Killshot: MSI’s Shady Review Practices & Ethics
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 มิ.ย. 2024
- We’ve had enough of MSI’s questionable review practices, particularly with how we think it tries to bury criticism. Support GN’s firm commitment to independent coverage and consumers: store.gamersnexus.net/ (Wireframe Mouse Mats & Modmats ship soon, so get on the back-order list to be guaranteed one in the next round; shirts, posters, glassware, and smaller mouse pads are all in stock and shipping)
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This video is simple: We’re going through a few years of ethical concerns we have felt pertaining to MSI’s handling of reviewers and the reviews process. MSI was given an opportunity to speak with us prior to publication. Our goal is that MSI, and the rest of the industry, can learn to behave more appropriately when working with media. Namely, that’d mean no more “asking” for changes to content or titles. As a bonus, there's lots of talk about our history of getting blacklisted (and un-blacklisted).
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TIMESTAMPS
00:00 - MSI's "Request" History
04:15 - Why This is Coming Up Now
07:09 - MSI's Tactics with Reviewers
08:50 - Threats GN Has Dealt With in the Past
09:53 - GN's Advice to Newer TH-camrs & Reviewers
11:00 - This Behavior is Rare, But...
13:56 - Incident: MSI Laptop Damaged Lid
20:28 - Incident: MSI’s X370 Titanium
24:07 - Trying to Stall Criticism Into Irrelevance
27:56 - Stringing Along New Reviewers
31:10 - A Deeply-Rooted Problem, We Think
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Host, Editorial: Steve Burke
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@jt thorsson I think you mean LOW QUALITY, but I'll take either!
Steve ist einer der besten IT-Profis!
Holy shots fired.
@Wayne Yates Did you even watch the video? Pay attention.
@@brianorourke4880 I think we found the MSI rep.
There isn't much more I can say, other than thank you. It's been a bit of insanity getting through this and I am incredibly grateful for the support. Seeing your experiences too, I can only hope this will change some minds at MSI HQ, and elsewhere.
GN Please pin this.
For what it is worth, I respect your channel as much as many of the larger channels out there. Your content has always been thorough and you obviously have a lot of passion. This situation has further proven your dedication to creating ethical and accurate reviews. Keep up the great work, you will be a bug voice in the space before long :)
@@RaiderOfTheLost what is your problem?
I admire your onisty and resolve, keep it up and never waver, from one honest reviewer to another.👍
@@RaiderOfTheLost ok mr smalltime 0k dont act big you're also a 12y/o kid
one more legendary intro xD
btw thanks for your work with the lian li o11 dynamic xl def looking at a similiar if not same case for my next build that case is freaking epic
I NEED MORE SOLDIERS.
MY SOLDIERS.
A legendary der8auer has appeared!
Your Army awaits your command.....
@@dadjokes8963 I have that case in white. It's phenomenal. And, beautiful.
You know you're back here because of MSI scalping their own cards lmao
Truly a prescient video
Never hurts to go back and get a reminder why you never buy MSI
Oh yeah. This... this is an amazing level of scumminess.
Lol yup!
Macro Scalpers International - MSI
This is the way to call out manufacturers. He had all his documentation and covered everything. Amazing job man. Wow
Scalping updates. . .
Done like a lawyer!
Bewared of MSI Spy's chip may be coming soon too.
MSI Company Souls had already been Highjack by CCP China. That is why MSI Keep on lying to the World & keep on using alot to Cheap component from china nowaday.
@@creeplyjoes8828 wow! Xenophobia at its best. Given that GN has exposed many other tech corporates for dodgy practises including Newegg, Dell, HP and others, your comment is baseless!
Asrock blacklisted us after the Z490 content, so we’re waiting for some new PR people who care to do the job well. Thankfully MSI has an excellent PR team in our region right now, long may it last.
We’ll also band together with any other reviewer threatened with legal action for an honest review, this happened to us very recently and it’s a shitty situation.
It's nice to see the other Steve show solidarity here 👀 Keep up the good fight HU!
Fortunately, most the companies realize it's a bad idea to sue media over objectively backed statements. ASRock blacklisted us as well, it seems, also because of our Z490 content. Same boat! We even told them we had good things to say about B550, but they stonewalled us. Some companies are too stuck in the past to realize that it's best for everyone to work together -- they'll forget about YEARS of good things that have been said after one critical review drops. It's absolutely insane.
@@GamersNexus Pretty funny, exact same story here about the B550 boards and their response, or lack of. Well done Asrock, I'm sure blacklisting Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed will help boost their dwindling sales.
Gamers Nexus man that’s pathetic. R&D engineer here, it’s a huge slap in the face of our teams when this happens because what we want more than anything is feedback to make the best thing we can in the future...
@@Hardwareunboxed i've been wary of asrock products before, now i won't even bother. thanks.
MSI: could you remove "shady" off the title please?
could WE remove
we think that maybe it doesn't representative for the whole company
I'd like to share the video with a friend but... it comes off a bit negative
Can you change the name MSI to ASUS please
@@gunnar6674 Hahaha makes me think of that Cathy Newman interview with Jordan Peterson
This video not only aged well, it has become a collectors item
I'm hopi g thier shirts do the same as I'm banking on it
MSI Company Souls had already been Highjack by CCP China. That is why MSI Keep on lying to the World & keep on using alot to Cheap component from china nowaday. ...................xxxxD
MSI Scum....: D ( alot of China Spy's working inside MSI. Going to Fully OWNed by China CCP again soon) Trying to Control all American Freedom again
just like my 640
@@creeplyjoes8828 What does this have to do with "American freedom"? MSI is a Taiwan company.
A killshot sequel for Nvidia would be the Netflix-worthy adaptation.
lol Netflix worthy.... you do realize many bigger companies have been doing the same strong arm tactics for ages.
@@gallyggg376 why do you feel the need to suck the joy out of people? 😂 go away.
MSI Company Souls had already been Highjack by CCP China. That is why MSI Keep on lying to the World & keep on using alot to Cheap component from china nowaday. (Be caution of Spy's chip inside also, soon)......,
MSI Scum....: D ( alot of China Spy's working inside MSI. Going to Fully OWNed by China CCP again soon) Trying to Control all American Freedom again......,,,...
What happened with Nvidia?
MSI: "Can you remove Ethics from the title? we don't want people to believe that's something we offer"
OOOOOH man, good one
You win comment section gold!
MSI go to hell you even over charge. , Change 1st.
I am laughing way to haard here, nice one.
Why u speak truth human
We don't do that here
"Engineers typically can't talk to reviewers, they aren't media-trained and often say things that are **true**."
Holy *shit*
Yeah, imagine the profits they'd earn if consumer trust would be allowed to build up through engineers speaking the truth.
You could make millions that way... Long term.
Shots fired right.
That's basically all PR reps in every industry. I've been privy to this in the trade show side of things from CES to SEMA and the women they hire (very rarely would they hire men unless they held all kinds of training and experience) would know nothing about the brand or tech and just regurgitate what they were taught in their week long to one month long training on bullsh-tting the customer and are treated as if they belonged in the industry at the trade show they were hired for.
@jt thorsson I reckon this is why AMD is so successful, their CEO is a lady who iirc besides having a PhD in computer engineering (don't quote me on the specialisation) and worked on the PS3's processor.
She presumably knew all the jargon Jim Keller used to discuss and develop the Zen architecture, and that can really benefit the development process.
this is very true, they knew the products inside out, they are their "mothers", so to speak.
not those kind of ppl who make a living with their mouth (or fingers, in that sense)
I don't know how MSI's public relations/brand trust can get any worse!
MSI: Hold my beer. It's scalped for twice the MSRP.
one more legendary intro xD
MSI Company Souls had already been Highjack by CCP China. That is why MSI Keep on lying to the World & keep on using alot to Cheap component from china nowaday. (Be caution of Spy's chip inside also, soon).......xxxZ
MSI Scum....: D ( alot of China Spy's working inside MSI. Going to Fully OWNed by China CCP again soon) Trying to Control all American Freedom again.....,....
The CEO died two months prior to this video being released.
"Fell" from the top storey of their building lol
"there's no we -- you were not here when I was making 180 dollars a year working every hour of my life to build this"
Brutal.
C-C-C-C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER!!!!
Brilliant isn’t it? He’s so original and articulate.
Time stamp?
@@ShivaanshPrasann 16:01
"we'll let you keep the next GPU if you take this video down"
That's just straight up bribe.
It’s also admitting how bad the current one is if they say you can keep the next one over this one.
I wouldn't consider it bribe at that moment, it is still a false promise. They may never send another unit to the reviewer
No they will, reviews do matter, businesses are like this.
@@AdityaBangalore Well, in that case (they never actually want to or intend to pay), it borders with (the operative word is borders with) a fraud. A False promise (made with full knowledge that it is a false promise) that pushes you to do something you wouldn't do otherwise and the perpetrator profits based on your actions fueled by this false promise. So not a good thing no matter how we look at it :)
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. (if that's the correct proverb in English)
So no more MSI review samples....
Nothing of value lost :)
No more overheating $250 boards. What a shame…
@@tcclaviger We know that because we've seen GN's reviews, it sucks that they'll have to source their own samples because consumers (especially those who are new to this hobby and just googling something for a review before purchasing it) still need to be informed.
@@superliljohn91 certainly true for some, others know from other sources. GN is great but should not be your only source of forming an opinion....
@@tcclaviger Agreed, which is why the more reviews (especially those that do in-depth testing/analysis) the better. Also the whole thing of don't judge on the brand, judge on the actual product (brand loyalty/avoidance).
You can always rely on Gamers Nexus for impartial, factual, and honest review practices. The amount of work put in your research and your commitment to integrity are things I will always respect you for. Thanks for all you do!
hey stephen,
I just saw this and the wording on this is a bit negative towards our brand.
MSI Scum....: D going to OWNed by China CCP again soon & going to put SPY Chip's on GPU to Spy us very soon.
EV!!L MSI again Tag with China CCP(SPY.Chips Plus Scalping) again. We Should boycott them in USA now..................(Bad MSI)..........zD
@@creeplyjoes8828 bruh who tf are you, english is obviously not your native language and you keep going on about chinese spies in your comments and saying "we" should boycott in the USA. You've probably never even been to America lol
@@kwoni3337 he is trolling xD
MSI: "Could you remove MSI from the title please..?"
“Can we replace the M, S, & I with I-B-M?”
@@NezD why?
@@SonofKalas22 they're implying that that is something MSI would ask, they themselves arent asking for it
@@TheHarleyEvans yeah. I got that after I posted lol
@@NezDhey leave bae IBM alone... they made good computers.... 30 years ago. Rip the IBM Thiccpad
Their products aren't even bad 99% of the time, this behavior is basically shooting themselves in the foot. They need to overhaul their PR department.
this. actually their products are still quite good, its their PR department that needs the great purge.
meh..... MSI has good ideas, but they try to save to many pennys.
same with thermaltake
.
EX..... my 990FXA-GD80 AM3+ mobo didnt have any LLC control (it was fixed, cant be adjusted) and actually INCREASED voltage when under load.
went from 1.48 (safe) to 1.55+ under load (given the load was prime 95, and in most games, it only went to 1.52 ish, which is "safe" as long as its cool (and i had a nh-d15, so it was fine)
.
it would have cost 10 cents to use a different bios chip with enough memory / features to have an adjustable LLC
ASUS, foxconn, biostar, ETC had LLC controls on their AM3 and AM3+ boards.... but MSI did not
.
MSIs VRM on that board.... despite being a "16 phase" iirc..... acted more like a 4 phase, and ran hot as hell
After buying these products over decades (since this company was known as "Microstar International", or really just "Microstar"), it's difficult to declare winners and losers, at least beyond the now mostly non-existent previous low-tier brands like PC-CHIPS and ECS. Asus consistently has the best reputation but other than them being the first company to specifically cater to competitive overclocking with boutique boards, I haven't seen much of a difference long term in the average quality of their products. That is, sometimes the reputation is deserved and other times it seems someone is asleep at the wheel; that goes with all of these companies. Asus, Gigabyte, and MSI have all been around since the mid-80s, and, from my perspective, they've been on a similar level taking the entire history into account. Biostar sticks out as a similarly aged company that is still around but not on the same level.
vesa hansa It’s always bad PR and Heads when a good thing looks very bad. Fools
This video alone will make me active steer customers away from this, This type of behavior is unacceptable. It is one thing to pull someone from review sample because you didn't like their opinion, like Steve said often that is temporary and short lived. However to actively sabotage or influence reviews is just unethical.
I ran a Computer store in the mid 90s, and we ran into this with companies. That was back when a 150 mb hard drive was $1500.00. I cant imagine what it is like now. Good luck to you. Love your channel.
The beginning looks like the intro to the hardest deathcore music video ever
If Humanity's Last Breath kicked in when it went black, I would've lost my mind lol
This is the bravest, most articulate, well explained and meticulous piece I've ever seen across any journalistic medium. And all of this coming from a die-hard MSI fan who never knew any of this was going on. Bravo (pun intended) for the excellent work, GN and Steve. I've followed you for some time but now you've got me for life.
I stand beside you as a Disheartened MSI Fan 😯 who is Proud of G/N
It is honest and credible journalism that push the company to make better product, punlish bad conner cutting and BS marketing. At the end, it's we the customer and the business as a whole that benefits.
Agreed, real journalism!
I used to support MSI as well until I got burned by their "paid review" tactics and have since then sorted who I listen to when it comes to reviews and GN ranks in the top, and I guess the 70+ dislikes is MSI representatives...
I thought that MSI and asrock had the highest quality stuff. they kinda have good stuff but damnnn they are rude af
Holy crap I love this channel. Never change.
Didn't think I'd see you in the GN comment section! Hope to see another cover from you soon, man.
fancy seeing you here!! my two worlds colliding holy crap :P
Cobus! Did not expect to see you here!
Used to watch you when I was 15/6. Now 28. Holy shit dude. 👋🏻😂
MSI Scum....: D going to Fully OWNed by China CCP again very soon & going to put SPY Chip's on GPU to Spy us very soon......,,
Just wanted to come back and say, I was an assassin hired by MSI to off Mr. Burke, but unfortunately as Mr. Burke never leaves his studio, we were unable to get our own retaliation killshot off
"MSI Deal with it. It's your writing that we're reading" ~Gamers Nexus
MSI Scum....: D ( alot of China Spy's working inside MSI. Going to Fully OWNed by China CCP again soon) Trying to Control all American Freedom again.........,,,
@@creeplyjoes8828 i don't want to alert you creeply but i saw some asian men in trenchcoats in front of your apartment last night. you should keep going
Look what you've done, MSI: you've made Steve curse.
I can’t find the time stamp now! I thought I heard it and loved it.
11:20 lol
Last time I recall he did that was the hilarious Tom's article on the RTX launch. I replay his "What the fuck? Is this satire? Patrick, is this satire?" multiple times every time I rewatch that.
When you burn bridges by being honest, it's the industry that has a problem, not you.
Gee tell me about iT
sweet summer child
after few msi product.. i know it just weak company.. all about profit..
"There is no oui"
*cries in French*
MrOracle lol
lol this is so stupid, have my upvote.
MrOracle!
Another fun thing I remember helping my friend fix his MSI laptop back in 2019, the GPU cooling fan in his laptop broke, and the reason for this was a design flaw in the laptop where it HAD to be set on a flat surface. He kept his laptop on a laptop cooler/riser to help keep it cool. How in the FUCK do you design a laptop so poorly you can't have a common helpful product added under the laptop, or it will break the fans. ALSO the tear down to get to the fans basically required a full tear-down to have the mobo out- which the tear-down for said laptop was so antagonistic I thought it was an apple product.
Engineers are not allowed to talk to reviewers, "They say things that are often true" LOL
I once got my ass chewed for talking to a customer. I asked the boss if I was doing anything illegal telling the truth. I then told them they'd better fire my ass if they expected me to lie. I'm still here, and still irritating management
Lefty eh Keep fighting the good fight!
@@leftyeh6495 You must be a competent engineer.
@@leftyeh6495 you're doing the Lord's work
@@leftyeh6495 what company?
I’m so happy to be a patron to support this kinda reporting. Thank you. It’s much appreciated.
Patreon and the store are a HUGE reason we can keep expanding our equipment/test practices and also forfeit ad money when we find a company to be in disagreement with our high requirements.
@@GamersNexus I wish that the shipping costs were not such a large percentage of the overall purchase price, as I would want more of the money to go to you, and not the shipper.
Dragon center not working anymore: Hello, Dragon center used to work but now i'm waiting for SDK installation. User scenario and mystic lights is missing. Also my motherboard RGB is stuck on the default rainbow = half the posts in the r/MSI_Gaming subreddit.
MSI coud't care less about dragon center, but it's for laptops. aaand it's in the utilities downloads for their B450 motherboards.
Use bloat standalone mystic light instead.
@@CosmicCleric The shipper is a separate small business that GN and Steve trust to do things right. That extra you pay for shipping supports a different family business that also does a lot to reduce plastic waste in their shipping.
@@supervillain3213 Apologies, but 47% of the total purchase price for shipping is too excessive to justify your rationalizations.
Edit: feel free to site other products that have a 50%ish shipping cost.
It's not only MSI it's every single company... But of course as you say it depends on the PR, MSI in Spain is better, there are some competitors that are way worse
Stop defending MSI just stop dude
@Ut1F70F Sin yeah im kot defending asus tho i thino that they product are shit The only brand that i like is EVGA
Giorno von maybe you didn’t clean the laptop fans?
@Ut1F70F Sin Laptops have their place, but more typically in the workplace or for school. Desktops and even mobile workstations are superior, of course, but they're also more expensive. Hobbyists, gamers, and more pc resource intensive professionals should steer clear of laptops if they can avoid it, but all others it's a valid option, albeit with tradeoffs.
Acer and Dell is pretty solid
I started watching this channel for the in depth case reviews, and stay for the journalistic integrity. Great work all around people. The progression of this channel is evident. Keeps the hits coming, thank you.
Gamers Nexus = 100% Integrity. And thats why we are here.
So true
just a quote/proof:
Gamers Nexus -- Der8auer & Steve: All the Problems with CES | Laziness, Lying, & Bad Products - th-cam.com/video/1qNNddXGsvU/w-d-xo.htmlm53s
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL 11 :03 guess who was mentioned
Plus taking shit about deepcool is their middle name. Lol 😆
@Necronoxxx hello MSI representative. How's your day going?
@Necronoxxx is that satire?
"Unlike MSI we actually have ethics"
Ooof.
That's a third degree burn
elaborate...
This is why I love GN
*ouch*
Burn, baby, burn!
"It's our intention to hopefully inflict change" whoa, Steve was soft back then.
massive props to steve and gn as a whole for supporting smaller content creators and citing willingness to utilize their platform to ensure people don't get shafted
"Engineers are often not allowed to talk to media [...] they say things that are often true." The smirk when Steve says that is PC review comedy gold (a small niche, admittedly).
Anyway, keep fighting the good fight, and I guess I'll keep buying mod mats.
12:58 for reference, and that is absolute comedy :D
"ask HQ why they are using the same MOSFETs on all boards instead" underrated 🔥🔥🔥
My MSI motherboards are graphics cards were usually crap. The MSI Ventus OP OC 2070 Super is an okay card though. I like my buddy's ASUS 2070 Super better though. Forget the model but it has a huge heat sink and stays in the low 60's under extreme stress. My Ventus hits 80 sometimes but that is more my case's fault. I have an NZXT 510.
@@dakoderii4221 I have the Titanium Motherboard an it is total garbage.. got it super cheap, but it wasn't worth it. My new Aorus Mainboard is sooo much better.
However I got the 5700XT Gaming X for relatively cheap. And while I think the MSRP for that card is way too high, I have to say it really is the beste 5700XT if you ignore the price. My Friend has the Nitro+ and it is really good too, but just a little more noisy.
So IMHO MSI is pretty hit and miss and that is not a good thing. I think Gigabyte for example are way more consistent IMHO that is what you want as a consumer.
Also so far it seems to me Gigabytes Marketing is more "fair" than MSI and ASUS.
@@zebarzebra My friend's old 4930k (Gigabyte MB) can game stable at 5.2GHZ but it's set to 4.5GHZ right now. Golden CPU and motherboard.
PR: what’s mosfet?
Let us not forget how they repurposed the same Twin Frozr design on Radeon GPUs.
As a consumer, I've always loved the products that I have bought from MSI. The products have always been reliable, and MSI was quick to fix any issues that I ran into (X99 big oof).
However, it's important to me that the companies I support do not resort to the tactics of a playground bully to try to strongarm reviewers into a glowing review, or getting rid of a slightly dull one.
I totally agree with GN here, a company's focus should be improving the product and, ultimately, learning from the issues that are encountered by the community. It is as if they do not think that the way they treat people will get back to us, the End User. That kind of low behavior can only color impressions a certain way.
I sincerely hope they can improve their relationship with reviewers, who, besides consumers, are their greatest asset. It is super sad to hear that this is, at all, industry standard.
I avoided MSI in my last build because of this video and coverage. Thank you.
"they don't have media training, they often say something that is... True."
Oooh boy, I felt that one deep in my soul. I've got nothing but love for all my compatriots that have to deal with the pressure and inconsistencies that go along with development, quality control, and maintenance.
If you say something publicly that's true and negative for the product, your competitors are going to drag you through the dirt until you're buried. Even if they have the same flaws. It's not fair to for the team.
If it's true everyone will find out eventually, engineers want a good product, the problem is always sales over promising and accountants trying to make cuts at the detriment of the product.
So now all i can see is a dragon burning bridges with knight snowflake doing battle with it while the rest of GN is playing heavy metal during the battle.
Still more power to you for sticking to your beliefs.
"knight snowflake doing battle with it while the rest of GN is playing heavy metal during the battle"
This is awesome.
Gamers Nexus i love your ceo
Can we get some fan art of that?
@@lazichicken1236 I second that! Mouse mat with headbanging tech Jesus, fire, and dragons!!!!!!
That's a t-shirt
Nothing about this behavior has changed in decades. When I did reviews two decades ago now on PC parts (long before video reviews were the place to be) harassment for negative reviews or even a negative opinion about a particular feature or result was par for the course. You gotta stick to your guns if integrity and honesty is what you are about. I knew a lot of reviewers that published nothing but positive reviews to continue getting free hardware, sometimes in the thousands of dollars a month. They went on to produce much larger sites because they were able to generate a lot of revenue by sacrificing their integrity. Love watching your channel and how honest you are and all about protecting the consumer, that was always most important to me back in the day. When I made the transition to working for these hardware companies in marketing, you would not believe the pressure that comes from corporate overseas to have nothing but positive feedback. People rarely ever consider the cultural differences between the western and eastern worlds (North America vs Asia) because we are so acustom to the way business works here in the US, but it is a completely different business mentality over there. Negative feedback and the use of certain words, colors, etc have huge implications on the company.
These tactis are disgusting and deep-rooted. Thank you for posting this GN. As someone who built a new PC a few months ago, I had bought the B450 Tomahawk MAX, which makes me feel disgusted for purchasing an MSI product, (which I'll never do again), but luckily it was one of their "good" products. I'll pass on purchasing any MSI product in the future if this continues.
MSI: “Noooooo you can’t show what we actually said, we try so hard to look good tho”
Just go back to the 90 and look on MSI they were not know for quality, now days they have got a bit better products but there still the same old crap i my eyes They need to do some thing with the management.
GN :"hahahaha upload button go clickkclickclick"
@@MrGhostLt true. I've never liked MSI. Always prefered Gigabyte or Asus. Never MSI or Biostar
MSI to GN: “Noooooo you can’t show what we actually said, we try so hard to look good tho”
GN to Thermaltake: "Your products suck"
Thermaltake to GN: "We know"
@@musticlas Never ASRock too.
I wrote a review on Amazon.com about MSI motherboard that I bought back in 2014. It was a fair review of the board and for my efforts I was threatened with a lawsuit if I did not "correct" my review. I told them to proceed with the lawsuit. That I found it funny that a huge company would care about one review of a product. My ability to review products on Amazon was removed for all products that I bought through Amazon. Amazon removed my review of the MSI motherboard. Oddly, several dozen others also highlighted the same issues I had with the same motherboard in their customer reviews. MSI's main claim was that since I returned the defective board, I could not review it. Amazon apparently agreed. No legal action was taken against me. (As of 2015, my ability to review products on Amazon was restored.)
That's an odd stance to take for Amazon. If you have experience with the product and returned it, people should know why. I have reviewed a few products I've had to return (a Gigabyte GPU and Dell Mixed Reality Headset come to mind immediately) and I centered my review sounds specifically why I had to return it.
Well I guess I'm never buying MSI motherboards ever.
@@FireFoxBancroft my MSI board sucks lol and just heard about what MSI is really like as a company. Screw MSI, never buying one of their products again.
@@yotoprules9361 what mobo you have?
@@deivytrajan msi z370 gaming plus.
First off, when a pcie wifi card is installed, the PC will not turn off. It just comes straight back on.
Second, the onboard audio stutters and crackles after a few hours. It's not the drivers.
Third, I bought a USB audio dac/amp to both increase audio quality and bypass the onboard audio. But the USB ports refuse to power it properly, with it glitching out and giving me not enough resources error on Windows. Works perfect, even on my laptop from 2003 (not even joking here, my laptop from 2003 functions better than my msi z370 gaming plus)
Although somehow I changed a bunch of stuff, and now it's working. It seems this exact combination of bios settings and this exact USB port I'm using on the front is allowing the dac/amp to work at least until I upgrade whenever ryzen 4000 is released.
Overall, this is what you'd expect from a £20 Chinese motherboard from Wish, not a £120 motherboard from a (once was) reputable company.
These problems should NOT exist even in budget products but ESPECIALLY when you start getting into the high end chipset. Admittedly the lower end of the z370 boards, but still, I only have an i5.
And before you ask, I've tried troubleshooting all of this and no one has been able to fix any of these issues. I'm on the latest bios from a about a month ago and it fixed literally nothing.
It's nice to rewatch videos like this to remind what brands avoid to buy (eg when having to choose between two simmilar products from diff manufacturers)
0:16 I'm honestly shocked that nobody has shopped an LTT logo in place of the dragon.
Yet...
The transparency and objectivity of GN is never in doubt. If there's one source I trust, it's you guys. This video is further evidence that GN are not "shills".
They will always be shills, but they're honest and what appears to be transparent and trustworthy shills.
The Compiler when did Jay do that?
2 of the most honest tech channels imo that point out the bad things also in products are Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed.
They could be shilling for the competition! Im kidding of course. I don't think there is any company I have ever seen steve and his hair have universally good reviews on every product they touch. I am sure there are brands they consistently like more than others, but that would tell me more of those companies higher level of quality over bias from these guys. GN always seems pretty up front with their own procedures and protocols. .
How can you sat that when GN has been taking sponsorship and co-marketing deals from MSI for years?
Is it just me or did Steve seem a little too comfortable digging holes and burying things in them?
He is a dog person, obviously.
im sure he has buried his thing in a hole a few times.
It certainly takes a lot of courage to criticize an advertising partner in public. But at some point the barrel is full. Enough is enough.
It's his secret garden. :3
This is not the first time...
Well, I'm glad you spoke about that and in particular about the design oversight of the MSI laptop with the bottom cover grill not matching the cooler fan whatsoever. Mine has exactly that problem (an MSI GE72 from a few years back). When I opened it to clean and I noticed that I couldn't believe my eyes. I swore right then and there *never* to buy any MSI product ever again and I stuck to it. I used to consider them top notch but this (and a 980 ti that broke for no appearent reason) was the deal breaker. It doesn't surprise me that they're the kind of people who intimidate reviewers to cover up their decision-makers' failures. What a scummy corporation. I'll gladly pay 20 to 30% more any other brand for the same specs but they will never get my money again.
Idk how long it takes you to do it but I really appreciate the timestamps on all the videos.
I have to say, I really admire the way you stand up against this kind of immorality and that you choose to expose any and all such behavior. We need more people like you on planet Earth who choose to follow their own reasonable moral compass. You have earned my deep respect for that. Please keep up the good work! :-)
@@benjy117 Dude chill, the company may be foreign but the people working on it and doing this things are totally Americans or "western". Stop blaming foreigners for the things that are been doing here by "our people". This is a common practice for many companies here, in fact, what about not attacking people and instead attacking the bad practices and policies?...
@@benjy117 Attack them? excuse me but can you specify what you mean by that? It does sound pretty extreme even if you did not intend it. The problem is they are the manufacturers because we outsourced most production of silicon and electric components because we are to cheap to pay for the labour and in China nobody gives a fuck about workers rights. The western world is fucking its economy by outsourcing production to countrys where labour and resources are cheaper for a long time now. I mean what can you do as consumer if you want any kind of computation device ? There are no companies in this realm that aren't producing and manufacturing in China. And that's like this for most industries, at least here in western Europe. Contrary, jobs are cut because of more and more outsourcing to China. A good friend of mine works as a "Link" to the chinese Pruducers for Continental, a pretty big corporation and they laid off like 30% of workers in my location this year alone. All due to outsourcing more manufacturing to china because they make a shitload of money more this way. We cant stop this trend, the industries will not do something good for economy if it doesnt make them more money. Its sad but it is how it is and it wont stop. Products are designed here and produced where its at the lowest cost to produce them if i were in a position where i would be responsible for such a project i'd do the same, what choice do you have in a middleman position like my friend? Either you do it like they want and get the best price or you are out of your Job and good luck finding one in the same field after botching a big operation worth billions.
Edit: The company i mentioned issued a Statement that they are closing down Operations in Germany completely, first people are getting let of starting 2021, it will be more than 7000 People losing their Job. Pretty fucked up.
@Harry Beaver whats it then ? its a ball of shit thats rotating perpetually so we do not drown in shit?
Edit: Sorry for the rant, i was to high and drunk last night, even for my standards.
Killshot, warning shot, nail in the coffin, all Eminem songs lmao
Beard is weird?
@N Webb HAHAHA
@@RobertD_83 "Let's talk about it"
Who thinks Steve has good taste in music?
all dope. plus The Sauce, The Warning, Monkey See Monkey Do, etc..
friendship with MSI is over EVGA is now my new best friend
MSI Scum....: D ( alot of China Spy's working inside MSI. Going to Fully OWNed by China CCP again soon) Trying to Control all American Freedom again.....,
Takes out USB bootable windows 11 USB drive with all my personal account information stored on it in TPM 2.0 mode from laptop and desktop PC for resale after getting inspected for anything to need repairing before selling it on let go.
I have a friend who, back in 2011 or 2012, bought an MSI gaming laptop with a 1080p matte display. During the warranty period, the display stopped working, so he sent it back to be replaced. They sent it back to him with a 720p glossy display and refused to compensate him for the loss or take the product back and fix it with the parts he paid for.
I've refused to buy any of their products ever since. Since I'm an IT consultant and I have sold thousands of custom-built PCs in my career, none of them included any MSI parts. I can't vouch for a company that treats their customers this badly and this video is just another proof of their shady practices.
Thank you for making this public.
I bought a msi laptop, last year out of the box was the worst laptop ive ever bought in my life I returned it in 3 days 😂 msi never again.
Young Steve had so much patience.
But he has since ascended to the order of Hardware Jedi Master.
@@VANDYKEDAN Did his ascension come before or after his promotion to the title of "Tech Jesus"?
"If you can't get a laptop undamaged to a reviewer, why should we trust that YOU, MSI, can deliver one to a customer?"
Damn I can feel the smell of the burns from here!
if you ship something from say Taiwan or China usually when it reach country they have no say in what transport company that are to deliver it.
specially if there is one main state operated mail transporter.... (welcome to Europe...)
and MSI like all manufactures also don't ship directly to customers, they ship to retailers and if broken underway it's not a customers problem unless it's from retailer to customer and then it's the retailers problem, so it's a bit trowing the torch at wrong person by GN just to make a cheap line...
not at defence at what MSI have being doing, but criticise where criticise is due.
@@brrebrresen1367 MSI said that it was most likely damaged during shipping and GN included that in the review. And... later on it became apparent that it was a common problem with the laptop. Yeah that quote might have been a bit harsh, but since he mentioned both the damage and MSI's claim he acted fairly. He also didn't mention in the review that MSI wanted him to remove the info about the damage.
So... that shipping quote is totally irrelevant IMO. If Steve had included the conversation with the MSI rep (including the above quote), then I would agree. Feel free to disagree though. :)
@@brrebrresen1367 It's not the fault of the delivery service at any stage if MSI simply doesn't have adequate packaging for their products.
MSI is fully aware of what it takes to get an undamaged product to a customer.
@@bwood6337 , have had 8mm plywood crates been broken to pieces but also gotten parts of glass perfectly delivered in an single layer of bubblewrap in an envelope...so what is "adequate" is up to debate...
but if it's a recurring problem it's worth mentioning when doing a review but then the reviewer also have to know if the package they received the review model in is the same as normal customers are getting or some extra fancy stuff like Asus and Gigabyte likes to use (and MSI for that matter, they are none better) and Nvidia absolutely loves for their review samples.
I can smell the burns from my overheating-even-though-it's-undervolted MSI laptop.
This is so helpful to hear from someone who is so farther ahead in the field with experience. I've experienced some, not as bad as MSI examples shown here, but absolutely in the same direction, just less brazen. I held my ground, kept the integrity, but there is a sense of insecurity that lingers after a big company tries to "scold you" or intimidate you into obediance. Seeing some of the same wording and tactics used here, helped me (and I can only hope thousands of others) understand and see past insecurity and naivety, and it encourages me to stay on the path of reporting on demonstrable and verifiable facts, regardless of the external pressure. I can't thank you enough for the work you do and for sharing the experience and encouragement they way you do. Thank you!
I've also had issues with MSI.
I had a GTX 1080 (gaming-x) that refused to post in several motherboards for no reason and their support was less than helpful. Ended up selling the card (with a note and return postage label, mind), and buying an evga card as a replacement.
I'll be steering clear of them in the future.
"if you need to you can reach out to me"
Tech jesus doing gods work
I'm atheist, but i'm starting to believe in tech jesus. Love you tech jesus, our lord and savior.
@@Purjo92 _He is starting to believe_
Have bought 2x MSI GPU's in 5 years. Had no problems with them. Honestly they've been fantastic.
What I do have a problem with is bullying. No customer loyalty is worth that. Today it's the reviewers, tomorrow it's the customers. I think I'll look elsewhere for my next upgrade.
What im thinking tbh, but ima see if they fix it before i go somewhere else
And i was seriously considering spending about $1100 on an MSI GPU.... I’m gonna look elsewhere.
They are already bullying their customers with their warranty support.
When your MSI-branded mobo or GPU dies on you under warranty, just try to return it to a place of purchase or contact MSI support directly. It's a big issue, at least where I live. Even though I like their products, I refrain from buying or recomending them.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
I already have alot of respect for you and everyone @gamersnexus but even more now. Telling up and coming TH-cam reviewers that you have their back is amazing. We need people to stand up for the little guy and someone to give honest reviews on pc hardware. Well done on all the content Steve. You're my go to for any in depth review.
Seeing someone take their platform and use it for good like you do is amazing. I have ASD, so I binge-watch a channel once it clicks with me. I was hooked the first time I saw you whip out a balance sheet in a video, it made my BS in BUS heart so happy. (Also my grandpa always used to say "who's this we stuff Batman? You got a mouse in your pocket?" Not sure why Batman but the mouse point still made sense to me as a kid lol).
We're not asking you to take down this video, but would you kindly mark it as unlisted? That'd really help us out over here.
-MSI PR
We're going to do our own internal testing and get back to you soon™.
And we are going to pay you... for the time you invested in this video, of course.
Our legal team is also looking into mascot abuse. If you take down this video immediately, we promise to not proceed however.
MSI have to remember that they sell to almost all segments to the PC builder. One bad experience can mean that one person never buys MSI again. If this happens often enough, then MSI will do irreparable damage to themselves.
Short term gains and cover-ups are NEVER good bed-fellows.
This is a great point. I've been building since the 90s I generally buy a single brand (which I won't name so I can't be accused of shilling) despite how much the company does stuff that pisses me off simply because I've never had a bad part from them. Yet I've had defective or just poorly functioning parts from a lot of other companies (some of which no longer even exist) and it definitely scares you off certain brands. Building a whole computer, especially if you're taking time to cable manage, just to find out the motherboard is screwed and you have to return it is a monumental pain in the ass.
@@Weaver_Games Absolutely. I stuck with gigabyte mobo's for years because I love their custom boot logo's. This really personalises a PC . I know it's stupid, but it's a really nice touch. My customers love it!
But having one fail a week after building an entirely new personal PC... I can't say I'll buy one again.
Ironically I'm using an MSI board now.
Do you remember when MSI was new... they were absolute garbage. Now they're pretty good boards.
had an msi board once. am3 socket ... sweating thermal pads on the mosfets fried my fx 6300.. twice... >.> never msi since then edit: this problem > www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/5lrvzt/help_with_vrm_leaking_from_msi_970_gaming_am3_mobo/
@@undeath6010 Bloody hell that's a lot of leakage.
@@DJ-Daz the reddit link was an example. the two msi boards leakt just like that and fried the poor cpu and itself. yes it was just an 105€ mb. still i dont expect leaking pads to fry my cpu D:
I noticed there was a GT72 Dominator Pro G for a brief second. Was that the laptop reviewed? I have a problem with mine making a "pop" sound and shutting down. It seems to ONLY do it when my iGPU is on. I've heard that there is a problem with the power adapter plug on the rear of the laptop where your brick plugs in. Is that my problem or is it the iGPU? Help with this would be GREATLY appreciated GN! I am NOT able to play the games I have because of this damn problem. I play D3, Civ V and VI relatively easy with the processor graphics. However anything else that takes a better designated GPU I am not able to.
I had just bought a MSI motherboard a couple weeks ago. Hearing this makes wish I would have went with a different company.
Still can..... Take it back.
MSI makes terrible boards. Terrible.
Literally only had 2 boards ever die randomly. Both MSi.
Absolutely terrible quality.
@@nexxusty my z170 m7 has lasted over 5 years
MSI Company Souls had already been Highjack by CCP China. That is why MSI Keep on lying to the World & keep on using alot to Cheap component from china nowaday. (Be caution of Spy's chip inside also, soon) xD.. MSI Spy's Chips coming..
I love "The engineers are blocked off because the don't have media training and THEY TELL THE TRUTH ABOUT THE PRODUCT." As an engineer myself this makes me smirk and nod.
Michael Dhalle project management office always wants to cut corners then have to try to shut up engineers about the cut corners
@@NoName-to5xl the world would be a much more straightforward place
less marketing and words more action
People don't buy things when you tell the truth, it's the consumer's fault because they don't want the truth.
@@roji556 lol that's not the consumers fault are you a moron? It's the liars fault when they lie
"the motherboard is unusable, the VRMs overheat after just 5 minutes of prime95"
Msi: "could you not use such negative language?"
That reads like something a company run by overly sensitive snowflakes who have never been told "no" in their lives would say. Just sounds so...infantile.
“The motherboard is undoubtedly stable for being used under optimal condition. Even in extreme condition, the VRMs are able to bear heavy loading for 300 seconds with the industry recognized stress testing software prime95.”
@@campingzhai lol
To be fair no use case really stresses a CPU like Prime 95 does.
its CHOINEES
I really appreciate your Real Talk™ during this. Really cool to hear and offering advice & help to the newcomers
Canceled my msi 3080 Ventus order thanks to scummy practices and underwhelming perfomance on the card. Will be ordering/buying a Tuf 3080 or Strix 3080 when they are available.
Thank God. MsI sucks in general, but the Ventus cards are a joke.
@@nexxusty Yeah, It was the only one that was 'in stock' when buying. Except it wasn't lol.
That will be tough. I ordered the strix 3080 weeks ago. Still many hundreds infront of me in queue. Hopefully we wont have to wait until feb 2021 or later.
@@Xirpzy I got an Evga 3080 XC3 Ultra after 1 week of ordering. Got super lucky
MSI Company Souls had already been Highjack by CCP China. That is why MSI Keep on lying to the World & keep on using alot to Cheap component from china nowaday. (Be caution of Spy's chip inside also, soon) ...............xD Bad people MSI
MSI: Makes the best midrange AM4 motherboards (especially the ridiculously popular B450 Tomahawk) and gains huge respect within the tech community for improving their X570 designs after they were criticised by reviewers.
Also MSI: Destroys their own reputation when they had one of the strongest positions in the market, to try to take down a handful of negative reviews (which existed alongside a generally heavily positive sentiment, and an expectation that they would be able to solve their problems like they did with their X570s).
They do degraded and ruined my $599 9900k to the point where I had to replace as LLC which was hidden lied in it's spec and overvolted it to death
Also, their CEO got pushed off from a very tall building.
Their boards are total shit i would rather punch myself in the face than use an MSI board.
@@timothygibney5656 MSI BIOS can be somewhat less intuitive to use, it isn't necessarily ''lied'', but many important detail that will affect eventual voltage input is not being put in front and center.
Stephen Gibb I’m loving my MSI board but I’ve only ever built 2 PC’s, what makes you dislike them so much? I’m genuinely asking because I intend on building more and would like to learn before making more decisions.
“We don’t want to destroy MSI”
Title: *killshot*
killshots fired :)
Kill the bad behaviour
nuked from orbit lmao
MSI shot themselves though soooo
Steve shot and killed the muscleman but hasnt gone after the boss yet. Msi has been warned. C:
Steve, I've watched you for a number of years now, you have the moniker of Tech Jesus for an absolutely rock-solid reason my friend. My personal experience comes from being that liaison between the customer and the company, however, mine comes from a different sector (commercial plumbing). You are SPOT ON with this information....the engineers and techs at my company would tell you with a straight face what the product strengths and weaknesses are. The problem is, most people don't get to speak with them when they encounter an issue. You call the customer support number provided (hopefully they have robust document control so that the contact info listed is still valid), and then speak with a rep who will go through a script written by the folks you want to actually speak with. We had to do this at my company, just for the simple fact that we had to have a filter in place to ensure we could focus on fixing the worst of the worst issues presented. Marketing and PR guys can all go pound salt....it is almost pointless to complain to them about issues, as their job is to spin in an attempt to improve market share and sales value however they can....ethical or not. Enough rant, just wanted to relate similar experience in a different field. Keep up the excellent work my friend!
I do have a MSI 3070 X Trio since it's the only GPU that was available at MSRP, and it's been great, no complaints. However this video is a reminder why no one should fanboy for any company. Just because I have an MSI GPU in my PC doesn't mean I can't absolutely hate and criticize them for their crappy conduct, which I am. It's saddening that I have to remind people to not be tech company fanboys but here we are. They get so attached to the products theyre buying that they go as far as to defend the company behind it no matter what they do just so their purchase feels... validated? Well news flash, it is validated if it's working great for you. The company behind it doesnt have to be perfect. No company is perfect. You should still call out companies on their bullshit like Steve did here.
Can we just take a second to appreciate how GREAT of a techtuber community we have these days? GN, Hardware Unboxed and yes even Linus nowdays are trustworthy sources with actual ethics! This is extremely rare in our world today where journalism in most cases is simply undercover commercial or political propaganda. Both the big and the smaller guys (AdoredTV, TechYesCity or Joker productions for example) are right there to call out anything shady going on in the industry. It feels so great to have people you know you can trust to protect you to an extent from the corporate interests of big companies.
Agreed.
When wasn't LInus trustworthy?
Linus has always been thrustworthy i believe?
@@Yigitcanakkas Me too, but antony209494 said, "even Linus nowdays"
People like to say linus is biased, but it's only because hes become so successful.
How sad is it that the industry is so crooked that the natural assumption is that anyone who gets ahead must be crooked as well
If MSI or any other company watch this and read the comments, for the most part I and many of my friends in the pc building community will not buy a product if GN (and other trusted sites) post a review pointing out the flaws. No we don’t blindly follow GN but we trust them for honest no bs reviews so if your thinking of any further comeback on GN you Will lose a big part of your customer base.
Same well said!
Agreed, well said!
This comment puts more leverage on to deny review privileges to .
I personally only buy products that are reviewed by people who have in the past negatively reviewed a product, and are now reviewing the update to that product. Or the review is contrastive between products in a similar market space, and still includes negatives for the product. If there are no negatives, no data with methodology, I don't trust that the reviewer to have fully reviewed a product.
This video here, is a good review of how a deals with reviewers. It has negatives, and some datapoints and a little bit about methodology (harder to measure because we are dealing with wet-ware), which makes this more trustworthy in my eyes. This also makes me trust this to review other parts of 's products, as they seem to promise to have similar integrity in future reviews.
100% agreed.
what he said
Haven't purchased MSI hardware since RMA'ing a premium level Motherboard that died on me within the warranty period. MSI sent back a Motherboard that was under 1/2 the value. That was well over 10 years ago, but still the first thing that runs through my mind when considering MSI products. This information will now be the 2nd thing to run through my mind. Definitely appreciate the integrity of your reviews!
This video is exact reason why I watch your reviews. Thank you for sticking to honesty over money
I remember a time, when the german print magazin "PCGames Hardware" wrote about Msi's Method to pimp the Test Sample Videocards by a modified "Press Bios" with higher specs then retail
When Tech Jesus closes a door, he opens a window.
I’m from the future and msi has “allegedly” (for now) were scalping RTX 30 series cards by a sub branch under MSI
Man, ASRock is the only motherboard manufacturer that Steve hasn't been mortifyingly pissed off at. They just get bad reviews, quietly fume and then they fix the issue. In ASRock's case, mildly fix the issue.
130 MSI employees disliked this video.
up to 157. Thats actually kind of low IMO, when you consider how many MSI marketing employees just got thrown sh!t at (granted its deserved and necessary, but its still throwing sh!t).
More like 166 burner accounts XD
I don't think they're all MSI employees. But probably all of them are PR people. 💩
Went up to 190 disappointed MSI employees. Reporting on Aug 2, 12:49 AM .
Yes, I stay up late on Sats to watch tech vids.
193 @ 142 a.m. EST
Edit: seems to be slowing down
This sounds like the CEO of a company i worked for when i first started in the I.T. industry who would, and this was a ongoing internal joke, "XXXXXX (the CEO) would rather spend a dollar to ignore a problem or cover warranties then to spend a dime to fix the problem" and it sounds like this is MSI's thinking as well. SAD
sadly a fairly common problem
@El Cactuar Heil Grammar!
Yep, you find that kind of short sighted behaviour everywhere.
Fixing requires an investment at first, but is in many cases the cheaper option as time passes. But people sadly still prefer to gamble and ignore problems until everything comes crashing down.
Pointy haired boss syndrome.
@@Sundara229 Yes, you are correct, it is not only less costly in the long run as well as potentially ruining the reputation of your company and or its products as well. Morale of the story is the spend that dime now and save a dollar (and your rep) later
I have gv62vr 7rf and it has a design flaw of self damaging display hinges, thanks GNex for bringing this widespread issue into light
Watching this today after scalping controversy..... this brings up questions about the other cards in bulk on eBay being scalped..
I remember the day I found your channel after browsing trough so much marketing/influencer bullshit videos, I was so glad, especially because your channel delivers extremely good, professional and unbiased content to this day and beyond
15:57 Steve at the urologist *"There is no wee"*
or a Scottish man at an adult-only convention
That was actually so real though "There is no 'we', you weren't here, when i was making 180$ in my first year, working every hour of my life to build what became this..." Huge respect to the GN team and ofc Tech Jesus
**Steve trying to explain to me why we can't play Wii Sports at his place.**
@@Drinkyoghurt Haha nice one too
Oui oui :D
I've neverwatched your channel before, I came here after Jayz 2 Cents referenced this video. You guys have backbone, I appreciate that, you got a new sub.
I get a lot of good info from yourself and the other two fellows. I could not make head or tails after not keeping up with the changes. Now I understand why I make a mistake on my builds. You guy keep on reporting.
I love how Steve just don't give a Frick about pissing off "Industry Partners" ... And I love it ... Don't ever stop. Most trusted tech youtuber EVER! ... going to preorder a mod mat now :)
Same
Despiser Despised one of those, huh?
This is why whenever an embargo lifts and I have 30 notifications all on the same product, I watch GN first.
Yeah, want unbiased honest reviews - Nothing more and nothing less
true that. GN isn't perfect. Sometimes they go too slow on some points or repeat some things a few too many times but I can trust their methodology. Whereas some other guys like Hardware canuks provide great visuals but I can't always trust their reviews. For example they spoke so highly of the evolv mATX case. I bought it only to find the thermals are complete garbage. This was not mentioned in the review at all
Good to learn about these practices.
As far as the cracking case on laptops goes; ALL MSI laptops have problems with the hinges breaking after a short time. Never seen one that didn't. My current MSI laptop is 6 years old, and I had to replace the shell twice already because the hinges broke. But that's to be expected if you only use a few 2mm screws IN PLASTIC to hold it together. Last repair I superglued the hinges to the shell in addition to the screws. It seems to be holding better now.
I personally never had any other problems with any MSI products however. Would like to know if the products can be trusted these days, since I'm saving up to build a 3D dev system, and planned to use an MSI motherboard. I will take the information in this video in to consideration too though. Ethics are about as important as a reliable product.
I got my MSI X399 motherboard for TR2950X 2.5 years ago, and I am happy with it (it is not 100% perfect product, but it does the job where I care most). But it was a really tough call, between MSI and Asrock. If I would know better about these issues I would probably go with Asrock, (which I used in my previous system for about 7 years with i7-3930K, still happy second computer).
"Unlike MSI, we actually have ethics." Damn, Steve. Burn those bridges! (Also, I bet the 8 dislikes so far are all from MSI employees!)
I doubt the average employee is supportive of what the higher ups do and think. I'm sure they're just as much on the receiving end of MSI's lack of ethics, as the customers are.
MSI is burning the bridges, GN is just shining a light on the arsonist
@jt thorsson unironically, yes
All of this "lack in ethics" comes from the higher ups, the bosses.
@@RFLCPTR Not all. I've worked in a few huge tech companies. They hire people who share their values as much as they can. If you don't share their values, you'll be pushed out in some way.
this is exactly what i love about GN, it "i dont give a shit about what the emails say, if it's shitty, im gonna say its shitty. if its good, im gonna say its good." it is for this reason that i started watching this channel, because i knew that if you said it was a good product, i could trust it for me and more importantly, for those people who pay me to build systems for them. im currently running one of those MSI gaming X 1080 video cards, the little brother to the 1080ti that buildzoid reviewed very positively, and the reason ive held onto it is because i can solidly cement the review of the device. it's been a top shelf performer for me for several years, even with doing things like folding@home, which pushes 100% throttle all the time. based on the trend, i will probably steer clear of newer MSI products, unless GN shows them in a good light, because i have also seen several MSI items, especially in the laptop sector, that have been rather lackluster, especially when taking price into account. my wife is running an older 990FX chipset msi board while we save for her Ryzen upgrade, and it's been a bit of a pickle to run, whereas my beat-to-shit 990FX Sabertooth from Asus was a flawless performer since 2013, even being overclocked running 1.51 volts at the cpu the entire time of that board (which ended only a few months ago, when i built my 3950x rig). Ive been in the hardware game since the Pentium 3 came out, so over 20 years of system building experience, so i do have a few brands that i stick to like glue when it comes to building my own personal rigs. but i do often rely on the reviews of folks like GN, and Jayztwocents, Pauls Hardware, Bitwit, and the dropped items on Linus Tech Tips, when i go to recommend hardware to a friend or a customer. for all of this honesty and reliability, i thank GN and the other top Tech-Tubers for sticking to their guns and putting up honest reviews. One of the LTT crew just reviewed a prebuilt system recently and was rather disappointed in it, and they stated that, which i thought was really good. the suggestions on improvements were logical and attainable suggestions, and considering the cost of the item, if i were to build the same system, i would have done the exact things they suggested to improve on it. i feel that honest reviews are harder and harder to find in a lot of industries because money means so much these days, but im happy that the list of reviewers i follow have stuck to their guns and done everything they could to keep reviews honest and on a level playing field. keep up the good work!
990FX Sabertooth was such nice mainboard. Miss it.
the comment is great, but I could barely read through it. please consider using ENTER/RETURN button for splitting lines.
@@TechEpiphany Hey that's the motherboard I have in my office PC. Still going strong - it's not doing any heavy lifting like gaming or rendering, but still runs well. It's running Folding@Home on the GPU only, and seems to do that well.
Movie reviews and game reviews have in large part fallen victim to these kinds of scummy behavior, since it seems entertainment journalists are more afraid of not being invited to previews and get advance copies of the games. But just like for tech reviews, I hope integrity lasts over time, because it's not like I'm going to trust a reviewer who lies about what they like or even what's in the movie or game that they're reviewing.
@gamersnexus What's a good x570 board for Ryzen 9 5950x with great ethical standards also.
Thanks