The difference between volume and gain explained

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  • @NickP333
    @NickP333 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +18

    Beautifully explained, Paul.

    • @M1Anut
      @M1Anut 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      🤨

    • @NickP333
      @NickP333 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      😘

  • @Think_Up
    @Think_Up 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +17

    When Paul's paper goes down and the glasses come of, you know you are about to be gut punched with facts and logic.

  • @ConstantinDendrinos
    @ConstantinDendrinos 15 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    Such a good question and such a simple and great answer! Thank you Paul!

  • @timleelim9930
    @timleelim9930 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +17

    We've literally gained volumes of knowledge from this video 😊

    • @Bassotronics
      @Bassotronics 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      I see what you did there again...

    • @pobodyisnerfect
      @pobodyisnerfect 15 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      I hear what you're saying there😂

    • @smccrode
      @smccrode 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I think I’ve had too much pot because I didn’t gain that much 😞 🙃

  • @ChannaGun
    @ChannaGun 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +13

    Thank you Paul, for that intuitive explanation! I'm a stereophile from Sri Lanka and have been for about 35 of my 51 years; it's just today that I truly understood the difference between volume and gain!

    • @Paulmcgowanpsaudio
      @Paulmcgowanpsaudio  16 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

      Nothing makes me happier.

    • @TheTomt50
      @TheTomt50 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      Yeah, I agree. I just have never quite grasped this before. I always assumed the volume control limited the output AFTER amplification---you're only using so much made. What a great, clear explanation! Nope you're limiting the voltage to be amplified. Thank you Paul!

    • @mfgillia7606
      @mfgillia7606 8 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      ​@@TheTomt50Me too - I had it backwards. 😅

  • @balacisco
    @balacisco 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    OMG,that was the greatest simplest explanation for volume and gain, so the
    1 volt in
    Volume set to .2 volt
    The output also changes accordingly,
    So volume influence both input and output

  • @babubabu12345
    @babubabu12345 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

    Paul Sir explained very well...

  • @ivindholta4081
    @ivindholta4081 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

    With reference to the Mark Levinson 326S, there is an other thing witch can be taken into consideration, as well:
    - This amplifier have independent gain control for all its inputs - witch mean you can also use this gain control to adjust, and equal out different signal strengths from different sources!

  • @abxaudiophiles
    @abxaudiophiles 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Enlightening as always guys! Well done. 😊

  • @subwoofer8865
    @subwoofer8865 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    This actually really helped explain how the Pre and Post gain works on my Peavey amp for my bass rig. Was using them backwards this whole time. The manual does a poor job of explaining how they work, but this really cleared things up for me.

  • @tushar8133
    @tushar8133 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    That definitely helped. Thanks Paul!

  • @SAGNI0971
    @SAGNI0971 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    Great video ! I own the Vandersteen Quatro Wood CT loudspeakers and they are extraordinary, wouldn’t trade them unless I was upgrading in the Vandersteen line.

    • @NoEgg4u
      @NoEgg4u 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      Those might be the original cloth covered Quatros, debuted in 2006 (I think).
      Paul did not say which of his Aspen series speakers the customer purchased. My guess is the FR30s, because otherwise I don't think it would be worth the trouble (perhaps not the sound quality benefit either) to trade in Quatros for FR20s or lower.
      I wonder if that Vandersteen customer listened to the Aspen based speakers before doing the trade-in?
      Or did the customer succumb to Paul's masterful salesmanship persona from these videos?
      And that customer is going to learn that he now has a bass issue that he did not have with his Quatros, because the Quatros have 11 potentiometers, to virtually flatten the bass. If that customer has bass valleys or bass humps in his room, his Aspen speakers have no remedy. It would be great to hear from that customer. Alas, we never will.
      I also believe that Paul cleverly took a shot at Vandersteen, by telling the world that a customer is upgrading from Vandersteen speakers to Aspen speakers. Of course, Paul said nice things about Richard Vandersteen. But none of that undo's the visual and Paul's commentary that the customer is discarding Vandersteen speakers in favor of Aspen speakers.
      I have heard the Quatros many times, from the cloth version to the wood version. I really wonder if the Aspen speakers are as good as the Quatro Wood speakers?
      i am confident that Vandersteen's Kento and Seven speakers are better than any of the Aspen speakers, based on my listening experiences. In all fairness, I never had the opportunity to listen to the Aspen series. But review wise, the Vandersteen Kento speakers and Vandersteen Seven speakers get non-stop praise. The Aspen speakers also get praise, but I have not seen the same level of adoration and devotion to Aspen speakers as I have seen for Vandersteen speakers.
      So our host took a shot at Vandersteen speakers, conveying that his Aspen speakers are better. Well, the FR30 speakers are approximately twice the price of the Quatro Wood speakers, so they should be better than the Quatro Wood speakers. But I doubt that they are more than marginally better. And if the customer has a bass anomaly (most rooms do), then even if the mids are better, and the soundstaging is better, that bass issue will grind on that customer's nerves.
      The customer had no problem trading in Vandersteen Quatros. Any dealer will take them, because they fly off the shelves.
      If the customer is unhappy with his Aspen speakers, and decides to go for the Vandersteen Kento speakers, I wonder how easy it will be to have a dealer take his Aspen speakers for a trade-in? Those Aspen speakers would likely sit for quite a while at the dealer, and the dealer knows that. Whereas, Vandersteen speakers will sell themselves.
      In fact, I wonder if our host paid the customer a premium to get those Vandersteen Quatro speakers, just to have the opportunity to use them in a video, conveying that Aspen's are better.
      If Richard Vandersteen sees this video, I wonder if he will set the record straight?
      That "good friend" statement from Paul will probably no longer be the case. Richard will see through what Paul did in this video.

    • @staceymangham
      @staceymangham 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Coming from a vanderstein owner who's never heard any of the aspens. Also most manufacturers strive to have the least amount of components between the amp and driver with just a single capacitor or inductor being the goal. All those potentiometers in between amp and driver must colour the sound and there are other ways of tuning the bass with speaker placement and or room treatments. Kind regards

    • @NoEgg4u
      @NoEgg4u 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@staceymangham "All those potentiometers in between amp and driver must colour the sound..."
      Vandersteen's Quatro, Kento, and Seven model speakers (model Five, too, when they were in production), are the only Vandersteen models that have potentiometers. Those aforementioned speaker models are all bi-amped. The signal going to the midrange driver and the tweeter driver never see the potentiometers.
      The bass section of the above models all have dedicated amps that power the woofers, and only the woofers.
      That design relieves the main amps from the heavy lifting of bass notes (not entirely, but significantly).
      "...must colour the sound..."
      You will find no reputable reviews asserting a colored sound.
      I have never seen any review of any of the above models having colored sound.
      "...and there are other ways of tuning the bass with speaker placement and or room treatments."
      Those ways are employed during a professional installation of those Vandersteen speakers.
      But after ideal speaker placement and room treatments are in place, you will still not have flat bass. Virtually no one ever does.
      You can measure the bass output via a microphone at your seated position, feeding a laptop running "Smart" software, and playing bass frequencies that the Smart software evaluates. Vandersteen provides those frequencies on a CD that accompanies the speakers. Vandersteen also has the tones available for free downloading on his site.
      The tones are measured for each speaker, individually. So the last detail in the speaker set-up is to fine-tune the bass with those tones and the Smart software (it can be done by ear, but no one will ever get it as precise as using the microphone and software).
      Virtually every room will then have a flat bass response (at the seated position), or very close to a flat response. Even rooms with terrible bass issues will be tamed with the above procedure -- not perfectly, but it will be far better. Aspens in that same room will not have a way to remedy such a bass issue.

    • @craigaust3306
      @craigaust3306 15 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      @@staceymangham Also, lowering a peak is one thing, but fixing a null is tougher.

  • @breedluv1
    @breedluv1 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Great video Paul! I understood that!

  • @jimc7320
    @jimc7320 10 วันที่ผ่านมา

    It helps, never knew we needed it! Thanks!

  • @johnmarchington3146
    @johnmarchington3146 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    An excellent explanation, Paul

  • @stimpy1226
    @stimpy1226 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    It’s a great question. Really good explanation today Paul.

  • @6643bear
    @6643bear 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Hi Paul , great explanation, in radio work we have Rf gain control, interesting, but the way you explained is the best way . Regards mark

  • @LarcR
    @LarcR 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Clean and clear explanation. Thanks.

  • @scottjarvis5485
    @scottjarvis5485 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

    probably the best explanation I've ever heard

  • @davidsicking7514
    @davidsicking7514 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    A volume control is the same as gain usualy in a self contained playback unit with speaker. It is called Volume due to the normal hearing property of losing low frequency sensitivity at low levels making the sources sound thinner. In other applications it is called gain, contrast, RF gaun, etc.
    The loudness control has a base boost as it is set to lower setting such that when set for lower listening levels the sound source still sounds full. I hope this helps those confused by over simplification.

  • @duarteteixeiradebarros3555
    @duarteteixeiradebarros3555 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Finally I understood this. Thanks!

  • @manitoublack
    @manitoublack 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Well explained 👍

  • @gtrguyinaz
    @gtrguyinaz 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Perfect explanation…

  • @dipanjanbiswas6580
    @dipanjanbiswas6580 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Brilliant explanation as always 👏A future book idea can be a HiFi FAQ - based on the hundreds of queries you've answered over the years on this channel 🙂

  • @johnnytoobad7785
    @johnnytoobad7785 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Gain is just the ratio between input and output (typically voltage) in a linear circuit.
    (Power amps DO have current gain values but this is rarely published and/or talked about
    since it is dependent on the voltage gain AND the load)
    "Volume" is a subjective audio term and typically "controls" both voltage gain and current gain
    since humans tend to listen to music through impedance loads.

  • @Kelty0656
    @Kelty0656 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Thanks !

  • @ofergover2978
    @ofergover2978 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    That was a great explanation. In that case why should home audio gear have gain knobs? it only complicates things for the user to have both volume and gain. I can understand it in pro-audio that you have all kinds of inputs/output with different voltages but in home audio it can be pretty standardized.

  • @funny0000000
    @funny0000000 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    What should a typical gain in a pre-amp be to have a good amount of movement of the volume control. I have seen some amps I can't stand where you can't play them soft it seem because they have too much gain. Can changing the resistance in the volume control pot help this problem or would lowering the gain with a different feedback resistor fix it better? Can lowering the gain or changing the resistance of the volume control pot reduce the noise floor in an amp? Can someone tell me how to make an amp more silent at idle other than different types of resistors?

    • @bsadewitz
      @bsadewitz 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Gain is usually expressed as a +dB quantity (+0db on up) whereas volume is from -x dB (at the lowest) up to 0dB. That is, in your setup, the volume control is a pot (which is a variable resistor), and the maximum volume is no resistance. As in your setup, gain is typically applied pre-amp stage. From what you describe, I think what you're looking for is to change the gain, because you want to boost that signal by a fixed amount BEFORE it reaches the volume control. The volume control then attenuates the signal by some variable amount. I don't know enough to answer your question for sure, but I suspect what you're looking for is a gain adjustment. They would both kinda do the same thing at the end of the day, but the thing is that volume controls sometimes do other things, too. For instance, on my Sansui AU-9500, the volume control pot also has a "tap" for the loudness circuit. As you turn the volume pot to the right, the loudness circuit has less and less of an effect until you reach some point (I think it's around 50% volume, but I'm not sure). (This is how loudness should work, whether its done with a pot controlling a circuit or done digitally somehow, although on lower-end amps they sometimes fudge it by just boosting those frequencies a fixed amount).
      As with your setup, gain is typically applied to a SOURCE signal in the pre-amp stage. Volume is applied in the amp stage. (I think, I could be wrong).
      The rest of your question sends me to Google, so I'm not gonna just retype something else that I don't understand myself, heh.

    • @bsadewitz
      @bsadewitz 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Well, the volume control is also a preamp thing, but gain comes before that I'm pretty sure.

    • @RacingAnt
      @RacingAnt 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      ​@bsadewitz did you just chuck their question into chatgpt to try to make yourself look clever?

    • @RacingAnt
      @RacingAnt 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      You need to lower the overall gain, which means changing the resistors in the feedback circuits. Not a simple undertaking. Changing the value of the volume control potentiometer won't change anything.

  • @janinapalmer8368
    @janinapalmer8368 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Gain is like the sensitivity and volume controls how much you use .. as Paul correctly says 😊

  • @seanb3303
    @seanb3303 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    But if you use a passive pre, will you have enough gain to fully utilize your power amps watts and current?

  • @ThinkingBetter
    @ThinkingBetter 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    Gain = sound level adjustment for calibrating system. Volume = user adjustable sound level. As electronics engineer we often use the term gain as ratio of output to input when involving amplification of a signal (not only audio). The dB (decibel) is a logarithmic way of describing a ratio.

  • @ezrf79
    @ezrf79 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I was always wondering, why not vary the gain instead of "throwing away" input signal? Would this not improve SNR?

  • @pobodyisnerfect
    @pobodyisnerfect 15 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    This is how you make your amplifier go to 11 instead of just 10

  • @NateEll
    @NateEll 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Years back I had a preamp that had separate gain and volume controls. The gain control was not particularly useful.

    • @johnh539
      @johnh539 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I am learning my new RME ADI fs2 and I am currently working on the differences in my system, am I correct in saying that a parametric EQ e.g. 5 band means five settable gains. If so I suspect I'll find the same as you as I think I prefer it without EQ.
      I think it also has overall gain settings, (I''ll check later ) if so I'm glad to have watched Paul as I would assumed high gain = more sparkle or something.

  • @audiorick841
    @audiorick841 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Could it be said that gain is additive (amplify the signal) and volume is subtractive (attenuate the signal)?

  • @jeppemichaeljensen2684
    @jeppemichaeljensen2684 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    Whats that big white thing you have in the background ?

    • @newsense2435
      @newsense2435 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

      it almost looks like a washing machine or something but it kinda looks round too. I was wondering too. cheers

    • @albertquirante6850
      @albertquirante6850 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

      ​@@newsense2435thats a speaker box and there's a speaker inside

    • @shopmunkey
      @shopmunkey 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Looks like an upside down FR30 cabinet viewed from the side

  • @JJ-no2ob
    @JJ-no2ob 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Amen ! Spot on jolly old fellow lol

  • @edmondj03
    @edmondj03 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Thanks Paul. Well explained

  • @endrizo
    @endrizo 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    wooo what is that white box in the background with 2 huge holes for two big woofers??? looks like a washing machine.

  • @ChiefExecutiveOrbiter
    @ChiefExecutiveOrbiter 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Looks like Crazy Eddie is ready for a blowout sale!!!

  • @abhiarch
    @abhiarch 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    hi Paul sir, namaste 🙏, I am from Mumbai, India. I am your subscriber, and never miss any video. i request you to resolve my query please, i want to know about gain built in power amplifier vs gain/volume control in preamplifier stage. in your previous videos you have mentioned that power amplifiers have generally a gain of about 26 -27db. and if a power amp is 100watts. so if i give 1 volt volume from preamp, how much power a 100 watt amplifier will produce? and what if I use a 200 watt amplifier with the same preamplifier and give 1 volt? as per your previous videos i learned that the loudness will be the same from speakers. if that is the case then why there is 3db boost when we double the watts in the amplifier. i am a bit confused to understand the entire scenario of this gain match with preamplifiers, amplifiers & speakers please simplify this complication. thank you very much sir. you are a brilliant teacher for people like us. god bless you.🙏

  • @Laz_Arus
    @Laz_Arus 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

    04:53 I think you mean 20% , not a twentieth. 0.2V over 1.0V would be one-fifth.

    • @RacingAnt
      @RacingAnt 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Noticed that, but it didn't change the explanation, so does it really matter?

  • @papabear1417
    @papabear1417 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Gain is how much the original source signal is amplified. Volume is how loud you want the gain to be?

  • @danielgeiger7739
    @danielgeiger7739 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Gain = steepness of slope. Volume = position on x-axis; sound level: value at intersection of x-axis and sloping gain line..

  • @stevenkoski228
    @stevenkoski228 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Gain is commonly referred to as a Loudness control, think amplitude.

  • @diyfullrangehifispeakers
    @diyfullrangehifispeakers 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Paul, I saw a comment about whiteboarding this. Most blokes learn visually not verbally. Ask their female partner. Please. TY.🇦🇺☮️

  • @richardhagerty6811
    @richardhagerty6811 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Simply put, gain is controlled ahead of the pre-amp, and volume is controlled behind the pre-amp. They're both controlled by potentiometers.

  • @InsideOfMyOwnMind
    @InsideOfMyOwnMind 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I just perhaps incorrectly but more relatably to me think of volume as gain/human perception of loudness.

  • @rodm1949
    @rodm1949 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Where it operates in the circuit is what he meant I presume.

  • @BubblePuppy.
    @BubblePuppy. 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    And remember Folks you will get just as good a deal on your trade-in speakers as you get on your trade-in automobile at the dealer.

  • @tomday7309
    @tomday7309 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Thanks Paul, I never understood the difference till now.

  • @PetraKann
    @PetraKann 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    This is a very good question:
    The standard definitions and distinction includes:
    "Gain is the input level within the amps; volume is the output level that goes to the speaker. Gain allows adjusting the tone of an audio track, whereas volume affects its loudness only."
    In a guitar amplifier "your gain setting determines how clean or dirty your sound is regardless of the master volume setting. You can set the gain high for a dirty tone, but set the overall volume of that dirty tone from near silent to near deafening using the master volume control."
    It's more than just semantics

  • @joejoejoejoejoejoe4391
    @joejoejoejoejoejoe4391 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

    The difference is amps with "GAIN" on them are cool, amps with "volume" on are lame.

  • @glenncurry3041
    @glenncurry3041 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Volume and gain. Speed and acceleration. Volume and speed are measurements of the current conditions. How loud or how fast we are right then. While gain and acceleration are changes in conditions. With gain being how much increase in voltage or power. While acceleration is the rate of change of speed.

  • @BoDiddly
    @BoDiddly 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

    It sounds to me that you got it backwords. In a pre-amp, and power amp, the input game comes first, then the Volume. You set the gain of the input to about 2 or 3, then you control the Output volume with the potentiometer, and you can turn that as high or as low as you want it to go, as long as the input gain is not too high.

  • @edd2771
    @edd2771 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    Please, I’ll ask again- take 5 minutes to lay something out on a white board when you are addressing topics of this nature.

    • @abxaudiophiles
      @abxaudiophiles 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

      Or…… Start your own channel and teach us better. 😂

    • @edd2771
      @edd2771 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      @@abxaudiophiles Clearly I need teaching or I wouldn’t be making such a request.

    • @abxaudiophiles
      @abxaudiophiles 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@edd2771 Good points. 🤣🤣😉😉. I’m a professional instructor in my career. We learn a lot about adult learners and how they absorb and retain information. The white board is a real deal…. Visual aids are key in retention for sure…. I was just teasing ya a bit, nothing to serious 😉😊😊

  • @timleelim9930
    @timleelim9930 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

    We've literally gained volumes of knowledge from this video 😊

    • @Bassotronics
      @Bassotronics 16 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I see what you did there...