Improvements to the filament must have been made because it bridges up to 30mm perfectly with the spool I just got. Awesome video like always, thanks you making these.
I printed a quadrocopter of this material. It feels like its unbreakable when you hold it in your hands. But the hard impacts broke the frame very easy at the holes where the spacers are fixed. (It's a copter like the FlexRC MicroOwl). I'm searching for another material which will fit better for this purpose. I will try PC-Plus and PolyPlus on next tries.
if you had the time could you give us an update on your follow up prints in PC-Plus and PolyPlus? did you find any better success versus hard impact compared to the cf nylon?
interesting with the PLA/Nylon gear at the end, I hadnt thought of that, it also goes along to helping you keep the expensive CoPA for when you need it, not for the entire part, smart move.
Kind of stole that idea from E3Ds OpenRC model. The idea is not only to save expensive filament but to use the soft and wear resistent material where you need it and use stiffer material in between like for example a carbon fiber filled material. So you can get the best out of both worlds.
It would be really cool if you would test the parts for gasoline and Oil-Resistance as well. I sometimes print things for my dirtbike (for example a New chainguard) and overtime it will get quite oily
5:31 A likely explanation is that the polyamide material underwent cold crystallization in that heated environment; this can be verified using a DSC if you have one available.
Very nice review. I had just bought my first spool, but didn't try it out yet, so I was very curious. I still wonder how it compares to Taulman Alloy 910 (black variant preferably) which is a Co-polymer of Polyamide 6.6 too and which I used on my product (automated turntables for 360 photography that can handle loads up to 100 kg). Thank you for your work. I love your videos!
Have you tried Polymaker PC-MAX yet? I see a lot of comparisons with materials like ABS but considering ASA is due to outmode it, and PC is supposed to be one of the very strongest materials, I'd be interested to see where it falls on your scale.
That rubber-like quality is very interesting. After you've printed your parts, you could then selectively water-treat some sections of the part while keeping other sections dry, to effectively make a multi-material print from only 1 material! For example, you could 3D print a bushing, and you boil it to make it flexible like rubber, but while you boil it you keep it's bolt-holes outof the water so that it still mounts rigidity. I wonder if it would help to apply a waterproofing agent over certain sections, but not other sections, and then boil it. Some universities (MIT? Or maybe it was Disney Research?) have been doing work with 3D printed designs like this, but IIRC they have been using other methods to adjust the material properties such as using various intricate infill patterns in different areas of the print (like lots of tiny repeating living hinges). So they can do things like make action figurines where the joints are bendy but everything else is stiff.
Considering the moisture only takes a handful of days to propagate through the whole depth of the part from the outside at room temperature - including injection moulded items - I don't deem partial treatment likely to succeed.
Could you please do a review of available filaments that are suitable for engineering parts? Is there anything that prints as well as PLA but has much higher temperature resistance? I have been considering NylonX for gears and cases, but I am not sure this will remain rigid at high domestic temperatures. (Inside a car on a summer day.)
polymakers cf and gf nylon print really well. alsoC theyre really stiff, and the glass fiber nylon supposedly can resist up to 192 degrees celcius, so higher than nylonX
That N....X stuff you're considering is one of the worst CF Nylons and Nylons in general in my experience, I'd stay away from that expensive shite. I suspect they use CF powder with a bad aspect ratio instead of proper fibers and got some other things out of whack as well. Perhaps they changed it in the meantime, hard to imagine it still being on the shelves the exact way it was, but I generally try to avoid companies that sell subpar or even crappy product at premium++ prices. There are plenty options anyway - 3dx, Tulman, Filamentum, Basf, Essentium got their own line as well iirc and many more - availability of real "engineering-grade" filament is already pretty good.
@@josiahong5177 Right, that seems to be a very common outcome with the N....X stuff. If it would be superior in one of its mechanical properties or had anything special about it whatsoever...
@@heinzhaupthaar5590 only two unique thing is thst they dont give data for the moisture absorbed parts, and they are kinda light at 1g/cc, although i wouldnt use it due to warping. Polymakers reinforced nylons are so easy to print they replace anything for most applications. Ive been able to print stuff in PA6-GF and it required a 0mm tolerance to fit, itherwise it was too loose, so really accurate printing.
Annealing does 2 things: 1. Reduce internal stresses from the printing process (which increases ductility) and 2. increase crystallinity if you have a semi-crystalline polymer. So the cooking will have changed the structure slightly, but also helped the water get into the part faster.
A possible test to determine if the moisture was the cause of the increased heat resistance would be to store a piece in room temperature water and boil one until they have the same moisture content and then run the test. If they perform similarly then the water is likely the cause.
Have you tried Overture Easy Nylon? It's also a CoPA of 6 and 6.6, supposed to be easy to print like this, but it's decently cheaper. Wondering if you know how they stack up.
Great review thanks. I would also like to see how this compares to Taulmans Alloy 910. Calim is that it warps less than Taulmans Alloy 910 but other than that not sure how the print quality compares.
WOW this is very useful video, didn't see something like this on TH-cam. There is no much info about this on internet as well. As a mechanical engineering student very interested in this. No body talk about strength of 3D printed structures. Thanks.
How different are the properties of different brands of Nylon? are they all fairly similar as it is the case with PLA or do Taulman Polymaker and cheaper no names really differ in quality?
Great Video, i'll definitely consider this filament in some of my projects. I'd like to see how it stacks up against Taulman Alloy 910 which i already used on some very high load gears and it worked beautifully.
A much more benign explanation for the heat performance would be that the retained moisture in the baked parts simply needed to vaporize, keeping the temperature near 100C until it had all bubbled out. You could test this by holding the temperature between 100 and 180C for an extended amount of time before continuing up to 180C, but the point is moot. Besides, drying in a low oven is a common way to dry hygroscopic filaments that have been left in a humid environment.
Great video, you do fantastic amount of work for this. I was wondering if there's a spreadhsheet of all your test results available? I'd love to have one as a reference, I'm working on a project right now and need something that has pretty good layer to layer adhesion. The tensile strength isn't as important due to how it will be printed.
Hi ! I must use a bendlay transparent filament for my project but after 3 innefective tests I can't make the part stick to the bed when it is as 80°C after only 5 layers ! is it the fan speed that's too high or perhaps that I don't have an enclosure for the 3D printer ?????? please give me some tips ! thanks.
Nope, not yet. I guess it's not the best though. I added some internal structure to the gear to get a tight fit after printing and until now it doesn't seem to fall apart.
Hi CNC kitchen! Thanks for your vid! Could you tell me if one need a printer with 2 nozzles to print out a multi material object like your gear made of nylon and pla? (i am looking for a 3 d printer, i see you did the multi-material with a prusa, can an Ender 3 v2 make it too ?) Cheers, Farid :-)
Bonjour and thanks a lot for your professional videos! Do you think primar, (?) paint or gold, silver aluminium ''placages'' Can protect against moisture?
well i am living in a dry desert and i always wonder what everybody is talking about filaments capturing moisture from the air, what moisture? my filaments are as dry as desert sand :D
So, people with dual-extrusion bots could print this with PVA supports to compensate for poor overhang performance, then condition it as just part of removing the supports. That's handy.
Ist es möglich Nylon-drucke irgendwie am Druckbett festzuschrauben? Ich bin mit meinem gerade am verzweifeln.. Oder auf einer Platte aus Nylon als Druckbett zu drucken? (Ich bitte um Verzeihung für Verwendung der deutschen Sprache unter einem englischem Video..bin gerade zu faul zum übersetzen :/)
Great video and a lot of stuff mentioned, but I still miss one important piece of information. How stiff is the material? Is it elastic enough for living hinges or clips like PETG or is it hard and can replace parts that would be made in polycarbonate? Would you print for example stepper motor brackets for a cnc pcb milling machine or you would lose accuracy because of flexibility? When you bended the boiled piece it looked like a semiflex material like colorfabb ngen flex or polymaker polyflex. Thanks in advance.
If you really add a lot of moisture it's like a semiflex material. Just letting it out in the air for a weak or two will make it perfectly usable for living hinges, way better than PETG! Wouln't use it for stepper motor brackets, though. In such a case ABS ist still an option or even better, annealed PLA.
Improvements to the filament must have been made because it bridges up to 30mm perfectly with the spool I just got. Awesome video like always, thanks you making these.
I printed a quadrocopter of this material. It feels like its unbreakable when you hold it in your hands. But the hard impacts broke the frame very easy at the holes where the spacers are fixed. (It's a copter like the FlexRC MicroOwl). I'm searching for another material which will fit better for this purpose. I will try PC-Plus and PolyPlus on next tries.
if you had the time could you give us an update on your follow up prints in PC-Plus and PolyPlus? did you find any better success versus hard impact compared to the cf nylon?
@@jed3219 I did not have any success with printing copters, so I switched back to milling Carbon frames again or flying the betafpv stuff...
interesting with the PLA/Nylon gear at the end, I hadnt thought of that, it also goes along to helping you keep the expensive CoPA for when you need it, not for the entire part, smart move.
Kind of stole that idea from E3Ds OpenRC model. The idea is not only to save expensive filament but to use the soft and wear resistent material where you need it and use stiffer material in between like for example a carbon fiber filled material. So you can get the best out of both worlds.
It would be really cool if you would test the parts for gasoline and Oil-Resistance as well.
I sometimes print things for my dirtbike (for example a New chainguard) and overtime it will get quite oily
5:31 A likely explanation is that the polyamide material underwent cold crystallization in that heated environment; this can be verified using a DSC if you have one available.
Sorry, this is one of the tools I unfortunately don't have in my shop ;-)
Very nice review. I had just bought my first spool, but didn't try it out yet, so I was very curious. I still wonder how it compares to Taulman Alloy 910 (black variant preferably) which is a Co-polymer of Polyamide 6.6 too and which I used on my product (automated turntables for 360 photography that can handle loads up to 100 kg). Thank you for your work. I love your videos!
what i don't like about black 910 is that it's not black..it's dark purple. i'm waiting on a custom run of some actually black 910
Have you tried Polymaker PC-MAX yet? I see a lot of comparisons with materials like ABS but considering ASA is due to outmode it, and PC is supposed to be one of the very strongest materials, I'd be interested to see where it falls on your scale.
That rubber-like quality is very interesting.
After you've printed your parts, you could then selectively water-treat some sections of the part while keeping other sections dry, to effectively make a multi-material print from only 1 material!
For example, you could 3D print a bushing, and you boil it to make it flexible like rubber, but while you boil it you keep it's bolt-holes outof the water so that it still mounts rigidity. I wonder if it would help to apply a waterproofing agent over certain sections, but not other sections, and then boil it.
Some universities (MIT? Or maybe it was Disney Research?) have been doing work with 3D printed designs like this, but IIRC they have been using other methods to adjust the material properties such as using various intricate infill patterns in different areas of the print (like lots of tiny repeating living hinges). So they can do things like make action figurines where the joints are bendy but everything else is stiff.
too bad no one experiment on that, printing 4m height 3d printed dildo make more views :(
You could do a selective treatment but this will only work short-term, since the moisture level will equalize over time in the whole part.
Sorry, but you know - "demonetization" and so on ;-)
Considering the moisture only takes a handful of days to propagate through the whole depth of the part from the outside at room temperature - including injection moulded items - I don't deem partial treatment likely to succeed.
Could you please do a review of available filaments that are suitable for engineering parts? Is there anything that prints as well as PLA but has much higher temperature resistance? I have been considering NylonX for gears and cases, but I am not sure this will remain rigid at high domestic temperatures. (Inside a car on a summer day.)
polymakers cf and gf nylon print really well. alsoC theyre really stiff, and the glass fiber nylon supposedly can resist up to 192 degrees celcius, so higher than nylonX
That N....X stuff you're considering is one of the worst CF Nylons and Nylons in general in my experience, I'd stay away from that expensive shite.
I suspect they use CF powder with a bad aspect ratio instead of proper fibers and got some other things out of whack as well.
Perhaps they changed it in the meantime, hard to imagine it still being on the shelves the exact way it was, but I generally try to avoid companies that sell subpar or even crappy product at premium++ prices.
There are plenty options anyway - 3dx, Tulman, Filamentum, Basf, Essentium got their own line as well iirc and many more - availability of real "engineering-grade" filament is already pretty good.
@@heinzhaupthaar5590 i suppose. ive seen horrible warping from nylon x, so ive stayed away from it.
@@josiahong5177
Right, that seems to be a very common outcome with the N....X stuff.
If it would be superior in one of its mechanical properties or had anything special about it whatsoever...
@@heinzhaupthaar5590 only two unique thing is thst they dont give data for the moisture absorbed parts, and they are kinda light at 1g/cc, although i wouldnt use it due to warping. Polymakers reinforced nylons are so easy to print they replace anything for most applications. Ive been able to print stuff in PA6-GF and it required a 0mm tolerance to fit, itherwise it was too loose, so really accurate printing.
I can't wait to see a video about the dual nozzle tarantula.
Working on it!
Does this filament need to be annealed to withstand 180°? Are there any health considerations with this filament?
Very interesting review.
Does it anneal the part in any way by cooking it additionally to just speeding up the process of moisturizing?
Annealing does 2 things: 1. Reduce internal stresses from the printing process (which increases ductility) and 2. increase crystallinity if you have a semi-crystalline polymer. So the cooking will have changed the structure slightly, but also helped the water get into the part faster.
A possible test to determine if the moisture was the cause of the increased heat resistance would be to store a piece in room temperature water and boil one until they have the same moisture content and then run the test. If they perform similarly then the water is likely the cause.
Have you tried Overture Easy Nylon? It's also a CoPA of 6 and 6.6, supposed to be easy to print like this, but it's decently cheaper. Wondering if you know how they stack up.
Great review thanks. I would also like to see how this compares to Taulmans Alloy 910. Calim is that it warps less than Taulmans Alloy 910 but other than that not sure how the print quality compares.
WOW this is very useful video, didn't see something like this on TH-cam. There is no much info about this on internet as well. As a mechanical engineering student very interested in this. No body talk about strength of 3D printed structures. Thanks.
How different are the properties of different brands of Nylon? are they all fairly similar as it is the case with PLA or do Taulman Polymaker and cheaper no names really differ in quality?
Great Video, i'll definitely consider this filament in some of my projects. I'd like to see how it stacks up against Taulman Alloy 910 which i already used on some very high load gears and it worked beautifully.
I'm currently planing a rig to test the wear resistance of different materials. I'd also be interested to see how they compare.
oh yes, wear resistance would be beautiful! thanks for all the work you put into this :D
Nice review. Thank you!
A much more benign explanation for the heat performance would be that the retained moisture in the baked parts simply needed to vaporize, keeping the temperature near 100C until it had all bubbled out.
You could test this by holding the temperature between 100 and 180C for an extended amount of time before continuing up to 180C, but the point is moot. Besides, drying in a low oven is a common way to dry hygroscopic filaments that have been left in a humid environment.
Great video, you do fantastic amount of work for this.
I was wondering if there's a spreadhsheet of all your test results available? I'd love to have one as a reference, I'm working on a project right now and need something that has pretty good layer to layer adhesion. The tensile strength isn't as important due to how it will be printed.
Hi ! I must use a bendlay transparent filament for my project but after 3 innefective tests I can't make the part stick to the bed when it is as 80°C after only 5 layers ! is it the fan speed that's too high or perhaps that I don't have an enclosure for the 3D printer ?????? please give me some tips ! thanks.
What about comparing pbt to pa? I.e. compared with carbon fibers in them? Like 3DE Premium PBT+ Or similar.
Curious if you did any testing on strength of the bonding between the PLA and and the nylon?
Nope, not yet. I guess it's not the best though. I added some internal structure to the gear to get a tight fit after printing and until now it doesn't seem to fall apart.
Hi CNC kitchen!
Thanks for your vid!
Could you tell me if one need a printer with 2 nozzles to print out a multi material object like your gear made of nylon and pla?
(i am looking for a 3 d printer, i see you did the multi-material with a prusa, can an Ender 3 v2 make it too ?)
Cheers,
Farid
:-)
Overture Nylon is the exact same CoPa mix for $33 per Kilo.
I’d be curious to see a comparison between these two to see if there’s actually any mechanical difference
that pebble time 7:03 tho
nothing can replace it
Review the glass fiber version too!
Bonjour and thanks a lot for your professional videos! Do you think primar, (?) paint or gold, silver aluminium ''placages'' Can protect against moisture?
Might be an option, but I don't know how well Nylon is paintable.
well i am living in a dry desert and i always wonder what everybody is talking about filaments capturing moisture from the air, what moisture? my filaments are as dry as desert sand :D
That can be quite an advantage but in case of the nylon i think after printing it is good that it absorbs a lot of moisture:)
Que distancia de retracción me recomienda para una ultimaker S5 no consigo quitar los bultos y los hilos
So, people with dual-extrusion bots could print this with PVA supports to compensate for poor overhang performance, then condition it as just part of removing the supports. That's handy.
You must make a video for friction coefficient between all nylon
Great review!
Why are there no 200g rolls of these expensive filaments????
What copter-model are you showing off here?
Random frame for my QX90 (www.thingiverse.com/thing:2062777). Thought it looked nice.
Ist es möglich Nylon-drucke irgendwie am Druckbett festzuschrauben? Ich bin mit meinem gerade am verzweifeln..
Oder auf einer Platte aus Nylon als Druckbett zu drucken?
(Ich bitte um Verzeihung für Verwendung der deutschen Sprache unter einem englischem Video..bin gerade zu faul zum übersetzen :/)
Suche mal nach ''how to print nylon'', vielleicht kommt da was hilfreiches
can you share your simplify 3d cr-10 fff please
maybe reduce bridging flow rate?
you should try pure poly carbonate too!
This shit is basically like extruding a constant stream of t90 prorvy 3. Insanely strong
Great video and a lot of stuff mentioned, but I still miss one important piece of information. How stiff is the material? Is it elastic enough for living hinges or clips like PETG or is it hard and can replace parts that would be made in polycarbonate? Would you print for example stepper motor brackets for a cnc pcb milling machine or you would lose accuracy because of flexibility? When you bended the boiled piece it looked like a semiflex material like colorfabb ngen flex or polymaker polyflex. Thanks in advance.
If you really add a lot of moisture it's like a semiflex material. Just letting it out in the air for a weak or two will make it perfectly usable for living hinges, way better than PETG! Wouln't use it for stepper motor brackets, though. In such a case ABS ist still an option or even better, annealed PLA.
You should test the new gyroid infill in slic3r.
I will, but I think it's not in the official release, yet.
Very thorough. Thx!
I would be nice if you tested EU brands like Spectrum, Gembird and DevilDesign :)
Hi! It will be verry interesting to see POM in action. Saying POM, I mean polyoxymethylene) Thank you.
Thanks Sir..
Thank you :)
i can't get nylon to stick ;-;
So far I've had best results with a wood glue (PVA) + water mix. Spread it out thin & let it dry completely. Brim helps a great deal too.
Thanks for sharing :-)
I'm I missing something here? You were trying to bridge with NO cooling fan running 🙄🤔👎
Nope, of course I tested bridging with fan on.
Polymaker PC-MAX please... err.. bitte? :))
The finished prints will absord moisture over time, if you live in high humidity you will lose over half the strength characteristics
2
Yes but it still has the same problem after the material is used/ printed so it must be treated because it does absorb humidity.