there are so many cons to revealing now with all these evil roles that can kill you just by knowing your role. I also believe Mayor discards any chance to be protected now since their defense cant go above none after revealing so they just become a target and they can only hope there's a lookout or a counter role like bg/crus to punish their killer.
just to note, doom sayer has to guess a specific person's role, not if the role exists or not. but other than that yea thats basically how big of a chad doomsayer really is
I don't mind the insta confirmed roles, cause Ritualist and Doomslayer exist. So it's even more of a risk to reveal, making so you have to be 100% sure one isn't in the game, 100% sure you're getting the best use of your ability, or risk getting killed/lynched, but saving it until the end.
A lot of those easily confirmable roles are listed as Town (Power), as well. I'm guessing there can only be one Power role in the game for each faction, so if there's a Jailor there won't be a Mayor or Monarch in the game.
@@Wyvernil unless amne no longer announces to town, it is also an instant confirm role, but its also a do nothing role that can only be town and like ret and the new coroner, requires you to wait for other town roles to die to actually do anything, though at least coroner can be immediately useful, ret still depends on how many roles it can actually use because ts1 ret can't use half of town.
@@sunjian9818 Dep is TK, Jailor, Mayor, Mon, and Pros are all Town power. Part of why I'm really not a fan of prosecutor is that it's just deputy with the fairly niche buff of being able to stop horsemen. Sure theres more of them now, but outside of four horsemen mode or potential future lists with multiple horsemen on them it's just not a big enough improvement over deputy when it has to compete with the amazingly powerful other town power roles.
Pesty no longer rampages, death is slow and unreliable but with an insane payoff, Famine is faster but with a way worse payoff, War is just an upgraded Jugg. I think Death is the one that can have the biggest swing there and is probably the strongest one, but with prosecutors and deputies firing away during the day, it’s gonna be interesting.
@@CoalanA War is decent because it's just Jugg but he gets invincible defense at max power along with unstoppable attack (so no more getting rekt by a dead trapper or random BG zombie). Death is probably the best of the bunch as with the seemingly slower meta (with ritualist and doomsayer discouraging public claims), death flies totally under the radar until transformation upon which town gets *ONE* try to find them or they instalose, and if there's more than like 6 people still alive that's likely not happening
I do think that removing survivor was a smart move to make, and amne now being a part of town does remove the picking sides part, but GA being gone feels like a loss to me, it was such a unique roll being able to directly help a player even after dying, so I hope it comes back somehow
@@thanoid2373 *town finally proceeds to kill medusa that that one sheriff was pushing all game* Medusa GA: Allow me to introduce myself. Honestly it would be hilarious and chaotic, i love this idea already
The things that struck me the most- One evil faction. I don't mind Maf going away (it was a vestige from the game ToS was modeled from), but now there's just the town faction, the evil faction, and the neutrals. I like having two opposing evil groups that can communicate, it created an interesting dynamic. Information is much worse now. TIs have less info, and revealing is suuuper dangerous without a way to ensure that there isn't a guess-killer. Pretty much, the psy is the only one who can safely reveal. While you noted that there are a lot of easily confirmed town roles now, it's also super dangerous for those townies to use their roles effectively. And it doesn't seem like there are a lot of ways to easily get your info out without putting yourself at risk. I think this is going to depend a lot on the makeup of the classic role list (how many neutrals, how easily confirmed, etc) Evils have a much bigger advantage now, if they get one of the information roles. They can figure out the TPs and TIs pretty easily from the visit info, for example. The pace of the games will be a lot faster now. There are a bunch of new sweepers, and town has a lot more killing power. I'd be surprised if any game lasts more than 10 minutes now.
Whisper meta is going to be a huge thing now, with results/roles only being shared freely amongst people who are confirmed to each other. I expect games to be much more mentally taxing. Looking forward to it though.
My thoughts from what I've seen so far, as someone who admittedly doesn't play a ton of ToS: - I'm really gonna miss BMer, man. Reading whispers I'm normally not able/supposed to see is easily one of my favorite things; while I will miss Mafia, most of their roles have been integrated into the Coven so it's not too bad of a loss. But the whisper-reading doesn't seem to have been carried over from what I saw. :( - On that note, I feel like a lot of the game is gonna be conducted in whispers now to avoid claiming publicly and getting immediately killed by the role-guessing killers. This will make it more difficult of a game for sure, but I'm unsure how I'd like such a change in practice, or if this is how games will really end up going. - I kinda hate the role-guessing killers, I feel like until the neutral spots are outed nobody's gonna claim, as you said. (And what about if they add an All Any gamemode, which I do hope they add? Then you really can't be sure.) They work alright in some games where the focus isn't on sharing very specific role-given info, but ToS right now I feel focuses so heavily on the info TIs get from their roles at night that I feel it runs a bit counter to that spirit. I don't recall if they only get one kill or if they get multiple, though. And maybe I'll come around to them once I get to play ToS2. - I'll also miss Guardian Angel, I do hope they add it in at some point. Having a GA or being a GA is a ton of fun, and I wouldn't mind if I die if my target dies, rather than them having to add Surv back in. I'll miss Medium too; I know a lot of people hate the role and it may not fit the balancing they want for the new game, but I love being able to talk with dead chat and it's a neat role to fake-claim.
Good news: Wildling can read whispers like Bmer now, and Ritualist and Doomsayer can’t guess TIs, so those are safe to claim. Unfortunately GA hasn’t returned, but they’re still updating and reworking as far as I’m aware
@@gamersfinest5319 I heard about that, yeah! Very excited that whisper-reading has made its grand return :D and my worries about Rit/Doomer on the flow of the game have been somewhat assuaged by that change + the switch to VFA as the predominant method of VFR-ing on the player side of things. On GA, the reworked Admirer seems to be its substitute and though it's not the same it's at least somewhat close in spirit. It feels similar to how they adjusted Amnesiac. All we're really missing from my list is Medium now, but unless they shoehorn in dead chat reading to an existing townie's abilities, I'm doubtful it will make a return.
Im pretty sad that they threw the Mafia under the bus. Even though they were replaced with the Apocalypse faction I will miss the Mafia. Now that roles like Forger Ambusher Consort Janitor Framer are now incorporated in the Coven faction it will be very unlikely for Mafia to return. Well not with their previous strength that is
I hope mafia returns as a completly new and remodled faction that they just go crazy with. Like imagine if mafia was able to recruit a town. Or some other crazy role to really bump the deception to a 10
The base mafia killing rules kept the mafia from being interesting. Base Mafia and Godfather took up half of the slots for the ability to stop the mafioso from being redirected, not worth the trade.
I hope there is a DLC with a reworked maf in there. just bring the roles back better, and make it so that other than GF no one exclusively gets a kill button. Like if the consort gets promoted, then they can chose to RB or kill. Sadly it's unlikely unless they think of completly new roles for maf.
Mafia's still around. Forger: Absorbed into Enchanter along with Framer, with Forger's ability being a coin ability with 2 uses, and Framer's ability being the basic ability. Gains a basic attack with Necronomicon Ambusher: Renamed to be Jinx, works the same, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon. Consort: Renamed to be Poisoner, but cannot target the same player twice, has a 1-time use of the Poison ability, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon. Janitor: Renamed to be Medusa, works the same, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon. Mafioso and Godfather: Reworked in the form of Coven Leader, who has a basic attack, and can choose to either gain a powerful attack, or gain basic defense with the Necronomicon. Blackmailer: Renamed to be Voodoo Master, but cannot target the same player twice, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon. Framer: Absorbed into Enchanter along with Forger, with Forger's ability being a coin ability with 2 uses, and Framer's ability being the basic ability. Gains a basic attack with Necronomicon Consigliere: Renamed to be Potion Master, and can choose to protect instead of investigating. Gains a basic attack with Necronomicon. Disguiser: Technically removed, but the ability to make your team members look innocent lives on in the form of Illusionist. The only character that doesn't live on in any way is Hypnotist. No one misses hypnotist. If anything, Mafia has been buffed, that the promotion mechanic is replaced with the abilities as a bonus.
I'd like to see the Investigator and Sheriff role merged into one in the original game. Finds out the player's faction, with some potential for mistakes (e.g. frame/douse/hex, MK that didn't attack that night, SK that hasn't killed yet, WW untransformed)
Faking being good when you're evil is probably one of the more nerve wracking thing to do, especially when you have to work as a team with the mafia, you fear letting down your teammates. So yeah, I'm worried about there being a large amount of townie roles that are instantly confirmed. The better thing is investigator being out because I use to have it memorized what the investigator sees, I started playing in 2014 & did a ton of classic in the beginning because there wasn't much at all going on that long ago so I got investigator a lot & was able to learn what shows up as what but as roles get added or things change around in general, if you're in an all any & you haven't played for a while & there's enough new roles so you don't know what the investigator sees when looking at you, it can be intense trying to think of some good lies. I make it a point to act kinda stupid no matter what role I get, unless I'm jester because acting stupid as jester doesn't get you lynched a lot of the time, but I still use my brain, I'm stupid in presenting where I actually know what I'm doing & faking & when I don't know what to fake, I freak out. Actually, I don't play Among Us that much because I can't fake being innocent when I'm the imposter, I can fake being innocent much easier in ToS when there isn't an investigator or if I get something easy like claiming doc when you're SK, I know vamp was added into that mix making docs seem more suspicious but it was an easy claim as an SK, you still looked a little sus but usually could use that to slide for a little until the town gets too smart. Eh, I just worry, I'm excited but worried. It's been at least a year since I've played the first game so there's probably roles & stuff added in that I have no experience dealing with so I'm going to be very behind on stuff.
Honestly, heres an idea If theres a mayor, no monarch and vice versa If theres a deputy, no prosecutor and vice versa And make admirer unique if it isnt
I had to buy a new computer to play this, which takes a stupid long amount of time to get money for when you only work part time. …hope the game is worth it LOL
@@jenniferlynn120 If that’s what the people want, then sure, but I also know this channel is a bit of a niche since I just talk about the game instead of playing it
in Blood on the Clocktower there is a role kinda like deputy exists, An easily confirmable role... right? well it is if it kills a demon.. but! The slayer has a counter to it however, ANYONE CAN FAKE A SLAYER SHOT! If the slayer shoots a townie, nothing happens, and If a fake slayer shoots anyone. the story teller (This is run by a human host btw) fakes the shot and says nothing happens. Prehaps they could find a way to do this to some of the easily confrimed roles (not mayor) The best way to do this would probably be to put it in the info tabs, to activate a fake version of their role
The thing is, this would be hard to implement for the monarch and judge, since they effect voting. The monarch is definitely the worst in this case, because it just gives someone an extra vote. The deputy maybe could have something like that, but for the others, it is basically impossible without being discovered relatively quickly.
Tbh, I'm not really that excited. Speaking as someone who played the original ToS for 6 years. I kinda got burned out, I even unsubscribed from Pipe because the videos were starting to feel repetitive. TiS was a flop and it really feels like these Social Deduction games are a dime a dozen. That being said, I will probably try it, and I hope it turns out good
The only thing I kinda hope they add is a unique message for whether someone decides to disconnect intentionally or not. Like if they leave the game manually it says they gave up and if they had something like a internet issue that forces a DC it says so. It would make it easier to tell whether or not someone is gone throwing on purpose or not.
I’m seeing a lot of people missing the *Guardian Angel*, and I agree, it’s really fun to both play as and to have. I propose an alternative, however. Change the *Admirer* to a *Neutral* role that’s a combination of the *Guardian Angel* and the new *Executioner* (the target picking part). You get a random target (maybe chosen, depends on how it balances), a crush if you will, every night. During the day, you must propose to your crush and, if they accept, it will publicly announce that you have become *Lovers* and the *Admirer* will become what I’ll call the *Betrothed*, however your *Lover*’s role is revealed to you and only you. If they don’t accept, it’ll randomly choose another crush for tomorrow (though I doubt that anyone would reject you since they would get a free teammate). After successfully becoming *Lovers* with someone, your goal then becomes getting them to survive until the end at all costs, even your own life. If they die however, you’ll die of heartbreak at the same time as they die. To ensure your *Lover*’s survival, you can use some form of protection (I don’t know what to call it though) and it will save them from any harmful abilities that activate that night/the immediate next day. Or maybe instead of protection, you can have an ability called *Avenge* that attacks anyone who attacks your target that night/the immediate next day but doesn’t protect them, it just makes people less likely to attack them even if you lose. To sum it up, I’d say change the *Admirer* to a *Neutral* role who’s initial goal is to become *Lovers* with someone, then transform into the *Betrothed* and protect your *Lover* at all costs. You have the ability to either *Protect* your *Lover* or *Avenge* your *Lover* (whatever you guys like more), with *Protect* saving your target from harmful abilities that happen to your *Lover* that night or the next day, and *Avenge* killing anyone who attacks your target, but doesn’t save them from dying (both can be used from the grave). You win if you become *Lovers* with someone and then keep them safe all game, no matter if you are alive or dead or even if your *Lover* wins. As long as their alive, you win. I don’t know if this is balanced, so if you find anything that’s too strong or too weak, feel free to change it in the replies. This is just to give you an idea on how we could change this role. There are plenty of other roles I think should get changed, but this one was the clearest so I decided to write it down.
I think most insta confirmed roles are balanced out through doomsayer and the fact that most of these roles die if they kill a town member. Prosecutor and deputy both have one shot at killing an evil and them and a town member die if they are wrong. Plus, prosecutor uses up a towns voting time, making it practically cancel out. Survivor being gone is huge as now evils will actually have to try and fake claim something interesting for once. I’m mad amnesiac isn’t a true neutral role though, as it works much better as being to remember anything (besides the apocalypse roles, that would be too broken). I actually enjoy mafia being gone, as it’s Salem, it’s supposed to be a coven. The cl change is kinda weird, but I appreciate it. I like the idea of choosing what you want, but powerful attack doesn’t seem terrible useful when you realize most roles don’t have basic defense, but almost all have invincible. I definitely think balancing will need to happen around this, but overall it seems like a much more skillful game.
I mean, mafia roles were really problematic, framer, disg, and hypnos are notorious for leaving n1, getting rid of maf by converting some mafia roles into coven is more healthy, coven looks to have a lot of unique roles to play with, also having 2 major (not mentioning vamps which are also cut?) evil factions in one game is a bit much, limiting it to one major faction is more balanced
@@Cringe89563 not included in the announcement trailer, but we’re also allowed to tell y’all that vampires are getting their own mode in the future! So not entirely removed! 😄
@@Cringe89563 I’m fine with them removing those three roles in particular, it’s just that consig was my favorite role and there was nothing more satisfying than getting a clean win with a good tram of mafia. I’m going to be sad, even if it’s for the better…
I hope they have a game review option after the game is over so they can see what all the coven members and apocalypse members told eachother and what people visited and what was in their wills.
with how dangerous investigation roles are becoming the extra confirmed roles are necessary for town to actually have some cohesion. it buys time for the information roles to work, until they are ready to pull the trigger.
Town Investigative roles are looking like the new Mafia Support; massive liabilities because of unforeseen consequences with adding the new Guesser roles (filched from other social deduction games) to the game. I predict games will come down to shootouts of high end role powers vs deduction and misdirection. And I'm not terribly confident this will improve the metagame over TOS1 Ranked once the novelty wears out, but I'm willing to have my suspicions be proven wrong.
Honestly, I like that sheriff just can now see all evils, but invest got a HUGE nerf. you have to investigate someone the night that (or the night after, im not sure which) they kill someone. that means if the sk kills someone, gets jailed and then rbd the night after (or just decide not to kill), their hands show up clean. (If i am misunderstanding this please correct me.) tracker and psychic work similarly to TOS1 so I like that. (yes pychic now visits, but still basically the same results)
Monarch is actually kinda neat. Another youtuber posted a video where a monarch was stoned N1, and the necromancer knighted a player and got away claiming monarch for the rest of the game.
ToS will always have a place in my game library. I credit the game with helping me to argue down a false accusation made by a stranger that accused me of a serious crime when I was out for a run. If I never had this game to show me how an accusatory asshole with a bullshit claim thinks; my life could have been so much more unnecessarily complicated.
It seems like this game has mainly made claiming to everyone much riskier, so now it’s gonna be much more of a whispering to people you trust type of thing which leads to way more social deception, which is awesome
ToS 2 truly feels like a turnbased rpg battle between town powers and coven roles where a role gets instaconfirmed and maybe kills and evil but then just gets killed. Claiming is hard but not even necessary since you can just easily kill claimers
Pretty sure they'll make the admirer ability hidden from the town. Like only the targets get notified if they get proposed to. That would make the role public to the town if ever the proposed declares it to the town. But the target can be evil so that might screw the town or coven (mostly coven) if the proposal was accepted by a coven member. I see hex masters and jesters not accepting the proposal ever since their abilities don't synergize with the admirer. Meanwhile, neutral killings would fare better with an known extra teammate at their side. It's interesting what happens if the lover was one of the neutral evils though. What happens to the admirer if the target (not jester) leaves the town after winning?
@@Sentralkontrol Yeah... That was sad. I just watched it happen and had to go back here. It was stupid. The admirer basically paints a target on both lovers and gives evils an extra kill. Very stupid. They should change the alignment to Town (Sabotage) instead of Town (Support).
I mean, these instareveal roles die soon thanks to the doomsayer and ritualist so it's not gonna be that big of a problem I reckon they are good target for horsemen too and stuff like that so I don't think they are gonna be op
Hold on… there’s a problem not many people are noticing; coven roles can just see what roles are, so if the PM sees what somebody’s role is, then the Ritualistic can just do their role… that’s broken.
I don't think 'walk away from the town in victory' means literally just exiting the game on the spot. I think it means when the game is officially over, you 'walk away' with a victory. So, whether you die, quit the game, or keep messing around until the end, you 'walk away' with a win regardless. At least that's how I see it. Just forcefully being removed from a game feels weird and I don't think it works.
I hate that they get rid of neutral benigns, I hope they bring them back for custom games or fun modes. The argument that they being kingmakers and therefor making game unfair is stupid. The game in itself is one big ball of chaos, and not the destination but the journey, the plot twists in it that happens is what makes it fun for me, the unexpectancy(or whatever that means). Yes that argument is metal solid on the ranked or competitive play, however there is always people that play for the fun of it, the chaos, the unexpectancy. No game is fun if there is no chaos in itself. and the opposite is also true. No game is fun if there is no order in itself. We just do not know where to draw the line. And also the line that is supposed to be drawn changes depending on the person. But getting entirely rid of kingmakers and chaos team in ToS is in my opinion, a very- very- bad decision. (Btw usually the oppressed is heard out, like people who hate kingmakers and want them got ridden, but to speak for myself personally, I love them.)
I am interested in the apocalypse roles, I did like plaguebearer in the original game, but I do think that they might be slightly overtuned, with two of them pretty much wiping the town as soon as they show up.
Death is gonna be the biggest swing ball. Famine is gonna be rather bad imo. You don’t kill any of the three bread holders, and just make sure that you’ll be the last one at n7. Which is soooo slow and honestly awful considering 3 other players will be alive to find you. War is just upgraded jugg. It takes one less kill and you get invincible defence instead of powerful. Good change for a role notorious for its lack of feeling. Pesty (for now) lost their rampage! That kind of kills their kill potential, even if town wouldn’t dare move until pesty was out. They still kill anyone visiting them.
I think Pipe made a good comment on Death. It punishes passive town. If you do nothing, then they'll pop up, and you simply don't have the information to find them. Its similar to what Arso would allow previously
@@solarstorm5242 Pest now has permanent self rampage though, but it could probably do with an SK bloody will-esque effect to not accidentally out yourself if a TI or tavern keep finds you
I feel like the part where you mentioned insta-confirms being problematic for fake claiming is a non-issue, because first off, ritualist, conjurer and doomsayer exist, and 2nd, it means there are MORE possibilities for fake claiming, because more townies are insta-confirms therefore you will have less counter claims for the roles that arent insta confirms
Couple problems I don’t like. Mafia being gone is one of the things I missed seeing. Admirer role looks pretty useless for town since if either of you dies the other one dies and it reveals the other persons role which means free ritualist kill. Ambusher was one of my favorite maf roles. Pretty disappointed
The removed Guardian Angel completely :( Edit: Yeah I know they removed surv to remove kingmakers but there were other things they could have done, like giving more protects and having GA die if their target dies, yeah I know it's harsh but
I don’t think the confirmed roles will be much of an issue has half of it is town power so they will be limited, not to mention the guesser roles. Overall I am super excited as I loved the OG TOS but don’t play it as much as I’d like. Baker (Town Apocalypse) is also hilarious to read.
While Ill certainly play ToS2. loved 1, but one thing I do not like at all and I hope it changes or players can change it themselves is how everything is in different colors. I have watched pipes videos about ToS 2 and following chat or anything is nightmare at least for me, because icons and different colors. I just want similar to ToS1, because its way easier to follow for me.
TIs will either need to start claiming fake TI claims to push their info, or they'll need to strictly control the number of true public claims. And once you get a confirmed TI or Jailor, that person needs to become the nexus of the investigative effort. With no BMer anymore, whispering is 100% going to be the currency.
My biggest problem so far with ToS2 is that Admirer is allowed to exist at all. You instantly confirm yourself and either instantly confirm another townie or instantly out an evil. "9 accept my proposal or you're evil" if they decline, it's publicly announced to everyone. if they accept, depending on how it works, it's either announced to everyone or you can just say "9 is (insert role here)" Far too strong.
@@Dr_Xewwer but would they do that? Its based on the Salem “Witch” Trials, the mafia became the og evil bcuz of the irl game mafia (I think), so now the game is more original without maf
I dislike what they did to the role list mostly Mafia and GA being removed but also Amne becoming a town role aside from the roles I like the rest of the game still GA being removed hurts me the most as I love playing GA I hope GA comes back or the rest of the game makes up for it but TOS 2 should be fun no matter what.
The lord possibilities for the abilities can make much more sense Blackmailing didn't make sense. You're about to get lynched. The blackmailer releasing the fact that you slept with the consort instead of doing your job doesn't matter. A voodoo master using a voodoo doll to see your mouth shut so you can't speak is WAY better There are many other "ability possible lore" examples where these roles make 50x more sense than the old roles, but I would be posting paragraphs to explain them all. The blackmailer was the worst offender though.
As a tester, i love that there are more day abilities.And yea, retri dupes now.They added new neutrals which i like, especially i like the four horsemen mode.Heres what i dont like:coven is…overpowered.Atleast CL who does nothing without necronomicon and always takes in beginning of game kinda fixes this.Coroner is….underpowered as hell.
Survivor might have been good to keep as a rare role, it can still be important to have not only skill, but the charisma to get another neutral player to side with you, although maybe it would have to be tweaked a little bit.
I'm kinda mixed about no medium since why not just, leave asap unless your team still is in the game?, gives uneeded info if there was a role to keep you around that could be useful like a cultist role that allows you to kill a member and silently replace them with a dead person [but they join the cultist faction] like old disg And no mafia? I get it but also damn helped add to the chaos of CAA and ik classic should be the main focus but :/
Adagia does the match making include NKs or is that just for the 4 horseman mode? I do not think I will be too interested in a 1 team vs 1 team dynamic. All chaos is removed in that situation then evils auto win as soon as they have majority.
Not sure how to feel about possibly just dying because you claim what you are, that seems way too strong imo and stifles information sharing which only helps evils. Personally I think BMG went a bit too heavy on nerfing town in this regard.
I dislike the invest rework honestly, but that's also cause I don't really like a lot of the new TI reworks. Jailor is way too nerfed imo, and NEs leaving kinda takes out the fun of playing NE (at least for me)
I dislike the fact they killed Neutral evils fun kinda they really remove ga I hope to see you its return I think we should put it in ac to nb but you have basic defense vfr still did not die a lot they did a little bit but only a bit The apocalypse faction just seems like a replacement of mafia pretty unique idea but Still there are a lot of good things in this this is my current thoughts let’s hear from everyone else
Everyone is taking abortion the new TOS2 roles and how they will change the game. I am thinking of all the new Jester plays you can make in TOS2 to get lynched.
This game is gonna be great, Surv is GONE, Investigator results are GONE, kingmakers in general are mostly GONE (Late game Exe). I think Spy’s change is good, Psychics rework is SO much better. I personally think the investigator results removal was for the sake of Ritualist and Doomsayer to be harder, though I’m not a fan of the edition because of how it could make TI have no leads, I welcome the edition anyways. I personally think the confirmable town roles are there to balance the chaotic nature of neutrals, and the confusion of more impactful Coven (Deception)as well. Mayor is good, Monarch can be good when used right so it’s good(though I think it could be like Marshall in modded where Mayor and Monarch are never in the same game), Deputy is a day phase vigi which is ok, Prosecutor is fine but slightly obsolete to Deputy, and Admirer I think should be the one that gets a rework. The Admirer (if this is not the case already) can have the lovers side effect like in coven expansion where if one dies the other dies, not only would this make the Admirer’s ability more risky, the rejection would be more justified if a Monarch or TI doesn’t want to easily die. I think Lovers could also come back as a custom modifier. Overall hype.
I don’t work for BMG- I was given a key to download the game in February and access to a discord server where the developers took feedback and posted game updates. Any knowledge I have comes from there, and we weren’t allowed to talk about it publicly until today :)
> Shows up to town
> "Mayor, Prosecutor, Jailor"
> they all die instantly
> leaves town
Doomsayer is truly the gigachad of ToS2
Lmao imagine I'm not sure Doomsayer can target revealed mayors tho
@@Mattyzer0 they can there wasn’t anything saying that doomsayer can’t target them
doomsayer? more like doomslayer
there are so many cons to revealing now with all these evil roles that can kill you just by knowing your role. I also believe Mayor discards any chance to be protected now since their defense cant go above none after revealing so they just become a target and they can only hope there's a lookout or a counter role like bg/crus to punish their killer.
just to note, doom sayer has to guess a specific person's role, not if the role exists or not. but other than that yea thats basically how big of a chad doomsayer really is
I don't mind the insta confirmed roles, cause Ritualist and Doomslayer exist. So it's even more of a risk to reveal, making so you have to be 100% sure one isn't in the game, 100% sure you're getting the best use of your ability, or risk getting killed/lynched, but saving it until the end.
it is a strong balance
A lot of those easily confirmable roles are listed as Town (Power), as well. I'm guessing there can only be one Power role in the game for each faction, so if there's a Jailor there won't be a Mayor or Monarch in the game.
@@Wyvernil Maybe if Jailor, no Dep or Pros. And if Mayor no Mon.
@@Wyvernil unless amne no longer announces to town, it is also an instant confirm role, but its also a do nothing role that can only be town and like ret and the new coroner, requires you to wait for other town roles to die to actually do anything, though at least coroner can be immediately useful, ret still depends on how many roles it can actually use because ts1 ret can't use half of town.
@@sunjian9818 Dep is TK, Jailor, Mayor, Mon, and Pros are all Town power. Part of why I'm really not a fan of prosecutor is that it's just deputy with the fairly niche buff of being able to stop horsemen. Sure theres more of them now, but outside of four horsemen mode or potential future lists with multiple horsemen on them it's just not a big enough improvement over deputy when it has to compete with the amazingly powerful other town power roles.
The four horsemen of the apocalypse are so badass they're probably the roles I'm looking forward to the most
They're very underpowered tbf
Pesty no longer rampages, death is slow and unreliable but with an insane payoff, Famine is faster but with a way worse payoff, War is just an upgraded Jugg. I think Death is the one that can have the biggest swing there and is probably the strongest one, but with prosecutors and deputies firing away during the day, it’s gonna be interesting.
@@CoalanA Famine look the worse, you're stuck to wait 2-3 day in a very limited pool of suspect. They are going to hang you for sure.
@@CoalanA War is decent because it's just Jugg but he gets invincible defense at max power along with unstoppable attack (so no more getting rekt by a dead trapper or random BG zombie). Death is probably the best of the bunch as with the seemingly slower meta (with ritualist and doomsayer discouraging public claims), death flies totally under the radar until transformation upon which town gets *ONE* try to find them or they instalose, and if there's more than like 6 people still alive that's likely not happening
bread
I do think that removing survivor was a smart move to make, and amne now being a part of town does remove the picking sides part, but GA being gone feels like a loss to me, it was such a unique roll being able to directly help a player even after dying, so I hope it comes back somehow
Amne also now auto remembers the first possible night so uh, have fun with that forced BG who left because yknow, BG
Amnesiac change is disappointing if this is true, lacks all fun and character
GA should now become their targets role when they die since surv got nuked, imagine hanging death only for their GA to become the horseman
Survivor was boring and unhealthy for the game.
Amne should be able to choose which role to remember even if it is only town.
@@thanoid2373 *town finally proceeds to kill medusa that that one sheriff was pushing all game*
Medusa GA: Allow me to introduce myself.
Honestly it would be hilarious and chaotic, i love this idea already
The things that struck me the most-
One evil faction. I don't mind Maf going away (it was a vestige from the game ToS was modeled from), but now there's just the town faction, the evil faction, and the neutrals. I like having two opposing evil groups that can communicate, it created an interesting dynamic.
Information is much worse now. TIs have less info, and revealing is suuuper dangerous without a way to ensure that there isn't a guess-killer. Pretty much, the psy is the only one who can safely reveal.
While you noted that there are a lot of easily confirmed town roles now, it's also super dangerous for those townies to use their roles effectively. And it doesn't seem like there are a lot of ways to easily get your info out without putting yourself at risk. I think this is going to depend a lot on the makeup of the classic role list (how many neutrals, how easily confirmed, etc)
Evils have a much bigger advantage now, if they get one of the information roles. They can figure out the TPs and TIs pretty easily from the visit info, for example.
The pace of the games will be a lot faster now. There are a bunch of new sweepers, and town has a lot more killing power. I'd be surprised if any game lasts more than 10 minutes now.
there's also apocalypse faction, if it counts as a faction idk
I think it does, but they don't know each other or communicate at night
@@Moleoflands i thought there was only one apocalypse per game
@@rogerphone481 their is. But their is also a 4 Horsemen Mode with The 4 horsmen vs Town
Whisper meta is going to be a huge thing now, with results/roles only being shared freely amongst people who are confirmed to each other. I expect games to be much more mentally taxing. Looking forward to it though.
My thoughts from what I've seen so far, as someone who admittedly doesn't play a ton of ToS:
- I'm really gonna miss BMer, man. Reading whispers I'm normally not able/supposed to see is easily one of my favorite things; while I will miss Mafia, most of their roles have been integrated into the Coven so it's not too bad of a loss. But the whisper-reading doesn't seem to have been carried over from what I saw. :(
- On that note, I feel like a lot of the game is gonna be conducted in whispers now to avoid claiming publicly and getting immediately killed by the role-guessing killers. This will make it more difficult of a game for sure, but I'm unsure how I'd like such a change in practice, or if this is how games will really end up going.
- I kinda hate the role-guessing killers, I feel like until the neutral spots are outed nobody's gonna claim, as you said. (And what about if they add an All Any gamemode, which I do hope they add? Then you really can't be sure.) They work alright in some games where the focus isn't on sharing very specific role-given info, but ToS right now I feel focuses so heavily on the info TIs get from their roles at night that I feel it runs a bit counter to that spirit. I don't recall if they only get one kill or if they get multiple, though. And maybe I'll come around to them once I get to play ToS2.
- I'll also miss Guardian Angel, I do hope they add it in at some point. Having a GA or being a GA is a ton of fun, and I wouldn't mind if I die if my target dies, rather than them having to add Surv back in. I'll miss Medium too; I know a lot of people hate the role and it may not fit the balancing they want for the new game, but I love being able to talk with dead chat and it's a neat role to fake-claim.
Good news: Wildling can read whispers like Bmer now, and Ritualist and Doomsayer can’t guess TIs, so those are safe to claim. Unfortunately GA hasn’t returned, but they’re still updating and reworking as far as I’m aware
@@gamersfinest5319 I heard about that, yeah! Very excited that whisper-reading has made its grand return :D and my worries about Rit/Doomer on the flow of the game have been somewhat assuaged by that change + the switch to VFA as the predominant method of VFR-ing on the player side of things.
On GA, the reworked Admirer seems to be its substitute and though it's not the same it's at least somewhat close in spirit. It feels similar to how they adjusted Amnesiac.
All we're really missing from my list is Medium now, but unless they shoehorn in dead chat reading to an existing townie's abilities, I'm doubtful it will make a return.
Im pretty sad that they threw the Mafia under the bus. Even though they were replaced with the Apocalypse faction I will miss the Mafia. Now that roles like Forger Ambusher Consort Janitor Framer are now incorporated in the Coven faction it will be very unlikely for Mafia to return. Well not with their previous strength that is
I hope mafia returns as a completly new and remodled faction that they just go crazy with. Like imagine if mafia was able to recruit a town. Or some other crazy role to really bump the deception to a 10
The base mafia killing rules kept the mafia from being interesting. Base Mafia and Godfather took up half of the slots for the ability to stop the mafioso from being redirected, not worth the trade.
I mean, if you watched the top 5 worst roles video, you can probably see why the maf was removed
I hope there is a DLC with a reworked maf in there. just bring the roles back better, and make it so that other than GF no one exclusively gets a kill button. Like if the consort gets promoted, then they can chose to RB or kill. Sadly it's unlikely unless they think of completly new roles for maf.
Mafia's still around.
Forger: Absorbed into Enchanter along with Framer, with Forger's ability being a coin ability with 2 uses, and Framer's ability being the basic ability. Gains a basic attack with Necronomicon
Ambusher: Renamed to be Jinx, works the same, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon.
Consort: Renamed to be Poisoner, but cannot target the same player twice, has a 1-time use of the Poison ability, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon.
Janitor: Renamed to be Medusa, works the same, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon.
Mafioso and Godfather: Reworked in the form of Coven Leader, who has a basic attack, and can choose to either gain a powerful attack, or gain basic defense with the Necronomicon.
Blackmailer: Renamed to be Voodoo Master, but cannot target the same player twice, gains a basic attack with Necronomicon.
Framer: Absorbed into Enchanter along with Forger, with Forger's ability being a coin ability with 2 uses, and Framer's ability being the basic ability. Gains a basic attack with Necronomicon
Consigliere: Renamed to be Potion Master, and can choose to protect instead of investigating. Gains a basic attack with Necronomicon.
Disguiser: Technically removed, but the ability to make your team members look innocent lives on in the form of Illusionist.
The only character that doesn't live on in any way is Hypnotist. No one misses hypnotist.
If anything, Mafia has been buffed, that the promotion mechanic is replaced with the abilities as a bonus.
I'd like to see the Investigator and Sheriff role merged into one in the original game. Finds out the player's faction, with some potential for mistakes (e.g. frame/douse/hex, MK that didn't attack that night, SK that hasn't killed yet, WW untransformed)
Pipe will definitely kill you on sight depending on his role. Looking forward to your battles in Town of Salem 2!
Faking being good when you're evil is probably one of the more nerve wracking thing to do, especially when you have to work as a team with the mafia, you fear letting down your teammates. So yeah, I'm worried about there being a large amount of townie roles that are instantly confirmed. The better thing is investigator being out because I use to have it memorized what the investigator sees, I started playing in 2014 & did a ton of classic in the beginning because there wasn't much at all going on that long ago so I got investigator a lot & was able to learn what shows up as what but as roles get added or things change around in general, if you're in an all any & you haven't played for a while & there's enough new roles so you don't know what the investigator sees when looking at you, it can be intense trying to think of some good lies. I make it a point to act kinda stupid no matter what role I get, unless I'm jester because acting stupid as jester doesn't get you lynched a lot of the time, but I still use my brain, I'm stupid in presenting where I actually know what I'm doing & faking & when I don't know what to fake, I freak out. Actually, I don't play Among Us that much because I can't fake being innocent when I'm the imposter, I can fake being innocent much easier in ToS when there isn't an investigator or if I get something easy like claiming doc when you're SK, I know vamp was added into that mix making docs seem more suspicious but it was an easy claim as an SK, you still looked a little sus but usually could use that to slide for a little until the town gets too smart. Eh, I just worry, I'm excited but worried. It's been at least a year since I've played the first game so there's probably roles & stuff added in that I have no experience dealing with so I'm going to be very behind on stuff.
Honestly, heres an idea
If theres a mayor, no monarch and vice versa
If theres a deputy, no prosecutor and vice versa
And make admirer unique if it isnt
I hope there can be only one neutral apocalypse per game
@@franciscomelon4159 I think in a classic game it’s 1 apocalypse but in the 4 horseman mode it’s town vs all 4 apocalypse roles
@@360mew9 that’s what I thought, cuz three NA (neutral apocalypse) in one “classic” game would be kinda crazy
@@franciscomelon4159 I believe it is. I think Tuba Antics's video covers that.
Mayor who is knighted would be broken
I had to buy a new computer to play this, which takes a stupid long amount of time to get money for when you only work part time.
…hope the game is worth it LOL
Does that mean…. Maybe some gameplay videos?? (I’m just dreaming over here don’t mind me lol).
@@jenniferlynn120 If that’s what the people want, then sure, but I also know this channel is a bit of a niche since I just talk about the game instead of playing it
@@AdagiaI would %100 watch gameplay vids
@@Adagia I would 1000% watch gameplay videos
@@Adagia I would 100000000 percent watch gameplay videos.
I hope its availible on mobile
in Blood on the Clocktower there is a role kinda like deputy exists, An easily confirmable role... right? well it is if it kills a demon.. but!
The slayer has a counter to it however, ANYONE CAN FAKE A SLAYER SHOT! If the slayer shoots a townie, nothing happens, and If a fake slayer shoots anyone. the story teller (This is run by a human host btw) fakes the shot and says nothing happens.
Prehaps they could find a way to do this to some of the easily confrimed roles (not mayor)
The best way to do this would probably be to put it in the info tabs, to activate a fake version of their role
The thing is, this would be hard to implement for the monarch and judge, since they effect voting. The monarch is definitely the worst in this case, because it just gives someone an extra vote. The deputy maybe could have something like that, but for the others, it is basically impossible without being discovered relatively quickly.
Rest in peace, survivor, i will miss you...
I can't believe the game comes out 1 day before my birthday. That's one heck of a birthday gift!
It's the day after mine
Tbh, I'm not really that excited. Speaking as someone who played the original ToS for 6 years. I kinda got burned out, I even unsubscribed from Pipe because the videos were starting to feel repetitive. TiS was a flop and it really feels like these Social Deduction games are a dime a dozen. That being said, I will probably try it, and I hope it turns out good
Super excited to see how this'll play out. This game seems super exciting and chaotic, even if you lose it'll be a lot of fun to see!
The only thing I kinda hope they add is a unique message for whether someone decides to disconnect intentionally or not. Like if they leave the game manually it says they gave up and if they had something like a internet issue that forces a DC it says so. It would make it easier to tell whether or not someone is gone throwing on purpose or not.
I dont like that they got rid of the mafia I liked having more then one faction :(
I’m seeing a lot of people missing the *Guardian Angel*, and I agree, it’s really fun to both play as and to have. I propose an alternative, however. Change the *Admirer* to a *Neutral* role that’s a combination of the *Guardian Angel* and the new *Executioner* (the target picking part). You get a random target (maybe chosen, depends on how it balances), a crush if you will, every night. During the day, you must propose to your crush and, if they accept, it will publicly announce that you have become *Lovers* and the *Admirer* will become what I’ll call the *Betrothed*, however your *Lover*’s role is revealed to you and only you. If they don’t accept, it’ll randomly choose another crush for tomorrow (though I doubt that anyone would reject you since they would get a free teammate). After successfully becoming *Lovers* with someone, your goal then becomes getting them to survive until the end at all costs, even your own life. If they die however, you’ll die of heartbreak at the same time as they die. To ensure your *Lover*’s survival, you can use some form of protection (I don’t know what to call it though) and it will save them from any harmful abilities that activate that night/the immediate next day. Or maybe instead of protection, you can have an ability called *Avenge* that attacks anyone who attacks your target that night/the immediate next day but doesn’t protect them, it just makes people less likely to attack them even if you lose.
To sum it up, I’d say change the *Admirer* to a *Neutral* role who’s initial goal is to become *Lovers* with someone, then transform into the *Betrothed* and protect your *Lover* at all costs. You have the ability to either *Protect* your *Lover* or *Avenge* your *Lover* (whatever you guys like more), with *Protect* saving your target from harmful abilities that happen to your *Lover* that night or the next day, and *Avenge* killing anyone who attacks your target, but doesn’t save them from dying (both can be used from the grave). You win if you become *Lovers* with someone and then keep them safe all game, no matter if you are alive or dead or even if your *Lover* wins. As long as their alive, you win.
I don’t know if this is balanced, so if you find anything that’s too strong or too weak, feel free to change it in the replies. This is just to give you an idea on how we could change this role. There are plenty of other roles I think should get changed, but this one was the clearest so I decided to write it down.
I think most insta confirmed roles are balanced out through doomsayer and the fact that most of these roles die if they kill a town member. Prosecutor and deputy both have one shot at killing an evil and them and a town member die if they are wrong. Plus, prosecutor uses up a towns voting time, making it practically cancel out. Survivor being gone is huge as now evils will actually have to try and fake claim something interesting for once. I’m mad amnesiac isn’t a true neutral role though, as it works much better as being to remember anything (besides the apocalypse roles, that would be too broken). I actually enjoy mafia being gone, as it’s Salem, it’s supposed to be a coven. The cl change is kinda weird, but I appreciate it. I like the idea of choosing what you want, but powerful attack doesn’t seem terrible useful when you realize most roles don’t have basic defense, but almost all have invincible. I definitely think balancing will need to happen around this, but overall it seems like a much more skillful game.
I think it’s cool, but I miss the mafia :(
I mean, mafia roles were really problematic, framer, disg, and hypnos are notorious for leaving n1, getting rid of maf by converting some mafia roles into coven is more healthy, coven looks to have a lot of unique roles to play with, also having 2 major (not mentioning vamps which are also cut?) evil factions in one game is a bit much, limiting it to one major faction is more balanced
@@Cringe89563 not included in the announcement trailer, but we’re also allowed to tell y’all that vampires are getting their own mode in the future! So not entirely removed! 😄
@Adagia Vamps can never die I swear, they even added their own mode for the buggers to include them
@@Cringe89563 I’m fine with them removing those three roles in particular, it’s just that consig was my favorite role and there was nothing more satisfying than getting a clean win with a good tram of mafia. I’m going to be sad, even if it’s for the better…
@@albinocatAt least PM and witch now fill the void of consig
I hope they have a game review option after the game is over so they can see what all the coven members and apocalypse members told eachother and what people visited and what was in their wills.
I don't think I'll ever truly abandon coven all any in town of Salem 1 but if ToS 2 all any is fun I'm willing to play it some.
with how dangerous investigation roles are becoming the extra confirmed roles are necessary for town to actually have some cohesion. it buys time for the information roles to work, until they are ready to pull the trigger.
Town Investigative roles are looking like the new Mafia Support; massive liabilities because of unforeseen consequences with adding the new Guesser roles (filched from other social deduction games) to the game.
I predict games will come down to shootouts of high end role powers vs deduction and misdirection.
And I'm not terribly confident this will improve the metagame over TOS1 Ranked once the novelty wears out, but I'm willing to have my suspicions be proven wrong.
Honestly, I like that sheriff just can now see all evils, but invest got a HUGE nerf. you have to investigate someone the night that (or the night after, im not sure which) they kill someone. that means if the sk kills someone, gets jailed and then rbd the night after (or just decide not to kill), their hands show up clean. (If i am misunderstanding this please correct me.) tracker and psychic work similarly to TOS1 so I like that. (yes pychic now visits, but still basically the same results)
Oh, and spy is almost uslesss unless you get lucky enough to go on someone bmd, doused, dreamwoven, infected, and (maybe) attacked and has defence
Monarch is actually kinda neat. Another youtuber posted a video where a monarch was stoned N1, and the necromancer knighted a player and got away claiming monarch for the rest of the game.
I wanna play Town of Salem 2 as soon as possible.
ToS will always have a place in my game library. I credit the game with helping me to argue down a false accusation made by a stranger that accused me of a serious crime when I was out for a run. If I never had this game to show me how an accusatory asshole with a bullshit claim thinks; my life could have been so much more unnecessarily complicated.
It seems like this game has mainly made claiming to everyone much riskier, so now it’s gonna be much more of a whispering to people you trust type of thing which leads to way more social deception, which is awesome
ToS 2 truly feels like a turnbased rpg battle between town powers and coven roles where a role gets instaconfirmed and maybe kills and evil but then just gets killed. Claiming is hard but not even necessary since you can just easily kill claimers
This is the biggest fucking nuke I have gotten in my life
Pretty sure they'll make the admirer ability hidden from the town. Like only the targets get notified if they get proposed to. That would make the role public to the town if ever the proposed declares it to the town. But the target can be evil so that might screw the town or coven (mostly coven) if the proposal was accepted by a coven member. I see hex masters and jesters not accepting the proposal ever since their abilities don't synergize with the admirer. Meanwhile, neutral killings would fare better with an known extra teammate at their side.
It's interesting what happens if the lover was one of the neutral evils though. What happens to the admirer if the target (not jester) leaves the town after winning?
Naw it’s announced
@@Sentralkontrol Yeah... That was sad. I just watched it happen and had to go back here.
It was stupid. The admirer basically paints a target on both lovers and gives evils an extra kill. Very stupid.
They should change the alignment to Town (Sabotage) instead of Town (Support).
I mean, these instareveal roles die soon thanks to the doomsayer and ritualist so it's not gonna be that big of a problem I reckon
they are good target for horsemen too and stuff like that so I don't think they are gonna be op
bringing back the whisper meta is just gonna mean that evils get lynched without knowing that they are suspect, takes away from gameplay.
ITS GOING TO RELEASE IN MY BIRTH DAY POG
Rest In Pieces Mafia
The fact that every "true" neutral (pirate, exe, doomsayer, jester) leave after fulfilling their wincon seems nice.
-Fake claim psy.
-Ritualist reveals himself by try guessing you are psy.
-Reveal as mayor and up ritualist
Mayor epic trolling.
Best strat ever
I'm so excited everything looks amazing and a lot better balanced than tos 1
Hold on… there’s a problem not many people are noticing; coven roles can just see what roles are, so if the PM sees what somebody’s role is, then the Ritualistic can just do their role… that’s broken.
Me going out of my way to shoot the confirmed jailor as deputy sacrificing myself in the process:
0:47: Town of Salem does not make sense:
How is it that Conjoror's attack pulls a meteor and the remaining town can still survive it?
magic, pulling a meteor doesn't make sense either, work with it
It's just a fireball
Imagine if they add a custom role maker
I don't think 'walk away from the town in victory' means literally just exiting the game on the spot. I think it means when the game is officially over, you 'walk away' with a victory. So, whether you die, quit the game, or keep messing around until the end, you 'walk away' with a win regardless. At least that's how I see it. Just forcefully being removed from a game feels weird and I don't think it works.
Naw the devs want true neutrals gone all neutrals now are their own winning faction.
I hate that they get rid of neutral benigns, I hope they bring them back for custom games or fun modes.
The argument that they being kingmakers and therefor making game unfair is stupid.
The game in itself is one big ball of chaos, and not the destination but the journey, the plot twists in it that happens is what makes it fun for me, the unexpectancy(or whatever that means).
Yes that argument is metal solid on the ranked or competitive play, however there is always people that play for the fun of it, the chaos, the unexpectancy.
No game is fun if there is no chaos in itself.
and the opposite is also true.
No game is fun if there is no order in itself.
We just do not know where to draw the line.
And also the line that is supposed to be drawn changes depending on the person.
But getting entirely rid of kingmakers and chaos team in ToS is in my opinion, a very- very- bad decision.
(Btw usually the oppressed is heard out, like people who hate kingmakers and want them got ridden, but to speak for myself personally, I love them.)
I am interested in the apocalypse roles, I did like plaguebearer in the original game, but I do think that they might be slightly overtuned, with two of them pretty much wiping the town as soon as they show up.
Death is gonna be the biggest swing ball. Famine is gonna be rather bad imo. You don’t kill any of the three bread holders, and just make sure that you’ll be the last one at n7. Which is soooo slow and honestly awful considering 3 other players will be alive to find you.
War is just upgraded jugg. It takes one less kill and you get invincible defence instead of powerful. Good change for a role notorious for its lack of feeling.
Pesty (for now) lost their rampage! That kind of kills their kill potential, even if town wouldn’t dare move until pesty was out. They still kill anyone visiting them.
I think Pipe made a good comment on Death. It punishes passive town. If you do nothing, then they'll pop up, and you simply don't have the information to find them. Its similar to what Arso would allow previously
@@solarstorm5242 Pest now has permanent self rampage though, but it could probably do with an SK bloody will-esque effect to not accidentally out yourself if a TI or tavern keep finds you
@@yoshifan2334 didn’t pest already have that though? I’m pretty sure that pest in TOS 1 rampages at their target’s home, as well as their own.
@@solarstorm5242 I don't recall, I thought it was just WW with unstoppable, but i could be wrong
I feel like the part where you mentioned insta-confirms being problematic for fake claiming is a non-issue, because first off, ritualist, conjurer and doomsayer exist, and 2nd, it means there are MORE possibilities for fake claiming, because more townies are insta-confirms therefore you will have less counter claims for the roles that arent insta confirms
I don’t think evils will have an issue with claim space considering ritualist is in the game
Forget the Mafia- im gonna miss the Medium (but not the transporter ;)
The transporter still exists(but only transes themselves and only transes attackers)
Couple problems I don’t like. Mafia being gone is one of the things I missed seeing. Admirer role looks pretty useless for town since if either of you dies the other one dies and it reveals the other persons role which means free ritualist kill. Ambusher was one of my favorite maf roles. Pretty disappointed
I think they shouldve kept mafia and coven. The dynamic of three teams interacting is much more interesting than two.
Some mafia roles were fundamentally flawed like mafioso and disg so maf needed to be heavily reworked or removed and I guess it was easier to remove
The removed Guardian Angel completely :(
Edit: Yeah I know they removed surv to remove kingmakers but there were other things they could have done, like giving more protects and having GA die if their target dies, yeah I know it's harsh but
I still wish there were more factions… I feel like all any was most fun because of the chaos due to all the different factions
Its been confirmed that vampire will get its own mode in the future
so most likely with all any there will be more factions then right now
Thanks for 3:57 video thoughts of this.
I love how right after learning all maf role are the ones that people hate the most besides surv maf is just gone from tos2
I don’t think the confirmed roles will be much of an issue has half of it is town power so they will be limited, not to mention the guesser roles. Overall I am super excited as I loved the OG TOS but don’t play it as much as I’d like. Baker (Town Apocalypse) is also hilarious to read.
While Ill certainly play ToS2. loved 1, but one thing I do not like at all and I hope it changes or players can change it themselves is how everything is in different colors. I have watched pipes videos about ToS 2 and following chat or anything is nightmare at least for me, because icons and different colors. I just want similar to ToS1, because its way easier to follow for me.
TIs will either need to start claiming fake TI claims to push their info, or they'll need to strictly control the number of true public claims. And once you get a confirmed TI or Jailor, that person needs to become the nexus of the investigative effort. With no BMer anymore, whispering is 100% going to be the currency.
The instaconfirm roles are a direct response to roles that counter townies claiming roles. It's a wonky way to balance but whatever.
I must say, VFR is not hurt in any way. I've been playing like it's ToS1 and it has not changed a single thing. At most, I claim alignment over role.
My biggest problem so far with ToS2 is that Admirer is allowed to exist at all.
You instantly confirm yourself and either instantly confirm another townie or instantly out an evil.
"9 accept my proposal or you're evil"
if they decline, it's publicly announced to everyone.
if they accept, depending on how it works, it's either announced to everyone or you can just say "9 is (insert role here)"
Far too strong.
Unless admirer protects you from being guessed, you just become a target for the guesser roles
@@Oshroth exactly Doomsayer just gets a free win, if they already know someone else’s role
There's gonna be a Mafia DLC maybe
If there was they would all suck cuz almost every single maf role has been converted into a coven role
@Sr Francisco well, I mean, they made the coven cooler so probably they can make maf even cooler
@@Dr_Xewwer but would they do that? Its based on the Salem “Witch” Trials, the mafia became the og evil bcuz of the irl game mafia (I think), so now the game is more original without maf
@@franciscomelon4159 see the problem with this reasoning is that there’s still sheriffs, deputy’s, veterans & the like
@@shadelightss wasn’t gasoline not even invented yet lmao
it's highly likely that the games balance will be a mess on launch, but patches exist so I'm not that worried.
I think the instant confirm roles are worrying, but they can easily be guessed buly guessing roles and die so...
Can't believe it, def awesome to see
I’m just glad surv is gone. However i feel like there won’t be a ranked anymore which is a shame.
Ok question, opinion on ga coming back?
I dislike what they did to the role list mostly Mafia and GA being removed but also Amne becoming a town role aside from the roles I like the rest of the game still GA being removed hurts me the most as I love playing GA I hope GA comes back or the rest of the game makes up for it but TOS 2 should be fun no matter what.
The lord possibilities for the abilities can make much more sense
Blackmailing didn't make sense. You're about to get lynched. The blackmailer releasing the fact that you slept with the consort instead of doing your job doesn't matter. A voodoo master using a voodoo doll to see your mouth shut so you can't speak is WAY better
There are many other "ability possible lore" examples where these roles make 50x more sense than the old roles, but I would be posting paragraphs to explain them all. The blackmailer was the worst offender though.
I hate my phone's auto correct...... Lore is a word, why correct to lord or sew to see.......
@@jfast8256 Naw people do kinda accept worse fates sometimes than defamation.
As a tester, i love that there are more day abilities.And yea, retri dupes now.They added new neutrals which i like, especially i like the four horsemen mode.Heres what i dont like:coven is…overpowered.Atleast CL who does nothing without necronomicon and always takes in beginning of game kinda fixes this.Coroner is….underpowered as hell.
I also dont like that amne is too situational, if one oiwn role djes n1 u have no choice, game forces u to remember it.
Survivor might have been good to keep as a rare role, it can still be important to have not only skill, but the charisma to get another neutral player to side with you, although maybe it would have to be tweaked a little bit.
Mafia kind of just doesn't need to be here anymore cuz they already have roles that are similar to Mafia so we don't need another
OMG THIS IS GOING TO JE EPIC
so glad surv is gone, so sad guardian angel is gone :(
Hi, thanks for the review. I'm wondering if my son of 15 would enjoy this or is he too old?
teleport bread when
I'm kinda mixed about no medium since why not just, leave asap unless your team still is in the game?, gives uneeded info
if there was a role to keep you around that could be useful like a cultist role that allows you to kill a member and silently replace them with a dead person [but they join the cultist faction] like old disg
And no mafia? I get it but also damn helped add to the chaos of CAA and ik classic should be the main focus but :/
I hope they remove being able to tell if a dead player disconnects
Hi, i am new to the channel, wish you very good luck with youtube❤
I bought, Skin(scrolls, house, points and Pet ) for 5 reais(1 dollar) i'll have the things that i buyed on TOS 1?
yeah but where’s the frankie skin option cmon bmg
Adagia does the match making include NKs or is that just for the 4 horseman mode? I do not think I will be too interested in a 1 team vs 1 team dynamic. All chaos is removed in that situation then evils auto win as soon as they have majority.
NK is still a thing :)
@@Adagia Thank you
Not sure how to feel about possibly just dying because you claim what you are, that seems way too strong imo and stifles information sharing which only helps evils. Personally I think BMG went a bit too heavy on nerfing town in this regard.
How do i aquarie the beta?
I dislike the invest rework honestly, but that's also cause I don't really like a lot of the new TI reworks. Jailor is way too nerfed imo, and NEs leaving kinda takes out the fun of playing NE (at least for me)
Jailor didn’t need the nerf but it’s not that bad NEs are just broken now except for jester and some TIs like new invest and coroner are hella weak
I dislike the fact they killed Neutral evils fun kinda they really remove ga I hope to see you its return I think we should put it in ac to nb but you have basic defense vfr still did not die a lot they did a little bit but only a bit The apocalypse faction just seems like a replacement of mafia pretty unique idea but Still there are a lot of good things in this this is my current thoughts let’s hear from everyone else
Im sad about no mafia but after seeing your top 5 most hated roles I might be the only one
Famine is a scrunkly scrimblo, 10/10 game
Honestly, I don't like a lot of the changes
Town was heavily depowered and nearly all the mafia roles got a coven varianf
Well they reworked admirer at least
Everyone is taking abortion the new TOS2 roles and how they will change the game.
I am thinking of all the new Jester plays you can make in TOS2 to get lynched.
This game is gonna be great, Surv is GONE, Investigator results are GONE, kingmakers in general are mostly GONE (Late game Exe). I think Spy’s change is good, Psychics rework is SO much better. I personally think the investigator results removal was for the sake of Ritualist and Doomsayer to be harder, though I’m not a fan of the edition because of how it could make TI have no leads, I welcome the edition anyways. I personally think the confirmable town roles are there to balance the chaotic nature of neutrals, and the confusion of more impactful Coven (Deception)as well. Mayor is good, Monarch can be good when used right so it’s good(though I think it could be like Marshall in modded where Mayor and Monarch are never in the same game), Deputy is a day phase vigi which is ok, Prosecutor is fine but slightly obsolete to Deputy, and Admirer I think should be the one that gets a rework. The Admirer (if this is not the case already) can have the lovers side effect like in coven expansion where if one dies the other dies, not only would this make the Admirer’s ability more risky, the rejection would be more justified if a Monarch or TI doesn’t want to easily die. I think Lovers could also come back as a custom modifier. Overall hype.
i actualy liked nb roles so im kinda sad but its understandable
IMO guardian angel would be fine to re-add
Game so good they made a second
Do you work for the company? Or did you know about it being developed?
Some content creators get early access to check things out, looks like it was a secret closed beta sort of thing till today
I don’t work for BMG- I was given a key to download the game in February and access to a discord server where the developers took feedback and posted game updates. Any knowledge I have comes from there, and we weren’t allowed to talk about it publicly until today :)
@@Adagia ah ok you just sound so official I was super impressed lol I knew content creators get early access 🤣 I was just surprised
Finally Pie Rat is NE