One thing that Indian needs to do to get some Harley riders to jump ship is ... offer a factory Trike. As Harley Riders age, or are injured (like me), we need three wheels.
I have left my new Harley Davidson bikes stock. The only major problem i had. happened one year out of warranty 😅 Harley Davidson stepped up and fixed it no cost to me 😊 that said i have had 7 Harley Davidson bikes i bought new so i have some experience 🤠 some of the problems people have with their Harley Davidson bikes could be their own fault.
I ran the UK's premiere Victory dealership here in the UK back in 2005 and got to know the Polaris philosophy quite well: They like to build out slowly, and focus on the US. This policy was working for Polaris with Victory and I'd say it's still working for them with Indian. Manufacturing has always been through problem. Even now, Indian dealerships in the UK will sell their entire allocation easily and are hungry for more. This has kept residual values solid around the worlds and provides stability at Spirit Lake. As production grows, Indian would be more exposed to natural changes in world markets - just like H-D is now, so being top dog is not always so good. I know I'm biased because I own a Scout, but I see as many Indians around in the UK as I do H-Ds. Considering how long Harley's have been sold in the UK that's quite something - be good to see the figures on that to test my perception bias. Indian need a smaller bike in he 400cc range to take on the emerging markets - especially India. Royal Enfield, Husqvana and now Triumph are dominating this sector and RE's Super Meteor 650 shows what can be done with a smaller cruising bike. Maybe by teaming up with an Indian Mfr, Indian can hit more sales without taking the risk of expanding their own manufacturing infrastructure
KEEP THE BOYCOTT GOING until their current CEO and Board of Directors are REPLACED and they announce that Revmax production will REMAIN IN THE US! FHD! ✊️
I owned a 2021 Indian Challenger for 3 years and put a lot of miles on it and it was bulletproof. Never-Never had an issue with it. Dealer network is important but Indian’s don’t have consistent breakdown issues like HD does….hence the smaller network. They certainly could use more dealers for the occasional service issues that come up. Next topic - Aftermarket. Let’s be clear. You buy HD knowing you will “mostly likely” customize that bike and there’s a huge aftermarket of products available. You buy an Indian realizing that many of the mods you would want on your Indian are potentially already on the bike when you buy it. If you are afraid to leave HD…. don’t be.
As much as I enjoy harleys for a variety of reasons, I have had other brand of bikes including the scout bobber that I also own currently. I’d really like to see some data around failures because I hear it both ways from Indian owners. Some swear they’ve had nothing but good experience while others have a total opposite experience. In regards to aftermarket, I like modding. It’s fun, and it gives me a reason to wrench and learn my bike in more detail. Even if the bikes are solid I’ll still want to customize to my liking, and having that option would be really nice on an Indian. Either way If I were to trade my scout bobber in (1-3 years from now) it’ll likely be the challenger. It was my favorite Indian and was much better ride vs roadglide.
@@IronBornRider Can’t go wrong with the Challenger. I only traded it because i just wanted a new bike…no other reason….and it held its value quite well.
@@dccycler3554 I agree. On another point, it is my opinion that the very existence of Indian and Harley is somehow connected since both riders share common interests and culture.
I was looking at Indian but I specifically want a motorcycle that does NOT have throttle-by-wire. Unfortunately all the scouts I looked at have throttle by wire and a some other Tech features I would want deleted or removed from my motorcycle. I'm not into customizing bikes anymore so I really wouldn't be concerned about a lot of aftermarket parts being available, there's just certain features or parts that I DON'T want on my bike. Having dealerships around on long trips is not really a concern for me because even if I break down on the road I prefer to fix it myself. Even with Harley my bike is older it's hard to get parts or service for a motorcycle that's older so those dealers were useless to me anyway.
Due to the nature of my work. I have to relocate every couple years. I’ve lived from California to Florida, and many places in between. From my observation. Indian has done a great job strategically locating their dealerships. The only places I’ve seen that didn’t have an Indian dealership within a reasonable distance, also didn’t have a Harley dealership. Places like Kansas or Wyoming. Furthermore I’ve personally had a substantially better experience at every Indian dealership, than any Harley dealership. I’ve had outright nightmare experiences keeping my Harley’s maintained. Every time I’ve stepped into an Indian dealership. It’s been an outstanding experience. Hell, the owner of Daytona Indian spent a half hour with me just BSing about motorcycles. Short story long. I won’t be selling my Harleys, but my next bike will be an Indian.
Thanks for the video. I am a Harley rider. I am biased towards Harley because of my Dad. Having said that, I will get myself an Indian at some point because they are great American bikes and some of my brothers ride them and they are bad ass bikes. In my opinion, Indian don't understand that the difference between Harley and Indian riders is, none. We all like big, comfortable and noisy American cruisers, but many of us love to work on our bikes, under a tree, or in a garage; while watching a game, or cracking a cold one. That is a big part of the American bike culture, and there is almost nothing for Indian riders on this department, making it hard for Harley riders to get into an Indian and do anything significant on them. How to fix it, get the aftermarket i.e; s&s and all the others to start making DIY friendly modifications like cams, stands, etc., and tools available for Indians! The key is to consider the biker culture that we are part off. Indie shops help the cause, but is not enough. Like you said, "AFTERMARKET". Something great can always be made better by their owner, unless, we think that bikes come out perfect from the factory! Respectfully submitted.
@@bikesandwrenches not to mention, the aftermarket ensures that older harleys can still be viable for long periods of time. I can go out and buy an older dyna for cheap, knowing I can make that bike into what I want with just some basic modifications. But you hit it on the head, we just enjoy wrenching on the bikes as much as we enjoy riding them. It’s an addiction
Innovation is key, especially when honda is offering motorcycles with DCT automatic and now E-clutch transmissions and Yamaha announcing their new Automatic transmission. If indian can offer similar transmissions, then that could help edge them out against Harley.
I haven’t had a problem finding Indian dealerships. Yeah, Harley has more shops, but have you considered how many are t-shirt and sticker stores? I don’t need any more t-shirts.
I haven’t had issues finding Indian dealerships but it’s not convenient relative to Harley. It would take me a good 1-2 hours to get to my closest Indian dealership and I don’t always have time to spend like that. Plus traffic in my area is horrendous which makes the issue worse
Idian is going in the right driection. It seems like they are trying to get builders to make bikes to encouage the after marked but you need more bikes before it will be the same as harely. Also the current softtail has been out sense 2017 so you have 7 years of parts at this point to. Hopeing harely gets there stuff together or indian is the way forward.
Indian needs more color and graphics options. Most buyers are visual. Most Indian motorcycles are very boring to potential buyers. If Indian can catch their attention with more cool and unique paint/graphic schemes, they'd be able to pull potential Harley-Davidson sales.
This is a really good point. Harley buyers love talking about paint and they always talk about what colors they like/don’t like. I like what Indian did with the scout 101 paint for example.
@IronBornRider yeah you gotta have more options. I don't understand why that's such a hard thing for Indian to understand. The coolest looks win hands down.
I don't think the business model that Harley is following right now is not going to work out for them in the next 5-10 years. The next generation of riders there is less of "my dad had a Harley" mind set and more this bike is better than what Harley offers.
Totally agree. They seem to be neglecting the new rider segment. Most new riders can’t or don’t want to spend $12-14k on a first bike. Triumph did really well with their 400 scrambler/street, and they’ve sold a ton of those units. Harley needs to take note
Funny how dealership presence is only important to Harley people, because Harleys are extremely prone to having issues. Its so bad, that Harley people can't imagine that you could own another brand without the dealer network!! 2024 Harley Davidsons are horrendously unreliable right now. Look into it! Having 40 pages of aftermarket parts is as redundant as having a million dealerships nearby. If you have been watching the market right now, nobody even has the money to afford a new Harley, let alone modifying it to death! People are buying motorcycles you dont need to modify You never hear Kawasaki, Honda, Suzuki, Indian or Triumph riders complaining about the lack of dealers.....because those bikes are reliable and any general maintenance can be done at home with basic knowledge and tools! If Harleys were reliable, then why would "dealer network" even matter? Its because otherwise they wouldnt have anywhere to buy $50 t-shirts, eat free donuts on Sundays, and cosplay with their leather-daddy friends 😂 Been riding Triumphs my whole life and my closest dealer has always been over an hour away. My current Triumph has 25k miles and counting! Only ditched my other Triumphs to trade in on new ones!
@@NicePantsLance you are spot on across the board. In fact I spoke on literally the same points you made in this comment thread. Harley riders project their inadequacies on the motorcycling diaspora. You don’t need an extensive dealer network when your bike doesn’t break down or isn’t plagued with gremlins that keeps you coming back multiple times for the same mechanical or electrical issue only to be turned away because they can’t fix it. I know I sure as hell don’t have to be clad from head to toe in brand specific clothing just so everybody I run into knows what I ride. 😆😆😆
I don't have a HD or an Indian but I can give one reason why dealer network matter. Where i live you have two dealerships of an uncommon brand within 1 hr of each other and nothing beyond. They seem to have a bad rep, because they know they are only two and if you bought one you're stuck with them. Bad customer service, impossible to get an appointment, have to wait a lot for parts. Not enough dealerships for the amount of customers.
Don't be woke, make a single cylinder starter bike with the same tech as their 1250. Guarantee they would win. Triumph sold 50k of their new 400s that came out last year.
@@logangodofcandy triumphs venture into the 400 scrambler and street proves that people want small displacement bikes that are affordable and still high quality
1. The fact that you had comments saying things like your ditching or abandoning hd is ridiculous and shows the mindstate of brand sheep. I dont understand how people can get butt hurt over choosing another brand different from their own. Smh 2. Modifications stem from necessity in my opinion. There was something not right and customers took it into their own hands to find a solution. That solution becomes popular and grows. Multiply that hundreds over the decades with improvements and you now have a culture of modders. Aftermarket takes a life of its own and is expected let alone required for some. 3. Reliability differences between the to companies are related in scale. Hd is a much bigger moco than indian, so their failure rate should be higher that indian's. Imagine if indian had a failure rate as high as hd still sold indian numbers. No one would take indian seriously. The fact that indian has tbis much of a following on social media and a growth for the market to notice is impressive.
Thats not the definition. Words migrate. Im a Swede and live in the most progressive country in the world. But the Church of Woke is crazy. Not even us in the most progressive country in the world beleive in the extreme views of woke. Example, I don't think people that are science denyers like not beliving in biologi are to be trusted and beleives like that are extremist. Thats way out on the left beyond what most people in my country belive in (and thats the most progressive country in the world as pointed out before). Once it mite have been true, but what you said is no longer the reallity. Read up and question 🤘🏻
Triumph sold 50 thousand of their new 400. Indian needs a bike in that power and price range. Go global by offering what the globe wants. The scouts are great bikes, but most people aren't looking at getting a 1200cc bike
@@logangodofcandy I couldn’t inmagibe riding a 400 on the street. I have a Honda crf450r that I race Mx with and it might be fun on streets, hiway would wear that thing down in a month lol.
Indian is not a bad product, it’s just not as desirable as Harley Davidson. No HD owner dreams of owning an Indian but I’m willing to bet many Indian owners dream of owning a Harley one day. Indian is like a Honda, great reliable bike but it’s not a Harley. You buy an Indian and spend most of your conversation explaining to people why you bought it whereas you buy a Harley and spend time watching people awe at the beautiful motorcycle you just purchased and you can customize it to reflect your personality. Ever try to customize a Goldwing ? Two different worlds.
Let's REALLY be real: 1. Harley Davidson's failure rate is above 30%. Higher than any other manufacturer except Ducati and BMW. Yes Harley owners NEED a dealership on each block, in every city, in every state because they DO break down. Even the brand new 2024 bikes. Let's not pretend like this isn't an issue. 2. Indian motorcycles are a hell of a lot more reliable than Harleys. Hell, I have an old 2015 Victory Vision with over 55,000 miles. I've criss crossed the entire United States on my Vic and all I do is change the oil and tires. No so-called preventative maintenance, no scheduled tune-ups, recalls, modifications or any other kind of wrenching required. Just press the start button and go. 3. Harley has a Sears and Roebuck-sized catalog of aftermarket parts available because people have normalized modifying underpowered, underperforming, uncomfortable, tractor-riding Harleys for so long that people are conditioned to believe spending another $1500 to $6000 dollars on a bike they just bought to make it perform and ride as well as the competition is supposed to be part of the honor of owning a Harley. Indian doesn't need to do anything but continue with their modest growth as the demand for big touring cruisers in general wanes. Meanwhile, Harley Davidson slowly collapses under their own weight. Indian motorcycles are designed and engineered so well all you need is an exhaust and a flash tune and you're good. No need for big bore kits, jugs, crazy cams, head work etc. unless you just want to go that crazy. Not like there aren't any parts out there. There are big bore kits for their Thunderstroke and Powerplus V-twins. There's just no need for a gigantic catalog just because that's what Harley guys are accustomed to doing.
Regarding the failure rate, I couldn’t find any data for Indian motorcycles so my data is annecdotal. But I mentioned it as a point to say Indian doesn’t have a stellar reputation. I’ve seen a fair share of comments on social media regarding Indian issues. If you can share data as to how Indian is more reliable than Harley please let me know Regarding aftermarket parts - I disagree. The aftermarket exists because people clearly enjoy modifications. This is also true in the car industry, as well as several others. Regardless, if Indian wants to compete (in terms of sales) I believe they need an aftermarket scene that’s close to Harley. Just my opinion of course.
One thing that Indian needs to do to get some Harley riders to jump ship is ... offer a factory Trike. As Harley Riders age, or are injured (like me), we need three wheels.
@@W9HJBill good point. There aren’t any Indian trikes available
I have left my new Harley Davidson bikes stock. The only major problem i had. happened one year out of warranty 😅 Harley Davidson stepped up and fixed it no cost to me 😊 that said i have had 7 Harley Davidson bikes i bought new so i have some experience 🤠 some of the problems people have with their Harley Davidson bikes could be their own fault.
@@northrider8628 harleys are pretty darn reliable if you generally leave them stock, at least from what I’ve heard/researched
I ran the UK's premiere Victory dealership here in the UK back in 2005 and got to know the Polaris philosophy quite well:
They like to build out slowly, and focus on the US.
This policy was working for Polaris with Victory and I'd say it's still working for them with Indian.
Manufacturing has always been through problem. Even now, Indian dealerships in the UK will sell their entire allocation easily and are hungry for more.
This has kept residual values solid around the worlds and provides stability at Spirit Lake.
As production grows, Indian would be more exposed to natural changes in world markets - just like H-D is now, so being top dog is not always so good.
I know I'm biased because I own a Scout, but I see as many Indians around in the UK as I do H-Ds. Considering how long Harley's have been sold in the UK that's quite something - be good to see the figures on that to test my perception bias.
Indian need a smaller bike in he 400cc range to take on the emerging markets - especially India.
Royal Enfield, Husqvana and now Triumph are dominating this sector and RE's Super Meteor 650 shows what can be done with a smaller cruising bike.
Maybe by teaming up with an Indian Mfr, Indian can hit more sales without taking the risk of expanding their own manufacturing infrastructure
I love my Scout bobber,never been a big Harley fan. I’ve had 2 Japanese bikes and one British bike. Love those American flag glove too.
@@mrmurphy8609 I have gone through a few bikes. Right now it’s an Indian scout bobber twenty and a Harley low rider s
KEEP THE BOYCOTT GOING until their current CEO and Board of Directors are REPLACED and they announce that Revmax production will REMAIN IN THE US! FHD! ✊️
I owned a 2021 Indian Challenger for 3 years and put a lot of miles on it and it was bulletproof. Never-Never had an issue with it. Dealer network is important but Indian’s don’t have consistent breakdown issues like HD does….hence the smaller network. They certainly could use more dealers for the occasional service issues that come up. Next topic - Aftermarket. Let’s be clear. You buy HD knowing you will “mostly likely” customize that bike and there’s a huge aftermarket of products available. You buy an Indian realizing that many of the mods you would want on your Indian are potentially already on the bike when you buy it. If you are afraid to leave HD…. don’t be.
As much as I enjoy harleys for a variety of reasons, I have had other brand of bikes including the scout bobber that I also own currently. I’d really like to see some data around failures because I hear it both ways from Indian owners. Some swear they’ve had nothing but good experience while others have a total opposite experience. In regards to aftermarket, I like modding. It’s fun, and it gives me a reason to wrench and learn my bike in more detail. Even if the bikes are solid I’ll still want to customize to my liking, and having that option would be really nice on an Indian. Either way If I were to trade my scout bobber in (1-3 years from now) it’ll likely be the challenger. It was my favorite Indian and was much better ride vs roadglide.
@@IronBornRider Can’t go wrong with the Challenger. I only traded it because i just wanted a new bike…no other reason….and it held its value quite well.
@@dccycler3554 I agree. On another point, it is my opinion that the very existence of Indian and Harley is somehow connected since both riders share common interests and culture.
I was looking at Indian but I specifically want a motorcycle that does NOT have throttle-by-wire. Unfortunately all the scouts I looked at have throttle by wire and a some other Tech features I would want deleted or removed from my motorcycle. I'm not into customizing bikes anymore so I really wouldn't be concerned about a lot of aftermarket parts being available, there's just certain features or parts that I DON'T want on my bike.
Having dealerships around on long trips is not really a concern for me because even if I break down on the road I prefer to fix it myself. Even with Harley my bike is older it's hard to get parts or service for a motorcycle that's older so those dealers were useless to me anyway.
True Harley doesn’t work on older bikes which is insane to me.
Love those gloves! What brand are they?
Thrashin supply
Due to the nature of my work. I have to relocate every couple years. I’ve lived from California to Florida, and many places in between. From my observation. Indian has done a great job strategically locating their dealerships. The only places I’ve seen that didn’t have an Indian dealership within a reasonable distance, also didn’t have a Harley dealership. Places like Kansas or Wyoming. Furthermore I’ve personally had a substantially better experience at every Indian dealership, than any Harley dealership. I’ve had outright nightmare experiences keeping my Harley’s maintained. Every time I’ve stepped into an Indian dealership. It’s been an outstanding experience. Hell, the owner of Daytona Indian spent a half hour with me just BSing about motorcycles. Short story long. I won’t be selling my Harleys, but my next bike will be an Indian.
@@soldierboy425 good to experience what other brands have to offer if I’m being honest. Makes us a better informed consumer
Indian got me with the FTR. Now I want a Challenger.
Thanks for the video. I am a Harley rider. I am biased towards Harley because of my Dad. Having said that, I will get myself an Indian at some point because they are great American bikes and some of my brothers ride them and they are bad ass bikes. In my opinion, Indian don't understand that the difference between Harley and Indian riders is, none. We all like big, comfortable and noisy American cruisers, but many of us love to work on our bikes, under a tree, or in a garage; while watching a game, or cracking a cold one. That is a big part of the American bike culture, and there is almost nothing for Indian riders on this department, making it hard for Harley riders to get into an Indian and do anything significant on them. How to fix it, get the aftermarket i.e; s&s and all the others to start making DIY friendly modifications like cams, stands, etc., and tools available for Indians! The key is to consider the biker culture that we are part off. Indie shops help the cause, but is not enough. Like you said, "AFTERMARKET". Something great can always be made better by their owner, unless, we think that bikes come out perfect from the factory! Respectfully submitted.
@@bikesandwrenches not to mention, the aftermarket ensures that older harleys can still be viable for long periods of time. I can go out and buy an older dyna for cheap, knowing I can make that bike into what I want with just some basic modifications. But you hit it on the head, we just enjoy wrenching on the bikes as much as we enjoy riding them. It’s an addiction
HD bikes objectively suck and need aftermarket to stop sucking
@@logangodofcandy disagree but to each their own
@@logangodofcandy ?
Innovation is key, especially when honda is offering motorcycles with DCT automatic and now E-clutch transmissions and Yamaha announcing their new Automatic transmission. If indian can offer similar transmissions, then that could help edge them out against Harley.
I haven’t had a problem finding Indian dealerships. Yeah, Harley has more shops, but have you considered how many are t-shirt and sticker stores? I don’t need any more t-shirts.
I haven’t had issues finding Indian dealerships but it’s not convenient relative to Harley. It would take me a good 1-2 hours to get to my closest Indian dealership and I don’t always have time to spend like that. Plus traffic in my area is horrendous which makes the issue worse
Idian is going in the right driection. It seems like they are trying to get builders to make bikes to encouage the after marked but you need more bikes before it will be the same as harely. Also the current softtail has been out sense 2017 so you have 7 years of parts at this point to. Hopeing harely gets there stuff together or indian is the way forward.
I agree, I think Indian has enough of a consumer base to keep them in business and the new scouts could rejuvenate a new market for them.
Indian is the superior American motorcycle 🇺🇸 . 1901 .
Maybe. But Harley still outsells them 10-3
I have 3 dealers in my state so definitely not a problem for me
That’s good to hear!
If people actually wanted very reliable and cheaper Cruisers, they would have been buying Japanese cruisers instead of Harleys all these years
Agreed. Motorcycling for many is a heart driven decision. Not always what makes the most sense
Do you still have your HD?
@@_S.E.J_ still have the low rider s
Indian needs more color and graphics options. Most buyers are visual. Most Indian motorcycles are very boring to potential buyers. If Indian can catch their attention with more cool and unique paint/graphic schemes, they'd be able to pull potential Harley-Davidson sales.
This is a really good point. Harley buyers love talking about paint and they always talk about what colors they like/don’t like. I like what Indian did with the scout 101 paint for example.
@IronBornRider yeah you gotta have more options. I don't understand why that's such a hard thing for Indian to understand. The coolest looks win hands down.
I don't think the business model that Harley is following right now is not going to work out for them in the next 5-10 years. The next generation of riders there is less of "my dad had a Harley" mind set and more this bike is better than what Harley offers.
Totally agree. They seem to be neglecting the new rider segment. Most new riders can’t or don’t want to spend $12-14k on a first bike. Triumph did really well with their 400 scrambler/street, and they’ve sold a ton of those units. Harley needs to take note
My dad had bikes his whole adult life. He bought at HD at 61 years old. You'd have to pay me to buy one. I guess subsidize half the cost? Lol
Funny how dealership presence is only important to Harley people, because Harleys are extremely prone to having issues. Its so bad, that Harley people can't imagine that you could own another brand without the dealer network!! 2024 Harley Davidsons are horrendously unreliable right now. Look into it! Having 40 pages of aftermarket parts is as redundant as having a million dealerships nearby. If you have been watching the market right now, nobody even has the money to afford a new Harley, let alone modifying it to death! People are buying motorcycles you dont need to modify
You never hear Kawasaki, Honda, Suzuki, Indian or Triumph riders complaining about the lack of dealers.....because those bikes are reliable and any general maintenance can be done at home with basic knowledge and tools!
If Harleys were reliable, then why would "dealer network" even matter? Its because otherwise they wouldnt have anywhere to buy $50 t-shirts, eat free donuts on Sundays, and cosplay with their leather-daddy friends 😂
Been riding Triumphs my whole life and my closest dealer has always been over an hour away. My current Triumph has 25k miles and counting! Only ditched my other Triumphs to trade in on new ones!
@@NicePantsLance leather-daddy 😆😆
@@NicePantsLance agree to disagree on just about everything you said lol
@@NicePantsLance you are spot on across the board. In fact I spoke on literally the same points you made in this comment thread.
Harley riders project their inadequacies on the motorcycling diaspora. You don’t need an extensive dealer network when your bike doesn’t break down or isn’t plagued with gremlins that keeps you coming back multiple times for the same mechanical or electrical issue only to be turned away because they can’t fix it.
I know I sure as hell don’t have to be clad from head to toe in brand specific clothing just so everybody I run into knows what I ride. 😆😆😆
I don't have a HD or an Indian but I can give one reason why dealer network matter. Where i live you have two dealerships of an uncommon brand within 1 hr of each other and nothing beyond. They seem to have a bad rep, because they know they are only two and if you bought one you're stuck with them. Bad customer service, impossible to get an appointment, have to wait a lot for parts. Not enough dealerships for the amount of customers.
Research Polaris. Way more woke than Harley.
Almost all big companies will at some point “go woke” they want to make money
Woke longer, but HD dove head first in to Woke just the same.
@JohnnyMan316 agreed. Better fire the CEO soon, or they will be done.
Don't be woke, make a single cylinder starter bike with the same tech as their 1250. Guarantee they would win. Triumph sold 50k of their new 400s that came out last year.
@@logangodofcandy triumphs venture into the 400 scrambler and street proves that people want small displacement bikes that are affordable and still high quality
1. The fact that you had comments saying things like your ditching or abandoning hd is ridiculous and shows the mindstate of brand sheep. I dont understand how people can get butt hurt over choosing another brand different from their own. Smh
2. Modifications stem from necessity in my opinion. There was something not right and customers took it into their own hands to find a solution. That solution becomes popular and grows. Multiply that hundreds over the decades with improvements and you now have a culture of modders. Aftermarket takes a life of its own and is expected let alone required for some.
3. Reliability differences between the to companies are related in scale. Hd is a much bigger moco than indian, so their failure rate should be higher that indian's. Imagine if indian had a failure rate as high as hd still sold indian numbers. No one would take indian seriously.
The fact that indian has tbis much of a following on social media and a growth for the market to notice is impressive.
@@savagewalker1able good points. Agree that it’s impressive what Indian has done in a relative short period of time
the thing i don't like about indian -- is they claim to be this old brand that has been going forever ,, which is hogwash ;;;
Yeah, there was that 50-60 year gap in between.
Harley sold 167000 bikes in 2023. Indian barely sold 30000 bikes. And remember people. Woke is to be aware! To be unaware is to be ignorant!!
Thats not the definition. Words migrate. Im a Swede and live in the most progressive country in the world. But the Church of Woke is crazy. Not even us in the most progressive country in the world beleive in the extreme views of woke. Example, I don't think people that are science denyers like not beliving in biologi are to be trusted and beleives like that are extremist. Thats way out on the left beyond what most people in my country belive in (and thats the most progressive country in the world as pointed out before).
Once it mite have been true, but what you said is no longer the reallity. Read up and question 🤘🏻
Triumph sold 50 thousand of their new 400. Indian needs a bike in that power and price range. Go global by offering what the globe wants. The scouts are great bikes, but most people aren't looking at getting a 1200cc bike
Nice try. Woke is NOT that at all. Smh.
@@logangodofcandy I couldn’t inmagibe riding a 400 on the street. I have a Honda crf450r that I race Mx with and it might be fun on streets, hiway would wear that thing down in a month lol.
Indian is not a bad product, it’s just not as desirable as Harley Davidson. No HD owner dreams of owning an Indian but I’m willing to bet many Indian owners dream of owning a Harley one day. Indian is like a Honda, great reliable bike but it’s not a Harley. You buy an Indian and spend most of your conversation explaining to people why you bought it whereas you buy a Harley and spend time watching people awe at the beautiful motorcycle you just purchased and you can customize it to reflect your personality. Ever try to customize a Goldwing ? Two different worlds.
Let's REALLY be real:
1. Harley Davidson's failure rate is above 30%. Higher than any other manufacturer except Ducati and BMW. Yes Harley owners NEED a dealership on each block, in every city, in every state because they DO break down. Even the brand new 2024 bikes. Let's not pretend like this isn't an issue.
2. Indian motorcycles are a hell of a lot more reliable than Harleys. Hell, I have an old 2015 Victory Vision with over 55,000 miles. I've criss crossed the entire United States on my Vic and all I do is change the oil and tires. No so-called preventative maintenance, no scheduled tune-ups, recalls, modifications or any other kind of wrenching required. Just press the start button and go.
3. Harley has a Sears and Roebuck-sized catalog of aftermarket parts available because people have normalized modifying underpowered, underperforming, uncomfortable, tractor-riding Harleys for so long that people are conditioned to believe spending another $1500 to $6000 dollars on a bike they just bought to make it perform and ride as well as the competition is supposed to be part of the honor of owning a Harley.
Indian doesn't need to do anything but continue with their modest growth as the demand for big touring cruisers in general wanes. Meanwhile, Harley Davidson slowly collapses under their own weight. Indian motorcycles are designed and engineered so well all you need is an exhaust and a flash tune and you're good. No need for big bore kits, jugs, crazy cams, head work etc. unless you just want to go that crazy. Not like there aren't any parts out there. There are big bore kits for their Thunderstroke and Powerplus V-twins. There's just no need for a gigantic catalog just because that's what Harley guys are accustomed to doing.
Regarding the failure rate, I couldn’t find any data for Indian motorcycles so my data is annecdotal. But I mentioned it as a point to say Indian doesn’t have a stellar reputation. I’ve seen a fair share of comments on social media regarding Indian issues. If you can share data as to how Indian is more reliable than Harley please let me know
Regarding aftermarket parts - I disagree. The aftermarket exists because people clearly enjoy modifications. This is also true in the car industry, as well as several others. Regardless, if Indian wants to compete (in terms of sales) I believe they need an aftermarket scene that’s close to Harley. Just my opinion of course.
I agree 🍻
I have a couple of triumph 1200s, but I still want to get add one and stuff to make them perfect