and “nicer”, however are usually the most abusive ones.
5:30 this happens with a lot of memes targeted at women. "Karens" exist as a woman who uses her privilege (usually white privilege) against other people (like calling the police on black people for no reason). It's a valid argument that came from the black community. But it's gotten out of hand and now every woman is a Karen. Its very annoying cause it gets in the way of the actual conversation we should be having about white privilege
For real. I see memes like guys vs girls, fitness memes centered around certain members of the FA community, etc. A lot of them seem to be "For the bros". I agree that the whole "date me or you're fatphobic" argument is bad, people have their preferences. The variants of those memes I see bash women.
In Spain we use "aliade", which would be the gender neutral way of saying "ally", instead of the masculine "aliado" or the feminine "aliada". I'm not sure I really like it, I've never seen a "pick me boy" falsely claiming to be nonbinary to sleep with women. I've seen guys like this claiming to be "aliados feministas" (feminist allies), so I get what the term is trying to convey, but I still think that making it nonbinary is weird, it's like combining "pick me boys" with "transtrenders" lol
I actually think "feministos" would work pretty well in Spanish too, we should import it from Brazil lmao much better than "aliades". It's like making the word "feministas" (which at least in Spanish is completely gender neutral, idk about Portuguese) masculine, love that!
I've said this before with "problematic". The word doesn't make sense when applying it as a characteristic of a dynamic target, like a person. When you do, it implies that nothing the person ever does will make them acceptable, save being a martyr, and even then not so much.
This happens so much with the goth/alternative scene too. Guys try to act like they care and are open minded but it's really just fetishization yet again.
I agree so much. Men who say any alternative fashion that they can't fetishize is dumb. They looove conventionally attractive goth women with very specific makeup and body shapes. But that's it lol
I mean do pick me enbys exist? I think nbs already know not to try to gain aproval from conservatives Idk as someone that considers themselves nonbinary thats how i feel
@@mateo4508 same, i think after being invalidated for so long because "nonono you have to be only a boy or a girl!1!!1!" we just learned to either fend for ourselves or help eachother out. I've never seen a pick-me-enby, but I have seen a lot of problematic nbs. Eh, well not everyone's perfect. You're right. Craving validation from crusty old people on Twitter who actively put you down is just stupid.
@@mateo4508 I think they might exist in 10 years or so. What tends to happen is the left gains ground on human rights, The right then engage in tokenism for the emancipated group, Pick-mes are created as a result. This has happened w/women, poc, homosexuals and transfolk for the past 150 years and it wouldn’t surprise me if enbys are next.
I don’t really think the Gold Star lesbian stuff is pick-me behavior, but it seems to be a way to gatekeep the lesbian community, especially in the more extreme examples where anyone who used to date men can’t be a lesbian. It’s rooted in my opinion in the expectation of women to be heterosexual, and often times perpetuated by women who feel upset that they never had the privilege of appearing straight to others. I don’t really think it’s a pick-me thing, but I don’t really know.
"Women just aren't as sexual as men" 🤢 No honey, you're just so unappealing they want nothing or as little as possible to do with you. I swear both genders are just as sexual as each other, it's just that women are shamed for it, hated for it, murdered for it, even just expressing it we're shunned. The guy who said that sounds like a creep.
That's because women are taught to be ashamed of being sexual unless it is with their husband. A lot of insults towards women have to do with sex, for example, whore, slut, thot, bimbo. Even the simplest things like wearing clothes that show a little stomach or cleavage can get you called a slut by men and women. It is taught as something that is "bad". In media their is a lot of fixation and fetishization on a girl's virginity like in "Fifty shades of grey" where Christian Grey focused a lot on Anna's virginity and being untouched like it was some great thing. If you are shamed your whole life for being even a little sexual obviously you will repress it.
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Hi! 🐄
Here's the article I showed on Clinton: www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/24/hillary-clinton-feminist-icon-jessa-crispin
And the article on Harris: www.them.us/story/kamala-harriss-record-on-trans-and-sex-work-issues
i love that margret thatcher "girl power" clip so much. i wonder if there's some sort of power dynamic there. girl boss "feminists" like to prop up women in power like Clinton or Harris, even if they use their power to actively infringe on the rights of of other, less powerful women (Bill's sexual assault survivors or trans women in prison). love the content you and the cow have been putting out recently queen.
You look a bit like Mary Crawley
haha na I just live on google
I liked that video, but I do have some different opinions. There isn’t Justice in starting to make fun of another sex because, you are making fun of your own too much. Also having that mentality looks spiteful and gives me the impression that it’s gonna be more bullying than jokes. You should just.. Uk make fun of something because it’s funny and not because there isn’t a balance in how many people ur making fun off. I do also think that misogyny in men gets called out a lot. Even when women are misogynistic it’s argued because of men too.
@@danielolarte3693 I agree with most of your points, but internalized misogyny is actually because of men.
Trying to follow the difference between "SIMP" , "nice guy", and "pick me" reminds me of trying to learn the difference between irony, sarcasm, and satire.
none of this matters, like AT ALL
I still don't understand the difference between those three.
@@pagolainaki7175
Sarcasm (Greek for "speak maliciously"): saying the exact opposite of what you mean, e.g. letting someone know they're being a bore by saying "Veeery interesting, please tell me more." Unlike irony, sarcasm is supposed to convey scorn/disdain.
Irony A: when the reality of a situation is contrary to the ideal in a kind of amusing way, e.g. student A tutors student B and then A ends up receiving a worse grade.
Irony B (greek for "simulated ignorance"): Basically my definition of sarcasm but more on the humorous side, less contemptuous. E.g. a household appliance breaks after a long week and you have to repair it: "Great, I've been having too much fun this week anyway."
Satire: imitating or illustrating someone's flaws in a mocking way. The flaw here is usually universally recognized as a moral shortcoming, so mocking someone's appearance alone is not satire, but mocking their greed can be.
Imo just pick whatever flows the best in the sentence you're making
And then there’s also incels
i feel like "pick me boy" is exemplified by that guy on tiktok who makes having tampons in his house his whole personality
Oh my god I JUST saw that today!
The comments were split between "all men should do this" and "if I was at your house, I'd think you were a player" 😂
@@spectre9340 honestly i'd be fine with it if it was one tiktok but it was his whole feed lmao
Y'all are gonna have to link this bullshit so I can revel in my dying braincells
@@ashikjaman1940 PLEASE
oh god, I've seen at least 3 guys posting about this and in my opinion it would be fine if it was a thing they did off camera without having to post it.. but they do it for the the tiktok and the attention and bc they saw other guys doing it.
People ask "where _is_ the cow?" - not " _how_ is the cow?"
When is the cow?
I'll give you a better one "why is the cow?"
@@dwaynedouglasb What _is_ a cow?
(metaphysically)
cow?
How now brown cow?
"Avoiding criticizing other women because they're women is an example of toxic girl power feminism" literally so spot on
ngl i notice that i do this sometimes, it’s not even on purpose it’s more subconscious but almost every time i do this i realize it, so i try to reanalyze the situation and see if i’m really being lenient with the woman. so yea i’m figuring it out
Very agree. It's such an annoying topic too, because you gotta know in your heart that there's a bunch of misogynists who are gonna harass any and all women by default regardless of if they're right or wrong, so it can feel like dogpiling to add to if a woman is legitimately shitty. But also (and I'd argue, at a similar rate to men, at least in terms of public figures and politicians), sometimes individual women are just shitty people who do actually deserve to be thrown off the stage for being shitty.
Yet the defense many such women will use for their own shittiness is an appeal to how oppressed they are for being a woman: that misogynists hating them is proof that they're in the right. That their real victimhood gives them the right to victimize others. And so the argument goes round and round.
Idk I could ramble about this for ages, but I'm really tired of real good faith feminism being co-opted by this nonsense. We really have to learn how to call a spade a spade regardless of their gender or skin tone or whatever. Like holy shit it's not feminist to elect Mussolini's fascist grand-daughter, I fucking promise yall it's just not.
True
@@seanbrodney7716beautifully said! Thank you! Couldn't agree more with you.
@@seanbrodney7716i hear this all the times : i saw the conversation going from "male loneliness epidemic" to "that is bs male and female are both lonely , it's your fault (we don't care about it)" To "the female lonelyness epidemic"
Same when you talk about men being the primary victims of violence or getting imprisoned ,
You have a white liberal feminist going "nah that's bs, women have to fear getting murdered every day"
And then you can talk about how you've been beaten up , how you got your head pushed under water at the pool , how you've been pinned to the ground and got farted on your face ,
How a girl followed your nephew in the bathroom and slammed the door on his fingers , and that girl got treated with the softest gloves imaginable ...
But it doesn't matter : you're making all of it up for simpaty ,
And if you don't think women have it worse in every regard then you're part of the problem ...
I feel like those male feminists who turn out to be sexual predators fit into this category
The problem is that still only criticizes men who hurt women in some way. What about men who put down other men in order to suck up to women, but don't hurt women in any way. They are still wrong for putting down other men.
@@greywolf7577 aren't these the same men though? , a pick me guy is the person who puts down men and trys to win female attention, AND also hurts women in the process
I feel like the Netflix show Grand Army has some great examples of pick me boys
@@blueuser9815 fucking TIM 😡
@Izzy Izzy I'd say women pick me's put down other for not following a feminine ideal to make themselves more attractive. So pick me men would probably put down men who are hypermasculine for the same reasons. Eg. Pointing out they're a feminist or "in touch with their feminine side" and not like other guys who are misogynist, while still being misogynistic themselves, to make themselves more attractive
My own father does some of that “[NAME] I am the most feminist person you’ll ever meet” as a response to me calling him out for blaming my period on all my emotions without considering the actual cause of my emotions:)
I had an ex boyfriend like this. It’s so frustrating!!
so performative bs.
Fr, they use feminism as a defence not as something they actually believe in and want to fight for.
My mum does this. It sucks a lot.
@@bycarolinakobayashi Bro same, you would think being having their own menstrual cycle would change that but- :))
the fedora really makes the whole thumbnail
EGG
She do be lookin' kinda dapper 😳😳
ATHEISM FOREVER!!
I think that's a porkpie
A massive pick-me boy statement: “I apologise for my gender”. 🙄
reminds me of Harry styles.
@@userhehe2991 lol
@@userhehe2991 did he really say that
Yeah this one ticks me off because I recognise it as something I used to do before I came out as trans. Turns out I wasn't sorry for 'my gender' - I just didn't identify with it and felt alienised within male social cycles. And it also does a terrible thing in demeaning men who aren't problematic, who are genuinely nice people who work hard at making the world a better place, and also minimalizes the awful things some men do as being "not in their control because of how they were born". Its nonsense and I'm glad I shifted away from it.
Yeah....
I keep hearing “Pygmy boy”, I can’t stop seeing small people in my mind’s eye. I have added nothing to this conversation, but I have added nonetheless.
You've added a smile to my face.
I know, right? The first time I heard T. talk about pick me girls in an unrelated video I kept hearing "pygmy girls".
LOL
Oh ffs! I shouldn't have gone comments before watching. Now the entire video is about pygmys!
@@minimalphilia now you shall see the world as I do
What do you call a gay guy who is mysoginistic but because he's feminine he gets a pass for constantly body shaming women among other horrible traits that are branded as cute because a cis gay man is doing it
You call him a misogynist.
i just.. call those "Those Cis Gay Guys tm" FHDJG!!
I do understand that these same gay men are an easy target for anyone who has been looking for some excuse to give gay men a hard time
Those are the "every gay character in bad tv shows" guys 😂😂
@@blankabontovics7063 the cis gay guy that cishet girls fetishize n want to be their sassy gay best friend but in reality they are not Sassy they are just ... mean but get away w. it
I think you could have socially conservative pick me men who say things like “I just want to take care of and protect my Queen who raises my kids and takes care of our home” when really he doesn’t respect women making any other choice than staying at home.
That's just a simp innit
Lol omg yes. Everytime I hear some turd utter that or similar in my presence I say, you're saying princess/queen/goddess but what you actually mean is someone dumb enough to clean your house and warm your bed for free.
@@mikey6467 he's not a simp, he's judt pretending he's that nice to his wige who doesn't experience it at all, so he can put himself on a pedestal where he can't be criticized while actively trying to take away rights from women.
This topic is pick me boys, not nice guys/simps.
@@maheenm.k1015 Agreed, simps are completely different. The most widely known definition represents redditors/incels who spend millions of dollars on their twitch waifu just so they could read their $3 donation. There may be others, but this is just the one I know most.
Infact, I was called a "simp" once just for saying "I respect women".
Pick me boys think that sexualising/being attracted to "unconventional" looking women is the same as respecting women
And that those women should be thankful and throw themselves at said men's feet.
YES
@@360shadowmoon what an enthusiastic response
I'm not like other boys, I like real women with curves not those popular starved skeleton models 🥴🤪
I used to know a dude who thought it was feminist to like (fetishize) fat girls. He bragged about how he gaslit a girl into giving up on losing weight by telling her he didn't see any difference in her figure after all her efforts. When I called him out on his toxic behaviour he said I was wrong, because telling women to lose weight = bad, and he was doing the opposite, and that = good.
Eyeahhhh... He didn't get the memo I guess lol.
mmmm.. um...
it's understandable but y'know... he was tryin to help but it sounded REALLY passive aggresive. why can't people word things differently?
@@JuguAbus except he wasn't trying to help :p he was trying to get her to stay fat when she wanted to lose weight because HE preferred it that way..
@@UltraMarineBlue I'm surprised I didn't catch that lol.😅It makes sense now
Oh my god this made me remember a youtube clip I watched(I think it was from a tlc show) and this dude constantly cooks for his gf, I thought it was weird cause he doesn't even eat it only his gf(he also looks quite fit while his gf is obese). Some of the comments said that the reason he does that is he thinks his gf will leave him so he gets her fat so she'd stay with him, it was kind of messed up now that I remember it
I once went on a date with a “feminist” guy and after I rejected him he went around telling my friends he’d been turned off by me “ordering for him” (which didn’t happen)
I-
Jfc nothing pisses me off more than someone spreading rumors about others
Rumours are so annoying. I broke up with a guy once because I found photos of another girl on his phone and he told everyone I left him for watching porn. Trust me, these weren't porn photos.
😐
My abusive boyfriend told everyone I was abusive and that I'd hit him and everyone thought I was a monster in class pretending to be a victim. He had a lot of friends and I had one best friend. Everyone believed him. I was so thankful for the virus so I didn't have to go to school and see them anymore.
I hate when a guy brags about knowing how to cook or clean. Cringeeeeee . You should know that being a human adult.
Last TWO times I met men who claimed to be "into cooking," they genuinely did not know the functional difference between salted and unsalted butter. Like...bro. It's self explanatory.
I'm generally disapointed by the amount of adults not just men who can't cook or think cooking is adding tomato sauce to pasta.
@@colleenroberts8202 Stupid question - But what's the functional difference between those two besides ... one is salted and one isn't?
You mean in regards of cooking? Like in which recipes you can use salted Butter (Soups for an example - So full blown "savory" Stuff) and in which you shouldn't?
@@DaroriDerEinzige There's very little reason to ever use presalted butter, unless you are following a recipe that explicitly calls for it or because you like it that way on toast. When cooking or baking, use unsalted. You can always add salt. You can't really take it out once it's dissolved.
@@colleenroberts8202 So that's the functional difference?
I kinda imagined something more ... exciting tbh ...
These "nice" guys, when you say no to them, they become this "toxic sadboi" ugh 😩✋ stop it .
"toxic sadboi" is my new favourite term
Ikr, and the fact that some of them would think that them being a “toxic and ig you could say m@nipulative sadboi” makes them look cool is just. 😃🖐
@@BarbarianGod it’s quite become a meme, with various bart edits 😭
They have something wrong with their noggins🤠
Oh wow. Your profile picture I love it !!!
"be a feminist bc you want equality NOT sex" i want this in my t-shirt NOOWWW
No you should no
Equality will increase and improve sex though so i wouldn't use it to manipulate a woman but as a society more and better sex is a good reason to be a feminist.
@@amyshoemaker8430 ?
@@sakurasfish2115 you know that's not the point they were making
@@mahi93162 true but still 😂
Kurtis Connor is the perfect example of a man respecting women and men and being overall a great man and he is what pick hes wished they could be.
Omg he is!! He drinks deeply from the fountain of respect woman juice!
@@Rhamburgers_420 ikr!! And he is also against toxic masculinity. Honestly an icon and I'm so happy I stumbled upon his videos
@@mir_ka8950 Isn't he the guy who said that men are trash?
@@playboyx1114 idk in which video?
@@mir_ka8950 In the video that's titled "Are Men Really Trash"?
"Be a feminist cuz you want equality- NOT sex." YESSS
What about both of them, may I ask
@@jøy_what_riley_loves_the_mostyour desire for sex should be completely separate from your support of feminism
Nahhh this year everyone’s getting called out nobody’s safe. Not even the men😎
Especially not the men 😤
Literally no ones safe I kinda like it tho lol
As it should be.
Ahh yes everyone will get called out
Tell em coconut head
Guys, I'm kind of thinking we will never see the cow :(
Pick cow, choose cow, love cow
Cow is love, cow is bae, cow is life
Live, laugh, love (cow)
I LOVE how "pedantic" you are. For me, you're actually just careful about being accurate, not afraid of explaining a thing properly, and trust your audience's attention span. Love your channel.
I've been on so many dates where the dude has been a performative feminist: talked about women's issues, bemoaned the inequality that women face, claimed to care about intersectionality, and then at some point he mentions a woman (a famous woman or a woman from a personal anecdote he's telling) whom he isn't attracted to and all of that performative respect vanishes. Suddenly he can't hide his disgust and is cautiously enjoying ridiculing and/or mocking the woman, using flimsy excuses as justification for calling her names. Always a dealbreaker. I feel like so many men think only respecting women they're attracted to is what "feminism" is (and if respect is predicated on whether or not you're attracted to me, it is NOT respect lol).
YES I totally understand. And when it comes to accepting their partner or even just accepting women's self-expression in general, they are only fine with it when they find it sexy. Bisexuality is okay because they fetishize lesbian sex, but leg hair is not because that's such a turn off. It's not real acceptance because everything is still judged through the lens of male sexual approval..
@@elsie384 I knew a guy like that but he would do it with racism. He was also misogynistic, transphobic, and homophobic. I would not be surprised if he was bigoted in other ways, but he would swear up and down he was "fighting against bigotry" 🥴🙄. Also relates to 12:05
The amount of guys that respected me, constantly talked to me saying I'm one of their best friends until I made it clear I wasn't sexually attracted to them and just dropped me is just too big-
Nobody care about yoyr bs and you also.
@@Koozomec OK
“this is a very heterosexual conversation”😂
And "american"
Sex Ed classes be like 😂😂
I have thought this thought during many a conversation 😂
@@avril6922, you have my name. Nice to meet another Avril. That’s it. That’s all I wanted to say.
Ikr 😅
This guy I dated once told me a woman flirted with him very heavily, but later wasn’t sure whether she wanted to have sex. He then said to her “You should be careful not to do this with another men in the future, because if I was them, I would probably get very violent and hurt you. You just can’t trust anyone these days” and it was such a big red flag even though he made it sound like he was showing concern for her safety
Wow, how much more passive aggressive can you get?
when you dodge not just a bullet but a whole damn nuke
@@PancakemonsterFO4 thats just aggression. It was a direct threat. Passive aggression is hidden aggression that you may not pick up on in the moment
Whoaaaa
Ew. It was basically a threat
In the Philippines or at least in my area, we call these type of boys “sadbois” and i think it’s more appropriate lmao
ikr! that's why when she showed the examples given on tiktok it sounded familiar to me, and my first thought was "this is just the manipulative sadboi". it's amazing how we can have different names for the same things, or at least have some commonalities but ascribe different terms.
I really like this one better than pick me boys
Yep! and in a way they're also like "Kyles" because punching walls are also kinda associated with them too 🤔
@@KH0LRA fuck shit **sinuntok yung pader** 😔
"soRry e2 laNg akO, dI akO kagWapuhan."
Tangna, bat ka nag-sosorry? Di naman ako nagluwal sayo ah.
I dated a “nice guy/pick me” and when I broke up with him he started stalking me.
Yup. Same. It went from "I just want you to love me" to "I will turn up at your house and shout through the front window to get your attention cause I know you must love me despite breaking up with me".
I doubt we're the only ones... :-(
I hope you're safe!
Get a restraining order!!
Yes! It went from “I’m in love with you” to stalking me and begging me to be with them, when that didn’t work they made fake social media accounts to follow me and still sends me random things in the mail like flowers and gifts.
@@amberdelia2814 That stuff can be so hard to shut down, and restraining orders can be harder to get than people think.
I'm so sorry for you. I hope you are basically safe and that the attention will die off. I hate to say that moving ended it for me, but... sometimes when every last avenue is cut off it ends. Women need to support each other in understanding how difficult the process can be. You have my support.
I used be a "pick me boy" then I discovered that I'm not even a boy..
Evolution, y'all, it's evolution
Its impossible that you arent a boy since you have millions of dna cells saying that you are..
@@nemo2179 they don’t identify as a male anymore allow it
A whole character arc 🙌
Best Character development
@@hasan-ci8nw identification doesn't mean shit. You will always be what you were assigned at birth.
The girl talking about how male influence can fuel the pick me girl: that’s exactly what happened to me. I struggled with female companionship because the adult women in my life were toxic and being around the men in my family was safer physically. So ofc being a child you adopt their habits. It really sucked because as a young woman I needed to companionship that women offer. Men and women have same but different ways of bonding. I am so glad I’ve grown out of the pick me phase. Not all men are toxic, but having healthy relationships with other women has made me a stronger person mentally and physically in ways men cannot.
I think that clip perfectly described so much of where the “pick me girl” gets her views. The more women I became close to in my life the more I deeply respect women who simply know what they like and respect themselves.
I'm a former pick me girl, and I think it was a common thing if you were in male dominated hobbies/fields in the 2000s/early 2010s, since it was a survival mechanism to escape harassment yourself. So I give myself a break now that I recognize that I was doing that.
Not good enough
That's awful. I'm furious at the people in these industries who were treating you in such terrible ways.
pick me-ism doesn’t come from nowhere, and it being a survival mechanism makes a lot of sense. « femininity » and things deemed feminine are definitely looked down on in society, yet propped up to this impossible standard. it’s a very effective tool for division. i hope you’re overcoming this, it’s definitely a hard journey to go through
"You never gonna get a better man than me"
"I cuddle more than other guys"
"I wouldnt mind taking care of the kids at home while my wife wants to work, because I would put my wife as first priority, not like other men"
"Other guys will be boring and ignore you after a while"
And this all while flirting with other women online.
Sums up basically my abusive ex.
That's fucked up. Especially the first and the last sentence; he should see you as so loveable and know that other men can love you the same and even better than he ever can. Anyone who says "you will never find someone better than me" that's controlling and abusive..... A good partner should say, "I can never find somebody better than you." I am sorry that you endured him. You are much better than that.
Tee Noir, much like Tara, is a godess here on earth.
I just saw her in my recommends... I'm going to check her out!
Gotta love when creators you genuinely enjoy praise other phenomenal creators. Tee Noir is such an intelligent and well spoken Queen.
Yes they're both amazing queens
Yes!!!! I love both of them so much!
that's true
I think this concept is similar to one we had for a long time here in Brazil called "esquerdomacho", roughly translated to "leftbro", but I feel that we are way more specific about what that entails. It's a guy who pretends to be a leftist and supporter of women but repeats many of the same behaviors of guys from the right with a woke excuse to do so. He is usually a guy who preachs 'free love' but he gets jealous when one of their girls starts seeing someone too. A guy who drinks beer with friends, talking about leftist politics, while asking his wife to bring them the food and more beers and leaving all the cleaning to her after the event. A guy who will ask for nudes but will try to justify it by saying that you should be more sexually liberated and acting like, in a way, he is trying to help you with this request. This is the kind of guy that an 'esquerdomacho'. Seems similar to a pick me boy, I think.
"One of their girls". This is so specific and accurate it hurts 🤣
Esquerdomacho is the best word ever
I am so glad you informed me of this
eu ia comentar agora sobre
Came here to say that. I had some experience with this kind of guy and it's accurate. I was seeing this guy and he tried to make me have something with him. I said no. Long story short, he told me I'm not "free" with my choices and I should be more open to new things (remember, I just said "no")
I feel like the problem is all of these terms stem from internalized misogyny, even pick me boys. So when push comes to shove, men never actually blame other men, everyone just always blames women. So a pick me boy is really just a nice guy with the added bonus of performative misandry.
But who knows if the woman might also be performing misogyny? Or if the man actually believes in his misandrist claims?
@@eMorphized The answer you're looking for is hypocrisy. Pick me boys generally show hypocrisy in their views, pick me girls generally do not. That's how you know it is or isn't performative.
I guess you you could say it like this???
Pick me girls = internalised misogyny
Pick me boys = manipulation
At least it often works like this, not in all cases though.
Mm-hmm. Women most affected.
Go off, chief. I'll wait my turn, as usual.
Saw the feminist t-shirt dude and now I'm afraid I'm going to be called out in this video. 😬😅
we like feminist men! just not FAUX feminist men 😉
@@TaraMooknee lol thanks so much 😃I know
I was joking. I probably deserve to get called out on a bunch of stuff anyways. ;-)
It would be an honor to be so by you. :-)
I do know though, that It's not enough to wear the t-shirt, you actually gotta show solidarity.
good feminist guys: "hey ik you have problems, and i just wanna help, please tell me what i can do :)"
bad feminist guys: "HEY HEY HEY I'M SOOOOOOOOOOOOO SORRY THAT I'M A CIS MAN, BUT I'M NOT LIKE THOSE OTHER CIS MEN, SO PICK ME PICK ME I'M THE GOOD ONE!"
@@doggytheanarchist7876 But did she pick you?
@@doggytheanarchist7876 well the fact that you’re considerate enough for this to cross your mind shows that you’re on the right track to being a true feminist.
I had a friend who was like this back before "pick me" was even a thing. He was a real "m'lady" type of guy and we stopped being friends when I started dating my ex and my friend said "It's not fair, it was my turn, not his." True colors
@UC_XSxY3z7__inVDpuwFsNsw man fuck you, you're everywhere in this comment section
@Arthur Frayn Wow. THAT was your take on the situation?
This guy was literally just being nice to her /being her friend, so he could get laid.
He felt entitled to date her because he had 'put in the time' before her boyfriend came on to the scene.
It was 'his turn'?! So he had 'dibs' because he knew her longer?! Eew, eew, eew!
He just assumed that he should be 'next' in line, without considering her feelings or asking her previously if she was even interested in him romantically.
@Arthur Frayn I literally changed what I said before you even commented, and realized my error in initially using said word.
So, your point is moot.
I realized that it was the wrong tack to take and I don't generally subscribe to ad hominem attacks.
Many others have already referred to you as such; I predicted that if I used the same term, that you would take umbrage with the word, while
deflecting from the actual point of the comment, which is exactly what you did.
Your whole attitude on here has been condescending and obnoxious to other commenters who disagree with you, by the way.
'Carefully curated'? What the actual?! You've repeated the whole 'bumper sticker' comment to others as well.
It doesn't mean anything, just verbal clap-trap, trying to label and pigeon hole others whilst complaining that we are doing the same.
@Arthur Frayn
Her 'friend's' entitlement that she should have dated him instead of her boyfriend because he knew her first , is the issue.
She never said she thought she was oppressed in any way.
Your sarcasm was duly noted.
The fact that you took it that way is problematic.
So she should be flattered that she was 'attractive enough' that the male friend was into her in the first place?!
I guess it doesn't matter that she doesn't have any romantic feelings towards him, and should've just
gone along with it?!
It is incredibly deceitful-not to mention disingenous- to be someone's friend, only with the expectation that they'll date you eventually.
He had a choice: he could've been honest from the get go and told her that he wanted to go out with her, but he didn't.
I've had guys pull this crap with my friends and me,and it sucks, because you think the person is genuinely interested in you as a friend, only
to find out that they have an ulterior motive.
9/10 times when you politely tell them that you're not interested romantically , they get angry and bugger off, and the friendship is over.
@Arthur Frayn my man the only person under this comment who sounds like a "dunce " is you. She never said she was a victim, and someone explained what the issue was in this relationship and you still react like that? Stop being So salty.
I love when ,
Tara Mooknee
Jordan Theresa
Tee noir
Tiffanyferg
Sarah Z
Keep directing me to each other's channels
Please suggest more feminist channels that deserve recognition.
ItzKeisha is another great channel
Khadija Mbowe!!
kristen leo!
I love tee noir!
I love all of them!
Thequeerkiwi is also a great one
A guy commented that the stretch marks on my chest were "beautiful as lightning" on a full bodied picture on fb. And then proceeded to DM me about how I shouldn't (tw: disordered eating) starve myself because I'm "a thicc goddess with thighs powerful enough to crush all men and their expectations of me" (about a post where I talked about my experience with eating disorders and the mental agony dysmorphia and dysphoria with a fairly large and curvy body brought) and that my skin looks "sweet as honey". Idk if the guy was a simp, a pick me dude or just a run of the mill cannibal with a taste for honeyed skin 🙄
Weird….that’s too much detail for him not to be a cannibal.
Just your run o the mill fetishist and also possibly a cannibal, who knows, the purple prose ones are always weird in horrifying ways...
Reminds me of a Neil Cicierega song, if you're interested.
@@normanclatcher i immediately knew what song u were talking abt and idk how to feel abt that lmao
Picking a label for my sexuality: boring
Picking a label for people who would put other people down just to have sex: 💫 *hell yes* 💫
"What can I say, the heteros are at it again!"
As an ace I feel like you've just summed up a good portion of my life.
Male asexual? Cool
@@mastermitser5693 wtf is that supposed to mean
the pick me boys i have met are always the "soft boys" who think they're so deep and understand women's struggles.
That's interesting that you see "pick me" women as generally conservative. I have seen for most of my life girls that want to be "one of the boys" by drinking heavy, burping, playing video games, reading comics and so on. Not always conservative hobbies or behaviors
Id say republican moreso, or conservatives who are so just due to the other qualities of them, and not necessarily Christain Conservative "values"
It’s Always Sunny in Philadelphia S1 E2 “Charlie Wants An Abortion”
This is the episode where Dennis and Mac go to an abortion rally to get laid lol.
YES!!!
I dated a guy who did this. Turned out to be the most abusive partner I had had.
He was the king of gaslighting, that's for sure. He also once actually complained to me "all my friends are lesbians who just want to use me for sex when they break up with girls!"
It was one of the most disorienting relationships I had ever had. Luckily it was a long time ago.. but that should tell you that this is by no means a new phenomenon :-/
Yes! And irl who are the ones who get the blame? Not the pick me men but the women fighting for safe abortions. People really hate women and their rights that they’ll blame faux allies for a whole movement
Only one upped by the episode from the recent “Beavis & Butthead” revival where they actually go to an abortion CLINIC to get laid (not knowing what it is, just knowing the guy with a megaphone outside says there’s wh*res in there).
OMG I love this series and this episode. This is so relevant now that I think about it.
I think the woman who talked about 'wanting to be heard' was really cutting to the root of it. And whilst that's a problem for dudes too, it's more of a problem for women, so we get more Pick me girls than boys but the boys still exist.
What I got from that bit was that she was probably seen as "lesser than" by her father and brothers just for being a girl. People don't generally value the opinions of the people they see as inferior and don't want to listen to them as a result.
YEP.
Very suspicious Cow™ hasn't made an appearance yet.
Cow™ edit a message into the video if you are being held hostage by Tara.
WHAT ABOUT THE COW CLIP
I know I'm late to the party but I'm just going to write a bit as a male cishet feminist.
Your video is spot on. Especially with the last comment. I get enough shit from dudes who accuse me of doing it all to get laid. I really don't want to be accused by the feminists and women as well. Not that it would stop me from being a feminist but it would discourage me from speaking up when needed. I have enough anxiety in my life and it wouldn't be nice to have more introduced by the team I belong to.
There's a lot of talk criticising male feminists and rightfully doubting their feminism while calling the behaviour and the group criticised as "male feminists". I get that the talk is always about a segment of male feminists that doesn't include me but I think using pick-me boys instead of the "male feminists" would be wonderful. Though I do understand it would be hard to introduce this concept and make it commonly used.
I used to say "I can't stand men who self proclaim as feminists" but for a while I couldn't quite put my finger on why... I knew I wanted a man who was a feminist, but my experience with men who said they were feminists openly and proudly was veeeeery sketchy... And yeah, basically, they were pick mes.
exactly men who are true feminists show it through their actions and their relationships with women
oh god! I have faced tons of these woke men. so there was this guy who seems a very woke person, goes to pride walk, and talks about all the philosophers all the time. And I was 18 and a freshman in the university and the man slid in my DMS...at first, he was discussing all Freud and stuff. Then suddenly he asked me for nudes. And I said no. And then he started gaslighting me into thinking that since I am a village girl since my upbringing is patriarchal thus i have these prejudices. Not sending nudes to men is a very non-feministic thing I was doing. And the guy was 28 and i was just 17 crossed 18...Jesus!! And this is just one example. Studying in one of the most famous "woke" universities in India opened a whole new door of pick me or " wokebois" in front of me. I can write a whole book about the samples I have faced. ugh!
Please do. I'm indian, that illogical manipulation is so unique to indian guys. One guy out of nowhere told his female friend he wanted to be compensated for his friendship with sex (can't remember his exact manipulative words). But the minute their parents or your guardians are around, they fully forgot their manipulative words because they know it only works when you get someone more vulnerable alone.
Yeah cis male philosophy and psychology students are definitely the worst xD him talking about freud is a huge red flag. Nobody takes freud seriously anymore. What a creep.
Oh boy, that's just straight up predatory.
Ah, yes the "you're boundaries are unfeminist and the progressive thing for me to do is let me cross those."
I hate those ones.
men who hide their bad intentions with fake intelligence are horrible
There's unfortunately gold star shaming in the bisexual community too, you're shamed as not being a real bisexual if you haven't dated both men and women.
Theres gold star shaming in the nonbinary community too, you're shamed if you present more femme than masc and get told you're faking for attention.
I would like to coin the term “Bingo Bi” for that
I never experience this.... I only experinced it by homosexuell and straight people.
But I heard from a bi guy whose grilfriend outed herself as bisexuell and he outed himself then too. She broke up with him, because bisexuell men always cheating. That really shocked me....
I feel really bad for people experience bad stuff in their own community. It should be a safe place.
There is a strong link to narcissism, I would say. If your behaviour is completely orientated on others approval and if they find you attractive, this can turn into narcissism pretty quickly. Calling internalised mysoginy out is important, but I would say that the pick-me-problem doesn’t just have a societal side but also a psychological that goes deeper than just “wanting to get laid”. Anyway, thanks for the interesting video!
As a nb gay "guy" person, I have been called a pick me boy by other men when I was in predominantly male spaces and they were saying degrading things about women and the women in my inner circle and I stood up for those women. I also think there is a moderate amount of misogyny rooted in calling feminine men a "pick me", there is already such a stigma surrounding fem guys already in our society that assuming they do it for attention doesn't particularly hold up if it is a constant thing they do. Also, a key feature of a pick me is trying to get it in with a woman, which seems like it could leave out a whole subset of gay men who seek validation from their female friends, but are really just misogynistic. I understand how it would be harder to make a distinction between the two if that were to be the case. However the difference between a true feminist and a pick me would be that the feminist believes in women's rights and respects women through their actions and the way the voice their feelings.
Agreed. You keep doing you, good things will come around to you
Well, you can't escape it, if males are nice they are call out of pick me, white nights, simp, can't win. Same when it comes to females, but they got call out when they are not nice to mysogonist men.
@@lishan4657 no
it's because they're only trying to get in women's pants
if they could just be without wanting to fuck every woman they see it wouldn't be as much of a problem
no one has to be nice to shitty people
This is such a common thing, guys will call guys a pick me just for stating vague support of women. Making a milktoast comment like "who cares what she wears" is enough. Adding to calling feminine men pick mes there's also a flipside of guys who are labeled a pick me (like for being feminist) is also considered being less masculine, like not being misogynistic enough is somehow considered feminine.
I was worried that I was something of a “pick me” boy. Then I realized that “pick me” boys are hated so much because they’re only pretending to respect women so they can get laid. Me on the other hand, well… I’m way too honest with people if anything, and I don’t regret standing up for gender equality despite being a young adult who hasn’t gotten so much as a first kiss. Being a “male feminist” hasn’t ever gotten me a girlfriend, and though it would be nice if it did, I never really thought it would. I guess the difference is that I’m not pretending, and the fact that I also happen to want a girlfriend but I don’t know how to get one had me pretty confused.
these men are the reason why I have a preference for girls/j
@ur playlist let's ignore the fact that I'm bi✋/j
@@ryleighd7147 HAHA SAME
that's good.
These men make me glad I'm not attracted to men/j
@@ryleighd7147 why does being bi change that? Bisexuals with a preference are still valid.
I've totally experienced this, but had never been able to put a label on it before. I was friends with this guy, and we would talk about feminism and slut shaming from time to time. Eventually we went on a couple dates, but something felt wiggy. When I told him we were better off friends he said something like "I told my friends I had it (as in sex with me) in the bag, what happened?"
It became QUITE clear very quickly that he didnt actually have any respect for women.
I used to be a pick me/nlog back when we didn't have that language. I was referred to as "the token girl" of the friend group. I would get intensely jealous when male attention went towards a different girl because "I worked so damn hard to prove myself." It took me until college to learn the error of my ways. I had a female frenemy who was also trying to be the token girl. I was the "bitchy" trope in men's eyes and she was the "cutesy" one so we clashed hard. Which meant at a party one day, they were infantilizing her super hard and she had been putting up with that bs her whole life. I was like, "no, she can make her own choices. Eff off. Hey, let's ditch this shithole and have our own party." Suddenly, we were super close friends, never gave those guys the time of day, and created our own friend group that didn't tokenize people even though it was diverse. It wasn't intentional, but it was basically a group of "misfits" that have had to try to hard their whole lives and suddenly felt like we could breathe and let our hair down. It was so damn freeing. That's why I try not to judge these people so hard because they're probably just lashing out and lashing out back does nothing to help
I agree wholeheartedly with your conclusion.
I'd love this as a webcomic ngl
AND THEN EVERYONE STARTED CLAPPING
The real cow was the friends we made along the way.
c,:
As a rather conventional, straight, cis girl, masculinity is hot. K? But the definition of masculinity I'm talking about is chivalrous and respectful. The definition of traditional masculinity is providing and protecting. Not dominance behavior, superiority, etc. Genuine, healthy masculinity is hot.
@@theliberation9061 or maybe you just aren't aware of how most feminists actually think? Just look at this comment. It got highlighted
@@theliberation9061 look at you. Going around this comment section putting words in other people's mouths and you're convinced that it's women's fault you're like this. Have you ever listened to or cared about a person who is not yourself even once in your miserable life? Pathetic.
@@theliberation9061 no it’s not, manners are manners. Belittling behaviours are belittling behaviours. You don’t know the difference ig
There's absolutely nothing wrong with those preferences, all I want in general and as someone who's into other types of men is that it shouldn't be the ideal or even standard. I want people like this to specify their type or whatever the same way I have to for people not to assume that I'm into this for example just by being a woman into men etc.
@Dawid XCX some "stereotypes" aren't harmful, sweety. If a person wants to be that and if someone is attracted to that, just let live their life
The best way to tell an actual ally from a pick me is by seeing how they behave around other men
So they should be a "I am not like every other man"?
If hes not like other men in a good way, sure why not.
@@TheKh65 I think op meant do they still hold up those same feminist beliefs around other men, when it can't be used for their own personal gain with women?
@@videoupload6898 nope, I think the op meant if those pick me boys disrespect Men for no reason, but only respect women that way the pick me guy can use the women for personal gain
I mean yes but no, some will drop the act but some have delusions of grandeur and are truly lost in the sauce
500 Days of Summer is a good example of "pick me cuz I'm a nice guy" and then he got angry when she didn't want a future with him, and got married and had kids with someone else as if she owed him something for being a nice guy
Plus all these guys and ladies defended him and the male who wrote this wrote the woman’s real first and last name in the movie!
It makes me sick how many pretty women date ugly males just because he is nice which only enables these gross lazy privileged males!
As a Latina I really appreciate the comment about fetishization b/c I've had so many guys just outwardly tell me they want me b/c I'm latina and genuinely think that we're thankful and that's something we want to hear! It's so uncomfortable and I wish it was more widely known that it's not ok to say things like that and it isn't a compliment b/c being stereotyped is not anything anyone wants to experience
Fr. I’ve seen ads about sex, specifically indicating their race. Most of times its latina too. Disgusting. Absolutely disgusting. Its just a fetish, and telling someone you like them because of their skin/ethnicity is creepy and gross.
White men branding literally any other woman of culture as “exotic” makes my skin CRAWL. Absolute biggest red flag. I’m white and that shit even scares the hell out of me.
It's absolutely okay to say things like that.
It's really amazing to me how young people have completely abandoned the concept of free speech. It's weird because when I was younger, we were all about free spech. I don't understand why the young adults of today are so emotionally fragile.
If someone wants to say that he is attracted to hispanic women it's not up to you to tell him it's not okay. If you don't like it that's your problem, not his.
@@patrickbarnes9874 Ok. They have their free speech to say that disgusting and creepy bs (why do people always pull that card when they say this shit?). So women don't have free speech? So they must just tolerate these disgusting comments? Because they are critisizing these comments that those men make. Or do you think that just men are allowed to have free speech? Free speech comes with consequences, you know. And it is free speech to criticize what these men have said. You cant just claim that women can't say anything when they make these comments cause that's nOt FrEe sPeECh bEcAuSe I sAy sO.
FR
The ‘pick me’ ideology is not exclusive to heterosexuals on the basis that a ‘pick me’ seeks approval from a certain group. Under this criteria we can assume anybody can be a ‘pick me’, regardless of race, gender or sexual orientation.
Most likely, being a ‘pick me’ stems from a need to please and feel important and special- to individualise oneself from the majority due to insecurities or being brought up in a demeaning environment, or being introduced to one at an early age. We live in an era where being ‘normal’ and not individual is bad, but being too out there and different is also bad. It’s a literal breeding ground for pick me’s, not to mention the constant change in radicalised belief systems and how we are viewing the world. People crave acceptance and tolerance, some go to extremes to gain this (such as ‘pick me’s’ do). Therefore we can conclusively state that being a ‘pick me’ is not exclusive to heterosexuality. Honestly, ‘pick me’ can be used as an umbrella term to envelop all different kind of pandering behaviour (gold star lesbians, battleax bi’s, nlogs, neckbeards and nice guys). It’s like a 50p picknmix, you never know what you’re going to get.
My ex boyfriend pretended to be a liberal for YEARS when he was actually quite conservative so I would continue to be with him. I’ve never thought of it in terms of pick-me.
I knew a guy who constantly said he was a feminist because he read somewhere that "men who identified as feminists were better in bed"
🤡
I feel like a key difference between a "nice guy" and a "pick me" is that usually the "nice guy" is actually outwardly misogynist, while a "pick me" markets himself as a feminist. there seems to be some gray area between "pick me boys" and "sad boys"
My favourite is the nice guys, that pretend to be your friend for years. Yet constantly tell you to leave any girl/guy you are with and berate your partners. Then send you depressed messages at 3am saying they are going to be alone forever. I’m over 30. These men don’t change...
I’ve seen some cases about it and it’s always very sad, men talk about how women are always friend zoning them, but get angry if you consider them friends and _dare_ to have romantic relationships with other people, even if they haven’t expressed liking you to begin with. The betrayal of realizing a guy wasn’t friends with you because you enjoyed each other’s personality, but because he thought he had a “chance” with you if he was nice for a while
@Heh the mental gymnastics that go on in people's brains like yours. all I hear are excuses and justification for bad behavior. "being used"? what do you think you're doing if you consider yourself "in the friendzone" and not just being in a genuine friendship. what are your motives, if not disingenuous themselves? what standing do you have to call them who just want to be friends with you, "being used". I cannot fathom why one would put themselves in either of those situations. I would not want to be friends with someone who thought like you (if I was a woman) nor would I want to put myself in a situation where I pine over someone in which they've never expressed interest. either spend less than 3 months with a crush and getting to know someone and move on if it isn't reciprocated (for your own well-being) or have a genuine friendship with someone of the opposite sex. and sometimes these things do turn into something more given the right timing and person too but live your life and if you can't, you need to move on. still these are exceptions to the rule. we as humans already have a hard time moving on from people we actually have real romantic relationships with, we don't need that with things that never were.
As someone who was kinda like that in High School, yeah they do. They just need to get over themselves and go to therapy to figure their shit out.
@Heh the fucking irony. *get a load of this guy meme*
Why the fuck are you people friends with these people then? If it is so blatantly black and white as you describe, then why do you enable these people? You even say you're over 30 and that these men never change, that seems pretty ironic coming from someone who keeps inviting these destructive people into their own life.
Maybe start making use of the life experience you've got?
Moral of the story: Date people normally, and don't be desperate, no matter who you are.
(Edit: Pick me boys/girls aren't bad people, they're just the result of pent up emotions of loneliness not being treated. So if you see it happen, try de-escalating the situation and helping them. Due to the replies, I thought I'd add this.)
Beautiful summary
Yes Lord Dio
Dio bringing the wisdom
And love yourself!! I feel like all these desperate people are just lacking self-love and confidence.
@@lujorom9172 I forgot to add that- self care is important, yes.
Just stumbled across this terribly underrated content creator. The whole last minute is dogs and baby cows. Yes please.
NLOB: not like other boys. “I’m ugly 😔😞” “you’ll find someone better”
Kind of like the NLOGs who put themselves down 🤔
But what if it's just genuine low self esteem issues?
The NLOG phenomena stems, often times, from insecurity and low self esteem. It had just been weirdly redirected as a superiority complex ("I'm not like those other girls who put makeup on just to take selfies ...) in order to hide or feel better about not conforming to this idealized feminity. I believe that this is TRUE NLOG behaviour.
Now, those that put temselves down and stop at that is just insecurity, and if they were to use that insecurity in order to gathe sympathy is just emotional manipulation.
I thought that was a big part of being a simp
@@ededetudo2879 THIS. I grew up being bullied for my appearance by (mostly) females and males and still suffer from low self-esteem. I accepted it and confidently say I'm ugly - does that make me Not Like Other Girls? I swear people make up labels for literally EVERY. SINGLE. THING.
@@Elliecham i think being like "hey I'm ugly, but that's fine", there's nothing wrong with that!
What would make it an NLOG is "_sigh_ I'm ugly, unlike all these other girls who are caked full of makeup and fake"
Guy: yeah I’m totally into respecting boundaries
Also guy: *asks for nudes when you’ve already said no*
@Arthur Frayn how sad is your life that you are all over this comment section invalidating women?
@Arthur Frayn get a life
Fr tho. Last night this dude asked me what my boundaries were so he didn't ask any questions that would make me uncomfortable. I said I didn't care as long as they weren't sexual. Literally every question he asked was sexual
Haha, once this guy asked me if I wanted to go on a date with him and I told him that I wanted to hang out with him again but I didn't feel like I knew him well enough to go on a date with him yet. He said that he completely understood and I though "great, we're on the same page." Then a couple days later he sent me a picture of himself naked in the shower 🤔🤔🤔
How are they so degrading yet so desperate at the same time?
they take lack of self respect to a whole new level.
Because they're hoping that you'll feel bad for them. I'm glad there is a term for this now because I knew several in college. It put me off because I'm not interested in someone without self confidence.
This is exactly how I feel about the boys in my town.
I’m a trans guy and i have always automatically leaned towards being friends with guys, so in elementary and middle school, before i came out, i was a huge pick-me “girl” because i was desperate for male aprovak cause i wanted to be “one of the boys”
Seeking friendship is slightly different so I think that's slightly better.
@@eMorphized i'm also gay
@@eMorphized it’s not better when the outcome is the same, in regards to dragging down other woman and allowing more inequality.
@@lunakjr5484 in terms of pick me, it is in the way of better at not being a pick me. Not better on the dragging people down situation.
And now you aren't just one of the boys, you are THE Boy! You're *that* guy! Holy shit, good for you, stranger-friend!
the guy trying talking to me rn has a favourite sentence: I haven't felt the touch of a woman in several months. like i can't help you with that buddy
Being decent isn't something you are, it's something you do.
- Batman (sort of)
"There’s no deep down, I believe that all we are is what we do" - Diane Nguyen (Bojack Horseman)
I've been watching for a while and I still haven't seen a cow. I'm beginning to think that cows might not actually produce these videos. I'll continue to suspiciously watch
fool she wouldn't lie..........especially about a cute cow.
“I wear this shirt and you won’t even let me *nUUuuutTtTT* “ will always be one of my favorite SNL lines in history
Example of pick me boy: "dude, you should learn about what makes your girl happy, or she will end up with me instead. A real man cooks, cleans and says yes to everything she says and treats her like the princess she is. You're not a real man."
Example of a normal human being who happens to be a guy (my boyfriend in this case) : "yeah, I actually do most of the chores at home because she works more than I do and earns more. This is my way of supporting her." - context: people are always saying he shouldn't do those things because he is not my maid. He gets PISSED.
He needs to work more. He is being a mooch. He is a boy in a boy’s society and mooching off of you. Males get paid more for the same job and promoted more and get more raises so he needs to work more.
Every single male women’s studies major I’ve ever met is a pick me.
That’s disappointing...predictable but still...
@@heyhorinshi "disappointed but not surprised"
You shouldn’t take one person’s anecdote as an indictment of all guys that take gender studies
@@brunothompson6157 I did not say ALL guys who take gender studies, I said every man I have met who was MAJORING in women’s studies.
@@acutie898 yeah fair my bad
Are "pick me boys" not the lads that will do the bare minimum and point it out for brownie points? (Treated you like a human! 🙊🙊🙊 Cleaned up after myself! 💀💀😝) Am I doing it right? Haha
Yes, they set the bar really low by saying they are worthless and no good, then feel like doing something completely minimal for being a decent person is an accomplishment. They do it to manipulate women.
@@jessn.3851 hot take but it is almost like pick me boys and pick me girls are people who never emotionally grew past trying to impress their parents levels of expressing love.
@@claryfey They obviously have some kind of hunger for love but do not love themselves. I think that's a common problem but many people will attempt to learn to love themselves instead of putting pressure on someone else. Pick me girls have an attitude that if they just do enough, another person will love them, but that is not how it works. You cannot make someone reciprocate. We should be teaching young girls to fulfill their own needs, that way they will be happy and not look for love in the wrong places and end up with disappointment. That's codependency.
I'm glad I knew about pick me guys long before they had a name. I don't like them because I prefer people with self esteem and I can't stand so much negativity. It's exhausting to be around anyone who put themselves down. They know they are not living up to their own standards but are unwilling to do anything about it. If they worked on their own happiness they would become the kind of guy that girls like and feel comfortable around without the manipulation. I think a lot of young people are shown through media that love is the most important thing, but they think it is love from other people, when it is really love for themselves that will solve the issue.
@@jessn.3851 no one likes negativity unless it's funny huh?
TREAT YOU LIKE A HUMAN ugh exactly. They will talk about sexual violence statistics then be like "I'd never do that to you babygirl" VOMIT
When I was a young teen entering college, the pursuit of pleasing and being a more attractive person/man to women caused me to self reflect and really consider the toxic traits I (and seemingly other young men may have) had. Which ended with me genuinely becoming a better man for myself, where I kinda forgot that I even started to change because of my pursuit of women in the first place.
So in a way being or nearly becoming a pick me, nice guy, soft incel, whatever made me self-reflect and just be a better person. Since I nearly was/ was one of those guys years ago, it’s very obvious when I meet another man who is still stuck in that. I’m so glad I grew from it.
I’m struggling with that right now. Any tips?
@@afroninjahd3778 I would recommend just keeping an open mind and ears to perspectives that may not naturally (instinctually) align with your own. You may not find much you agree with at times, but you will start to find bits and pieces from those differing perspectives that could add to your sense of self and well-being. I hope that helps!
@FilthyDankWastemanFabuless you're right, when we have the chance to change we either double down on what we know or we let go and change. I'm glad that I was able to grow as well, I think having my thoughts challenged and discussed with others (and with myself) helped for sure. I am lucky, and I'm self-aware enough to say that lol :)
Mini story about feminism growing up: I remember in 10th grade we were asked to define feminism to ourselves in English class. I gave a pretty normal one about how it's about helping women achieve equality except I added in a part explaining how much it matters to take it seriously in other countries where little girls can't go to school or be themselves properly without struggle.
A guy behind me said "Nobody say nothin after that"
I know he was talking about the one hyper conservative kid behind me but it still bothers me that there might have been someone who honestly disagreed with me that feminism is important when we were all children.
Then I started meeting people who were girls or women like me but would sneer at the word feminism. It makes you feel strange when the people around you who you respect like a close friend or your peers don't agree with you about something that you're so sure is correct. I honestly started to retract the ways I felt about feminism around certain people. I've stopped doing that but the feeling of "Am I just overly enthused? Am I being too SJW?"... It lingers in you.
I totally agree! I used to hate things that related to feminism because I didnt want to be associated with sjw’s
I've never been able to relate harder. I was friends with toxic people and I struggle now with the fact I used to distance myself from equality because of who I was around. Once the friendship ended and I cut ties with them it was almost immediately that I felt comfortable again to be a feminist, but that feeling definitely lingers
just remember that whenever women, or any minority group for that matter, speaks up/ stands up for themselves, society will call us an sjw or smthn just to put us down. please dont listen to them, they cannot silence us, not now, not ever
I have friends who also don't understand what feminism is (and many other good -isms), and they have some questionable takes on these topics because they can't be bothered to educate themselves, so instead of telling them that I'm a feminist, I try to patiently steer them in the right direction. I drop links, avoid confrontation, and guide them towards developing better takes.
@@theliberation9061 hey! ever thought that some feminists are fake?? yeah, craaaazy!!!
I'm so glad you mentioned the queer community because there's a lot of instances among trans folks which i would consider to be pick-me behavior (although it isn't necessarily romantic). there's a certain flavor of trans person, such as, say, blaire white or kalvin garrah, who push a narrative of the trans experience that's meant to make cis people comfortable. they do this by asserting that all trans people are gender-conforming, heavily dysphoric, etc, and throwing gnc trans and nonbinary people like me under the bus. It's like they're saying "look at this person! they're not a real trans person like me! people like this are why cis people hate us and don't take us seriously :(" they definitely remind me of pick-mes.
Still no cow? My patience is running thin tara :(
we just need faith we'll at least hear it's moo.
you know, sometimes i get scared of falling in the trap of being a "pick me boy", when that fear comes over me i ask myself "would i still be doing what i'm doing if there was no female or male friends watching to make me feel validated?" if the answer is yes i keep doing it, if the answer is no i stop it immediately
Yes! I wish more people would question their behavior instead of justifying it.
@@beepot2764 Or neither, that's fun to watch.
I feel like any guy who unironically uses terms like "alpha, sigma, beta males" come under a subsection of the pick me guys...trying to put down others, and being the absolute picture of "masculinity"
ugh I really hate those guys. got a strong urge to punch one in the face.
Hi! You used one of my insanely unpopular TikToks in this video ("Here's an idea: instead of making fun of pick me girls, why don't we just make fun of men?"). The idea for that TikTok originated for me in the understanding that "pick me" girls are a product of what the patriarchy expects from women-- not only taking on traditional femininity in society, but also being excited and delighted to do so. My original point was that instead of making fun of women who take on this trope to be attractive to men, we should be discussing how and why men portray their ideal woman in this way.
Obviously I didn't actually include any of this nuance because I was hoping to gain more traction (I have virtually no TikTok followers; not sure how you even found this TikTok!) but wanted to share my though process behind it!
thank you for sharing!!!
That line made me cackle, ngl
I;ll make fun of any female that thinks it's okay to make fun of men.
I used to hate hearing from emotionally manipulative people but now I kind of like it
“It’s ok, I’m used to rejection”
“That’s good, we should all feel comfortable with it”
“I ruin everything”
“It’s great that you’re so self-aware”
Omg i needed that like 3 months ago when i was dealing with a serious nice guy that i rejected
He'd go between agressive and then "i am so sorry, I always ruin things, i had a bad cloud over my head"
I just didn't know how to act with someone who had the same age as me but acting like a toddler
I can't believe you mentioned Tee Noir she is such a queen just like you ♥️
Honestly, a lot of the talking points I’m hearing about pick me boys sound just like the rhetoric coming from the “anti-sjw” community. “He’s just saying that to get into women’s pants” is a common ad hominem attack on anything a male feminist ever says, used in an effort to invalidate the argument without actually engaging with it or attempting to refute it. Now, as a gay man, I am not actually very familiar with women’s dating lives, so the disingenuous feminist man could be more common than I am aware. However, whenever I’ve seen this archetype being referenced, it was almost exclusively from reactionaries attempting to invalidate the genuine beliefs of male feminists.
That's a dangerous way to look at it.
I don't know if you spend a lot of time in Leftist circles, but it's actually an issue that has been a fairly big one for a while. A lot of Liberal men ARE exactly the disingenuous creeps that the reactionaries say they are.
Reactionaries may apply the judgement too liberally (pun intended) but they are not at all wrong that there's a problem.
Which is why we need feminist men to actively call out other men for using feminist talking points to creep on women.
It's the tribalistic nature of saying "reactionaries say it so it's probably fake" that allows the creepers to smokescreen themselves and gaslight their victims into silence.
Edit: By Liberal I mean the Trudeau's and Clinton's of the world, I am of course a leftist.
@@Jane-oz7pp That’s fair. As I said, I don’t really know about women’s dating lives, but I’m definitely more than familiar with the common reactionary trope. It’s frankly very sad & disgusting that men like this do exist, & it also definitely hurts our causes. I’ve even had the accusation thrown at me from reactionaries with whom I was arguing before promptly smacking my face & informing them of my gayness. I suppose it’s definitely necessary to both call out the faux-feminist man trying to pick up women, whilst simultaneously asserting that, no, this is not something that automatically applies to feminist men.
@@matthewodonnell6906 100%
The absolute hardest part about advocating for social justice is that you're fighting a war on both sides, effectively. On the one hand, we HAVE to hold "our side" accountable when we mess up/call out toxicity in our own communities, but we also have to ensure the reactionaries don't use that to imply that the movement itself is toxic.
It's not an easy balance to strike but I think we've been making some good progress lately.
It's the main reason that it's the responsibility of male voices to tell their listeners to listen to female voices as well, because that lived experience can be really hard to see from the outside.
I hope my tone hasn't come across as lecturing, btw, just my thoughts from where I sit. :)
It’s a real thing, but thank you for mansplaining the topic anyway.
@@flowergirl5962 I never said it wasn’t a real thing. Again, we should condemn any disingenuous faux-feminist men trying to just pick up women, but it’s worth keeping in mind that this is a common trope in reactionary rhetoric used as an ad hominem attack to try to discredit any feminist opinions men hold without actually engaging with those ideas. There’s a balance where we say, “yes, this is a problem, but this is not automatically any hetero/bi man with feminist beliefs.” Hitting this nuance is precisely why I stated that, as a gay man, I’m not very familiar with women’s dating lives and this very well could be far more common than I would personally know.
I HAVE had an experience with a pick me guy and it was traumatizing. One time at a party a guy started following me around calling me a "goddess," asking why I didn't see myself as he saw me, and explaining how women are mistreated by men, blah blah blah. It was annoying at first because I could tell it was just an awkward approach to flirting, but he was so persistent and odd that it freaked me out so much I left the party. I had been drinking, so I was only intending to go to my car to sit and get away. BUT THIS GUY FOLLOWS ME OUT OF THE PARTY and towards my car because he "wants to make sure I'm okay," all while I start walking faster and explaining how I just want to be alone. I had to drive away while drunk because he refused to leave me alone (I ended up just driving out of sight and parking, but this man almost had me drunk driving to escape him). Horrifying experience.
wtfff glad nothing happened to you omg
Nah, I agree. You ARE a goddess
I’m starting to think this cow doesn’t exist ☹️
Shhh...
😔 Sadness
Don’t lose hope
She does exist, in our hearts 😔♥️
Mooooo
In Brazil, we call the pick me boys “esquerdomacho” a mix of “left male”, because feminism in BR is really related to the left wing. But the main point is, Brazilian pick me boys use feminism as a way to look sensitive and “nicer”, however are usually the most abusive ones.
kkkkkkk o fiuk aí
@@tonyhawksmovingcastle kkkkkkkkkkkkkkk “desculpa ser homem”
5:30 this happens with a lot of memes targeted at women. "Karens" exist as a woman who uses her privilege (usually white privilege) against other people (like calling the police on black people for no reason). It's a valid argument that came from the black community. But it's gotten out of hand and now every woman is a Karen. Its very annoying cause it gets in the way of the actual conversation we should be having about white privilege
For real. I see memes like guys vs girls, fitness memes centered around certain members of the FA community, etc. A lot of them seem to be "For the bros". I agree that the whole "date me or you're fatphobic" argument is bad, people have their preferences. The variants of those memes I see bash women.
Weird, in Brazil we already had a name for this for years, we call'em "feministos"
In Spain we use "aliade", which would be the gender neutral way of saying "ally", instead of the masculine "aliado" or the feminine "aliada". I'm not sure I really like it, I've never seen a "pick me boy" falsely claiming to be nonbinary to sleep with women. I've seen guys like this claiming to be "aliados feministas" (feminist allies), so I get what the term is trying to convey, but I still think that making it nonbinary is weird, it's like combining "pick me boys" with "transtrenders" lol
I actually think "feministos" would work pretty well in Spanish too, we should import it from Brazil lmao much better than "aliades". It's like making the word "feministas" (which at least in Spanish is completely gender neutral, idk about Portuguese) masculine, love that!
Someone in another comment said in Brazil they are called "esquerdomacho" is that different or just another word for the same thing?
@@christmastiger they mean pretty much the same thing, I guess esquerdomacho can only be applied to more of leftist ideology
Ou esquerdomachos amg
Maybe, “isn’t that a bit of a pick me statement?” Rather than “you ARE a pick me”
I've said this before with "problematic". The word doesn't make sense when applying it as a characteristic of a dynamic target, like a person. When you do, it implies that nothing the person ever does will make them acceptable, save being a martyr, and even then not so much.
This happens so much with the goth/alternative scene too. Guys try to act like they care and are open minded but it's really just fetishization yet again.
@Arthur Frayn wow you're an actual incel.
@Arthur Frayn incel
@Arthur Frayn Reading comprehension is apparently not your strong suit.
Being bitter is attractive to no one and neither is being desperate.
I agree so much. Men who say any alternative fashion that they can't fetishize is dumb. They looove conventionally attractive goth women with very specific makeup and body shapes. But that's it lol
So true.
In short most men don't care about our hobbies or interests, we are just literal sex objects to them ):
"pick me girls"
"pick me boys"
People who don't identify as gals or guys:
I mean do pick me enbys exist?
I think nbs already know not to try to gain aproval from conservatives
Idk as someone that considers themselves nonbinary thats how i feel
@@mateo4508 Thank you for clarifying!
The leave-us-aloNe-B-s
@@mateo4508 same, i think after being invalidated for so long because "nonono you have to be only a boy or a girl!1!!1!" we just learned to either fend for ourselves or help eachother out. I've never seen a pick-me-enby, but I have seen a lot of problematic nbs. Eh, well not everyone's perfect. You're right. Craving validation from crusty old people on Twitter who actively put you down is just stupid.
@@mateo4508 I think they might exist in 10 years or so.
What tends to happen is the left gains ground on human rights,
The right then engage in tokenism for the emancipated group,
Pick-mes are created as a result.
This has happened w/women, poc, homosexuals and transfolk for the past 150 years and it wouldn’t surprise me if enbys are next.
I don’t really think the Gold Star lesbian stuff is pick-me behavior, but it seems to be a way to gatekeep the lesbian community, especially in the more extreme examples where anyone who used to date men can’t be a lesbian. It’s rooted in my opinion in the expectation of women to be heterosexual, and often times perpetuated by women who feel upset that they never had the privilege of appearing straight to others. I don’t really think it’s a pick-me thing, but I don’t really know.
"Women just aren't as sexual as men"
🤢
No honey, you're just so unappealing they want nothing or as little as possible to do with you. I swear both genders are just as sexual as each other, it's just that women are shamed for it, hated for it, murdered for it, even just expressing it we're shunned. The guy who said that sounds like a creep.
Right. “Women just aren’t as sexual as men.” Just say no one wants you and keep it moving lmao
Yes but does he sound like a weirdo?
More than 2 but yeah
That's because women are taught to be ashamed of being sexual unless it is with their husband. A lot of insults towards women have to do with sex, for example, whore, slut, thot, bimbo. Even the simplest things like wearing clothes that show a little stomach or cleavage can get you called a slut by men and women. It is taught as something that is "bad". In media their is a lot of fixation and fetishization on a girl's virginity like in "Fifty shades of grey" where Christian Grey focused a lot on Anna's virginity and being untouched like it was some great thing. If you are shamed your whole life for being even a little sexual obviously you will repress it.
I realy think how sexyal someone is more based on them than their specific gender
Marco
Polo
@@josh111yn dammit! you beat me to it!