Today I wanted to discuss what I believe would make Star Citizen's reputation and progression system ever by adding unique rewards and perks for obtaining higher reputation that goes beyond what the system is today which simply gives us access to higher paying missions of the same varied mission set. What are your thoughts of my list?
I think a lot of it is that for some it doesn't seem like an important topic, but with the goals they have for short and long-term reputation and criminality, it will absolutely affect how you play and where you're able to go.
Great analysis highlighting the importance of getting reputation right, and how doing so could strengthen player engagement. Another couple of suggestions along the lines of your examples: 1) Call In A Favour Once a certain threshold of reputation is achieved, players may “spend” either their rep, or another rep-based value that allows them to call in a favour from their faction. Another favour cannot be called in until the player has “refilled” the reputation bar with activity valued by the faction. Examples could be: a security detail to accompany a cargo ship, armed medical evacuation, or ship recovery. Other favours could be some of the examples you mentioned (access to exclusive missions, items, etc). 2) Reputation rewards generating new content for the entire game Perhaps exclusive reputation-based missions or favours could create content that other players could interact with as well, should they be fortunate enough to stumble across it. For instance, a reputation award from a mining company could be a tip that a particularly valuable node has been discovered. Activating the reward spawns in the node, making it visible to other players who could access it if they happen to find it. The node might also be a zone contested by NPCs or similar complications. Another example could be a nine-tails affiliated player calling in an assault squad to occupy a bunker to allow the player to better access something, which effectively creates a bunker mission for other players. In any case, the reputation-based reward generates a mini-event that creates content not only for the player who unlocked the reputation reward, but other players as well. One challenge, however, is balancing the various faction rewards. It would be a pity to implement a deep and rich reputation reward system only for one “tree” to be the clear meta. Balance will be important to ensure that rewards are useful to different players and play styles. Great video! Lots of great ideas. Thanks!
I agree with everything you said. Personally, I understand that Star Citizen is probably not even halfway developed into a fully fleshed out game. I've only been playing off and on for 16 months or so. But you can see the intent of the game with the advancements of gameplay. When we start getting Nix, Terra, Magus, and other solar systems, they will offer unique game scenarios. Then comes the method to tie all of the adventures together in a way to make them all relevant. All of this will reveal the times progression will reflect in reputation. Whether it be paint skins for specialties earned or armors or plaques or however they decide.
I think the game is slowly getting pretty close to release (3 years or so), but they will continue development and add things to it over the next decade or more. Look at Eve for example and how much attention it gets as well. I think we'll start to see some major changes at some point when they get closer to that actual release. Fingers crossed as usual though
I think you have a good idea with the visibility of reputation. But reputation in only about interaction and building relationships. So being aware of your reputation with the locals of an area can define your approach. I would just make it an icon next to your crime stat. Missions are important now, when star citizen is incomplete and has a low player cap. But, from the information they provide for the future and their vision, you will have little time for missions. Missions are good for introducing the game, but are mere side-quests to the PVP aspect of it. In fact, PVP missions, human generated as emergent gameplay will be far more complex and satisfying than PVE. I really like the concierge progression. I would apply the same criteria for each profession. Depending on achievements like assets, employees, org members, bases, stations and good reputation building could give you a different status. I would def build that part last and don't bother with it now when they are whipping the database. The real game is not that far away. I believe the game's progression should be skill based. For that skill you set a price. Getting special tech and weapons is a result of risk and reward, skill and exploration. But, it should never give you an overwhelming advantage.
I think that pvp missions being more complex and satisfying is a matter of opinion. We know that they're planning to make more narrative story missions for 1.0. We also know that they're planning for your reputation to have longer term consequences which will prevent someone from going from a long standing criminal history to upstanding citizen quickly. Instead if someone wants to change their long term reputation it will take a much longer time. This will ultimately affect where they can go or travel. Progression will absolutely be more than just reputation, but it's one factor that will make for a very engaging system. And yes, we know that professions will also have this same progression system (which uses the reputation system) to further increase your standing and unlock certain items
@@Hav0k I worked in a startup creating an algorithm to measure reputation. I understand the concepts behind it. Story missions are geared to a single player experience inside the MMO. But, dream with me for a sec. You have 4-5 systems and 24 shards with a cap of 64000 players... Active players 16000, 3200 per system. With large orgs, small orgs and teams all fighting for resources. With missions from the org. Do you think PVE will ve viable or interesting?
Personally, yes. I do believe that pve missions will still be important and viable in their own way. Given how quickly they can add missions now, they can make adjustments to them and make them more or equally as lucrative as PVP contracts.
the reputation and rewards will likley be Blueprints and crafting schematics and resources are going to have VALUE to players so keeping a stock pile to use etc.
There's a few videos from SQ42, but here's a couple th-cam.com/video/ki0aKYyFUBc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=ALuN8wv5bBiVmofP th-cam.com/video/_aCE7gxQOVY/w-d-xo.htmlsi=Kfbks2k9EK8f87Ex
@@Hav0k thnx, but i already saw those multiple times, 0:04 where it shows the tower collapsing in the vega events i have never seen before, can pls guide where i can find the original clip, i know am asking fr to much
Unique gear you can loose in an instant would deter people from taking risk or engaging with certain content. However unique reusable blueprints would be a great solution.
I know it's not a popular position but tbh I would just prefer they add in a typical leveling mechanic where I gain levels as I play, and there are some high level NPCs and some low level ones. Having stats be tied to armor and weapons would be ok if it wasn't so easy to lose everything. I don't mind dropping all my armor and weapons if I could just go back and retrieve it, but if I am basically a loot drop for some pirate org of players, I'm never getting that gear back, so I am always at risk of just resetting to 0. If I could at least level up, then I keep some of that progression even if someone steals all my stuff. Otherwise, I'd prefer that you just can't loot other players. Otherwise, if everything is just tied to money, the game is literally pay to win
I don’t think we need ‘more powerful gear’ based on reputation… this is Tyranny of the grinder… while grinders hate that other backers can buy things now in Alpha… player rule by grinding for hours for ‘better’ gear will kill new player experience once the world matures. You see this in something simple like 7 Days to Die multiplayer - once a map seed matures there are few new players to fight the level 200 players who all the ‘better’ gear
It has definitely not become tab targeting. It requires quite bit more skill than clicking on a target and spamming buttons... Master Modes will continue to be iterated on to where it's not the same as it is currently
I don't understand what you are talking about. Why does everything suddenly become dynamic and ever changing just because 1 magic word "reputation". I have played Elite for years where everyone absolutely hated reputation.... not a single time did you explain why the reputation in Star citizen will be absolutely fantastic and perfect??? If all these things are determined by reputation you can just look in your mobi check your reputation with the faction and now you know exactly how they will act upon your arrival. making everything super predictable and boring. What you and everyone wants is just a little bit of variance in the things you do, in missions. in salvage or whatever right. But there is never going to be one thing that adds all that, a lot of people say reputation is going to fix that. But a lot of other people say no Server meshing is what holding back all these features, once server meshing is in they can just add everything. No that's not how this works. Instead you SLOWLY SLOWLY build/expand on the systems you have. And once it's very very expansive you can start randomly turning something off or on, obviously they don't want to do that now they want it the same everytime so we effectively test things for them, they want the least amount of variance right now. That's another reason why everything is so repetitive. But what your talking about is that systems tie in to other systems and for some reason you call this reputation, now obviously they will limit this as much as possible. Why? because if unfinished systems tell other unfinished systems what to do things break real fast and you spend hours finding the beginning of the mistake/change. Or communicating to other departments how it's changed. If it was that easy to say the game needs to be like this: now Make it. There would be a whole lot more awesome games. If you want to tell me how the best way of doing progression, at the very least use some actual logic, math or schematics. You say something along the lines of as you build up standings with different factions you could get access to unique mission givers. This sounds awesome right? sounds real life like, there is uncertainty and everything. But the problem is, it's a video game, and people will figure out the exact conditions needed to unlock the mission. Instantly making it another grind. You could add random number generators, but we all hate those. Same goes for "making your decisions matter". When people find the best decisions everyone will do one and be done with it. Your ship infinitely spawns for free, if you press backspace you respawn. How is a decision ever going to matter?? at least have us transport our ships around instead of conjuring up a new one all the time. Let me lose my ship let me sell my ship let me pay for my repairs. See how many things you could do right now? without any new systems. I imagine there is good reasons for not doing that. i've seen free claims for the past 8 years expecting it to change for all that time. Do you really think decisions will only matter with reputation? I do not want reputation, i want things to be locked behind skill. That's what gaming is about AFAIK. My first game was the original prince of persia. That would just be a whole lot of trial and error, a lot of dieing/failing. But everytime you discovered something would be the best thing ever, you often needed 2 brains. One was reflecting the actions one was doing the actions. Today everything is a reputation or exp bar, but everyone grinds to the end asap. So you end up with everyone being the same again hahahaha.
There's a few factors of reputation that play into it being dynamic that I didn't speak about, but as you work on reputation for one faction, it can ultimately affect another if they're rival gangs or companies. Ships will not infinitely spawn for free. Insurance will change once the game is fully released, and depending on the ship, we may have to wait some time for its replacement. Forcing us to pay a ton of money for it to be expedited or have a backup. Reputation is just the first half of a very expansive system they're planning to work on. Hostility will play a factor as described but it will be more than that and they've been talking about their goals for that for years. In short, you won't be able to max out all of the different reputations because it will affect your reputation with others if they don't like that gang or org. Making you choose who's rep you focus on since reputation will ultimately decide how you're treated over a long period of time.
This would be amazing its just a shame CIG dont do amazing. They actively avoid it from everything I have seen for 12 years now. They barely do average. Actually they still need to get a basic box mission to work reliably so this is probably well beyond the mission team.
Today I wanted to discuss what I believe would make Star Citizen's reputation and progression system ever by adding unique rewards and perks for obtaining higher reputation that goes beyond what the system is today which simply gives us access to higher paying missions of the same varied mission set. What are your thoughts of my list?
I'm glad that more and more content creators do videos on such important topic.
I think a lot of it is that for some it doesn't seem like an important topic, but with the goals they have for short and long-term reputation and criminality, it will absolutely affect how you play and where you're able to go.
Great analysis highlighting the importance of getting reputation right, and how doing so could strengthen player engagement.
Another couple of suggestions along the lines of your examples:
1) Call In A Favour
Once a certain threshold of reputation is achieved, players may “spend” either their rep, or another rep-based value that allows them to call in a favour from their faction. Another favour cannot be called in until the player has “refilled” the reputation bar with activity valued by the faction.
Examples could be: a security detail to accompany a cargo ship, armed medical evacuation, or ship recovery. Other favours could be some of the examples you mentioned (access to exclusive missions, items, etc).
2) Reputation rewards generating new content for the entire game
Perhaps exclusive reputation-based missions or favours could create content that other players could interact with as well, should they be fortunate enough to stumble across it. For instance, a reputation award from a mining company could be a tip that a particularly valuable node has been discovered. Activating the reward spawns in the node, making it visible to other players who could access it if they happen to find it. The node might also be a zone contested by NPCs or similar complications. Another example could be a nine-tails affiliated player calling in an assault squad to occupy a bunker to allow the player to better access something, which effectively creates a bunker mission for other players. In any case, the reputation-based reward generates a mini-event that creates content not only for the player who unlocked the reputation reward, but other players as well.
One challenge, however, is balancing the various faction rewards. It would be a pity to implement a deep and rich reputation reward system only for one “tree” to be the clear meta. Balance will be important to ensure that rewards are useful to different players and play styles.
Great video! Lots of great ideas. Thanks!
As always, great vid!
Glad you enjoyed the video!
"could" is a very fitting central word pertaining to SC.
Unfortunately accurate.
I agree with everything you said. Personally, I understand that Star Citizen is probably not even halfway developed into a fully fleshed out game. I've only been playing off and on for 16 months or so. But you can see the intent of the game with the advancements of gameplay. When we start getting Nix, Terra, Magus, and other solar systems, they will offer unique game scenarios. Then comes the method to tie all of the adventures together in a way to make them all relevant. All of this will reveal the times progression will reflect in reputation. Whether it be paint skins for specialties earned or armors or plaques or however they decide.
I think the game is slowly getting pretty close to release (3 years or so), but they will continue development and add things to it over the next decade or more. Look at Eve for example and how much attention it gets as well.
I think we'll start to see some major changes at some point when they get closer to that actual release. Fingers crossed as usual though
Hopefully devs will see this.
X2 on all suggestions!
Glad you appreciate the suggestions! I think they'll have similar if not better ideas for sure.
I think you have a good idea with the visibility of reputation. But reputation in only about interaction and building relationships. So being aware of your reputation with the locals of an area can define your approach. I would just make it an icon next to your crime stat.
Missions are important now, when star citizen is incomplete and has a low player cap. But, from the information they provide for the future and their vision, you will have little time for missions. Missions are good for introducing the game, but are mere side-quests to the PVP aspect of it. In fact, PVP missions, human generated as emergent gameplay will be far more complex and satisfying than PVE.
I really like the concierge progression. I would apply the same criteria for each profession. Depending on achievements like assets, employees, org members, bases, stations and good reputation building could give you a different status. I would def build that part last and don't bother with it now when they are whipping the database. The real game is not that far away.
I believe the game's progression should be skill based. For that skill you set a price. Getting special tech and weapons is a result of risk and reward, skill and exploration. But, it should never give you an overwhelming advantage.
I think that pvp missions being more complex and satisfying is a matter of opinion. We know that they're planning to make more narrative story missions for 1.0.
We also know that they're planning for your reputation to have longer term consequences which will prevent someone from going from a long standing criminal history to upstanding citizen quickly. Instead if someone wants to change their long term reputation it will take a much longer time. This will ultimately affect where they can go or travel.
Progression will absolutely be more than just reputation, but it's one factor that will make for a very engaging system. And yes, we know that professions will also have this same progression system (which uses the reputation system) to further increase your standing and unlock certain items
@@Hav0k I worked in a startup creating an algorithm to measure reputation. I understand the concepts behind it.
Story missions are geared to a single player experience inside the MMO. But, dream with me for a sec. You have 4-5 systems and 24 shards with a cap of 64000 players... Active players 16000, 3200 per system. With large orgs, small orgs and teams all fighting for resources. With missions from the org. Do you think PVE will ve viable or interesting?
Personally, yes. I do believe that pve missions will still be important and viable in their own way. Given how quickly they can add missions now, they can make adjustments to them and make them more or equally as lucrative as PVP contracts.
Great content!
Glad you enjoyed the video
the reputation and rewards will likley be Blueprints and crafting schematics and resources are going to have VALUE to players so keeping a stock pile to use etc.
from where did you get the squadron42 footage 00:01 - 00:44 , am really desperate to find those
There's a few videos from SQ42, but here's a couple
th-cam.com/video/ki0aKYyFUBc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=ALuN8wv5bBiVmofP
th-cam.com/video/_aCE7gxQOVY/w-d-xo.htmlsi=Kfbks2k9EK8f87Ex
@@Hav0k thnx, but i already saw those multiple times, 0:04 where it shows the tower collapsing in the vega events i have never seen before, can pls guide where i can find the original clip, i know am asking fr to much
@@vairoalexnder No worries at all. I had to do some rummaging through my old files, but here's the link
th-cam.com/video/dO-fWiYJ1I4/w-d-xo.html
Unique gear you can loose in an instant would deter people from taking risk or engaging with certain content. However unique reusable blueprints would be a great solution.
@Kiyomoto657 true. But in the future we'll probably have item insurance or something of the sort that we can get it back.
I know it's not a popular position but tbh I would just prefer they add in a typical leveling mechanic where I gain levels as I play, and there are some high level NPCs and some low level ones. Having stats be tied to armor and weapons would be ok if it wasn't so easy to lose everything. I don't mind dropping all my armor and weapons if I could just go back and retrieve it, but if I am basically a loot drop for some pirate org of players, I'm never getting that gear back, so I am always at risk of just resetting to 0. If I could at least level up, then I keep some of that progression even if someone steals all my stuff. Otherwise, I'd prefer that you just can't loot other players. Otherwise, if everything is just tied to money, the game is literally pay to win
cool to see boba fett play star citizen :P
Lol the knock off Star Citizen Boba Fett
@@Hav0k thats the best kind!
I don’t think we need ‘more powerful gear’ based on reputation… this is Tyranny of the grinder… while grinders hate that other backers can buy things now in Alpha… player rule by grinding for hours for ‘better’ gear will kill new player experience once the world matures. You see this in something simple like 7 Days to Die multiplayer - once a map seed matures there are few new players to fight the level 200 players who all the ‘better’ gear
Star citizen is becoming tab targeting. Based on what master modes has started. I wouldn’t expect too much
It has definitely not become tab targeting. It requires quite bit more skill than clicking on a target and spamming buttons... Master Modes will continue to be iterated on to where it's not the same as it is currently
I like your ideas and hope we see some sort of action soon. The quality of your content is very high, hope more people will follow the channel.
I appreciate that! I definitely hope we see some action soon as well!
I don't understand what you are talking about. Why does everything suddenly become dynamic and ever changing just because 1 magic word "reputation". I have played Elite for years where everyone absolutely hated reputation.... not a single time did you explain why the reputation in Star citizen will be absolutely fantastic and perfect??? If all these things are determined by reputation you can just look in your mobi check your reputation with the faction and now you know exactly how they will act upon your arrival. making everything super predictable and boring.
What you and everyone wants is just a little bit of variance in the things you do, in missions. in salvage or whatever right. But there is never going to be one thing that adds all that, a lot of people say reputation is going to fix that. But a lot of other people say no Server meshing is what holding back all these features, once server meshing is in they can just add everything.
No that's not how this works. Instead you SLOWLY SLOWLY build/expand on the systems you have. And once it's very very expansive you can start randomly turning something off or on, obviously they don't want to do that now they want it the same everytime so we effectively test things for them, they want the least amount of variance right now. That's another reason why everything is so repetitive. But what your talking about is that systems tie in to other systems and for some reason you call this reputation, now obviously they will limit this as much as possible. Why? because if unfinished systems tell other unfinished systems what to do things break real fast and you spend hours finding the beginning of the mistake/change. Or communicating to other departments how it's changed.
If it was that easy to say the game needs to be like this: now Make it. There would be a whole lot more awesome games.
If you want to tell me how the best way of doing progression, at the very least use some actual logic, math or schematics.
You say something along the lines of as you build up standings with different factions you could get access to unique mission givers. This sounds awesome right? sounds real life like, there is uncertainty and everything. But the problem is, it's a video game, and people will figure out the exact conditions needed to unlock the mission. Instantly making it another grind.
You could add random number generators, but we all hate those. Same goes for "making your decisions matter". When people find the best decisions everyone will do one and be done with it.
Your ship infinitely spawns for free, if you press backspace you respawn. How is a decision ever going to matter?? at least have us transport our ships around instead of conjuring up a new one all the time. Let me lose my ship let me sell my ship let me pay for my repairs. See how many things you could do right now? without any new systems.
I imagine there is good reasons for not doing that. i've seen free claims for the past 8 years expecting it to change for all that time. Do you really think decisions will only matter with reputation?
I do not want reputation, i want things to be locked behind skill. That's what gaming is about AFAIK. My first game was the original prince of persia. That would just be a whole lot of trial and error, a lot of dieing/failing. But everytime you discovered something would be the best thing ever, you often needed 2 brains. One was reflecting the actions one was doing the actions.
Today everything is a reputation or exp bar, but everyone grinds to the end asap. So you end up with everyone being the same again hahahaha.
There's a few factors of reputation that play into it being dynamic that I didn't speak about, but as you work on reputation for one faction, it can ultimately affect another if they're rival gangs or companies.
Ships will not infinitely spawn for free. Insurance will change once the game is fully released, and depending on the ship, we may have to wait some time for its replacement. Forcing us to pay a ton of money for it to be expedited or have a backup.
Reputation is just the first half of a very expansive system they're planning to work on. Hostility will play a factor as described but it will be more than that and they've been talking about their goals for that for years.
In short, you won't be able to max out all of the different reputations because it will affect your reputation with others if they don't like that gang or org. Making you choose who's rep you focus on since reputation will ultimately decide how you're treated over a long period of time.
This would be amazing its just a shame CIG dont do amazing. They actively avoid it from everything I have seen for 12 years now. They barely do average. Actually they still need to get a basic box mission to work reliably so this is probably well beyond the mission team.
The barely do average because they're trying to get to a point to do better than they have. It's honestly just a waiting game. And it really blows.