oh, all the time i get misunderstood too we are literal, they look for what an allistic "really meant" as if insinuations and hidden meanings are expected of ev-er-y-one gasp
Many good points. I'd particularly echo the one that autists are not deliberately trying to be different. In some cases we can try to change our behaviour to neurotypical norms but either at great personal cost or without any success. For example it doesn't matter how hard I try my social skills will always be poor. We're often told that neurotypicals have "empathy" but there's often very little of it on show when they deal with autists or anyone else who cannot help but be different.
I've had to tell bosses, "i shouldn't have to go down and get my file with my diagnosis, but i will." Had an awful narcissistic manager who was an "everybody's on the spectrum" type. Teamed everybody up against me and manipulated the situation. Thankfully she ended up getting fired before me.
6:28 When I was in college I found that what worked best for me was trying to take classes that were all on the same 2-3 days in a quarter. So I'd take multiple Tuesday Thursday classes, instead of one class Monday Wednesday, one Tuesday Thursday, etc. Like, I found that having the recovery day in-between was what enabled me to function.
3:26 You know, I appreciate you saying that. While there are lots and lots of situations throughout my life where I've not been trying to be rude but come off that way to people, I think it's important to recognize that autistic folks can have bad days, hold grudges, not get along perfectly with everyone as well. It's a normal human thing to not mesh perfectly with everyone, and something that we can and do experience too!!!
What I think is that you have done a great job speaking for those of us who are not able to be what is considered "normal".I like how you explained how hard it can be for us to work at a regular job and other challenges and all that that entails.Thank you for being honest.
Dana, Thank you for this video. As a Neurotypical person, I get so confused by the Autistic responses that seem to defy reason to me. Life is hard enough when the response is "normal" but I really struggle when something makes no sense or appears , to me, to be making life harder for the Autistic person. It is exhausting to be the Neurotypical in these relationships also. Many times I just "back off" because I do not know how to bridge this gap in our conversations. We all struggle to survive in this world together. I am trying to do better, but feel defeated most of the time. Your video helps me realize that most of the "hurt" I feel is not intentional. Thank You!
from the other side, I learned at some point that some of the bullying I had experienced during school times was actually caused exactly by this. That some of the neurotypical kids were confused about how I was talking and behaving and didn't know how to interact with me. That was long long time before I had even the slightest idea that I could be autistic, but have a special interest in "figuring out people" and was able to talk to those who bullied me and became "sort of" friends with them when I made it clear that alot of the things they were upset about with me, were not actually intentional. (though i do wish they would have communicated in a less hostile and confusing way originally I can understand that this was one way to start any form of interaction, while others just ignored me mostly
I wore costumes to elementary school, and I knew nobody else did, but I liked wearing fancy clothes. One time a classmate was super mean to me about it, telling me I was going to ruin the class photo, but honestly I felt very uncomfortable wearing 'normal' clothes and they made me more self conscious than wearing 'weird' outfits. I had a lot of trouble when we had a uniform in middle school, because I knew it looked bad on me and it drew attention to my body in ways I absolutely hated, and it emphasized that my family was poorer than a lot of other students, because my uniforms were old and secondhand. Thankfully high school once again didn't restrict what I could wear, and I again wore a lot of odd things, but by then I was at an art school so nobody cared, or if they did, they didn't make it my problem, and I was far from the only student wearing things out of the norm
P.S. Same, On The Text Issue, I've Often Had People Have A Go At Me And Even Accuse Of Me Of Claiming To Be Perfect Or Being Arrogant Etc. And I've Been Both Hurt & Of Course Confused By That, I've Always Said To 'Mundanes' (LOL😛) That Whatever The Dictionary Meaning(s) Of A Word(s) Is Exactly What I Mean When I Say It. 😝
Idk if my comment posted or not. I was in the middle of petting a kitten and attempting to manuever a waste management trashcan that is just about as tall as me... not sure why i was like "oh notification sound. Must click now!" Trashcan fell. Kitten ran off with me screaming "nooooooo". Pure chaos. Thx for the upload!!😂
Oh, I see you have sticky hands, too. I'm always walking around with crap in my hands that I become blind to until I wonder why I'm struggling to do something. 😂
@johnbillings5260 I'm the worst with it!! For some reason.... I convinced myself long ago that I can obviously do ALL the things at once. I have zero clue where or why that thought entered my head but it's there. And that thing has staying power.....🤔
@@LynIsALilADHD Yes! I don't know why it should require more than one trip from the car to the house when grocery shopping as well. My back starts to tell me, but otherwise I feel like it's the correct thing to do. I have a theory that it relates to object impermanence when things are picked up. Are you ADHD as well if you don't mind my asking?
@johnbillings5260 pretty a lot adhd. Lol. And about the groceries thing.... I mean .. seems like it should be fine to cut off circulation to the hands for the walk inside, righ?
@@LynIsALilADHD I had a good laugh after I sent that and then looked at your screen name again. That should indicate to you how aware I am at times. And who needs pinky fingers anyway? I seem to be able to use my hands fine until the feeling returns in them.
oooh those latter points. Im so sick of being labelled a rebel or whatever just cos people have such a narrow frame of existence. Ill be honest with certain people Ill just act as antagonistic and assumptive as neurotypical people feel to me.
I think alot of the issues in communication between autistic and neurotypicals comes from the fact that while autistics have to question their communications all the time because they get often negative feedback for it (often without explanations), while someone neurotypical would just not need to question theirs because most of the time it aligns with their surroundings, which means, unless they are in a situation themselves where they would be required for survival to question it, they might not even realize how and why they are doing and seeing things the way they do. And I mean this in a completely non judgemental way. It's a very human thing to not be bothered/concerned by things that aren't affecting your life. But this also means, it's very hard for autistic people to make their difficulties understood towards neurotypicals, because it's not obvious to neurotypicals that we are practically having a language barrier there while on the surface we are speaking the same. We actually see similar effects when people talk about subjects like discrimination or privilege....being aware of those terms is not the same as having lived through it or to understand what it means when you come from a place where it hasn't been a problem for "you".
I've been diagnosed only recently in my 40s, and I realize only now why so many times people got angry at me or frustrated by my questions or answers. For example if I ask "why do I have to do this?", it's a genuine question. But neurotypicals are accostumed to it beeing a disguised way of saying "I don't want to do it". If I don't want to do it, I WILL tell you, but first, to decide if I wanna do it, I need more context 🫠 The funny thing is I often misunderstand people precisely because I've known for a long time that they often don't say exactly what they mean, so I try to guess what they really meant, but guess wrong 😅 I've had strong reactions in the past (which I now know to be meltdowns) because people got very mad at me, screeming that I should understand what's happening because it is "obvious", and refusing to explain, saying I was lying about not understanding the situation and doing it to provoke them... I'm not doing all this to be annoying, and on the contrary I will very much try all I can think of to not be annoying, I very much DO NOT enjoy hurting people or making them angry! Lastly what baffles me is how much people judge things that are NOT important : like... they will forgive someone for being a nazi, sexist etc but judge you heavily just for being "weird". Seems to me that social norms are much more important to the general population than actually being a decent person. Priorities... 😅
12:20 Kaelynnism did a Shorts recently on hidden requests titled "Which style of communication do you prefer? 🗣 #autism #autistic #neurodivergent #adhd" that is on this exact phenomenon. A lot of times people phrase things that are actually requests very non-literally, and it's not always possible to tell whether or not they're just making a comment or asking specifically for something. 😭I kind of have the opposite problem where I look for hidden requests/subtexts in messages with people who are super-ultra literal, because people making hidden requests is so common in my area's culture.
Thank you so much for what you said about jobs and working. I've been told so many times "you're lazy," or "you just don't want to work." I kept trying to explain how I feel and how things affect me, but then that only seemed to reinforce the "you just don't want to work" narrative to those I was trying to explain it to. Including therapists. I'm probably forever going to feel guilt and self-hatred because of hearing those things. Also, I hate that read-between-the-lines business. Everything you said speaks to my personal experience. One example is I have been told I was flirting with someone, when I thought I was just talking to that person in a normal way. How could what I have said have been perceived as flirting? I have no idea how to flirt intentionally.
I've always tried to not judge others because I knew there could be a good reason for their actions (or inactions), physical appearance, etc. My mind will go off on a tangent and create a life for them to explain why they may be that way. I gained a lot of empathy early for being me when I didn't know why I was in trouble for doing it.
Excellent Dana, you told it exactly how it is. You and I share a lot of similarities with our autism. Do you also have ADHD and learning difficulties too? You don't have to answer if it's too personal. I have ADHD and dyslexia and my 4 boys are all neurodivergent 😊
HOLY S***! GIRL! SAME!!!!! I've Often Been Missed On The Autism Because Of My Intelligence And I've Always Said I Learnt Much Of What I Know And Understand From Television & Movies, Much Of My Intelligence & Even Morality Comes From Star Trek, And The Morality Is Reinforced From Things Like Power Rangers & Sailor Moon. 🥰🤪
I can relate to this as well, since I am also autistic. I do believe the reason why many neurotypical people don't understand what autism is nor what it was like being autistic, is because they are not autistic themselves, and they did not discover autism by themselves, by not doing any research about it at all like researching it on Google, read books, or watch different videos about Autism. I felt like some of them just refuse to discover about autism for themselves, because they just don't care. They mostly would tell us to try harder, do better, stop being weird, but it's not always that easy. No matter how many times we tried to fit in, and mask ourselves, it would still cause more stress, because the autistic brain is not similar to the neurotypical brain. It's just wired differently. I also have that kind of experience mostly from my own grandmother. Whenever I would mention autism, she would flip out, and become ableist towards me. She wanted me to be more of an extroverted person, and be more like her and the other members in our family, when I can't be like them, because I am not an extrovert outgoing person. I'm more of an introvert person, who always spends a lot of time alone in a room or a space where is quiet. I did heard that many autistic people do struggle trying to keep a job, because of their experiences in the workplace. I wish that all jobs has a space or working accommodations for autistic people, because I do think that it is really important to look out for your mental health. It is something that I have worked on as well, when I applied to work at my 1st job, and I've already put my accommodations for my autism. I had decided to experience something new, by working at a job, and take a break from my college experience, since I choose to drop out from a 4 year college from the burnout and the hardwork that I have done from it, and maybe choose to return to college if the job experience didn't work for me.
You're VERY helpful! Just discovered your channel a couple days ago. I'm (very) late diagnosed (AuDHD) and your descriptions of your experiences definitely resonate. Growing up, I didn't realize just how dysfunctional our family was. That really fed the already strong feelings of isolation and "otherness".
"I'm just trying to survive, and get through things, and deal with things so I can watch my TV shows I enjoy" I feel this so hard!!
I don't put anything between the lines, either, but people always seem to think there is. Plain English seems to baffle them.
Implicit knowledge is a part of communication.
@@kipling1957 Yes it is but don't expect autistic people to understand it.
@@kipling1957 Yes it is. However we might understand it but we probably won't.
@@kipling1957
I leave it out. I know I can't read minds, but lots of people seem to think they can.
oh, all the time i get misunderstood too
we are literal, they look for what an allistic "really meant" as if insinuations and hidden meanings are expected of ev-er-y-one gasp
People used to laugh at my "weird" clothes. Six months later they would all be doing it. Lol
Many good points. I'd particularly echo the one that autists are not deliberately trying to be different. In some cases we can try to change our behaviour to neurotypical norms but either at great personal cost or without any success. For example it doesn't matter how hard I try my social skills will always be poor. We're often told that neurotypicals have "empathy" but there's often very little of it on show when they deal with autists or anyone else who cannot help but be different.
Empathy when it comes to nts seems to mean lying to people in order not to hurt their feelings.
Indeed🎉
I've had to tell bosses, "i shouldn't have to go down and get my file with my diagnosis, but i will."
Had an awful narcissistic manager who was an "everybody's on the spectrum" type. Teamed everybody up against me and manipulated the situation. Thankfully she ended up getting fired before me.
6:28 When I was in college I found that what worked best for me was trying to take classes that were all on the same 2-3 days in a quarter. So I'd take multiple Tuesday Thursday classes, instead of one class Monday Wednesday, one Tuesday Thursday, etc. Like, I found that having the recovery day in-between was what enabled me to function.
People add subtext and see hidden meanings where there aren't any, which is why I often massively over explain. Very relatable!
3:26 You know, I appreciate you saying that. While there are lots and lots of situations throughout my life where I've not been trying to be rude but come off that way to people, I think it's important to recognize that autistic folks can have bad days, hold grudges, not get along perfectly with everyone as well. It's a normal human thing to not mesh perfectly with everyone, and something that we can and do experience too!!!
I do like that (paraphrasing)
"I have all this context, but I don't know what bits are impotant."
What I think is that you have done a great job speaking for those of us who are not able to be what is considered "normal".I like how you explained how hard it can be for us to work at a regular job and other challenges and all that that entails.Thank you for being honest.
Dana, Thank you for this video. As a Neurotypical person, I get so confused by the Autistic responses that seem to defy reason to me. Life is hard enough when the response is "normal" but I really struggle when something makes no sense or appears , to me, to be making life harder for the Autistic person. It is exhausting to be the Neurotypical in these relationships also. Many times I just "back off" because I do not know how to bridge this gap in our conversations. We all struggle to survive in this world together. I am trying to do better, but feel defeated most of the time. Your video helps me realize that most of the "hurt" I feel is not intentional. Thank You!
from the other side, I learned at some point that some of the bullying I had experienced during school times was actually caused exactly by this. That some of the neurotypical kids were confused about how I was talking and behaving and didn't know how to interact with me. That was long long time before I had even the slightest idea that I could be autistic, but have a special interest in "figuring out people" and was able to talk to those who bullied me and became "sort of" friends with them when I made it clear that alot of the things they were upset about with me, were not actually intentional. (though i do wish they would have communicated in a less hostile and confusing way originally I can understand that this was one way to start any form of interaction, while others just ignored me mostly
Emotional and executive dysfunction might be helpful for you to look into. Sometimes a response is coming from this place
I wore costumes to elementary school, and I knew nobody else did, but I liked wearing fancy clothes. One time a classmate was super mean to me about it, telling me I was going to ruin the class photo, but honestly I felt very uncomfortable wearing 'normal' clothes and they made me more self conscious than wearing 'weird' outfits. I had a lot of trouble when we had a uniform in middle school, because I knew it looked bad on me and it drew attention to my body in ways I absolutely hated, and it emphasized that my family was poorer than a lot of other students, because my uniforms were old and secondhand. Thankfully high school once again didn't restrict what I could wear, and I again wore a lot of odd things, but by then I was at an art school so nobody cared, or if they did, they didn't make it my problem, and I was far from the only student wearing things out of the norm
P.S. Same, On The Text Issue, I've Often Had People Have A Go At Me And Even Accuse Of Me Of Claiming To Be Perfect Or Being Arrogant Etc. And I've Been Both Hurt & Of Course Confused By That, I've Always Said To 'Mundanes' (LOL😛) That Whatever The Dictionary Meaning(s) Of A Word(s) Is Exactly What I Mean When I Say It. 😝
Idk if my comment posted or not. I was in the middle of petting a kitten and attempting to manuever a waste management trashcan that is just about as tall as me... not sure why i was like "oh notification sound. Must click now!" Trashcan fell. Kitten ran off with me screaming "nooooooo". Pure chaos. Thx for the upload!!😂
Oh, I see you have sticky hands, too. I'm always walking around with crap in my hands that I become blind to until I wonder why I'm struggling to do something. 😂
@johnbillings5260 I'm the worst with it!! For some reason.... I convinced myself long ago that I can obviously do ALL the things at once. I have zero clue where or why that thought entered my head but it's there. And that thing has staying power.....🤔
@@LynIsALilADHD Yes! I don't know why it should require more than one trip from the car to the house when grocery shopping as well. My back starts to tell me, but otherwise I feel like it's the correct thing to do. I have a theory that it relates to object impermanence when things are picked up. Are you ADHD as well if you don't mind my asking?
@johnbillings5260 pretty a lot adhd. Lol. And about the groceries thing.... I mean
.. seems like it should be fine to cut off circulation to the hands for the walk inside, righ?
@@LynIsALilADHD I had a good laugh after I sent that and then looked at your screen name again. That should indicate to you how aware I am at times.
And who needs pinky fingers anyway? I seem to be able to use my hands fine until the feeling returns in them.
oooh those latter points. Im so sick of being labelled a rebel or whatever just cos people have such a narrow frame of existence. Ill be honest with certain people Ill just act as antagonistic and assumptive as neurotypical people feel to me.
ummm ok maybe you should try and consider how what you said is likely hurtful or bigotted@pawntune
@pawntune yup and with good reason
I think alot of the issues in communication between autistic and neurotypicals comes from the fact that while autistics have to question their communications all the time because they get often negative feedback for it (often without explanations), while someone neurotypical would just not need to question theirs because most of the time it aligns with their surroundings, which means, unless they are in a situation themselves where they would be required for survival to question it, they might not even realize how and why they are doing and seeing things the way they do.
And I mean this in a completely non judgemental way. It's a very human thing to not be bothered/concerned by things that aren't affecting your life.
But this also means, it's very hard for autistic people to make their difficulties understood towards neurotypicals, because it's not obvious to neurotypicals that we are practically having a language barrier there while on the surface we are speaking the same.
We actually see similar effects when people talk about subjects like discrimination or privilege....being aware of those terms is not the same as having lived through it or to understand what it means when you come from a place where it hasn't been a problem for "you".
I've been diagnosed only recently in my 40s, and I realize only now why so many times people got angry at me or frustrated by my questions or answers. For example if I ask "why do I have to do this?", it's a genuine question. But neurotypicals are accostumed to it beeing a disguised way of saying "I don't want to do it". If I don't want to do it, I WILL tell you, but first, to decide if I wanna do it, I need more context 🫠 The funny thing is I often misunderstand people precisely because I've known for a long time that they often don't say exactly what they mean, so I try to guess what they really meant, but guess wrong 😅
I've had strong reactions in the past (which I now know to be meltdowns) because people got very mad at me, screeming that I should understand what's happening because it is "obvious", and refusing to explain, saying I was lying about not understanding the situation and doing it to provoke them...
I'm not doing all this to be annoying, and on the contrary I will very much try all I can think of to not be annoying, I very much DO NOT enjoy hurting people or making them angry!
Lastly what baffles me is how much people judge things that are NOT important : like... they will forgive someone for being a nazi, sexist etc but judge you heavily just for being "weird". Seems to me that social norms are much more important to the general population than actually being a decent person. Priorities... 😅
That prom dress top hat converse combo sounds amazing!
12:20 Kaelynnism did a Shorts recently on hidden requests titled "Which style of communication do you prefer? 🗣 #autism #autistic #neurodivergent #adhd" that is on this exact phenomenon. A lot of times people phrase things that are actually requests very non-literally, and it's not always possible to tell whether or not they're just making a comment or asking specifically for something. 😭I kind of have the opposite problem where I look for hidden requests/subtexts in messages with people who are super-ultra literal, because people making hidden requests is so common in my area's culture.
Thank you so much for what you said about jobs and working. I've been told so many times "you're lazy," or "you just don't want to work." I kept trying to explain how I feel and how things affect me, but then that only seemed to reinforce the "you just don't want to work" narrative to those I was trying to explain it to. Including therapists. I'm probably forever going to feel guilt and self-hatred because of hearing those things.
Also, I hate that read-between-the-lines business. Everything you said speaks to my personal experience. One example is I have been told I was flirting with someone, when I thought I was just talking to that person in a normal way. How could what I have said have been perceived as flirting? I have no idea how to flirt intentionally.
As a fellow autistic, this is extremely relatable, and I appreciate you making this video that I can share with others.
I like this video as a neurotypical
I've always tried to not judge others because I knew there could be a good reason for their actions (or inactions), physical appearance, etc. My mind will go off on a tangent and create a life for them to explain why they may be that way. I gained a lot of empathy early for being me when I didn't know why I was in trouble for doing it.
Hi Dana 👋🏻 This is 100% something I'd like to see more of 🙏🏻😊
Helping me thank you.
Ah! Neurotypical tone policing. Say no more.
Thanks Dana. I'm so glad you can express this stuff.!
Thanks! This will go on my list of videos to point people to.
Great video!😁
Excellent Dana, you told it exactly how it is. You and I share a lot of similarities with our autism. Do you also have ADHD and learning difficulties too? You don't have to answer if it's too personal. I have ADHD and dyslexia and my 4 boys are all neurodivergent 😊
Do you have heds to I have fybromyalgia with it
HOLY S***! GIRL! SAME!!!!! I've Often Been Missed On The Autism Because Of My Intelligence And I've Always Said I Learnt Much Of What I Know And Understand From Television & Movies, Much Of My Intelligence & Even Morality Comes From Star Trek, And The Morality Is Reinforced From Things Like Power Rangers & Sailor Moon. 🥰🤪
I can relate to this as well, since I am also autistic. I do believe the reason why many neurotypical people don't understand what autism is nor what it was like being autistic, is because they are not autistic themselves, and they did not discover autism by themselves, by not doing any research about it at all like researching it on Google, read books, or watch different videos about Autism. I felt like some of them just refuse to discover about autism for themselves, because they just don't care. They mostly would tell us to try harder, do better, stop being weird, but it's not always that easy. No matter how many times we tried to fit in, and mask ourselves, it would still cause more stress, because the autistic brain is not similar to the neurotypical brain. It's just wired differently. I also have that kind of experience mostly from my own grandmother. Whenever I would mention autism, she would flip out, and become ableist towards me. She wanted me to be more of an extroverted person, and be more like her and the other members in our family, when I can't be like them, because I am not an extrovert outgoing person. I'm more of an introvert person, who always spends a lot of time alone in a room or a space where is quiet.
I did heard that many autistic people do struggle trying to keep a job, because of their experiences in the workplace. I wish that all jobs has a space or working accommodations for autistic people, because I do think that it is really important to look out for your mental health. It is something that I have worked on as well, when I applied to work at my 1st job, and I've already put my accommodations for my autism. I had decided to experience something new, by working at a job, and take a break from my college experience, since I choose to drop out from a 4 year college from the burnout and the hardwork that I have done from it, and maybe choose to return to college if the job experience didn't work for me.
Just found your channel. So far i totally relate! Subscribed
I'm new (to your channel, and pretty new to my diagnosis) This is a great video, you express a lot of the things I feel.
New sub! I’m late diagnosed AuDHD. We are hair twins! ❤❤❤
Me to 43
You're VERY helpful! Just discovered your channel a couple days ago.
I'm (very) late diagnosed (AuDHD) and your descriptions of your experiences definitely resonate.
Growing up, I didn't realize just how dysfunctional our family was. That really fed the already strong feelings of isolation and "otherness".