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I bought the U-Turn Orbit Theory with the Ortofon Bronze cartridge upgrade a few months ago, after a lot of research. I wanted a turntable worthy of higher end cartridges and higher end phono preamps, and I wanted a pretty turntable built in the USA with premium fit finish and feel. And that's what I believe I got. I am extremely happy with it and don't regret the purchase. I started with Schittt Mani 2 phono preamp rather that a built-in Pluto, and about the same time ordered a Bottlehead Eros 2, a relatively expensive kit tube phono preamp, which I have since completed and that has replaced my Mani. The system sounds awesome. The combo is clearly better than my digital chain which consists of Apple Music lossless > Airplay > WIIM mini bit-perfect mode > Toslink > Denifirps Aries II w/ 12th anniversary firmware upgrade. My wife (very much not an audiophile) put it nicely when comparing a couple of tracks from Foreigner 4 Vinyl to digital: "it sounds flat", "it" being the digital chain. That in nutshell is what an Ortofon Bronze cartridge > U-Turn Orbit Theory turntable > Bottlehead Eros 2 phono preamp is capable of in my system, versus what is in my opinion, a very nice sounding digital chain. Digital sounds obviously flat by comparison. No critical listening required to tease out the difference.
I bought this Uturn table with the Bronze cartridge and the upgraded cables with no preamp about 3 hours ago before I saw this video. I almost bought the Rega Planar 3 50th anniversary but this table was cheaper and more flexible in upgrades.. I also prefer the Theory tonearm. Can't wait to try it out.
You can custom build a U-Turn or pick pre configured models at different price points. Do some research before deciding. U-Turn is very high quality. Love that you can custom build your turntable which means you control the features cartridge & price.
I have a Fluance RT-85 and have been very happy with it. If you're going to upgrade from an RT-85, you probably want a table that has a more substantial difference. For me, I went with a SL1200GR with a Sumiko Wellfleet Cartridge. The improvement was quite drastic. Plus, there's adjustable VTA and a removable headshell. I still listen to my Fluance on a regular basis and Im still very fond of it. Im just saying, if you're going to drop 1000+ dollars on a turntable, make sure its a significant enough improvement over what you already have.
Hi Randy, Thanks for the review. I purchased and own this turntable with the Ortofon Bronze cart, and Orbit record weight since late last year. It has performed (dead quiet) and sounds great. Plus, made in the USA! Pretty awesome. Very happy with the purchase.👍
I have one of the basic UTurn Orbit tables because I wanted to ease my way back into vinyl without breaking the bank and I've been quite pleased with both the unit and with their customer service (the tone arm I ordered arrived broken and they made it extremely easy to exchange it and were extremely nice about it all!). I very much may look into the Theory table if I ever want to take things to the next level. I really like the company and their products. Glad to hear that their high end model lives up to the price point.
I didn't think I would ever see a puff device advertised on this channel, but here we are scratching another addiction of mine, and perhaps I need to research Fum, as it will be a very long time before I look into vinyl. Thank you as always for your time, effort, and sharing this with us all.
I have the Fluance RT85, love it, and is a FANTASTIC value for the price at $500. I don’t think I’d pay double to have a slightly better finish(my cherrywood 85 looks AMAZING) and an audibly negligible quieter unit. That and my 85 has a removable headshell and auto-stop.
I'm completely with you. I bought an RT82 but ended up upgrading it to an 85. The last thing I did was ditch the 2M Blue for a Nagaoka MP200 cartridge and wow...I was completely blown away. It is pricey at around 425, but man does it sound good!
A removal head shell and auto-stop go a long way in my opinion. I would never consider any turntable, regardless of price, without those features. It would have been interesting to see a comparison against some from the Technics lineup with removal head shell, auto-stop, direct drive and similarly priced. I'm using a Technics from 1980, a SL-D2 and a 2Blue Ortofon original owner. If and when willing to upgrade I will stay within Technics.
I have been auditioning a U-Turn Theory for a week now. I like it. I’m finding that I am hearing a lot of noise, but I’m also using a new cartridge, the Ortofon Bronze, new cables SKW brand, and many new albums as well. Since I currently have a Denon DP-1200 with several cartridges and headshells, I can understand the swapping perspective mentioned. I just wanted to try something new and different. Right away the soundstage was broad and impressive on this setup. No WOW and flutter issues. Tracking is right on, no turntable noise coming through for me so far. The chain is minimal with this setup by eliminating the headshell swapping feature as the time spent finding the right combo for a given cartridge is always important to audiophiles along with endless tweaking to get the most out of your cartridge as you well know. It’s hard to compare all the turntables, cables and rooms I’ve had, but this turntable is very good and I’ll give it a chance. It has good looks, it gives e the good feel I’m seeking in my record collection so far, the bass is there where I like it through my RELs/Thiels and I know it will be 40 to 50 hours of listening until this all begins to coalesce. For you new folks or those who have already settled down to a brand rut, fine, I’ve been exploring some newer stuff along the way during my long journey from the late sixties. The U-turn support is very good, the three year warranty is good, the company is the home team and I’ve had a lot of experience with the German and Japanese products to be comfortable about comparing. The look and feel of this turntable is pleasing and I have a good feeling about my choice after quite a bit of research. I doubt I’ll give a future follow up on this channel because I don’t follow Randy, he’s just not my kinda reviewer and his style isn’t my cup o tea so to speak. This is a good value product. If you by a vintage anything, and you are new to the vintage vinyl world, you gotta understand you’ll find it difficult to find turntable service and each turntable has a big learning curve ahead that’ll soon tame you. If you want to spend a lot of time and money to keep up with the big boys, go vintage, it will be worth it, but if you don’t have the deep pockets and don’t have the type of wherewithal to persevere, think twice.
I looked at U-Turn and many others. They all have great style and components. Fluance sold me on the two-speed motor and the auto stop is the cherry on top. I think it is insane that others do not have auto stop especially with such high-priced needles. Love your videos. Thanks!
Denon has a model with auto stop that also lifts the tonearm. My new Thorens has autostop like your Fluance. Have you noticed how many revolutions it takes to finally stop the record? Vintage tables stopped once into the runoff area. These modern tables take many revolutions before they stop. Maybe the dead wax in the runoff area doesn't damage the needle, but it will lessen the longevity of the needle over time.
My parents had a record console with the stackable records and a mono speaker. Many hours of listening on that player. Things are so much better now a days and thanks for bringing us this.
I pulled a Dual 1019 turntable from my in-laws media console when they moved into assisted living. It's made in Germany and weighs a ton. It has the ability to drop in a long spindle for stacking records. Sadly, I'm not going to dive back into vinyl at this point in my life and will sell it to a vintage enthusiast.
I just got the Theory with the bronze cartridge about a week ago. My fist record player besides a Fischer-Price one I vaguely remember having as a kid. I'm running it with a Mani 2 preamp and Klipsch the 5 speaker with a Pioneer 10" sub. I'm super happy with it, no hum a little pop and cracks. The bronze definitely likes extremely clean and flat vinyl, its very sensitive to static and wobble, but probably worth it for the clairity. Overall I would purchase it all over again except for the new expense I've found for record albums.
I purchased a U Turn Orbit Plus in 2018. Open box deal, great price. I used to live in Boston so the connection was there as well. I recently sold the Orbit and replaced with another open box table by Thorens. Paid half price for a $1,200 table. The Thorens is also semi automatic which I was leaning towards away from the manual style. Simply a preference. The only reason why I sold the Orbit was because of the loud hum of the motor. You can't hear it through the speakers or while listening from afar, but you can in between tracks and in quiet passages in classical music. There is no excuse for a table motor to be louder than my power amp transformers. Which, are barely audible. I hear the Theory's motor is quieter, but there are plenty of vintage tables that are dead silent. My Thorens is as well. I fould it very annoying.
I had the 2m bronze on a Rega Planar 6. It's not a warm and forgiving sound, but more revealing and some would say truthful. Sibilance is going to come through if it's there on the recording. Its a great cart if you like the sound.
I have a 4month old rega p3 with brand new Elyis 2 cartridge and sounds petty good at £499, the rt85 is a great turntable for the price point . That obit look great with real wood . Great video Randy
So, the Theory was the first TT I bought getting "back" into vinyl (and the only one, I don't plan on getting another), so I can't compare it to anything. I read and saw some good reviews on it, but what sold me was the solid wood plinth. Seriously. I wanted that! I wanted something special and I couldn't find any out there with that solid wood plinth in this price range. As he pointed out, it looks good. It just looks classy, yet modern. UTurn has GREAT customer service also. Randy mentioned Ben at UTurn, I have emails from Ben answering my questions. I have had one issue, a sound when I start it up after 6 months. Ben had me pack it up and send it back, they are fixing it now. I will say, it sounds good as far as I can tell. I had it connected to a Moon 240i and B&W 703 S1s. Everything together really sounds good.
As much as I like the Fluance, that Uturn wins on looks and build quality, the knurled finished and aluminium spindle as well as the real wood plinth...just stunning! You're paying extra for a better built deck, well worth it IMO. 3 years ago I wanted the Fluance RT85, but it was never in stock on Amazon, as importing it to the UK, cost way to much, so ended up with a NAD table.
@@1mctous It sure is, but I guess it works both ways, we get EU brands much cheaper than the Americans do, although most EU big brands are available over there, unlike many US brands which are not available here and are direct to customer only. I SOOO want a Geshelli Dac, but not paying the import duties and tax...
Which NAD? It really is worth getting current C 588 for the better tonearm instead of C 558. I went for a C 558 as I have more CDs than LP as primary media. My issue I noted in a very long comment else where here regarded the non-removable headshell. A week after I got it I destroyed wiring to cart taking it off wrong, to replace what it came with. In midst of C-V in NYC and no car, not waning to carry in to authorized service IF it was open I ordered a different TT and put the NAD aside. It was just repaired it and going to pick up by MON. For 2 TT in system.
Turntables are the one thing I generally recommend people buy used, if there's a good shop in your area that services and sells them or you know of a reputable online dealer. In particular, Japanese direct drive units from the late 1970s and early 80s are hands down the best performance-to-price value in turntables, especially from Technics, Sony, and Pioneer. You'd have to pay well over a thousand bucks to find a table that really competes with what you can often get for a hundred or two used in terms of sound, and even then it's likely you're getting belt drive and not the reliability of direct drive. Your new tt almost certainly won't be automatic or semi-automatic either, like those old tables often were.
So, you give up the easily changed out head shell, an S shaped tone arm, and a perfectly simple auto-stop. For another $500. And it's less "noisy". Hmmmmm. Nah, I'm going back into the living room to reassure my RT-84 that she's fine just the way she is. Because she's AWESOME!
I have the Fluance 85/ 2M blue as well, and agree with comments above re fit and finish. After using for the past 6 months or so I love the sound (connected to my vintage Kenwood with Advent large) but have 3 picky issues, none of which impact sound quality. First, the tonearm is not height adjustable, second the cueing lever and mech feel cheap and do not work very well, and third the logo on the front of my unit is ever so not level (can’t unsee this, other detail people will know).
Excellent review Randy. I have an Orbit TT with a blue cartridge and the acrylic platter and love it. They sound great are customizable,simple and beautiful too look at.
I have one of the Orbits from when they were launching on kickstarter, it's a solid budget turntable and I have very few complaints with it (the original lid hinges are weak, and the lack of a grounding post is problematic when your phono preamp has a hum and nothing to ground it to, it's not just vintage gear that will hum) and it's a great option to upgrade parts as needed. I've been curious about the Theory, the added features look good, I'm still not in need of a new turntable at the moment but you've confirmed my suspicions that the Theory is most likely worth the money, U-Turn remains on my list of audio companies I have no problem supporting and recommending
It looks to be a single piece tonearm & head shell - which is less resonance, and lighter weight/lower mass. Lower mass means it should track better. If my Linn Axis stops working, I will *definitely* consider this 'table. It is made a couple of towns away from me.
@@TriAmpMyFi I am. I am told that the likely failure point in the power supply is electrolytic caps - I will be looking at them to see if A) they are leaking or anything obvious, and B) whether they are something I can get and replace myself.
I ran a Technics SL 1800 MK1 and then a SL1600 MK2 for my reentry into vinyl. I ran a couple cheap carts then stepped up to a Denon 103r low output MC cart. That would have made a big difference if I knew anything about carts, phono amps, integrated amplifiers…. You know, that stuff. So I added a PHO-701 phono amp and dialed it in to the cart and wow, what a difference. Played around with the setup a little with a setup gauge I aligned up and shimmed the cart to correct the VTA and position. I was able to learn a TON about turntables because of the mistakes I made with the Denon cart. I read everything! I watched everything and in the end my vinyl sounded so insanely better. I started to think what kind of difference would it make to step up the turntable? Here comes the Music Hall 9.3! A walnut, triple plinth, acrylic table, divorced motor, 9” carbon fiber tone arm, 40LB monster with a low output MC Eroica LX cart. This table taught me about diminishing returns! Hahaha….. it is definitely better. But nowhere near the jump I was expecting. But I love it! That table is going nowhere! BTW…. Looking to buy a Technics turntable? 🤣
I have an RT85 and I'm pretty pleased with it. But I think the fit and finish is probably where Fluance skimped a little. It looks like the U turn is probably better built and that is worth something. For my limited listening to vinyl the RT85 suits me fine however.
I agree regarding the RT85 plinth (I have one, as well); I am not, however, interested in paying double - literally - for a solid wood one (although it is admittedly gorgeous), especially without a removable headhsell. Now, I LOVE my vinyl hobby, but it is just not worth that much of a cost increase to me since my RT85 has been an incredible, and perfectly enjoyable, piece of kit.
So, on a warped record the Theory rides the waves better, therefore, less noise. However on a nice flat record sans warping, that would not be an issue, and, presumably, both tables would essentially sound indistinguishable from each other. I guess I'll just continue using my RT85. Sounds like an example of the law of diminishing returns to me.
I see a lot of convergence between the U-Turn Theory ($1K) and the MoFi StudioDeck ($1.5K). Both have Sorbothane feet, platters with a groove for the belt, better AC synchronous motors, better platter bearings, and beautiful and well-made plinths. The StudioDeck still has 2 grooves on the motor for 33 and 45 but they are much closer than the U-Turn's. I'd still go with the Schiit Mani 2 preamp ($150) because it's quieter and more resolving than any cheap tube phono stage.
The Technics SL-100C has auto lift and is $1k. It is the same as the SL-1500 but without the preamp and has a cheaper cartridge instead of the 2M Red. So if you like direct drive it is a good table. I've had no issues with mine and I upgraded the cartridge to an AT-VM540ML.
I think the audio-technica LP-7 at $850, is still the best (or at least one of the best), turntables under $1000, but of course I haven't heard every turntable under a $1000, thanks for the review.
Glad to see that a turntable made it for a review after a gazillion of cheaply priced Chinese gear. A drawback is the absence of removal head shell and installing new cartridges can be a real pain. Finally, is it really necessary to have, as sponsor, what could be a precursor to vaping?
Reading your comment could be a precursor to me needing a drink, so is it really necessary. Gawd I hate that you can't make a comment without being a nanny.
It's inches and degrees with most products. Your reviews are very comprehensive Randy. So much choice ...the Uturn and Fluance turntables look great for the price..... Project and Audiotechnica need so competition.
Great Review, Its on the top of my list if I decide to spend under $1500. I'll get it with the 2M bronze. That way it's an easy upgrade to the 2M Black. Randy it was great meeting you at the Embassy Suites check-in.
why would one pick the blue over the brown cartridge on the theory? and what do i lose without a removable head - is it just connivence or i will be limiting myself with cartridge choices? ty
Chasing down grounding buzz on a vintage receiver? Might be a dealbreaker for a lot of people but what’s new there. It looks beautiful but there’s so many better options for less than $1000 out there that I just don’t see this being viable for a lot of people, but it is a pretty one.
I want to love the RT85 but that thick MDF plinth is a non-starter. Crazy talk, I know, but the solid wood, low profile look of the Theory alone puts it in another league.
If I was in the USA*, I'd definitely be looking at a U-turn over a Fluance. US-made, a company that's listening to customers and improving its product, plus is said to have great customer service. Not gonna slate Fluance but U-turn much more my jam. *if I lived in central Europe, I'd probably buy a Pro-Ject; as it is, I live in the UK and bought a Rega.
When I first got into hifi years ago vinyl was the thing. I sold all my vinyl when the CD came to be. Big mistake! I want to pick up a new turntable and start collecting vinyl again. Some lessons are learned the hard way.
I have the Fluance 85 and it is a good turntable and priced right but the Uturn you are reviewing is definitely better quality components and the fit and finish is premium. At my age (old) the cartridge makes more difference in sound quality than the turntable does.
Thanks for the review Randy. Will probably end up going with this turntable as I've been looking at it for a while, adding to this that Audio Technica's AT-LP2022 has sold out of a lot of places already. With your review, I'm probably sold as soon as I save up the funds, will most likely go for one of Ortofon's black cartridges for an upgrade.
The RT85 was on my list and I still consider it a great value. However, according to the Fluance specs, the tonearms on the Fluance RT83, RT84 and RT85 have an effective mass of 27.5g - very heavy by current standards. Using Ortofon’s compliance and resonant frequency charts, that makes the factory supplied Ortofon 2M cartridges a poor match for the heavy Fluance tonearms. Compliance and resonant frequency are important to me. A good match with a high compliance cartridge like the 2M Blue or Bronze is better attained with the low mass 8g magnesium tonearm on the Theory. Incredible value IMO - Acrylic platter, 8g magnesium tonearm, excellent wow and flutter (.07 reported by Fremer), seamless belt, electronic speed change 33/45, solid beautiful wood plinth, 3-year warranty, Ortofon 2M Bronze installed for less than $1200, and made in the USA. Also, world class customer support - as many others have stated. I upgraded from a direct drive, linear tracking Technics Sl-7 with a Shure V-15 LT and nude Fritz Gyger 5/75um FG2 stylus. I have about 60 hours on the 2M Bronze and this is my end game turntable - simply an amazing sounding beautiful product.
i still listen to records because in the 90´s when i started to earn more money i bought a expensive component system and started also to buy more cds ,but some of those cds sounded so strange that i used to put the record playing and noticing the far greater superiority of records, guitars sound like guitars ,i´m refering to electric guitars with a pedal to distortion also the level of the tracks in the music on cd the guitars stayed under the level of the voice(and almost didn´t sound like guitars) while in the original record it wasn´t like that and while the cd sound was kind of narrow the vinil was expansive , in 95 the stores in my country capital, Lisbon, closed and after 5 days they open not selling records anymore ,but in the weekend there was a open air market for records ,i filled my 70´s huge mercedes twice and in the last run ,when returning home i had to bring home my friends so only in the bagage area i filled it ,i bought hundreds of records new and sealed and almost spent what today is 60€ or less. there were all companies selling their records including alternative ones ,and they were not like the bad quality of vinil today, i even bought a expensive thorens turntable , i was still using a pioneer belt driven from 1974 that made the records sound much better than cds ,this talking mainly about rock bands like...so many ,also pink floyd ,emerson lake and palmer, king crimson, etc. I can say that i already had the records i liked the most from this last bands i refered but i bought all Lp´s sealed by some cents. in this vinil market ,that still exists today but i saw a tool LP being sold for 150€, don´t get me wrong i have thousands of original cds and a very expensive cd player ,more like 4 CD players, a PD-73 ,a PD-9000 , a PD-S803 from pioneer and being more economical independent at the time i spent a lot of money on a belt driven cd player by CEC or chuodenki (a very known brand for those who were interested in hi-fi in the 70´s)also i bought a DAT recorder which is digital but sounds very good , the cds maybe because of the excessive compression one can´t hear old records converted to digital or even Lp´s released in the 90´s that sound several times better in vinil than it´s cd version. I also think that from this 3 brands of turntables, the Pro-ject, the Rega and the Fluance ,the Fluance being cheaper is for sure the best, the first brand i refer around the cost of 1.000€ sound like ...nothing i had heard till today ,it´s not comparable because they sound so bad, nothing else. The price of turntables are really expensive with no quality at all, why not install a mechnical system to change speed which is done before reading the record,either than this each people have diferent levels of moisture in their hands so a belt excessivelly filled with sweat ,more greasy or not will improve the quality of sound ,this materials that already existed before the turntables they don´t slide with grease ,what about being protected in a box it will make the sound experience bad?that is new to me if one conects a new turntable to a old receiver (maybe 70´s) it will have a hum, i thought that would only happen without ground wire, this because anything new sounds better when conected top a 70´s amplifier or with radio ,a receiver, even new speakers sound really dynamic with old amplifiers. Also people today talk a lot about valves amplifiers having better sound, the only one i own was from my grandfather with a almost 2 meters high pieces of furniture with design in the wooden grill but only 100 watts of power and i still remenber my grandfathers voice "let´s see the birds, after we return and listen to some music" it had to warm up. About metallica i ,when the release of master of puppets , went to a place where they sold records but not much more gambling ,pens ,paper ,tobbaco ,i saw a metallica record i never had seen and when taking it from the stand i notice it was doble ,i bought it when arriving at home something was wrong ,it was the speed it were two maxi-singles ,instead of one LP ,at 45 r.p.m the sound is better , i even started to listen more the old metallica records, a friend of mine stole the picture disc of the ride the lightening in blue ,i had only seen it in green from a friend of mine ,maybe a mistaken colour in that cover, and i bought the picture disc,later i discover that a older friend of mine was his favorite band so i had access to all records released by metallica, i remenber later buying the harvester of sorrow maxi-single after the stupid death of Clif Burton ,he was projected from the bust first floor through the window and in a very leveled green field the only rock km´s around was where he falls with his head into , but returning to the maxi, it had two covers in the b side the prince and breadfun or something like that but it were better than the originals ,maybe you never saw turntables either than this new wave of bad sounding turntables, i bought a technics to a friend of mine for 120€ that to match it one has to spend 14.000€ in a pro-ject turntable and a good cartridge that cost a bit more than 5.000€, only my opinion but i only listened to records for the last 47 years, i also started a radio station ,there was none in my hometown and it is the big district in my country also worked as a dj for 35 years, stoped in 2007
Sometimes, nicer built things are just nicer to handle. I bought my first turntable a few months before this model was released. I would have given this one a real close look, as I like locally made stuff as servicing is better, if it was out when I was shopping. I ended up getting a Rega planar 2 over the fluance, simply because my I handled a friends fluance and the stores rega and the tonearm bearing just seemed smoother and better built, also looking at the arm weight on the fluance its a little heavy, and the rega's tonearm is longer too. Ya gotta go with what you want to live with for awhile, from looks to handling.
I think you've drunk Uturn's cool-aid. As you've said, an AB comparison is difficult on turntables, but here you have one with idenical carts, which makes it simple if you have a preamp with TWO switchable phono inputs.
Thanks Randy, shopping for a new deck myself. I gotta say though, removable headshell gonna be very important to me considering the one i have now is not. Obviously if something is good enough to overcome that factor of the equation then…?
I'm always interested in the advancement of entry level audio. Great that you constantly highlight these products. As much as I like the new project turntables and entry level rega models I prefer vintage models live those from pioneer eg the pl12 and 15 and I even bought an AR XB1 turntable.... I need to change the motor as I'm in Australia with different frequency and voltage. Also for years Technics turntables were cheap.....not now lol. A great entry level amp is the Rotel A10
To put things in historical perspective, when I was 13 1975 , I purchased a pioneer PL 12 turntable with an cartridge , it cost 200$ adjusted to inflation in present day that would be about $1200. This is most likely a much better turntable.
I was impressed that this table is american made. So many manufacturers are unable to effectively do that, and just mindlessly ship manufacturing to be done offshore, someplaces. with manufacturing ethics that nobody would really want to be involved with The non removable head shell is a common approach to better tonearm sound, as any break in the mechanical structure sends reflected energy back the wrong way, towards the cartridge. Plus an owner sending this much money on a turntable is probably only running one cartridge anyway. Some enjoy changing cartridges for different records , and enjoy an interchangeable head shell. I would rather have my money concentrated in one superior phone cartridge, since, even with a selection, only one is going to be the best anyway. I would have enjoyed a little exploration into the main bearing construction , the sonic heart of any turntable , yet so often ignored. Even with identical main platter bearing designs, the care in manufacturing shown on the visible items would have a significant sonic advantage with a better finished bearing, if it was indeed given more care. Tonearms are often not given a lot of consideration because they come attached to whatever turntable is selected, but they are so very critical to the sound, and should be considered as more than just a whatever item. .
Yeah, and if you really want quiet use CD's. I grew up with some of the finest turntables and stereo equipment as my dad was an audiophile of the highest order. His records sound amazing! However, as soon as compact disc's dropped he bought the best CD player on the market and never looked back. I guess 60 years of pops and hiss were an easy trade for pure unadulterated music. Oh but Vinyl is so much warmer and real, yeah, sure. lol
This video was informative but comparing a $500 Fluance RT85 to U-Turn's flagship turntable at $1,000 and concluding the U-Turn is better was an expected outcome and not really the most informative comparison. I think the following turntables that are all cheaper than the U-Turn but more expensive than the Fluance RT85 with specific materials closer to that U-Turn would have been more revealing . For example Pro-Ject's Debut Carbon EVO. For $600 you get that well-reviewed Pro-Ject carbon fiber tone arm and a more comparable build quality. Or... the Rega Planar 2, Music Hall Classic, DUAL CS 518, Thorens TD 201, & Audio Technica's AT-LP7. These turntables range between $650-$850, well below $1,000 but generally considered a clear step above Fluance. An average customer considering a turntable at a $1,000 budget may be more inclined to compare this U-Turn with something that's $150-$350 cheaper than dropping down to half the money in my experience. For example... Imagine comparing this U-Turn turntable to the Rega Planar 2, now that should be much more intriguing and a more reasonable price difference of approximately $225 which is a lot of money to save with a $1000 turntable budget. But I have to say that throwing the Pro-Ject Debut Carbon EVO at $600 at this U-Turn would've created a more competitive comparison as well. Randy appeared a bit out of touch in this video. Just my opinion.
Theory with the built in Preamp and upgraded 2M Bronze Cartridge in route scheduled to dock this Sat!! Cant wait! First turntable in over 40 years! Its going into a small 12x12 piano/library room and I'll be mating it to a pair of KEF LSX II's. Small Room, Simple system.
Vinyl prices here in Oz are a joke. I worked out that for the price of a decent entry level table with onboard preamp I could buy 10-12 vinyl albums of the music I love. Guess how the same exercise works out for a CDP and the CDs I love ? It would be interesting to add up the 3 options - 12 months of Room+Tidal vs vinyl vs CDs, but I still watch the turntable reviews. Masochist ;)
They don't make them in the US. They ASSEMBLE them in the US. Out of part sourced in Asia. And STILL charge a thousand bucks for them. And no detachable headshell.
A grand seems like its past or at the point of diminishing returns, I mean no matter what table we buy its still gets down to a needle in a groove right-? Record scratches and other deficiencies will still be there but with better fidelity on a better table, and the cartridge and the preamp have the most to do with that ??
Nice to see you with another legit sponsor, congrats! Also, I have a theory: you are a dork, that’s actually my wife’s theory, and it’s about me, ok cya next time!
Interesting info about the Pluto 2 from uturn bring forward in the upper range. I’ve been listening to some of the remastered Cure records on my orbit with 2M blue and thinking there was A LOT of treble. Actually have a mani 2 out for delivery, so I’m excited to see how it affects the sound.
Nice to see some vinyl content again. This looks like a great TT option if its in your budget and I don't think its too expensive to look at for the channel given that vinyl is inherently going to be on the esoteric side of the audiophile spectrum no matter what your budget is. With this though it does look like you do get a lot for your money and its something you'll hold onto for awhile, a comparison to the Technics 1500C would be interesting to see.
Fluance rt85 gives a lot of value mainly the ortofon blue. The construction, damping etc is terrible compared to a project in that price point with the same cartridge. $1,000 seems too pricey but this is the second positive review I’ve seen but both seem borderline positive. Trying to convince me $1000 is not a lot. Go watch sky audio’s review which seems similar
Cheapaudioman you are kind of drifting from cheap audio just lately. To be honest for the price of this you could buy a Technics 1210GR if you wait for discounted prices.
i had that system at home but my father never let me use it because of the old type stylus but it was fun to see the ramones records after one side being heard other would fall from what i think it was excessive height it made a sound like PAAAHHHH!!! and then surfin´bird
The tonearm is not the noise contributor. If you had 2 tonearms where the stylus was perfectly aligned in the groove in all dimensions and angles, the difference in surface noise would be a result of the stylus profile. In other words, the actual dimensions and cut of the stylus. Since you are using the same stylis in both cases, the first thing you should do is check the alignment setup on the Fluance, or the wear on the stylus on your FL-83.
New sub! I had a Uturn Orbit Plus. It was a nice turntable but ran alittle fast and there is no way to adjust it and I’d get a hum when switching to Phono. Checked everything and it was ok. Jumped to a Rega P3 and their Neo psu and never looked back. Would I recommend the Uturn? Yes!! It’s a great little turntable
We went to axpona, so many products there have several more zeros in the price, they would definitely consider this cheap, not that I’d agree but subjectivity is subjective
Depends on who you ask. I don't mind when Randy talks higher or mid-fi prices...I watch for entertainment value as most of the gear reviewed here is not something I'd put into any of my set ups. Although he gets some good priced gems in to review every once in awhile.
No it's not cheap, but to be fair he does concentrate a lot on cheap 'Chi-Fi' and the same US brands, so it's nice to see something else for a change. To some people they'd consider the Uturn table cheap (not me. just saying)
@@les3782 cheapaudioman said he compared to rt85, but also said he used rt83 with 2m blue. but did he also upgrade platter - if not, it is not a comparison to rt85.
thats cause the other u-turn tables platterr do not have a groove in them why a lot of people complain about belt coming off I do not have a u-turn table but when I saw the first one in a review I knew right away that belt which is rounded not flat will come off ,I been playing with TT's all mt life even I an idiot likw me saw that coming ,there are other TT's out there that use a similar platter but they use a flat belt or have a channel in the platter ,the only thing about the fluance which i do not like is if you open them up they are completly hollow inside there is a motor lots of space and the circuit board and few other things but it is practically empty ,I have seen a lot of reviews for this TT and yes they are a fantastic ,beautifull TT i like how they look but a lot of the reviews say solid wood its wood like but compare it to the u-turn they are solid wood not to mention they are made in china no offense to them but i am sure they are not paying people who work there a lot of money so fluance is making money for a hollow unit they are made better but still hollow and there are other TT's out there made the same way same glossy finish same build and lot of them are cheaper ,so 1000.00 dollars is too high for me if I wanted one but I am into the vintage automatic TT's I work hard all day using manual TT's was getting to be a pain in the ------ so i have sevearl TT's dual 1009 sk,1037 a Garrard at-60 and a Bsr 610 ,and I wanted to prove that stacking the records does not scratch the record remember lead in groove and record label keeps most of surface from touching and remember the music is inside of groove not on top and when record falls on top of another record yes you will hear the record sliding on top of the other but the lead in groove and label !!! also most of scratching is coming from the handler as he unwittingly changes to second side of record as iz saw my father doing when i was younger there is no one out there to teach on how to handle record it is the same if you were using a manual TT u pick up record flip it over place on platter ,well i do the same I grab one or 2 records at a time flipping them carefully place them on top of each other and i am ready to go relax even dose off which i tend to do ,I have tried this on several records I bought used as my test subjects mostly all of them in great condition and been doing this going on 3 years now I checked so far every time i play them so far no scratches ,I did manage to scratch one on the track on begining of a track cause i was using my pro-ject debut 3 manual TT and my stupid hand jerked the tone arm as i was placing it down note [that is what cueing lever is for ]but i have heard all this poop about record stacking TT that they are bad ,baloney the best stacking TT if you want to try it so far to me has been the dual 1009sk and the 1237 models when they drop a record they seem to fall down so effortly and gently that they barely slide when the come down ,I am just trying to prove that there are stackers that do a great job ,the garrad at-60 is a little rough cause of the back lever that tells TT what size record it is but no scratches so far and thats all I will say but that I really like your vids and i have subscribed to your channel you have a fantastic sense of humor its good to watch after a poop filled day at work thanks again JRo
My problem with U-turn was from the entry level all the way to their most expensive one the tiny round belt always comes off maybe not all the time but you will have issues with it falling off and it was just annoying and they wear out faster because they’re so tiny and round whereas fluence has the flat thicker belt and I’ve never had a problem with my fluence, but now it sounds like they got smart and they’ve added a groove to hold the belt because they were getting a lot of feedback of belt issues and most of the TH-camrs reviewing them were hiding that fact and weren’t being honest that the turntables kept throwing the belts. So I think it’s good they’ve at least updated them now I don’t know if they did all the models or just on the special because it’s the most expensive I hope they add the grooves in the platter to all the models so in my experience the fluence was a better turntable I ended up returning my U-turns I also disagreed that it’s worth twice as much as fluence you might get a little bit more noise I don’t know what your records are like but unless my records are trashed I don’t get any noise on my fluence it rides the waves perfectly with the S shaped tonearm I think it’s a better design also than the straight shaft on the U-turn and with the bamboo finished one and with the noise dampening rubber feet that are adjustable I still think it’s a better turntable for the money but that’s just my opinion. And that’s without even getting into the differences in the wow and flutter which also the fluence is better which you didn’t go into they have a rating that’s supposed to be low on the U-turn but when a lot of TH-camrs tested the speed they were getting various results and I like that the fluence Has the laser scanning motor to make sure it’s more correct with its speed being proper which is another feature the U-turn just doesn’t have for twice the money there wow and flutter can be hit or miss.
I've had an orbit with acrylic platter since day 1 of kickstarter shipping and the only time I've had issues with belt slip was when the original belt was worn and needed to be replaced. if it's slipping throw the belt in a baggy with some talcum powder, shake it up and that should fix it
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I bought the U-Turn Orbit Theory with the Ortofon Bronze cartridge upgrade a few months ago, after a lot of research. I wanted a turntable worthy of higher end cartridges and higher end phono preamps, and I wanted a pretty turntable built in the USA with premium fit finish and feel. And that's what I believe I got. I am extremely happy with it and don't regret the purchase. I started with Schittt Mani 2 phono preamp rather that a built-in Pluto, and about the same time ordered a Bottlehead Eros 2, a relatively expensive kit tube phono preamp, which I have since completed and that has replaced my Mani. The system sounds awesome. The combo is clearly better than my digital chain which consists of Apple Music lossless > Airplay > WIIM mini bit-perfect mode > Toslink > Denifirps Aries II w/ 12th anniversary firmware upgrade. My wife (very much not an audiophile) put it nicely when comparing a couple of tracks from Foreigner 4 Vinyl to digital: "it sounds flat", "it" being the digital chain. That in nutshell is what an Ortofon Bronze cartridge > U-Turn Orbit Theory turntable > Bottlehead Eros 2 phono preamp is capable of in my system, versus what is in my opinion, a very nice sounding digital chain. Digital sounds obviously flat by comparison. No critical listening required to tease out the difference.
I’m still using my 1979 JVC turntable with quartz lock, and direct drive. It has auto return at the end of the record….. I like that.
Love those! I have the JVC QL-A5 I think from 1981 or 82 and it still works fine.
@@deputy3690
Mine is the QL-A2. Not a top of the line model, but still has the features I like.
Me too!!!!
I bought this Uturn table with the Bronze cartridge and the upgraded cables with no preamp about 3 hours ago before I saw this video. I almost bought the Rega Planar 3 50th anniversary but this table was cheaper and more flexible in upgrades.. I also prefer the Theory tonearm. Can't wait to try it out.
you had me sold on Fluance ! - now the new kid on the block shows up at 2 X $ - - Nope - I'll be ordering the Fluance
Same here. This looks really nice, but you just can’t beat the value of the Fluance.
You can custom build a U-Turn or pick pre configured models at different price points. Do some research before deciding. U-Turn is very high quality. Love that you can custom build your turntable which means you control the features cartridge & price.
Bought my daughter a Fluance RT82. Super nice
I have a Fluance RT-85 and have been very happy with it. If you're going to upgrade from an RT-85, you probably want a table that has a more substantial difference. For me, I went with a SL1200GR with a Sumiko Wellfleet Cartridge. The improvement was quite drastic. Plus, there's adjustable VTA and a removable headshell. I still listen to my Fluance on a regular basis and Im still very fond of it. Im just saying, if you're going to drop 1000+ dollars on a turntable, make sure its a significant enough improvement over what you already have.
Hi Randy, Thanks for the review. I purchased and own this turntable with the Ortofon Bronze cart, and Orbit record weight since late last year. It has performed (dead quiet) and sounds great. Plus, made in the USA! Pretty awesome. Very happy with the purchase.👍
I have one of the basic UTurn Orbit tables because I wanted to ease my way back into vinyl without breaking the bank and I've been quite pleased with both the unit and with their customer service (the tone arm I ordered arrived broken and they made it extremely easy to exchange it and were extremely nice about it all!). I very much may look into the Theory table if I ever want to take things to the next level. I really like the company and their products. Glad to hear that their high end model lives up to the price point.
Same here ,makes getting into vinyl so easy
I didn't think I would ever see a puff device advertised on this channel, but here we are scratching another addiction of mine, and perhaps I need to research Fum, as it will be a very long time before I look into vinyl. Thank you as always for your time, effort, and sharing this with us all.
puff piece 🤭
You don't know what you are missing with vinyl .I suppose you believe in Climate change too
I have the Fluance RT85, love it, and is a FANTASTIC value for the price at $500. I don’t think I’d pay double to have a slightly better finish(my cherrywood 85 looks AMAZING) and an audibly negligible quieter unit. That and my 85 has a removable headshell and auto-stop.
Fluance is the way.
I have the RT-85 in Bamboo. I agree with you. Fluance is fantastic.
I'm completely with you. I bought an RT82 but ended up upgrading it to an 85. The last thing I did was ditch the 2M Blue for a Nagaoka MP200 cartridge and wow...I was completely blown away. It is pricey at around 425, but man does it sound good!
Auto stop is a must
A removal head shell and auto-stop go a long way in my opinion. I would never consider any turntable, regardless of price, without those features. It would have been interesting to see a comparison against some from the Technics lineup with removal head shell, auto-stop, direct drive and similarly priced. I'm using a Technics from 1980, a SL-D2 and a 2Blue Ortofon original owner. If and when willing to upgrade I will stay within Technics.
I have been auditioning a U-Turn Theory for a week now. I like it. I’m finding that I am hearing a lot of noise, but I’m also using a new cartridge, the Ortofon Bronze, new cables SKW brand, and many new albums as well. Since I currently have a Denon DP-1200 with several cartridges and headshells, I can understand the swapping perspective mentioned. I just wanted to try something new and different. Right away the soundstage was broad and impressive on this setup. No WOW and flutter issues. Tracking is right on, no turntable noise coming through for me so far. The chain is minimal with this setup by eliminating the headshell swapping feature as the time spent finding the right combo for a given cartridge is always important to audiophiles along with endless tweaking to get the most out of your cartridge as you well know. It’s hard to compare all the turntables, cables and rooms I’ve had, but this turntable is very good and I’ll give it a chance. It has good looks, it gives e the good feel I’m seeking in my record collection so far, the bass is there where I like it through my RELs/Thiels and I know it will be 40 to 50 hours of listening until this all begins to coalesce. For you new folks or those who have already settled down to a brand rut, fine, I’ve been exploring some newer stuff along the way during my long journey from the late sixties. The U-turn support is very good, the three year warranty is good, the company is the home team and I’ve had a lot of experience with the German and Japanese products to be comfortable about comparing. The look and feel of this turntable is pleasing and I have a good feeling about my choice after quite a bit of research. I doubt I’ll give a future follow up on this channel because I don’t follow Randy, he’s just not my kinda reviewer and his style isn’t my cup o tea so to speak. This is a good value product. If you by a vintage anything, and you are new to the vintage vinyl world, you gotta understand you’ll find it difficult to find turntable service and each turntable has a big learning curve ahead that’ll soon tame you. If you want to spend a lot of time and money to keep up with the big boys, go vintage, it will be worth it, but if you don’t have the deep pockets and don’t have the type of wherewithal to persevere, think twice.
I looked at U-Turn and many others. They all have great style and components. Fluance sold me on the two-speed motor and the auto stop is the cherry on top. I think it is insane that others do not have auto stop especially with such high-priced needles. Love your videos. Thanks!
Denon has a model with auto stop that also lifts the tonearm. My new Thorens has autostop like your Fluance. Have you noticed how many revolutions it takes to finally stop the record? Vintage tables stopped once into the runoff area. These modern tables take many revolutions before they stop. Maybe the dead wax in the runoff area doesn't damage the needle, but it will lessen the longevity of the needle over time.
@@felony53 I think it is a time limit... maybe 5-10 sec.
Thanks! For all you do for us hifi fans
Thank you so much!
Most welcome 😁
Have the Orbit Basic Turntable. It's terrific. When/If I ever upgrade, it will be with a new UTurn.
My parents had a record console with the stackable records and a mono speaker. Many hours of listening on that player. Things are so much better now a days and thanks for bringing us this.
Ironically it took CNC to make better turntable parts more affordable.
I pulled a Dual 1019 turntable from my in-laws media console when they moved into assisted living. It's made in Germany and weighs a ton. It has the ability to drop in a long spindle for stacking records. Sadly, I'm not going to dive back into vinyl at this point in my life and will sell it to a vintage enthusiast.
I just got the Theory with the bronze cartridge about a week ago. My fist record player besides a Fischer-Price one I vaguely remember having as a kid. I'm running it with a Mani 2 preamp and Klipsch the 5 speaker with a Pioneer 10" sub. I'm super happy with it, no hum a little pop and cracks. The bronze definitely likes extremely clean and flat vinyl, its very sensitive to static and wobble, but probably worth it for the clairity. Overall I would purchase it all over again except for the new expense I've found for record albums.
...And a Ortofon 2M blue. Love it!
Thanks!
I purchased a U Turn Orbit Plus in 2018. Open box deal, great price. I used to live in Boston so the connection was there as well. I recently sold the Orbit and replaced with another open box table by Thorens. Paid half price for a $1,200 table. The Thorens is also semi automatic which I was leaning towards away from the manual style. Simply a preference. The only reason why I sold the Orbit was because of the loud hum of the motor. You can't hear it through the speakers or while listening from afar, but you can in between tracks and in quiet passages in classical music. There is no excuse for a table motor to be louder than my power amp transformers. Which, are barely audible. I hear the Theory's motor is quieter, but there are plenty of vintage tables that are dead silent. My Thorens is as well. I fould it very annoying.
Love to see a review of it with the 2m bronze upgrade
This ☝️. From what I heard is the Bronze isn't friendly with noisy records. So I would love that input.
I had the 2m bronze on a Rega Planar 6. It's not a warm and forgiving sound, but more revealing and some would say truthful. Sibilance is going to come through if it's there on the recording. Its a great cart if you like the sound.
I have a 4month old rega p3 with brand new Elyis 2 cartridge and sounds petty good at £499, the rt85 is a great turntable for the price point . That obit look great with real wood . Great video Randy
So, the Theory was the first TT I bought getting "back" into vinyl (and the only one, I don't plan on getting another), so I can't compare it to anything. I read and saw some good reviews on it, but what sold me was the solid wood plinth. Seriously. I wanted that! I wanted something special and I couldn't find any out there with that solid wood plinth in this price range. As he pointed out, it looks good. It just looks classy, yet modern. UTurn has GREAT customer service also. Randy mentioned Ben at UTurn, I have emails from Ben answering my questions. I have had one issue, a sound when I start it up after 6 months. Ben had me pack it up and send it back, they are fixing it now. I will say, it sounds good as far as I can tell. I had it connected to a Moon 240i and B&W 703 S1s. Everything together really sounds good.
As much as I like the Fluance, that Uturn wins on looks and build quality, the knurled finished and aluminium spindle as well as the real wood plinth...just stunning! You're paying extra for a better built deck, well worth it IMO. 3 years ago I wanted the Fluance RT85, but it was never in stock on Amazon, as importing it to the UK, cost way to much, so ended up with a NAD table.
The import penalty is very real and the NAD is a very good 'table.
@@1mctous It sure is, but I guess it works both ways, we get EU brands much cheaper than the Americans do, although most EU big brands are available over there, unlike many US brands which are not available here and are direct to customer only. I SOOO want a Geshelli Dac, but not paying the import duties and tax...
@@leegill2427 The less open your market, the more you'll pay and/or the less you'll get.
Which NAD? It really is worth getting current C 588 for the better tonearm instead of C 558.
I went for a C 558 as I have more CDs than LP as primary media. My issue I noted in a very long comment else where here regarded the non-removable headshell. A week after I got it I destroyed wiring to cart taking it off wrong, to replace what it came with. In midst of C-V in NYC and no car, not waning to carry in to authorized service IF it was open I ordered a different TT and put the NAD aside. It was just repaired it and going to pick up by MON. For 2 TT in system.
Turntables are the one thing I generally recommend people buy used, if there's a good shop in your area that services and sells them or you know of a reputable online dealer. In particular, Japanese direct drive units from the late 1970s and early 80s are hands down the best performance-to-price value in turntables, especially from Technics, Sony, and Pioneer. You'd have to pay well over a thousand bucks to find a table that really competes with what you can often get for a hundred or two used in terms of sound, and even then it's likely you're getting belt drive and not the reliability of direct drive. Your new tt almost certainly won't be automatic or semi-automatic either, like those old tables often were.
So, you give up the easily changed out head shell, an S shaped tone arm, and a perfectly simple auto-stop. For another $500. And it's less "noisy". Hmmmmm. Nah, I'm going back into the living room to reassure my RT-84 that she's fine just the way she is. Because she's AWESOME!
Yeah, my point exactly!
Beautiful table! I enjoyed my orbit custom for years. I might consider one of these for a second table.
I have the Fluance 85/ 2M blue as well, and agree with comments above re fit and finish. After using for the past 6 months or so I love the sound (connected to my vintage Kenwood with Advent large) but have 3 picky issues, none of which impact sound quality. First, the tonearm is not height adjustable, second the cueing lever and mech feel cheap and do not work very well, and third the logo on the front of my unit is ever so not level (can’t unsee this, other detail people will know).
Excellent review Randy. I have an Orbit TT with a blue cartridge and the acrylic platter and love it. They sound great are customizable,simple and beautiful too look at.
I have one of the Orbits from when they were launching on kickstarter, it's a solid budget turntable and I have very few complaints with it (the original lid hinges are weak, and the lack of a grounding post is problematic when your phono preamp has a hum and nothing to ground it to, it's not just vintage gear that will hum) and it's a great option to upgrade parts as needed. I've been curious about the Theory, the added features look good, I'm still not in need of a new turntable at the moment but you've confirmed my suspicions that the Theory is most likely worth the money, U-Turn remains on my list of audio companies I have no problem supporting and recommending
It looks to be a single piece tonearm & head shell - which is less resonance, and lighter weight/lower mass. Lower mass means it should track better. If my Linn Axis stops working, I will *definitely* consider this 'table. It is made a couple of towns away from me.
You from MA Neil? Your name rings a bell.
@@TriAmpMyFi I am. I am told that the likely failure point in the power supply is electrolytic caps - I will be looking at them to see if A) they are leaking or anything obvious, and B) whether they are something I can get and replace myself.
@@NeilBlanchard Is the word awning significant to you? We may share that in common too.
@@TriAmpMyFi Well, I know what an awning *is* but I wouldn't say it is significant?
@@NeilBlanchard Oh well. Perhaps your name is quite popular. Safe Travels.😁
I ran a Technics SL 1800 MK1 and then a SL1600 MK2 for my reentry into vinyl. I ran a couple cheap carts then stepped up to a Denon 103r low output MC cart. That would have made a big difference if I knew anything about carts, phono amps, integrated amplifiers…. You know, that stuff. So I added a PHO-701 phono amp and dialed it in to the cart and wow, what a difference. Played around with the setup a little with a setup gauge I aligned up and shimmed the cart to correct the VTA and position. I was able to learn a TON about turntables because of the mistakes I made with the Denon cart. I read everything! I watched everything and in the end my vinyl sounded so insanely better. I started to think what kind of difference would it make to step up the turntable? Here comes the Music Hall 9.3! A walnut, triple plinth, acrylic table, divorced motor, 9” carbon fiber tone arm, 40LB monster with a low output MC Eroica LX cart. This table taught me about diminishing returns! Hahaha….. it is definitely better. But nowhere near the jump I was expecting. But I love it! That table is going nowhere! BTW…. Looking to buy a Technics turntable? 🤣
Pro-Ject Debut Carbon With Ortofon 2M Red Cartridge - make your life easy
I have an RT85 and I'm pretty pleased with it. But I think the fit and finish is probably where Fluance skimped a little. It looks like the U turn is probably better built and that is worth something. For my limited listening to vinyl the RT85 suits me fine however.
I agree regarding the RT85 plinth (I have one, as well); I am not, however, interested in paying double - literally - for a solid wood one (although it is admittedly gorgeous), especially without a removable headhsell. Now, I LOVE my vinyl hobby, but it is just not worth that much of a cost increase to me since my RT85 has been an incredible, and perfectly enjoyable, piece of kit.
Just looks-wise, I think the new Uturn crushes the Fluance. I’m still rocking the Orbit Basic, but one day…
So, on a warped record the Theory rides the waves better, therefore, less noise. However on a nice flat record sans warping, that would not be an issue, and, presumably, both tables would essentially sound indistinguishable from each other. I guess I'll just continue using my RT85. Sounds like an example of the law of diminishing returns to me.
I see a lot of convergence between the U-Turn Theory ($1K) and the MoFi StudioDeck ($1.5K). Both have Sorbothane feet, platters with a groove for the belt, better AC synchronous motors, better platter bearings, and beautiful and well-made plinths. The StudioDeck still has 2 grooves on the motor for 33 and 45 but they are much closer than the U-Turn's. I'd still go with the Schiit Mani 2 preamp ($150) because it's quieter and more resolving than any cheap tube phono stage.
The Technics SL-100C has auto lift and is $1k. It is the same as the SL-1500 but without the preamp and has a cheaper cartridge instead of the 2M Red. So if you like direct drive it is a good table. I've had no issues with mine and I upgraded the cartridge to an AT-VM540ML.
I think the audio-technica LP-7 at $850, is still the best (or at least one of the best), turntables under $1000, but of course I haven't heard every turntable under a $1000, thanks for the review.
The Orbit Custom is the way to go. If you don't need a pre-amp, you can get all of the good options for a total of $708.
Glad to see that a turntable made it for a review after a gazillion of cheaply priced Chinese gear. A drawback is the absence of removal head shell and installing new cartridges can be a real pain.
Finally, is it really necessary to have, as sponsor, what could be a precursor to vaping?
Reading your comment could be a precursor to me needing a drink, so is it really necessary.
Gawd I hate that you can't make a comment without being a nanny.
Always liked U-turn's TTs. That one puts them up against Rega's fancier tables. Love the wood finishes! And the speed switch.
Very nice, they are in the next town over from me. It’s pronounced “Woo burn”, I hope they end up having an onsite sale at some point
I would certainly consider this tt, if it had a removable headshell
It's inches and degrees with most products. Your reviews are very comprehensive Randy. So much choice ...the Uturn and Fluance turntables look great for the price..... Project and Audiotechnica need so competition.
Great review
Great Review, Its on the top of my list if I decide to spend under $1500. I'll get it with the 2M bronze. That way it's an easy upgrade to the 2M Black. Randy it was great meeting you at the Embassy Suites check-in.
why would one pick the blue over the brown cartridge on the theory? and what do i lose without a removable head - is it just connivence or i will be limiting myself with cartridge choices? ty
The fixed head shell turns me off - I like to swap cartridges. Good video thanks
Chasing down grounding buzz on a vintage receiver? Might be a dealbreaker for a lot of people but what’s new there. It looks beautiful but there’s so many better options for less than $1000 out there that I just don’t see this being viable for a lot of people, but it is a pretty one.
I'm guessing that you're a direct drive fan.
Not since my dj days, now I’m indifferent
I’ll stick with my Fluance.
I want to love the RT85 but that thick MDF plinth is a non-starter. Crazy talk, I know, but the solid wood, low profile look of the Theory alone puts it in another league.
If I was in the USA*, I'd definitely be looking at a U-turn over a Fluance. US-made, a company that's listening to customers and improving its product, plus is said to have great customer service. Not gonna slate Fluance but U-turn much more my jam.
*if I lived in central Europe, I'd probably buy a Pro-Ject; as it is, I live in the UK and bought a Rega.
When I first got into hifi years ago vinyl was the thing. I sold all my vinyl when the CD came to be. Big mistake! I want to pick up a new turntable and start collecting vinyl again. Some lessons are learned the hard way.
I have the Fluance 85 and it is a good turntable and priced right but the Uturn you are reviewing is definitely better quality components and the fit and finish is premium. At my age (old) the cartridge makes more difference in sound quality than the turntable does.
Thanks for the review Randy. Will probably end up going with this turntable as I've been looking at it for a while, adding to this that Audio Technica's AT-LP2022 has sold out of a lot of places already. With your review, I'm probably sold as soon as I save up the funds, will most likely go for one of Ortofon's black cartridges for an upgrade.
Lovely looking turntable. Could spend a lot of time just looking at it.
The RT85 was on my list and I still consider it a great value. However, according to the Fluance specs, the tonearms on the Fluance RT83, RT84 and RT85 have an effective mass of 27.5g - very heavy by current standards. Using Ortofon’s compliance and resonant frequency charts, that makes the factory supplied Ortofon 2M cartridges a poor match for the heavy Fluance tonearms. Compliance and resonant frequency are important to me. A good match with a high compliance cartridge like the 2M Blue or Bronze is better attained with the low mass 8g magnesium tonearm on the Theory.
Incredible value IMO - Acrylic platter, 8g magnesium tonearm, excellent wow and flutter (.07 reported by Fremer), seamless belt, electronic speed change 33/45, solid beautiful wood plinth, 3-year warranty, Ortofon 2M Bronze installed for less than $1200, and made in the USA. Also, world class customer support - as many others have stated.
I upgraded from a direct drive, linear tracking Technics Sl-7 with a Shure V-15 LT and nude Fritz Gyger 5/75um FG2 stylus.
I have about 60 hours on the 2M Bronze and this is my end game turntable - simply an amazing sounding beautiful product.
i still listen to records because in the 90´s when i started to earn more money i bought a expensive component system and started also to buy more cds ,but some of those cds sounded so strange that i used to put the record playing and noticing the far greater superiority of records, guitars sound like guitars ,i´m refering to electric guitars with a pedal to distortion also the level of the tracks in the music on cd the guitars stayed under the level of the voice(and almost didn´t sound like guitars) while in the original record it wasn´t like that and while the cd sound was kind of narrow the vinil was expansive , in 95 the stores in my country capital, Lisbon, closed and after 5 days they open not selling records anymore ,but in the weekend there was a open air market for records ,i filled my 70´s huge mercedes twice and in the last run ,when returning home i had to bring home my friends so only in the bagage area i filled it ,i bought hundreds of records new and sealed and almost spent what today is 60€ or less. there were all companies selling their records including alternative ones ,and they were not like the bad quality of vinil today, i even bought a expensive thorens turntable , i was still using a pioneer belt driven from 1974 that made the records sound much better than cds ,this talking mainly about rock bands like...so many ,also pink floyd ,emerson lake and palmer, king crimson, etc. I can say that i already had the records i liked the most from this last bands i refered but i bought all Lp´s sealed by some cents. in this vinil market ,that still exists today but i saw a tool LP being sold for 150€, don´t get me wrong i have thousands of original cds and a very expensive cd player ,more like 4 CD players, a PD-73 ,a PD-9000 , a PD-S803 from pioneer and being more economical independent at the time i spent a lot of money on a belt driven cd player by CEC or chuodenki (a very known brand for those who were interested in hi-fi in the 70´s)also i bought a DAT recorder which is digital but sounds very good , the cds maybe because of the excessive compression one can´t hear old records converted to digital or even Lp´s released in the 90´s that sound several times better in vinil than it´s cd version. I also think that from this 3 brands of turntables, the Pro-ject, the Rega and the Fluance ,the Fluance being cheaper is for sure the best, the first brand i refer around the cost of 1.000€ sound like ...nothing i had heard till today ,it´s not comparable because they sound so bad, nothing else. The price of turntables are really expensive with no quality at all, why not install a mechnical system to change speed which is done before reading the record,either than this each people have diferent levels of moisture in their hands so a belt excessivelly filled with sweat ,more greasy or not will improve the quality of sound ,this materials that already existed before the turntables they don´t slide with grease ,what about being protected in a box it will make the sound experience bad?that is new to me if one conects a new turntable to a old receiver (maybe 70´s) it will have a hum, i thought that would only happen without ground wire, this because anything new sounds better when conected top a 70´s amplifier or with radio ,a receiver, even new speakers sound really dynamic with old amplifiers. Also people today talk a lot about valves amplifiers having better sound, the only one i own was from my grandfather with a almost 2 meters high pieces of furniture with design in the wooden grill but only 100 watts of power and i still remenber my grandfathers voice "let´s see the birds, after we return and listen to some music" it had to warm up. About metallica i ,when the release of master of puppets , went to a place where they sold records but not much more gambling ,pens ,paper ,tobbaco ,i saw a metallica record i never had seen and when taking it from the stand i notice it was doble ,i bought it when arriving at home something was wrong ,it was the speed it were two maxi-singles ,instead of one LP ,at 45 r.p.m the sound is better , i even started to listen more the old metallica records, a friend of mine stole the picture disc of the ride the lightening in blue ,i had only seen it in green from a friend of mine ,maybe a mistaken colour in that cover, and i bought the picture disc,later i discover that a older friend of mine was his favorite band so i had access to all records released by metallica, i remenber later buying the harvester of sorrow maxi-single after the stupid death of Clif Burton ,he was projected from the bust first floor through the window and in a very leveled green field the only rock km´s around was where he falls with his head into , but returning to the maxi, it had two covers in the b side the prince and breadfun or something like that but it were better than the originals ,maybe you never saw turntables either than this new wave of bad sounding turntables, i bought a technics to a friend of mine for 120€ that to match it one has to spend 14.000€ in a pro-ject turntable and a good cartridge that cost a bit more than 5.000€, only my opinion but i only listened to records for the last 47 years, i also started a radio station ,there was none in my hometown and it is the big district in my country also worked as a dj for 35 years, stoped in 2007
Is the Fluance made in the USA?
Sometimes, nicer built things are just nicer to handle. I bought my first turntable a few months before this model was released. I would have given this one a real close look, as I like locally made stuff as servicing is better, if it was out when I was shopping. I ended up getting a Rega planar 2 over the fluance, simply because my I handled a friends fluance and the stores rega and the tonearm bearing just seemed smoother and better built, also looking at the arm weight on the fluance its a little heavy, and the rega's tonearm is longer too. Ya gotta go with what you want to live with for awhile, from looks to handling.
I think you've drunk Uturn's cool-aid. As you've said, an AB comparison is difficult on turntables, but here you have one with idenical carts, which makes it simple if you have a preamp with TWO switchable phono inputs.
Thanks Randy, shopping for a new deck myself. I gotta say though, removable headshell gonna be very important to me considering the one i have now is not. Obviously if something is good enough to overcome that factor of the equation then…?
I'm always interested in the advancement of entry level audio. Great that you constantly highlight these products. As much as I like the new project turntables and entry level rega models I prefer vintage models live those from pioneer eg the pl12 and 15 and I even bought an AR XB1 turntable.... I need to change the motor as I'm in Australia with different frequency and voltage. Also for years Technics turntables were cheap.....not now lol. A great entry level amp is the Rotel A10
no removable headshell is a non-starter for me. Otherwise pretty interesting
To put things in historical perspective, when I was 13 1975 , I purchased a pioneer PL 12 turntable with an cartridge , it cost 200$ adjusted to inflation in present day that would be about $1200. This is most likely a much better turntable.
I was impressed that this table is american made. So many manufacturers are unable to effectively do that, and just mindlessly ship manufacturing to be done offshore, someplaces. with manufacturing ethics that nobody would really want to be involved with The non removable head shell is a common approach to better tonearm sound, as any break in the mechanical structure sends reflected energy back the wrong way, towards the cartridge. Plus an owner sending this much money on a turntable is probably only running one cartridge anyway. Some enjoy changing cartridges for different records , and enjoy an interchangeable head shell. I would rather have my money concentrated in one superior phone cartridge, since, even with a selection, only one is going to be the best anyway.
I would have enjoyed a little exploration into the main bearing construction , the sonic heart of any turntable , yet so often ignored. Even with identical main platter bearing designs, the care in manufacturing shown on the visible items would have a significant sonic advantage with a better finished bearing, if it was indeed given more care.
Tonearms are often not given a lot of consideration because they come attached to whatever turntable is selected, but they are so very critical to the sound, and should be considered as more than just a whatever item. .
Yeah, and if you really want quiet use CD's. I grew up with some of the finest turntables and stereo equipment as my dad was an audiophile of the highest order. His records sound amazing! However, as soon as compact disc's dropped he bought the best CD player on the market and never looked back. I guess 60 years of pops and hiss were an easy trade for pure unadulterated music. Oh but Vinyl is so much warmer and real, yeah, sure. lol
90% of vinyl is digital, even from the 80's,
enjoy listening to someone ELSE's DAC and amp plus WOW FLUTTER NOISE RUMBLE CLICKS & POPS
This video was informative but comparing a $500 Fluance RT85 to U-Turn's flagship turntable at $1,000 and concluding the U-Turn is better was an expected outcome and not really the most informative comparison.
I think the following turntables that are all cheaper than the U-Turn but more expensive than the Fluance RT85 with specific materials closer to that U-Turn would have been more revealing .
For example Pro-Ject's Debut Carbon EVO. For $600 you get that well-reviewed Pro-Ject carbon fiber tone arm and a more comparable build quality.
Or...
the Rega Planar 2, Music Hall Classic, DUAL CS 518, Thorens TD 201, & Audio Technica's AT-LP7.
These turntables range between $650-$850, well below $1,000 but generally considered a clear step above Fluance.
An average customer considering a turntable at a $1,000 budget may be more inclined to compare this U-Turn with something that's $150-$350 cheaper than dropping down to half the money in my experience.
For example...
Imagine comparing this U-Turn turntable to the Rega Planar 2, now that should be much more intriguing and a more reasonable price difference of approximately $225 which is a lot of money to save with a $1000 turntable budget.
But I have to say that throwing the Pro-Ject Debut Carbon EVO at $600 at this U-Turn would've created a more competitive comparison as well.
Randy appeared a bit out of touch in this video.
Just my opinion.
Theory with the built in Preamp and upgraded 2M Bronze Cartridge in route scheduled to dock this Sat!! Cant wait! First turntable in over 40 years! Its going into a small 12x12 piano/library room and I'll be mating it to a pair of KEF LSX II's. Small Room, Simple system.
Vinyl prices here in Oz are a joke. I worked out that for the price of a decent entry level table with onboard preamp I could buy 10-12 vinyl albums of the music I love. Guess how the same exercise works out for a CDP and the CDs I love ? It would be interesting to add up the 3 options - 12 months of Room+Tidal vs vinyl vs CDs, but I still watch the turntable reviews. Masochist ;)
They don't make them in the US. They ASSEMBLE them in the US. Out of part sourced in Asia. And STILL charge a thousand bucks for them. And no detachable headshell.
A grand seems like its past or at the point of diminishing returns, I mean no matter what table we buy its still gets down to a needle in a groove right-? Record scratches and other deficiencies will still be there but with better fidelity on a better table, and the cartridge and the preamp have the most to do with that ??
Thank you!
Thanks for the review. UTurn offers the bronze cartridge. Would you recommend sticking with the blue or pay extra to upgrade to the bronze?
Nice to see you with another legit sponsor, congrats!
Also, I have a theory: you are a dork, that’s actually my wife’s theory, and it’s about me, ok cya next time!
Interesting info about the Pluto 2 from uturn bring forward in the upper range. I’ve been listening to some of the remastered Cure records on my orbit with 2M blue and thinking there was A LOT of treble. Actually have a mani 2 out for delivery, so I’m excited to see how it affects the sound.
Nice to see some vinyl content again. This looks like a great TT option if its in your budget and I don't think its too expensive to look at for the channel given that vinyl is inherently going to be on the esoteric side of the audiophile spectrum no matter what your budget is. With this though it does look like you do get a lot for your money and its something you'll hold onto for awhile, a comparison to the Technics 1500C would be interesting to see.
Even more interesting to compare it using an external preamp and an SL-100C.
Sounds just like my RT 85 which is half the price
Isn't it 'Magnesum' in the States?😉
How does it compare to the Rega p3? Thanks!
Randy has gone all 'Hollywood', what with his real sponsors and all.....
Fluance rt85 gives a lot of value mainly the ortofon blue. The construction, damping etc is terrible compared to a project in that price point with the same cartridge. $1,000 seems too pricey but this is the second positive review I’ve seen but both seem borderline positive. Trying to convince me $1000 is not a lot. Go watch sky audio’s review which seems similar
Cheapaudioman you are kind of drifting from cheap audio just lately. To be honest for the price of this you could buy a Technics 1210GR if you wait for discounted prices.
i had that system at home but my father never let me use it because of the old type stylus but it was fun to see the ramones records after one side being heard other would fall from what i think it was excessive height it made a sound like PAAAHHHH!!! and then surfin´bird
I would love to see this next to a Project Carbon Evo with a Ortofon 2m Blue.
The tonearm is not the noise contributor. If you had 2 tonearms where the stylus was perfectly aligned in the groove in all dimensions and angles, the difference in surface noise would be a result of the stylus profile. In other words, the actual dimensions and cut of the stylus. Since you are using the same stylis in both cases, the first thing you should do is check the alignment setup on the Fluance, or the wear on the stylus on your FL-83.
New sub! I had a Uturn Orbit Plus. It was a nice turntable but ran alittle fast and there is no way to adjust it and I’d get a hum when switching to Phono. Checked everything and it was ok. Jumped to a Rega P3 and their Neo psu and never looked back. Would I recommend the Uturn? Yes!! It’s a great little turntable
Is a $1000 turntable really cheap audio?
I'd say no.
We went to axpona, so many products there have several more zeros in the price, they would definitely consider this cheap, not that I’d agree but subjectivity is subjective
@@chrisnunya7171 you need a 250$ phono preamp too🤣
Depends on who you ask. I don't mind when Randy talks higher or mid-fi prices...I watch for entertainment value as most of the gear reviewed here is not something I'd put into any of my set ups. Although he gets some good priced gems in to review every once in awhile.
No it's not cheap, but to be fair he does concentrate a lot on cheap 'Chi-Fi' and the same US brands, so it's nice to see something else for a change. To some people they'd consider the Uturn table cheap (not me. just saying)
I would never pay $900 for a turntable! That's just ridiculous.If you still need to pull a rubber band over to a motor then where is the progress??
Rt83 does not have an acrylic platter. Does yours?
No, only the RT85 comes with the acrylic platter
@@les3782 cheapaudioman said he compared to rt85, but also said he used rt83 with 2m blue. but did he also upgrade platter - if not, it is not a comparison to rt85.
I’m not 100% sure, but I think in prior videos he’s said he upgraded to the acrylic platter.
Eh when I upgrade my Orbit it’ll be with a Technics
Tone arm looks like a Rega RB250 with a slightly different pattern on the mounting plate.
What do you think of the Audio-Technica AT-LP120XUSB?
thats cause the other u-turn tables platterr do not have a groove in them why a lot of people complain about belt coming off I do not have a u-turn table but when I saw the first one in a review I knew right away that belt which is rounded not flat will come off ,I been playing with TT's all mt life even I an idiot likw me saw that coming ,there are other TT's out there that use a similar platter but they use a flat belt or have a channel in the platter ,the only thing about the fluance which i do not like is if you open them up they are completly hollow inside there is a motor lots of space and the circuit board and few other things but it is practically empty ,I have seen a lot of reviews for this TT and yes they are a fantastic ,beautifull TT i like how they look but a lot of the reviews say solid wood its wood like but compare it to the u-turn they are solid wood not to mention they are made in china no offense to them but i am sure they are not paying people who work there a lot of money so fluance is making money for a hollow unit they are made better but still hollow and there are other TT's out there made the same way same glossy finish same build and lot of them are cheaper ,so 1000.00 dollars is too high for me if I wanted one but I am into the vintage automatic TT's I work hard all day using manual TT's was getting to be a pain in the ------ so i have sevearl TT's dual 1009 sk,1037 a Garrard at-60 and a Bsr 610 ,and I wanted to prove that stacking the records does not scratch the record remember lead in groove and record label keeps most of surface from touching and remember the music is inside of groove not on top and when record falls on top of another record yes you will hear the record sliding on top of the other but the lead in groove and label !!! also most of scratching is coming from the handler as he unwittingly changes to second side of record as iz saw my father doing when i was younger there is no one out there to teach on how to handle record it is the same if you were using a manual TT u pick up record flip it over place on platter ,well i do the same I grab one or 2 records at a time flipping them carefully place them on top of each other and i am ready to go relax even dose off which i tend to do ,I have tried this on several records I bought used as my test subjects mostly all of them in great condition and been doing this going on 3 years now I checked so far every time i play them so far no scratches ,I did manage to scratch one on the track on begining of a track cause i was using my pro-ject debut 3 manual TT and my stupid hand jerked the tone arm as i was placing it down note [that is what cueing lever is for ]but i have heard all this poop about record stacking TT that they are bad ,baloney the best stacking TT if you want to try it so far to me has been the dual 1009sk and the 1237 models when they drop a record they seem to fall down so effortly and gently that they barely slide when the come down ,I am just trying to prove that there are stackers that do a great job ,the garrad at-60 is a little rough cause of the back lever that tells TT what size record it is but no scratches so far and thats all I will say but that I really like your vids and i have subscribed to your channel you have a fantastic sense of humor its good to watch after a poop filled day at work thanks again JRo
Does it have vta and how much does it weigh?
My problem with U-turn was from the entry level all the way to their most expensive one the tiny round belt always comes off maybe not all the time but you will have issues with it falling off and it was just annoying and they wear out faster because they’re so tiny and round whereas fluence has the flat thicker belt and I’ve never had a problem with my fluence, but now it sounds like they got smart and they’ve added a groove to hold the belt because they were getting a lot of feedback of belt issues and most of the TH-camrs reviewing them were hiding that fact and weren’t being honest that the turntables kept throwing the belts. So I think it’s good they’ve at least updated them now I don’t know if they did all the models or just on the special because it’s the most expensive I hope they add the grooves in the platter to all the models so in my experience the fluence was a better turntable I ended up returning my U-turns I also disagreed that it’s worth twice as much as fluence you might get a little bit more noise I don’t know what your records are like but unless my records are trashed I don’t get any noise on my fluence it rides the waves perfectly with the S shaped tonearm I think it’s a better design also than the straight shaft on the U-turn and with the bamboo finished one and with the noise dampening rubber feet that are adjustable I still think it’s a better turntable for the money but that’s just my opinion. And that’s without even getting into the differences in the wow and flutter which also the fluence is better which you didn’t go into they have a rating that’s supposed to be low on the U-turn but when a lot of TH-camrs tested the speed they were getting various results and I like that the fluence Has the laser scanning motor to make sure it’s more correct with its speed being proper which is another feature the U-turn just doesn’t have for twice the money there wow and flutter can be hit or miss.
I've had an orbit with acrylic platter since day 1 of kickstarter shipping and the only time I've had issues with belt slip was when the original belt was worn and needed to be replaced. if it's slipping throw the belt in a baggy with some talcum powder, shake it up and that should fix it
How does this one stack up against a Technics SL-100C?
Because in terms of pricing, it's not too far off...
Sorry, no removable headshell is a deal breaker for me. Heck, my Rotel from the early 70s has a removable headshell. I question the price without it.