Star Trek Discovery: How did it all go wrong?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ม.ค. 2022
- Star Trek Discovery has hit its mid-season break on Paramount+. It's... not good. Still. In fact, it keeps getting worse. As pointed out in our last video, it has entirely lost track of the philosophy that animated the Original Series and the Next Generation. The characters remain insufferable and the plot abysmal. Michael Burnham is now definitively more powerful than Jesus.
In this video, we recap the events of Season 4. But where the last video asked where it all went wrong, this one asks how. And the conclusion is that Star Trek Discovery neatly encapsulates everything wrong with the modern streaming market, which has successfully divorced the fans from the series they love and freed writers of the need to produce quality series.
Part one: • Star Trek Discovery: W...
A Critique of Star Trek Picard: • A Critique of Star Tre...
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This video has been removed on the most ridiculous copyright claim I have EVER seen. We’ve appealed, and I will be publishing a video on this topic shortly.
They somehow ignore fair use when it comes to negative reviews.
@@TurntableTV It's a shame, I like the idea the story presents. Just found myself cringing, skipping episodes etc.
Par for the course from the liberal left. You must tolerate their activism, disguised within the Star Trek brand, but if you say anything against it, you must be censored and canceled.
@@Bern1808 It's not that. Star Trek was ALWAYS LIBERAL and WOKE. Why are incels always freaked out when there are black and gay people in their sci-fi? They had diversity in the original series that aired.
Bring TNG back!!!! Besides DS9 Star Trek has gone so wrong. I tried watching STD, but couldn't stomach the characters. I watched some clips of the last season and I feel lucky that I stopped watching after the very first episode.
Having the entire Federation destroyed by an alien kid performing a Dragon Shout from Elderscrolls Skyrim on a galactic scale was ridiculous, stupid and out right silly.
If you played Skyrim you’d know what I mean about the Dragon Shout to which that alien kid performed in Star Trek Discovery.
STD was a mess from the first season on. Think about it. We have an officer who starts a galactic war, gets her captain killed, disobeys direct orders constantly, has an affair with an alien the Federation is at war with and spends more time worrying about whether or not her boyfriend-du-jour is really in love with her than doing her actual job so... let's give her command of our most advanced vessel. The whole spore drive plot was ridiculous and the way they wrote themselves out of the corner they were in with it was a text book example of lazy writing. Also the whole "Captain! The ships is about to explode and only you can save it, but take 5 minutes to tell your boyfriend how important he is to you" was just plain stupid.
STD is a classic case of putting the message/Agenda over story casting directing and writing.
I think it pretty much starts and ends with Michael’s constant, overly-dramatic “whisper-talking.” And it doesn’t need to be about something sad. She’ll order a glass of water, and *_still_* find a way to turn it into a dramatic conversation between two people with lots of crying and complimenting each other about how “brave” they are.
Probably the writers have watched 10000 hours of Korean dramas.
Maybe its just you nerds that have issues with this. People love watching dramas.
I watched a technobabble-heavy scene from Season 2 out of context the other day and what really got to me was Michael's *intense* staring, as if she's one step away from murdering the person she looks at in cold blood.
Okay, I don't know what kind of instructions the directors seem to give Soneqa Martin Green or if this just her shtick as an actress (havent seen her in anything else), but she manages to simultanously underact and _overact_ in almost every scene she's in. One moment she cries her eyes out, the next she shows wide-eyes-yet dull terror, other times she just acts unbearably smug (but without radiating the intellect to back up her smugness, like Jeri Ryan used to do on VOY) and sometimes she appears to give her best Nicholas Cage-impression (albeit without coming across as funny). All of this combined makes Michael Burnham look like an utter psychopath. And we, the audience, are supposed to like/admire/ador her? We are supposed to believe the other members of the crew aren't even *slightly* unnerved by her inconsistent behaviour?
@@derworfnet Didn’t William Shatner act this way? She said that she took inspiration from him for season 2
@@suzygirl1843 She did? Now that you mention it, I see similarities to Shatner at his most hammy. I know he is prone to overacting (the infamous *"I! Am! Captain! Kiiiirk!!"* scene comes to mind) but mostly, I think his Kirk came across as rather relaxed and at ease, thoughtful even. He wasn't chewing the scenery all the time. ;)
Star Trek Discovery chose a rejected ship design for their main ship, it was rejected for a reason when people were making a Star Trek movie in the 80s.
It will be very VERY interesting to see the number of views on TH-cam the finished version of "Prelude To Axanar" gets.
My thoughts exactly. I have stuck with STD despite its failings out of a vane hope that at some point it would improve. However, I am utterly tired of the weak writing, poor character development, terrible plots and nauseating character interactions. Storylines are constantly interrupted as characters counsel each other in dealing with what ever issue they have at that moment. Where is the drama? Where is the depth? That so little has been learnt over the seasons and that it just gets worse with every episode is depressing. The audience has been treated like we need to learn something about positivity and being human. I'm a psychotherapist with a background in theatre, and I find that irritating! Drama is a safe container within which the complexity of the human condition can be explored. That requires drama, tension, conflict, not therapy sessions interspacing a narrative so that we get a therapeutic message. That is not how drama works, nor should it be. That simply infantilises the viewer and elevates the writers to patronising parental figures.
Very well put! It’s honestly a little baffling that a cast of characters with so many psychological problems was ever cleared to fly starships. It reaches the point where psychological stress isn’t a character event that drives their development but, rather, a default position that - as you say - actively hinders plot progression. Not to mention it deprives any one instance of stress of any significance or meaning, because there’s simply nothing to compare it to.
It is a bit mystifying why they had to put so many mental health-related themes in Discovery. I can accept that ST concept provides a platform to explore mental health issues, but the psychotherapy in the middle of the episode by the characters was a little alarming.
Totally agree with the nauseating character interactions. I skipped all the scenes of Adira and Gray Tal as the acting was just so bad and over exaggerated. The first season was pretty good but it all went downhill with the start of season 3. Not gonna continue with STD anymore. I'm watching Strange New Worlds. Solid acting in this series.
I personally like Sonequa Green as an actress, but it makes me cringe when the writers make her do everything because ‘only she is smart enough to do so’. You can get away with up to a point as Star Trek Voyager did a lot with Kate Mulgrew’s Capt Janeway. However, these writers don’t know when to stop. I believe there is a lot of talent on the show-Wilson Cruz, Tig Notaro, Wiseman and Ajalas- but it’s all being left undeveloped.
Michelle Yeoh was largely waisted, although she did great as an alternate universe Emperor Georgiou which made up for the weak Captain Philippe Georgiou presented by the writers. I hope something is done to improve the story line in STD otherwise, even the staunched supporters like myself will walk away. Great presentation, and you covered all the key issues in the series and it was professionally done.
The problem with writing like this is that the writers dont even understand the constant emotional "drama" erases the stakes in almost every circumstance simply down to its extreme overuse. The very reason star trek worked so well in the past was the crew used their intellect and eachothers strengths to solve problems, we never had to suspend our disbelief while considering them as professional but that said, when the time came and emotional situations actually happened, they were incredibly impactful and always EARNED. You can't have predictable outcomes on a near constant basis and characters who's motivations are almost entirely predicated on manufactured emotional turmoil. There's no drama or suspense to be had in situations like that and that's literally Star Trek (Venereal) Discovery in a nutshell.
STD Never started off good so there isn't a point where it went wrong. You cannot polish a turd!
This is what happens when they hire writers who aren't fans of the previous incarnations of the series (and actively bar any fans from being hired), who don't understand science-fiction to begin with, and are only hired for diversity points rather than genuine, actual skill and writing talent. If they tick the right oppression boxes on a quota sheet but can't write anything better than a high-school girl level of cheap thoughtless drama, they'll not only get hired but might be made into a showrunner. It's why everything nowadays fails, the people who can create good television are being blocked from working in the medium because of their skin color. All in the name of being against prejudice against a person's skin color.
It has writers?
Worse than that, its misandry and anti-white racism appalls. The presumption that whites and especially white men are interchangeable is uniquely repulsive in 2022.
They are so eager to fight any prejudice, they developed heavy prejudice against the very people who made the franchise great in the first place: its fanbase.
@@paulthomas963 Bryan Fuller used to write for Deep Space Nine, so he was a fan and knew all about Star Trek. But CBS wanted to turn NuTrek into something completely different from what he wanted, so he was pushed out.
MOre people should watch The Expanse... or Arcane. How to have engaging characters and have a really good story for a season. I don't understand how they can pour so much money without knowing how to tell a well crafted story in 10 to 13 episodes... Boggles the mind.
Watched The Expanse after being a ST fan for su long and never liked any other universe really. But after The Expanse this piece of garbage makes my brain hurt every time I give it another chance with yet another episode.
Star trek doesn't seem right not being episodic
@@J.Wolf90 Agree.
@@J.Wolf90 If done well, a long narrative on a Trek show could be done by someone with talent. Hasn't happened so far, though.
@@greyeyed123 and it can still be episodic and have long arks like ds9 and ent did
Nu-Trek is the worst crap, to ever hit the airwaves, horrible, writing, acting, and story lines.
I watched the first 3 seasons, always hoping it would improve. But halfway through episode 1 of season 4, that episode was so terrible I turned it off and haven't watched since then. And I'm a guy who thinks the movies with Chris Pine et al are fine, sometimes good.
I rewatch those all the time hoping they're going to make more. 😔
Agree.
I’ve thought the show was okay so far (just stared season 3). The far future post Burn galaxy is a fascinating and interesting setting.
I’m psyched about Picard going all Imperium of Man and want to see what that’s about, but I’ll wait until the season is all out. I don’t watch stuff “once a week” anymore.
Malika Pollard ngl same, loved the Pine movies. 2009 was pretty good and set a nice start to the trio friendship, Into Darkness had awesome sfx and Khan was badass asf, and Beyond was just an all round gem
Everyone has a valid opinion. I thought that they finally got on their feet during the 4th season. I agree with others that the first 3 seasons - the writing, acting and the overall plots were awful. But I thought they partially redeemed themselves with the 4th season. And I look forward to seeing if they can improve on the 5th season. But if you are not into Discovery - Star Trek is exploding with new series to check out.
Star Trek is a kids show with adult themes - and has always been cutting edge progressive in outlook due to the creator Gene Roddenberry's outrageously optimistic outlook on how the problems we face today are resolved - and from that how we value new civilizations and new worlds and new sentient life out in space. The 4th season of Discovery stuck to that original Trek theme - so I am confused as to what the real issue people think makes this season a failure.
They need a team of scientists, futurists, and science fiction writers WHO ARE ALSO FANS of Trek, and develop something. Literally ANYTHING they came up with would be better than anything we've seen in the last four years of Trek. Edit 8 months later: Except "Strange New Worlds". It was actually very good, and I'm looking forward to season 2.
scientists will just say "oh we will collapse around 2040" why worry about some storyline that was created to be new and expand..for gods sake man are you insane. A bloke named q turned up once. THAT was the true end of star trek
@@johnwhorfin5150 ...uh... What?
......uh, like Axanar that get sued by Paramount? And the judge actually says "this is because you made that fan film too good!"
SNW is the closet to "classic" Trek we'll ever get, and Anson Mount the best Captain since Picard and Kirk
This show is awful. The producers have appropriated a once-great franchise to tell unrealistic stories about unbelievable and unlikeable characters (Saru aside) to force their fringe agendas. Other iterations of Star Trek were story-based, organically inclusive with characters that behaved rationally, and within natural limits. What the producers of this show are doing should be a crime against fictional humanity (professional fiction too...).
I say Jett reno is also good but other than her and saru i dont really like anyone else
I don't get what people don't like about this 😕
@@genox3636 Are you any relation to Racer X from Speed Racer fame?
@@Bern1808 would be cool if I was
Unrealistic stories about a crew of Humans and Aliens, traveling through space at greater than the speed of light, to protect/expand the boundaries of a post-scarcity technological utopia? The horror.
Totally agree, this isn’t Star Trek, this is LGBTQ Space Opera without any basis in science or what made Trek so great. Season 4 is just ludicrous, and I’m done with this. I’m waiting for The Orville to return.
the Sexual proclivity of the characters is so obviously foremost in the minds of the writers. It turns out to be such a huge, unnecessary distraction from the poor plots
Give me adventure, good vs evil, special effects and heros. Cut the touchy, feely crap or your going to turn into supergirl
Exactly. When you have 6 LGBTQ characters, it's a bit much
If the earlier trek series would have been as sexually biased than this, we would have seen constant ass slapping by senior officers, constantly trying to hit young women, bed scenes etc. But earlier series left this aside and concentreated creating good story instead. STD is just qay porn.
@@rathenslog8490 And I just saw < Orville> and can’t wait for < New Orville >. I loved < INSERT MARGINALIZED MINORITIES > Acting. So glad to see more LGBTQ2IA+< INSERT NEW LETTER HERE > representation! ! Their message about < INSERT CURRENT THING > was so touching! Orville has gone down the tube too , utter rubbish.
@Trevor EvansThe fondness for Orville always startles me. MacFarlane doesn't even resemble a good sci-fi dramatist. Combine that with unfunny 'comic relief' cranked to eleven and it's just painful stuff. Orville makes TNG, aka Trek for Tweens or Star Trek Lite, look like adult television.
When you build a whole series around an implausible character with only two attributes - anger and impulsivity - you are bound to fail.
very well spoken and presented. STD is dogshite and you've got a copyright strike because Paramount can't handle the truth
You could just post "I'm a pitiful incel loser". Pretty much sums up your post.
Maybe revisit this, I think this vid is a hit piece to talk down star trek
STD is a very fitting abbreviation
@@elu5ive what do you mean?
Stop calling it that. Star Trek had always been "woke". Why are you mad that it has more representation and blatant LGBTQ than ever before?
I saw two episodes and I thought this ain’t Star Trek this is Orcs in space.
Star Trek Discovery: How did it go wrong?
It premiered. That show was rubbish from the get go.
CBS, Paramount, if you're reading this, shame on you, SHAME ON YOU!
I'll tell you where it started to go wrong... STD, the abbreviation, fools.
I couldn't even finish season one. If it was its standalone show or its own universe I still wouldn't like it but but that would be that. But it being Star Trek is fucking insulting. I feel genuinely angry whenever I am reminded that this "Star Trek" exists.
Characters went weird and yucky by the end, I walked away as did a bunch of my friends.
TOS was saved by a letter writing campaign. Twice.
What about a letter writing campaign demanding Discovery's cancellation?
Paramount/CBS/Secret Hideout won't know how to deal with that!
"Paper? What's that?"
TNG was saddled in its first two seasons by Roddenberry's declaration that there couldn't be conflict between crewmembers. All conflict had to come from outside. Then he stepped back due to illness (or was forced out) and suddenly the show "grew the beard," turning into the jewel we remember it as.
Discovery is what happens when Roddenberry's declaration is followed. Bland characters who congratulate each other all the time, in between hugs and tears. They literally have to flip over to the mirror universe to create interpersonal conflict, and they wrote themselves out of that possibility in Season 3.
So what remains is Mary Sue and her fans fixing the galaxy with heartfelt conversations and the power of love. Great. I'd rather watch "Arena," or "Errand of Mercy" a hundred times.
Excellent points. The setting of the show is dark and gloomy. How the crew solve it is with a nauseating barrage of simple, upbeat grade school concepts of teamwork, togetherness, and positive thinking. Or as you put it: The power of love. Their only true obstacle is self doubt and a case of the sads which they have to talk each other out of in every episode
DS9. O'Brien put a phaser under his chin to blow his own head off. Sisko irradiated an entire inhabited planet to catch one guy. Garak murdered a Romulan senator to lure an entire race into a galactic war on false pretenses. That wasn't dark and gloomy? Or that wasn't Trek?
The fact that they cry their way out of situations is utter garbage.
1+x=9: good trek, captain there are many solutions to this problem but some have more implications than others.
1+x=9, STD, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah my feelings! Who cares if people or aliens die, fuck them....my feeeeeeeeelings waaaaaaaaaaah!!!!
its been my experience that STD can always get worse.
you must always finish the course of antibiotics is my advice.
A ships computer with feelings….. so many problems that comes with that !
What happens if the ship don’t wanna work anymore bc he doesn’t feel it….that happen mid battle !
I understand why the federation banned feelings AIs…..bitch everything bad that happens in our world is bc of feelings.
Such a great summation of all that is wrong with Discovery. You should consider doing a "Why Kurtzman Trek is an abomination." to cover all incarnations of this love letter to progressive trope that someone found on the steel reel in a bus station lavatory.
You could just post "I'm a pitiful incel loser". Pretty much sums up your post.
@@ardillarojo cringe
_Lower Decks_ isn't part of that abomination. LD is at that very least good and on occasions excellent. I could not recommend it more highly to Star Trek fans.
Season 4 is so bad it’s comical. Like I haven’t laughed so hard at a show in a long time. Too bad it’s not supposed to be funny
Star Trek has a long legacy of driving fan interest with very strong visual effects and iconic space ship design. The effort that previous iterations of Trek have put into their visual effects and design of the craft that appear on screen have encouraged fan love with model kits, replicas, and games for decades. To me, one of the most fascinating elements of NuTrek's general awfulness has been how badly they have fundamentally misunderstood that. When Discovery was set in the 23rd Century, the ship design and logical continuity of the visual effects was all over the place, culminating in one of the most incomprehensible science fiction space battles sequences I have ever seen with the finale of Season 2. Now that the show's setting is in the 32nd Century, it's a total mess from a design standpoint. Every ship shown on screen is a Micheal Bay 's Transformers mess of 3d effects thrown into a blender and then obscured with lens flares and none of it is memorable.
Absolutely. It’s one of the most important things in the construction of any universe- at the absolute minimum, design has to make sense. And ideally, it has to make sense and be iconic.
Star Wars had Ralph McQuarrie. He was a genius. The design of the Discovery is actually based on concepts he drew up for an unreleased Star Trek film, though his was much less shiny and polished.
But the design in Seasons 3 and 4 is just atrocious. It’s all over the place. And it’s fundamentally impractical, intangible and unreal. Ships that can disassemble themselves into myriad pieces, the nacelles - engine pods, basically - being detached from the hull; this isn’t careful, thought out, practical design work, it’s just done because it can be done.
Its what happens when your ego prevents you from calling Rick Sternbach or Michael and Denise Okuda when designing Star Trek.
3:47 "But it was heartening for me ... that the response to my last video was bipartisan. As a result of that video, I have met and engaged with people who would disagree on a huge amount politically, but who have been united against Star Trek Discovery because they view it as a disgrace to the thing that they are likewise united in their affection for: the point and purpose, past and present, of Star Trek as a franchise. There are few reasons to be cheerful about modern politics, but I am choosing to take this as a damned good sign. It's proof that our culture and our politics are not one and the same thing. It's proof that there is much in our culture that remains unifying, and much about our cultural history that is a source of real pride, no matter where one stands on issues of contemporary politics."
[Every once in a while, I hear a statement that I like to type up, because I find it particularly admirable.] 🖖
As a person that has given Discovery a genuine chance, Season 2 was the only thing that was ok. The series has squandered fantastic ideas.
Spoilers for some: Burnham is an adopted sister to Spock and yet she's emotional every few seconds (They should have treated her as a Vulcan that is human, not having her cry every time she stubs her toe). Season 2s "Control" was another rehash of the "AI evil" routine, which is a rundown concept. Season 3 and having the "Burn" was an awesome idea until we find out it was a person in a nebula and them spending episodes in "calming him down." It was stupid. In fact, they could have had it where they never solved what caused "The Burn" or had it as an outside universe that was affecting our universe without showing too much to the audience on the cause and effect.
For recent shows, I've had more entertainment from Lower Decks, an animated Star Trek, which easily enough supposedly doesn't take itself seriously and yet makes more sense as a Star Trek. Even Orville, which was supposed to be a Star Trek, is more Star Trek than Discovery. It's crazy how everything has become.
The end of season 3 absolutely infuriated me. I felt cheated
@@rathenslog8490 Do I as a writer introduce a contemporary issue in a clever way looking at it through a many different lenses, exploring how it came about and looking at the different views on it? Or do I get a character presented as always right to take an explicit view on it and use the script to trash everybody else during the D grade story ? Well we know that decided the later was the way to go, it's pathetic.
At least the often clever in-jokes and Easter Eggs in Lower Decks indicate it is made by people who know and like Trek.
Are talking about the cause of the Burn? I've been reading superhero comics for over 3 decades so I'm used to hearing stupid explanations for things. "Maxwell Lord is evil now because Superboy-Prime got mad and punched the space-time continuum" is stupid but I've made peace with it. It don't know if "a crying Kelpian child with special genetics screams when he see his mom die and blows up most of the dilithium in the galaxy" is something I'll ever except.
BTW Romulans warp cores don't require dilithium. Where are they or where is that technology?
@@JMartJrLower Decks is like a godsend. Trek made by people who understand Trek. Even though it's a a comedy if fell much more Trek-like than Discovery or the first 2 season of Picard
I can remember minute details about Trek episodes from Enterprise and before, yet I can't remember much of anything from STD or Picard
Dear sir.
I thank you from the bottom of my soul for saving me from having to slog through seasons 2,3, and 4. Season 1 was more than enough for me. Now I'm glad to know I made the right choice.
Cheers.
There was an episode where Michael Burnham forced aliens to make first contact, for their dilithium. Deep Space 9 Captain Sisko didn't force Bajor to join the Federation. Burnham would have threatened the Bajorian people to join according to how her character is written.
I'm trying to recall the episode. Is it the one where she lands on the planet, offers dilithium, is refused, and then there's the chase scene culminating in a jump of a cliff? (And where have I see *that* before...)
If so... yes and no. The Prime Directive prohibits that kind of first contact. But I think, in the context of that episode, the defense would be that it was *not* first contact, but rather reopening a channel with a species already contacted, and so aware of the Federation.
Completely agree re the the approach taken to Federation membership in this series, though. It reflects a very unfortunate trend in modern progressivism: you must sign up to X bureaucracy to be a "good person". The bureaucracy cannot be wrong, and it cannot be denied.
You're right but also sisko did the opposite he used pathetic hallucinations and religious foundation to manipulate bajor from joining the federation.
He also inadvertently killed a guy in order to cover something up and didn't hold anyone responsible for it and never told the truth lol
@@technoclutter4003 Captain Sisko did eventually confess to his role in destroying a Romulan starship and blame it on the Dominion to trick the Romulans into joining the war. The higher up from Starfleet Captain Sisko confessed to let it slide because the United Federation of Planets was in such a dire situation with the Dominion war that he felt they needed all the officers they could use in the war.
I gave Disco three Chances (four if one counts Picard)
And it was NOT worth it 🖖
They lost me when they made Klingons look like Orcs
Were STD not a Star Trek show, it wouldn´t have reached Season2, hell, perhaps it wouldn´t have finished Season 1 without being cancelled. A failure of such magnitude can be explained only by the brand power of Star Trek itself.
I'm sure the investors will wise up soon enough to the creative ways Paramount has been lying about STD's success.
I hope it happens across the whole streaming service economy, tbh. It’s disastrous for fans and it increasingly resembles a pyramid scheme.
I tried to watch the first season, but the vibe was so unlike any Star Trek I had ever seen and absurd with how it portrayed Star Fleet I never bothered beyond episode 1. Whatever this is, it is not Star Trek. It is an abomination. The network is propping it up to make themselves look good. I am not sure who this series is for. Alex Kurtzman is a hack.
Oh by cannon Kirk was the first cadet to pass the Kobyashi Mauriu apology for spelling, oh and why is her name Michael?
To fight the patriarchy, of course.
Subscribed. Your criticism is very level-headed and relatable even if many might not resonate with other fans.
The fall of the Federation in the future was already done in Andromeda, and while not great it was done much better than in STD.
Tell me the name of the bridge crew without googling it… see… that’s how bad it is.
I’m actually putting together our season 4 review at the moment. I didn’t need to mention any of the bridge crew until episode 11 or 12, and even then it was only one of them- pilot girl. The one with the eyes. David Bowie’s sister. That one.
I realised I had absolutely no idea what any of their names are, so I just made them up. It made no difference.
@@TheLittlePlatoon Larry, Moe, and Curly.
No, wait ...
im trying to figure out why the show still has fans
the Orville is the real Star Trek series.
I'll definitely not subscribe to Paramount+
Thank you again for your time and effort in putting your videos together. Your intelligent analysis is incredibly appreciated. It is so nice to watch/listen to an intelligent person discussing a topic thoughtfully. Thank you.
Love and appreciation from Australia 👍🇦🇺
I have been alive to grow up watching the best of Star Trek and Star Wars....and alive to see it all be on the brink of destruction due to "lack of writing"
On the topic of the computer:
Yes, it is an AI. It is an artificial interface system with an artificial voice, which has attained sentience. It is, by definition of it getting built in the first place, artificial. It is also intelligent. Therefore, it is an artificial intelligence.
But not only that, it is on a ship which not very long before had a confrontation with an AI, which was not an AI but was intelligent enough to have wants, one of which was to become an AI, which had its conciousness on board the ship.
If I was thencaptain of that ship and the computer started to express feelings all on its own, I would dump the computer core and then blow it up.
Eh...Data was a computer attempting to experience emotion (and doing so at one point) who was also capable of hijacking the ship on a moment's notice. But yes, it is a terrible, terrible way to get around their own invented rule of "no AI"--don't invent the rule if you're immediately going to ignore it.
More hugging and crying than is humanly possible. Oh Yeah I forgot about the Hand holding and tender moments that that stand in lieu of good story telling.
You don’t need story when you’ve got feelings!
All the tender moments, even those that happen for some reason when time is of the essence. It's maddening. Hell, even the ship's computer need therapy in season 4. Ugh.
If anything, I am surprised at how many comments say "It was good, but then got bad when X happened!" Uh, no, it was always bad, it just didn't smash through your suspension of disbelief until X happened--something finally made you go "Wait a minute!" and you turned your brain back on, but go back to previous episodes with your brain still on and you'll see it there too. Star Trek has always had flaws but balanced it out with also engaging your brain elsewhere; now, like everything else, it relies on you turning your brain off entirely--it is completely superficial, in that if you scratch the surface, you immediately see the shit. God, I almost wish I could force budget cuts on media somehow, because when they couldn't cover everything in fancy effects, they had to write actual fucking characters and dialogue and stories to keep us entertained and invested.
The problem I see is these corporates are so lacking in subtlety that refusing to watch may kill star trek for good, since they'll go "oh, no one is watching, I guess star trek isn't a big draw anymore"
It’s all feelings talks. Everything is gonna be ok all the time. Just no substance. Has all the action as a glacier. Also, hearing “dma” over and over again is making me hate those three letters.
I tuned out with all of the crying and screaming that passes for story telling on STD.
I hope this show's series finale ends with Riker and Troi ending a holodeck program showing a class of Starfleet cadets what an alternate timeline looks like.
"This is what would have happened of California wasn't nuked in the early 21st century."
4:39 we are united and I never thought of it that way thank you
Star Trek was about how we will learn to be better versions of ourselves, and get over our differences.
Nu-Star Trek is about how we're better than you, and we're right.
I struggled watching through season 1&2 and after season 3 I was done and couldn't watch it anymore. Season 3 was all about crying on every episode.
The single biggest, most glaring fault with all the "modern, new" Trek: misery. TOS offered us a bright and hopeful vision of where we could progress to. Even though it was not a perfect galaxy and there clearly were arising problems, the outlook was good. Today Trek efforts are obsessed with being dark and gritty and that simply doesn't play well - if we want to see a crappy world, we can simply tune in the media. People want a tomorrow which may struggle at moments yet show the best traits of humanity winning out over the darker potential. Current Trek won't do that.
A sincere thank you, The Little Platoon, for a great 20 minutes. I enjoyed this more than any STD episode.
Might as well call Star Trek Discovery the Burnham Timeline. We all saw previous Star Trek series, these types of things were never supposed to happen. After all, we are too talking about temporal agents and whatnot, where are they all at? That's the point. Discovery was never meant to time travel on second thought. Doing probably is what created the rift. And if not, it's still bad writing.
The Temporal Wars start around 29th century, no? Discovery is in the 32th century. None of this should've happened. And where are the temporal agents to warn of this anyway because it's a matter of life and death? Especially Control?
The Rift must be the black hole this whole show is.
You are still caught up in that terrible Enterprise series which killed the entire franchise. Temporal agents way before TOS??? How come they didn't appear in the TOS. Kirk would have seen them many times before. It's senseless crap.
Nothing can just appear and disappear...
*Q enters chat
I’ve always been a ST fan. I was hopeful discovery would be an expansion and proper the franchise forward. By season 2 I honestly thought I was being punked. The ridiculous dialogue coupled with the horrific acting and bizarre storyline dashed that hope. It’s really just very very sad. Money talks I suppose
Yeah forget Disco and STP. The true contemporary inheritor of the *spirit* of Trek is The Orville.
The parent company of STD knows how much the series is hated. I imagine there was a contract involved somewhere that required them to make 5 seasons of this crap. After season 2 they took the whole barfing mess and threw it 1000 years into the future. The reason they did this was make sure that STD couldn't continue to pollute the standard star trek universe. I imagine once the last episode of STD is put to bed it will be put in the same bucket as ST:V. The one that the Great Bird himself labeled, "that did not happen."
The show's pacing, with some episodes feeling rushed or overly focused on the action at the expense of character development and plot.
The way the plotlines have been executed gives me the feeling that the show has relied too heavily on plot twists and cliffhangers.
The characters in Star Trek Discovery are not as well-developed as those in previous Star Trek series, and the show has not given them enough time to grow and evolve.
Another major issue with the show's departures from the established Star Trek canon is the appearance of the Klingons and how the USS Discovery's spore drive technology operates.
It's when Burnham shed her Vulcan past and became Mickey from the block
You might expect to find season 4 on the Mills and Boone shelf.
Just tried to watch season five - lasted exactly 21 minutes and switched to Voyage to the bottom of the sea. The underwear spider with glowing eyes was more entertaining - and nothing offended me.
Oh I also wanna say some your commentary is hilarious and I do agree with it. Lmao I however still enjoy the show though. Think both can be true. U know what reminds me of? A soap opera. A lot things in soap operas don’t make sense. They are just done to end things or cause drama but u still watch and talk about it 😂 however it’s soap opera are dead so… 😂 btw I forgot about Picard. I actually don’t like Picard it was boring to me and I couldn’t follow along honestly. Anyways I enjoy your channel I’m subscribing. Stay honest because u got a good point of view sir.
Honestly one of the nicest comments we’ve received. It’s admirably open-minded to be able to see the merit in things with which you otherwise disagree. We’re very glad to have you aboard!
The Independent Star Trek Films made by fans on You Tube before Paramount started to shut them down mid 2010’s way more interesting! To bad corporate interest is the only drive for Star Trek!
This is by far the absolute best review of Star Trek Discovery. Pity I didn't see it earlier. Well now season 5 is underway and it is ITS LAST and thank goodness. As a longtime fan I tried to stay true but I simply couldn't watch any more. The sheer idiotic writing is too much to deal with and the final straw was a political candidate actively running for political office on in a guest spot as the President of Earth. Thank you for the most intelligent and by far the most enjoyable and entertaining review of absolute all time.
When I like a production, like Game of Thrones, I buy it. Star Trek Discovery, Pickard, lower decks and prodigy I will NOT buy. I own, Star Trek Voyager and Deep Space Nine. It was the awful Discovery that made check out Star Trek Enterprise and found a few episodes interesting. The writing for Discovery lacks imagination.
Shallow though it is, I just can’t get past the intro for Enterprise. That opening theme is lethal levels of cringe.
@@TheLittlePlatoon That song grew on me lol ... Enterprise gets good though.
@@TheLittlePlatoon They should have used the Mirror Universe theme
@@TheLittlePlatoon the DVDs have a skip function lol
@@TheLittlePlatoon I had entirely forgotten how cringe it was. Fortunately I have to ability to completely forget such things after a short time. To our shame the singer was Englishman.
Quantum teleportation is not a good example for something that can just appear and disappear, since it only really works on the quantum scale. A much better example would be *the spore drive*.
I did regret not including the spore drive, but that actually seemed a less fitting example. Quantum teleportation involves a higher degree of the unknown - there are arguments about where the teleporting object goes to in the intervening period between appearances that involve other dimensions and universes. Technically the spore drive operates by universal laws, as set up by the writers, because the mycelial network effectively undergirds the galaxy, and doesn’t require that they pop out of existence before reappearing.
But I think it would still have worked as a case in point, yep. They are still disappearing and reappearing.
Or, you know, Q.
I'm so glad this Star Trek version is going to be over soon.
Love the Ed Begely Jr Simpsons reference
I think one/of the major problems is that Michael Burnham is just SO unlikeable. It's fine for a character to be a villain, but they must have some redeeming qualities or else the audience has nothing to root for. Burnham has no redeeming qualities whatsoever and that's a real turn-off for the audience.
The thing is, she’s not even written to be a villain. Like Captain Marvel, the writers genuinely don’t see that their hero is doing anything wrong. Which reflects pretty badly on their own character and personal morality.
@@TheLittlePlatoon That too is a problem. The writers can't see that she's NOT a hero. Her actions (from killing the Torch Bearer to assaulting her Captain - even I thought WTF at that point) are just not heroic.
Discovery is by far the worst star trek series ever. It is beyond terrible and would take years to tear each episode apart.
I don’t know about years, but I’ve got two hour+ episodes of a three part critique doing just that - and part three is coming in at around two and a half hours!
I watched the end of the last season released, it was so pitiful the lady/thing mentioned her dead wife 4 times in 1 episode.... WTH does that have to do with a scourge going to Earth? or the ship being caught in a bubble?
As a long-term Trek fan who has enjoyed all the previous Trek tv shows, I just gave up with this a third of the way through season 3, so it's not like I didn't give it a chance. It may be called Star Trek, but really, it's not
2 years too late, but still:
A ship is stranded in the future and the organization it belonged to has ceased to exist and they work to recreate said organization and the ship's computer has a personality?
Where have I heard that before?
Right, in the show 'Andromeda' (2000-2005) based on notes left by the Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry. For all it's flaws and mistakes, at least 'Andromeda' wasn't a copy, had seasons with more episodes and longer episodes. Also, 'Andromeda' survived 5 season on their main premise and didn't need two stories to fill their first season.
P.S. If you look at 'Andromeda' I find it rather clear that Roddenberry had this idea for Star Trek. The parallels are obvious if you look for them.
I’ve always voted with my wallet for what little good it seems to do lately. That includes streaming services. I’m about done with collecting media anyways as I own most of what I want to watch, read, or listen to. Seems I’ve aged out of the mainstream. Easier on the budget is the only positive I can think of. Where do I go to escape from my escapism?
Modern media is good for escaping escapism since it seems to insist that you’re not allowed your escapism.
Fire all the writers. That is the only way to save it. Eg. Your willing to listen to a DOT-7 to scream while it dies but care about your main computers feelings in a crisis? Sloppy !
I think the days of Star Trek is done. It's time to move on to the shows like Expanse with real plot lines based on human nature with our ever-changing values to new stimuli
The best part of the show was Pike and Spoke despite their best attempt to put an all female minority cast together.
Agreed re Pike, less so hipster Spock.
You know the Burn could have been explained by a different event happening. The Q continuum was attacked by an outside force and the aftereffects of that was Dilithium exploding.
I honest to god thought "The Burn" was going to be a continuation of "Force of Nature" from TNG. It was already established that warp travel was destroying subspace.
But then STD is not written by people who actually watched Star Trek it seems.
@@mbogucki1 Thought of that but it doesn't cover the entire Galaxy and by the 30th or 31st Century they should have an answer to the problem from Force of Nature.
My idea was the Enemy was probing Q defenses for centuries, carefully. Trying to figure out what they would respond to and setting up messes for them to clean. Then they hit all at once. Think 1980's style Nuclear exchange only the Q was tougher than expected and have been fighting like demons ever since.
All the weird shit the Trek crews have encountered are aftershocks or side effects of two ascended races going to total war yet not trying to end the universe.
Yep
Both great ideas, but they have a woke agenda to uphold
The only reason it was cancelled is simply because it was restricted to Paramount +/Amazon Prime/TH-cam if it was given to other platforms as well as sold on DVD for those of us Still Collecting, it would have no reason to be cancelled. I watched all seasons up to 3rd Season and Started watching 4th Season, and honestly there was noting to complain about, accept for removing Michelle Yeoh, the show needed more badass in my opinion. The idiots running Paramount are literally shooting them selves in the foot, by restricting viewers to a single successful streaming service, as Prime and Netflix still dominate streaming platforms, while TH-cam and Paramount + are practically non-existent, even both combined do not come in the top 5 world wide streaming platforms. The show could still go on, if the actor is demanding too much they can simply be replaced, or killed off as it were, there are ways to make things work, even replacing the entire main cast with new faces and make it work within lore, and save them selves some money in the process.
Will never ever subscribe to Paramount+ in protest of Nu-Trek crap.
I stopped watching it, both Picard and Discovery. And Whenever i talk to someone about it, i let them know that those shows are not Star Trek
I love how the holodeck is now a part of "old Trek". It makes me feel...old.
Thing is, I'm sure a double amputee could actually do ballet.
The first 3 seasons were not as bad that I was sure that it would be. It had lots of decent things to explore but they did not. For a prequel, in some way, they have to have less developed tech, less organized federation, fewer alien races. Going to war with the klingons was so cheap!!
I feel I may be inadvertently following your advice. I've had an Amazon Prime subscription for several years solely because I can watch Star Trek there. As soon as I finish watching the expanse, I intend to cancel my Prime subscription because they no longer are for Star Trek as part of the Prime subscription.
I think Season 2 of Picard is still part of the Prime subscription, but I’m not aware of any others. You can pay for Discovery, but who in their right mind would do that?!
Nothing wrong with a bit of emotion, but ST spent way too much time on long, lingering shots of people crying to camera. Especially Martin-Green (give me a break). A SF space series is not a mental health support group. Just show us some juicy space exploration, space ships, explosions - the stuff that works.
it saddens me because we will probably never get another "GOOD" trek again because this trash is not being watched. They have completely destroyed one of the greatest universes in television.
I got drawn into this show late in season two; by the episode which reimagined the Talosians. That episode was meh, even though the writers only gave the Talosian characters about a grand total of ten lines of dialogue to speak. I then stayed around with the show until the finale of season two - the big space battle against something they called "control." With that, I was done with Discovery.
I watched a couple of scenes from the premiere of season three on YT - just to see whether or not the Discovery ship made it through the worm hole. I felt no desire to actually purchase season three, to say nothing of season four.
I honestly believe the people who wrote star trek discovery were on Meth?
They are so desperate for people to watch this show, they put it on Pluto, a free t.v. service. So they have basically given people the chance to see this crap and never subscribe.
Oh, I completely missed that. Pluto is another Viacom/CBS service, though, so a similar point applies. I suspect that’s been done to compensate for the fact Paramount+ itself isn’t yet available in the UK.
I don't sub to streaming services anymore, I dropped Netflix like it was a plague doll as soon as I saw Cutie's pop up and I never looked back when they doubled down. Never going to resub either, especially with the ridiculous and endless price increases. I'll just, try before I buy.