@@GaryHiebner exactly to your point that they did more than just have some influences from Deftones. I get the connection there, but it’s silly to just state they’re a Deftones knock off. Hell, this album even has a black metal section. In my opinion, this record implemented so much that I see it more as their own signature sound. They earned that respect on my end. They set the stage for a new realm of shoegaze-core or post-Metalcore… or whatever you wanna call it.
Another band called Holy Fawn do a very nice job of blending metal tones with Shoegaze as well. They're a seriously underrated band that everyone should check out at least once
@@adrianmojica2619 there are tons of shoegaze elements in Deftones that are not samples. Delays and reverbs on the guitars , bass & synth are much more present than sampling
The Squier Bass VI is almost identical to this guitar and gets the job done as well for anyone that’s interested in this sound. Same 30 inch scale length and use strings 90-20 like Erik does. I also believe that he swaps out the 90 low string for a 105 bass string. Definitely look into it
Yeah the Bass VI and Jazzmaster Baritone have the exact same neck. The one Loathe guitarist also uses a Fender Pawnshop Bass VI. Suppose the pickups will sound quite different. But I have seen guys using a Bass VI and the swapping out the pickups for single coil sized humbuckers for a beefed sound.
Is it really you literally is the Pink Maggit/Back To School progression, I feel like they did it on purpose as a tribute rather than rip it off though
Does nobody remember those "metalgaze" or "blackgaze" bands that came out of the post-metal scene? I feel like nobody really talks about bands like Junius, Deafheaven, etc. anymore. Loathe's sound definitely reminds me of those bands from a decade ago.
Not the same, but check out Black Sun Eon or any of the other bands Tuomas the mastermind behind them has been in. It's classed as melodic death/doom, but it's got atmospheric and symphonic elements. Riffs are extremely unique, and it's often slow with unexpected chord changes and crazy melodies. Love it.
My favorite metal- ish shoegaze still comes from Iroha (Birmingham UK), guys from the Final, Jesu, Godflesh circle of people. They are no more, the follow up Khost is way more brutal / industrial. God, i loved Iroha. Great lesson Gary, thank you.
This is exactly the kind of content I'm always looking for! Great video! Since it's so hard to find those baritone jazzmasters, I've been considering one of those SubZero VI baritones and then just putting the appropriate pickups in it for this sound.
That is awesome. Glad you're enjoying the videos. And yeah the SubZero Bass VI is gonna be the way to go to get close to their sound. Maybe load it up with some Humbucker size P90's to get that single coil sound. To give you. hint, my next video is gonna be on 'Sounding Like Northlane'. So stay tuned for that one :)
@@GaryHiebner Nice! As I'm sure you gathered from my username, Northlane is also one of my favorite bands. Yeah, some humbucker sized P90s are exactly what I was thinking. Also, some fun facts about the tunings Loathe used on this album according to their drummer: Heavy Is The Head has the lowest string dropped to B0 on the Squier Baritone Jazzmaster. Screaming, Is It Really You? and A Sad Cartoon are actually played on a regular 25.5" scale guitar tuned as follows. Screaming tuning = ADADGB, Is It Really You? tuning = AbDbAbDbGbBb and A Sad Cartoon tuning = AbEbAbDbGbBb.
@@DJENTISNTNOTAGENRE Yeah that's why I mentioned about the new video. Man, thats pretty interesting with the B0 tuning and then standard scale guitars on the other songs. Where did you read/or find this out. Would love to read more about that.
@@DJENTISNTNOTAGENRE I also wonder how they gonna do those songs live. using their Jazzmasters or Standard scale. And are the standard scale guitars also Jazzmasters with the Duncan Designed Pickups?
@@GaryHiebner It was actually the drummer commenting about it on someone's cover of Is It Really You? here on TH-cam. I asked him how he knew this information before realizing his name is Sean Radcliffe lol. I tried out learning some of A Sad Cartoon in the tuning he suggested and it seemed to check out. I know there's a very small possibility it could be someone pretending to be him, but I think that's pretty unlikely given the nature of the information he gave and the fact that Loathe isn't exactly a really well known band just yet.
The album is amazing. Still at the top of the list of my favorite albums. And New Faces is a great track. The contrast between the heavy and more chilled bits is great!
Subbed. Great video. Listening to the last track (same name as album) and a couple of riffs sounded so dense and heavy that I assumed they had sourced a fretless baritone. Imagine the abyss a fretless baritone could create.
Yeah it is pretty Deftones, but its almost like they performing bass and guitar roles on the Baritone with their weird tunings. Like you've got Drop A, and then a lower strings lower then that add that extra lows to your chords and riffs. Its really fun to play with :)
Damn...excellent work my dude. My ear doesn't pick up those chords as well as yours does. I've been slowly making my way through A Sad Cartoon. Nice work!
Yeah also found out after making the video. I did the Nail the Mix session of theirs and watched George Lever’s video where he explains they mainly used Plini. Who would have thought. Interesting hey? I might have to do a follow up video :)
@@GaryHiebner yesssss loved this video but If you could make a second one showing us how to dial Loathe’s tones on the plini plugin and maybe even give us the presets to download. That would be much appreciated.
Soon as i heard these guys experimental styel I was reminded of certain Coaltar of the Deepers tracks, check them out guys, very different overall though you might pick up on it
Hey man I love the version of “A Sad Cartoon” you have on here. I’m working on a cover of this song using my 10-string guitar (an Agile Pendulum Pro 102730) to really get that low G# action that appears to be in the song. Kinda stuck on some of the chords used in the middle and the intro though. Sweet Jazzmaster Baritone too. I played one last year at my local GC and loved it. Shame they stopped making those last year. Anyway man, cool video. Stay safe! 🤘🏼😎
Just reading this now is kinda funny, I messaged the drummer on Instagram cuz he wrote that song & it’s actually on a regular 25.5” six string tuned to drop G#. they just use an octave effect for the low parts apparently!
Those string gauges on a 6 string sounds craaaaazy, but considering the tuning also we're talking about loathe and that ur using a baritone suddenly all makes sense hahahh
I'm going to try your string setup because what I'm currently using on the VMBJ is a 105 for the 6th and 74-20 from a 90-20 set for the other 5 and I keep snapping the second string when I attempt to tune. As a note, I'm using the same strings that Erik apparently uses (Bass VI short scale bass strings and a 105 from another bass set).
Nice. Yeah I’ve also tried it out on my 7-string. If you got humbuckers. Try coil split them to get a more single coil sound to match the Loathe single coil tone
If you don’t have humbuckers and already have single coils then it will be pretty close to the Jazzmaster single coil tone. Have fun playing some Loathe on a 7-string.
Yeah you can look at the Squier Bass VI, the Gear4Music SubZero 30-inch Baritone, the Gretsch Baritones which are 29,75 in scale length. And Harley Benton has the GuitarBass which is a 30-inch Bass VI.
@@GaryHiebner Man, I wish I bought the Subzero one before Loathe popularized it and causing it to go up £100 in price, and now it's not available to ship until September. T_T
Yeah C# isn't the lowest that bottom string goes, I'm 90% certain it goes to B when they play "Heavy Is The Head That Falls With The Weight Of A Thousand Thoughts" and that lead part for Two-Way Mirror sounds a little off
Yeah that's true. after the video I found out that 'Heavy is the Head' goes down to B0. That is crazy cool though. I see they both use 105 gauges on the 6th string to get down to that B0.
This was SUPER helpful as I’m trying to get a baritone guitar and make this specific genre, I do have one question though , when you had the 4 guitar tracks and panned them left and right , is every track a different guitar recording/take?
@@GaryHiebner thank you so much !! also, I know you did that nail the mix for this album , I don’t have the baritone yet, but did you know if the bass on this album is in the same tuning? Or is it just standard ?
Yep! Connor goes back and forth between a Jazzmaster Baritone and a Bass VI. Not sure if it's for specific songs or just what he feels like playing at the time, though.
while they do sound like deftones- they still rock and there a good alternative for that vibe of music. I could be wrong. Let me know about any bands with similar vibes \m/
Just to let everyone know. You can get a Sub Zero guitar for less then $300 right now. It's the same model the guitarist from Loathe uses. Awesome guitar!!!!! Will probaly cost ALOT less then a jazzmaster
@@GaryHiebner I've never been happy with the dirty tones though. I play heavy stuff and mostly on an HH strat with humbucker sized P90s tuned to drop A. For some reason I like the sound and of the floppy strings. I want to find the sound with the baritone, but it keeps sounding boxy or nasaly. I think I've got the wrong strings and I need to give it a good setup though. I hate really heavy gauge G strings that aren't wound, they stick out too much and don't stay in tune.
You could possible go down to the Drop E tuning on a 28-inch. But you will need to use thicker strings. And depending on the bridge and how far you can push back the saddles you might have slight intonation issues. I know I have gone down to Drop E fone on my Stagemaster 7 with a 28 inch Baritone neck conversion. But a 30 inch handles it way better
Near the end of the video I do go through the amp emulation and pedal emulsion software I use to get the sound. It's mainly the amp and cab giving the sound, then with a Tubescreamer in the front and some post EQ processing.
Yeah sometimes I do that. And other times I also quad track track. For these tracks it felt good to just duplicate and send through some different effects.
It intonate fine on my Baritones with 28-inch scale and 30-inch scale in Drop E. It's all preference. I like the tonality of guitars this low. Has it's limitations like you can't play chords once you get below G1, but its fun to play with :)
Thank you for being one of the best channels on TH-cam. What are you thoughts on the Subzero Baritone? Loathe featured one in a recent video (th-cam.com/video/W4vcSdkw2IA/w-d-xo.html) - Do you think it's better to save for something more like the Bass VI, or would the Subzero be good stock? My friends suggest the Subzero would need an additional $200+ in upgrades to be good.
Thanks. Yeah I think the Subzero Bass Vi is an awesome option. But yeah definitely budget in a few mods. Like a oickup change and maybe a good setup. Heard some mixed reviews on the QC on them. But nothing that a good setup csnt fix up. I'm definitely thinking of getting one of the new white SubZeros
You can get down to the Drop E on a 28 inch, but I think any lower is pushing it and you gonna run into ontonation issues. I tried Drop E on my 28 inch 7 string and it worked fine with the riggt string gauges. So maybe like a 16-85 on a 28 inch Baritone for Drop E.
@@GaryHiebner thanks for the info man, being a lefty really limits your options. Sounds like I may have to put the baritone dreams to bed and go extended range. Cheers again man, subbed.
You could find a good luthier near you and get a barirone conversion neck made. Thats what I did. I got a good luthier near me to build a 28 inch baritone conversion neck for my 7 string.
Hi, thanks for this video! I just fall in love with this band for you, after being watching videos of my same guitar, I just found you and your channel! Sorry, could you share the tunning of the guitar?
Glad you enjoyed the video. I’ve used a combination of different tunings. But for the most part the 5th to 1st string is a Drop A tuning and then on the 6th string I switch between a Low E to a Low DB and down to the low D. So as long as you have a thick gauge on the 6th string like a .100 gauge you can change that low tuning and still have good tension
I’m looking at buying a Subzero Rogue VI which is a baritone already tuned EADGBE but an octave below a normal guitar. How would I tune that to EAEADF#? Would the D and G get tuned UP?
Yes that's correct. The 6th and 5th strings stay the same. Where the other strings are all tuned up 2 semitones (up a step). The best way to think of the tuning is the 1st to 5th strings are tuned to Drop A. And then the 6th string is an extra low E.
They only recently started using those. They used the Jazzmasters on their first album and then I Let It In... For example if you watch the Two Way Mirror video they using the Jazzmaster in their and Connor also used a Fender Pawnshop Bass VI that you can see in that video. But yeah in their latest playthrough videos you see them using the SubZero and Gretsch in those videos.
From lowest string to highest: EAEADF#. And then they tune the low down even further to C#1 and B0 on some songs. But the rest of the strings stay the same.
Yeah I only found that out recently. I did the Nail The Mix session with them and I see George Lever mentioned that Erik doesn’t like tube screamers. Haha! Who doesn’t like tube screamers!
The model is a Squier Jazzmaster Baritone. But it has a 30 inch scale. It comes tuned in A Std from the factory. But if you put thicker strings on you can tune it down E Std like a Bass VI, or even lower.
I’m wondering if the Ernie ball 9 string set will work on them as well? They literally have the exact same string gauges on the 8 string set but have added the 105 string with it
@@GaryHiebner deafheaven and Oathbreaker. Deafheaven includes a lot of super heavy riffs in their songs but also has a lot of pretty mellow shoegaze parts. Oathbreaker is an experiment black metal band which has a much more black metal sound but there are riffs that you can get lost in because due to how ambient their sound is. Listen to the song being able to feel nothing but the version from audiotree live. It’s absolute insanity.
The pitch shift effect is bypassed. That’s just in my template and I turn it in when needed. There’s no pitch shifting going on with these Loathe riffs. Just the guitar tuned differently.
You can slap some thick string on, like maybe 20-90 and you could possibly use the tuning. But your intonation might go off when you get closer to the 12th fret and higher
Yeah this guitar has a great single coil tone. Those Duncan Designed Jazzmaster pickups are pretty unique. I used a combination of different cab emulations for the guitar tones.
I used the following custom set 100,62,48,34,24,16. Which is basically the Ernie Mammoth set from the 62-16. And then have chucked on a 100 for the 6th string.
I am still on the lookout for that Jazzmaster Baritone but for the time being I got the Harley Benton GuitarBass VS and threw in some hotrods that I had left over from another project. I HIGHLY recommend that guitar. m.thomannmusic.com/harley_benton_guitarbass_vs_vintage_series.htm
That’s pretty cool. Heard some cool stuff with those guitars. Check out an artists called Caynug. He uses that same guitar with some Bare Knuckles in it and tunes down to low D. He’s got an awesome tone with it.
I like how Loathe released one of the most aggressive Deftones albums. Joking aside, "I let it in and it took everything" is a metal masterpiece.
Yeah they do have a definite Deftones influence. But they do so much more with regards to genre bending.
@@GaryHiebner exactly to your point that they did more than just have some influences from Deftones. I get the connection there, but it’s silly to just state they’re a Deftones knock off. Hell, this album even has a black metal section.
In my opinion, this record implemented so much that I see it more as their own signature sound. They earned that respect on my end. They set the stage for a new realm of shoegaze-core or post-Metalcore… or whatever you wanna call it.
@@shaggy4847 i think that "black metal reference" is a reference from Deafheaven, that they do like some shoegaze/black metal stuff
You guys should check out hum
@@lol-od4ip that’s what I was thinking. Hum’s new album has this vibe
Another band called Holy Fawn do a very nice job of blending metal tones with Shoegaze as well. They're a seriously underrated band that everyone should check out at least once
yes boy!
^^ THIS ^^
hell yeah man, holy fawn is a local band for me in arizona, so seeing them get talked about is super cool
YES YES YES!!!
Holy fawn are the best ! holy fawn and loathe are in my top albums of this year for sure !
They combine their hardcore roots into massive Deftones influence with a more metallic twist. It's so fucking wicked
I see how shoegaze and metal can go well together since theyre both about volume to some extent
Yeah they great styles to mix together.
Eh. I guess, but shoegaze is more or less about atmosphere and timbre more so than volume. Volume is an effect people like Kevin Shields love
Yup. Deftones, Alcest, and now Loathe are a few examples of bands that mix them really well
They are both about atmosphere
Found you lol
Tips: use bridge cables as guitar strings
Step 1: Listen to and learn LOTS of Deftones
Deftones' riffs are mostly just power chords. Most of the shoegaze sound comes from the samplings.
You are right to an extent. That “is it you” track is the same progression from back to school off the white pony album
@@adrianmojica2619 lies
@@adrianmojica2619 there are tons of shoegaze elements in Deftones that are not samples. Delays and reverbs on the guitars , bass & synth are much more present than sampling
@@scottneilson2314 true but loathe add some extra spice in my opinion they’ve took deftones and made it there on sound
The Squier Bass VI is almost identical to this guitar and gets the job done as well for anyone that’s interested in this sound. Same 30 inch scale length and use strings 90-20 like Erik does. I also believe that he swaps out the 90 low string for a 105 bass string. Definitely look into it
Yeah the Bass VI and Jazzmaster Baritone have the exact same neck. The one Loathe guitarist also uses a Fender Pawnshop Bass VI. Suppose the pickups will sound quite different. But I have seen guys using a Bass VI and the swapping out the pickups for single coil sized humbuckers for a beefed sound.
Yea homie has bass strings on his guitar lol
There's also the agile intrepid 630. Same scale length, but it has emg's
Heard that thing can't stay in tune at all
Okay, I love the sound... but jeez guys, _that_ progression is so similiar to "Back to School" :)
Yeah, its pretty similar to Deftones stuff. I think I have seen them a couple of times mention Deftones as an influence. So that makes sense.
Is it really you literally is the Pink Maggit/Back To School progression, I feel like they did it on purpose as a tribute rather than rip it off though
No fuckin' way did I just find a South African metal youtube channel. Fuck yeah bro! Subbed.
Edit: Bonus points for Loathe btw
Haha! Saffas FTW!
sounds great! Your version of the guitars for "Is It Really You?" sounds perfect!
Thanks, such a great song
Does nobody remember those "metalgaze" or "blackgaze" bands that came out of the post-metal scene? I feel like nobody really talks about bands like Junius, Deafheaven, etc. anymore. Loathe's sound definitely reminds me of those bands from a decade ago.
Numenorean are top tier. Their Adore album is amazing
Not the same, but check out Black Sun Eon or any of the other bands Tuomas the mastermind behind them has been in. It's classed as melodic death/doom, but it's got atmospheric and symphonic elements. Riffs are extremely unique, and it's often slow with unexpected chord changes and crazy melodies. Love it.
My favorite metal- ish shoegaze still comes from Iroha (Birmingham UK), guys from the Final, Jesu, Godflesh circle of people.
They are no more, the follow up Khost is way more brutal / industrial. God, i loved Iroha. Great lesson Gary, thank you.
This is exactly the kind of content I'm always looking for! Great video! Since it's so hard to find those baritone jazzmasters, I've been considering one of those SubZero VI baritones and then just putting the appropriate pickups in it for this sound.
That is awesome. Glad you're enjoying the videos. And yeah the SubZero Bass VI is gonna be the way to go to get close to their sound. Maybe load it up with some Humbucker size P90's to get that single coil sound. To give you. hint, my next video is gonna be on 'Sounding Like Northlane'. So stay tuned for that one :)
@@GaryHiebner Nice! As I'm sure you gathered from my username, Northlane is also one of my favorite bands. Yeah, some humbucker sized P90s are exactly what I was thinking. Also, some fun facts about the tunings Loathe used on this album according to their drummer: Heavy Is The Head has the lowest string dropped to B0 on the Squier Baritone Jazzmaster. Screaming, Is It Really You? and A Sad Cartoon are actually played on a regular 25.5" scale guitar tuned as follows. Screaming tuning = ADADGB, Is It Really You? tuning = AbDbAbDbGbBb and A Sad Cartoon tuning = AbEbAbDbGbBb.
@@DJENTISNTNOTAGENRE Yeah that's why I mentioned about the new video. Man, thats pretty interesting with the B0 tuning and then standard scale guitars on the other songs. Where did you read/or find this out. Would love to read more about that.
@@DJENTISNTNOTAGENRE I also wonder how they gonna do those songs live. using their Jazzmasters or Standard scale. And are the standard scale guitars also Jazzmasters with the Duncan Designed Pickups?
@@GaryHiebner It was actually the drummer commenting about it on someone's cover of Is It Really You? here on TH-cam. I asked him how he knew this information before realizing his name is Sean Radcliffe lol. I tried out learning some of A Sad Cartoon in the tuning he suggested and it seemed to check out. I know there's a very small possibility it could be someone pretending to be him, but I think that's pretty unlikely given the nature of the information he gave and the fact that Loathe isn't exactly a really well known band just yet.
That random fade in the middle of the video started freaking me out. Thought I was having a stroke.
Very good job on figuring out the chords !!
Thanks a lot!
Yes! Bring on more of these!
Awesome! Glad you enjoyed the video. Will definitely do more. Take a look also at my recent Northlane one I did. And send any suggestions as well
Great stuff. My guitar teacher from 1998 would have had a cow with that thumb mute. Haha .
my favourite song from the album is new faces in the dark because of the really heavy bits and the Quite light parts. it's just an amazing song
The album is amazing. Still at the top of the list of my favorite albums. And New Faces is a great track. The contrast between the heavy and more chilled bits is great!
this is tight and is exactly what i've been looking for
Awesome. Glad you enjoyed the video
One of the best videos, I ever see in youtube. Freaking awesome dude, congrats!!!! Greetings from brazil
Awesome. Glad you enjoyed the video
Great guitar, love this sound. Thank you so much for this démonstration 👍🙏❤️
Subbed. Great video.
Listening to the last track (same name as album) and a couple of riffs sounded so dense and heavy that I assumed they had sourced a fretless baritone. Imagine the abyss a fretless baritone could create.
A fretless baritone would be insane!
This is cool. All loathe stuff that isn’t heavy is just Deftones to me personally. I’m not hating on it. I do similarly with my music. Love the video!
Yeah it is pretty Deftones, but its almost like they performing bass and guitar roles on the Baritone with their weird tunings. Like you've got Drop A, and then a lower strings lower then that add that extra lows to your chords and riffs. Its really fun to play with :)
Apparenty they used the Neural DSP Plini Archetype for the album
Yeah found this out after doing the video. Saw it in the Nail The Mix session.
@@GaryHiebner still awesome video keep it up bro
Woah good to know
Kinda crazy you can spend like $450 ($300 guitar + $150 plugin) plus some studio monitors and a computer and you have their sound
@@dilbophagginz Baritone jazz masters are usually at least $1000+
Damn...excellent work my dude. My ear doesn't pick up those chords as well as yours does. I've been slowly making my way through A Sad Cartoon. Nice work!
Yeah it was a bit of trial and error figuring out these riffs. Have fun figuring out some of the other songs :)
Recently, at least one of the guitarists, switchted to the Subzero Rouge VI from Gear4music. Maybe u should check them out.
Nice explanation 👍🏻 thank you for sharing your knowledge
*Cries in standard 6*
Shrill
A sad cartoon was played on a six tuned to G#
It has been revealed to us that most of the tones on the album are from archetype plini.
Yeah also found out after making the video. I did the Nail the Mix session of theirs and watched George Lever’s video where he explains they mainly used Plini. Who would have thought. Interesting hey? I might have to do a follow up video :)
@@GaryHiebner yesssss loved this video but If you could make a second one showing us how to dial Loathe’s tones on the plini plugin and maybe even give us the presets to download. That would be much appreciated.
Soon as i heard these guys experimental styel I was reminded of certain Coaltar of the Deepers tracks, check them out guys, very different overall though you might pick up on it
Thanks for the suggestion. Thats a very cool band.
Hey man I love the version of “A Sad Cartoon” you have on here. I’m working on a cover of this song using my 10-string guitar (an Agile Pendulum Pro 102730) to really get that low G# action that appears to be in the song. Kinda stuck on some of the chords used in the middle and the intro though. Sweet Jazzmaster Baritone too. I played one last year at my local GC and loved it. Shame they stopped making those last year. Anyway man, cool video. Stay safe! 🤘🏼😎
Nice. Try figure out 'Heavy is the Head that Falls' That goes down to B0. You might be able to figure that out on your 10-string
Just reading this now is kinda funny, I messaged the drummer on Instagram cuz he wrote that song & it’s actually on a regular 25.5” six string tuned to drop G#. they just use an octave effect for the low parts apparently!
.100 GAUGE STRING?!?!?! Damn!!!
It's Reminds me of Cave-in or Oceansize at the beginning
So, its basically HUM?
apparently
great video
Those string gauges on a 6 string sounds craaaaazy, but considering the tuning also we're talking about loathe and that ur using a baritone suddenly all makes sense hahahh
Yeah its sounds crazy till you consider the tuning and scale length. Those guitars are basically short scale basses.
@@GaryHiebner facts, suddenly I need a baritone in my life
amazing brother
Thanks, glad you enjoyed it
@@GaryHiebner sure did bro. pretty cool .hey if you haven't yet. give us a listen. would love to know what you think of our band and music
You should do “how to” for building modern death metal tones. Such as slaughter to prevail, thy art is murder, and to the grave
Great idea. Will definitely consider this.
You love A Sad Cartoon so much haha! totally agree man keep it going!
It's a great tune. Had to do two riffs from that song!
amazing video man. Do you have some pointers to achieve their ambient sound? especially the one in "is it really you" verse just before the chorus
I'm going to try your string setup because what I'm currently using on the VMBJ is a 105 for the 6th and 74-20 from a 90-20 set for the other 5 and I keep snapping the second string when I attempt to tune. As a note, I'm using the same strings that Erik apparently uses (Bass VI short scale bass strings and a 105 from another bass set).
Yeah I tried that same set as Erik but found the tension to be a bit high.
Excellent vid!
Thanks, glad you enjoyed the video
8:58 shi got layers to it ian gon lie
Love the breakdown! Question for you is where did you manage to get a .100 Gauge string for this setup? I'm looking to put one on my JM!
You can use a 100 single bass string. Or look at some Bass VI sets like from Newtone that have 100s in them
@@GaryHiebner Thanks for the help man!
Love this video.
Thanks so much
Ive been jamming loathe on my seven string
Nice. Yeah I’ve also tried it out on my 7-string. If you got humbuckers. Try coil split them to get a more single coil sound to match the Loathe single coil tone
@@GaryHiebner That's a great idea but don't have humbuckers unfortunately
If you don’t have humbuckers and already have single coils then it will be pretty close to the Jazzmaster single coil tone. Have fun playing some Loathe on a 7-string.
@@GaryHiebner i got a better job so i may actually be able to get a baritone now lmao
@@GaryHiebner got a baritone and it slaps!
Can't find a Vintage Baritone anywhere now. What would be the best similar baritone to get? Bass VI or Rogue VI?
Yeah you can look at the Squier Bass VI, the Gear4Music SubZero 30-inch Baritone, the Gretsch Baritones which are 29,75 in scale length. And Harley Benton has the GuitarBass which is a 30-inch Bass VI.
@@GaryHiebner Man, I wish I bought the Subzero one before Loathe popularized it and causing it to go up £100 in price, and now it's not available to ship until September. T_T
Got my Squire Bass VI today and could not be happier. Plays like a much more expensive guitar. 100% recommend.
Yeah C# isn't the lowest that bottom string goes, I'm 90% certain it goes to B when they play "Heavy Is The Head That Falls With The Weight Of A Thousand Thoughts" and that lead part for Two-Way Mirror sounds a little off
Yeah that's true. after the video I found out that 'Heavy is the Head' goes down to B0. That is crazy cool though. I see they both use 105 gauges on the 6th string to get down to that B0.
Damn you made me notice that my tuning was wrong 😅
Haha! What tuning did you use?
More baritone metal lessons would be neat!
Definitely. Some more baritone videos are definitely coming up.
This was SUPER helpful as I’m trying to get a baritone guitar and make this specific genre, I do have one question though , when you had the 4 guitar tracks and panned them left and right , is every track a different guitar recording/take?
Glad you liked the video. Yes every guitar track is a new take.
@@GaryHiebner thank you so much !! also, I know you did that nail the mix for this album , I don’t have the baritone yet, but did you know if the bass on this album is in the same tuning? Or is it just standard ?
I think the bass is in the same tuning. So its tuned in unison in the same octave as the guitars (EAEA)
I know the Channel its about low tones but i'd would love If you made a vídeo about Holy fawn and DIIV
Holy Fawn is amazing. Definitely thinking about a video on them.
hypeeeeee!!!
@@GaryHiebneryesss please!!!!
Agressive evolution frr
I liked this video before watching it...sue me.
I also think they use Squire Bass VI's as well
yeah the second guitarist Connor uses a Squire Bass VI
Yep! Connor goes back and forth between a Jazzmaster Baritone and a Bass VI. Not sure if it's for specific songs or just what he feels like playing at the time, though.
while they do sound like deftones- they still rock and there a good alternative for that vibe of music.
I could be wrong. Let me know about any bands with similar vibes \m/
Just to let everyone know. You can get a Sub Zero guitar for less then $300 right now. It's the same model the guitarist from Loathe uses. Awesome guitar!!!!! Will probaly cost ALOT less then a jazzmaster
Yeah thats true. Connor used a SubZero, and Erik is now using the Gretsch Baritone.
I have that exact guitar.
Great guitars!
@@GaryHiebner I've never been happy with the dirty tones though. I play heavy stuff and mostly on an HH strat with humbucker sized P90s tuned to drop A. For some reason I like the sound and of the floppy strings. I want to find the sound with the baritone, but it keeps sounding boxy or nasaly. I think I've got the wrong strings and I need to give it a good setup though. I hate really heavy gauge G strings that aren't wound, they stick out too much and don't stay in tune.
Could this work with the PRS baritone or the ibanez baritone? (Length is 27.7" - 28" inches)
You could possible go down to the Drop E tuning on a 28-inch. But you will need to use thicker strings. And depending on the bridge and how far you can push back the saddles you might have slight intonation issues. I know I have gone down to Drop E fone on my Stagemaster 7 with a 28 inch Baritone neck conversion. But a 30 inch handles it way better
Okay but how about what pedals to use for the shoegaze sound 😩😂😂
Near the end of the video I do go through the amp emulation and pedal emulsion software I use to get the sound. It's mainly the amp and cab giving the sound, then with a Tubescreamer in the front and some post EQ processing.
I came just by listening “Is it really you”
Fun fact, they used a free lepou amp sim for two way mirror
Yeah thats interesting. I remember hearing that. Definitely gonna try it out.
so you only actually record 2 different guitar takes, the other trackings are just copy and paste's with different effects?
Yeah sometimes I do that. And other times I also quad track track. For these tracks it felt good to just duplicate and send through some different effects.
Can you please make a tutorial on how to get those scratch/screeching sounds that loathe makes?
Yeah great idea. I think they'd sing it with Whammy pedals. One is on my Wishlist and when I get one I'll definitely do a video on that
Is tuning to drop e necessarily needed, bass vi can be difficult to intonate plus setting up that low can be limiting
It intonate fine on my Baritones with 28-inch scale and 30-inch scale in Drop E. It's all preference. I like the tonality of guitars this low. Has it's limitations like you can't play chords once you get below G1, but its fun to play with :)
What kind if style/bpm drum sample was this?
I used GGD Invasion as the drum samples. What do you mean by the style and bpm?
The songs sound much better with doubled speed
Thank you for being one of the best channels on TH-cam. What are you thoughts on the Subzero Baritone? Loathe featured one in a recent video (th-cam.com/video/W4vcSdkw2IA/w-d-xo.html) - Do you think it's better to save for something more like the Bass VI, or would the Subzero be good stock? My friends suggest the Subzero would need an additional $200+ in upgrades to be good.
Thanks. Yeah I think the Subzero Bass Vi is an awesome option. But yeah definitely budget in a few mods. Like a oickup change and maybe a good setup. Heard some mixed reviews on the QC on them. But nothing that a good setup csnt fix up. I'm definitely thinking of getting one of the new white SubZeros
@@GaryHiebner Thank you so much for the reply! Yeah those white ones look soso good. What kind of pickups do you think would go well with the Subzero?
Great video man! Do you think you could get down to those tunings on a 28' scale baritone guitar?
You can get down to the Drop E on a 28 inch, but I think any lower is pushing it and you gonna run into ontonation issues. I tried Drop E on my 28 inch 7 string and it worked fine with the riggt string gauges. So maybe like a 16-85 on a 28 inch Baritone for Drop E.
@@GaryHiebner thanks for the info man, being a lefty really limits your options. Sounds like I may have to put the baritone dreams to bed and go extended range. Cheers again man, subbed.
You could find a good luthier near you and get a barirone conversion neck made. Thats what I did. I got a good luthier near me to build a 28 inch baritone conversion neck for my 7 string.
Would a 130 gauge on the 6th string be too much on the neck?
And tuning down to what with it? I know guys have used 120s on the Jazzmaster and tuned it down to B0
Harley Benton does one too!
Yes. Their one looks great. It has single coils. So if you want a hum bucker you will need single coiled sized humbuckers.
Hi, thanks for this video! I just fall in love with this band for you, after being watching videos of my same guitar, I just found you and your channel!
Sorry, could you share the tunning of the guitar?
Glad you enjoyed the video. I’ve used a combination of different tunings. But for the most part the 5th to 1st string is a Drop A tuning and then on the 6th string I switch between a Low E to a Low DB and down to the low D. So as long as you have a thick gauge on the 6th string like a .100 gauge you can change that low tuning and still have good tension
I’m looking at buying a Subzero Rogue VI which is a baritone already tuned EADGBE but an octave below a normal guitar. How would I tune that to EAEADF#? Would the D and G get tuned UP?
Yes that's correct. The 6th and 5th strings stay the same. Where the other strings are all tuned up 2 semitones (up a step). The best way to think of the tuning is the 1st to 5th strings are tuned to Drop A. And then the 6th string is an extra low E.
@@GaryHiebner Thanks! My Strat’s in drop A so I totally get it
@@GaryHiebner, is it feels well with 24-84, or i need a different gauge to tune like this? i mean a tuned up 1st and 2nd strings.
Is the jazzmaster a specific model?
Yeah it’s the Squier Jazzmaster Baritone with a 30-inch scale. It has now been discontinued. Pity.
Given you some taam??
100 gauge string daaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyum
Is that a 30” scale baritone bass6
Yeah, it's the Squier Jazzmaster Baritone with a 30 inch scale. But it's pretty much a Bass VI
Im trying to play Is it really you?. But i cannot make my Fender Lt25 amp to sound like it. Someone pleasee help
I let it In and it took everything uses a subzero rogue VI I think, not the jazzmaster. and that one gretsch baritone
They only recently started using those. They used the Jazzmasters on their first album and then I Let It In... For example if you watch the Two Way Mirror video they using the Jazzmaster in their and Connor also used a Fender Pawnshop Bass VI that you can see in that video. But yeah in their latest playthrough videos you see them using the SubZero and Gretsch in those videos.
@@GaryHiebner I was going off the playthroughs that's probably it
@@GaryHiebner Also they supposedly used Danelectro 56 bari in The Cold Sun recordings
@@entyzst Oh, that's interesting. SoDid they use the Danelectro 56's before the Squier Jazzmaster Baritones?
1-5th drop A? What are each strings tuning?
From lowest string to highest: EAEADF#. And then they tune the low down even further to C#1 and B0 on some songs. But the rest of the strings stay the same.
They actually don't use any tube screamer or any sort of od in their sound.
Yeah I only found that out recently. I did the Nail The Mix session with them and I see George Lever mentioned that Erik doesn’t like tube screamers. Haha! Who doesn’t like tube screamers!
It is a baritone or a bass vi?
The model is a Squier Jazzmaster Baritone. But it has a 30 inch scale. It comes tuned in A Std from the factory. But if you put thicker strings on you can tune it down E Std like a Bass VI, or even lower.
Could you use a fender 60's vintage jazzmaster for a similar tone?
TurboTurkey 94 I’m pretty sure you could, the only reason the baritone is used is because of how low the tuning is
Yeah you could, the jazz master pickups may be slightly different. As they as Duncan Designed Jazzmaster Pickups.
Go on Turbo Turkey
Did you have to sand the nut to fit those string gauges? Or can they fit stock?
Yeah I had to sand the nut. I just used the string and moved it back and forth between the slot to widen it. Til it fitted snug in the slot.
What type of Andrew Baena is this Channel?
I’m wondering if the Ernie ball 9 string set will work on them as well?
They literally have the exact same string gauges on the 8 string set but have added the 105 string with it
The 105 on the EB 9 strings set tapers at about 29 inches. So if you have a 30 inch baritone. It will be a problem.
@@GaryHiebner ah gotcha thanks for the tip
Appreciate it
@@GaryHiebner another question can the D'ADDARIO 8 string pack work was well?
Why does your tone sound alittle different from theirs?
Hears your accent; Leo pointing at tv meme
Hey, can anyone list bands that plays shoegaze + metal like this, besides Loathe? It means a lot to me. Thanks!
Deftones is obviously a good one. I'd also like to hear of some other shoegaze metal suggestions.
@@GaryHiebner deafheaven and Oathbreaker. Deafheaven includes a lot of super heavy riffs in their songs but also has a lot of pretty mellow shoegaze parts. Oathbreaker is an experiment black metal band which has a much more black metal sound but there are riffs that you can get lost in because due to how ambient their sound is. Listen to the song being able to feel nothing but the version from audiotree live. It’s absolute insanity.
Nothing. That’s the band name, check it out.
I'm confused as to what you're doing with the pitch shift on that first track you showed us.
The pitch shift effect is bypassed. That’s just in my template and I turn it in when needed. There’s no pitch shifting going on with these Loathe riffs. Just the guitar tuned differently.
@@GaryHiebner Alright, thanks for the answer. I didn't hear any pitch shifting happening and it confused me for a second.
GREAT:)
what scales do they use the most?
My band adds a lot of this same element were called desolate blight, album we just put out is nostalgic dread!!
Do you think a 27" scale 6 string guitar will hold this tuning well?
You can slap some thick string on, like maybe 20-90 and you could possibly use the tuning. But your intonation might go off when you get closer to the 12th fret and higher
single coil wow im surprised also the cab ix 2x12 no?
Yeah this guitar has a great single coil tone. Those Duncan Designed Jazzmaster pickups are pretty unique. I used a combination of different cab emulations for the guitar tones.
Heavy Tones yeah I have Duncan designed pick ups on my squier vintage modified strat guitar not bad at all
what guage are those strings?
I used the following custom set 100,62,48,34,24,16. Which is basically the Ernie Mammoth set from the 62-16. And then have chucked on a 100 for the 6th string.
I am still on the lookout for that Jazzmaster Baritone but for the time being I got the Harley Benton GuitarBass VS and threw in some hotrods that I had left over from another project. I HIGHLY recommend that guitar.
m.thomannmusic.com/harley_benton_guitarbass_vs_vintage_series.htm
That’s pretty cool. Heard some cool stuff with those guitars. Check out an artists called Caynug. He uses that same guitar with some Bare Knuckles in it and tunes down to low D. He’s got an awesome tone with it.
@@GaryHiebner checking now, thanks man
o a t h b r e a k e r
The second chord in the 10:22 progression is wrong doesn’t sound right but the rest is absolutely spot on
Great work subbed and liked
Haha! Sounded right to me at the time. Also no tabs around the check the exact chords :) Glad you enjoyed the video and like the channel.
What did you do to get the 100 gauge string fit??
The string custom tapered both sides and just needed to file the nut a bit for it to fit through it. Other then that no other mods that needed to do.