TRAIL RATINGS ARE LOCAL. Given the trails nearby it's at least a black. Lens and good rider can hide difficulty to keyboard warriors. What is a green in France, Colorado, or Whistler has nothing to do with a trail in Utah. Heck, even a trail rating 6mi away has nothing to do with the trail ratings at this location. Also an interesting fact; the name comes from the fact that when building the trail the builders discovered a corpse. Hence Boneyard and Tombstone.
That is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Ratings are not something, and definately should not be, 'local' or variable in any way. A standard is a standard regardless of location. This trail is not even close to being a double black. at best it's a blue trail, basically a straight up flow trail. Understanding that trails are, or at least are supposed to be rated by there most difficult section, be that short or long, there was not one section on this that could honestly be called 'double black diamond' and to rate it as such for whatever reason simply is an effort to make an area or trail network more appealing to tourists (visitors). Any respectable trail manager/builder would never rate that trail as more than a blue, which is what it is. Rating this harder could ultimately lead someone to think they the skills for a proper double black diamond, which could put them in a VERY bad situation with serioud risk of injury. That is THE reason ratings are standard regardless of location. Someone could get hurt riding a true double black, and theoretically, come back and sue these guy for making them think they had the skills to ride a true double black, when they don't. Dumbing down ratings is never a good thing and should never be defended.
@@Tony_Karzen With all respect, you are clueless. Ski trails and MTB trails have been rated LOCAL for eons. It's not a new thing. A blue in Squamish has little resemblance to a blue anywhere else (for example). Otherwise every trail in Squamish would be a yellow or double black, and every trail in Cedar City a green (for example). That's a stupid way to do it. The ratings are a relative rating to give GUIDANCE to riders on how to progress on a new-to-them trail system. Pre-ride, work your way up, not work your way down. Have a good one.
@@johnconnolly2815 Clearly it is you who is clueless. That could not be further from the truth. Standards like trail ratings are not local, otherwise they carry zero actual value and tell people nothing. Having grown up in a ski town, skied my whole life, across the US and Europe, I can tell you for certain, a blue is a blue wherever you are. The same holds true for bike trails. As a trail builder myself, having also ridden in a very wide array of locations, blue trails are blue trails. There is no discussion on this. Also, having worked in both the ski and bike industries, I can say that the insurance industry is a HUGE driver in how trails are rated. It is critical to liability claims and related issues. Do you actually believe they would insure one location whose black trails are proper black trails when others rate their blue trails as double black diamond? Of course they wouldn't. The standard is there as guidance, of course, but that guidance has to be consistent otherwise it means nothing.
@@Tony_Karzen pretty funny since I rate a lot of Utah trail difficulties for the signs and apps. You should stick to your home cooking stuff. Also funny that you are a skier. A Snowbird blue is vastly more difficult than a blue at 95% of ski areas around the world. For example. A Snowbird green is a black at a lot of places. Just saying. The standard is trail ratings ARE LOCAL.
I'm guessing the risk factor of certain sections being at height and the potential dangers made this a double black, because otherwise it looks pretty chill.
I would agree with that. I also wondered about all the warning signs at the trail entrance, makes me wonder if several people got hurt pretty bad on that trail because of those dangers.
Most likely from people with over inflated egos trying to haul down it as fast as possible without ever being on it first and simply getting out of control in the wrong place.
True to some extent, but while cutting across the upper ridge, the trail is much steeper than it appears here and is very loose terrain. Compound that with the high exposure and you understand why it’s a double Black
Looks pretty steep in places. High consequences in many parts and you could reach huge speeds if you let it go. But if you keep it controlled it looks quite chill.
There is nothing dangerous about this trail, it is a fun solid blue trail I ride all the time. This guy's camera makes sections look like they might have exposure, but they don't. It's just an easy, fun trail.
And that trail does not look anything more than a blue! Maybe if you started hitting some of those doubles, it might be a single black, but what is all the warning about?! There was absolutely nothing to that trail that was double black!
Rode about a year ago. It’s steep otherwise ordinary black. And although steep, not all that rocky and no? ledges. (don’t remember - but none noteworthy). It was a fun trail and the warning and skeleton are neat!
I thought it becomes double black when difficult features are mandatory and not easily walkable. If not hitting the features, it is more of a blue trail with some loose steep sections that you need to watch your speed. Looks super fun tho.
Awesome looking trail and nice riding Not seeing how they designated that as a double black though. Seems bluish but hey, I’m not in charge. Thanks for the video
I use to ride trails alone till I flipped and landed on my head. I was luckily, I was alright. The other thing was, it was just a sunset. If I was really hurt I would have been there all night long. After that when I ride alone, I take it easy.
How you liking the Knolly fugitive? LT? I have the exact same also in Raw. Love it. Great for trails like this. Just ordered the 170 Chilcotin today on sale. Great riding.
I absolutely love the Fugitive LT. Knolly makes very awesome bikes. I’ll bet you’re stoked to get that Chili… I’ve been eyeing that one and the Warden as well.
Looks pretty fun actually. If you want some truly chunky black diamond try tunnel Trail and cold Springs in Santa Barbara.. 😂😂😂😂 especially tunnel Trail. There are plenty of TH-cam videos, check it out. I lived there and we would go up it on electric mountain bikes because it's so technical and fun.
Trail builders have nothing to lose and everything to gain by listing a trail as double black and dangerous. Then when someone inevitably gets hurt on it they are less likely to get sued.
I know that the camera flattens things out considerably, but I still don’t see this as a double black. Black/Blue? Definitely. I still revere Portal as the ultimate double black and I’ll likely never ride it again.
I don’t think the camera does it justice for how steep it is. But if you send the jumps and drops properly, they are double black features. The exposure and high winds add to the difficulty.
Yeah, that optional line has two back to back drops on the exit. I didn’t get a good look but I’m guessing they are 4 footers. I could be wrong though.
I'm going to guess it's called Boneyard for all the ER visits caused by people thinking they are better than they are, and this is just a blue flow trail .
It's a pretty sweet trail but it's listed too high for the reality of it. But I can understand as a newb with too much speed is going to F themselves up, big time.
Thats pretty lame. Trail is medium difficult at least. But- if i was in your place riding this for the first time i would have done just the same. Go slow, explore, you nver know whats up next...
This IS NOT A TOUGH trail. I've ridden this several times and is maybe slightly challenging but definitely not a Double Black. Maybe your skills are not great but the trail is not the tough type.
TRAIL RATINGS ARE LOCAL. Given the trails nearby it's at least a black. Lens and good rider can hide difficulty to keyboard warriors. What is a green in France, Colorado, or Whistler has nothing to do with a trail in Utah. Heck, even a trail rating 6mi away has nothing to do with the trail ratings at this location.
Also an interesting fact; the name comes from the fact that when building the trail the builders discovered a corpse. Hence Boneyard and Tombstone.
Probably the best explanation, funny how people don’t realize this about trail ratings. And thanks for that fact, that’s crazy and very interesting!
That is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Ratings are not something, and definately should not be, 'local' or variable in any way. A standard is a standard regardless of location. This trail is not even close to being a double black. at best it's a blue trail, basically a straight up flow trail. Understanding that trails are, or at least are supposed to be rated by there most difficult section, be that short or long, there was not one section on this that could honestly be called 'double black diamond' and to rate it as such for whatever reason simply is an effort to make an area or trail network more appealing to tourists (visitors). Any respectable trail manager/builder would never rate that trail as more than a blue, which is what it is. Rating this harder could ultimately lead someone to think they the skills for a proper double black diamond, which could put them in a VERY bad situation with serioud risk of injury. That is THE reason ratings are standard regardless of location. Someone could get hurt riding a true double black, and theoretically, come back and sue these guy for making them think they had the skills to ride a true double black, when they don't. Dumbing down ratings is never a good thing and should never be defended.
@@Tony_Karzen With all respect, you are clueless. Ski trails and MTB trails have been rated LOCAL for eons. It's not a new thing. A blue in Squamish has little resemblance to a blue anywhere else (for example). Otherwise every trail in Squamish would be a yellow or double black, and every trail in Cedar City a green (for example). That's a stupid way to do it. The ratings are a relative rating to give GUIDANCE to riders on how to progress on a new-to-them trail system. Pre-ride, work your way up, not work your way down. Have a good one.
@@johnconnolly2815 Clearly it is you who is clueless. That could not be further from the truth. Standards like trail ratings are not local, otherwise they carry zero actual value and tell people nothing. Having grown up in a ski town, skied my whole life, across the US and Europe, I can tell you for certain, a blue is a blue wherever you are. The same holds true for bike trails. As a trail builder myself, having also ridden in a very wide array of locations, blue trails are blue trails. There is no discussion on this. Also, having worked in both the ski and bike industries, I can say that the insurance industry is a HUGE driver in how trails are rated. It is critical to liability claims and related issues. Do you actually believe they would insure one location whose black trails are proper black trails when others rate their blue trails as double black diamond? Of course they wouldn't. The standard is there as guidance, of course, but that guidance has to be consistent otherwise it means nothing.
@@Tony_Karzen pretty funny since I rate a lot of Utah trail difficulties for the signs and apps. You should stick to your home cooking stuff.
Also funny that you are a skier. A Snowbird blue is vastly more difficult than a blue at 95% of ski areas around the world. For example. A Snowbird green is a black at a lot of places. Just saying. The standard is trail ratings ARE LOCAL.
I'm guessing the risk factor of certain sections being at height and the potential dangers made this a double black, because otherwise it looks pretty chill.
I would agree with that. I also wondered about all the warning signs at the trail entrance, makes me wonder if several people got hurt pretty bad on that trail because of those dangers.
Everything is smaller on camera
Yeh that’s the conclusion I came to, it seems pretty chill. Looks amazing tho
Most likely from people with over inflated egos trying to haul down it as fast as possible without ever being on it first and simply getting out of control in the wrong place.
It's the exposure
Looks like a fun trail. Other than a couple of sections of exposure, it looks more like a solid blue trail. Not a DB.
True to some extent, but while cutting across the upper ridge, the trail is much steeper than it appears here and is very loose terrain. Compound that with the high exposure and you understand why it’s a double Black
Of course, all trails look easier from your couch.
Fun flow trail. A double black in the Pacific North West will make a lot of people fill the Depends.
I live very close to Black Rock in Oregon. I very much agree with this.
Listing this as a DB is quite dramatic for this type of ride. It's a flow trail with possible jumps.
Who is the person that thought this was a double black?
It's a blue trail at best with a single red option..
But hey it looks cool and well made :)
Red? I thought it went green blue black
Paul, the video quality here is off the charts, kudos, keep them coming!
Much appreciated! And there is definitely more to come! 😎
What I love about videos like this: trails only go down. You never have to struggle up to the top. Still wondering how that works.
Looks pretty steep in places. High consequences in many parts and you could reach huge speeds if you let it go. But if you keep it controlled it looks quite chill.
Absolutely!
Hard to tell with the extreme fisheye. Looks like you're riding down a giant basketball.
Try Project X in the Southern California mountains of Idyllwild. A true Double Black trail Aaron Gwin used to test bikes on.
There is nothing dangerous about this trail, it is a fun solid blue trail I ride all the time. This guy's camera makes sections look like they might have exposure, but they don't.
It's just an easy, fun trail.
And that trail does not look anything more than a blue! Maybe if you started hitting some of those doubles, it might be a single black, but what is all the warning about?! There was absolutely nothing to that trail that was double black!
Rode about a year ago. It’s steep otherwise ordinary black. And although steep, not all that rocky and no? ledges. (don’t remember - but none noteworthy). It was a fun trail and the warning and skeleton are neat!
I thought it becomes double black when difficult features are mandatory and not easily walkable. If not hitting the features, it is more of a blue trail with some loose steep sections that you need to watch your speed. Looks super fun tho.
Wow that trail looks epic!!!! I want to ride that!!!!
Next year come out for a practice enduro!!!
@@trailswithty9062 sounds like a blast!
I can’t wait to get back on this trail.
Here in WV, that looks like the same style trail we take to the mailbox! 😂😂
Nice riding. This trail looks pretty fun and flowy. Shoots, drag me along with Matt.
Green trail worthy.
I could totally do that trail.... if I can go 1.5mph and I have literally all day long, and it's nice and cool outside.
Looks challenging. Where is this trail?
Awesome looking trail and nice riding
Not seeing how they designated that as a double black though. Seems bluish but hey, I’m not in charge. Thanks for the video
Thanks for watching!
I use to ride trails alone till I flipped and landed on my head. I was luckily, I was alright. The other thing was, it was just a sunset. If I was really hurt I would have been there all night long. After that when I ride alone, I take it easy.
Good idea. Time is crucial with trauma.
What's your point? It's his video, not yours... this isnt about you
Such a good one!!! You definitely are capable of
For sure, just might need to do a couple laps to get it down. That big double is quite the set up.
badass, makes me wanna go to Utah
How you liking the Knolly fugitive? LT? I have the exact same also in Raw. Love it. Great for trails like this. Just ordered the 170 Chilcotin today on sale. Great riding.
I absolutely love the Fugitive LT. Knolly makes very awesome bikes. I’ll bet you’re stoked to get that Chili… I’ve been eyeing that one and the Warden as well.
What camera and settings do you use? Looks great
Looks pretty fun actually. If you want some truly chunky black diamond try tunnel Trail and cold Springs in Santa Barbara.. 😂😂😂😂 especially tunnel Trail. There are plenty of TH-cam videos, check it out. I lived there and we would go up it on electric mountain bikes because it's so technical and fun.
I'm locked in my house after eye surgery, i'm pretending i'm you riding. Thanks Paul, great trail!
I hope you have a speedy recovery!
Trail builders have nothing to lose and everything to gain by listing a trail as double black and dangerous. Then when someone inevitably gets hurt on it they are less likely to get sued.
Honest Canadian Blue
What on earth is the fuss all about? Dreamy flow trail
Might as well be a fire road.
I know that the camera flattens things out considerably, but I still don’t see this as a double black. Black/Blue? Definitely. I still revere Portal as the ultimate double black and I’ll likely never ride it again.
not even seeing the black diamond reason let alone double. is it just because of exposure on the ridge?
I don’t think the camera does it justice for how steep it is. But if you send the jumps and drops properly, they are double black features. The exposure and high winds add to the difficulty.
@@paorton I didn't see any drops...? Maybe on that optional line you skipped.
Yeah, that optional line has two back to back drops on the exit. I didn’t get a good look but I’m guessing they are 4 footers. I could be wrong though.
I'm going to guess it's called Boneyard for all the ER visits caused by people thinking they are better than they are, and this is just a blue flow trail .
In france this would be barely a blue trail xD
THATS a double black diamond??? Thats a blue line at best where im from and im not even that good 😂
wouldve said red in the UK , someone probably launched off the ridge and smashed themselves up
This would be a green at trestle
Not suitable for most riders? Lol that's an easy blue at best
Is the extremely dangerous double black thing like an inside joke or something? That was like a light blue flow trail lol
I hate it when my hose comes loose :(
Beautiful trail but definitely not technical
I think they meant trail for the advanced age.
It's a pretty sweet trail but it's listed too high for the reality of it. But I can understand as a newb with too much speed is going to F themselves up, big time.
With that caveat, a sidewalk could be rated double black :)
Great trail, but definitely not double black. Strange rating.
Looks like a very cool trail. But "extremly dangerous"...?
Doesn't seems very hard)
Another note your wind noise is brutal and the camera angle is nausea inducing. Please see the camera work of Dale Stone for tips
Thats pretty lame.
Trail is medium difficult at least.
But- if i was in your place riding this for the first time i would have done just the same. Go slow, explore, you nver know whats up next...
The video would be more enjoyable if you talk less and rode faster
Not a double black trail much less “extremely dangerous” SMH 😂. My 10 year old daughter would yawn going down it.
This IS NOT A TOUGH trail. I've ridden this several times and is maybe slightly challenging but definitely not a Double Black. Maybe your skills are not great but the trail is not the tough type.
Utah?