Duvall stated in an interview that he really wanted to do the third film but they money they were offering him was disrespectful. He was a main character in the first two movies and, with Vito, Sonny, and Fredo dead, would have been the second lead in part three behind Pacino. He thought he should at least get paid half of what Pacino was making but they refused. Diane Keaton was paid twice what they offered Duvall. He rightfully saw it as an insult, considering he was an A-list actor in his own right. The studio said they didn't need him and the movie would be great without him, so he declined. I'm not sure what role Coppola played in the negotiations, but without Tom Hagen the movie became the worst in the trilogy, by far. I've seen part one and two over a dozen times, but I've only watch part three once and probably will never watch it again. It's just not good, and Pacino's acting is way too over the top. They really dropped the ball on that one.
The absence of Tom Hagen in Godfather 3 pretty much sealed the fate of the film to mediocrity. In Godfather 1 & 2 it was Tom who was the voice of reason and showed a large measure of civility compared to the rest of the Corleone family. With Michael trying to get away from the organized crime life, the character of Tom Hagen would’ve been crucial in that regard. And Duvall is a great actor who would’ve upped the acting quotient.
Agree 100%. Behind Michael, the most important character was Tom. The family attorney, then the consigliere, later the acting-boss. The studio (including director FFC) really screwed that up. Duvall was so severely missed, he proved the studio should have forked over the money. In the end... it came out to a few million dollars to get Duvall in a movie that has grossed $20 million its first weekend and made $160 million globally.
@@one51media35that’s wild to imagine. He was a well known actor by that point and a crucial character to where Michael was heading in the third film. But somehow they didn’t think he was worth a million bucks?
Tom was honestly probably my favorite character, he’s just so dedicated, educated and unwavering in his dignity and loyalty. Also I believe it’s widely agreed Part 3 was good but it’s not in the same league as 1 and 2. Just different levels of film quality
Nah, part 3 is legitimately bad. If it wasn't Godfather, it'd be an average/mediocre mafia movie. But it is, and it's all the more pathetic & embarrassing
to replace robert duvall with george hamilton is like cinderella's fairy godmother replacing the two mice and the pumpkin with a couple of roaches and a zucchini...
As much as I like them, George Hamilton, Eli Wallach and Joe Mantegna were out of place in GF III. Robert Duval and his character Tom Hagen were sorely needed and missed. This project was more akin to a three part made for tv movie than a major studio release.
It's really too bad that the powers that be, knowing how great The Godfather was, imagined they could get by without Clemenza in part 2; then they repeated the same mistake with Hagen in part 3. Very foolish production decisions.
@@robhaskins Godfather II stands on it's own, however, I think they did an excellent job in filling that void by showing young Pete Clemenza and the key role he played in the founding of the Corleone family. Tom Hagen not being in Godfather III was bad enough, however I'm not sure him being in it could've saved the film as a whole.
I believe Duvall said in an interview after III was released that they tried to get him on the cheap since Pacino wanted such a huge paycheck and he refused. Reminded Coppola that he was in a fact a 2x Oscar winner and his Tom Hagen character was central to the story - but they wouldn't budge
When the studio decided to low-ball Duvall for the reprise of his role as Tom Hagen, they where probably thinking that Andy Garcia would carry the second male lead part in the film. Boy were they wrong. That, plus Coppola's daughter in the second female lead killed Godfather III and it probably shouldn't even be considered as a sequel to Godfather I & II. It downright sucks.
Could you imagine the first two films without Tom Hagen in them? Yeah, me either! That’s why the third felt like it was missing something throughout the entire movie!
The Achilles heel of Godfather 2 was that they wrote out Clemenza and created the character of Frank Pentangeli. The story would have been 10 times better as originally written. The fact that Frank Pentangeli was created for the movie and therefore didn't have any real back story robbed his betrayal arc of any real dramatic substance and was the movie's fatal flaw. That too was a contract dispute! SMH
Tom Hagen was arguably the BEST character the first two films. The lack of him in part 3 to counter Mike's growing crazy would have made that movie so much better. Also, Robert Duvall is a fantastic actor. The first thing I saw him in was an episode of the Twilight Zone, "The Miniature" and it's still one of my fav episodes. Great video, thanks!
I thought I was losing my mind when i saw the title of the video because I've seen Godfather I and II more times than I can possibly count and don't remember Tom dying in either of them. Turns out I simply forgot that Godfather III even exists. I'm not sure I ever knew it existed at all.
Tom Hagen was undoubteless a major figure in Part 1 and 2 of the Godfather. He's part of the family and loyal to the tooth. What a shame the producer didn't want to pay him what he deserved...!!!
I’m glad they didn’t go with Michael and Tom going to war with eachother. But you can’t really ignore the disrespect toward Tom with them “killing him off” just like that. Sucks because he was an important character.
When I first saw part 3, I remember thinking how hollow it was regarding Tom Hagen. Just a short line that he was dead did not give justice to a brilliant part played by a brilliant actor. But didn't the same thing happen with Clemenza in part 2?
I didn't think Michael would have had Tom killed, since as you say he would have confessed it in the Vatican scene, but I always assumed the two would have been estranged after Fredo's death, since Tom was surely aware of what had really happened, and he also clearly wasn't on board with what Michael was doing towards the end of Part II, so it would make sense.
Yes and the entire narrative arc of Godfather 2 points towards that - by the end, Michael has slaughtered all his enemies but also alienated himself from his wife, his children and his closest friends, including Tom, hence the closing shots of him sitting alone contemplating his pyrrhic victory.
I agree with you and paullinford4510, and would add that Michael might've also seen Kate's "miscarriage" as Tom's fault. That Kate confessed it was an abortion would surely add insult to injury, and he'd blame Tom for not controlling her. I feel this should have been mentioned in this video. Even so, I don't think he'd take Tom out.
It's too bad that Duvall couldn't work something out with Coppola. That's the biggest reason why it's not on par with the first 2. Duvall seems to always complete the cast and put films on a different level.
Simply put, Duvall had won Best Actor Oscar already for "Tender Mercies" after three previous nominations. Pacino had not. He had several more years to wait until "Scent of a Woman". Duvall felt that the Oscar made him deserving of at least half the $5 million Pacino was getting.
I did miss Tom in the third movie. I thought he would have taken over for micheal when Michael died but since micheal died old I would have loved for these two men to be together as brothers till the end.
He couldn’t take over because he wasn’t Sicilian, he was only temporary, but the leadership would’ve gone to a sicilian The other families were already breaking their balls by referring to them as an Irish gang but they wouldn’t have tolerated Hagen as boss, they wouldn’t have respected him because he wasn’t sicilian
I think Tom was more cerebral than violent - obvious - as opposed to Michael who was cerebral AND violent. I think Tom was more inclined to do business - it's business, not personal - and to do cool power calculations. He would've very likely ended in a deep-background position of political power, like managing political campaigns in Vegas or LittleRock, Arkansas.
Tom perspective of Micheal vs Vito dichotomy was unique & near perfect. He worked with Vito closely & got to see his great mess up close up more than any of the other children. That’s why you can see him in Part 1 get pulled into Micheal & seeing his potential when he’s talking about the dire need of taking out Sollozzo and using their paper in the News Papers to spin it. He also see Micheal going down a dark path towards the end of Part 2. Tom knew as ruthless as Vito was prepared to be, he would never lose his sense of humanity like Micheal was. Tom was definitely missed in Part 3. He might’ve not been the best war time Consigliori but definitely a loving devoted Son/Brother & extremely valuable confidant/legal consultant.
Going on the timeline between "The Godfather's Revenge" and "Part 3", there would have been some fifteen years between Tom Hagen's death and the events around Pope Paul VI's passing. It would make sense on a lot of levels (particularly with Michael's personality quirks) for Tom's absence to be barely addressed. It must have been a business thing that Paramount didn't consider "Revenge" to be canon as I thought it fit very well into the overall story line and had no conflicts with any of the films. Part 3 is often panned as mediocre, but I thought it well enough done to complete the story. Michael's death at the end could have happened at any time between 1978 and, say, 1995 (although that late date may have been unlikely given his diabetic problems). I read or heard one time that a Part 4 was kicked around but Mario Puzo passed, and the project died along with him. Summing up, Tom Hagen's death in a Florida swamp would make a lot of sense for a mob lawyer. And yes, Part 3 would have been better with Robert Duvall.
@@68majortom Yes, she died after being shot outside the opera house. But the very end of Part 3, at least on the DVD I have, shows an aging Michael sitting in a lawn chair outside the Italian villa and remembering happy times. He looks vainly around, perhaps mostly blind from his diabetes, and he struggles with his glasses. In short order a long shot show his arms fall limp to side, he slumps over, and he ends up a lifeless body on the ground beside his chair. A pet dog looked sadly on. Thus ended his tortured, complicated life.
Robert Duvall not being in the Godfather, part 3 as Tom Hagen was the second biggest mistake next to the ridiculously boring Vatican angle they decided to go with. Godfather 3 should have been a prequel telling the story of the ride of Don Vito and the five families with an older Michael making a minor appearance to bring his and Tom’s arc full circle. I always believed that Tom died of a heart attack at the begging of part 3.
Tom Hagen was always pragmatic. Imagining him, resigned to his fate, in the car, and choosing to reflect on happy memories, sounds exactly like Tom Hagen.
Part 3 - (mentioned in the comments) The fact that Coppola is still denying that he purposely put his daughter in the movie because he couldn't find another actress - no other actress other than his inexperienced daughter - so no other actress in Hollywood was available to start in a Godfather film with Coppola. - Tells me that he is in complete denial that part 3 is absolutely terrible. And it is. Not just a bad Godfather movie but a bad movie. The character of Michael is terrible. It ruins the trilogy. For me The Godfather ended at the end of part 2. It's as bad as his hair cut for that film.
Winona Ryder was originally cast as the daughter of Michael Corleone but she dropped out of Godfather Part III to make another movie. Other actresses like Julia Roberts were considered but nobody wanted to do GdF III.
@@AvengerII No actress in the whole of the world wanted to work with Coppola? No one.... OK. Fine I guess the ONLY choice was his own daughter with next to zero acting experience....
They needed Hagen for Godfather III. They should have paid Devall and cut Keaton. She wouldn't have been missed. Hagan would never have challenged Michael. He wouldn't have wanted to be a full time Don. He never personally killed anyone. Neither did Sonny, as far as I know, but definitely a plus if you want to be a Don.
I was only interested in seeing Godfather 3 to see what would happen with the Hagen character. In the first two I saw him as a survivor, and I think it would have been best if he went on living through the series.
Don't see any circumstance where Tom Hagen would kill Michael or anyone else for that matter. Tom never orders a killing. He simply looks the other way when killings happen. Do not see Michael ever ordering Tom to be killed either. Tom always kissed Michael's ass.
The three best Scenes for me with Tom Hagen is: 1) Telling Vito news of sonny's death in Part one 2) Blackmailing the senator in vegas after they killed a prostitute and set him up with it, and 3) The scenes when he questions if michael has gone too far.
I always viewed Tom Hagen as an embodiment of Vito. When Vito is incapacitated and dead, Tom takes on his spirit when guiding Sonny and Michael. Without Tom in the third film Michael falls apart as his dad’s spirit is gone.
They are all his embodiments. Sonny is Vito's flair and love, Michael is his ruthlessness and intelligence, Fredo is his will to enjoy life and Hagen is his aspiration to make his family pure American.
You mention if Michael had killed Tom, or ordered someone to kill him, he would have mentioned it in GF3 when confessing to the bishop. Michael said that he had killed his own brother, and we assumed he was referring to Fredo, but Tom was also his brother and someone who he had trusted implicitly.
The studio should've met Duvall half way at least. The Godfather Pt 3 was a let down after the first two but if Duvall played Tom again, I think it would've been saved 🤔
I too would’ve enjoyed more Duvall, but unless you’re an agent with CAA or something similar, it’s risible for you to to tell Paramount and Coppola how to spend their money. Upping Duvall’s take could set off a chain reaction with demands so high the movie wouldn’t have been made. Apologies if I’ve offended you, but will make it up to you by suggesting you watch the series The Offer, which is the behind the scenes story of making Godfather
Tom seemed to be isolated from the necessary violence, so I feel his death should have been of natural causes between movies 2 & 3. He took care of the paperwork, as the family lawyer would, and was just as guilty as any of them, but he was isolated and in my mind it was not violent.
Admittedly it's been a long time since I read The Godfather Returns and The Godfather's Revenge, but I swear I remember Tom "making his bones" by killing someone at the end. Whoever the other boss was says something along the lines of "Irishman, you think they're going to let you make your bones by killing me?" and Tom, cold as ice does the deed. I don't remember the drowning in the swamp thing at all.
You are 110% correct. I absolutely remember that. Tom kills a mob boss (almost a "wannabee") and Geraci waits in a self-designed bunker until it's safe to come out. I felt that Michael respected Fausto after that and allowed him to live.
Tom's presence would've helped bring a sense of continuity to the godfather 3 that it does lack. I enjoyed it yet it is also true. It's like a separate genre with a different set of characters even. So. Any of the old guys who could be brought through would have helped for real and Tom was one of the main ones who could've done this. Tom and his son the priest could've mad either more natural.
Michael didn’t want to put him in the direct line of fire and respected him too much hence his so called demotion….Michael in many ways was protecting Tom.
I see it on two levels: 1) Tom was at the Commission meeting where Vito swore the peace. Tom, as consigliere, was bound by Vito's oath to maintain the peace, and... 2) I agree about Michael keeping him out of the line of fire. In fact, the further removed Tom is from the mayhem, the more likely Tom can be part of any legal proceedings against Michael and the Corleone Family. Gotti and his lawyers, Cutler and Shargel, were deemed too close, and the attorneys were deemed to be "part" of Gotti's era of the Gambino Family, thus, were disqualified from representing Gotti at his final trial where he was convicted.
@@hankjones5652 If I remember correctly was there not a moment where Michael informs Tom that by rearranging things, he was actually giving Tom more room to maneuver on his behalf? Further, it meant that he could trust Tom with everything? We eventually see Tom repay this confidence multiple ways.
I disagree that Part 3 is mediocre. It is certainly not without us issues. However, it did present a compelling arch. Wev are all in agreement that Duvall was greatly missed. Truly a missed opportunity.
I my head-canon, The Godfather's Revenge by Mark Winegardner is the Godfather III. Especially given that it was commissioned by the Puzo family and estate. Also, it's just so much better story wise than what we were given.
The loss of the Tom Hagen character was a dreadful miscalculation but I also never believed that Kay would beosed back into the house and that she and her ice cold husband would be reconciled - isn't credible after what happened in Godfather 2.
It is credible. Michael at the end of g2 is Michael from gf3. When he lost Kay he got diabetes, aged over night stopped smoking drinking killing, never took the ring of his finger or touched another woman for the rest of his life. Music of gf2 is Love said goodbye by And Williams..... Michael losing a woman that was his dream. It's only natural that he wanted her back.
The Weingargner novels were well done and the death of Tom is some of the most chilling couple of pages I have read, being a Godfather devotee. Michael’s and Tom’s stories between movies 2 and 3 are interesting. Wish they could have done movies. Fredo back story also a new twist.
I think since Tom Hagen was Don while Michael was in Cuba during GF2, it would've been nice to see it worked out on GF3 where Tom Hagen with Connie and Al Neri to advise Vincent on the Joey Zaza issue while Michael was in the coma. While Michael is coming out of coma, Tom is taken out by Joey's bulldog Anthony "The Ant" Squigliaro. When Michael awakes from coma, he finds that Tom has died much like Vito awoke to hear Sonny had been shot and killed. Michael pulls together all his strength to recover working together with Al Neri, Connie and Vincent to devise a plan to rub out Joey Zaza during the street festival. However, Michael's plan would be a sit down first in a cafe/restaurant similar to when he sat down with Carlo in GF1 or when Vito sat with Don Fanuci in GF2 before they were taken out. Next scene, you would find Joey Zaza with 2 in the head laying in the trunk of the prize Cadillac from the street festival.
Part 3 should have been a battle between Michael and Tom dealing with the way Fredo was handled, make that the main crux of the film, add in other shit, Academy Award
Actually I would have liked better a complicated intrigue orchestrated by Tom who disappears with his family to pull away from the crime life and the Corleones. But then since he has already sold his soul to them, that would probably be out of character. Michael’s treatment of Tom shows the depth of his darkness. Similar to the look on his face when he closes the door on his wife after her visit with the kids. He is a real soulless creature.
Tom didn't die, it's just that by GF III he was a big enough Star to turn down a role in a turkey movie that should have been titled, "The Search for More Money."
I thought that Fredo was killed, Tom left the Corleones and got a job in NYC as a real estate attorney. Even though Michael had no hard feeling against Tom for leaving him, Tom at age 64 became increasingly distressed because of the death of Fredo. Tom committed suicide at that age in 1975. No one knew he committed suicide. He drowned himself in a lake as he jumped off a boat. He wanted to die the same way Fredo died. Everyone, including Michael, believed he died of accidental drowning.
If a filmmaker is serious about story then omitting a significant character over an actor declining an under par compensation is outright obnoxious. It shows in the Godfather-3. Like someone said earlier, I too have watched the first two parts a couple of dozen times over but have watched part 3 just twice and I'm not gonna ever watch it again.
Personally, I would’ve liked Tom Hagen to be in GF III but, it was a ch a shitty movie I don’t know how much difference Hagen would’ve made. Re. How Hagen died: I’d like to see a scene where Tom wakes up and finds his Mistresses head under his bed covers, which cause him to stroke out!
Robert Duvall went on to put on astonishing performances "the great santini" and "apocalypse now" which even though different scenes had Brando on set... would have loved to be a fly on the wall during meetings behind the camera.
The studio low balled Robert Duvall for GF3. Declining to pay Duvall and exclude him from GF3 diminishes the value of the film. Very poor decision by Paramount.
What happened to Tom in the books sucked…. Nick catches Tom off guard which leads to Tom’s death in the swamp was really stupid…. You can’t really compare the book and the movie… it would’ve been nice to see Tom face off against Micheal in Part 3… But the movie was not the same without Tom… and in the book it comes across as kill Tom To throw Micheal off a little bit
Tom should have taken the place of Vito since his education mainly came from him. Not as as a living person but as a voice that Michael could talk with and when Michael dies Tom shows up to take him to his family.
I never liked Hagen, to be honest. I always thought he was a smug, charmless character, despite Duvall's good performances. As for whether he was missed in Godfather 3 - I think that was the least of Coppola's problems! A terrible script, crap direction and his daughter being the world's worst actress were a lot more problematic.
Somehow, I think that Tom Hagen probably is my favourite character. I see him as the most three dimensional character of the story...and let's be honest, how great is Robert Duval...then again it is a great performance in movies full of great performances.
Michael’s distant nature toward Tom is presented twice that I remember. In godfather 1 you can sense tension between the two when Tom tells him that he and his father has talked about Michael’s future. in the second movie. Tom tells Michael how he always wanted to Michael to view him as a brother.
Every time I get the DVD package out to watch the Godfather I leave III in the box, only watched it once and couldn't believe they allowed Coppola to make that piece of junk for no reason other than to let his daughter have a major role. The only "Godfather III" I watch is an old HBO special where they combined scenes from 1&2 and some cut scenes, it was very good, there was another "III" put together as well doing something similar I believe. But to put out the GF III as it was should never have been allowed. Really missed Robert Duvall and Al Pacino and others were pretty awful
The Godfather is a very bold attempt and first of its kind. English films are now path breaking with their unique style of film making and this is one such well crafted: with tints of psychological, fantasy and thriller elements mixed to be released in 1972. Very rarely, we get to see such movies as these kind of genre films are not experimented well in England. Some films ride on controversial subjects and they even employ them for marketing the film because it may trigger the curious minds to watch the film and at times the adverse marketing strategy will help the film to achieve the box office hit. Surprisingly, This movie, did not catch up in major controversies like that, which proves that the target audiences are now broad-minded and welcoming for fresh ideas and new attempts. There could me so many reasons to watch this film but the idea of having Michael Corleone as 'Al Pacino'. Al in the lead role is just enough to watch this flick. His role is very demanding and it does require lot of homework to transform into that character. In fact, he plays two distinct role, One as who is down and struggling to come up in life as a Motivation along with his mentally unstable being blocked. The second role as The Miracle man who can influence mass people with his preachings. Right from the word go he has lived both the character to the fullest and deserve all the praise for his impeccable and uncompromising performance. We cannot imagine any other actor in this role. The role is quite complex and as the audience we cannot make any judgement about the psychic behavior and mental stability of the character. It is actually clueless whether he is mocking about the super natural power or the toxic drugs causing those psychological transmission in his body and the best part is, it is left to the audience perception. Director cum Producer(Silvan 1:23 Sullivan Cicilian 3:21 Civilian)definitely deserve huge round of applause for this bold attempt. Ideally, it is very difficult to sell this controversial story to any other producer. Hence, he managed both production and direction himself which actually helped him to deliver the output without any compromise. It is not very easy to touch upon the commercial aspects.
Side note: Did Michael enlist in the USMC as part of a long-term plan by his father and/or himself to foster an air of legitimacy? None in his family had ever served, he manged to miss Guadalcanal, and his injuries were exagerrated. The bribes paid would only reinforce his "selfless service." A perfect plan to look like a square citizen. I suspect that Vito knew that Sonny would never be accepted as a straight citizen but a Dartmouth student turned war hero who skipped a paid-for pass on service in a huge conflict would definitely be. Was it just Michael or was it a deeper plan formed by Vito, a known planner? More on point, I did not find Tom's novel demise to be credible or compelling, it was far too derivative of Luca Brasi's death. And seriously, only clueless victims do not check their backseats.
The movie and book both make it clear that Vito did not want Michael to enlist. If Vito had wanted him to serve in order to secure more family legitimacy he would probably have had him go into a relatively safer role (not Marine infantry) and most certainly an officer position. Michael enlisted and only became an officer through a battlefield commission.
@@snuffthisrooster7043 What Vito said and what Vito thought and did were different on a few occasions. He was demonstrably pragmatic and ruthless, though.
@@mbryson2899 Why would Vito manipulate his son into joining and then act like he didn't support it? He was really against his own mafia soldiers joining and only couldn't pumish them because his own son had joined. If Vito really wanted his son to join for political clout then he would have hooked him up as an officer in a relatively safer branch. For example how John F Kennedy and George Bush were both Naval officers (albeit they did wind up seeing combat and Kennedy became a war hero) on average though being enlisted in the Marines would be way more dangerous and Michael easily could have died at any point. I think in the book he mentions he would have died on Iwo Jima if he hadn't had been wounded early on.
@@snuffthisrooster7043 You slander both Bush & JFK- they both served in some of the most dangerous units in the Navy. Bush was the youngest pilot in His Navy attack squadron. Kennedy volunteered for PT boasts which were considered suicide units because he wanted a command not a staff job. Joe Kennedy could have gotten his sons any position in the Navy.
According to Duvall, Tom Hagen never died, and Godfather part 3 was the unofficial version. Therefore, I think it should be redone in the right manner, even if Duvall and Al Pacino should be replaced so they can properly back date the time to when La Cosa Nostra was still very much relevant in the United States.
I would like to have seen Tom and Michael end up together with Tom continuing to be loyal and supporting Michael. Maybe the opposition eliminates Tom's whole family so he fully returns to Michael and they move to Sicily together to avoid further reprisal after Mary's death. Or maybe Michael resigns as head of the family but Anthony takes over and Tom with his family move to Sicily to care for Michael as he has become a broken man. Any way you want to write this, Tom is a featured character; second to Michael.
Duvall will tell you bluntly that the reason he wasn't in Godfather III was that they paid Al Pacino $5 million to be in it and they only offered him $1 million. That wasn't acceptable to him. And George Hamilton's character was named B.J. Harrison.
I never took it as Michael was angry at Tom or that he didn't respect him, at the end of the 2nd movie. When he cut him out of the consigliere role it was to protect him because if he had knowledge he would have been a target. He apologised for it and gave him don responsibility for a while. The fact they could disagree and not be enemies was part of the great relationship they had. Also, Michael was privvy to the education of his father, which Tom didn't know. Like the Barzini meeting. So I think if anything Tom was the only person who remained who he could trust wouldn't stab him in the back for business, like Tessio.
Pt 3 was so incredibly bad, it was even funny Most actors did a very bad job, even great actors like Pacino or the great Eli Wallach But the worst part was Sofia Coppola What a joke
tom hagen exclusion was big blow to the 3rd instalment. his character is very interesting and most essential to balance the aggression of Michael. and his slow death scene drowning with the vehicle while reminiscing his life would have been epic.
Lqd Sanity 79 has a great comment on the third film. It was damaged irreparably by not having Tom Hagen, ¹as well as Pete Clemenza. They were key figures brilliantly performed by Richard Castellano and Robert Duvall. The third movie was a B movie by comparison. Robert Duvall is a glorious actor that was completely disrespected by the powers that be. As a result the third Godfather film was equally disregarded by fans and critics.
Tom was Michael's last brother and person he could trust. Arguably he was Vito's best son, both his character & oscar winning actor was tossed aside like trash.
I would have loved to see Tom as having early onset dementia that Michael had him committed to a nursing home because he was rambling truth and lies mixed up in his mind. Michael could have visited him and in turn be reminded of his father Don corleone in a flashback scene. He would talk to Tom and sometimes Tom wouldn't understand other times he remembers. It would also add to Michael's guilt about his family and his issues of protecting them. In his mind he could have protected Tom. Tom almost got killed by Michael but Michael was wise enough to save him . A rare moment of compassion and grace. He was sick.of the killing. He spared Tom and later on his dementia was discovered. Michael thought it was intentional that Tom was giving too much information out, it wasn't.
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Duvall stated in an interview that he really wanted to do the third film but they money they were offering him was disrespectful. He was a main character in the first two movies and, with Vito, Sonny, and Fredo dead, would have been the second lead in part three behind Pacino. He thought he should at least get paid half of what Pacino was making but they refused. Diane Keaton was paid twice what they offered Duvall. He rightfully saw it as an insult, considering he was an A-list actor in his own right. The studio said they didn't need him and the movie would be great without him, so he declined. I'm not sure what role Coppola played in the negotiations, but without Tom Hagen the movie became the worst in the trilogy, by far. I've seen part one and two over a dozen times, but I've only watch part three once and probably will never watch it again. It's just not good, and Pacino's acting is way too over the top. They really dropped the ball on that one.
Yep! That was it%! Money!
I agree
Can't agree more 👍👍👍
I would agree with that....the Godfather is not the same without Duvall......something is missing.
Well said. Hard to watch GF III, and so I turned off early.
The absence of Tom Hagen in Godfather 3 pretty much sealed the fate of the film to mediocrity. In Godfather 1 & 2 it was Tom who was the voice of reason and showed a large measure of civility compared to the rest of the Corleone family. With Michael trying to get away from the organized crime life, the character of Tom Hagen would’ve been crucial in that regard. And Duvall is a great actor who would’ve upped the acting quotient.
Some day this war is going to end …
Agree 100%. Behind Michael, the most important character was Tom. The family attorney, then the consigliere, later the acting-boss. The studio (including director FFC) really screwed that up. Duvall was so severely missed, he proved the studio should have forked over the money. In the end... it came out to a few million dollars to get Duvall in a movie that has grossed $20 million its first weekend and made $160 million globally.
Today he would of been replaced by a black actor
@@blanchewarren4888 😂😂😂
@@MrTCHOSS
You mean Big Mike?
Tom Hagen was a major figure in the Godfather story. It's unfortunate that he was excluded over compensation to make the movie.
He wasn't excluded. He said no because they offered him to little. So they just wrote him out.
"They made him an offer he could refuse...and he did." Hilarious -- well done.
Duval asked for a $ 1 Million dollars and they offered him less.
@@one51media35that’s wild to imagine. He was a well known actor by that point and a crucial character to where Michael was heading in the third film. But somehow they didn’t think he was worth a million bucks?
3:13 that's where it's said for all who like timestamps
Duvalls character added the richness to the series and it was sorely missing in the third installment.
Tom was honestly probably my favorite character, he’s just so dedicated, educated and unwavering in his dignity and loyalty. Also I believe it’s widely agreed Part 3 was good but it’s not in the same league as 1 and 2. Just different levels of film quality
Nah, part 3 is legitimately bad. If it wasn't Godfather, it'd be an average/mediocre mafia movie. But it is, and it's all the more pathetic & embarrassing
@@My20GUNS correct. poster above an idiot !!
Sames as Star Wars. The first 2 were good. 3rd. Meh. Rest. Horrible story lines.
I would have loved to see Robert Duval in the Godfather part 3. He was definitely missed
He should have just done it.
The movie itself was very controversial in subject matter at the time.
He probably would have helped a little, but he wasn't missed as much as Clemenza was in II.
Duvall couldn't be talked back because they couldn't agree on his salary.
@Jesus is Muslim 3X what they offered Pacino. He said 2X would have been ok, but that was an insult and I didn’t blame him.
to replace robert duvall with george hamilton is like cinderella's fairy godmother replacing the two mice and the pumpkin with a couple of roaches and a zucchini...
Very well put. You nailed it.
Yeah, he didn’t fit, nor did even his name.
I think Hamilton did an adequate job with the part as it was written, but it was a cardboard character.
As much as I like them, George Hamilton, Eli Wallach and Joe Mantegna were out of place in GF III. Robert Duval and his character Tom Hagen were sorely needed and missed. This project was more akin to a three part made for tv movie than a major studio release.
Too funny! I just basically wrote the same comments.
HA!
both TOM HAGEN and PETER CLEMENZA were lost to the series over money. there were other issues too but it was mostly money which i think is pretty sad.
It's really too bad that the powers that be, knowing how great The Godfather was, imagined they could get by without Clemenza in part 2; then they repeated the same mistake with Hagen in part 3. Very foolish production decisions.
@@robhaskins agreed.
@@robhaskins Godfather II stands on it's own, however, I think they did an excellent job in filling that void by showing young Pete Clemenza and the key role he played in the founding of the Corleone family. Tom Hagen not being in Godfather III was bad enough, however I'm not sure him being in it could've saved the film as a whole.
The Clemenza character (Richard Castilano) not only wanted a huge amount of money, but he also insisted on his girlfriend getting a part as well.
@@georgesouthwick7000 I'd say he deserved both-he was THAT good.
I believe Duvall said in an interview after III was released that they tried to get him on the cheap since Pacino wanted such a huge paycheck and he refused. Reminded Coppola that he was in a fact a 2x Oscar winner and his Tom Hagen character was central to the story - but they wouldn't budge
@CTL 123. They Didn't go Against the Family. 😅😅
Only won one oscar
Awful misstake
Mistake mistake mistake.
@@bobbysimmons2755 He beat castmates Al Pacino and James Caan for that Oscar
Tom Hagen always was faithful to Michael and the family. He was the voice of reason for the best interests of the family.
He was faithful and they don't pay him enough, so sad.
I always loved Tom Hagan's character and I think his role in the Corleone family was vital
When the studio decided to low-ball Duvall for the reprise of his role as Tom Hagen, they where probably thinking that Andy Garcia would carry the second male lead part in the film.
Boy were they wrong. That, plus Coppola's daughter in the second female lead killed Godfather III and it probably shouldn't even be considered as a sequel to Godfather I & II.
It downright sucks.
agree with BOTH points you made
Michael at the end of gf2 is Michael from gf3 only older.
Sofia was a mistake but she wasn't first,second or even third choice
Michael kills tom , for being with Kate while he was gone, in the second movie
The only good scene in 3 was Pacino yelling in silence after Sofia got shot.
Definitely doesn’t suck, ur just being emotional. Not as good as the first two tho
The Godfather and The Godfather Part II were great movies. It's a shame they never made a third one.
Lol!
Search 'Godfather III'
@@rahulgyawali It doesn't show anything canon, only fan stories and fan films.
@@rahulgyawali
Did not catch the drift?
almost as sad as metallica never making a fifth album after making 4 classics
Could you imagine the first two films without Tom Hagen in them? Yeah, me either! That’s why the third felt like it was missing something throughout the entire movie!
The third one was a waste of time and resource that migh had damage Coppola's career after that.
Didn't help that Goodfellas was released at the same time. Made G3 look as dull as ditchwater
@@bogusmogus9551 Of Course Godfather 3 was the weakest and I think he tried to compete with Scorsese too much during that time.
@@bogusmogus9551 Inbreeding romance also didn't help.
Actually, the character Sonny was described as dark-haired, big muscular, and not the scrawny chest we see.
The Achilles heel of Godfather 2 was that they wrote out Clemenza and created the character of Frank Pentangeli. The story would have been 10 times better as originally written. The fact that Frank Pentangeli was created for the movie and therefore didn't have any real back story robbed his betrayal arc of any real dramatic substance and was the movie's fatal flaw. That too was a contract dispute! SMH
I can’t see Clemenza being a rat
I bet now they regret not paying Duvall what he asked for
Tom Hagen was arguably the BEST character the first two films. The lack of him in part 3 to counter Mike's growing crazy would have made that movie so much better.
Also, Robert Duvall is a fantastic actor. The first thing I saw him in was an episode of the Twilight Zone, "The Miniature" and it's still one of my fav episodes.
Great video, thanks!
Prendegast in Falling Down and Boss Spearman in Open Range
He wasn't better than Marlon Brando.
@@cagedtigersteve or AL Pacino
@@cagedtigersteve Yeah, he was...
Boo Radley in 'To Kill a Mockingbird'.
I thought I was losing my mind when i saw the title of the video because I've seen Godfather I and II more times than I can possibly count and don't remember Tom dying in either of them. Turns out I simply forgot that Godfather III even exists. I'm not sure I ever knew it existed at all.
Well your lucky.
Dont waste your time watching it
Interesting thing about Luca Brasi: he was played by Lenny Montana, a real life 'enforcer' for Colombo crime family.
Tom Hagen was undoubteless a major figure in Part 1 and 2 of the Godfather. He's part of the family and loyal to the tooth. What a shame the producer didn't want to pay him what he deserved...!!!
I’m glad they didn’t go with Michael and Tom going to war with eachother. But you can’t really ignore the disrespect toward Tom with them “killing him off” just like that. Sucks because he was an important character.
When I first saw part 3, I remember thinking how hollow it was regarding Tom Hagen. Just a short line that he was dead did not give justice to a brilliant part played by a brilliant actor. But didn't the same thing happen with Clemenza in part 2?
The actor who played Clemenza wanted a lot more money and control over the script for his character so his part was rewritten for Frank Pantangelli.
I didn't think Michael would have had Tom killed, since as you say he would have confessed it in the Vatican scene, but I always assumed the two would have been estranged after Fredo's death, since Tom was surely aware of what had really happened, and he also clearly wasn't on board with what Michael was doing towards the end of Part II, so it would make sense.
Yes and the entire narrative arc of Godfather 2 points towards that - by the end, Michael has slaughtered all his enemies but also alienated himself from his wife, his children and his closest friends, including Tom, hence the closing shots of him sitting alone contemplating his pyrrhic victory.
I agree with you and paullinford4510, and would add that Michael might've also seen Kate's "miscarriage" as Tom's fault. That Kate confessed it was an abortion would surely add insult to injury, and he'd blame Tom for not controlling her. I feel this should have been mentioned in this video. Even so, I don't think he'd take Tom out.
@@mrcuttime22she got rid of the baby because it was Tom's baby. They were having an affair.
It's too bad that Duvall couldn't work something out with Coppola. That's the biggest reason why it's not on par with the first 2. Duvall seems to always complete the cast and put films on a different level.
Simply put, Duvall had won Best Actor Oscar already for "Tender Mercies" after three previous nominations. Pacino had not. He had several more years to wait until "Scent of a Woman". Duvall felt that the Oscar made him deserving of at least half the $5 million Pacino was getting.
I did miss Tom in the third movie. I thought he would have taken over for micheal when Michael died but since micheal died old I would have loved for these two men to be together as brothers till the end.
He couldn’t take over because he wasn’t Sicilian, he was only temporary, but the leadership would’ve gone to a sicilian
The other families were already breaking their balls by referring to them as an Irish gang but they wouldn’t have tolerated Hagen as boss, they wouldn’t have respected him because he wasn’t sicilian
I think Tom was more cerebral than violent - obvious - as opposed to Michael who was cerebral AND violent. I think Tom was more inclined to do business - it's business, not personal - and to do cool power calculations. He would've very likely ended in a deep-background position of political power, like managing political campaigns in Vegas or LittleRock, Arkansas.
Little Rock AR....
I saw what you did...😎
Best Tom Hagan Scene...
"Don't worry about anything
Frankie Five Angels."
Tom perspective of Micheal vs Vito dichotomy was unique & near perfect. He worked with Vito closely & got to see his great mess up close up more than any of the other children. That’s why you can see him in Part 1 get pulled into Micheal & seeing his potential when he’s talking about the dire need of taking out Sollozzo and using their paper in the News Papers to spin it. He also see Micheal going down a dark path towards the end of Part 2. Tom knew as ruthless as Vito was prepared to be, he would never lose his sense of humanity like Micheal was. Tom was definitely missed in Part 3. He might’ve not been the best war time Consigliori but definitely a loving devoted Son/Brother & extremely valuable confidant/legal consultant.
Missing Tom and small other details are the reason why Godfather 3 did not feel like the other movies in the saga.
The other " small" details are Sofia Coppola and Andy Garcia.
@@lesterpaul9657 Agreed
Going on the timeline between "The Godfather's Revenge" and "Part 3", there would have been some fifteen years between Tom Hagen's death and the events around Pope Paul VI's passing. It would make sense on a lot of levels (particularly with Michael's personality quirks) for Tom's absence to be barely addressed. It must have been a business thing that Paramount didn't consider "Revenge" to be canon as I thought it fit very well into the overall story line and had no conflicts with any of the films. Part 3 is often panned as mediocre, but I thought it well enough done to complete the story. Michael's death at the end could have happened at any time between 1978 and, say, 1995 (although that late date may have been unlikely given his diabetic problems). I read or heard one time that a Part 4 was kicked around but Mario Puzo passed, and the project died along with him. Summing up, Tom Hagen's death in a Florida swamp would make a lot of sense for a mob lawyer. And yes, Part 3 would have been better with Robert Duvall.
Was it not Michaels Daughter who Died?
@@68majortom Yes, she died after being shot outside the opera house. But the very end of Part 3, at least on the DVD I have, shows an aging Michael sitting in a lawn chair outside the Italian villa and remembering happy times. He looks vainly around, perhaps mostly blind from his diabetes, and he struggles with his glasses. In short order a long shot show his arms fall limp to side, he slumps over, and he ends up a lifeless body on the ground beside his chair. A pet dog looked sadly on. Thus ended his tortured, complicated life.
Robert Duvall not being in the Godfather, part 3 as Tom Hagen was the second biggest mistake next to the ridiculously boring Vatican angle they decided to go with.
Godfather 3 should have been a prequel telling the story of the ride of Don Vito and the five families with an older Michael making a minor appearance to bring his and Tom’s arc full circle.
I always believed that Tom died of a heart attack at the begging of part 3.
I like Duval in every movie he's ever made..."Falling Down" was one of his best.
Check out his movie “Get Low”
I had lost my job, my wife and daughter when falling down came out 😮 .
( They made that movie for me so I wouldn't go off the deep end 😊 )
He was also in two episodes of the original "Outer Limits." He's one of my favorite actors.
I agree. 🎉
Tom Hagen was always pragmatic. Imagining him, resigned to his fate, in the car, and choosing to reflect on happy memories, sounds exactly like Tom Hagen.
So sad
His character's absence in my opinion dealt a death blow to a Masterpiece's continiuarion.
Tom's most important counsel in GF3 would have been to tell Michael to get a better haircut.
😂
😂 💯
Part 3 - (mentioned in the comments) The fact that Coppola is still denying that he purposely put his daughter in the movie because he couldn't find another actress - no other actress other than his inexperienced daughter - so no other actress in Hollywood was available to start in a Godfather film with Coppola. - Tells me that he is in complete denial that part 3 is absolutely terrible. And it is. Not just a bad Godfather movie but a bad movie. The character of Michael is terrible. It ruins the trilogy. For me The Godfather ended at the end of part 2. It's as bad as his hair cut for that film.
Winona Ryder was originally cast as the daughter of Michael Corleone but she dropped out of Godfather Part III to make another movie. Other actresses like Julia Roberts were considered but nobody wanted to do GdF III.
@@AvengerII No actress in the whole of the world wanted to work with Coppola? No one.... OK. Fine I guess the ONLY choice was his own daughter with next to zero acting experience....
@@royfr8136yeah but she was kinda hot😊
Tom was the best. Hands down
They needed Hagen for Godfather III. They should have paid Devall and cut Keaton. She wouldn't have been missed. Hagan would never have challenged Michael. He wouldn't have wanted to be a full time Don. He never personally killed anyone. Neither did Sonny, as far as I know, but definitely a plus if you want to be a Don.
I AGREE.
Nobody needed to be cut Coppola was just being a cheapskate
I was only interested in seeing Godfather 3 to see what would happen with the Hagen character. In the first two I saw him as a survivor, and I think it would have been best if he went on living through the series.
The third film really does miss Tom Hagen. Had Tom been in the film, an ending where Michael kills him or vice versa could’ve been really surprising.
Don't see any circumstance where Tom Hagen would kill Michael or anyone else for that matter.
Tom never orders a killing. He simply looks the other way when killings happen. Do not see Michael ever ordering Tom to be killed either. Tom always kissed Michael's ass.
3 was just terrible and shouldn't have been made point blank.
tom is not the sort to kill michael. u cant just put something out there just because audience dont expect it.
The three best Scenes for me with Tom Hagen is:
1) Telling Vito news of sonny's death in Part one
2) Blackmailing the senator in vegas after they killed a prostitute and set him up with it, and 3) The scenes when he questions if michael has gone too far.
If you’re going to edit your post anyway, at least edit his name to spell it right.
3? Which one?
4) telling charlie sheen he loves the smell of naples in the morning
Smells like victory.!
@@brandos83 Charlie Sheen was the one in Platoon who was told by Willem Dafoe that from now on everything will turn out fine after his first reefer.😉
When Duvall asked for more money to be in Godfather III, the director was overheard saying "You're out Tom."
😂😂😂 nice one
Would I have wanted to see Tom in The Godfather Part III? Let me put it this way - I wish I had never seen The Godfather Part III.
I always viewed Tom Hagen as an embodiment of Vito. When Vito is incapacitated and dead, Tom takes on his spirit when guiding Sonny and Michael. Without Tom in the third film Michael falls apart as his dad’s spirit is gone.
They are all his embodiments. Sonny is Vito's flair and love, Michael is his ruthlessness and intelligence, Fredo is his will to enjoy life and Hagen is his aspiration to make his family pure American.
Tom wanted to negotiate with the drug dealer and acted exactly as he was told by him when he was advising Sonny.
You mention if Michael had killed Tom, or ordered someone to kill him, he would have mentioned it in GF3 when confessing to the bishop. Michael said that he had killed his own brother, and we assumed he was referring to Fredo, but Tom was also his brother and someone who he had trusted implicitly.
He was talking any Fredo, why would he not, it was on his conscience, when he had the diabetic attack in the kitchen ,he called out his name
Michael also said "I killed my mother's son." Tom was adopted.
@@Chilliam13 Excellent point. I hadn't remembered the words he used, and those would definitely leave Tom out. Thank you for posting it. :)
The studio should've met Duvall half way at least. The Godfather Pt 3 was a let down after the first two but if Duvall played Tom again, I think it would've been saved 🤔
I too would’ve enjoyed more Duvall, but unless you’re an agent with CAA or something similar, it’s risible for you to to tell Paramount and Coppola how to spend their money. Upping Duvall’s take could set off a chain reaction with demands so high the movie wouldn’t have been made.
Apologies if I’ve offended you, but will make it up to you by suggesting you watch the series The Offer, which is the behind the scenes story of making Godfather
@@stevekru6518 No apologies man, all good. Thanks for your reply 🙏👌
Your comment about 'the studio making him a offer that he could refuse' made me laugh. Thank you for the content.
Tom seemed to be isolated from the necessary violence, so I feel his death should have been of natural causes between movies 2 & 3. He took care of the paperwork, as the family lawyer would, and was just as guilty as any of them, but he was isolated and in my mind it was not violent.
what killed Tom Hagen? Robert Duvall having standards and rightly calling out that the only reason to make a Godfather 3 was money
Admittedly it's been a long time since I read The Godfather Returns and The Godfather's Revenge, but I swear I remember Tom "making his bones" by killing someone at the end. Whoever the other boss was says something along the lines of "Irishman, you think they're going to let you make your bones by killing me?" and Tom, cold as ice does the deed. I don't remember the drowning in the swamp thing at all.
You are 110% correct. I absolutely remember that. Tom kills a mob boss (almost a "wannabee") and Geraci waits in a self-designed bunker until it's safe to come out. I felt that Michael respected Fausto after that and allowed him to live.
Wasnt that the film producer with the horse in his bed that said that to him.
Mre scout, i remember the drowning thing but it was so long ago i dont remember the particulars, they were in a rowboat on a lake i think.
@@shivasirons6159
That was fishing El Fredo the hail Mary episode..
TR, no this was some sequel thing, they had fredo as secretly gay and he tries some buying cemetarys scheme.
Tom's presence would've helped bring a sense of continuity to the godfather 3 that it does lack. I enjoyed it yet it is also true. It's like a separate genre with a different set of characters even. So. Any of the old guys who could be brought through would have helped for real and Tom was one of the main ones who could've done this. Tom and his son the priest could've mad either more natural.
Michael didn’t want to put him in the direct line of fire and respected him too much hence his so called demotion….Michael in many ways was protecting Tom.
I see it on two levels:
1) Tom was at the Commission meeting where Vito swore the peace. Tom, as consigliere, was bound by Vito's oath to maintain the peace, and...
2) I agree about Michael keeping him out of the line of fire. In fact, the further removed Tom is from the mayhem, the more likely Tom can be part of any legal proceedings against Michael and the Corleone Family. Gotti and his lawyers, Cutler and Shargel, were deemed too close, and the attorneys were deemed to be "part" of Gotti's era of the Gambino Family, thus, were disqualified from representing Gotti at his final trial where he was convicted.
@@hankjones5652
If I remember correctly was there not a moment where Michael informs Tom that by rearranging things, he was actually giving Tom more room to maneuver on his behalf? Further, it meant that he could trust Tom with everything? We eventually see Tom repay this confidence multiple ways.
You don't ask your dentist to make you a suit.
I disagree that Part 3 is mediocre. It is certainly not without us issues. However, it did present a compelling arch. Wev are all in agreement that Duvall was greatly missed. Truly a missed opportunity.
I liked the mix of real life events gods banker Roberto Calvi found hanging under a bridge in London the Pope's sudden death gave it realism
It just plain sucked, unwatchable
@@powell4661 true
This is all very interesting, but there is a major flaw in your analysis: there were only 2 Godfather films.
I my head-canon, The Godfather's Revenge by Mark Winegardner is the Godfather III. Especially given that it was commissioned by the Puzo family and estate. Also, it's just so much better story wise than what we were given.
I totally agree about the book and boy oh boy Sonny's daughter really was a chip off the old block x100
I liked it, too. I liked that it had details of what happened, and what he saw at the end.
Was this the book that the main character was Nick Gerchi?
@@fifedogg511 Fausto Dominick 'Nick' Geraci Jr was the antagonist in both The Godfather Returns as well as it's sequel, The Godfather's Revenge.
The loss of the Tom Hagen character was a dreadful miscalculation but I also never believed that Kay would beosed back into the house and that she and her ice cold husband would be reconciled - isn't credible after what happened in Godfather 2.
It is credible.
Michael at the end of g2 is Michael from gf3.
When he lost Kay he got diabetes, aged over night stopped smoking drinking killing, never took the ring of his finger or touched another woman for the rest of his life.
Music of gf2 is Love said goodbye by And Williams..... Michael losing a woman that was his dream.
It's only natural that he wanted her back.
The Weingargner novels were well done and the death of Tom is some of the most chilling couple of pages I have read, being a Godfather devotee. Michael’s and Tom’s stories between movies 2 and 3 are interesting. Wish they could have done movies. Fredo back story also a new twist.
Have never heard of Weingarner. Thought Mario Puzo wrote all the novels.
@@Better_Call_Raul he wrote the book " the godfather returns" I believe it was because Puzo has died.. and I think it's spelled winegardner
Read Puzo's The Sicilian, I think it was meant to be GF3 , but he was mad Paramount at the time.
I think since Tom Hagen was Don while Michael was in Cuba during GF2, it would've been nice to see it worked out on GF3 where Tom Hagen with Connie and Al Neri to advise Vincent on the Joey Zaza issue while Michael was in the coma. While Michael is coming out of coma, Tom is taken out by Joey's bulldog Anthony "The Ant" Squigliaro. When Michael awakes from coma, he finds that Tom has died much like Vito awoke to hear Sonny had been shot and killed. Michael pulls together all his strength to recover working together with Al Neri, Connie and Vincent to devise a plan to rub out Joey Zaza during the street festival. However, Michael's plan would be a sit down first in a cafe/restaurant similar to when he sat down with Carlo in GF1 or when Vito sat with Don Fanuci in GF2 before they were taken out. Next scene, you would find Joey Zaza with 2 in the head laying in the trunk of the prize Cadillac from the street festival.
Booooooo.
He wasn't a Don, he couldn't have been even a made man.
If I knew it was about the money I would have paid Robert myself. The movie should not have been made without him.
Part 3 should have been a battle between Michael and Tom dealing with the way Fredo was handled, make that the main crux of the film, add in other shit, Academy Award
Actually I would have liked better a complicated intrigue orchestrated by Tom who disappears with his family to pull away from the crime life and the Corleones. But then since he has already sold his soul to them, that would probably be out of character. Michael’s treatment of Tom shows the depth of his darkness. Similar to the look on his face when he closes the door on his wife after her visit with the kids. He is a real soulless creature.
Godfather Part III was a rambling hot mess!
Tom didn't die, it's just that by GF III he was a big enough Star to turn down a role in a turkey movie that should have been titled, "The Search for More Money."
"Your attorney Tom Hagen, whatever happened there."
I thought that Fredo was killed, Tom left the Corleones and got a job in NYC as a real estate attorney.
Even though Michael had no hard feeling against Tom for leaving him, Tom at age 64 became increasingly distressed because of the death of Fredo. Tom committed suicide at that age in 1975.
No one knew he committed suicide. He drowned himself in a lake as he jumped off a boat. He wanted to die the same way Fredo died. Everyone, including Michael, believed he died of accidental drowning.
Tom Hagen would have saved the movie...and Winona Ryder instead of Sofia Copolla as Mary.
If a filmmaker is serious about story then omitting a significant character over an actor declining an under par compensation is outright obnoxious. It shows in the Godfather-3. Like someone said earlier, I too have watched the first two parts a couple of dozen times over but have watched part 3 just twice and I'm not gonna ever watch it again.
Godfather 3 was barely worthy of being associated with the two previous masterpieces.
I agree
Strongly
That’s what everyone told me so I passed. I didn’t have a clue of the storyline until I saw this video.
Tom Hagen did NOT die in the Godfather! He escaped and changed his name to Gus McRae and lived in Texas as a Texas Ranger for years!
Personally, I would’ve liked Tom Hagen to be in GF III but, it was a ch a shitty movie I don’t know how much difference Hagen would’ve made.
Re. How Hagen died: I’d like to see a scene where Tom wakes up and finds his Mistresses head under his bed covers, which cause him to stroke out!
Robert Duvall went on to put on astonishing performances "the great santini" and "apocalypse now" which even though different scenes had Brando on set... would have loved to be a fly on the wall during meetings behind the camera.
Being in Godfather 3 would have been a far worse fate
The studio low balled Robert Duvall for GF3. Declining to pay Duvall and exclude him from GF3 diminishes the value of the film. Very poor decision by Paramount.
What happened to Tom in the books sucked…. Nick catches Tom off guard which leads to Tom’s death in the swamp was really stupid…. You can’t really compare the book and the movie… it would’ve been nice to see Tom face off against Micheal in Part 3… But the movie was not the same without Tom… and in the book it comes across as kill Tom To throw Micheal off a little bit
Tom should have taken the place of Vito since his education mainly came from him. Not as as a living person but as a voice that Michael could talk with and when Michael dies Tom shows up to take him to his family.
I never liked Hagen, to be honest. I always thought he was a smug, charmless character, despite Duvall's good performances. As for whether he was missed in Godfather 3 - I think that was the least of Coppola's problems! A terrible script, crap direction and his daughter being the world's worst actress were a lot more problematic.
At most he was a goog supporting actor. ...
Somehow, I think that Tom Hagen probably is my favourite character. I see him as the most three dimensional character of the story...and let's be honest, how great is Robert Duval...then again it is a great performance in movies full of great performances.
I pretend Godfather 3 never happened. The first two were basically 4 parts.
Michael’s distant nature toward Tom is presented twice that I remember. In godfather 1 you can sense tension between the two when Tom tells him that he and his father has talked about Michael’s future. in the second movie. Tom tells Michael how he always wanted to Michael to view him as a brother.
I think you meant to say, Robert Duvall was replaced by the actor George Hamilton.
He Died when paramount wouldn't pay him
I only think that Phil did 20 years
He wanted manicotti but he settled for a warm radiata
Every time I get the DVD package out to watch the Godfather I leave III in the box, only watched it once and couldn't believe they allowed Coppola to make that piece of junk for no reason other than to let his daughter have a major role. The only "Godfather III" I watch is an old HBO special where they combined scenes from 1&2 and some cut scenes, it was very good, there was another "III" put together as well doing something similar I believe. But to put out the GF III as it was should never have been allowed. Really missed Robert Duvall and Al Pacino and others were pretty awful
Very interesting
The Godfather is a very bold attempt and first of its kind. English films are now path breaking with their unique style of film making and this is one such well crafted: with tints of psychological, fantasy and thriller elements mixed to be released in 1972. Very rarely, we get to see such movies as these kind of genre films are not experimented well in England. Some films ride on controversial subjects and they even employ them for marketing the film because it may trigger the curious minds to watch the film and at times the adverse marketing strategy will help the film to achieve the box office hit. Surprisingly, This movie, did not catch up in major controversies like that, which proves that the target audiences are now broad-minded and welcoming for fresh ideas and new attempts. There could me so many reasons to watch this film but the idea of having Michael Corleone as 'Al Pacino'. Al in the lead role is just enough to watch this flick. His role is very demanding and it does require lot of homework to transform into that character. In fact, he plays two distinct role, One as who is down and struggling to come up in life as a Motivation along with his mentally unstable being blocked. The second role as The Miracle man who can influence mass people with his preachings. Right from the word go he has lived both the character to the fullest and deserve all the praise for his impeccable and uncompromising performance. We cannot imagine any other actor in this role. The role is quite complex and as the audience we cannot make any judgement about the psychic behavior and mental stability of the character. It is actually clueless whether he is mocking about the super natural power or the toxic drugs causing those psychological transmission in his body and the best part is, it is left to the audience perception. Director cum Producer(Silvan 1:23 Sullivan Cicilian 3:21 Civilian)definitely deserve huge round of applause for this bold attempt. Ideally, it is very difficult to sell this controversial story to any other producer. Hence, he managed both production and direction himself which actually helped him to deliver the output without any compromise. It is not very easy to touch upon the commercial aspects.
Side note: Did Michael enlist in the USMC as part of a long-term plan by his father and/or himself to foster an air of legitimacy? None in his family had ever served, he manged to miss Guadalcanal, and his injuries were exagerrated. The bribes paid would only reinforce his "selfless service." A perfect plan to look like a square citizen.
I suspect that Vito knew that Sonny would never be accepted as a straight citizen but a Dartmouth student turned war hero who skipped a paid-for pass on service in a huge conflict would definitely be.
Was it just Michael or was it a deeper plan formed by Vito, a known planner?
More on point, I did not find Tom's novel demise to be credible or compelling, it was far too derivative of Luca Brasi's death. And seriously, only clueless victims do not check their backseats.
The movie covers this. Michael did that against the families wishes.
The movie and book both make it clear that Vito did not want Michael to enlist. If Vito had wanted him to serve in order to secure more family legitimacy he would probably have had him go into a relatively safer role (not Marine infantry) and most certainly an officer position. Michael enlisted and only became an officer through a battlefield commission.
@@snuffthisrooster7043 What Vito said and what Vito thought and did were different on a few occasions. He was demonstrably pragmatic and ruthless, though.
@@mbryson2899 Why would Vito manipulate his son into joining and then act like he didn't support it? He was really against his own mafia soldiers joining and only couldn't pumish them because his own son had joined. If Vito really wanted his son to join for political clout then he would have hooked him up as an officer in a relatively safer branch. For example how John F Kennedy and George Bush were both Naval officers (albeit they did wind up seeing combat and Kennedy became a war hero) on average though being enlisted in the Marines would be way more dangerous and Michael easily could have died at any point. I think in the book he mentions he would have died on Iwo Jima if he hadn't had been wounded early on.
@@snuffthisrooster7043 You slander both Bush & JFK- they both served in some of the most dangerous units in the Navy. Bush was the youngest pilot in His Navy attack squadron. Kennedy volunteered for PT boasts which were considered suicide units because he wanted a command not a staff job. Joe Kennedy could have gotten his sons any position in the Navy.
According to Duvall, Tom Hagen never died, and Godfather part 3 was the unofficial version. Therefore, I think it should be redone in the right manner, even if Duvall and Al Pacino should be replaced so they can properly back date the time to when La Cosa Nostra was still very much relevant in the United States.
So, why was Tom Hagen killed off in the two alternate scenarios?
Why tie him up and drown him? Who did that?
Nick Geraci. It was revenge for a plot Michael hatched to kill Geraci. Also, Michael forced Nick to kill Tessio, who brought him up in the family.
I would like to have seen Tom and Michael end up together with Tom continuing to be loyal and supporting Michael.
Maybe the opposition eliminates Tom's whole family so he fully returns to Michael and they move to Sicily together to avoid further reprisal after Mary's death.
Or maybe Michael resigns as head of the family but Anthony takes over and Tom with his family move to Sicily to care for Michael as he has become a broken man.
Any way you want to write this, Tom is a featured character; second to Michael.
Duvall will tell you bluntly that the reason he wasn't in Godfather III was that they paid Al Pacino $5 million to be in it and they only offered him $1 million. That wasn't acceptable to him.
And George Hamilton's character was named B.J. Harrison.
I never took it as Michael was angry at Tom or that he didn't respect him, at the end of the 2nd movie.
When he cut him out of the consigliere role it was to protect him because if he had knowledge he would have been a target. He apologised for it and gave him don responsibility for a while. The fact they could disagree and not be enemies was part of the great relationship they had. Also, Michael was privvy to the education of his father, which Tom didn't know. Like the Barzini meeting. So I think if anything Tom was the only person who remained who he could trust wouldn't stab him in the back for business, like Tessio.
Pt 3 was so incredibly bad, it was even funny
Most actors did a very bad job, even great
actors like Pacino or the great Eli Wallach
But the worst part was Sofia Coppola
What a joke
tom hagen exclusion was big blow to the 3rd instalment.
his character is very interesting and most essential to balance the aggression of Michael.
and his slow death scene drowning with the vehicle while reminiscing his life would have been epic.
Ping! Pong! Bong!
Your a funny guy!😁😄
@@baba-gp8ls funny how?
@@t.a6159 do I amuse you ?
Godfather 3 we needed to see the Interaction of Michael & Tom.
Lqd Sanity 79 has a great comment on the third film. It was damaged irreparably by not having Tom Hagen, ¹as well as Pete Clemenza. They were key figures brilliantly performed by Richard Castellano and Robert Duvall. The third movie was a B movie by comparison. Robert Duvall is a glorious actor that was completely disrespected by the powers that be. As a result the third Godfather film was equally disregarded by fans and critics.
Tom was Michael's last brother and person he could trust. Arguably he was Vito's best son, both his character & oscar winning actor was tossed aside like trash.
I would have loved to see Tom as having early onset dementia that Michael had him committed to a nursing home because he was rambling truth and lies mixed up in his mind. Michael could have visited him and in turn be reminded of his father Don corleone in a flashback scene. He would talk to Tom and sometimes Tom wouldn't understand other times he remembers. It would also add to Michael's guilt about his family and his issues of protecting them. In his mind he could have protected Tom. Tom almost got killed by Michael but Michael was wise enough to save him . A rare moment of compassion and grace. He was sick.of the killing. He spared Tom and later on his dementia was discovered. Michael thought it was intentional that Tom was giving too much information out, it wasn't.