The friendly fire perk is a must with them, any idea if it stacks? Like it's both for and against so if both of us have a 50% mod is it 50% 75% or 100% resist
The Stun Sweepes get into S tier simply because you can mix an Aussie accent into your dwarf one liners. In fact, as an open letter to the DRG team; PLEASE HAVE SCOUT POP CROCODILE DUNDEE AND STEVE IRWIN REFERENCES WHENEVER HE USES THESE I BEG YOU FOR THE LOVE OF GOD
I honestly just like the silly shock boomerangs because they clear the tiny swarmer swarms with little real reason to look in that direction after the throw
@@pokelordomega1701 Me too, I used a lot the pheromones grenade until I got the 'rang. It was love at first site: The sound of swarmers dying one by one was music to my ears.
For those who don't understand how broken pheromones are: Imagine that every bug hit with pheromones spawns an Engi lure AND the glyphids effected will attack eachother. Halts any threatening wave in a pinch
@@RDKirbyNyeah its amazing to pheromone bolt oppressors, especially if theres a lot of swarmers skittering about. All the little guys start biting his ankles and he just says "I'm over it" and does his big AoE slam. Also great on Mactera, as they won't get immediately chunked by a ground-based swarm
Definitely worth considering how the hazard level affects the placement of these throwables. I believe the devs have balanced throwables around the hazard 3/4 level, where pheromones aren't nearly as potent, and stun sweepers have much more value due to the thinner enemy count. Great video!
That's correct, devs have said they balance the game around haz 4 ! They've said they aren't interested in balancing for haz 5+ which is understandable imo.
stun sweeper is a solid A tier in haz 4, but i think cryo reigns supreme at that level. clearly once you get higher though, sweeper loses relevance and pheremones becomes overwhelmingly strong due to the density
@@CrabOnABeach You can complete any mission even on haz 5 with no upgrades So everything above F goes to S You cant fail no matter how weird your build is
One important note about the stun sweeper not mentioned is its effective range. It can accurately stun a bug from 40m away which gives it a unique use case against menaces ans now stingtails. If your team is threatened by a mactera wave you can provide critical support from across the cave with 1 of your 8 grenades
Honestly I use the stun sweeper to pick off big targets that my gunners/drillers would have to waste a lot of time killing. I see a warden, praetorian, sentry bot or something to that nature, throw the stun and grapple over to kill it quickly and cleanly so that the gunners can focus their efforts on the swarm proper. It also does *very strange things* to bulk detonators (Locking them in place but not actually stunning them), but I'm sure that's a bug.
I do think in terms of a tier list it ends up below the other options but that's just a testament to how many good options the Scout gets. The use cases of the others are focused and strong in ways that help to round out the Scout's kit. The stun sweeper on the other hand is a versatile tool that requires significantly less thought/positioning than the other grenades to get its value in.
@@kevingriffith6011it’s not a bug bulks are immune to stun so it applies a completely different Status effect which is shorter then the normal stun that keeps it in place
@@SaitdarkAsexual after the nerf to cyro nade against the breeder, it's definitely like a B or even a C tier. Having 8 boomerangs to stun a mass flock of mactera is literally life saving.
Shredders deserve S tier for pure versatility alone. Good for swarms because they kill fast and can move from enemy to enemy quickly. Good for bigger targets because of the slowdown their hits apply, and this is very apparent when all five are attacking on target, like a Dreadnought. They may not be the best at everything, but they do any one task well enough that they can be thrown out whenever and find use.
@@secretname2670 if used correctly. It's uses are very limited due to how low the count you get is and how low the spread is. But if it hits.. *oh..oh it **_hits_*
Very new drg player here, those tierlist videos are incredibly helpful to get a general understanding of what weapons do, how they can be used and what an experienced player like you, thinks of them. I also enjoy your Haz 6x2 commentary videos a lot as they are really informative for newer players like me. Great video!
Keep in mind that the video is heavily biased to an experience player's perspective with things like pheromones not being as effective in haz 3 as they are in haz 5 and vice versa with the voltaic sweeper.
@@thenippleextractor I would take that a step farther and say that it's specifically bias towards haz 6x2 gameplay with several of the picks. Pheromones and neurotoxic are probably too high from a base difficulty perspective and SSGs are 100% too low. The enemy count just isn't there, even on haz 5, to justify some of the placements. Also skill plays a large factor in the ratings where stuff like animation canceling is part of what makes clusters, leadbursters, and axes so freaking good.
@@shadowwolf7933 I just wish the greybeards that produce 90% of youtube content on the game kept in mind the more casual players who just do solo haz 3 on the weekends and an occasional deep dive.
@@thenippleextractor I mean, players doing solo haz 3s on weekends don't really need a tierlist. You can run pretty much anything on haz 3 and it'll work just fine.
I absolutely despise neurotoxin grenades in terms of teamplay, because you literally cant see shit through it and the bugs have heat vison. Considering youre more focused on true solo they provide good crowd control for driller who can deal with things close range comfortably, but as a gunner or engi it just kills the teams line of sight entirely when bounced into wrong crevices and leave them vulnerable to slashers and macteras. F tier. Just like, throw out a puddle of sludge or sticky flames.
I find using neurotoxin 'nades with sludge really nice, it feels like throwing out a big ifg which (while you cant see shit trough) kills most grunts, slashersand guards
I’m always surprised axes do melee damage and trigger vamp when thorns doesn’t. (Actually a lot of things in DRG have jank damage types now that I think about it…)
For me I use them on stray mactera spawn/trijaws to instantly delete them. They're still very good at removing priority threats with a medium amount of tankiness and spewing them for funnies if you have spares at the resupply. That being said I also don't really like them because they get caught on other things and behave wonky when I'm joining and not hosting games.
just use them to say, "fuck off" to a slasher coming up over a crevice when your reloading and maybe get some health back in the process with vamp i *ALWAYS*have vamp on driller cuz he always has drills and in a pinch, they do the job
As a newer player I think shredders are my favorite for both versatility and how utterly hands off they are. My monkey ass brain has ascended into how hands off I can make the game with a turret, steeve, and shredder nades. I pop all three down and then go make ramen and come back to a completed mission, it’s great.
I think the main problem with the boomerangs is that they scale down with effectiveness as Haz level increases, while the other three scale up, and quite massively. I think boomerangs should be buffed slightly, as axes are also negatively affected by Haz scaling to an extent but they're so good by default that they're still meta on high Haz. Boomers could use the same treatment.
@@jonathannash8471 Axes biggest issue is simply that the competition is so bad for driller grenades. Neurotoxin punishes kiting, fire, and visibility far too harshly, HE's damage is laughable even if you do get six of em, and Rippers are just a bad joke considering they do exactly what driller primaries already do, but worse. Axes on a scout probably wouldn't even be picked because they already get high single target damage from the primary, same goes for gunner and possibly even engi.
@@shadowwolf7933 the problem is that driller needs zero crowd control. Furthermore two of the nades seem pretty much only good for "fun" builds but suck ass. HE nades? Fun to bounce around and time as well as get it to explode right in a horde but if you wanna do that, just point your primary and press fire. Ripper? Needs very high positioning and kills your teammates in seconds. Great for scouts. Neurotoxin is just...
that would be a great buff to the HE grenade for sure. I feel like it would even make it a viable pick finally. Same thing with the ripper getting melee damage instead of explosive + MAAYBE lots of armor break?
@@andusz5518 give HE infinite armour break like drills, armour ignoring, and better carving whilst maybe ripper deals more damage the larger something is(like it is ripping through, instead of a single hit then passes through) for those satisfying moments where you throw it through a bulk/opressor and it just rips through the health.
I think the ripper should just break when colliding with a dwarf, doing no damage. It would reward players that can deploy a ripper without hitting their teammates, while punishing those who can't because it will cease ripping, after hitting a teammate. Personally I have had a lot of fun digging tunnels and then leaving a ripper behind me to take out the bugs in pursuit, but at the same time, it prevents me from leaving my tunnel again, while it spins around. Would be nice to be able to just walk through it, without worrying about damage, but breaking it in the instance.
Make your own tunnel as a driller, throw a Springloaded Ripper there and enjoy it obliterating everything that comes in. Also, Toretta missions work just as good.
Way too much effort, and way to slow to do what Driller can do with his primaries or det charges in a fraction of the time, while trading away his best grenade. Shredders are just terrible, in all situations.
Great video, really enjoyed it! I'm a day 1 Deep Rock Player, and, I was so excited when they announced the new grenades. I do find this list pretty accurate and helpful, especially for new players. If I could change just one thing, I'd move the Shredder Swarm Nade into the S tier. The amount of value you get out of the 4 of them is insane, it can save you so much ammo against a group of grunts, slashers, and such, they're great for chip damage, and, as stated in the video, they do not require any focus to use because they're just there to help. And, I know the springload rippers sucks, but man they're dang fun to play to me, hah. Also, ROR2 music, huh? Niiiiiiiice.
if this was based solely on vanilla then yeah id agree with shredders being S tier, however they do begin to falloff a bit in modded difficulties bumping them down a tier
@@Marian_DRG While that is theoretically true, sometimes, it’s nice not having to spend much ammo on hordes and instead just be able to click a singular button and obliterate several generations worth of a horde.
@@danolantern6030 it being only one button is something I can somewhat understand, but clicking M1 and moving your mouse in a circle around the tunnel isn't significantly more effort. Also the ammo efficiency is not comparable. You have the choice of spending 1/6 of your grenades or spending 5/300 of your flamethrower ammo. Furthermore sticky flames also work in the open while rippers really need a small choke to do anything somewhat significant.
i would place the shreders in S tier since of their ease of une and their ability to help instantenaously both with swarms and large targets (especialy due to the insane slow down effect they aply on hit).
i'm 3.5mins into the vid and i had to pause for a moment to say i love how stingtails are just juggling you back and forth multiple times through the vid, god i love the chaos that comes with this enemy
yea, their buggy behaviour aside like them flinging you across the cave instead of pulling you towards them (or sending you to the shadow realm before the first hotfix patch) i like how threatening they are and when you hear their scream they instantly become a top priority because they can very easily take you down. they make you pay more attention in swarms especially considering they're very hard to spot in the dark until they try to grab you (or you don't because they're hiding behind the swarm and grab you into the swarm) also nice tier list, i've switched to leadbursters ever since they came out as my nade for all gunner builds, they're very niche yes but strong at it and that alone makes them the best. i also love how shredders require zero thought for a guaranteed effect and that's why i mainly use them nowadays. as for pheromones and neurotoxin, teams in pubs just make them very hard to use so i generally avoid them but i might give pheromones another try
My first encounter with stingtails had me grabbed by one only to immediately get stolen by a cave leech then stolen by a second stingtail to yet another cave leach then back to the first stingtail to finnaly be rescued by my friend. I like to imagine I wasn't a sobbing wreak at the end
I fondly remember my earlier DRG days when I ran Neurotoxin grenades on my Driller loadouts solely for how fun the CC is. But ofc, Impact Axes with Vampire on Driller; that’s tough to beat. Also, I’d argue Engineer’s Proximity Mines would be an A tier grenade because of something I didn’t directly hear you mention actually: If you put a Proximity Mine on an Engineer platform and then destroy the platform completely, the Proximity Mine actually FLOATS and will stay that way. I’ve found this particularly useful on mission types where the terrain is more readily incorporated into how enemies approach you (for me, Salvage, On-Site, Elim, and Industrial Sabo come to mind). It feels like the detection range of the Proximity Mine increases when there isn’t any terrain covering its “sides” (given it is a circle/sphere, I say “sides” generously ofc)l and I’ve found this to be the case too with turrets (you can also build turrets on platforms and when the platforms are destroyed, the turrets still float, which allows them to shoot enemies at more angles). It’s made for impractically interesting moments such as kiting a Dreadnaught into a floating mine, or watching a Mactera swarm get blown up all at once, or hammering at the armored health of a Caretaker, etc. The area control with floating mines has been super engaging for me, anyway. Very enjoyable video you made; Leadbursters are an S tier grenade in my book too. Rock & Stone! ⛏️
Please make that love letter build to the M1K you mentioned in your weapon tier list video. I also love the gun immensely, and I'd love to see how you use it in 6x2 content and your mentality approaching playstyle in those harder difficulties.
I dont really like the tierlist format but i like your insight on this topic after playing the hardest difficulty because it forces you to think about everything in the build
Honestly I use sweepers a ton just for the value of patching up a loadout weakness to swarmer/naedocyte. I think its great role for a grenade to fill and I'd actually use it on Gunner and Engineer for those purposes too. I also think you're underrating the grunt clear potential of bursters/incendiaries. Its like instant value to just cash in when you see a lot of grunts in the same area.
I don't think that burst grunt clear niche is immensely valuable though, especially on engi who has the secondaries that he does and gunner, who has AV or Hellfire or Hurricane. I think they're still pretty good, mind you - hidden in this tier list there's a large gap between tier B and C and a smaller one between A and S, and within those margins the strengths are honestly fairly similar, but I have to rank everything somewhere.
@@pvewaste I see value in it because it saves on breach/hurricane ammo which can deal with stuff besides grunts. Also betting you'll have groups of grunts to deal with is a safe bet for getting grenade value.
A lot of people will shit on me for this but I agree with the leadburster placement once I learned the tech with gunner where you can throw down your shield to herd enemies into a certain direction and then throw a grenade ahead of the shield towards the direction they're going, I realized you can herd a huge group of bugs into any grenade of your choice. And this only makes Leadburster a powerhouse machine, regardless if you're in a tight tunnel or not. Because a lot of people will see leadburster and think it needs to be used in a tight area to do real damage. Nope. Just plop a shield down, throw it ahead of your shield in the direction the bugs are backing into, and watch the carnage fly. You can also use the dash tech to throw your grenades an immense distance too which also works wonders with leadburster. I think it's one of the best grenades in the game simply for the huge amount of damage it can puke out in such a short time. And I honestly think it might be one of the most underrated grenades in the game.
Scout's grenade choice is always a tough one for me... do I want cryo to deal with sudden mactera swarms, ifg to help the team at choke points? Phero as a sort of emergency eject button? Gah XD
@@eliodergamer VSS only stuns 9 enemies; in modded (this video is for modded content btw - 5.5x2, STE etc) you're going to be encountering swarms that can be 5 or more times vs vanilla games. IFG/Phero/Cryo can affect large groups, not just 9. For vanilla gameplay I would agree, VSS can be clutch in many situations!
Cool vid. I've always enjoyed the voltaic sweeper since you could make a bulk stop moving for a pretty good time for your Gunner to not have to aim, but as you've mentioned, it's competing with three other strong nades, one of which is a good slow for everything in a medium-size area. Not to mention it only affects a specific amount of enemies, which can make hitting the bulk in the middle of a swarm feel almost impossible.
If you want to use the boomerang to specifically hit a high value target of your choicem you actually can. The stun sweeper (to my knowledge) will prioritize whatever bug you are aiming at within a 40m range, hitting it first.
I think Stun Sweepers are at least B because they, like some other grenades, require absolutely zero thought about aiming and positioning, I just chuck them whenever I feel like some bugs need to be stopped, and they are stopped for up to 8 seconds while also taking damage while _also_ being vulnerable to the effects of something like Zhukovs' T5A, and this works regardless of how spread-out or clumped up those bugs are. They are also absolutely amazing at instantly taking out a bunch of swarmers or naedocytes which Scout can struggle with sometimes. I think that having +2 boomerangs over IFG is a fine tradeoff unless you are consistently getting more than 9 bugs per IFG _and_ you also take your sweet time killing them, because IFG lasts twice as long. That said, at higher Hazards where sometimes the floor is made of bug the limitation of 9 hits per sweeper instead of an AOE starts to become relevant. Shredder Swarm feels S-tier to me because Engineer already has his hands full dealing with everything else, so having a friendly swarm of bots that can do damage and CC while I am running around, maybe setting up the turrets or doing the objectives or just kiting bugs, is very nice. It also helps to conserve ammo for swarms which LURE doesn't do, and considering how much AoE damage Engi can do with the right build, expending ammo while having more bugs to fight is sometimes even better than spending it on occasional small waves, which can be almost wiped out by a grenade. And it can be very useful for providing just a little bit of insurance when resupplying amidst a heated fight or trying to get to a fallen teammate, by killing certain high-damage threats before they can do damage. I just treat the SSG as the "oh sh*t" button and it works very well for that. LURE is also useful in similar situations, but it doesn't move with you.
Entertaining seeing you constantly getting ping ponged around by the stingtails And showcase of the pheromone capabilities at 11:10 solidifies their position in higher difficulty lobbies.
I tried out the pheromone grenade based on this video and it did seem neat, but before long I went back to my boomerang tazer cause it just felt better to use. I could absolutely see pheromone being goated in hazard 5 and above in solo or duo runs, but for me playing normally with 3 other teammates, usually all tuned to handle crowds way better than me as scout and all way more ammo hungry, it felt like I had to actively find situations where it's worth using a pheromone grenade on a huge crowd, and if I used it any other time it was a waste. (Often times even in those crowds its a waste cause my team had it handled). Stun sweepers meanwhile are just always useful I feel. Surrounded on all sides, attacked by flying enemies, enemies crawling on walls and ceilings high above, robot enemies that can't smell; there's almost no situation where they can't get you a bit of breathing room, and they excel at those harder to reach targets that are already scout's specialty. And most importantly, you get twice as many of them, so they can just be spammed whenever you need them and still have a few left before the first resupply. Even if a single pheromone grenade has more value than two stun sweepers, the ability to use two of them separately is valuable on its own.
hey waste, got into deep rock recently and your content has been super useful. your whole channel is just a no bs info haven, and despite all this great info you encourage players to do whatever they find the most fun, so thank you for that. and a side note, im pretty sure i played a death sentence first world bank game with you on pd2, but this was a while back. just wondering if you remember that if you read this lol. rock and stone.
@@pvewaste yea most likely, i often joined random dsod pubs or played in kevkild lobbies, so it probably has happened multiple times lol. finding this game has been such a blessing though, and to me its basically payday without the bullshit. keep it up man cant wait to see new vids :)
something that would fix neurotoxin grenades into something usable would be if it put the cloud out every .5 to 1 seconds or something, so if it *does* get lit on fire, you aren't instantly SoL, and could be used in games with randoms. Near every class is running something with fire on it these days, so it also devalues cryo canon imo :/ it's a shame.
10:51 I'm grey enough in the beard to remember when this was true, but there is actually an enemy cap on the effectiveness of pheromone grenades. I think its fairly larger than the cap on LUREs but it no longer aggros every single bug in the cave.
It's a cap per bug now, which is weaker than it used to be but still more than enough to aggro the entire cave (as illustrated in the background footage)
I agree with everything, my only additions are that neurotoxin grenades, while extremely powerful when there's no fire damage, they are also mostly useless if anyone on the team has any fire weapons. In solo it's pretty good if you make your build around that, but in team comps, not taking anything to set enemies on fire can be a pretty major hinderance. Not to mention they essentially just do driller's job of covering a large area with damage over time, so I think they're a B-tier grenade. Shredder swarm is also an easy S tier, while it can't block choke points as well as proximity detonators, have high burst damage like plasma bursters, or stop enemies like lures, they're just so versatile and helpful that you can throw them in any situation and still get a lot of value out of them. Either they do insane chip damage against big targets, clear out small targets, or just save ammo by damaging everything a little bit, they're still useful. Not to mention that they last for 40 seconds, you can literally have shredders out for an entire swarm and still be full on your resupply. Even if you're about to go down, throwing down swarmers ensures that you're easy to revive, and of course they have no friendly fire so there are no downsides.
My Experince Notes: - HEs delete the rockpx blisters, so on rockpox missions thery are a personal slot in - The Rippers are fun on Escort in those dozer tunnels and especially on Refine if you dig your pipes through tunnels, even if you dont need to I like to dig some short tunnels for the pipes as a bit of cover and to lure the bugs in, even the big bois die quick when the saw hits them 3 times a second - SSGs are good vs Rockpox - Leadburster *CAN be good vs rockpox depending on placement - The boomerangs long stun I also like on the rockpox to give me the time to quickly pinpoint all the blisters Gee intersting that the S3 grenades do so well vs the S3 enemies imo
I don't know if anything has changed in a few months, but I have a few observations. Playing mostly on haz 4. I would swap positions of Cluster Grenade and Sticky Grenade. Cluster's too unreliable, even if it has greater potential, and while it's less significant it will kill someone, there's a greater chance it will hurt someone. Stickies are enough for most situations when my primary has failed in some way and they'll almost certainly do what I want them to. I would knock neurotoxin down a tier. It's very good at doing what driller's primary is doing already, except only in one spot. It's great if there's a bug swarm you're running away from, because they'll all get poisoned. Most of the time, neurotoxin doesn't get enough time to do its job and its are of effect, even if pretty good, is still stuck in one place. IFG I would put lower, because it depends on your teammates a lot. Great if you have a great team, but not great otherwise. Cryo grenade I also want to put lower, but mostly because pheromone grenade is even better.
Hey I was looking at you slaughtering the bugs and was wondering how the hell the bugs are disappearing instantly? And was wondering if it was a mod that deletes corpses and was also wondering if you would lend it :) (I hunger fps)
best part about the shredders is the fact they SHINE on escort (also known as the best mission) the engineer can focus on keeping doretta prepared while still helping defeat the swarm
I think engi's shredder nades deserve to be higher A tier, if not S tier. Freeing up your attention economy and decent trash clearing if you don't have your turrets up(or end up in a bad position for whatever reason) make them super strong. And not destroying your sight lines like neuro nades do is pretty nice. And i confidently believe that scout's nades are the hardest to use effectively and that's why a lot of newer or more casual players gravitate towards the rang. I personally don't use the ifg anymore cause it's just hard for me to use effectively in mp. My funniest leadburster usage recently was a random being confused on how i killed a bulk in like 3 seconds, those things are so fucking good
Just finished watching your weapons video, glad to see you have a good backlog with 6x2 stuff! If you're inspired to do so, I'd love to see a video on the leadbursters, I never feel I can get value out of them in 6x2. For a while I tried using them as a pick for mactera plague specifically, but even there, where I would think it should shine, the team damage and lack of reliability due to terrain, I just ended up going back to incendiaries for solo and clusters for co-op. You seem to use them well, I'd love to gain some insight if you're inspired to share!
I definitely think you did sticky grenades dirty, i actually find them to be pretty solid. As long as you make sure they dont stick onto enemies, they can surerly wipe a good handfull of glyphids off the map with ease. Generaly one of the most straight forwards grenades in the game, and i very much appreciate that.
I always play neurotoxin grenades because they give much needed breathing room (fun to say considering it's gas lmao) when there are tons of tiny buggers around, and they don't friendly fire! (unless someone detonates it for you)
I agree with the video for the most part but I disagree with the criticism of the sticky grenade with its fear proc, the main reason for this grenade is for praetorians or oppressors so you can hit their weak points more easily along with chucking it at a grunt in front of a swarm to have it wander to the middle and explode for more effectiveness, though it is worse then the flame and cluster in the factors but the multi use of it doesn't deserve C and should be in my opinion B or A.
non of the things listed do good single target damage. If you want an Engie loadout to shred bosses take executioner and hyperpropellant. I take proxy mines for the phase of the hiveguard where you shoot the weird side bits. also hyperprop is entirely enough so I like some AoE primary like explosive chemical rounds better.
poison grenades for driller are really underrated I use it as sorta a sheild like gunner I think it would be the best grenade on every class if they had different grenade loadouts gets out shined by drillers already great crowd control especially scout since he lacks crowd control
@@pvewaste i have join many modded haz5 4p scaling with bulk infestation warning 1 lead burster if throw into correct place (like how you use bouncing OC with drak-25 to kill praet) enough to shred their hp down below 40%, its between throw another 1 lead burster to finish him off or just use your main/secondary guns
Since phernomone canister nerf in 2020, everyone says that its essentially useless since its inconsistent with some bugs still attacking players and how the status effect is more limited in the number of enemies it has affected. If pheromones can still maintain its utility why do you think people felt it was so underpowdered?
It did recently (like, a year ago or so) get a buff where pheromoned enemies would fight back and had the aggro cap increased, which has definitely helped it. That being said, I don't think it was ever particularly bad, but compared to its past glory people just overreacted and overcorrected.
I really want to enjoy Neurotoxin grenades, and they are great fun in solo especially with goo, but any sort of team gameplay it is definitely rough, whether a teammate has fire or to be most effective with it often cutting line of sight on big groups that a gunner or engi could clean up faster. ill definitely try out pheromones more often though ive always picked cryo or ifgs so might be worth switching up
I think an easy first step would be to make them spammable. They might need some numeric tweaks as well, but it's kind of tough to balance them that way, given they're already overtuned on like, Hazard 3, where each nade stuns the whole swarm.
I've found the stun sweeper to be amazing against the huge waves of Naedocyte Shockers in Dense Biozone, as well as macteras and anything you want stunned from pretty huge distances away
I'm surprise for the boomrang ! I always tought it wad amazing, I mean you have 8 of them, they auto aim meaning to can throw them in a nano second, and they provide breathing room AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, THEY KILL THOSE ANOYING SWARMERS But I of course see your point !
The biggest problem boomerangs run into is becoming worse the higher up in hazard you go. Hazard 3 and below? They're amazing. Hazard 4? Still good. Hazard 5? Starting to get eh but still has a great use-case vs swarmers, naedocytes, stunning big boys/mactera, and for clutching revives. In fact I enjoy taking them in hazard 5 especially to deal with swarmers and mactera. Past that though, they start to fall from eh to a lot worse. Where the other grenades get better and affect more enemies as hazard goes up, boomerangs dont. Coming from the perspective of modded hazards, boomerangs stop being able to do stuff they used to like wiping out swarmers/naedocytes because there are simply too many. Likewise with clutch revives, once again there are too many bugs to stun them all. Compare this to a pheromone grenade where 1 phero can equal like 10+ boomerangs with a good throw and they just stop really comparing. To be clear though, use it if you want to. They aren't bad in any un-modded hazard, and in fact offer up a lot of unique and fun possibilities and uses. They just simply dont scale beyond vanilla gameplay.
I do like the gunner's sticky grenade. The fact that it sticks to the surface makes it perfect imo to get rid of big tough targets, especially if I manage to hit the weak spot. I find it very reliable, provided that I throw it correctly
I keep hearing people say that rippers are bad, but they only do slightly lower damage than axes and can hit multiple enemies, if you use them like a more “traditional” grenade and throw them at groups of grunts they’re pretty good imo
HE grenade enjoyers unite proking vampire heals from distance and shattering iced targets is cool and all, but deleting a whole group of glyphids, swarmers or macteras across the room and up-close alike, while still having 4 even bigger explosions for more important negotiations just feels good yeah you can do pretty much the same with epc with tcu, but i just can't care for learning how to plasma, and i do like my boolet, especially with new subata's mods
I love the shredders. They just fix anything. They damage Oppressors, they slow down anything bug enough to survive them konger than a half second, and they singlehandedly clear grunt swarms. Macteras and the other special enemies aren't safe either. S tier imo. Vital for a solo engie build.
Honestly if the drillers buzzsaw did melee damage it would potentially too strong in higher hazards when combined with vampire Also if i remember right , alot of the tanky bugs are either vulnerable or have no damage resist to melee so it could also really fuck up dreads and opressors Its really in one lf those spots balance wise though tbh i wouldnt mind if they jusy made it melee damage to see how it goes in practice
@@TheTreesmac I think maybe make it "rip" more, via doing more damage the longer it stays in a enemy hitbox like the breach cutter which would be a boon for driller and single-target. Add on very chunky weakpoint boosts and you've got a praetorian killer
On a more serious note if it did both direct and aoe dmg like the auto cannon so it would still hurt teammates but also wouldn’t hit them with the full 100+ dmg as it does rn would be a start
I feel like base hord size on haz 5 is not large enough for Clusters to be really usable to its full effect aside from the stun (but imo Gunner has better ways to stun than throwing 1/4 of your nades out), thats why i rarely feel like using them. Every time i tried them i was like "damn if i had Leadbursters i could be dealing with a wider target selection", on low gravity missions Clusters become even harder to use imo. Whereas Leadbursters only care about line of sight, do well enough for haz 5 swarm clear + single target deletion. Only weakpoint for them is accidentally triggering stationary targets across the cave like Korloks and or Dreads if thrown badly Stickys were my go to before Leadbursters got added since they are easy to use and provide decent crowd clear if you throw them on the ground instead of on enemys plus having an instant fear source to interrupt large targets makes them decently versatile
The stun sweapers are clearly inferior, I mean freeze usually affects more targets with immobilisation, but here is the thing. It feels good. You can throw them endlessly in downtime as fidgeting, it is usually good enough to clear a downed ally for resurection, it is a nice panic button, makes a satiafying bouncing animation and sound, and you can't waste them, because they auto-hit or come back for you to try again. The stun sweaper isn't a good nade, but it's a brainless convenience with spectacle.
Agree with the other comments about stun sweepers, they may not be as nuky as the other Scout nades, but you pack 8 of them. And it's so fun to stun a menace from the middle of nowhere and trifork volley it into oblivion
I think proxy is A-S depending on terrain because it just lets you ignore entire attack vectors except for the heavy enemies. (I play haz 4 btw, maybe this isn't true on 6x2.)
I only use HE grenades on driller. Not the best option, but very nice to have for dealing with swarms (especially macteras) just out of reach of a facemelter flamethrower or to hard to properly hit with a sludge pump charged shot. Thin containment field on the plasma pistol kinda solves that, but I don’t always have the plasma pistol with me and I’m not great at using it consistently. However, the main reason I like them so much is that they are so, so satisfying to use, especially when you cook it just right to clear out a group of fliers
Biggest uses I've found for lures as Engi isn't to distract enemies, but rather to clump them up for nukes, plascrete explosions, turret arcs/discharges, turret whips, etc. Also the lure is super handy against the nemesis. Just throw two lures at it and then you and your fellow dwarves can get right up in its face for like a solid 30 seconds without fear of being grabbed. But, the main issue is that aside from rare enemy spawns and specific builds, you're almost always better off just grabbing SSGs for the all around workhorse utility. Also I can't agree more with the ripper being in F. My teams driller has killed me more with those things than with satchels
Leadburster became my fav grenade by far due to being able to accomplish things no other nade can. It also rewards players getting really good with it. Still love napalm for its aoe and ability to corral swarms since they try to avoid it. Cluster aside from stun has only been used for style. As for sticky I share your same opinion though I like its got its niche Personal rating LB>Fire>Cluster>Sticky
Hi waste I’ve been playing deep rock for about 5 months now and I’m starting to really understand the game and can do haz 5 consistently but I want to look into modding what mods would you recommend/use
The only gameplay changing mod I use extensively is custom difficulty, which lets you increase the difficulty of the game. I play Hazard 6x2, but you might want to try Hazard 6 first, then maybe Hazard 5x2 spicy fire, then 6x2 to ease into it.
If there was a dwarf trapped inside a burning building the springloaded ripper would heroically leap into the blaze to maul that dwarf one last time.
Can confirm
"he doesn't teamkill, you just had a bad aura"
The friendly fire perk is a must with them, any idea if it stacks? Like it's both for and against so if both of us have a 50% mod is it 50% 75% or 100% resist
This comment had strong Sseth energy
@@whatwhat7119 I imagine that you would receive 25% damage, not 0%
Yes, Scout’s grenades are in their own class. It’s called Scout.
Scout is so chad his starting headgear is called scout.
shrimp grapple gang
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@@CyberCoderZ1 Who needs Jesus when we have Karl?
@@novastar6112indeed
Counterpoint on the stun sweeper:
You can call them “rangs”
The Stun Sweepes get into S tier simply because you can mix an Aussie accent into your dwarf one liners. In fact, as an open letter to the DRG team; PLEASE HAVE SCOUT POP CROCODILE DUNDEE AND STEVE IRWIN REFERENCES WHENEVER HE USES THESE I BEG YOU FOR THE LOVE OF GOD
although a "ranger" is something completely different
The Thundah from DownUndah!
I honestly just like the silly shock boomerangs because they clear the tiny swarmer swarms with little real reason to look in that direction after the throw
@@pokelordomega1701 Me too, I used a lot the pheromones grenade until I got the 'rang. It was love at first site: The sound of swarmers dying one by one was music to my ears.
For those who don't understand how broken pheromones are: Imagine that every bug hit with pheromones spawns an Engi lure AND the glyphids effected will attack eachother. Halts any threatening wave in a pinch
also makes last man revives A LOT safer/easier, since in most cases bugs will ignore you
Fun fact- while engi lure stops 10 bugs the pheromone status effect lures up to 12 so effectively 13 bugs gone per bug you hit with it
The pheromone/charm effect is so powerful. The bolts on scout are good for marking a fat target and pulling the wave onto them instead of your team
@@RDKirbyNyeah its amazing to pheromone bolt oppressors, especially if theres a lot of swarmers skittering about. All the little guys start biting his ankles and he just says "I'm over it" and does his big AoE slam. Also great on Mactera, as they won't get immediately chunked by a ground-based swarm
To be honest at first I just used them because they reminded me of the Jarate from TF2,but I can say that they are awsome
Definitely worth considering how the hazard level affects the placement of these throwables. I believe the devs have balanced throwables around the hazard 3/4 level, where pheromones aren't nearly as potent, and stun sweepers have much more value due to the thinner enemy count. Great video!
That's correct, devs have said they balance the game around haz 4 !
They've said they aren't interested in balancing for haz 5+ which is understandable imo.
stun sweeper is a solid A tier in haz 4, but i think cryo reigns supreme at that level. clearly once you get higher though, sweeper loses relevance and pheremones becomes overwhelmingly strong due to the density
@@CrabOnABeach
You can complete any mission even on haz 5 with no upgrades
So everything above F goes to S
You cant fail no matter how weird your build is
@@CrabOnABeach Or use the Boltshark which gives you mini Cryo and mini Jarate so you can use the Boomerang for the shocking flying Enemies!
One important note about the stun sweeper not mentioned is its effective range. It can accurately stun a bug from 40m away which gives it a unique use case against menaces ans now stingtails. If your team is threatened by a mactera wave you can provide critical support from across the cave with 1 of your 8 grenades
Yeah, Voltaic should be A. It has more situational use even than Cryo nade. And Definity is best at shredders.
Honestly I use the stun sweeper to pick off big targets that my gunners/drillers would have to waste a lot of time killing. I see a warden, praetorian, sentry bot or something to that nature, throw the stun and grapple over to kill it quickly and cleanly so that the gunners can focus their efforts on the swarm proper. It also does *very strange things* to bulk detonators (Locking them in place but not actually stunning them), but I'm sure that's a bug.
I do think in terms of a tier list it ends up below the other options but that's just a testament to how many good options the Scout gets. The use cases of the others are focused and strong in ways that help to round out the Scout's kit. The stun sweeper on the other hand is a versatile tool that requires significantly less thought/positioning than the other grenades to get its value in.
@@kevingriffith6011it’s not a bug bulks are immune to stun so it applies a completely different Status effect which is shorter then the normal stun that keeps it in place
@@SaitdarkAsexual after the nerf to cyro nade against the breeder, it's definitely like a B or even a C tier.
Having 8 boomerangs to stun a mass flock of mactera is literally life saving.
Shredders deserve S tier for pure versatility alone. Good for swarms because they kill fast and can move from enemy to enemy quickly. Good for bigger targets because of the slowdown their hits apply, and this is very apparent when all five are attacking on target, like a Dreadnought. They may not be the best at everything, but they do any one task well enough that they can be thrown out whenever and find use.
I agree. I also feel like it’s more simple than lure.
Especially against rockpox. Shredders delete them
@@rh9909 Yeah I know that's like my main reason I think they're s tier.
absolutely. most high rank engis I find use shredders religiously
@@PatternRecognitionNotRacism dude it’s the shit. Lure can distract them but shredders just kill them.
lead burster in S tier is the most based thing in this video
he forgo to mention how it pops these nice little patterns into the walls of the cave and how satisfying the sound is when it explodes
The feeling of power I get from jointing a random lobby and removing a bull det in 3~ seconds is incomparable
S-tier leadbursters is extremely based
I love those things
Tried them out once and never went back
Two shot bulk detonators.
I'm thinking best grenade in the game.
@@secretname2670 if used correctly. It's uses are very limited due to how low the count you get is and how low the spread is. But if it hits.. *oh..oh it **_hits_*
I don’t get why people don’t like them, basically the only gunner grenade I use apart the sticky one for shitty autocannon builds
Very new drg player here, those tierlist videos are incredibly helpful to get a general understanding of what weapons do, how they can be used and what an experienced player like you, thinks of them. I also enjoy your Haz 6x2 commentary videos a lot as they are really informative for newer players like me. Great video!
Keep in mind that the video is heavily biased to an experience player's perspective with things like pheromones not being as effective in haz 3 as they are in haz 5 and vice versa with the voltaic sweeper.
@@thenippleextractor I would take that a step farther and say that it's specifically bias towards haz 6x2 gameplay with several of the picks. Pheromones and neurotoxic are probably too high from a base difficulty perspective and SSGs are 100% too low. The enemy count just isn't there, even on haz 5, to justify some of the placements. Also skill plays a large factor in the ratings where stuff like animation canceling is part of what makes clusters, leadbursters, and axes so freaking good.
@@shadowwolf7933 I just wish the greybeards that produce 90% of youtube content on the game kept in mind the more casual players who just do solo haz 3 on the weekends and an occasional deep dive.
@@thenippleextractor I mean, players doing solo haz 3s on weekends don't really need a tierlist. You can run pretty much anything on haz 3 and it'll work just fine.
@@shadowwolf7933 Exactly, videos like this are for the small minority that plays the game purely for hazard 5-6.
The true s-tier grenade is the friends we made along the way
But do your friends scale their damage with enemy density?
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I absolutely despise neurotoxin grenades in terms of teamplay, because you literally cant see shit through it and the bugs have heat vison. Considering youre more focused on true solo they provide good crowd control for driller who can deal with things close range comfortably, but as a gunner or engi it just kills the teams line of sight entirely when bounced into wrong crevices and leave them vulnerable to slashers and macteras.
F tier. Just like, throw out a puddle of sludge or sticky flames.
You're talking about Driller, mate. Messing with teammates is considered a bonus.
I find using neurotoxin 'nades with sludge really nice, it feels like throwing out a big ifg which (while you cant see shit trough) kills most grunts, slashersand guards
The WW1 vibes they give bumps it to S tier
You no the bugs don't even have eyes right?
Toxic grenades are by far the best in the entire game. You're just an F tier player.
I’m always surprised axes do melee damage and trigger vamp when thorns doesn’t.
(Actually a lot of things in DRG have jank damage types now that I think about it…)
i guess that way SYIH and thorns would combo but considering how both aren't that great then it wouldn't be an issue, really
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i might be the only one that absolutely loves the springloaded ripper - mainly because it's drillers only instant area clear.
Honestly the axe doesn't really do it for me on non-cryo builds, I very often forget i even have them
Use them on Oppressors!
For me I use them on stray mactera spawn/trijaws to instantly delete them. They're still very good at removing priority threats with a medium amount of tankiness and spewing them for funnies if you have spares at the resupply.
That being said I also don't really like them because they get caught on other things and behave wonky when I'm joining and not hosting games.
just use them to say, "fuck off" to a slasher coming up over a crevice when your reloading and maybe get some health back in the process with vamp
i *ALWAYS*have vamp on driller cuz he always has drills and in a pinch, they do the job
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My beloved boomerang! How dare you.
I know it's mid, but it goes whoosh and sparkles!
Yeah I'm new to the game and I love using it, you get 8 and it stuns praetorians...
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@@CyberCoderZ1 Bro, people been saying "soon" since 33AD. He ain't comin' back.
As a newer player I think shredders are my favorite for both versatility and how utterly hands off they are. My monkey ass brain has ascended into how hands off I can make the game with a turret, steeve, and shredder nades. I pop all three down and then go make ramen and come back to a completed mission, it’s great.
As a boomerang enjoyer I can see how these grenades might not be too useful in haz 6, but I'd say they are still pretty decent on haz 5.
I think the main problem with the boomerangs is that they scale down with effectiveness as Haz level increases, while the other three scale up, and quite massively.
I think boomerangs should be buffed slightly, as axes are also negatively affected by Haz scaling to an extent but they're so good by default that they're still meta on high Haz. Boomers could use the same treatment.
@@jonathannash8471 Axes biggest issue is simply that the competition is so bad for driller grenades. Neurotoxin punishes kiting, fire, and visibility far too harshly, HE's damage is laughable even if you do get six of em, and Rippers are just a bad joke considering they do exactly what driller primaries already do, but worse. Axes on a scout probably wouldn't even be picked because they already get high single target damage from the primary, same goes for gunner and possibly even engi.
@@shadowwolf7933 the problem is that driller needs zero crowd control. Furthermore two of the nades seem pretty much only good for "fun" builds but suck ass. HE nades? Fun to bounce around and time as well as get it to explode right in a horde but if you wanna do that, just point your primary and press fire. Ripper? Needs very high positioning and kills your teammates in seconds. Great for scouts. Neurotoxin is just...
I can save a dwarf in trouble from half a mile away with a boomerang.
There’s a haz 6 option?
Man I just wish the HE grenade can carve the caves more. It's my fave driller nade because Boom but I need more carving power.
Yeah it even says something about their carving power in their description, right?
that would be a great buff to the HE grenade for sure. I feel like it would even make it a viable pick finally. Same thing with the ripper getting melee damage instead of explosive + MAAYBE lots of armor break?
@@andusz5518 give HE infinite armour break like drills, armour ignoring, and better carving whilst maybe ripper deals more damage the larger something is(like it is ripping through, instead of a single hit then passes through) for those satisfying moments where you throw it through a bulk/opressor and it just rips through the health.
make them impact nades
@@GameFuMaster hell nah cooking them is what makes them so fun
I think the ripper should just break when colliding with a dwarf, doing no damage. It would reward players that can deploy a ripper without hitting their teammates, while punishing those who can't because it will cease ripping, after hitting a teammate. Personally I have had a lot of fun digging tunnels and then leaving a ripper behind me to take out the bugs in pursuit, but at the same time, it prevents me from leaving my tunnel again, while it spins around. Would be nice to be able to just walk through it, without worrying about damage, but breaking it in the instance.
Make your own tunnel as a driller, throw a Springloaded Ripper there and enjoy it obliterating everything that comes in. Also, Toretta missions work just as good.
I'd rather just use my primary to do that and impact axe spam any tanky targets that show their face.
Way too much effort, and way to slow to do what Driller can do with his primaries or det charges in a fraction of the time, while trading away his best grenade.
Shredders are just terrible, in all situations.
why spend your grenade slot on that when all of your primaries have top tier ways to abuse a tunnel better
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Great video, really enjoyed it! I'm a day 1 Deep Rock Player, and, I was so excited when they announced the new grenades. I do find this list pretty accurate and helpful, especially for new players.
If I could change just one thing, I'd move the Shredder Swarm Nade into the S tier. The amount of value you get out of the 4 of them is insane, it can save you so much ammo against a group of grunts, slashers, and such, they're great for chip damage, and, as stated in the video, they do not require any focus to use because they're just there to help.
And, I know the springload rippers sucks, but man they're dang fun to play to me, hah.
Also, ROR2 music, huh? Niiiiiiiice.
if this was based solely on vanilla then yeah id agree with shredders being S tier, however they do begin to falloff a bit in modded difficulties bumping them down a tier
*be driller *
Dig a tunnel
Use ripper
Delete glyphids
Mushroom
in step 3 put down 5 sticky flames, one charged sludge shot or a bit more ice trail and the bugs still die. driller doesnt need aoe in his grenades.
@@Marian_DRG yeah but chainsaw go vroom
we're rich!
@@Marian_DRG While that is theoretically true, sometimes, it’s nice not having to spend much ammo on hordes and instead just be able to click a singular button and obliterate several generations worth of a horde.
@@danolantern6030 it being only one button is something I can somewhat understand, but clicking M1 and moving your mouse in a circle around the tunnel isn't significantly more effort. Also the ammo efficiency is not comparable. You have the choice of spending 1/6 of your grenades or spending 5/300 of your flamethrower ammo. Furthermore sticky flames also work in the open while rippers really need a small choke to do anything somewhat significant.
I really enjoy the stun sweepers as they handle both Naedocytes and swarmers pretty well.
This was my biggest Weakness as it forced me to use the Pistols just to defend myself when I wanted to use the Boltshark. DAM NAEDOCYTES!!!
i would place the shreders in S tier since of their ease of une and their ability to help instantenaously both with swarms and large targets (especialy due to the insane slow down effect they aply on hit).
i'm 3.5mins into the vid and i had to pause for a moment to say i love how stingtails are just juggling you back and forth multiple times through the vid, god i love the chaos that comes with this enemy
They're such a fun enemy addition! I'm struggling with them a bit right now, but hopefully as I get practice with them things will smooth out.
yea, their buggy behaviour aside like them flinging you across the cave instead of pulling you towards them (or sending you to the shadow realm before the first hotfix patch) i like how threatening they are and when you hear their scream they instantly become a top priority because they can very easily take you down. they make you pay more attention in swarms especially considering they're very hard to spot in the dark until they try to grab you (or you don't because they're hiding behind the swarm and grab you into the swarm)
also nice tier list, i've switched to leadbursters ever since they came out as my nade for all gunner builds, they're very niche yes but strong at it and that alone makes them the best. i also love how shredders require zero thought for a guaranteed effect and that's why i mainly use them nowadays. as for pheromones and neurotoxin, teams in pubs just make them very hard to use so i generally avoid them but i might give pheromones another try
My first encounter with stingtails had me grabbed by one only to immediately get stolen by a cave leech then stolen by a second stingtail to yet another cave leach then back to the first stingtail to finnaly be rescued by my friend. I like to imagine I wasn't a sobbing wreak at the end
just got the game a couple days ago and never thought of using pheromone grades, will definitely give them a shot ^^
I fondly remember my earlier DRG days when I ran Neurotoxin grenades on my Driller loadouts solely for how fun the CC is. But ofc, Impact Axes with Vampire on Driller; that’s tough to beat.
Also, I’d argue Engineer’s Proximity Mines would be an A tier grenade because of something I didn’t directly hear you mention actually: If you put a Proximity Mine on an Engineer platform and then destroy the platform completely, the Proximity Mine actually FLOATS and will stay that way.
I’ve found this particularly useful on mission types where the terrain is more readily incorporated into how enemies approach you (for me, Salvage, On-Site, Elim, and Industrial Sabo come to mind). It feels like the detection range of the Proximity Mine increases when there isn’t any terrain covering its “sides” (given it is a circle/sphere, I say “sides” generously ofc)l and I’ve found this to be the case too with turrets (you can also build turrets on platforms and when the platforms are destroyed, the turrets still float, which allows them to shoot enemies at more angles).
It’s made for impractically interesting moments such as kiting a Dreadnaught into a floating mine, or watching a Mactera swarm get blown up all at once, or hammering at the armored health of a Caretaker, etc. The area control with floating mines has been super engaging for me, anyway.
Very enjoyable video you made; Leadbursters are an S tier grenade in my book too. Rock & Stone! ⛏️
Please make that love letter build to the M1K you mentioned in your weapon tier list video. I also love the gun immensely, and I'd love to see how you use it in 6x2 content and your mentality approaching playstyle in those harder difficulties.
I dont really like the tierlist format but i like your insight on this topic after playing the hardest difficulty because it forces you to think about everything in the build
Honestly I use sweepers a ton just for the value of patching up a loadout weakness to swarmer/naedocyte. I think its great role for a grenade to fill and I'd actually use it on Gunner and Engineer for those purposes too.
I also think you're underrating the grunt clear potential of bursters/incendiaries. Its like instant value to just cash in when you see a lot of grunts in the same area.
I don't think that burst grunt clear niche is immensely valuable though, especially on engi who has the secondaries that he does and gunner, who has AV or Hellfire or Hurricane. I think they're still pretty good, mind you - hidden in this tier list there's a large gap between tier B and C and a smaller one between A and S, and within those margins the strengths are honestly fairly similar, but I have to rank everything somewhere.
@@pvewaste I see value in it because it saves on breach/hurricane ammo which can deal with stuff besides grunts. Also betting you'll have groups of grunts to deal with is a safe bet for getting grenade value.
A lot of people will shit on me for this but I agree with the leadburster placement
once I learned the tech with gunner where you can throw down your shield to herd enemies into a certain direction and then throw a grenade ahead of the shield towards the direction they're going, I realized you can herd a huge group of bugs into any grenade of your choice. And this only makes Leadburster a powerhouse machine, regardless if you're in a tight tunnel or not. Because a lot of people will see leadburster and think it needs to be used in a tight area to do real damage. Nope. Just plop a shield down, throw it ahead of your shield in the direction the bugs are backing into, and watch the carnage fly. You can also use the dash tech to throw your grenades an immense distance too which also works wonders with leadburster. I think it's one of the best grenades in the game simply for the huge amount of damage it can puke out in such a short time. And I honestly think it might be one of the most underrated grenades in the game.
Scout's grenade choice is always a tough one for me... do I want cryo to deal with sudden mactera swarms, ifg to help the team at choke points? Phero as a sort of emergency eject button? Gah XD
Everytime I used one of them, I always encounter a situation where I would say "Damn I should've used [another nade]"
I think boomerang is emergency too tho just stun and kill them too
@@eliodergamer VSS only stuns 9 enemies; in modded (this video is for modded content btw - 5.5x2, STE etc) you're going to be encountering swarms that can be 5 or more times vs vanilla games. IFG/Phero/Cryo can affect large groups, not just 9. For vanilla gameplay I would agree, VSS can be clutch in many situations!
@@theflyingwhale5778 Too true! Damned random swarm types XD
Cryos also delete swarmer swarms
Awesome explanations and gameplay examples. Big bonus props for using Risk of Rain 2 soundtrack for the video!
I also noticed the Risk of Rain 2 soundtrack in the background and honestly it fits pretty well for Deep Rock Galactic
Oh wow was just watching your previous video and this is just what I was hoping for! thanks a lot, very informative video
Cool vid. I've always enjoyed the voltaic sweeper since you could make a bulk stop moving for a pretty good time for your Gunner to not have to aim, but as you've mentioned, it's competing with three other strong nades, one of which is a good slow for everything in a medium-size area. Not to mention it only affects a specific amount of enemies, which can make hitting the bulk in the middle of a swarm feel almost impossible.
very true minteikitsune
If you want to use the boomerang to specifically hit a high value target of your choicem you actually can. The stun sweeper (to my knowledge) will prioritize whatever bug you are aiming at within a 40m range, hitting it first.
@@pvewaste thank you pvewaste (:
@@realkoniri This is true, but for me it's rather inconsistent. I'll have to give it more playtime in modded lobbies with friends soon.
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I think Stun Sweepers are at least B because they, like some other grenades, require absolutely zero thought about aiming and positioning, I just chuck them whenever I feel like some bugs need to be stopped, and they are stopped for up to 8 seconds while also taking damage while _also_ being vulnerable to the effects of something like Zhukovs' T5A, and this works regardless of how spread-out or clumped up those bugs are. They are also absolutely amazing at instantly taking out a bunch of swarmers or naedocytes which Scout can struggle with sometimes. I think that having +2 boomerangs over IFG is a fine tradeoff unless you are consistently getting more than 9 bugs per IFG _and_ you also take your sweet time killing them, because IFG lasts twice as long. That said, at higher Hazards where sometimes the floor is made of bug the limitation of 9 hits per sweeper instead of an AOE starts to become relevant.
Shredder Swarm feels S-tier to me because Engineer already has his hands full dealing with everything else, so having a friendly swarm of bots that can do damage and CC while I am running around, maybe setting up the turrets or doing the objectives or just kiting bugs, is very nice. It also helps to conserve ammo for swarms which LURE doesn't do, and considering how much AoE damage Engi can do with the right build, expending ammo while having more bugs to fight is sometimes even better than spending it on occasional small waves, which can be almost wiped out by a grenade. And it can be very useful for providing just a little bit of insurance when resupplying amidst a heated fight or trying to get to a fallen teammate, by killing certain high-damage threats before they can do damage. I just treat the SSG as the "oh sh*t" button and it works very well for that. LURE is also useful in similar situations, but it doesn't move with you.
I've singlehandedly taken care of entire swarms using just 1 or 2 toxic grenades. They're amazing. Easy S tier.
Entertaining seeing you constantly getting ping ponged around by the stingtails
And showcase of the pheromone capabilities at 11:10 solidifies their position in higher difficulty lobbies.
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Great vid bro!! Keep it up
the bullet sprinkler is my favorite, that opinion is typically not shared among my teammates however.
I tried out the pheromone grenade based on this video and it did seem neat, but before long I went back to my boomerang tazer cause it just felt better to use. I could absolutely see pheromone being goated in hazard 5 and above in solo or duo runs, but for me playing normally with 3 other teammates, usually all tuned to handle crowds way better than me as scout and all way more ammo hungry, it felt like I had to actively find situations where it's worth using a pheromone grenade on a huge crowd, and if I used it any other time it was a waste. (Often times even in those crowds its a waste cause my team had it handled).
Stun sweepers meanwhile are just always useful I feel. Surrounded on all sides, attacked by flying enemies, enemies crawling on walls and ceilings high above, robot enemies that can't smell; there's almost no situation where they can't get you a bit of breathing room, and they excel at those harder to reach targets that are already scout's specialty. And most importantly, you get twice as many of them, so they can just be spammed whenever you need them and still have a few left before the first resupply. Even if a single pheromone grenade has more value than two stun sweepers, the ability to use two of them separately is valuable on its own.
Risk of rain 2 ost hits so damn hard
hey waste, got into deep rock recently and your content has been super useful. your whole channel is just a no bs info haven, and despite all this great info you encourage players to do whatever they find the most fun, so thank you for that. and a side note, im pretty sure i played a death sentence first world bank game with you on pd2, but this was a while back. just wondering if you remember that if you read this lol. rock and stone.
oh shit yeah i remember you from death sentence, think we ran into each other more than once
@@pvewaste yea most likely, i often joined random dsod pubs or played in kevkild lobbies, so it probably has happened multiple times lol. finding this game has been such a blessing though, and to me its basically payday without the bullshit. keep it up man cant wait to see new vids :)
Hey Waste do you use a mod that disables weapon viewmodels? I see none at 11:03 and would love to get my hands on that mod/setting
That was just a bug lol
Great video! I love the boomerang for easy tiny creature clearing. Especially with slower harder hitting guns.
something that would fix neurotoxin grenades into something usable would be if it put the cloud out every .5 to 1 seconds or something, so if it *does* get lit on fire, you aren't instantly SoL, and could be used in games with randoms. Near every class is running something with fire on it these days, so it also devalues cryo canon imo :/ it's a shame.
The saw-nade is peak driller. High team damage, as in high damage to the team.
I started playing a little under 2 months ago, and was a cryo all the way person, but now after trying out piss nades, it's nothing but them for me.
That intro clip very noice, never seen the objective done like that
10:51 I'm grey enough in the beard to remember when this was true, but there is actually an enemy cap on the effectiveness of pheromone grenades. I think its fairly larger than the cap on LUREs but it no longer aggros every single bug in the cave.
It's a cap per bug now, which is weaker than it used to be but still more than enough to aggro the entire cave (as illustrated in the background footage)
I agree with everything, my only additions are that neurotoxin grenades, while extremely powerful when there's no fire damage, they are also mostly useless if anyone on the team has any fire weapons. In solo it's pretty good if you make your build around that, but in team comps, not taking anything to set enemies on fire can be a pretty major hinderance. Not to mention they essentially just do driller's job of covering a large area with damage over time, so I think they're a B-tier grenade.
Shredder swarm is also an easy S tier, while it can't block choke points as well as proximity detonators, have high burst damage like plasma bursters, or stop enemies like lures, they're just so versatile and helpful that you can throw them in any situation and still get a lot of value out of them. Either they do insane chip damage against big targets, clear out small targets, or just save ammo by damaging everything a little bit, they're still useful. Not to mention that they last for 40 seconds, you can literally have shredders out for an entire swarm and still be full on your resupply. Even if you're about to go down, throwing down swarmers ensures that you're easy to revive, and of course they have no friendly fire so there are no downsides.
Jesus is coming soon! He loves you and He died on the cross for your sins!❤
My Experince Notes:
- HEs delete the rockpx blisters, so on rockpox missions thery are a personal slot in
- The Rippers are fun on Escort in those dozer tunnels and especially on Refine if you dig your pipes through tunnels, even if you dont need to I like to dig some short tunnels for the pipes as a bit of cover and to lure the bugs in, even the big bois die quick when the saw hits them 3 times a second
- SSGs are good vs Rockpox
- Leadburster *CAN be good vs rockpox depending on placement
- The boomerangs long stun I also like on the rockpox to give me the time to quickly pinpoint all the blisters
Gee intersting that the S3 grenades do so well vs the S3 enemies imo
Jesus is coming soon! He loves you and He died on the cross for your sins!❤
Great vid dude! Never really used phero nades over phero darts since they changed how the effect works, but I’ll be sure to give a try!
I don't know if anything has changed in a few months, but I have a few observations. Playing mostly on haz 4.
I would swap positions of Cluster Grenade and Sticky Grenade. Cluster's too unreliable, even if it has greater potential, and while it's less significant it will kill someone, there's a greater chance it will hurt someone. Stickies are enough for most situations when my primary has failed in some way and they'll almost certainly do what I want them to.
I would knock neurotoxin down a tier. It's very good at doing what driller's primary is doing already, except only in one spot. It's great if there's a bug swarm you're running away from, because they'll all get poisoned. Most of the time, neurotoxin doesn't get enough time to do its job and its are of effect, even if pretty good, is still stuck in one place.
IFG I would put lower, because it depends on your teammates a lot. Great if you have a great team, but not great otherwise. Cryo grenade I also want to put lower, but mostly because pheromone grenade is even better.
Hey I was looking at you slaughtering the bugs and was wondering how the hell the bugs are disappearing instantly? And was wondering if it was a mod that deletes corpses and was also wondering if you would lend it :) (I hunger fps)
Yeah, I use the No Ragdolls mod
@@pvewaste got a link?
@@theimposterofmark mod.io/g/drg/m/no-ragdolls
Oh and was wondering if you were also using a no particle mod because I never see the particles of you mining the ores
love the vids!!! !keep it up you're making me a better player
Jesus is coming soon! He loves you and He died on the cross for your sins!❤
3:25 those stingtails combo-locking you into the shrooms was absolutely evil
congrats on 1k dude :))
The risk of rain music goes hard lol
I like the rick of rain 2 music you got in the background.
best part about the shredders is the fact they SHINE on escort (also known as the best mission) the engineer can focus on keeping doretta prepared while still helping defeat the swarm
I think engi's shredder nades deserve to be higher A tier, if not S tier. Freeing up your attention economy and decent trash clearing if you don't have your turrets up(or end up in a bad position for whatever reason) make them super strong. And not destroying your sight lines like neuro nades do is pretty nice. And i confidently believe that scout's nades are the hardest to use effectively and that's why a lot of newer or more casual players gravitate towards the rang. I personally don't use the ifg anymore cause it's just hard for me to use effectively in mp.
My funniest leadburster usage recently was a random being confused on how i killed a bulk in like 3 seconds, those things are so fucking good
Just finished watching your weapons video, glad to see you have a good backlog with 6x2 stuff! If you're inspired to do so, I'd love to see a video on the leadbursters, I never feel I can get value out of them in 6x2. For a while I tried using them as a pick for mactera plague specifically, but even there, where I would think it should shine, the team damage and lack of reliability due to terrain, I just ended up going back to incendiaries for solo and clusters for co-op. You seem to use them well, I'd love to gain some insight if you're inspired to share!
I definitely think you did sticky grenades dirty, i actually find them to be pretty solid. As long as you make sure they dont stick onto enemies, they can surerly wipe a good handfull of glyphids off the map with ease. Generaly one of the most straight forwards grenades in the game, and i very much appreciate that.
I always play neurotoxin grenades because they give much needed breathing room (fun to say considering it's gas lmao) when there are tons of tiny buggers around, and they don't friendly fire! (unless someone detonates it for you)
I love the risk of rain soundtrack in the background. Another goated game
I agree with the video for the most part but I disagree with the criticism of the sticky grenade with its fear proc, the main reason for this grenade is for praetorians or oppressors so you can hit their weak points more easily along with chucking it at a grunt in front of a swarm to have it wander to the middle and explode for more effectiveness, though it is worse then the flame and cluster in the factors but the multi use of it doesn't deserve C and should be in my opinion B or A.
Neuro Lasso + Spinning Death + Proximity Mine + Sentries × 4 engies = Boss Melter
or: Turret EM Discharge + Spinning Death + L.U.R.E. + Sentries × 4 engies = anything melter. you just give everything in one place (or in two places)
non of the things listed do good single target damage. If you want an Engie loadout to shred bosses take executioner and hyperpropellant. I take proxy mines for the phase of the hiveguard where you shoot the weird side bits. also hyperprop is entirely enough so I like some AoE primary like explosive chemical rounds better.
poison grenades for driller are really underrated I use it as sorta a sheild like gunner I think it would be the best grenade on every class if they had different grenade loadouts gets out shined by drillers already great crowd control especially scout since he lacks crowd control
Slight correction: *two* lead bursters will kill a regular bulk detonator
(Unless there was a balance change Im not aware of)
Two perfectly placed bursters in 1p scaling, maybe, but practically it usually takes 3 or 4
@@pvewaste i have join many modded haz5 4p scaling with bulk infestation warning
1 lead burster if throw into correct place (like how you use bouncing OC with drak-25 to kill praet) enough to shred their hp down below 40%, its between throw another 1 lead burster to finish him off or just use your main/secondary guns
Since phernomone canister nerf in 2020, everyone says that its essentially useless since its inconsistent with some bugs still attacking players and how the status effect is more limited in the number of enemies it has affected. If pheromones can still maintain its utility why do you think people felt it was so underpowdered?
It did recently (like, a year ago or so) get a buff where pheromoned enemies would fight back and had the aggro cap increased, which has definitely helped it. That being said, I don't think it was ever particularly bad, but compared to its past glory people just overreacted and overcorrected.
Nice how you have Risk of Rain music playing
I really want to enjoy Neurotoxin grenades, and they are great fun in solo especially with goo, but any sort of team gameplay it is definitely rough, whether a teammate has fire or to be most effective with it often cutting line of sight on big groups that a gunner or engi could clean up faster.
ill definitely try out pheromones more often though ive always picked cryo or ifgs so might be worth switching up
shoutout for the risk of rain music
If you could change something about stun sweeper, what would you do ?
I think an easy first step would be to make them spammable. They might need some numeric tweaks as well, but it's kind of tough to balance them that way, given they're already overtuned on like, Hazard 3, where each nade stuns the whole swarm.
I've found the stun sweeper to be amazing against the huge waves of Naedocyte Shockers in Dense Biozone, as well as macteras and anything you want stunned from pretty huge distances away
I'm surprise for the boomrang ! I always tought it wad amazing, I mean you have 8 of them, they auto aim meaning to can throw them in a nano second, and they provide breathing room
AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, THEY KILL THOSE ANOYING SWARMERS
But I of course see your point !
The biggest problem boomerangs run into is becoming worse the higher up in hazard you go. Hazard 3 and below? They're amazing. Hazard 4? Still good. Hazard 5? Starting to get eh but still has a great use-case vs swarmers, naedocytes, stunning big boys/mactera, and for clutching revives. In fact I enjoy taking them in hazard 5 especially to deal with swarmers and mactera.
Past that though, they start to fall from eh to a lot worse. Where the other grenades get better and affect more enemies as hazard goes up, boomerangs dont. Coming from the perspective of modded hazards, boomerangs stop being able to do stuff they used to like wiping out swarmers/naedocytes because there are simply too many. Likewise with clutch revives, once again there are too many bugs to stun them all. Compare this to a pheromone grenade where 1 phero can equal like 10+ boomerangs with a good throw and they just stop really comparing.
To be clear though, use it if you want to. They aren't bad in any un-modded hazard, and in fact offer up a lot of unique and fun possibilities and uses. They just simply dont scale beyond vanilla gameplay.
Jesus is coming soon! He loves you and He died on the cross for your sins!❤
I do like the gunner's sticky grenade. The fact that it sticks to the surface makes it perfect imo to get rid of big tough targets, especially if I manage to hit the weak spot. I find it very reliable, provided that I throw it correctly
I keep hearing people say that rippers are bad, but they only do slightly lower damage than axes and can hit multiple enemies, if you use them like a more “traditional” grenade and throw them at groups of grunts they’re pretty good imo
i mean they're fine against grunts, but that's next to meaningless on the class with the best grunt clear
sooooo awesome. love these videos!
HE grenade enjoyers unite
proking vampire heals from distance and shattering iced targets is cool and all, but deleting a whole group of glyphids, swarmers or macteras across the room and up-close alike, while still having 4 even bigger explosions for more important negotiations just feels good
yeah you can do pretty much the same with epc with tcu, but i just can't care for learning how to plasma, and i do like my boolet, especially with new subata's mods
I love the shredders. They just fix anything. They damage Oppressors, they slow down anything bug enough to survive them konger than a half second, and they singlehandedly clear grunt swarms. Macteras and the other special enemies aren't safe either. S tier imo. Vital for a solo engie build.
Honestly if the drillers buzzsaw did melee damage it would potentially too strong in higher hazards when combined with vampire
Also if i remember right , alot of the tanky bugs are either vulnerable or have no damage resist to melee so it could also really fuck up dreads and opressors
Its really in one lf those spots balance wise though tbh i wouldnt mind if they jusy made it melee damage to see how it goes in practice
the problem then is if you give it melee then it's way too good with vampire and if you don't, it's still bad.
@@poggestfrog yeah with how that is its a damned if you do damned if you dont, kind of situation
@@TheTreesmac I think maybe make it "rip" more, via doing more damage the longer it stays in a enemy hitbox like the breach cutter which would be a boon for driller and single-target. Add on very chunky weakpoint boosts and you've got a praetorian killer
No you see it would be a soul for a soul. You would group some bugs and regen to max at the cost of your scout but eh no matter
On a more serious note if it did both direct and aoe dmg like the auto cannon so it would still hurt teammates but also wouldn’t hit them with the full 100+ dmg as it does rn would be a start
How'd you remove the ragdolls of the bugs when you kill them? Also been enjoying your stuff, thank god I ran into your vids.
the mod No Ragdolls
I feel like base hord size on haz 5 is not large enough for Clusters to be really usable to its full effect aside from the stun (but imo Gunner has better ways to stun than throwing 1/4 of your nades out), thats why i rarely feel like using them. Every time i tried them i was like "damn if i had Leadbursters i could be dealing with a wider target selection", on low gravity missions Clusters become even harder to use imo. Whereas Leadbursters only care about line of sight, do well enough for haz 5 swarm clear + single target deletion. Only weakpoint for them is accidentally triggering stationary targets across the cave like Korloks and or Dreads if thrown badly
Stickys were my go to before Leadbursters got added since they are easy to use and provide decent crowd clear if you throw them on the ground instead of on enemys plus having an instant fear source to interrupt large targets makes them decently versatile
great vid and love the ror2 music, but sometimes its hard to understand without captions :p
The stun sweapers are clearly inferior, I mean freeze usually affects more targets with immobilisation, but here is the thing.
It feels good. You can throw them endlessly in downtime as fidgeting, it is usually good enough to clear a downed ally for resurection, it is a nice panic button, makes a satiafying bouncing animation and sound, and you can't waste them, because they auto-hit or come back for you to try again. The stun sweaper isn't a good nade, but it's a brainless convenience with spectacle.
Agree with the other comments about stun sweepers, they may not be as nuky as the other Scout nades, but you pack 8 of them. And it's so fun to stun a menace from the middle of nowhere and trifork volley it into oblivion
I hear that RoR2 music mod in the background, I have it too and love it.
I think proxy is A-S depending on terrain because it just lets you ignore entire attack vectors except for the heavy enemies. (I play haz 4 btw, maybe this isn't true on 6x2.)
I only use HE grenades on driller. Not the best option, but very nice to have for dealing with swarms (especially macteras) just out of reach of a facemelter flamethrower or to hard to properly hit with a sludge pump charged shot. Thin containment field on the plasma pistol kinda solves that, but I don’t always have the plasma pistol with me and I’m not great at using it consistently.
However, the main reason I like them so much is that they are so, so satisfying to use, especially when you cook it just right to clear out a group of fliers
Biggest uses I've found for lures as Engi isn't to distract enemies, but rather to clump them up for nukes, plascrete explosions, turret arcs/discharges, turret whips, etc. Also the lure is super handy against the nemesis. Just throw two lures at it and then you and your fellow dwarves can get right up in its face for like a solid 30 seconds without fear of being grabbed. But, the main issue is that aside from rare enemy spawns and specific builds, you're almost always better off just grabbing SSGs for the all around workhorse utility.
Also I can't agree more with the ripper being in F. My teams driller has killed me more with those things than with satchels
Leadburster became my fav grenade by far due to being able to accomplish things no other nade can. It also rewards players getting really good with it. Still love napalm for its aoe and ability to corral swarms since they try to avoid it.
Cluster aside from stun has only been used for style. As for sticky I share your same opinion though I like its got its niche
Personal rating LB>Fire>Cluster>Sticky
The placement of spring loaded ripper hurt my heart yet I agree
Love your content man
I like the ROR2 background music. You have very good videogame taste.
Hi waste I’ve been playing deep rock for about 5 months now and I’m starting to really understand the game and can do haz 5 consistently but I want to look into modding what mods would you recommend/use
The only gameplay changing mod I use extensively is custom difficulty, which lets you increase the difficulty of the game. I play Hazard 6x2, but you might want to try Hazard 6 first, then maybe Hazard 5x2 spicy fire, then 6x2 to ease into it.
The RoR2 music really hitting
Hold on you're telling me that my empty blackout stout mug didn't even make it on the tierlist