4:30 So the "challenge" with the Challenger is the ATR. LOL. I just bought the 6th version of this shoe in wide at the Ultra Running Company website. Not at Amazon because Bezos is the opposite of cool, while Leehman is the pinnacle of cool. Not at the Hoka website because they make me say "oh-NAY oh-NAY" in front of people. Not at Zappos because Kedar rides shotgun with Bezos and Bezos is trying to destroy my quiet town with a giant warehouse.
Thank you so much. I just ordered the Challenger ATR5 GTX online..hoping I made a good decision. Sounds like I did. I have some heel issues on my left foot and I need something waterproof to walk my dogs on a light gravel trail every morning. I was wearing Kinvara 11s this summer and they are great but I tried on my Saucony Excursions and I almost died from the pain in my heel. Months of PT completely shot. Hoping that this ATR5 helps me this coming winter.
Might need to pick up a pair. There on sale right now. I run on road and around me has lots of horse trails and fire roads I can just pop over and run on. Generally the cliftons do fine but it would be great when running up some of the steeper hills.
Yes, the brand name situation here is amusing to me. Many people say Hoka 1 1, and some say "Hoka ohnay ohnay". Myself, I just call them Hoka. Good review. I'm also interested in the Hoka Arahi 3.
Thanks PJ87 - just Hoka works for us! FWIW, we won't be reviewing the Arahi in any form. Some consultants told HOKA they needed to be in the "Stability" market, so they created a shoe with some silly technology in the sole and call it a "stability/guidance" shoe. Same with the Gaviota. There's zero science showing that use of these technologies reduces injury rate, allow anyone to run further or faster, or does anything measurable except potentially increase strain on the knees, so we don't carry or review shoes in this category. Also, we just don't think they're as comfortable as their neutral counterparts...so there's that. :)
Best reviews out there..thank you! I’m trying to find out which one is the best for me,challenger or speedgoat! I usually hiking in light rocky trails!
We have limited testing of the Ultraventure, but it's actually a pretty fair comparison, Pedantic. We find the Ultraventure cushion to be a bit less firm (more pillowy!) than the Challenger, but the added width and slight weight gain seems to add back in some of the consistency that one would expect to lose when the cushion is softer. Certainly the toe box on the Ultraventure is better for folks with round or square forefeet, but the Challenger is offered in a wide that may be a better fit for people with a straighter overall foot (from the heel to the toes). We think both are solid entries in the high cushion, multi-surface arena, and would consider both for our longer runs.
I do orienteering, which is a running sport with a map and compass in forest. I train on road and on trail since I’m running on dirt most often during competition and these shoes are literally everything I need. My only real complaint is the upper’s conformity to the foot. For me, I have to really crank the laces in order to get it snug. I heard that this is an issue for some people with this shoe.
Hi, I have a pair of Challenger ATR 5 along with Powerstep insoles which have very much helped me overcome plantar fasiciitis. First time hiking with them I fell but have now gotten used to them and would not hike in anything else.
Brilliant review! I can't decide wether i should get this shoe. It's on sale for just under 80$. I'm not really that much into trail, I just began running on light trail roads a couple of weeks ago. For road running I use the Clifton 6 which I adore! Giving the reduced price of the Challenger, I'll probably end up buying it since you can use it on both lighter trails and roads. My Cliftons are size 11, how do the Challengers compare to that? Should I just get the same size? Thanks for answering !
I am looking to return to trail running after quitting a year and half ago. I used to run in the Challenger ATR 3s I believe and they were very popular. How does this version stack up against the 3s. I’ve ran 3 50 milers on the 3s and they were comfortable
Great question, Danny. We thought the 3s shined primarily because of their towboat, and find this version to be quite accommodating as well. If you liked that version, we expect this will go over well. FWIW, the 2 was our least favorite. :)
Returning mine. Bought as replacement for ATR 2 but these 5's are far too hard and stiff, nothing like the soft cushion of my old cliftons and challengers. Don't know how they can have to much foam yet feel like a hard responsive racing flat.
Thanks for the feedback! We agree both the Clifton and Challenger have gotten firmer since first introduced (we think they're trying to increase durability and lifespan), but we still find the cushion to be much softer than most options on the market. The wider forefoot of the 5th version also allows our feet to expand a bit, and this seems to make that cushion a bit more accessible than past versions. With that said, no two feet are the same, and we really appreciate your comments!
Eli, we just took a look at our trusty Brannok device and 11" gets you to the 11.25 mark...which in our experience means you should be wearing AT LEAST the M12. We like to have 1/2-1" in front of our longest toe, *especially* for trail shoes. Of course the best bet is to stop by a local specialty running store for a personalize fitting, but in lieu of that (and because awesome local stores aren't available everywhere) we would suggest starting with a M12 with the understanding a M12.5 would be even better. Good luck!
Bought these shoes and loved them for running. Got my best running times and my joints didnt hurt as much after a 13mile run....but I returned them because they were not comfortable while walking as they hurt.but running in them felt great.snappy and fast......then I bought speed goats and they dont seem as fast...do you know what could be as good as challenger atr5?? But better fit?
I am looking at a pair of these for cheap online and was curious if they run big or small and if the wide are noticeably wide as those are the ones available.
I run on arahi 4 and gaviota 2...will this shoe still help me ..how does it compared to them..am looking for a hoka that has the cushioning and stability of the arahi and gaviota but with longer trade life
Do these stay true to size? I wear 44 (10.5 US) but I recently bought Hoka Gaviota 2 and had to return them because they were a size too small. Also, are these good for supination (under-pronation)?
If you have pretty buffed out trails which are normally dry and hardpacked, would a normal Clifton work out? I'm thinking especially with the 6th Clifton at 9oz, the weight loss will make it favourable?
Hey @The Ultra Running Company I am going to a very challenging week that has a lot of running in sand and water and i wanted to know if this is the right shoe for it?
To the best of our knowledge, the Mafate EVO is the most durable HOKA made. With that said, the SPeedgoat 3/Speedgoat EVO both have the Vibram MegaGrip material in their sole, which is the same as the Mafate and therefor equally rumble. The Mafate EVO has deeper lugs.
As of today, the latest HOKA is the Speedgoat EVO. It was just released today, so we think we nailed that part of the question. As for which is the best...well, that depends. We have reviews of the Mafate EVO, the Speedgoat, the Challenger, the Stinson, and (in a week or two) the Torrent. We honestly think they each serve a purpose and may appeal to at least a small group of runners. Nathan has used *every single one* in a race in the last 2 years, and since he can run in pretty much whatever he wants, at some point he thought each would be the "best" for what he was doing that day. Check them out and see which one resonates with you!
Hi, Is the wide version *only wider* on the toebox? my heel and midfoot are narrow but my toes are big, looking for shoes that have good lockdown on heel and midfoot but wide on toebox.
Hi Reza - great question! A true "wide" shoe will be wider *throughout* the shoe, not just in the toe box. For folks with narrower heels, this can definitely cause fit issues since the width that feels great at the front is just more than they need at the rear. Fortunately, there are some really solid options for people like you on the market - may we humbly suggest trying out some running shoes from Altra or Topo? Both have solid options on the road AND trail side, and both tend to accommodate people with wider toes than heels. Good luck!
@@TheUltraRunningCompany Thanks! I ran a 100 miler on Altras LP 3.0s. I also own Challenger ATR 5s (regular width), toebox is a few mm narrower than Altra LP 3.0s, but not sure the toebox is spacious enough for a super long race.
Just watched a video where the CEO of Hoka said it’s name was not pronounced 1,1 rather onay, onay. But I’m sure your right, what would the ceo know after all?
How does the toe box size of the normal width (not the 2E version) ATR 5 compare to that of the previous ATR 4? Are they the same or is the newer model narrower/wider? Thank your for your review!
I run with Brooks Glycerin 16 on easy trails with a bit of gravel (I know they're not for trails but I didn't know I liked trailed when I bought them). They shield the front of my feet adequately for distances up to 10 miles but I think I'd prefer something more cushioned for anything longer so I will not feel the gravel stones on the ball of my feet. Would you say any of the Hoka shoes (perhaps the Challenger) would be better in that sense than the Glycerin? Thanks!
Nope, although that sure makes sense. Some of the Stinson ATR 4 and Challenger ATR 4 promo shots even featured runners on pavement, although the ones we have seen for the 5s are entirely crushed gravel/dirt roads and trails. TBH, that's probably their best use, but they do have flexibility some of the deeper lugged models do not.
@@TheUltraRunningCompany Is the difference between the Challenger ATR 5 and the Challenger ATR 4 the Challenger ATR 5 is more suitable for the road because of the lugs you mentioned in your review? I have the Challenger ATR 4 I use for light trails and if there is light rain or snow on the road. I got the Challenger ATR 4 because I liked the Clifton 4, but the Clifton 6, not so much, because there's not as much forefoot cushioning in the 6. Thanks for the excellent review.
"We can have that conversation all day long" No, we can't. It's [Onay Onay], period. Why don't you just make an effort and learn about the name origin and meaning? Really, please stop being so arrogant and ignorant out there across the pond. Apart from that, thanks for the review, much appreciated :)
OK, it looks like this hasn't come up for a while, so we'll repeat it here: When HOKA was first introduced, it was clearly called Only-Onay. We know, because we were wearing them when they first came out, and the history of the name was a part of their origin story. BUT THEN, about the time HOKA was purchased by Deckers, they renounced that pronunciation, and it became One-One. All of their (at the time independent) reps were educated on this and it became their approach. In recent years, as they have adjusted to the market, HOKA has come to re-embrace the Onay-Onay pronunciation and the Māori roots of the brand. The reason we laugh about is that there was SUCH an effort to deny this for about 2 years in 2013/14. We called HOKA out on it when they told us the original pronunciation was a myth, and we call it out in our reviews now that they have returned to the original version. Now, when Nathan says "Bondi" wrong, that's just because he was ignorant when he bought his first pair almost a decade ago and can't get his peanut brain to adjust to the fact he KNOWS the beach is pronounced differently. No history lesson needed there. :)
Thanks for the insightful and detailed review. I especially valued your review of the Wide version, which is what I will be trying out.
Right on! Thanks!
BADASS review!! It was exactly what I needed to watch.
First review I saw that actually explained the meta rocker 😄
1:38
Glad we can help. We really dig this stuff - happy you do as well!
Good review. I just ordered a pair as the ATR 5 went on clearance today!
Love these --- Have had two pairs, and will buy again.
I just bought a pair. I liked the wide fit and the cushion really puts a spring in your step. Literally!
Glad to hear it, Mike! Thanks for the comment!
Pretty much what my teachers used to write on my evaluations. "Capable. But not overly capable." LOL.
4:30 So the "challenge" with the Challenger is the ATR. LOL. I just bought the 6th version of this shoe in wide at the Ultra Running Company website. Not at Amazon because Bezos is the opposite of cool, while Leehman is the pinnacle of cool. Not at the Hoka website because they make me say "oh-NAY oh-NAY" in front of people. Not at Zappos because Kedar rides shotgun with Bezos and Bezos is trying to destroy my quiet town with a giant warehouse.
Awesome Review.
Phenomenal Details.
Thanks sharing
I love my ATR 5's. 180 miles with no visible wear. They fit my foot so much better than the goats. I hope this model sticks around for a while.
I bought these shoes based on your review. Thank you.
Thank you!!
Thank you so much. I just ordered the Challenger ATR5 GTX online..hoping I made a good decision. Sounds like I did. I have some heel issues on my left foot and I need something waterproof to walk my dogs on a light gravel trail every morning. I was wearing Kinvara 11s this summer and they are great but I tried on my Saucony Excursions and I almost died from the pain in my heel. Months of PT completely shot. Hoping that this ATR5 helps me this coming winter.
The best.Thank you! Amazing review!
Might need to pick up a pair. There on sale right now. I run on road and around me has lots of horse trails and fire roads I can just pop over and run on. Generally the cliftons do fine but it would be great when running up some of the steeper hills.
I have 15 par of Hoka, this one is THE BEST .
Dardan Eagles you are a true hoka fan lol 😂
Very thorough review! Thanks!
Thank you!
I love hokas! I have the Bondi 6 in purple and the ora recovery shoe in a coral color.
You asked what shoe should we do next?
I would like see review on Hoka Stinson ATR 5
Yes, the brand name situation here is amusing to me. Many people say Hoka 1 1, and some say "Hoka ohnay ohnay". Myself, I just call them Hoka. Good review. I'm also interested in the Hoka Arahi 3.
Thanks PJ87 - just Hoka works for us!
FWIW, we won't be reviewing the Arahi in any form. Some consultants told HOKA they needed to be in the "Stability" market, so they created a shoe with some silly technology in the sole and call it a "stability/guidance" shoe. Same with the Gaviota. There's zero science showing that use of these technologies reduces injury rate, allow anyone to run further or faster, or does anything measurable except potentially increase strain on the knees, so we don't carry or review shoes in this category. Also, we just don't think they're as comfortable as their neutral counterparts...so there's that. :)
@@TheUltraRunningCompany Thanks for the information. You make a very interesting point.
Best reviews out there..thank you! I’m trying to find out which one is the best for me,challenger or speedgoat! I usually hiking in light rocky trails!
Any chance you've tried the topo ultraventure and could compare the two?
We have limited testing of the Ultraventure, but it's actually a pretty fair comparison, Pedantic. We find the Ultraventure cushion to be a bit less firm (more pillowy!) than the Challenger, but the added width and slight weight gain seems to add back in some of the consistency that one would expect to lose when the cushion is softer. Certainly the toe box on the Ultraventure is better for folks with round or square forefeet, but the Challenger is offered in a wide that may be a better fit for people with a straighter overall foot (from the heel to the toes). We think both are solid entries in the high cushion, multi-surface arena, and would consider both for our longer runs.
@@TheUltraRunningCompany you
I do orienteering, which is a running sport with a map and compass in forest. I train on road and on trail since I’m running on dirt most often during competition and these shoes are literally everything I need.
My only real complaint is the upper’s conformity to the foot. For me, I have to really crank the laces in order to get it snug. I heard that this is an issue for some people with this shoe.
Hi, I have a pair of Challenger ATR 5 along with Powerstep insoles which have very much helped me overcome plantar fasiciitis. First time hiking with them I fell but have now gotten used to them and would not hike in anything else.
Right on Thomas! Good luck hiking!
Please review the Torrent 2! Great reviews.
Brilliant review! I can't decide wether i should get this shoe. It's on sale for just under 80$. I'm not really that much into trail, I just began running on light trail roads a couple of weeks ago. For road running I use the Clifton 6 which I adore! Giving the reduced price of the Challenger, I'll probably end up buying it since you can use it on both lighter trails and roads. My Cliftons are size 11, how do the Challengers compare to that? Should I just get the same size? Thanks for answering !
Please do a review on the Superior 4, can't decide between them and the Sense 7!
Ooooh. That's an interesting comparison. It may be a few weeks, but we'll try to include a note on those two in the review. Thanks for the idea!
How many miles can u put on them until u need a new pair?
Great review, thank you.
Shucks. Thanks, Hugo!
I am looking to return to trail running after quitting a year and half ago. I used to run in the Challenger ATR 3s I believe and they were very popular. How does this version stack up against the 3s. I’ve ran 3 50 milers on the 3s and they were comfortable
Great question, Danny. We thought the 3s shined primarily because of their towboat, and find this version to be quite accommodating as well. If you liked that version, we expect this will go over well. FWIW, the 2 was our least favorite. :)
Returning mine. Bought as replacement for ATR 2 but these 5's are far too hard and stiff, nothing like the soft cushion of my old cliftons and challengers. Don't know how they can have to much foam yet feel like a hard responsive racing flat.
Thanks for the feedback! We agree both the Clifton and Challenger have gotten firmer since first introduced (we think they're trying to increase durability and lifespan), but we still find the cushion to be much softer than most options on the market. The wider forefoot of the 5th version also allows our feet to expand a bit, and this seems to make that cushion a bit more accessible than past versions. With that said, no two feet are the same, and we really appreciate your comments!
Is the sizing (width and length) on the Challenger ATR 5 pretty much identical to the Clifton 6 sizing?
Yes for me they feel the same sizing.
We find them identical.
Thanks for responding (much) falser than us, Mikka!
My feet measures at 11inches without shoes do i get 11.5 or 12 in these?
Eli, we just took a look at our trusty Brannok device and 11" gets you to the 11.25 mark...which in our experience means you should be wearing AT LEAST the M12. We like to have 1/2-1" in front of our longest toe, *especially* for trail shoes. Of course the best bet is to stop by a local specialty running store for a personalize fitting, but in lieu of that (and because awesome local stores aren't available everywhere) we would suggest starting with a M12 with the understanding a M12.5 would be even better. Good luck!
Bought these shoes and loved them for running. Got my best running times and my joints didnt hurt as much after a 13mile run....but I returned them because they were not comfortable while walking as they hurt.but running in them felt great.snappy and fast......then I bought speed goats and they dont seem as fast...do you know what could be as good as challenger atr5?? But better fit?
I am looking at a pair of these for cheap online and was curious if they run big or small and if the wide are noticeably wide as those are the ones available.
A great shoe, I really like mine.
I run on arahi 4 and gaviota 2...will this shoe still help me ..how does it compared to them..am looking for a hoka that has the cushioning and stability of the arahi and gaviota but with longer trade life
👍
Please next: Brooks Caldera 4!
Thank you
Proper review !
Right on!
Do these stay true to size? I wear 44 (10.5 US) but I recently bought Hoka Gaviota 2 and had to return them because they were a size too small. Also, are these good for supination (under-pronation)?
If you have pretty buffed out trails which are normally dry and hardpacked, would a normal Clifton work out? I'm thinking especially with the 6th Clifton at 9oz, the weight loss will make it favourable?
Absolutely. We wouldn't hesitate for a second.
@@TheUltraRunningCompany Thanks for the guidance!
Hey @The Ultra Running Company I am going to a very
challenging week that has a lot of running in sand and water
and i wanted to know if this is the right shoe for it?
Which hoka would you suggest that would be more durable on rockier terrain? Thanks
To the best of our knowledge, the Mafate EVO is the most durable HOKA made. With that said, the SPeedgoat 3/Speedgoat EVO both have the Vibram MegaGrip material in their sole, which is the same as the Mafate and therefor equally rumble. The Mafate EVO has deeper lugs.
what is the latest hoka one one? best for trail running? thanks
As of today, the latest HOKA is the Speedgoat EVO. It was just released today, so we think we nailed that part of the question.
As for which is the best...well, that depends. We have reviews of the Mafate EVO, the Speedgoat, the Challenger, the Stinson, and (in a week or two) the Torrent. We honestly think they each serve a purpose and may appeal to at least a small group of runners. Nathan has used *every single one* in a race in the last 2 years, and since he can run in pretty much whatever he wants, at some point he thought each would be the "best" for what he was doing that day. Check them out and see which one resonates with you!
Hi, Is the wide version *only wider* on the toebox? my heel and midfoot are narrow but my toes are big, looking for shoes that have good lockdown on heel and midfoot but wide on toebox.
Hi Reza - great question! A true "wide" shoe will be wider *throughout* the shoe, not just in the toe box. For folks with narrower heels, this can definitely cause fit issues since the width that feels great at the front is just more than they need at the rear. Fortunately, there are some really solid options for people like you on the market - may we humbly suggest trying out some running shoes from Altra or Topo? Both have solid options on the road AND trail side, and both tend to accommodate people with wider toes than heels. Good luck!
@@TheUltraRunningCompany Thanks! I ran a 100 miler on Altras LP 3.0s. I also own Challenger ATR 5s (regular width), toebox is a few mm narrower than Altra LP 3.0s, but not sure the toebox is spacious enough for a super long race.
Just watched a video where the CEO of Hoka said it’s name was not pronounced 1,1 rather onay, onay. But I’m sure your right, what would the ceo know after all?
How does the toe box size of the normal width (not the 2E version) ATR 5 compare to that of the previous ATR 4? Are they the same or is the newer model narrower/wider? Thank your for your review!
I bought the 5 first and it has plenty of room in the toe box, I now own the Challenger 4 and can tell it is not as roomy as the 5. Hope that helps
Thank you very much for your deeeeeep review :)
Ha! Sorry if we went too long. LOL. Dude doesn't know when to shut up sometimes... :)
@@TheUltraRunningCompany It's always better more than less!
Especially since you have the same size (13) as me
Or as Saucony liked to say with the original Freedom: 14. :)
Hoka want want
I run with Brooks Glycerin 16 on easy trails with a bit of gravel (I know they're not for trails but I didn't know I liked trailed when I bought them). They shield the front of my feet adequately for distances up to 10 miles but I think I'd prefer something more cushioned for anything longer so I will not feel the gravel stones on the ball of my feet. Would you say any of the Hoka shoes (perhaps the Challenger) would be better in that sense than the Glycerin? Thanks!
We think you'd find a pretty significant difference. And we think you'd like it! :)
Is that really what ATR means? I always thought it many all types of *off-road* terrain.
Nope, although that sure makes sense. Some of the Stinson ATR 4 and Challenger ATR 4 promo shots even featured runners on pavement, although the ones we have seen for the 5s are entirely crushed gravel/dirt roads and trails. TBH, that's probably their best use, but they do have flexibility some of the deeper lugged models do not.
@@TheUltraRunningCompany Is the difference between the Challenger ATR 5 and the Challenger ATR 4 the Challenger ATR 5 is more suitable for the road because of the lugs you mentioned in your review? I have the Challenger ATR 4 I use for light trails and if there is light rain or snow on the road. I got the Challenger ATR 4 because I liked the Clifton 4, but the Clifton 6, not so much, because there's not as much forefoot cushioning in the 6. Thanks for the excellent review.
"We can have that conversation all day long"
No, we can't. It's [Onay Onay], period. Why don't you just make an effort and learn about the name origin and meaning? Really, please stop being so arrogant and ignorant out there across the pond.
Apart from that, thanks for the review, much appreciated :)
OK, it looks like this hasn't come up for a while, so we'll repeat it here: When HOKA was first introduced, it was clearly called Only-Onay. We know, because we were wearing them when they first came out, and the history of the name was a part of their origin story. BUT THEN, about the time HOKA was purchased by Deckers, they renounced that pronunciation, and it became One-One. All of their (at the time independent) reps were educated on this and it became their approach. In recent years, as they have adjusted to the market, HOKA has come to re-embrace the Onay-Onay pronunciation and the Māori roots of the brand. The reason we laugh about is that there was SUCH an effort to deny this for about 2 years in 2013/14. We called HOKA out on it when they told us the original pronunciation was a myth, and we call it out in our reviews now that they have returned to the original version.
Now, when Nathan says "Bondi" wrong, that's just because he was ignorant when he bought his first pair almost a decade ago and can't get his peanut brain to adjust to the fact he KNOWS the beach is pronounced differently. No history lesson needed there. :)
Challenger atr 5 cs speedgoat 4 wodę?