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Sail Life - Sailboat deck replacement, fairing the deck - DIY sailboat refit
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ต.ค. 2017
- Come join me for lots of sanding as I start fairing the deck aboard my 1987 Warrior 38 sailboat.
Thomas's video: • Two aboard Tuuli - Beh...
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Hey Mads, you should be perfectly fine to fill the low spot on the foredeck with just the fairing compound up to about 5mm. Any more than that you'll want to piece in some glass to build it up, and then fare :-) Looking good!!
for a little more than 5mm can you use long strand mixed filler?
I`m always glad to see comments from people who know
wath they are talking about.
I was JUST about to say exactly the same as Andy (ha ha)
Good luck with the rest of the job Mads.
Awesome Andy! I was going to reference your videos about the blush and fairing, you've done a great job covering this in depth, I'm sure he already watched them though and a specific response here is even better! looking forward to your next video as well as Mads' always!
What about adding 402?
You said that some of the areas were up to a centimeter deep. I've seen the guy from BoutworksToday use some of the chopped strand sheets with concentrically larger areas to fill sections like that. He likes the chopped strand because you can tear it by hand and the edges are easy to taper. So, maybe a sheet or 2 of chopped strand in the deepest section and then the fairing compound once it is no more than 5mm deep as he suggests?
PS We love your videos! You seem to be such an awesome person!
Congratulations Mads, she is slowly revielling her sweet lines.
Looks like your new deck has greatly increased the strength of the entire boat. Great work, Mads!
Thanks for mentioning the "behind the scenes" video, Mads :-) You have made some great progress and I am really happy to see, that the mahogony beam is just loose and not the superstructure compromised. - Thomas
Gonna miss watching all this sanding when your done with the boat, So much fun to watch
Any conversation that starts, "I want to show you something cool in the trunk of my car", usually gets weird quickly.
For the deck profile roundness inconsistencies you can cut a flexible plastic applicator to the correct profile and use it with the appropriate filler in the same basic way you use the straight knives to fair the 'flat' areas of the deck. Drag it bow to stern. If possible cut it so that a segment can ride along the correctly faired top deck and the other end on the lower deck surface. Pick your first layer of fill material based on the largest dimension to be filled. An alternative method is to use a wide knife and work filler up from the lower deck over the curve and onto the top deck. You can hand sand bow to stern with a long sanding block that takes adhesive back 2-3/4" sandpaper. Durablock makes different lengths. Autobody supply stores have these things. Or borrow one from the marina shop, if possible..
Been watching your videos for couples years now and they have become the first thing I look forward to when I wake up on a Sunday! Keep up the good work!
Monday night in New Zealand now complete having watched yet another great video
Your hard work and perseverance will pay off. You are making fantastic progress. Thanks for making these videos.
As most everyone else has already suggested, fix the low spot same way you would repair a ground out hull blister, a few layers of glass cut out in smaller and smaller pieces. Oh and nice job Mads! You're one of my heroes!
A friend repainted his 40' sailboat with Awlgrip this past February and applied the Kiwi Grip non-skid. It turned out beautiful! He purchased their rollers and followed the directions for a fantastic finish. Based upon his success, I believe you'll be quite happy with the results.
I wouldn't consider that box a "cliffhanger". Its not like you showed it to us, but refused to tell us what it is. Sure you didn't open it, but you're not using it yet, so no biggy. Its nice that you show us the stuff in advance, I like to see your planning stages, etc. Also, I wanted to commend you again on your lack of clickbait (for the most part). Its refreshing to see creative and humorous thumbnails instead of the Busty girlfriends in bikini's in every other channel, super classy of you, sir! Keep up the great content!
Pleeeeeease bring back the outtakes.... :-) we've been watching some of your earlier episodes, and they are just so great!
Yeay, Madsday, again!
One deck down, some more hull to glass ...
Seemingly, You did NOT mess up anything, deckwise - what You luckily figured out for Your own, already.
Well done, looks pretty dang spiffy, even with no gelcoat yet.
For Your low spot on the fore to port: I'd rather put in some additional glass layers to bring it up to about 1-2 mm before fairing, to prevent the notorious 10 mm layer of microballoons from giving in under load and messing up Your gelcoat/surface later.
Oh, and by the way: Feed and party Your laminating crew well, they absolutely deserve it!
I eagerly await your new channel: Sand Life!
Another great one Mads. Thanks for letting us share your adventure!
Another great step forward that leaves me full of admiration of your efforts. Incidentally I agree totally with other comments suggesting you consider the use of 'contoured' patch (or patches) of thicker glass mat, 'faired out' at the margins, as opposed to simply applying filler in the area of the deeper depression, it'll be lighter, yet a stronger fix and not liable to crack under load. We all know that foredecks can sometimes take a hammering, particularly with heavy crew hauling out water-filled dinghy's. Well done Mads - with 'thumbs up' from EF.
Re
I really enjoy watching the progress you are making on Athena. You may not have a lot of experience doing your various DIY projects, but you obviously do your research and always do a top notch job! Very well done videos!
I did Kiwigrip as the non-skip on my last boat. The old molded non-skid was badly cracked and worn. The Kiwigrip did a marvellous job of renewing the surface. I found that by varying the amount of material applied as well as varying the pressure on the roller, you could get a variety of textures. I did a less aggressive non-skid on the cockpit seats, and a much more aggressive texture on the foredeck. A couple of caveats: first, pay attention the the temp/humidity graph they supply - it really matters. Second, pull the masking tape right away after coating and rolling out. This allows the material to "slump" a bit as it sets up, and you get a nice soft edge. Third, this stuff stick tenaciously to anything. Have rags and a bucket of water at the ready. Oh, and lean your tools right away, and perhaps throughout the day. Fourth, the only downside I have found to the material is that it collects dirt in its nooks and crannies. I live in a place with a lot of airborne pollution, and the decks wanted more frequent washing then molded non-skid.
You can tape out quite a nice pattern of sections in the nonskid. You could even apply your boat logo with masking tape, perhaps just forward of the mast. I found that a notched trowel allowed me to apply the material evenly and efficiently before rolling. I also found that a large old paintbrush had just the right stiffness in its bristles to create texture in places where the roller couldn't reach. My son and I did the job on my boat together, on applying, one rolling and texturing, and it was perfect.
That's it ..I had to rewind to hear the word ...all the best you two .
To fix the low spot, I'd suggest using the heaviest fiberglass you've got and add a few layers of that. Andy will probably have words to say about it, I guess :) With regards to the fairing compound, I would suggest laying down a little bit more than you think you need. Though it doesn't shrink much when hardening. you're going to sand it, and you'll more than likely get low spots without the excess compound. Not much, just don't scrape it off quite as rigorously as you seem to be doing.
G'day Mads. You can use car body filler to refine your radius on the edge of the deck. Make up a tool from sheet metal with the 2 radius on it and use it to scrape your desired edge while screeding out car body filler. You can also use a guide to direct this tool to remove the wavy parts. I know this might be hard to follow so happy to try to explain further if you need.
Tim
Longboard for finishing is the way to go. Happy sanding.
For fairing a old hand saw with a straight back edge works well. They can be picked up at yard sales or second hand shops cheap. The spring steel in them always comes back to shape, yet they can be bent over the curve of a deck or hull and fair out larger areas than a drywall knife.
Hi Mads, great video. Enough detail on all the tasks without becoming tedious. That my friend is a balance learned over time. Perhaps a simple building of faring to solve the low area on the fore deck port side. You might want to check any beams located immediately below depression. An alternate to the coats of faring would be tapered shims glassed over the top of a beam near the depression.
The excess glass on a corner contour or hard edge can be knocked off rapidly with a belt sander. Maybe that trick can help with laying up glass in the future. Calm seas and fair winds my friend.
PS.. Already watched Thomas's Video. Was fun to get an on lookers point of view.
Hi Mads. A bit late making comments but your International Support Team appear to have covered everything - really looking good. By the way make all your internal deck beams do some work - so when you refix - first preload them a tad. When those big green waves hit you for the first time you will feel even safer!!
Mads, I re did the non skid on my small 20 foot sailboat last summer with Kiwi Grip and I am really happy on the end product and surprised with how easy it was to apply. BTW based of the testimonial you provided on your Butyl Tape episode 2 years ago or so (Sail Life - Rebedding deck-hull bolts using butyl tape), I have just re installed most of my deck hardware using Butyl tape and I have no leaks to report after a fairly major blustery rainfall earlier this week. Tks ;)
Looking good Mads! Thanks for sharing and adding the link of your friend's behind the scenes. Have a great week!
Kiwi grip is a great product easy to use and wears well. I used it on my boat and came up great. Practice on a board first. Use a good masking tape that does not get soggy when wet, as you need to remove the tape while the grip is still half wet and soggy cheap tape just tears.
My Sunday is now complete. Looking forward to next Sunday's instalment
The trouble with working on things like this is that you get to know every fine detail of the object. Unless it is a glaringly obvious fault in the work 99% of people won't ever see the " glaring imperfection " you perceive. If it is going to puddle water them a layer or two of glass in that area fared in will be a cure, othewrwise it will be lost under the finish and no one will be any the wiser. I enjoy your vids and approach to this restoration. Keep on keeping on.
Great job on the deck Mads! I would suggest skimming the fairing compound a little thicker, you shouldn't see any glass, just red. A majority of it will get sanded away but I think you are going to end up doing a second skim of fairing compound. I'm sure you already know how much easier that stuff is to sand so go with a finer grit on the belt and disc sanders. You may way to try your hand at a long board sander, you can make one DIY easily and will come in handy for fairing the hull. For the low spot I would calculate the thickness of you heaviest fiberglass cloth and lay in a few layers, progressively feathering back toward the center. I can't think of any other way to fill that 7mm low spot without using a ton of filler.
I would lay up more glass on that low spot. For that wavy radius I would slowly work down the high spots by hand using something to back the paper with that isn't too hard but nothing as soft as a sanding sponge. Styrofoam perhaps. You want some give so that you do not flatten the radius. Maybe some scrap deck coring? Sanding sponge could work too but I have feeling something harder beneath the sand paper to get the high spots down with would be better to start with.
Kiwigrip is good stuff. I think you'll be happy with it.
Ok, I have a way of fairing the radius at the edge of the deck, but it is difficult to explain without a drawing to help. First you must make a “drag” template of the radius that fits how you would expect the end product to look. It can be made of 2-3 mm thick aluminum. Then you need to fasten a spline (batten) down to the deck where the edge of the template ends, preferably on the top of the deck. Use hot glue or double faced tape. As you drag the template full of your filler along, it will form the radius. You may have to do several applications to get it perfect. Also, before you begin, make sure the deck surfaces at both the top and bottom of the template are fair. The template will ride on the two surfaces along the fairing batten. You can shape the template with the top radius and bottom fillet, and, Bob’s your uncle. I hope this explanation makes sense. I have done it many times. I wish I knew of another way to speak to you, but I’m not sure how to do it. Good luck. And keep up the good work.
Monday morning - wake up - coffee - Sail Life - Thanks for another great video!!
Hi Mads, I would strongly suggest not 407’ing the depression on your foredeck, lay up a bit more glass to bulk the main part the fair it in. To much 407 will leave you at risk of the epoxy cracking and will ruin your hard work. Awesome devotion, truly admirable 👍👍
Lay up another layer or two of light weight glass in your low spot and feather it out to the edges with a layer of veil or light weight CSM. Then fair as normal. Congrats on the new deck.
i like total boat fairing compound...no mixing fillers and priced right
Thank you, this makes my Sunday.. Looking great!
Kiwi grip is an awesome deck covering. I know I’m catching up on your videos so I hope you decided to go with kiwi grip.
Anyway I love watching your progress with all the ups and downs of restoration work
Hi Mads, you can obtain a better result trimming the fiber if you use a half-circle shape trimming tool. Great video as usual.
Hi Great vid beautiful work.
Tip walking on fresh FG bear foot can get FG splinters in your feet.
Tip A paper suit is a great idea to keep that itchy FG sanding dust off.
Use gloves and tape to seal the suit.
Tip You can fair the corners the same way you faired the top.
My .02 cents on filling the radius around the cabin top. Use the technique when we finish bull nose concrete steps. Cut a piece of plastic from a milk jug, about 6" x 6" or larger or more rectangular and use it as a tool to screed your fairing compound along the corner. It's stiff enough to hold a shape and pliable enough to conform to your radius.
Your deck looks really good. You could fair in the flat spot a little, and then put non skid on top. If you try to get the curves on both sides to be identical, you might drive yourself a little crazy. The deck needs to be strong, safe, and not leaky. I think you have accomplished that.
You could fill it with Awlfair or microballoons but 7 mm deep, it might later crack. My approach to the same problem was to treat that 60 x 60mm depression like filling in a through hull opening that's no longer needed; cut a circle of cloth just smaller than the depression, with more circles of cloth on top of that, each smaller and smaller. Then, sand and fair.
Mads, the deck on Athena looks great! Well done!
The deck looks better than new.
Thanks for a great vid Mads. Making the difficult look easy.
Nice work again Mads you keep me going on my own projects. Looking forward to the deck painting
What are we to look forward to once Athena is under way? My DIY Mondays will never be the same again :( You have made huge progress over your summer. Hope to meet you (and your girlfriend) in NZ when you come cruising this way.
Your going to love the kiwi grip! I used it on a fishing boat rebuild which held up well for several years then I sold the boat on.
Mads that is looking absolutly SPIFFY! WOW..JUST WOW! One day you have to come to the Great Lakes and sail! Would love to meet you and buy you a beer or 3! Maybe treat you to a good steak on the grill as well!
On the low spot in the deck---you might rough up the glass and lay in a few more layers of glass and then feather it into the rest of the deck, stronger than laying in a thick layer of fairing compound. Looks good so far-----Mikey--Seattle
It's great to see the light at the end of the redecking tunnel! Good job, Mads!
Great way to end the weekend for me. Job well done.
Actually looking forward to watching more below deck DIY videos....I bet you are too...fiberglass coming out of our eyeballs... :) great videos....last thing I watch on Sunday afternoon!
Hi Mads,
About fairing the deck you received some advice. I think it was a missed opportunity not to properly support the lower skin from below while you had the core out.. This can be done with a support similar to yours. At the trouble lower spots you push in some wedges between support and skin. Quite simple actually. Only consideration is that the lower skin was probably the wrong shape from the time the boat was build. So there is a limit, how much correction you can make without creating strain in the skin, which
could lead to delamination.
About fairing the side edge of the deck; Well… your favorite…. sanding. Sanding with a longboard / spline. Spline made out of wood, plywood or fiberglass. You can use longboard and chalk to mark high spots which are then sanded down with power tools. So if you have enough material you can sand right away, otherwise you would have to build up some material. Fairing compound or epoxy mixed with filler and some fibers. And… to repeat everybody else: I love your videos and project.
"And it may seem like I have absolutely no idea what i'm doing here...and that's because I basically don't...." just priceless Mads, this made me laugh a lot ! keep up the good work champ :)
I wish I had an answer for you on your questions, but I'm not a fiberglass guy hell I have only been on a sailboat once. I did want to say however I love your videos, just from a DIY pov it is crazy cool and makes me wish they were twice as long(I know the work involved to do that would be crazy). It does seem like that dip in the deck is too much for fairing compound and I would think it would crack like using a lot of Bondo on a car since I imagine the deck will flex a little when sailing.
Noisiest episode ever...great video as usual! Sand away Mads, sand away!!!
I have Kiwi-Grip on my small boat's deck.... great stuff! Lay down a thick (I mean THICK) coat with a wide knife, then slowly roll with the textured roller. Avoid going fast, it makes the tread too fine and slings that stuff father than you think. One coat should do it, overcoating is not a good idea. I dries with a waxy feel that several washings to get clear. Over-coating is fine after a few years, but on a new deck its kinda like dealing with amine blush between layers of epoxy.
Hello, re your low spot: get some water from your jug and tip it on the that section of the deck. See if it runs off. It is doesn't you are going to wish you had sorted that at this stage. Although boats rock about. You don't want water pooling. Using fresh water that way now, you are going to get a good idea of what you will have to live with. Also adjust your fore and aft heights (with jacks if needed) to line up with the real (not manufacturer marks) waterline marks you had. Then pour some water into those gullies around the edge of the deck and the toerail. See where the water might pool and not run off. You may want to design in some decent limber holes so water can run away easier. I did this on my last yacht and it was a beautiful thing.
Re your low spot in the deck: it is a real issue that you need to deal with. As per the comments below you will need to build it up using glass. Don't fill more than 3mm not 5mm. 5mm is too much.
You are doing a very good job btw. I really like the rate of progress and the fact moral is still high. Well done. Paul
great episode Mads. The deck look awesome. Cheers from PEI Canada, Bryan
Maybe now would be a good time to put a net under the large hatch to prevent anything from falling through;) Thanks for your hard work on these videos.
The deck is looking good. Keep up the excellent work.
Thanks for all the detail. Really enjoy your channel.
Glad there was no rabbit hole with the cabin top, although it would have just made for more video content lol. It's nice to see more companies reaching out to sponsor you. It's helpful for us when you try a product we may use in the future. Definitely looking forward to the O-tool review video. How is Obelix doing? Please give us an update on her when you can :)
Looking good Mads.
Have you looked at Flex Mold. It looks great and has a much nicer feel on bare feet or knees and looks great. I never have liked Kiwi Grip. It's like sand paper and it looks like an aftermarket job when your done. Also it can be a pain to clean. Flex Mold can look like a factory job if care is taken and it comes in just about every texture pattern you can think of.
Looks like you have done a fantastic job so far.
That deck is looking sweet!
Once again another awesome video Mads. Progress is coming along very nice. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
I think before you concern yourself with the taper of one side of the deck to the other, make sure the boat itself is level overall. As far as the dip, I wouldn't worry about it because the deck is tapered and almost all the time you'll be healing to one side or the other or rocking at anchor or dock. ....Unless it just bothers you and then you may take a good job and in trying to fix it, make a bigger problem in another way. Enjoy your video, and your determination.
Awesome vid, Mads. Excellent work. My only thought about your low spot is to build it up with a few layers of CSM. Personally, I'd probably just not sweat it...but you seem the type who would be eternally bothered by it. :)
For your Amine Blush cleaning, just add some vinegar to your hot water. 70/30 water to vinegar is good. I also wipe down with acetone to displace residual moisture but that isn't totally necessary.
Hey Mads! Looking good. for you low spot i would use some chop stranded matt, 3/4 oz not the 1 1/2 oz. (sorry i don't know what that equates to in grams.) you could lay multiple layers in the deeper area, and work you way out to the edges like you do if you were patching a hole in the hole.
I'm not sure why you are fairing the deck when you are going to put non-skid down. It will hide any defects. but Yeah, fill in the holes. I wouldn't worry about the slight waviness of the edge either. The only one who will ever know its there is YOU... and the only fix is --- yep... more sanding.
For me best way to achieve perfect surface is using light placed on the deck as low as possible, work better after dark ;)
You will see all the low spots that need to be filled.
For the edges I would use 30-40 cm pice of wood wrapped in 60 grid sand paper.
Belt sander is to agresive for edges and can do more harm than good.
Great video, always enjoy watching.
That new deck will be Awesome ! thanks
I agree with Andy on that one. No boat is perfect or symmetrical.Just use enough filler to make it smooth to the eye. Use your eye instead of a straight edge/level. Also you will not be disappointed with KiwiGrip. Great product, easy to apply and clean up(water-based), If you're not happy with the generic colors they offer, get white and have it tinted at your neighborhood paint store to whatever you like. There is a slight learning curve to applying it but it's not rocket science. All I ask is you please round off the corners when you mask it off to apply the KG. It'll look aesthetically more pleasing to the eye and more professional. Otherwise I think you're doing a great job!!! Getting closer every week!!!
You are tireless and seem to have endless wells of good cheer. You're amazing, Mads! (I miss Jökul!) :-)
Just noticed the teak hand rails...some new stainless steel rails would be a nice upgrade.
This time when you are visiting CA host a meetup with MADS!
I bet the neighbouring boats in your shed love you! All that dust! But looking good so far. Well done. :-)
me too
Andy miller shows how to fill in low spots using decreasing sized pieces of chopped strand fiberglass. Give him a call
5th😳Are you going to longboard for final finishing? The belt sander is deffo the go to tool for this stage.👍 Great progress.😀 I think if that deck depression is the only area of significant deviation AND you want to do something about it then the best way is probably more fibreglass layup.😳
I was going to suggest that you lay one more layer of glass in that lower area sand it down on the edges and then fair it.
Another good video. Question, though: don't the people who have the other boats in the shed object to all the fine epoxy dust getting on their boats? For the low spot, just build it up with layers of cloth patches (widest at bottom and progressively smaller on center), then do a final fairing with thickened epoxy (using a notched "trowel"}. For the cabintop edge radius, make yourself a sanding board with a corresponding concave face and go back & forth until it is fair. You can skim any exposed cloth fibers with thickened epoxy.
I see Boatworks Today has given you a good answer to the low spot on your foredeck... One centimeter is just to big a gap for any kind of filler. Slap in some glass patches however and then fare it out will keep it from having a week spot that cracks over a short time of use.
Majestic Mark. I don't agree.
The layup is all the same thickness. There isn't a weak spot, it's just a low spot.
Yes Gary Souza I understand that but if you fill it with fairing compound you will create a week spot that will crack over time. The fairing compound is not strong enough on it's own to fill a 1 centimeter gap. So this will end up cracking over time and creating a cosmetic problem. The deck is fine and will not have any problem but any paint applied on top will eventually show the crack of the fairing compound.
You don't have to agree but I can tell you first hand that if you fill that large of a low spot that is 1cm deep in time the fairing compound will crack leading to a cosmetic problem. The actual deck will not suffer any kind of problem because it is strong enough now.. However with the motion of boats fairing it without the fiberglass filler will show cosmetic stress cracks.
True Mark. But the point is I don't think it needs to be filled. Just use your eye to fair it in. Decades ago a fellow boat builder taught me that, and I guarantee if you took a straight edge to most boats you'd see they're not going to be straight. That's why when you long board a hull it's SO much work and expense. If Mads wants it all perfectly straight, he will have to add more glass.
I worked in a car work shop to level out large areas i would fill the depression then use a long sander you can get meter long sanders also to smooth off the edges you could use a large diameter router bit not sure if it will suit your needs but i like watching your videos so im keen to see what solution you come up with
The sanding channel.
Awesome job! Keep up the good work mads 😊
2 layers of coremat 4 mm in center and fairing compound all over will help you with this low spot.
An inspiration. Thank you.
If I were you I would take care of that support beam immediately and I wouldn't wait until after Winter. Really think about it, it's worth doing now...as tired as you may be. :)
Wow, sanding is such a messy job. Nice work sir.
Looking great!