Ending the Aim vs Gamesense Debate
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2021
- If your AIM is bad enough, your gamesense might not even matter. But does that mean Aim as a whole is more important than gamesense? or does it mean something else? taking a look into the importance of Aim vs Gamesense.
edited by SadKellz -- / sadkellz
#csgo #AimvsGamesense
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tags: csgo, cs go, cs:go, counter-strike: global offensive gameplay, csgo aim, csgo gamesense, csgo 200iq, csgo aim vs gamesense, aim vs brain, how important is aim, how important is gamesense, voocsgo aim vs gamesense - เกม
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edited by twitter.com/sadkellz
crosshair placement is 50/50 aim/gamesense, as all things should be. Hear me out though, pretty much exactly half of cp is knowing where to look, and the other half is being able to aim there quickly.
I'm waiting for your "Thoughts on new CS:GO Update" video.
my problem is that i aim on them and for some reason aim off them
As a silver, I can proudly say that I have neither
same bro, same
rushing A on dust2 with mac10s works too often for me to say definitively that we shouldn't do it.
such a shame to picture of PAIN.
Salute
Went from dmg to silver over time. It sucks but the game is still fun.
Knowing where to place your chrosshair is gamesense, and then actually having your crosshair where you want it to be in your crosshair placement is imo aim.
That makes tons of sense
I feel the same way. Being able to get your crosshair to the point your brain wants it to be quickly and efficiently i do believe is an aiming skill.
isn't 'knowing where to keep your crosshair' just crosshair placement?
@@a5hen I agree with you but I think the comment was trying to get the idea of actually getting it there is aim
@@a5hen crosshair placement takes gamesense. Sometimes you hold wide angle, sometimes u dont. Being in right postion at right time while looking at right location is game sense. So yes crosshair placement is a part of gamesense.
Hope you guys enjoy the edit! The workshop map is "yprac aim trainer" for anyone wondering.
0:58-1:07 was incredibly slick. Nice job dude
The edit was 1337 af
WHAT IS THAT WHITE SPHERE BALL AIM TRAINING WORKSHOP MAP FOR CSGO?? PLEASE TELL NAME OR LINK TO IT.
@@akhilvashist1339 fucking yprac aim trainer, dude
Man, the edit was top notch! Keep up the excellent work!
Aim is the foundation of the game, you simply need to know it. You can't play chess without knowing how the pieces move. Game sense comes in play when you're facing someone with the same aim skill. When both players know how the pieces move, that's when moving the right ones matter.
I think this is a really good explanation to it. Combined with another comment suggesting that with better aim, can allow you to do riskier strats and thus make it seem you have better gamesense
You could also pretty much wrap tactics like forks and skewers into the aim part of the metaphor as well, since they typically become fundamental rules of how higher level play works while being something that lower levels can use to get an advantage on a player who doesn't know
Can I just say that I love the animations / editing in this vid? Feels really smooth and well done.
Thank you!
@@sadkellz yo sick edit bro
Just watched the video in 40x speed very well put together mr voo!
I have a chrome extension that lets me do this and. Idk what I expected tbh.
I gotta say I love this type of editing / style of the video. I hope videos of THIS SORT are going to be like this in the future because they fit this style of videos. Very high quality, probably the best you can get right now.
This has “how good was swags cross hair placement” energy, good work
I'm like so far from swags skill level that I can't be seen but even I always liked to keep my crosshair far from a corner so the enemy moves into it, especially if I'm anticipating a wide, semi-wide swing. Even with the AWP I get a significant portion of my kills by letting the guy wide swing into my crosshair. If I dont anticipate correctly tho that can mean I have to flick to the right and I'm also more exposed to an angle.
i love this different type of video where you show a bunch of clips, and the transition to the infographs are really smooth, can't really describe it perfectly, but i like these more
Better aim gives you more confidence to try different options using your game sense. Game sense is the potential on how well you can utilize that aim.
@Meh confidence, confidence, confidence. You say that, but would you do it in a game in which you’re losing all your gunfights?
@@thawtayza1892 lmaooo
If you guys are trying to figure out which is more important(aim or gamesense), Let me ask you this question..
Lets say you were completely new to FPS and you could use one cheat. Which would you choose? Aimbot or wallhack?
I hope this answers the debate here…
@@TheLittleAzn I mean, they first have to be stupid enough to cheat but then, you do have a point.
Perfectly said man
The problem is that aim really limits how you can play, I often see players, myself included, holding angles that are easy to hold, but strategically not the right choice, usually because the enemy gets too much room. Also there are only a few really good angles on every map and if you play only these the enemy will probably prefire them soon. The better the aim is, the more freedom do you have in your decisions, making it look like you have even more gamesense. Usually the unexpected plays are the hard plays with difficult fights
True. If you have a bad aim, you tend to play passive, giving up too much space. Even if you have like 100lvl gamesense, they can utilize this space to do splits, good luck with shooting them down now.
With better aim, you get more aggressive, more angles to hold and more space, which leads to more information.
@@assetaden6662 you dont even have to be bad in aiming to play passively. alot of people are simply not confident enough to be aggressive and just hold passiv angles cause its simply easier and more convinient. i personally had to learn to get more aggressive and stop being so passiv all the time and pretty much build up my confidence, i have enough gamesense and aim to do that but i never really had the confidence to do so. so in the end it ended up in not utilizing my gamesense and completely rely on my aim, which even if you're s1mple, you will most likely loose more battles that way and thats why s1mple never really goes passiv unless he has to.
aim + gamesense isn't all that matters, its also the confidence that you have that make a huge difference in your decisions.
this video was way more easier to watch than your previous ones and I enjoyed it so much. Keep it up!
The recent NIP vs Mouz Game on Inferno is the perfect example. Basically Mouz always gets the opening kills by setups, then the rest of NIP players just run around and demolished Mouz by aim. So painful to watch as a Mouz Fan.
LOVE the production quality, keep it up man!
I started to get back into CS:GO 2 months ago after a roughly 8 year hiatus. I'm now fluctuating between mg1 and mg2.
What I notice a lot is that bad aim frustrates me a lot more. If I made a smart play (or got lucky) and just can not hit the shot it is very annoying.
If the positioning or timing is wrong and I loose a gunfight it does not feel too bad. All of this is not black a white of course as you pointed out.
this video is amazing bro. this editing was so fluid
4:10 ah yes Aim 30% and gamesence 60% that adds up
smh @sadkellz
@@vooCSGO 😳 math hard
and 10℅ packet loss LUL
10% gaming chair
10 percent luck, 50 percent skill ..... x)
The level of editing of this video is practically god tier. Damn.
Just wanna say this was really well written and edited, great video
really great quality here - loved the camera angles
This video is so well done and edited, it gave me launders' video on swag's crosshair placement vibes.
What a truly amazing video
i like how he puts out everyone can makes mistakes even himself
is he supposed to call himself the supreme flawless god tht is above everyone else or smth like lmfao ofc every1 makes mistakes
@@SlayNorway ofc he make yt csgo vids
lmao he is good but nowhere near the top level. Pros can shit on him with their eyes closed. CSGO is one of those games have insane gap between different classes of players. So obviously he makes mistake all the time
I don't usually comment, but I felt like the editing really meshed well to your style of video and also just really refreshing to see this much effort put into csgo content. Great video!
Your video quality has improved exponentially! Great job!
Good points and really smooth editing!
Voo this editing is crazy good man, love the new style
CONGRATULATION FOR THIS HIGH QUALITY CONTENT VOO KEEP IT UP BRO
That A-Ramp flank from voo is literally MY LIFE. Good video, love the debate.
Nice video, good editing and animations :)
Nice editing, liked the style of the video
What’s frustrating is being stuck at a rank because your aim is lacking, and spectating teammates making dumb plays from game sense perspective
I can relate. I have played this game for a Long time but i play on and off so in always stuck around LE-LEM
Your voice in this video was really good. It had a more "casually explained" informational vibe to it, while staying interesting (not getting boring)
Reinventing yourself is so true. I trained aim hard in my earlier days, after taking 5 years off from playing it felt like I had no idea how to play the game. I wasn't entirely just running and gunning to get kills. The way I played was based on the fights I knew I could win and as soon as that margin shifted ever so slightly, it's like nothing I thought I knew worked anymore. As I've kept playing I've found that my consistency has gone up a lot.
In a FPS game aim will always take over game sense.
Not at lower skill levels.
@@REALDEALFLEXSEAL dont you mean especially in low skill levels? i can run in and rush a 5 stack and win if im facing silvers, my gamesense can be doggy and i can still win duels 90% of the time
Tell that to Quake players.
Amazing editing!
Reminds me of some of Launders videos they have simmilar edits. Well done!
Editing is really good!
This is actually a very interesting way to look at this debate. When I'm playing at my best, I'm holding passive angles with an AWP and trying to set my team up for the best possible retake (CT side) and/or clutching late-round (if I'm on T). However, if I'm smurfing with my friends I find myself making "s1mple-like" plays and just doing whatever tf I want, relying on my aim vs worse players and I find myself becoming that "WHY IS HE PLAYING LIKE THAT" when I play on my main account. It's a funny way of viewing the aim vs game sense debate, because I can see arguments from both side of it.
I think about it like this. What is more important in a girl, how she looks or what kind of a person she is. Well obviously both, but no matter how nice of a person the woman is, even if she is literally perfect, no guy would consider having a relationship with her if she is ugly. So having some basic lvl of nice look is a MINIMUM requirement for the personality to matter, and the same is with aim, it is a MINIMUM requirement for your gamesense to matter, which makes aim more important to me.
Weird metaphor but ok
This editing is top notch!
really liked this style of video
Honestly this explains a lot of games where with "similarly" ranked match ups the other team just does WAY better than the other team making it look like to some folks like it's a match of Globals vs MG's and the other team doesn't seem to deserve their rank. But in reality it's really because sometimes the other team is just so much better at out-dueling/aim than the other team no matter how many strats they throw it almost always ends up in vain.
It's like how in your matches you'll have a situation against a strong team where you have a solid bomb plant on a site with everyone alive in strong positions but the 2 CT's left absolutely wipe the floor with you still leaving everyone dumbfounded.
True, I know potentially great players who spend all their time researching on all angles smokes and maps but never practicing
the editing on this video is so clean
I love how you used the Apeks - Grus deagle play on mirage, A-site :D It's the sickest deagle i've ever seen o.o 3:40
jesus christ this is a well thought out and produced video.
I always find that I am unable to play the same strats I use after returning from counterstrike from a longer break. I like to push main on cache for example, but the best pop flash cant save you if you cant hit for shit. Very frustratring to not be able to play your style properly but luckily it comes back after a while
I agree with all of this. Especially the point that when you get hammered in an unbalanced game, opponents stop using strategy to beat you, which then makes the game feel aim heavy and less skillful. It would be good to answer the question - how do you make teams respect you. What strats (rush b?) work best against teams with better aim than yours?
ok this production value and writing was top notch
A player with great aim, working up the ranks, will eventually learn enough about the game to succeed.
A player sitting at his desk studying rotations, callouts, defaults, lineups, watching demos, etc. Might never make it out of nova if he has a 1 second response time and has trouble clicking the steam icon to start up the game. There are physical limitations to how much a players aim can improve.
Can ONLY aim carry you to pro? absolutely.
Can ONLY game sense carry you to pro? Fuck no.
THIS VIDEO LOOKS SO GOOD WHAT
The way I see it is 50% aim and 50% game sense, but that doesn't necessarily mean those two things are equal. Having better aim will always trump game sense. For example, a friend of mine is a very good player on games like Call of Duty, Battlefield, PUBG, and Valorant, but has never played CS:GO before, however, he still came 4th across both teams and it generally stayed like that until his game sense increased enough to the point where he is now able to come 1st across both teams for most games. If you want to think of it another way, try it like this. If you take 5 average players and play on a map they know very well against someone like s1mple but he has never played on this map, who do you think will win?
SadKellz is doing an amazing job, this is insane
i like how you can make a reasonable argument and fuck around as well
Maybe this makes it easier.
For me, game sense is your instinct.. the read of the game that you have in your own mind which dictates your thought of what is the best play you can make to win the round.
And so, it also depends on what level of players or teams you are playing against on a regular basis. It is formed based on your expectation of what the opponent will do.
Aim is simply your ability to win duels. You might jiggle peek an awper 10 times to make him miss the shot and then swing for an easy kill or simply wide peek and instantly shoot him in the head. That entire package is aim. The percentage of duels that you win.
s1mple does have a ceiling of aim where he can hit ridiculous flicks but I think his major advantage is his instinct and how he breaks the opponents expectation. This is why he used to be particularly less effective against the old Astralis, because they were able to modify their expectations and expect his plays. In a way, Astralis used to capitalise on NaVis dependence on simple.
Currently, NaVi are no.1 because the dependence on simple has reduced, and he himself has transformed to a more consistent player.
He still makes ridiculous plays which no one expects. But he doesn't try to do that every round. It is no longer his responsibility to create magic. NaVi can win rounds without magic from him too.
This is a very good video man. Your aim decides how you apply your gamesense!!
on the last example with simple pushing because of "confidence in his aim". I think you could argue he pushed like that because his gamesense told him its the right moove to make. Interesting debate and video for sure
yeah i'd say it's a bit of both for sure. if it was someone else they probably hold back because they're not confident if they *do* see someone they'll get the kill consistently
in reality what's going through s1mple's mind is "fak zis bish"
So how do I improve my ganesense? I know I can practice aim on prefire maps or aim maps bit how do I practice gamesense? Are there some maps as well I missed?
It's difficult for me to look at it. I don't play soloqueue anymore. A few pugs and the rest is praccs and officials.
My Faceit average stats are horrible as usual. And leetify gives me really bad aim stats when I get above average frags and stats for the team. Maybe that's survivorship bias? If you play bad, you only get the frags where you have the advantage and not the flicks and aggressive moves.
You might sort of get why i find it ABSOLUTELY stupid when a “coach” takes a silver level player and starts teaching him smokes, utility use, positioning, map understanding and all this shit. That is stupid for two reasons. 1. At that level his problem is obviously mechanics and not where he stands. 2. He will now learn to rely on these things and not mechanics when he plays a LOT more and in the process it will create bad habits.
The way I thought my friends that were new to cs go is i first took them into surfing servers and had fun playing that for weeks. The first time he stepped into a game, his movement was like easily MG level and it made a BIG difference. And its not only movement, surfing, bhop maps, will help even with aiming mechanics indirectly as well, especially with beginners. This is how u learn counter strike. Counter strike, back from cs 1.6 days has always been about mechanics.
The level of production just got higher....
Anyone know the map Voo shows at 00:35?
yprac aim trainer
Well made video! imo gamesense is more important because I also lose to much lower ranked players on maps I haven't played a lot (vertigo for example) simply because I don't know the angles and where to place my crosshair I'm just clueless so its gamesense for me
i think we can all agree that after a streak of 7 won rounds the team itself get a boost of confidence and can rush mollys together without a word the syncrinization doubles at that point. Its not aim is moral boost.
Editing hella fly
When I'm feeling it, when the point click aim is good, so is the crosshair placement. I think gamesense however might tell you if you hold/peek one angle or another but if you know what you want to peek, then crosshair placement is all aim imo
ScreaM proved this
no evidence his aim was better than the aim of others, he just had a different aimstyle
As a person who never had a good aim in any game I will say that AIM is more important, because in the end of the day if you can't click on the enemy you will always lose. But the s1mple example was good. This proves one thing: that neither is more important. The most important thing is confidence. In the few occasions I had confidence in myself while playing I was unstoppable.And as soon as I started thinking about my aim, my positions and other stuff, I started sucking and couldn't kill a frozen bot with a knife. Overthinking is my biggest enemy.It stops me from comfortably getting into my zone and being confident. So if you have confidence you are halfway there.
Game sense allows for better aim, as it makes it easier to win gunfights but raw aim is a combination of being able to point, click, and control the recoil of your weapon. Ultimately crosshairs placement is game sense but is tied into aim as well
Lol i played a similar game in Mirage like the one you lost; the T's were stomping mid and going EVERYWHERE in the map (short/b apps/window/kitchen at the same time...) We managed to comeback (i tried to lead: control, punish then decide where to go) and we lost 14-16 (from a 0-9 start).
honestly the best take ive heard yet.
For crosshair placement I would go completly for the aim, I mean, you dont need to know about the game enought to play with your crosshair head height (I played all battlefields and always aimed to place my crosshair where their heads should be, and it translated well to CSGO)... prefire corners peeking is gamesense in the other hand...
I look at this debate like this: aim is your practice, gamesense is your experience, and I'm making up an example... Mirage T side u rush mid but the previous round u know 1 person from CT pushed short( don't care about con, under, window) with aim from CT, he will straight up peek as fast as possible and maybe try to quickly check common, but if u get there fast enough u can get into an uncommon angle that u know works against a push play from short and set up ur crosshair a bit wider than the tightest where u can place it, and with just base aim like seeing him, shooting while at the least trying to control spray, but since u already set up ur crosshair u won't need many shots to kill him so like 75 percent gamesense with 25 percent aim.
(This is just my perspective)
anyone got a link or know what the circle shooting workshop map he was using?
WHAT IS THAT WHITE SPHERE BALL AIM TRAINING WORKSHOP MAP FOR CSGO?? PLEASE TELL NAME OR LINK TO IT.
Reviewing this video I think people should think of bot only game sense or aim but of aimsense as well, the combination of both to their fullest to support each other
Finally someone answered this question properly
Surprised in that 3 main points of mechanics you don't include crosshair placement which has helped me more than any spray control or movement would for about a third of my kills.
i agree aim > game sense but when you get to a higher level and you choose between better aim or game sense, game sense is better in my opinion
having good gamesense/awareness is nothing if you don't have good aim. Having good aim is like talent - it can take you a long way but you need the game sense sprinkled in to reach your potential - the hard work in this analogy.
Can you explain the Happy joke? Is it because if you are looking behind instead of ahead, you catch Happy because he always came from behind?
For me the way I think about it is that a player with great aim and no gamesense can probably progress further than a player with gamesense and no aim.
8:15 I completely disagree with you here.
It's an example of a play that completely eliminates the contest of who has the better aim because he can shoot his opponent in the back.
The worse your aim the more reason was there to go for that play.
If you are 99% sure you will lose the aim duel this is the perfect play to compensate for that.
The right example of a combination of aim, and game sense is when someone flashes himself into five opponents with perfectly chosen timing and kills them all.
I have decent aim, but when i go on new maps that i havent played before my "aim" suddenly sucks, because i dont know where to place my crosshair. So as someone else said: gamesense is knowing where to put your crosshair, aim is actually putting it there. You gotta have both.
Now THIS is an interesting topic and video. Aim vs Gamesense. Both are (very) important). Crucial. But if your aim is very bad then it's hard to make use of GS.
I am aim.
I am the pure example of a one trick pony, i used to have really good aim. I got to faceit 10, 2.4k elo with just that.
I literally dont know any smokes, my utility is silver at best.
I got a good combination of gamesense and aim, i just xantares peeked and used peekers advantage and played agressively all the time, taking fights without flashing since idk flashes or using any utility.
I outaimed everyone and even at 2.4k elo i was being called a hacker.
Now i am in my 30's and i also dont play as much, ive deranked a lot since i can't aim anymore and i feel reluctant to try. But hell, i got so far with just aim when i was younger.
I mostly just feel slow and i cant be arsed to move as quick, my reflexes are duds now unless i am on caffeine or something.
The downside of being a onetrick pony is that once my aim died, my rank died really hard. I now find myself having to learn utility, after 20+ years of me not even trying since cs1.5.
BUT AIM ALONE wont get you that far, if you dont watch the right angles and know where to expect the enemy. Aim and some good gamesense, will.
'in theory' this is also why s1mple is number one and my own theory on why HIGH sens is better (on paper).
But most people can't handle high sens, its to quick for eye coordination or for the finessing part.
But the faster you are the easyer your fights should be. s1mple can play high sens wich allows him to be such a prick that can outaim anyone.
yes i kinda agree
when i play mm sometimes the balance is off and my teammates are like silvers or gold novas but im not
also all of the enemy team is in my level lets call it +mg1
when they understand that 4 of their opponents are like bots and they would kill them no matter how stupid they play the game gets messy
even if i coulve carry that match on by myself i would likely to lose beacuse the possibilities are infinite at that point.
they could push through a smoke that they threw and they could push behind you at the same time.
even if i can outaim all of them in normal 1v1 duel those normal 1v1 duels are not gonna happen very often beacuse of the confident that theyre aim gives them.
in that position no matter how good you are you will most likely lose the match.
god the first thing that he said about aiming better and being moron is so true, had a team, cannot think and play the map at all, does stupid shit, push and play whatever position they want, I keep telling them play the positions, hold, wait for my flash to peek, does not listen, I told them if they keep playing stupid we'll lose, and guess what we still won
bec aim is too important and good brain only matters when the opponent is similar in aim
Pog editing
Pog content
I think it's more of mechanics vs game sense.
Aim/crosshair placement won't be useful if you have a shitty counter strafe ability and movement. You are gonna miss it even though your crosshair placement is as good as xantares. So, mechanics comes as a pack IMO.
Game sense, on the other hand, is more of reading where your opponent is, when to walk or run, how to lurk by reading the situation, etc.
To sum it up: you need both mechanics and game sense to be a good player. You will need mechanics more in the lower rank, and more of game sense in the higher rank because the difference in mechanics at the higher rank is so small that it looks like all people have good mechanics.
good theme for a chat and video or to make a better study
quality content
This video was really well put together. One of your higher quality videos.
How does anyone think crosshair placement is gamesense? The concept is widely misunderstood
Gamesense consists of strats, reading the enemy, coming up with a way to win mid-round, understanding enemies positions and how to position yourself favorably, etc.
Crosshair placement is 100% aim, which can be trained and perfected. This is why even top aimers might lack gamesense, it is not something you can really practice and burn into your brain.
what's the map used in 0:34
??????
There's a reason why top aimers generally are extremely aggressive or take on entry fragging roles. Aim vs gamesense is a question of using your skills to their fullest. Good aim enables riskier plays by making them less risky. Good gamesense is the knowledge to make the right play for the situation. The skill gap comes in when your ability to execute is bad (can limit playmaking) or when you don't make the higher percentage play because you simply don't know it's an option.
those animations were so clean
That moment when your team triple stack @B Dust 2 ct
U may think that game sense tells you when to aim, aim tells you where to shoot