I think the reason why the man in the wall wanted to remove the Lotus from her mother role for the tenno because then the tenno would be become just kids who are scared and not knowing what to do without a mother figure. With Lotus not in the picture, the man in the wall has more influnce over the tenno and becoming the tenno's "guardian" and will depend on the man in the wall. With how man in the wall view toward the tenno, they view as their children or even their dolls to mess with. If the man in the wall does care for the tennno, it in a abusive/manipulative manner. Just my thoughts.
Wally drives parents1.0 insane, trust towards parents broken, Rell keeps wally from tenno, orokin make lotus to stabilize tenno, Lotus gets removed, Rell dies, Wally ready to step in?
The Tenno are NOT children. They listen to the "empty" option in the Umbra quest. Keep in mind the fact the Tenno have fought a war. That with Umbra at least they *were* Umbra "I just killed my son!" Even if at some point they were a kid, after Umbra, they aren't. They are kids as much as Babette from Skyrim is.
@@dr.calibrations7984 then what would you say about Rell? was he a perfectly normal kid who, overtaken by the Man in the Wall, threw a facade to install a false narrative and that's why he's the only who has died? This is the only way I could see the Tenno being 'undying with an eternal body' but not Rell, and also how he was unaccounted for in Margulis' memories.
A part of me is considering that the Man in the Wall has our own goals in mind, but is also trying to get what it wants through us. It may even make us destroy the Lotus, just get us both our goals. Such as getting the Lotus back, then destroying her to further its own intentions.
1:42 yeah... literally mind fuck lmao In my opinion I believe the Man in the Wall is the literal representation of the Void's conciousness if that makes any sense, everything and everyone that has been in contact with the Void could potentially hear him and interact with him if he (the Void) so desires.
You know the series trans formers prime when megatron puts dark energon into his body he could control all that had somwhat connection to it that could be just like the man in the wall
So, I know in the past I've quoted Ember's Codex entry (regarding the fact that no children were supposed to be on the Zariman) and given multiverse theories (2 Zarimans, 1 with and 1 without children, crossing and returning to the wrong universe) and theories about the crew being de-aged, but I came across a thread about the theories regarding Albrecht and his interactions with the MitW, and one person suggested that time in the Void could be completely random in relation to time in the Origin System, and presented the idea that one would need a real-space item to kind of "force" time in the Void to behave in relation to the time outside of it. As such, another theory cropped up in my mind: perhaps, there were indeed no children on the vessel before it entered the Void "accidentally" (I still think the MitW had influence over this incident). Perhaps they had no such real-space item to force time in the Void to behave, and as such...they spent years upon years within it, held within the grasp and influence of the MitW as he watched them (remember the player-tenno's "father" mentioning something watching them?). A human crew, stuck on the same ship, for years, could cause relationships to blossom out of the sheer necessity for companionship, seeing as they would have no idea when or if they'd ever escape. And as such...they had children, among each other, within the Void. No one could have possibly fathomed what the Void could do to a living organism being developed inside it from conception to birth. This could very well have been a kind of experiment of the MitW, to see if such thing was possible, and then, once the children had grown enough, to cause an "elimination" of the now unneeded adults and release of the children back into the Origin System at any point in its time he so chooses. If the Orokin didn't know how unreliable the comparison of time within and without the Void was, then no wonder they'd be so baffled by children on a ship there weren't supposed to be children on, and wouldn't even consider the idea that they'd been conceived, born, and raised on it inside the Void if sufficient time hadn't passed in their system. After all, until they became war heroes, the Tenno had already been regarded as monsters, especially since they were now out of the comfortable cradle that was the Void keeping their abilities under wraps, perhaps even the MitW directly keeping them under control until then. This could also explain his attachment to the Tenno, his twisted thinking of them almost as his "children", and his manipulations possibly causing the elimination of any other potential parental figures should he feel slighted by them (Margulis's execution after she "cast" Rell out, since I still think he influenced Ballas, whereas Rell could have easily been his favorite considering how in-tune with the Void Rell was). Or when the brainwashed mother-figure had outlived her usefulness as that role and now, after the Tenno became _too_ dependent on her in his absence (Rell "imprisoning" him), _leading_ the Tenno to witness her betrayal in an attempt to almost be like, "how dare she betray you, but don't worry, _at least you have me, I'll always be here for you and always have."_ Or at least, that's the feeling I've been getting recently from reviewing the curscenes leading to the Lotus leaving, particularly with the MitW's actions and mannerisms, mocking the Lotus while leading us to watch her leave, and always making sure to pay us some sort of visit occasionally almost as a "remember me? I'm still here" type of sentiment. Like a father checking in on his children every once in a while, to let them know he still "cares". Sorry for the rambling 😅
@@TheDsIEGE My theory is that since the man in the wall seems to be a near godly entity it may be doing all this for enjoyment, or to seek entertainment in the boredom that such a status would bring.
I'm still hoping for an opportunity to side fully with good ol' Wally boy; I would love if there was an option to have him replace the Lotus as your quest speaker so I can take my marching orders straight from Nyarlathotep!
This video itself bring another interesting question: when the Lotus was still around, what did she really want? If she was a real mother, she would have the tenno try to live normal lives and be happy humans but she never, not even once, attempt to have the tenno lives peaceful lives. She saw the tenno as soldiers under the guise of "her children" We rescue people, do mobile defense, normal defense, spying, sabotage,etc but not once told us why/how this is important. She tell us it important but not the why.(if this is just a game mechanic, it kinda a lazy one) We never heard/know what happening behind the curtains. Because of this, I was always suspicious of Lotus and was not shocked when she was "stolen". WTF was Lotus' plan...
i remember reading that the origin system is so fucked up now that we cant even have a normal life +i believe she was kinda trying to protect us from the truth (that we are trained kids to be used as weapons) until stalker and hunhow made it impossible to hide it anymore so in conclusion i believe she thought making us save the system or making it a better place while upgrading our arsenal and be better prepared for stuff like vor or stalker is the only way for us to be kinda normal or cope
@@y0sef497 I remember reading about this too but the tenno are still children soldiers. Yes, I understand her wanting protect the tenno and training them to protect themselves but she never once told anything about what her plan in general. What about the people in Cetus, it probably the closest to a "normal life" in the game where are other kids, community, family, culture, etc. I guess I never trust the Lotus almost make me wonder what was her plan in the long run....
Yeah, what are those Lotus syndicate guys doing all the time(the dudes in the blue suits). We have to rescue them and they pull guard duty on stations, that's seemingly it And the fact that we maintain the balance between perpetually at war factions instead of taking over and stopping them (Which I dunno how many tenno there are in lore, but with player numbers we've got more than enough power to stop the grinner and corpus and small scale infestations)
@@TheDsIEGE yeah, the void is very powerful it seems, and if he's more powerful than the void, that could explain why he pops up like revelations from God to many characters in the story idk tho
Nice interesting parallels with Warframe and Bloodborne’s lore! I don’t know if you know this game, but the lore of the Void and of the Man in the Wall also seems to be heavily inspired by the lore of Dishonored, which got released almost at the same time as Warframe and has even more parallels with each other compared to Warframe. In Dishonored’s lore, there is an alternate plane of existence called the Void that is as old or even older than the corporeal universe, and is also a place where magic originates from, and where time/space/memories are convoluted. In addition, the Void has an emissary being called the Outsider, a near omnipotent being who blesses those that interest him with incredible powers, and also loves to interact and mess with his chosen. Does any of this sound familiar? Both the Man in the Wall and the Outsider have many similarities. Maybe the Man in the Wall is like the Outsider, interested in causing massive chaos, and like the Outsider in Dishonored, the Man in the Wall has bestowed the Tenno with god-like powers to fulfill his desire to see chaos and anarchy reign over, without necessarily directly interfering. The Man in the wall gave several children Void powers, and in the end they destroyed an Empire and drove the Sentients back to the Tau system. Now 1000 years later the Tenno are going to once again cause chaos as they fight in a new war with new factions, players, characters, and armies. Even more so now that their mother figure is now the enemy, and with the Corpus, Grineer, Sentients, and Orokin at each other’s throats again, there’s bound to be pandemonium. I can’t really think of any other crazy motivations for the Man in the Wall other than to sow chaos like his other Lovecraftian counterparts in other games/media so I’ll look forward to what you talk about in your next video!
the Outsider doesn't really want to cause chaos. He just finds it entertaining to observe if his subjects would abuse the powers he had given them. He predicts people to do the wrong thing which usually has a bigger negative impact on the world and he finds it funny how easy are people to predict but what entertains him the most are low-chaos choices, because they are surprising and unexpected.
"Oh you naughty naughty you tease me" is all that's going through my mind finishing this video your videos are so great and addicting and I'm hooked. Keep it up.💯❤
The man in the wall. An entity of the void. Hes the one that gave us the powers. He saw the effects of the void on humans and gave the children the chance to fight it off. He is the father of the Tenno. Speaking as a father would to his child. Doing what he believes is best for them. His final act it to bring the tenno, his children, into the void the become as powerful as he is. Possibly to instead to stay in our dimension and rule over it. Another idea is he is the literal manifestation of the fermi paradox. Making him the force that stops a sentient species from growing to the point of cross galactic crusading. Instead of some hard cut end of that species it trims down the ability to traverse and leaves us to try and appreciate what little slice of the universe we have. By way of a war that burns away what he deems unnecessary. Oh right that's the red veil's whole thing isn't it?
Thanks for upload as always enjoy what you give us. I believe he is just a entity watching over us. As you mention before, he does appear floating over us in some battles. Reil after we free him, found compassion in us. We become closer to him, we become a friend. Just my 2 cents. Peace friend and again thanks for your content.
@@TheDsIEGE I agree, at same time as he was mock and cast away by others Margulis was the only one to be there for him. With the lotus behind us and when we help Paladino. Reil maybe see's a ally in us... Anyway love your content even if I am on a Warframe ''break'' lol
I watched first part of "The Devil in the Details" and there I saw parts of my theory about warframe lore. I am impressed about that you saw these small but important things in game. Your video was really interesting and I watched your other videos. Your videos are just awesome. Keep it up :)
I've always seen the Man in the Wall as a Loki-type figure by screwing with us for what seems like partly shits and giggles and partly to help us achieve some unknowable goal.
I'm only just finding this series now, but I can confirm one small thing. Long ago I had actually started playing games with Erra's voice actor on Warframe and Halo. I basically asked him before New War came out, "What's something you can tell us about the story without spoiling anything major?" His response was "When Erra speaks, think to yourself, is it REALLY Erra?" Vague and interesting, and just finding your series here has started to make me realize what he may have meant by that. Gonna keep watching now that I got that outta the way. Dope series btw
Sweet! Bloodborne in a Warframe video. I also viewed certain entities as a kind of mind parasite or a creature that lives in the collective unconscious of living things like SCP 5000.
How is it that Nora knows, "there is something watching us, from a direction that we cannot point"? What is her connection to all of this? She has too much info not to be involved in some way.
The man in the wall really confuses me but it makes me more interested, like was he on the zaraman ten zero? Was he here before time? Is he the first "human"? It's weird
It think it's more like an entity of the Void or your void possessed second personality. I can word it like: "It's like your twin bother or your mirror.. but it's not.. looks like you.. but it's feels different.. An identity that was always around you, but now you see it too.. It's the Man in the Wall... The Void.."
@@martinnagy3791 Interesting theory, like when the zaraman accident happen we sorta had our personalities split and that's when the man in the wall takes control of the other personality
i think the man in the wall is on our side but still has his own goals, i had this theory that he's actually controlling the lotus after ballas "freed her" and now he's making it so we kill sentients little by little with the events until they all completely die out (cool frost btw)
I’ve been waiting for part 2. The man in the wall could be in the void and doesn’t know how to get out and needs the Tenno is get lotus back and get her to help the Tenno but this ‘Tenno’ is the man in the wall and that way he can get out. Just an idea, might be very far stretched but Yano, cheers for the video though
Man in the Wall: My goals are beyond your understanding The time jumps type things could be shown through the concept of void storms & the duviri paradox associated with it. It could be that void itself is associated with time since harnessing void energy kinda gave immortality type stuff and the kuva extraction/harvester is actually extracting traces of void energy from different planets. I believe that, the more we try to embrace the power of the void, we open small holes for the man in the wall to come through. Making him more and more in control of our memories. I want to see the void storms, because I think that Cephlon CY might have a lot of experience with it. CY might help us uncover a lot of stuff. Wraith warframe's lore might have a bunch of cool stuff as it is supposed to be related to the void storms. Additionally, in a way, the wraith's shadow is some sort of a man in the wall type entity for the wraith warframe.
Bro i never thought loreframe would be still alive. Awesome video by the way. I think we some revelations from deimos. It is cleared that the transference is something artificial created by the orokin using the heart. Maybe it is extracting the void resources and because of that man in the wall got freed once more. And also it may have freed himself in zariman tenzero too but was sealed by margulis. But the orokin created transference and release, maybe putting the whole origin system in danger
I was squealing at the connections of Bloodborne with the use of the ruins and requiems. And a cliff hanger leaving us to ask “Why make the Lotus look like the bad guy” has me wanting more. 🙇♀️Like right now.
@@TheDsIEGE And I apologize for being impatient. The wait for this video was worth it and waiting for the next means it has been given a lot of thought to it. 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏Amazing work, my dude!!!
Here's my question; let's say that the Man in the Wall is trying to get the tenno to go to war with Natah. If that's the case, why show us the final cutscene from the new war? The Tenno already saw the first interactions between Natah and her supposed brother, and she calls them the enemy, so it's pretty clear that at that moment she was prepared to fight us. That, and we fought against her Ropalotyst, so it seems like Conflict has already begun. That being said, what's the point of the Man in the Wall showing us a scene in which Natah is having doubts? A scene in which it's pretty clear that Natah is being manipulated somehow. I have a few ideas that aren't very thought at, but just explanations I had if that were the case. 1. Margulis still has influence over us, or at least the Lotus helmet that allows us to see a fair bit of these visions. My only real evidence for this is the calling for the Tenno during the Sacrific and I think motives are a lot more clear with Margulis showing us Natah being manipulated vs the man in the wall. 2. The Man in the Wall manipulated the memory of Natah already, by making her, and us by extension, believe that they did kill Erra when they never did. (This is the weakest possibility I think) 3. The Man in the Wall wants us confused, and to hesitate at every step. I think a large portion of the community wanted Natah dead after her initial betrayel, but as we got more information, and have seemingly been put up to kill the Lotus by everyone, it seems like we're getting set up, and that's making people think we shouldn't kill Natah. Heck, maybe this is a win win for the Man in the Wall; either Natah kills us or we kill her, one less loose end. Those are just some of my thoughts.
The man in the wall wrote "he suffers while you dream" on the wall...tht means Rell's mind is still alive but suffering in a humanoid form in a psychic plain through the harrow warframe, and we would still be in the cryo pod if we did the quest for the first time
My personal belief of The Man in the Wall is most similar to what you explained, specifically to the point of it being not a single entity but a being linked to Void-touched entities in our world. To elaborate on my view on The Man in the Wall I’ll need to explain my view on the nature of the void (since it’s most likely its origin), thematically speaking they’ve likened the process of communicating with the void as in staring at a “mirror” (especially in Deimos) and that explains why The Man in the Wall appears as an entity similar to us for it is our reflection from the void. That also might explain one of the possible natures of the void and why we see the Zaramin 10-0 in Daviri.
I'd say the MitW's goal is to leave us alone and helpless, with nobody to truly rely on. This way we'll be more inclined to follow his plan. I wonder it will be the usual Void/Dark vs Light thing, where the Void wants to engulf everything
I like how SEIGE keeps teasing and scaring us, by putting that empty...souless...taunting smile and those ugly...golden eyes...this guy knows to trigger someone
The benefit of a war between Tenno and the Lotus is so I do not have to hear Its the Grineer on a Grineer based planet where there is 100 in front of me
Well New War is practically confirmed for this year, so we may finally figure out what it going on. I have always trusted DE to make good cinematic quests, they haven't let me down in the past. So I trust that whatever they have planned, has a very high chance of being good, and hopefully answeres a lot of these questions.
Hello here from watching ur video on us not being alone...spending about 3hrs on ur page really made me learn about warframe and entertain me...this is the longest I've been on TH-cam I now love ur channel and have "hey kiddophobia"
I've had an idea on how others experience the man in the wall. It's similar to how in kingdom hearts xion is seen through Roxas' eyes as a black haired Kairi, but xigbar saw ventus. And others saw different things. I think the man in the walls appearance is different to who perceives him, as a means to make himself more... palatable(?)... or to achieve what ever he need to with an image that's more personal to the observer.
This may sound too obvious, idk, but I just wanted to share something I heard of: the "wall" itself is just a symbolism that represents the "wall that separates us from the other persons", the informations about ourselves that we don't share with anyone. The Man in the Wall is an entity that can see through this wall - he sits *on* the wall. That is, he would be an omniscient being.
Now that you mention it, do we really owe the him or is that just what he wants us to think? Influencing us with the memories of someone else that does owe him, but having primed us into thinking we might with the "Don't forget" line to get us to think we're remembering out own debts.
The gist I've gotten is that the man in the wall is not so much evil, as he is someone who admires those who seek to become stronger or greater and possess the potential to do so. The actions the tenno takes that he seems to most support are ones that are geared towards ruthless pragmatism and self improvement albeit divorced of any moral or ethical concerns.
So an update from earlier, I was doing railjack and Everytime you exit a mission he speakes to you, so that's why I believe he is trapped in the void and doesn't want us to leave
I love this therorys but maybe he's just the manifested fears, anger, happiness or just strong feelings of an person that is heavily influenced by the void. It's maybe just, how the void works. Mysterious... But this thing with Rell.... Mmmhmhm
Siege, I love these in depth lore theory videos but the problem is by mentionng the doppelganger voice you now had me comparing your voice in pt1 versus now.
I think that "Wally" is a construct of the Void, made through thousands of memories stored through the vast realm, since Void is known to be able to store such things as memories or points in time. Their ultimate goal might be something less grand than we expect, they might want to feel, like we do. Being trapped in a realm like the Void since forever, witnessing events yet never able to participate and made through god knows how many personalities that conflict for dominance might be why sometimes act more "evil" than other times when he helps, sometimes he's more desperate to reach their goal than other times.
The lack of information makes us anxious and scared, we don't even know if killing Natah is something good or not even with them throwing this idea towards us, the Man in the Wall looks like an ally, an enemy and a neutral entity that just wants to have some fun all at the same time. This leaves us without a north, it's scary.
It's not 100% of course but I'm pretty sure Albrecht Entrati's seriglass bell is more like a diving bell than the noisemaking kind. Look at the image of the shattered sphere that appears when he describes his first journey into the Void and meeting the Man in the Wall.
Today I had the man in the wallaby's as my operator near the operator room but it was looking around the corner it scared me a little much more then it should have.
It might have something to do with the derviary paradox as we saw the real, tenno the human one. He might be trying to cause a masive anomaly for some randome purpose as he needed some minnions to control, thats why he needed to make the tenno. He had the means with the zaramen 10-0 and the void storm massacre.
It's very likely that the lotus' memory (and the flashback we were shown) has been manipulated in some way, as Erra is still alive and emphasis wass given on that confusion. I initially thought that the erra we see now isn't the real one and that the real one was dead, but it's possible that we and the lotus actually don't remember correctly what happened, as Erra suggests.
The man in the wall IS an alternate universe. He became aware of the physical universe of Earth when the Orokin ripped a hole in their universe and entered the void. He's never met another entity and has become fascinated with the members of the Earth universe. However, he's not physical in the way the entities from the game universe are. It gives him great power, in a way, but also renders him impotent where physical actions are concerned. It's basically the Beyonder from Marvel comic books.
The benefits of fighting against Natah would be: A. maybe thats a way for DE to imploment more stuff like ordis becoming Ordan, something regarding Ballas and maybe it is a way for you to fight against Hunhow. So maybe that would be an easy way to continue the story B. The players kinda feel like they have a connection with Lotus and fighting in a way against her now that she is Natah would make the story more dramatic. C. Maybe DE wants to show that way that Tenno isnt who he used to be, they have been disconnected from Lotus for so long that they have now matured they are now stronger and that they are older like what we see in the teaser in which tenno is clearly older, he now looks like a 15 year old but in the teaser he looks maybe mid 30s
During The New War, I had a feeling that he, at the time, had NO INTENTION of harming us. Instead he seemed more like he wanted to protect us and keep us informed on CERTAIN subjects. I think, he’s more or less trying to do so because he has plans for us. Plans that, in order for them to work, require US.
Dispute to something near the end. If the vision you see in your personal room in the orbiter is a earlier memory then when did the lotus become alien lotus? Because the tenno did meet her in person during our playtime. If the man can show past memories, then why not current experiences as well
Let me start by saying that although the man in the wall seems to be a mental projection right now the fingers on our railjacks are quite tangible, he is not tangible from what we've seen up to this point, he possibly isn't capable of assuming that state right now. As for the tenno, we've been branded as "betrayers" in times past (an event which wasn't recounted except in lore, of which we might not even have memories of), the tenno are secluded, outcasts, they have to prove themselves to each faction they have dealings with. The tenno's only anchor was the lotus, now gone. The tenno are literally being groomed to distrust the lotus and view her as the enemy whilst being given small pats on the back and "words of comfort" (if you can call them that) from our new wall-dwelling "friend". So let's assume that this is all the work of the man in the wall: They force the lotus to "sing" and gather the sentient army, apparently her being the only one who can. Such an army would press us hard. In dire need, we search for something we can wield against this threat. Along comes a friendly face, somebody who has given us something before, offering the perfect solution to our current predicament. And all we have to do is open the gates a little wider, wide enough for more than fingers to slip in.
See this is why the Tenno should just say screw it and take up Grunkle Parvos' offer to work together. Yeah he probably wants to form another cult or something, but he's dead smart to the point of being able to rival the Orokin. He could probably help find a way to ward off ol Wally.
I think the man in the wall is the void itself. I think it is kinda like the voodoo cyberspace gods in the sprawl trilogy and he just wants to experience being different
What if the man in the wall is a tenno who was left in the void during the ship thing but then he grew instead of staying a child or he is the material form of our operator and switches to his soul form whenever which is why he talks to us like he knows us.
Liking the vids! They are making me think more (explains the headaches lol) A war with Natah huh....what if the void has more just 'The man in the wall' , we see in the paradox trailer some kinda creepy skelly thing, what if it's a minion of him? Arguably the most powerful factions are the sentients and the tenno....even with the tenno being un-organised past maybe some clans with their own agendas. They are still so strong that just one is the equivalent of 100 army's. But if the tenno go to war with the sentients, they are more likely to grow using void powers...his powers, and chances are void fissures and storms would get worse as we causualy cast space magic warfare. That's my shot in the dark anyway!
The Man in the wall is probably one of the most interesting Engimas. The question starts with, is he friend, or foe. Regardless if the memory is altered, Natah is acting under her own auspices. More so, I would say that the red from War within is the Kuva more than anything to be frank. If you consider the full events of warframe, Everything went wrong when the gate to the Void was first opened. The Fall of the Orokin Empire can almost be directly correlated to Void discoveries (the implementation of the Flaw), the origin of the Tenno and their powers, and more. Up until it's fall, the Tenno seem almost like slave warriors of a kind. They obviously served the Empire for a extended period thanks to the stories of the Leverian, as well as apparently the full on formation of Tenno Schools to format and regulate the Tenno's powers. And yet all that time, the Void keeps fueling their power. The Man in the wall is I think the single most important entity for the full story. I believe it's because of him that the Empire ultimately fell and because of him the Sentients invaded as well. The Void also is I think, not a place. The Man in the wall does not feel like a personal shadow but instead the total collective consciousness of the Void in it's entirety. The Man seems to be fully capable of manipulating the Void to the projection of vision, memory, and more. Touching on your video about the Karma system and how the Night form sees him more or less merged to us and having us under his sway, I would say it's only 'more' under sway. The Man is clearly able to take a Tenno and rip their consciousness across lightyears at a time, meaning he is universally omnipotent to the actions of the Sentients and other races at one time. His power is more extreme near active void gates of course, but Tenno seem to be walking anomalies unto themselves. I want to remind here that Warframes Focus Void energy, not contain it. Ember's fire isn't because it's Ember. It's still the Tenno's raw power, and I will tell you my Ember is a walking apocalypse. Anyway, when the Sentients plot something, the Man seems to be warning the Tenno about the oncoming threat more than anything. Him using shadow Lotuses is suspect, but I don't think anyone here now sees the Lotus as a ally anyway. What this all however proves is we are fully under the Man's sway. I think his actions right now are benevolent only towards what he might call his 'children', which would explain his indifference and sheer horror to all other factions who get too close to the Void, yet gives the Tenno undeniable raw power instead. Going forward, I would think the Man will take up ever more prominent positions in the life of our Tenno. It's very likely he will have a more extreme presence on the Duviri plains. I think right now the reason the Sentients are going all out to end the Tenno is because they seek to crush the Man by killing his most overpowering servants. We are the darkness, the Demons, of a extremely powerful deity who more or less lets us wander freely. I would even think our continuous presence of causing endless bloody warfare across the System might even be fueling the Man in some capacity. His arrival in the timeline has only ever begotten more bloodshed. In all honesty, I wouldn't be surprised if he was devouring Oro, or rather the Souls of mortals. As long as the Tenno exist, the grim tally will constantly climb.
It's true... the connection the void gave the system life, but just like oxygen is both the reason we live and the reason we'll die, the void may too be both the savior and the destroyer of this system.
@@TheDsIEGE I think it strikes a balance. Like Oil and water, it can't fully manifest itself. The presence of Void Storms I think indicates a heavy bleed over effect, as the many void gates have been open constantly. Zoom out on the galaxy map and you can see Void storms raging on the periphery of the system. I think what we have right now is a pact with a devil of some kind. Just so happens that devil is on our side. Sentients may just have a grudge too, so have to be careful postulating too much. But when we look at the story of Rell, the Red Veil went completely psychopathic. The Horror of the Void seems almost toxic to mortal beings. And the Chains quest only proves we met the Man before. First time you go to Lua during the Second Dream, you will encounter shadowy Infested. This is rather odd, you know..when the same shadow people also appeared in the place of the corrupted Rell. The Void I think is critical to the well being of the Oro. But itself is a extreme danger to all mortals as the Void seems to crave chaos. Are Tenno already fulfilling it's purpose? If so, that may be why it is so laid back, save in matters involving the one true enemy that actually is difficult to fight in the game, the Sentients.
Deadspace was a influence for certain things in warframe that’s why certain aspects look alike like the way you pickup things looks similar and the UI that’s why the menu looks like part of the game. And sure the game is very different in terms of tone but both have a similar feel when you ADS even tho it’s much easier than deadspace. Warframe was inspired by scary games like dead space and left 4 dead.
The Man in the Wall is the biggest enigma in Warframe right now. We have next to zero information about who or what he is. However, here is a thought. What if He/It is an Orokin; like Nihil, and is manipulating forces towards a final goal? Maybe he doesn't want the Tenno specifically going after/killing Lotus as much as taking the fight to the Sentients, which are a far larger threat. If the Sentient issue is resolved, he can move on to whatever he has planned next. Although, perhaps the Void is fed by humanity and their emotions. The Man could be a subconscious manifestation that in turn influences the physical world. Kind of like the snake eating itself, both feeding on each other. A few more ideas to muddy the waters. ;)
Well with the Tenno fighting the Lotus, much of the Sol System would be thrown into chaos. Grineer would grow bold and attempt to expand further, the Corpus would likely attempt to seize more power from the absent Tenno and the Infestation would spread further and faster, potentially absorbing both factions entirely as they have proven inept at containing it, at least for long. We kept these 3 factions mostly in check since our awakening. And with us distracted, the Sentients could come in and do some serious damage, if not wipe them out. They brought the Orokin to their knees until the Tenno were unleashed, what chance does a degrading clone army or selfish bankers have against them? Whatever is manipulating everything behind the scenes, man in the wall or something else clearly wants a large-scale conflict. The Sentient scout ships we fought off are clear evidence of that as what other reason could they really be coming to the Sol system for? They fought the Orokin to stop them from destroying another system, but now that the Orokin are gone what other faction poses a threat to Andromeda now? Sure Hunhow would want Natah back but I doubt they are willing to begin another genocide just for one of their own and even so, they have her back now so why continue pushing for war? After all, we still don't know the circumstances of our own betrayal. We defeated the Sentients but then immediately slaughtered the people we fought to defend afterwards? The Man in the Wall or whoever it may be has been manipulating things long before the Old War and potentially further back than the Zarimen incident. This thing has been at work for a long time, and I doubt this'll be over anytime soon.
I think they depict natah more as a victim than a villian the chimera scenes. Especially with how she was trying to remember things then was thrown into some machine when she was saying things didn't add up.
@@TheDsIEGE Militant, but confused. Edit: To clarify, It seems to me she was being even more manipulated than before. And she was starting to see that. At least from my perspective.
he may be a person created from the subconscious mind and memories of the tenno but cant reveal all the memories to avoid damaging the tenno's mind maaan idk he is so mysteries as always nice video
yeah that may explain why he says hey "KIDDO" every time because he wasn't sleeping as the tenno were add to that the line in the second dream "you owe me" might indicate that he did something to us (or for us) so before we go zzzzz
. Every time you've indicated the man in the wall's presence, it's given us something. Not to say we should trust it, but it hardly seems to be so generous with others that it encounters. I'm starting to think that it might be benign, or at least think it's being benign, to us out of familiarity. The Orokin claimed that the Zarimen Ten Zero did not and would not have children on board. I may be wrong, being bad with time tables in general, but I don't think it was lost for long enough for the crew to just start coupling up as though they would never return home and decided to make a new life on the ship. I'm starting to think that the Tenno are examples of whatever the man in the wall is or at least a piece of it, simply given a defined form. That, this might be it trying to replace the lotus and reconnect with those that left it behind in the void. To be clear, I think that from start to end, the Zeramen ten zero made one continuous journey. Originally I had assumed there was some sort of inhabited world on the other side of the void, but with the way the crew died, the Orokin response, the non existent knowledge of Orokin procedure such a return trip would require, and the heavy use of memory alteration, it may have been an attempt by the man in the wall to create a physical body for its self and replace the crew. This assuming it didn't understand individuality and accidently made multiple bodies based on the crew, possibly of their own younger selves. That said, I'm probably going off on a tangent. Not like I have anything other than the weird way my mind connects likely faulty information to support this in the first place.
Honestly I've never questioned if the man in world is real, the personality and constant hints seem way too detailed, but what I'm truly interested in is what happens if The Man in World is completely released unrestrained.
Personally I still believe Ballas wasn't overtaken by the Man until he died, the voice change can be explained as simply "resonating inside your head". The events of the Old War as portrayed may have been where the Tenno gave this "IOU" to the Man in the Wall, giving them enough power to wipe out the invasion entirely and brainwashing Natah borrowing the Tenno's memories of their expired caretaker. The Man in The Wall may have come back to us when Teshin made us do that one trip to memory lane and the Tenno awakened their powers, but it was only until we unchained the vessel that he properly lodged himself in our minds. I couldn't really explain Ballas' reappearence but one thing that's almost certain is it's linked with the Moon being retransported into orbit, whether that got his attention specially with Umbra awakening or all along he was hiding in it who knows. After his death (quotation marks?) he either is still there or only the Man in the Wall remains in his the chimera body. Giving the Man in The Wall credit for EVERYTHING that happened since TWW seems a little too much, telling Ballas has always been notBallas since a little after Margulis' death seems a little too much. Ok God of Schemes and all but we have to set a line in which this dude took notice and decided to fuck around with existence, to me a good line seems to be the Old War, where his interventions started to assume some semblance of a shape and which consequences affected the future relevant to us.
If we're asking what the purpose of pitting the tenno against the lotus is, it may lie in what the tenno can do with the lotus. In the cinematic with erra, the lotus appears to be able to control or unify the tenno to attack erra. So perhaps the lotus has some form of connection to each tenno, like the khala from starcraft 2, that serves as some kind of protection or restraint on the tenno. Then, the reason the man in the wall would want to kill the lotus, which is his most likely objective, is to destroy that connection. From here on, I'm not sure what might happen but if I follow my starcraft example, he may wish to replace the lotus and gain command of the tenno. Side note: why is it that when ballas removes the wires from the lotus, we start seeing interference? And if we're seeing this from ballas' perspective, why don't we see the lotus' face?
Also @DarkPhoenix I just realized! Every. Single. Tenno. Already has a transference bolt in them so the can operate the Warframes granted it's nothing advanced like with Ballas and Umbra and acts more as like...a string connected to puppets but what if, OK What if! That machine Lotus was hooked up to was somehow linked up with Every Single transference bolt in all of the tenno and that's how she controlled them against Erra and THAT is what TMITW wants
I think the reason why the man in the wall wanted to remove the Lotus from her mother role for the tenno because then the tenno would be become just kids who are scared and not knowing what to do without a mother figure. With Lotus not in the picture, the man in the wall has more influnce over the tenno and becoming the tenno's "guardian" and will depend on the man in the wall.
With how man in the wall view toward the tenno, they view as their children or even their dolls to mess with. If the man in the wall does care for the tennno, it in a abusive/manipulative manner.
Just my thoughts.
Wally drives parents1.0 insane, trust towards parents broken, Rell keeps wally from tenno, orokin make lotus to stabilize tenno, Lotus gets removed, Rell dies, Wally ready to step in?
The Tenno are NOT children. They listen to the "empty" option in the Umbra quest. Keep in mind the fact the Tenno have fought a war. That with Umbra at least they *were* Umbra "I just killed my son!" Even if at some point they were a kid, after Umbra, they aren't. They are kids as much as Babette from Skyrim is.
@@dr.calibrations7984 then what would you say about Rell? was he a perfectly normal kid who, overtaken by the Man in the Wall, threw a facade to install a false narrative and that's why he's the only who has died? This is the only way I could see the Tenno being 'undying with an eternal body' but not Rell, and also how he was unaccounted for in Margulis' memories.
I love how the lore is so creepy
me too.
As it should be
Maybe the man in the wall is orokin who traped in void (duviri paradox)
Ikr
@@leonaluceid2388 maybe 👀
A part of me is considering that the Man in the Wall has our own goals in mind, but is also trying to get what it wants through us. It may even make us destroy the Lotus, just get us both our goals. Such as getting the Lotus back, then destroying her to further its own intentions.
I like the way you think!
1:42 yeah... literally mind fuck lmao
In my opinion I believe the Man in the Wall is the literal representation of the Void's conciousness if that makes any sense, everything and everyone that has been in contact with the Void could potentially hear him and interact with him if he (the Void) so desires.
It makes complete sense.
You know the series trans formers prime when megatron puts dark energon into his body he could control all that had somwhat connection to it that could be just like the man in the wall
So, I know in the past I've quoted Ember's Codex entry (regarding the fact that no children were supposed to be on the Zariman) and given multiverse theories (2 Zarimans, 1 with and 1 without children, crossing and returning to the wrong universe) and theories about the crew being de-aged, but I came across a thread about the theories regarding Albrecht and his interactions with the MitW, and one person suggested that time in the Void could be completely random in relation to time in the Origin System, and presented the idea that one would need a real-space item to kind of "force" time in the Void to behave in relation to the time outside of it.
As such, another theory cropped up in my mind: perhaps, there were indeed no children on the vessel before it entered the Void "accidentally" (I still think the MitW had influence over this incident). Perhaps they had no such real-space item to force time in the Void to behave, and as such...they spent years upon years within it, held within the grasp and influence of the MitW as he watched them (remember the player-tenno's "father" mentioning something watching them?). A human crew, stuck on the same ship, for years, could cause relationships to blossom out of the sheer necessity for companionship, seeing as they would have no idea when or if they'd ever escape. And as such...they had children, among each other, within the Void. No one could have possibly fathomed what the Void could do to a living organism being developed inside it from conception to birth.
This could very well have been a kind of experiment of the MitW, to see if such thing was possible, and then, once the children had grown enough, to cause an "elimination" of the now unneeded adults and release of the children back into the Origin System at any point in its time he so chooses. If the Orokin didn't know how unreliable the comparison of time within and without the Void was, then no wonder they'd be so baffled by children on a ship there weren't supposed to be children on, and wouldn't even consider the idea that they'd been conceived, born, and raised on it inside the Void if sufficient time hadn't passed in their system. After all, until they became war heroes, the Tenno had already been regarded as monsters, especially since they were now out of the comfortable cradle that was the Void keeping their abilities under wraps, perhaps even the MitW directly keeping them under control until then.
This could also explain his attachment to the Tenno, his twisted thinking of them almost as his "children", and his manipulations possibly causing the elimination of any other potential parental figures should he feel slighted by them (Margulis's execution after she "cast" Rell out, since I still think he influenced Ballas, whereas Rell could have easily been his favorite considering how in-tune with the Void Rell was). Or when the brainwashed mother-figure had outlived her usefulness as that role and now, after the Tenno became _too_ dependent on her in his absence (Rell "imprisoning" him), _leading_ the Tenno to witness her betrayal in an attempt to almost be like, "how dare she betray you, but don't worry, _at least you have me, I'll always be here for you and always have."_
Or at least, that's the feeling I've been getting recently from reviewing the curscenes leading to the Lotus leaving, particularly with the MitW's actions and mannerisms, mocking the Lotus while leading us to watch her leave, and always making sure to pay us some sort of visit occasionally almost as a "remember me? I'm still here" type of sentiment. Like a father checking in on his children every once in a while, to let them know he still "cares".
Sorry for the rambling 😅
As if Wally wasn’t already scary enough
Good point, lol
@@TheDsIEGE My theory is that since the man in the wall seems to be a near godly entity it may be doing all this for enjoyment, or to seek entertainment in the boredom that such a status would bring.
I'm still hoping for an opportunity to side fully with good ol' Wally boy; I would love if there was an option to have him replace the Lotus as your quest speaker so I can take my marching orders straight from Nyarlathotep!
As long as it's some lovecraftian god, it's all good!
This video itself bring another interesting question: when the Lotus was still around, what did she really want? If she was a real mother, she would have the tenno try to live normal lives and be happy humans but she never, not even once, attempt to have the tenno lives peaceful lives. She saw the tenno as soldiers under the guise of "her children"
We rescue people, do mobile defense, normal defense, spying, sabotage,etc but not once told us why/how this is important. She tell us it important but not the why.(if this is just a game mechanic, it kinda a lazy one) We never heard/know what happening behind the curtains. Because of this, I was always suspicious of Lotus and was not shocked when she was "stolen".
WTF was Lotus' plan...
Now you're asking the important questions.
i remember reading that the origin system is so fucked up now that we cant even have a normal life +i believe she was kinda trying to protect us from the truth (that we are trained kids to be used as weapons) until stalker and hunhow made it impossible to hide it anymore
so in conclusion i believe she thought making us save the system or making it a better place while upgrading our arsenal and be better prepared for stuff like vor or stalker is the only way for us to be kinda normal or cope
@@y0sef497 I remember reading about this too but the tenno are still children soldiers. Yes, I understand her wanting protect the tenno and training them to protect themselves but she never once told anything about what her plan in general.
What about the people in Cetus, it probably the closest to a "normal life" in the game where are other kids, community, family, culture, etc.
I guess I never trust the Lotus almost make me wonder what was her plan in the long run....
Yeah, what are those Lotus syndicate guys doing all the time(the dudes in the blue suits). We have to rescue them and they pull guard duty on stations, that's seemingly it
And the fact that we maintain the balance between perpetually at war factions instead of taking over and stopping them (Which I dunno how many tenno there are in lore, but with player numbers we've got more than enough power to stop the grinner and corpus and small scale infestations)
It's important to remember the Apostacy prologue, it seems the Lotus was "programmed" in a sense by the Orokin. Who only saw the children as soldiers.
Ayy part 2 is here, thanks for this DsIEGE
I wonder how powerful the man in the wall is
In my opinion? Well, how powerful is the void?
@@TheDsIEGE yeah, the void is very powerful it seems, and if he's more powerful than the void, that could explain why he pops up like revelations from God to many characters in the story
idk tho
Or maybe he is the void?
@@TheDsIEGE yeah true he could be, and or he might have restricted powers in the void
Chains of harrow✨ no cap had me scared asf just seing the shadow in front of me i would start running with my regular saryn😂💀
The man in the wall is afraid of the MIGHTY SEER
Nice interesting parallels with Warframe and Bloodborne’s lore!
I don’t know if you know this game, but the lore of the Void and of the Man in the Wall also seems to be heavily inspired by the lore of Dishonored, which got released almost at the same time as Warframe and has even more parallels with each other compared to Warframe.
In Dishonored’s lore, there is an alternate plane of existence called the Void that is as old or even older than the corporeal universe, and is also a place where magic originates from, and where time/space/memories are convoluted. In addition, the Void has an emissary being called the Outsider, a near omnipotent being who blesses those that interest him with incredible powers, and also loves to interact and mess with his chosen.
Does any of this sound familiar?
Both the Man in the Wall and the Outsider have many similarities. Maybe the Man in the Wall is like the Outsider, interested in causing massive chaos, and like the Outsider in Dishonored, the Man in the Wall has bestowed the Tenno with god-like powers to fulfill his desire to see chaos and anarchy reign over, without necessarily directly interfering.
The Man in the wall gave several children Void powers, and in the end they destroyed an Empire and drove the Sentients back to the Tau system. Now 1000 years later the Tenno are going to once again cause chaos as they fight in a new war with new factions, players, characters, and armies. Even more so now that their mother figure is now the enemy, and with the Corpus, Grineer, Sentients, and Orokin at each other’s throats again, there’s bound to be pandemonium.
I can’t really think of any other crazy motivations for the Man in the Wall other than to sow chaos like his other Lovecraftian counterparts in other games/media so I’ll look forward to what you talk about in your next video!
Really? I may have to play that game... I never knew!
the Outsider doesn't really want to cause chaos. He just finds it entertaining to observe if his subjects would abuse the powers he had given them. He predicts people to do the wrong thing which usually has a bigger negative impact on the world and he finds it funny how easy are people to predict but what entertains him the most are low-chaos choices, because they are surprising and unexpected.
"Oh you naughty naughty you tease me" is all that's going through my mind finishing this video your videos are so great and addicting and I'm hooked. Keep it up.💯❤
Thank you! I'm glad you're enjoying them!
*watches video
*snorts Kuva
Dude what if we are the Wall
What if indeed...
The man in the wall.
An entity of the void. Hes the one that gave us the powers. He saw the effects of the void on humans and gave the children the chance to fight it off. He is the father of the Tenno.
Speaking as a father would to his child. Doing what he believes is best for them. His final act it to bring the tenno, his children, into the void the become as powerful as he is. Possibly to instead to stay in our dimension and rule over it.
Another idea is he is the literal manifestation of the fermi paradox. Making him the force that stops a sentient species from growing to the point of cross galactic crusading. Instead of some hard cut end of that species it trims down the ability to traverse and leaves us to try and appreciate what little slice of the universe we have. By way of a war that burns away what he deems unnecessary.
Oh right that's the red veil's whole thing isn't it?
Thanks for upload as always enjoy what you give us. I believe he is just a entity watching over us. As you mention before, he does appear floating over us in some battles. Reil after we free him, found compassion in us. We become closer to him, we become a friend. Just my 2 cents. Peace friend and again thanks for your content.
Hey, like I said in the video, many believe him to be an ally, and... maybe that's what he is, or at least what he wants us to believe he is.
@@TheDsIEGE I agree, at same time as he was mock and cast away by others Margulis was the only one to be there for him. With the lotus behind us and when we help Paladino. Reil maybe see's a ally in us... Anyway love your content even if I am on a Warframe ''break'' lol
Don't tell anyone but aside from getting footage for videos, so am I, lol...
and btw LOVE the title The Devil in the Details its really cool and you actualy remember to play warframe! Love the content YOU make
I watched first part of "The Devil in the Details" and there I saw parts of my theory about warframe lore. I am impressed about that you saw these small but important things in game. Your video was really interesting and I watched your other videos. Your videos are just awesome. Keep it up :)
I've always seen the Man in the Wall as a Loki-type figure by screwing with us for what seems like partly shits and giggles and partly to help us achieve some unknowable goal.
Gotta say, i didnt know how much i missed you videos until you started you upload agein.
Hey thank you! I'm glad you are enjoying it!
I'm only just finding this series now, but I can confirm one small thing. Long ago I had actually started playing games with Erra's voice actor on Warframe and Halo. I basically asked him before New War came out, "What's something you can tell us about the story without spoiling anything major?"
His response was "When Erra speaks, think to yourself, is it REALLY Erra?" Vague and interesting, and just finding your series here has started to make me realize what he may have meant by that. Gonna keep watching now that I got that outta the way. Dope series btw
I knew it!!!! Thank you for that!!!
@@TheDsIEGE glad I could be any help. ❤️
Love the voice filter. Perhaps the War is meant to completely sever us from the Lotus, leaving the tenno vulnerable to further influence from wally?
Sweet! Bloodborne in a Warframe video. I also viewed certain entities as a kind of mind parasite or a creature that lives in the collective unconscious of living things like SCP 5000.
Thank you for such a good source of lore your narrating skills are AMAZING!
Thank you!
How is it that Nora knows, "there is something watching us, from a direction that we cannot point"? What is her connection to all of this? She has too much info not to be involved in some way.
I rarely comment on people stuff but I love your lore theory’s and I hope you make more
I definitely plan on it!
4:13 No...
The man in the wall really confuses me but it makes me more interested, like was he on the zaraman ten zero? Was he here before time? Is he the first "human"? It's weird
That's the real question, isn't it?
It think it's more like an entity of the Void or your void possessed second personality. I can word it like: "It's like your twin bother or your mirror.. but it's not.. looks like you.. but it's feels different.. An identity that was always around you, but now you see it too.. It's the Man in the Wall... The Void.."
@@martinnagy3791 Interesting theory, like when the zaraman accident happen we sorta had our personalities split and that's when the man in the wall takes control of the other personality
i think the man in the wall is on our side but still has his own goals, i had this theory that he's actually controlling the lotus after ballas "freed her" and now he's making it so we kill sentients little by little with the events until they all completely die out (cool frost btw)
I’ve been waiting for part 2. The man in the wall could be in the void and doesn’t know how to get out and needs the Tenno is get lotus back and get her to help the Tenno but this ‘Tenno’ is the man in the wall and that way he can get out. Just an idea, might be very far stretched but Yano, cheers for the video though
Man in the Wall: My goals are beyond your understanding
The time jumps type things could be shown through the concept of void storms & the duviri paradox associated with it.
It could be that void itself is associated with time since harnessing void energy kinda gave immortality type stuff and the kuva extraction/harvester is actually extracting traces of void energy from different planets.
I believe that, the more we try to embrace the power of the void, we open small holes for the man in the wall to come through. Making him more and more in control of our memories.
I want to see the void storms, because I think that Cephlon CY might have a lot of experience with it. CY might help us uncover a lot of stuff.
Wraith warframe's lore might have a bunch of cool stuff as it is supposed to be related to the void storms. Additionally, in a way, the wraith's shadow is some sort of a man in the wall type entity for the wraith warframe.
Bro i never thought loreframe would be still alive. Awesome video by the way.
I think we some revelations from deimos. It is cleared that the transference is something artificial created by the orokin using the heart. Maybe it is extracting the void resources and because of that man in the wall got freed once more. And also it may have freed himself in zariman tenzero too but was sealed by margulis. But the orokin created transference and release, maybe putting the whole origin system in danger
I was squealing at the connections of Bloodborne with the use of the ruins and requiems. And a cliff hanger leaving us to ask “Why make the Lotus look like the bad guy” has me wanting more. 🙇♀️Like right now.
You're gonna have to give me a bit but rest assured... it's coming!
@@TheDsIEGE And I apologize for being impatient. The wait for this video was worth it and waiting for the next means it has been given a lot of thought to it. 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏Amazing work, my dude!!!
Perfect time to see the video. I’m bout to hop on warframe and listen to the homie siege is a good time
And I appreciate you doing it!
After 6 fucking months of absence, he finally shows 6 hours before you post this
I LOVE THIS STORY!!!!! awesome vid!
:D man your insight is great...post new war hits better with this
Here's my question; let's say that the Man in the Wall is trying to get the tenno to go to war with Natah. If that's the case, why show us the final cutscene from the new war? The Tenno already saw the first interactions between Natah and her supposed brother, and she calls them the enemy, so it's pretty clear that at that moment she was prepared to fight us. That, and we fought against her Ropalotyst, so it seems like Conflict has already begun. That being said, what's the point of the Man in the Wall showing us a scene in which Natah is having doubts? A scene in which it's pretty clear that Natah is being manipulated somehow.
I have a few ideas that aren't very thought at, but just explanations I had if that were the case.
1. Margulis still has influence over us, or at least the Lotus helmet that allows us to see a fair bit of these visions. My only real evidence for this is the calling for the Tenno during the Sacrific and I think motives are a lot more clear with Margulis showing us Natah being manipulated vs the man in the wall.
2. The Man in the Wall manipulated the memory of Natah already, by making her, and us by extension, believe that they did kill Erra when they never did. (This is the weakest possibility I think)
3. The Man in the Wall wants us confused, and to hesitate at every step. I think a large portion of the community wanted Natah dead after her initial betrayel, but as we got more information, and have seemingly been put up to kill the Lotus by everyone, it seems like we're getting set up, and that's making people think we shouldn't kill Natah. Heck, maybe this is a win win for the Man in the Wall; either Natah kills us or we kill her, one less loose end.
Those are just some of my thoughts.
I'll take choice number 3!
Bloodborne and Warframe in the same video? Immediately getting my sub, and eagerly await the next video!
Quick thought, why would Wally do all this? I think it's to be free of the void. To see with real eyes, to touch with real hands. Perhaps? 🤔
Super looking forward to you revisiting this.
Love your videos especially on lore like this
I'm glad you liked it!
The man in the wall wrote "he suffers while you dream" on the wall...tht means Rell's mind is still alive but suffering in a humanoid form in a psychic plain through the harrow warframe, and we would still be in the cryo pod if we did the quest for the first time
Or at least... that's what he wants you to think.
@@TheDsIEGE hmmmm clever he is...
My personal belief of The Man in the Wall is most similar to what you explained, specifically to the point of it being not a single entity but a being linked to Void-touched entities in our world. To elaborate on my view on The Man in the Wall I’ll need to explain my view on the nature of the void (since it’s most likely its origin), thematically speaking they’ve likened the process of communicating with the void as in staring at a “mirror” (especially in Deimos) and that explains why The Man in the Wall appears as an entity similar to us for it is our reflection from the void. That also might explain one of the possible natures of the void and why we see the Zaramin 10-0 in Daviri.
I'd say the MitW's goal is to leave us alone and helpless, with nobody to truly rely on. This way we'll be more inclined to follow his plan. I wonder it will be the usual Void/Dark vs Light thing, where the Void wants to engulf everything
I like how SEIGE keeps teasing and scaring us, by putting that empty...souless...taunting smile and those ugly...golden eyes...this guy knows to trigger someone
I've done my job then!
@@TheDsIEGE lol yessir
The benefit of a war between Tenno and the Lotus is so I do not have to hear Its the Grineer on a Grineer based planet where there is 100 in front of me
Well New War is practically confirmed for this year, so we may finally figure out what it going on. I have always trusted DE to make good cinematic quests, they haven't let me down in the past. So I trust that whatever they have planned, has a very high chance of being good, and hopefully answeres a lot of these questions.
Hello here from watching ur video on us not being alone...spending about 3hrs on ur page really made me learn about warframe and entertain me...this is the longest I've been on TH-cam I now love ur channel and have "hey kiddophobia"
I'm glad you're enjoying the content! And yeah, watch it. You might start hearing that in real life, like I do!
Interesting as always. I really had to turn it up though, the audio seemed tinny and faint.
I've had an idea on how others experience the man in the wall. It's similar to how in kingdom hearts xion is seen through Roxas' eyes as a black haired Kairi, but xigbar saw ventus. And others saw different things.
I think the man in the walls appearance is different to who perceives him, as a means to make himself more... palatable(?)... or to achieve what ever he need to with an image that's more personal to the observer.
This may sound too obvious, idk, but I just wanted to share something I heard of: the "wall" itself is just a symbolism that represents the "wall that separates us from the other persons", the informations about ourselves that we don't share with anyone. The Man in the Wall is an entity that can see through this wall - he sits *on* the wall. That is, he would be an omniscient being.
Now that you mention it, do we really owe the him or is that just what he wants us to think? Influencing us with the memories of someone else that does owe him, but having primed us into thinking we might with the "Don't forget" line to get us to think we're remembering out own debts.
That's an interesting question you pose...
The gist I've gotten is that the man in the wall is not so much evil, as he is someone who admires those who seek to become stronger or greater and possess the potential to do so. The actions the tenno takes that he seems to most support are ones that are geared towards ruthless pragmatism and self improvement albeit divorced of any moral or ethical concerns.
Agreed. I don't think a being like him would be evil or good, in truth he may have no concept of either...
So an update from earlier, I was doing railjack and Everytime you exit a mission he speakes to you, so that's why I believe he is trapped in the void and doesn't want us to leave
I love this therorys but maybe he's just the manifested fears, anger, happiness or just strong feelings of an person that is heavily influenced by the void. It's maybe just, how the void works. Mysterious... But this thing with Rell.... Mmmhmhm
Or maybe he's the cosmic consciousness of the void?
Siege, I love these in depth lore theory videos but the problem is by mentionng the doppelganger voice you now had me comparing your voice in pt1 versus now.
Is that what you're doing? Good.
You now got me thinking about what’s goin on now
I think that "Wally" is a construct of the Void, made through thousands of memories stored through the vast realm, since Void is known to be able to store such things as memories or points in time. Their ultimate goal might be something less grand than we expect, they might want to feel, like we do. Being trapped in a realm like the Void since forever, witnessing events yet never able to participate and made through god knows how many personalities that conflict for dominance might be why sometimes act more "evil" than other times when he helps, sometimes he's more desperate to reach their goal than other times.
Theory go brrrrrrrrrrr
Oho, I've been expecting you!
I have devised a plan on how to defeat the man in the wall.
Go outside where there aren’t any walls for him to be in
It's full proof!
But from a certain perspective, the floor is the wall.....
@@crayonmanccc3408 damn it
So the vacuum of space, ok. Let test that out.
@@MissBabyForte then, what about the wall between reality and void?
The lack of information makes us anxious and scared, we don't even know if killing Natah is something good or not even with them throwing this idea towards us, the Man in the Wall looks like an ally, an enemy and a neutral entity that just wants to have some fun all at the same time. This leaves us without a north, it's scary.
It's a smart tactic.
Great video I have been waiting for this video and I was not disappointed 😂 The audio is different though did you get a new mic
I had to fix my audio due to my having some allergy issues and the original recording not sounding great.
@@TheDsIEGE ahhh okay yeah I am have allergies as well hope you feel well soon and keep the great videos rolling
It's not 100% of course but I'm pretty sure Albrecht Entrati's seriglass bell is more like a diving bell than the noisemaking kind. Look at the image of the shattered sphere that appears when he describes his first journey into the Void and meeting the Man in the Wall.
Been waiting for this Tenno
the man in the wall its like hes trying to tell us something but the peapol around us get him out of us
Today I had the man in the wallaby's as my operator near the operator room but it was looking around the corner it scared me a little much more then it should have.
It might have something to do with the derviary paradox as we saw the real, tenno the human one. He might be trying to cause a masive anomaly for some randome purpose as he needed some minnions to control, thats why he needed to make the tenno. He had the means with the zaramen 10-0 and the void storm massacre.
It's very likely that the lotus' memory (and the flashback we were shown) has been manipulated in some way, as Erra is still alive and emphasis wass given on that confusion. I initially thought that the erra we see now isn't the real one and that the real one was dead, but it's possible that we and the lotus actually don't remember correctly what happened, as Erra suggests.
The man in the wall IS an alternate universe. He became aware of the physical universe of Earth when the Orokin ripped a hole in their universe and entered the void. He's never met another entity and has become fascinated with the members of the Earth universe. However, he's not physical in the way the entities from the game universe are. It gives him great power, in a way, but also renders him impotent where physical actions are concerned. It's basically the Beyonder from Marvel comic books.
I think Man In wall
i think he trying set up something a roadmap
and future plans
I can't wait for DE to continue the main storyline and let us know more about all of this.
The benefits of fighting against Natah would be:
A. maybe thats a way for DE to imploment more stuff like ordis becoming Ordan, something regarding Ballas and maybe it is a way for you to fight against Hunhow. So maybe that would be an easy way to continue the story
B. The players kinda feel like they have a connection with Lotus and fighting in a way against her now that she is Natah would make the story more dramatic.
C. Maybe DE wants to show that way that Tenno isnt who he used to be, they have been disconnected from Lotus for so long that they have now matured they are now stronger and that they are older like what we see in the teaser in which tenno is clearly older, he now looks like a 15 year old but in the teaser he looks maybe mid 30s
During The New War, I had a feeling that he, at the time, had NO INTENTION of harming us. Instead he seemed more like he wanted to protect us and keep us informed on CERTAIN subjects. I think, he’s more or less trying to do so because he has plans for us. Plans that, in order for them to work, require US.
Dispute to something near the end. If the vision you see in your personal room in the orbiter is a earlier memory then when did the lotus become alien lotus? Because the tenno did meet her in person during our playtime. If the man can show past memories, then why not current experiences as well
Let me start by saying that although the man in the wall seems to be a mental projection right now the fingers on our railjacks are quite tangible, he is not tangible from what we've seen up to this point, he possibly isn't capable of assuming that state right now.
As for the tenno, we've been branded as "betrayers" in times past (an event which wasn't recounted except in lore, of which we might not even have memories of), the tenno are secluded, outcasts, they have to prove themselves to each faction they have dealings with. The tenno's only anchor was the lotus, now gone. The tenno are literally being groomed to distrust the lotus and view her as the enemy whilst being given small pats on the back and "words of comfort" (if you can call them that) from our new wall-dwelling "friend".
So let's assume that this is all the work of the man in the wall:
They force the lotus to "sing" and gather the sentient army, apparently her being the only one who can.
Such an army would press us hard.
In dire need, we search for something we can wield against this threat.
Along comes a friendly face, somebody who has given us something before, offering the perfect solution to our current predicament.
And all we have to do is open the gates a little wider, wide enough for more than fingers to slip in.
I thought it was a bell not as "a musical instrument" but as "a diving bell"
See this is why the Tenno should just say screw it and take up Grunkle Parvos' offer to work together. Yeah he probably wants to form another cult or something, but he's dead smart to the point of being able to rival the Orokin. He could probably help find a way to ward off ol Wally.
Well i have half moon and sun in my profile so I'll just befriend the man in The wall
I think the man in the wall is the void itself. I think it is kinda like the voodoo cyberspace gods in the sprawl trilogy and he just wants to experience being different
What if the man in the wall is a tenno who was left in the void during the ship thing but then he grew instead of staying a child or he is the material form of our operator and switches to his soul form whenever which is why he talks to us like he knows us.
The benifit of a war with natah might
Make the tenno look away from any interactions between the corpus,greener and the void or the man in the wall
Liking the vids! They are making me think more (explains the headaches lol)
A war with Natah huh....what if the void has more just 'The man in the wall' , we see in the paradox trailer some kinda creepy skelly thing, what if it's a minion of him?
Arguably the most powerful factions are the sentients and the tenno....even with the tenno being un-organised past maybe some clans with their own agendas. They are still so strong that just one is the equivalent of 100 army's.
But if the tenno go to war with the sentients, they are more likely to grow using void powers...his powers, and chances are void fissures and storms would get worse as we causualy cast space magic warfare.
That's my shot in the dark anyway!
That's an interesting possibility. And if true, god help us all!
The Man in the wall is probably one of the most interesting Engimas. The question starts with, is he friend, or foe. Regardless if the memory is altered, Natah is acting under her own auspices. More so, I would say that the red from War within is the Kuva more than anything to be frank. If you consider the full events of warframe, Everything went wrong when the gate to the Void was first opened. The Fall of the Orokin Empire can almost be directly correlated to Void discoveries (the implementation of the Flaw), the origin of the Tenno and their powers, and more. Up until it's fall, the Tenno seem almost like slave warriors of a kind. They obviously served the Empire for a extended period thanks to the stories of the Leverian, as well as apparently the full on formation of Tenno Schools to format and regulate the Tenno's powers. And yet all that time, the Void keeps fueling their power.
The Man in the wall is I think the single most important entity for the full story. I believe it's because of him that the Empire ultimately fell and because of him the Sentients invaded as well. The Void also is I think, not a place. The Man in the wall does not feel like a personal shadow but instead the total collective consciousness of the Void in it's entirety. The Man seems to be fully capable of manipulating the Void to the projection of vision, memory, and more. Touching on your video about the Karma system and how the Night form sees him more or less merged to us and having us under his sway, I would say it's only 'more' under sway. The Man is clearly able to take a Tenno and rip their consciousness across lightyears at a time, meaning he is universally omnipotent to the actions of the Sentients and other races at one time. His power is more extreme near active void gates of course, but Tenno seem to be walking anomalies unto themselves. I want to remind here that Warframes Focus Void energy, not contain it. Ember's fire isn't because it's Ember. It's still the Tenno's raw power, and I will tell you my Ember is a walking apocalypse. Anyway, when the Sentients plot something, the Man seems to be warning the Tenno about the oncoming threat more than anything. Him using shadow Lotuses is suspect, but I don't think anyone here now sees the Lotus as a ally anyway. What this all however proves is we are fully under the Man's sway. I think his actions right now are benevolent only towards what he might call his 'children', which would explain his indifference and sheer horror to all other factions who get too close to the Void, yet gives the Tenno undeniable raw power instead.
Going forward, I would think the Man will take up ever more prominent positions in the life of our Tenno. It's very likely he will have a more extreme presence on the Duviri plains. I think right now the reason the Sentients are going all out to end the Tenno is because they seek to crush the Man by killing his most overpowering servants. We are the darkness, the Demons, of a extremely powerful deity who more or less lets us wander freely. I would even think our continuous presence of causing endless bloody warfare across the System might even be fueling the Man in some capacity. His arrival in the timeline has only ever begotten more bloodshed. In all honesty, I wouldn't be surprised if he was devouring Oro, or rather the Souls of mortals. As long as the Tenno exist, the grim tally will constantly climb.
It's true... the connection the void gave the system life, but just like oxygen is both the reason we live and the reason we'll die, the void may too be both the savior and the destroyer of this system.
@@TheDsIEGE I think it strikes a balance. Like Oil and water, it can't fully manifest itself. The presence of Void Storms I think indicates a heavy bleed over effect, as the many void gates have been open constantly. Zoom out on the galaxy map and you can see Void storms raging on the periphery of the system. I think what we have right now is a pact with a devil of some kind. Just so happens that devil is on our side. Sentients may just have a grudge too, so have to be careful postulating too much. But when we look at the story of Rell, the Red Veil went completely psychopathic. The Horror of the Void seems almost toxic to mortal beings. And the Chains quest only proves we met the Man before. First time you go to Lua during the Second Dream, you will encounter shadowy Infested. This is rather odd, you know..when the same shadow people also appeared in the place of the corrupted Rell. The Void I think is critical to the well being of the Oro. But itself is a extreme danger to all mortals as the Void seems to crave chaos. Are Tenno already fulfilling it's purpose? If so, that may be why it is so laid back, save in matters involving the one true enemy that actually is difficult to fight in the game, the Sentients.
Deadspace was a influence for certain things in warframe that’s why certain aspects look alike like the way you pickup things looks similar and the UI that’s why the menu looks like part of the game. And sure the game is very different in terms of tone but both have a similar feel when you ADS even tho it’s much easier than deadspace. Warframe was inspired by scary games like dead space and left 4 dead.
love the series and what i think is that the man in the wall could be rell or the tenno's father but "voidefide"
cuz he says kiddo and in the war within and usualy he says hey kiddo too
I've been waiting for this 👁️👄👁️
The Man in the Wall is the biggest enigma in Warframe right now. We have next to zero information about who or what he is. However, here is a thought. What if He/It is an Orokin; like Nihil, and is manipulating forces towards a final goal? Maybe he doesn't want the Tenno specifically going after/killing Lotus as much as taking the fight to the Sentients, which are a far larger threat. If the Sentient issue is resolved, he can move on to whatever he has planned next.
Although, perhaps the Void is fed by humanity and their emotions. The Man could be a subconscious manifestation that in turn influences the physical world. Kind of like the snake eating itself, both feeding on each other.
A few more ideas to muddy the waters. ;)
Well with the Tenno fighting the Lotus, much of the Sol System would be thrown into chaos.
Grineer would grow bold and attempt to expand further, the Corpus would likely attempt to seize more power from the absent Tenno and the Infestation would spread further and faster, potentially absorbing both factions entirely as they have proven inept at containing it, at least for long.
We kept these 3 factions mostly in check since our awakening. And with us distracted, the Sentients could come in and do some serious damage, if not wipe them out. They brought the Orokin to their knees until the Tenno were unleashed, what chance does a degrading clone army or selfish bankers have against them?
Whatever is manipulating everything behind the scenes, man in the wall or something else clearly wants a large-scale conflict. The Sentient scout ships we fought off are clear evidence of that as what other reason could they really be coming to the Sol system for?
They fought the Orokin to stop them from destroying another system, but now that the Orokin are gone what other faction poses a threat to Andromeda now?
Sure Hunhow would want Natah back but I doubt they are willing to begin another genocide just for one of their own and even so, they have her back now so why continue pushing for war?
After all, we still don't know the circumstances of our own betrayal. We defeated the Sentients but then immediately slaughtered the people we fought to defend afterwards? The Man in the Wall or whoever it may be has been manipulating things long before the Old War and potentially further back than the Zarimen incident.
This thing has been at work for a long time, and I doubt this'll be over anytime soon.
even if i don't play warframe anymore , i still do hope we get lotus back and wally actually has neutral intentions for us
I think they depict natah more as a victim than a villian the chimera scenes.
Especially with how she was trying to remember things then was thrown into some machine when she was saying things didn't add up.
You think she sounds like a victim when speaking in the erra quest? She sounds militant to me...
@@TheDsIEGE Militant, but confused.
Edit: To clarify, It seems to me she was being even more manipulated than before. And she was starting to see that. At least from my perspective.
he may be a person created from the subconscious mind and memories of the tenno but cant reveal all the memories to avoid damaging the tenno's mind
maaan idk he is so mysteries
as always nice video
OOOOR he is the first tenno that defected and he is controlling every tenno and having their memories locked up releasing it when he wants
Maybe he's the duviri guy we barely see at the end of the trailer... Sure looks a lot like a tenno, yeah?
yeah that may explain why he says hey "KIDDO" every time because he wasn't sleeping as the tenno were add to that the line in the second dream "you owe me" might indicate that he did something to us (or for us) so before we go zzzzz
I'm really liking this series
. Every time you've indicated the man in the wall's presence, it's given us something. Not to say we should trust it, but it hardly seems to be so generous with others that it encounters. I'm starting to think that it might be benign, or at least think it's being benign, to us out of familiarity. The Orokin claimed that the Zarimen Ten Zero did not and would not have children on board. I may be wrong, being bad with time tables in general, but I don't think it was lost for long enough for the crew to just start coupling up as though they would never return home and decided to make a new life on the ship. I'm starting to think that the Tenno are examples of whatever the man in the wall is or at least a piece of it, simply given a defined form. That, this might be it trying to replace the lotus and reconnect with those that left it behind in the void.
To be clear, I think that from start to end, the Zeramen ten zero made one continuous journey. Originally I had assumed there was some sort of inhabited world on the other side of the void, but with the way the crew died, the Orokin response, the non existent knowledge of Orokin procedure such a return trip would require, and the heavy use of memory alteration, it may have been an attempt by the man in the wall to create a physical body for its self and replace the crew. This assuming it didn't understand individuality and accidently made multiple bodies based on the crew, possibly of their own younger selves. That said, I'm probably going off on a tangent. Not like I have anything other than the weird way my mind connects likely faulty information to support this in the first place.
Honestly I've never questioned if the man in world is real, the personality and constant hints seem way too detailed, but what I'm truly interested in is what happens if The Man in World is completely released unrestrained.
What if he already is?
@@TheDsIEGE I don't think so, I think that why he wants to corrupt or convert the Tenno.
Personally I still believe Ballas wasn't overtaken by the Man until he died, the voice change can be explained as simply "resonating inside your head".
The events of the Old War as portrayed may have been where the Tenno gave this "IOU" to the Man in the Wall, giving them enough power to wipe out the invasion entirely and brainwashing Natah borrowing the Tenno's memories of their expired caretaker.
The Man in The Wall may have come back to us when Teshin made us do that one trip to memory lane and the Tenno awakened their powers, but it was only until we unchained the vessel that he properly lodged himself in our minds.
I couldn't really explain Ballas' reappearence but one thing that's almost certain is it's linked with the Moon being retransported into orbit, whether that got his attention specially with Umbra awakening or all along he was hiding in it who knows. After his death (quotation marks?) he either is still there or only the Man in the Wall remains in his the chimera body.
Giving the Man in The Wall credit for EVERYTHING that happened since TWW seems a little too much, telling Ballas has always been notBallas since a little after Margulis' death seems a little too much. Ok God of Schemes and all but we have to set a line in which this dude took notice and decided to fuck around with existence, to me a good line seems to be the Old War, where his interventions started to assume some semblance of a shape and which consequences affected the future relevant to us.
No yeah you got me..I've never heard of a more mind fuck then that! Well done.
It is the truth because in the sacrifice you literally see the lotus in that mech at the end of the sacrifice quest
If we're asking what the purpose of pitting the tenno against the lotus is, it may lie in what the tenno can do with the lotus. In the cinematic with erra, the lotus appears to be able to control or unify the tenno to attack erra. So perhaps the lotus has some form of connection to each tenno, like the khala from starcraft 2, that serves as some kind of protection or restraint on the tenno. Then, the reason the man in the wall would want to kill the lotus, which is his most likely objective, is to destroy that connection. From here on, I'm not sure what might happen but if I follow my starcraft example, he may wish to replace the lotus and gain command of the tenno.
Side note: why is it that when ballas removes the wires from the lotus, we start seeing interference? And if we're seeing this from ballas' perspective, why don't we see the lotus' face?
Could she have a transference bolt like Balas did?
@@darkphoenix7225 aye...that..that makes way too much sense what the hell
Also @DarkPhoenix I just realized! Every. Single. Tenno. Already has a transference bolt in them so the can operate the Warframes granted it's nothing advanced like with Ballas and Umbra and acts more as like...a string connected to puppets but what if, OK What if! That machine Lotus was hooked up to was somehow linked up with Every Single transference bolt in all of the tenno and that's how she controlled them against Erra and THAT is what TMITW wants
could you do a video on who Cephalon Cy and who Cephalon Simaris is if you haven't already?